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Trolly problem

SNP1
Posts: 2,403
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9/12/2015 2:43:37 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
On my phone and don't want to look up if someone has made this problem before, but here we go.

You have minimal control of a trolly. You can only choose which way it will go, left or right.
On the left is 1 person who will die if you go that way.
On the right are 5 people who will die if you go that way.

You are completely unaware of what comes after these people.
This means that what you do not know is:
1) If you go left the same problem will happen again.
2) If you go right then the trolly will stop.

Your job is to be as ethical as possible.
Remember, it is usually seen as being more ethical to kill the lesser amount if you are forced to kill people.
Also remember that one is considered more unethical the more people they kill.

That isn't all. This is, in a way, 2 problems.
In one version you are aware of the choice you just made.
In the other, each time you finish choosing left or right you forget the problem you just faced, BUT remember the number of deaths you are responsible for.

Now, what is the moral choice, left or right? Why is it the moral choice?
#TheApatheticNihilistPartyofAmerica
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Fkkize
Posts: 2,147
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9/12/2015 8:20:36 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/12/2015 2:43:37 AM, SNP1 wrote:
On my phone and don't want to look up if someone has made this problem before, but here we go.

You have minimal control of a trolly. You can only choose which way it will go, left or right.
On the left is 1 person who will die if you go that way.
On the right are 5 people who will die if you go that way.

You are completely unaware of what comes after these people.
This means that what you do not know is:
1) If you go left the same problem will happen again.
2) If you go right then the trolly will stop.

Your job is to be as ethical as possible.
Remember, it is usually seen as being more ethical to kill the lesser amount if you are forced to kill people.
Also remember that one is considered more unethical the more people they kill.

That isn't all. This is, in a way, 2 problems.
In one version you are aware of the choice you just made.
In the other, each time you finish choosing left or right you forget the problem you just faced, BUT remember the number of deaths you are responsible for.

Now, what is the moral choice, left or right? Why is it the moral choice?

A reason is a belief that if true would count in favor of your doing. One is rational IFF one is acting in accodance with his reasons or apparent reasons.
Since one is unaware of what comes after the first switch, it is reasonable to conclude that one only has beliefs about the first switch, e.g., "going left would kill the least people".
This belief is false, as going left at least kills 6 people. It is therefore only an apparent reason. However, even acting on apparent reasons suffices for rationality.
Hence the most rational thing to do is to go left.
: At 7/2/2016 3:05:07 PM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
:
: space contradicts logic
Lavaguava
Posts: 4
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9/12/2015 11:23:55 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/12/2015 2:43:37 AM, SNP1 wrote:
On my phone and don't want to look up if someone has made this problem before, but here we go.

You have minimal control of a trolly. You can only choose which way it will go, left or right.
On the left is 1 person who will die if you go that way.
On the right are 5 people who will die if you go that way.

You are completely unaware of what comes after these people.
This means that what you do not know is:
1) If you go left the same problem will happen again.
2) If you go right then the trolly will stop.

Your job is to be as ethical as possible.
Remember, it is usually seen as being more ethical to kill the lesser amount if you are forced to kill people.
Also remember that one is considered more unethical the more people they kill.

That isn't all. This is, in a way, 2 problems.
In one version you are aware of the choice you just made.
In the other, each time you finish choosing left or right you forget the problem you just faced, BUT remember the number of deaths you are responsible for.

Now, what is the moral choice, left or right? Why is it the moral choice?

You should quickly get on your phone's browser, google "seven sided dice online", select the seven sided option, 1 roll, 1 dice, if you roll 7, you go left, anything else, you go right. This is the fairest way, philosophy tube did a presentation on it.
Lavaguava
zmikecuber
Posts: 4,068
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9/12/2015 12:20:32 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/12/2015 2:43:37 AM, SNP1 wrote:
On my phone and don't want to look up if someone has made this problem before, but here we go.

You have minimal control of a trolly. You can only choose which way it will go, left or right.
On the left is 1 person who will die if you go that way.
On the right are 5 people who will die if you go that way.

You are completely unaware of what comes after these people.
This means that what you do not know is:
1) If you go left the same problem will happen again.
2) If you go right then the trolly will stop.

Your job is to be as ethical as possible.
Remember, it is usually seen as being more ethical to kill the lesser amount if you are forced to kill people.
Also remember that one is considered more unethical the more people they kill.

That isn't all. This is, in a way, 2 problems.
In one version you are aware of the choice you just made.
In the other, each time you finish choosing left or right you forget the problem you just faced, BUT remember the number of deaths you are responsible for.

Now, what is the moral choice, left or right? Why is it the moral choice?

