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Theory of Evolution

dattaswami
Posts: 322
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10/15/2015 5:23:35 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
(Excerpt from message of Shri Datta Swami)

You say that the man is evolved from the monkey in course of time based on the theory of evolution. But, we say the reverse of this because a perfect sage existed in the beginning of the creation and in course of time, the sage is degraded to the present man, who is behaving like a monkey. The scripture says that perfect sages (like Manu and Sanaka) were created in the beginning of this universe. Therefore, we have to agree to the theory of entropy only, which is a tendency of proceeding from regularity (Dharma) to irregularity (Adharma) as the time proceeds from Krutayuga to Kaliyuga. You cannot say that the tail of monkey disappeared in the man in course of time due to evolution. Even in the time of the existence of monkeys, men without tails existed. Even now the monkeys exist with tails. If your concept is correct all the monkeys should have lost the tails based on the uniform reason of evolution.

Why some monkeys only have lost the tails and became men? The concept of evolution should be uniform in all the monkeys. Hanuman is the best evolved human being in health of body and mind, but retained the tail. Hence, it is better to accept the concept of entropy as universal phenomenon. We respect the Science, which is a systematic analysis of creation, but not as analysis of the Creator and His activities.

Any way, we are not touching this field because our main line is about the existence of unimaginable God proved through the unimaginable events of human incarnation. Let us not deviate from the main line. Still, this discussion is relevant in view of your projection of science over the scripture.

posted by: surya (disciple of swamiji)
www.universal-spirituality.org
ken1122
Posts: 484
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10/16/2015 1:31:40 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/15/2015 5:23:35 PM, dattaswami wrote:
(Excerpt from message of Shri Datta Swami)

You say that the man is evolved from the monkey in course of time based on the theory of evolution. But, we say the reverse of this because a perfect sage existed in the beginning of the creation and in course of time, the sage is degraded to the present man, who is behaving like a monkey. The scripture says that perfect sages (like Manu and Sanaka) were created in the beginning of this universe. Therefore, we have to agree to the theory of entropy only, which is a tendency of proceeding from regularity (Dharma) to irregularity (Adharma) as the time proceeds from Krutayuga to Kaliyuga. You cannot say that the tail of monkey disappeared in the man in course of time due to evolution. Even in the time of the existence of monkeys, men without tails existed. Even now the monkeys exist with tails. If your concept is correct all the monkeys should have lost the tails based on the uniform reason of evolution.

Why some monkeys only have lost the tails and became men? The concept of evolution should be uniform in all the monkeys. Hanuman is the best evolved human being in health of body and mind, but retained the tail. Hence, it is better to accept the concept of entropy as universal phenomenon. We respect the Science, which is a systematic analysis of creation, but not as analysis of the Creator and His activities.

Any way, we are not touching this field because our main line is about the existence of unimaginable God proved through the unimaginable events of human incarnation. Let us not deviate from the main line. Still, this discussion is relevant in view of your projection of science over the scripture.

posted by: surya (disciple of swamiji)
www.universal-spirituality.org

Evolution never said anything about man evolving from a monkey. Where are you getting this stuff?

Ken
fettywap
Posts: 10
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10/16/2015 2:53:21 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/15/2015 5:23:35 PM, dattaswami wrote:
(Excerpt from message of Shri Datta Swami)

You say that the man is evolved from the monkey in course of time based on the theory of evolution. But, we say the reverse of this because a perfect sage existed in the beginning of the creation and in course of time, the sage is degraded to the present man, who is behaving like a monkey. The scripture says that perfect sages (like Manu and Sanaka) were created in the beginning of this universe. Therefore, we have to agree to the theory of entropy only, which is a tendency of proceeding from regularity (Dharma) to irregularity (Adharma) as the time proceeds from Krutayuga to Kaliyuga. You cannot say that the tail of monkey disappeared in the man in course of time due to evolution. Even in the time of the existence of monkeys, men without tails existed. Even now the monkeys exist with tails. If your concept is correct all the monkeys should have lost the tails based on the uniform reason of evolution.

Why some monkeys only have lost the tails and became men? The concept of evolution should be uniform in all the monkeys. Hanuman is the best evolved human being in health of body and mind, but retained the tail. Hence, it is better to accept the concept of entropy as universal phenomenon. We respect the Science, which is a systematic analysis of creation, but not as analysis of the Creator and His activities.

Any way, we are not touching this field because our main line is about the existence of unimaginable God proved through the unimaginable events of human incarnation. Let us not deviate from the main line. Still, this discussion is relevant in view of your projection of science over the scripture.

posted by: surya (disciple of swamiji)
www.universal-spirituality.org : :

We were created much differently than most folks believe.
n7
Posts: 1,360
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10/16/2015 4:15:35 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/15/2015 5:23:35 PM, dattaswami wrote:
(Excerpt from message of Shri Datta Swami)

You say that the man is evolved from the monkey in course of time based on the theory of evolution.
One sentence in and already there's a strawman.