Do nothing.
"Delete your fvcking sig" -1hard

"primal man had the habit, when he came into contact with fire, of satisfying the infantile desire connected with it, by putting it out with a stream of his urine... Putting out the fire by micturating was therefore a kind of sexual act with a male, an enjoyment of sexual potency in a homosexual competition."
n7
Posts: 1,355
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9/12/2015 4:30:01 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/12/2015 12:20:32 PM, zmikecuber wrote:
At 9/12/2015 2:43:37 AM, SNP1 wrote:
On my phone and don't want to look up if someone has made this problem before, but here we go.

You have minimal control of a trolly. You can only choose which way it will go, left or right.
On the left is 1 person who will die if you go that way.
On the right are 5 people who will die if you go that way.

You are completely unaware of what comes after these people.
This means that what you do not know is:
1) If you go left the same problem will happen again.
2) If you go right then the trolly will stop.

Your job is to be as ethical as possible.
Remember, it is usually seen as being more ethical to kill the lesser amount if you are forced to kill people.
Also remember that one is considered more unethical the more people they kill.

That isn't all. This is, in a way, 2 problems.
In one version you are aware of the choice you just made.
In the other, each time you finish choosing left or right you forget the problem you just faced, BUT remember the number of deaths you are responsible for.

Now, what is the moral choice, left or right? Why is it the moral choice?

Do nothing.
That's my philosophy of life!
404 coherent debate topic not found. Please restart the debate with clear resolution.


Uphold Marxist-Leninist-Maoist-Sargonist-n7ism.
n7
Posts: 1,355
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9/12/2015 4:37:51 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/12/2015 2:43:37 AM, SNP1 wrote:
On my phone and don't want to look up if someone has made this problem before, but here we go.

You have minimal control of a trolly. You can only choose which way it will go, left or right.
On the left is 1 person who will die if you go that way.
On the right are 5 people who will die if you go that way.

You are completely unaware of what comes after these people.
This means that what you do not know is:
1) If you go left the same problem will happen again.
2) If you go right then the trolly will stop.

Your job is to be as ethical as possible.
Remember, it is usually seen as being more ethical to kill the lesser amount if you are forced to kill people.
Also remember that one is considered more unethical the more people they kill.

That isn't all. This is, in a way, 2 problems.
In one version you are aware of the choice you just made.
In the other, each time you finish choosing left or right you forget the problem you just faced, BUT remember the number of deaths you are responsible for.

Now, what is the moral choice, left or right? Why is it the moral choice?
This is my favorite version.

The trolly is going down a track with five people on it. You've designed the trolly and know that the man near the outside of the trolly is fat enough to stop it. Do you throw him out and kill the one, or let the 5 die?

This is a lot harder for someone to answer let the one die because it has them take an active role in the killing.
404 coherent debate topic not found. Please restart the debate with clear resolution.


Uphold Marxist-Leninist-Maoist-Sargonist-n7ism.
zmikecuber
Posts: 4,068
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9/12/2015 9:05:21 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/12/2015 4:30:01 PM, n7 wrote:
At 9/12/2015 12:20:32 PM, zmikecuber wrote:
At 9/12/2015 2:43:37 AM, SNP1 wrote:
On my phone and don't want to look up if someone has made this problem before, but here we go.

You have minimal control of a trolly. You can only choose which way it will go, left or right.
On the left is 1 person who will die if you go that way.
On the right are 5 people who will die if you go that way.

You are completely unaware of what comes after these people.
This means that what you do not know is:
1) If you go left the same problem will happen again.
2) If you go right then the trolly will stop.

Your job is to be as ethical as possible.
Remember, it is usually seen as being more ethical to kill the lesser amount if you are forced to kill people.
Also remember that one is considered more unethical the more people they kill.

That isn't all. This is, in a way, 2 problems.
In one version you are aware of the choice you just made.
In the other, each time you finish choosing left or right you forget the problem you just faced, BUT remember the number of deaths you are responsible for.

Now, what is the moral choice, left or right? Why is it the moral choice?

Do nothing.
That's my philosophy of life!

Indeed. ;) Even assuming some sort of consequentialism, morality of obligation towards others is much more controversial than morality of murder.
"Delete your fvcking sig" -1hard

"primal man had the habit, when he came into contact with fire, of satisfying the infantile desire connected with it, by putting it out with a stream of his urine... Putting out the fire by micturating was therefore a kind of sexual act with a male, an enjoyment of sexual potency in a homosexual competition."
skipsaweirdo
Posts: 1,861
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9/12/2015 10:48:13 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/12/2015 2:43:37 AM, SNP1 wrote:
On my phone and don't want to look up if someone has made this problem before, but here we go.