But, we say the reverse of this because a perfect sage existed in the beginning of the creation and in course of time, the sage is degraded to the present man, who is behaving like a monkey. The scripture says that perfect sages (like Manu and Sanaka) were created in the beginning of this universe. Therefore, we have to agree to the theory of entropy only, which is a tendency of proceeding from regularity (Dharma) to irregularity (Adharma) as the time proceeds from Krutayuga to Kaliyuga.

That's not what entropy is. Entropy is simply the number of ways atoms can be arranged. An ordered regular 2 inch box has more entropy than a 1 inch box filled with loose irregular atoms.
http://www.avogadro.co.uk...

You cannot say that the tail of monkey disappeared in the man in course of time due to evolution. Even in the time of the existence of monkeys, men without tails existed. Even now the monkeys exist with tails. If your concept is correct all the monkeys should have lost the tails based on the uniform reason of evolution.

Who says all monkeys have to evolve a certain way? Entities evolve within an environment, if some monkeys are in differing environments then their evolution will happen differently.

posted by: surya (disciple of swamiji)
www.universal-spirituality.org

Not a bad epic. I give it an 8/8
404 coherent debate topic not found. Please restart the debate with clear resolution.


Uphold Marxist-Leninist-Maoist-Sargonist-n7ism.
dattaswami
Posts: 322
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10/16/2015 3:17:33 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
from surya (disciple of Swamiji)

Charles Darwin proposed the theory of evolution which says man is evolved from monkey.

At 10/16/2015 1:31:40 AM, ken1122 wrote:
Evolution never said anything about man evolving from a monkey. Where are you getting this stuff?
Ken
n7
Posts: 1,360
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10/16/2015 5:19:28 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/16/2015 3:17:33 PM, dattaswami wrote:
from surya (disciple of Swamiji)

Charles Darwin proposed the theory of evolution which says man is evolved from monkey.

No he didn't. He stated man and monkeys have a common ancestor. That's far from saying monkeys were that ancestor.

It is therefore probable that Africa was formerly inhabited by extinct apes closely allied to the gorilla and chimpanzee; and as these two species are now man's nearest allies, it is somewhat more probable that our early progenitors lived on the African continent than elsewhere
http://darwin-online.org.uk...


At 10/16/2015 1:31:40 AM, ken1122 wrote:
Evolution never said anything about man evolving from a monkey. Where are you getting this stuff?
Ken
404 coherent debate topic not found. Please restart the debate with clear resolution.


Uphold Marxist-Leninist-Maoist-Sargonist-n7ism.
Otokage
Posts: 2,352
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10/16/2015 5:51:39 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/15/2015 5:23:35 PM, dattaswami wrote:
(Excerpt from message of Shri Datta Swami)

You say that the man is evolved from the monkey in course of time based on the theory of evolution. But, we say the reverse of this because a perfect sage existed in the beginning of the creation and in course of time, the sage is degraded to the present man, who is behaving like a monkey. The scripture says that perfect sages (like Manu and Sanaka) were created in the beginning of this universe. Therefore, we have to agree to the theory of entropy only, which is a tendency of proceeding from regularity (Dharma) to irregularity (Adharma) as the time proceeds from Krutayuga to Kaliyuga. You cannot say that the tail of monkey disappeared in the man in course of time due to evolution. Even in the time of the existence of monkeys, men without tails existed. Even now the monkeys exist with tails. If your concept is correct all the monkeys should have lost the tails based on the uniform reason of evolution.

Why some monkeys only have lost the tails and became men? The concept of evolution should be uniform in all the monkeys. Hanuman is the best evolved human being in health of body and mind, but retained the tail. Hence, it is better to accept the concept of entropy as universal phenomenon. We respect the Science, which is a systematic analysis of creation, but not as analysis of the Creator and His activities.

Any way, we are not touching this field because our main line is about the existence of unimaginable God proved through the unimaginable events of human incarnation. Let us not deviate from the main line. Still, this discussion is relevant in view of your projection of science over the scripture.

posted by: surya (disciple of swamiji)
www.universal-spirituality.org

It is such a shame that a follower of philosophies so interested in the animal world as bhuddism and hinduism is in fact so missinformed about the theory that better explains the animal world... I recommend you actualy take the time to research about evolution and understand evolution. Once you do, I promise you will be closer to the wise state you are seeking.

Peace.
dattaswami
Posts: 322
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10/17/2015 7:27:00 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
from surya (disciple of Swamiji)

Actually, satguru (God in human form i.e., God-in-flesh) confines to that knowledge which is useful for the upliftment of the humanity. But, some devotees may like to know about additional things. One such is like theory of evolution. Some more may be like, how is the creation started etc. Even though these are not very much useful for the devotee in the process of upliftment, sometimes He answers some questions to satisfy them for which you need not write unnecessary comments.

I have posted many spiritual topics in this forum but probably you have responded only on this topic. If you are not interested in evolution topic, you come and discuss on my other spiritual topics. It is the positive approach.

You visit our website www.universal-spirituality.org You will find plenty of spiritual knowledge covering the entire spectrum.

At 10/16/2015 5:51:39 PM, Otokage wrote:
It is such a shame that a follower of philosophies so interested in the animal world as bhuddism and hinduism is in fact so missinformed about the theory that better explains the animal world... I recommend you actualy take the time to research about evolution and understand evolution. Once you do, I promise you will be closer to the wise state you are seeking.