You have minimal control of a trolly. You can only choose which way it will go, left or right.
On the left is 1 person who will die if you go that way.
On the right are 5 people who will die if you go that way.
This seems like a loaded gun. Why isn't it just easier to say that,someone's going to force you to kill your wife, or your 2 children. Would be easier to kill the wife, lol
You are completely unaware of what comes after these people.
This means that what you do not know is:
1) If you go left the same problem will happen again.
2) If you go right then the trolly will stop.

Your job is to be as ethical as possible.
Remember, it is usually seen as being more ethical to kill the lesser amount if you are forced to kill people.
Also remember that one is considered more unethical the more people they kill.
I don't see how someone can have levels of ethics in this case, seems leading,
That isn't all. This is, in a way, 2 problems.
In one version you are aware of the choice you just made.
In the other, each time you finish choosing left or right you forget the problem you just faced, BUT remember the number of deaths you are responsible for.
why can't I jump off the trolley and not be responsible?
Now, what is the moral choice, left or right? Why is it the moral choice?
Neither is the moral choice unless one of the people owes you a lot of money, then you don't kill them or their group.
Yassine
Posts: 2,617
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9/15/2015 8:12:53 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/12/2015 2:43:37 AM, SNP1 wrote:
On my phone and don't want to look up if someone has made this problem before, but here we go.

You have minimal control of a trolly. You can only choose which way it will go, left or right.
On the left is 1 person who will die if you go that way.
On the right are 5 people who will die if you go that way.

You are completely unaware of what comes after these people.
This means that what you do not know is:
1) If you go left the same problem will happen again.
2) If you go right then the trolly will stop.

Your job is to be as ethical as possible.
Remember, it is usually seen as being more ethical to kill the lesser amount if you are forced to kill people.

- Not a all.

Also remember that one is considered more unethical the more people they kill.

- Not necessarily.

That isn't all. This is, in a way, 2 problems.
In one version you are aware of the choice you just made.
In the other, each time you finish choosing left or right you forget the problem you just faced, BUT remember the number of deaths you are responsible for.

Now, what is the moral choice, left or right? Why is it the moral choice?

- Both are equally immoral. The only not immoral thing to do is to do nothing. If the trolly was going left, leave it be. If it was going right, leave it be, unless there are particulars about the people on the left vs. those on the right.
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skipsaweirdo
Posts: 1,861
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9/15/2015 9:50:28 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/12/2015 2:43:37 AM, SNP1 wrote:
On my phone and don't want to look up if someone has made this problem before, but here we go.

You have minimal control of a trolly. You can only choose which way it will go, left or right.
On the left is 1 person who will die if you go that way.
On the right are 5 people who will die if you go that way.

You are completely unaware of what comes after these people.
This means that what you do not know is:
1) If you go left the same problem will happen again.
2) If you go right then the trolly will stop.

Your job is to be as ethical as possible.
Remember, it is usually seen as being more ethical to kill the lesser amount if you are forced to kill people.
Also remember that one is considered more unethical the more people they kill.

That isn't all. This is, in a way, 2 problems.
In one version you are aware of the choice you just made.
In the other, each time you finish choosing left or right you forget the problem you just faced, BUT remember the number of deaths you are responsible for.

Now, what is the moral choice, left or right? Why is it the moral choice?

Evolutionist, " people who are on tracks in danger are morons, therefore eliminate the most morons from the gene pool"
Environmentalist, "the world is becoming over populated, kill the most"
Person who is deranged and notices these people are stupid, "kill the least that way there can be more people to manipulate"
Survivor of Hiroshima, "Dam the least amount of people are Americans, the others are Japanese, kill the Americans"
Lastly me, " Kill the group with the ugliest women, leave the more attractive ones"
mrsatan
Posts: 417
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9/16/2015 12:59:51 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/12/2015 2:43:37 AM, SNP1 wrote:
On my phone and don't want to look up if someone has made this problem before, but here we go.

You have minimal control of a trolly. You can only choose which way it will go, left or right.
On the left is 1 person who will die if you go that way.
On the right are 5 people who will die if you go that way.

You are completely unaware of what comes after these people.
This means that what you do not know is:
1) If you go left the same problem will happen again.
2) If you go right then the trolly will stop.

Your job is to be as ethical as possible.
Remember, it is usually seen as being more ethical to kill the lesser amount if you are forced to kill people.
Also remember that one is considered more unethical the more people they kill.

That isn't all. This is, in a way, 2 problems.
In one version you are aware of the choice you just made.
In the other, each time you finish choosing left or right you forget the problem you just faced, BUT remember the number of deaths you are responsible for.

Now, what is the moral choice, left or right? Why is it the moral choice?

It doesn't matter. People are responsible for their own lives. Anyone dumb enough to stand on train tracks and not watch out for a train holds all the blame for getting hit by it.
To say one has free will, to have chosen other than they did, is to say they have will over their will... Will over the will they have over their will... Will over the will they have over the will they have over their will, etc... It's utter nonsense.