Peace.
Otokage
Posts: 2,352
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10/17/2015 12:49:49 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/17/2015 7:27:00 AM, dattaswami wrote:
from surya (disciple of Swamiji)

Actually, satguru (God in human form i.e., God-in-flesh) confines to that knowledge which is useful for the upliftment of the humanity. But, some devotees may like to know about additional things. One such is like theory of evolution. Some more may be like, how is the creation started etc. Even though these are not very much useful for the devotee in the process of upliftment, sometimes He answers some questions to satisfy them for which you need not write unnecessary comments.

I have posted many spiritual topics in this forum but probably you have responded only on this topic. If you are not interested in evolution topic, you come and discuss on my other spiritual topics. It is the positive approach.

You visit our website www.universal-spirituality.org You will find plenty of spiritual knowledge covering the entire spectrum.





At 10/16/2015 5:51:39 PM, Otokage wrote:
It is such a shame that a follower of philosophies so interested in the animal world as bhuddism and hinduism is in fact so missinformed about the theory that better explains the animal world... I recommend you actualy take the time to research about evolution and understand evolution. Once you do, I promise you will be closer to the wise state you are seeking.

Peace.

On the contrary, I have answered to you on other topics, as the one in which you spoke about the need for vegetarianism. Also, I do not agree with your concept of positiveness. Confrontation is not negative, as it can be a positive behaviour in order to test and uplift oneself. Also, recognizing a flaw on the knowledge of an interlocutor, and point out this flaw, is a very positive thing, as it will serve you to amend this flaw in this case by learning more about the theory of evolution which you clearly do not understand (yet).
fromantle
Posts: 274
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10/17/2015 5:37:03 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
From what I gather of this you are saying the first thing that ever existed was perfection. and over the course of time this has devolved to the present state of mankind.
Well looking around the world it certainly seems to have devolved in many ways but this is due to scientific progress unbridled by moral compass.
Let us suppose you are correct what do you propose we do now?
For what untimately creates the future is our behaviour.
Hayd
Posts: 4,022
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10/18/2015 4:12:53 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/16/2015 4:15:35 AM, n7 wrote:
At 10/15/2015 5:23:35 PM, dattaswami wrote:
(Excerpt from message of Shri Datta Swami)

You say that the man is evolved from the monkey in course of time based on the theory of evolution.
One sentence in and already there's a strawman.

But, we say the reverse of this because a perfect sage existed in the beginning of the creation and in course of time, the sage is degraded to the present man, who is behaving like a monkey. The scripture says that perfect sages (like Manu and Sanaka) were created in the beginning of this universe. Therefore, we have to agree to the theory of entropy only, which is a tendency of proceeding from regularity (Dharma) to irregularity (Adharma) as the time proceeds from Krutayuga to Kaliyuga.

That's not what entropy is. Entropy is simply the number of ways atoms can be arranged. An ordered regular 2 inch box has more entropy than a 1 inch box filled with loose irregular atoms.
http://www.avogadro.co.uk...

You cannot say that the tail of monkey disappeared in the man in course of time due to evolution. Even in the time of the existence of monkeys, men without tails existed. Even now the monkeys exist with tails. If your concept is correct all the monkeys should have lost the tails based on the uniform reason of evolution.

Who says all monkeys have to evolve a certain way? Entities evolve within an environment, if some monkeys are in differing environments then their evolution will happen differently.

posted by: surya (disciple of swamiji)
www.universal-spirituality.org

Not a bad epic. I give it an 8/8

We did not evolve from monkeys n7, what he is saying is complete and utter_bullshit because he lacks any understanding of evolution, he says that our tails couldn't have fallen off, we didn't evolve from monkeys, we evolved from apes (no tales) that's why we share 99% of our DNA with a chimpanzee.
skipsaweirdo
Posts: 1,872
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10/19/2015 3:31:14 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/16/2015 1:31:40 AM, ken1122 wrote:
At 10/15/2015 5:23:35 PM, dattaswami wrote:
(Excerpt from message of Shri Datta Swami)

You say that the man is evolved from the monkey in course of time based on the theory of evolution. But, we say the reverse of this because a perfect sage existed in the beginning of the creation and in course of time, the sage is degraded to the present man, who is behaving like a monkey. The scripture says that perfect sages (like Manu and Sanaka) were created in the beginning of this universe. Therefore, we have to agree to the theory of entropy only, which is a tendency of proceeding from regularity (Dharma) to irregularity (Adharma) as the time proceeds from Krutayuga to Kaliyuga. You cannot say that the tail of monkey disappeared in the man in course of time due to evolution. Even in the time of the existence of monkeys, men without tails existed. Even now the monkeys exist with tails. If your concept is correct all the monkeys should have lost the tails based on the uniform reason of evolution.

Why some monkeys only have lost the tails and became men? The concept of evolution should be uniform in all the monkeys. Hanuman is the best evolved human being in health of body and mind, but retained the tail. Hence, it is better to accept the concept of entropy as universal phenomenon. We respect the Science, which is a systematic analysis of creation, but not as analysis of the Creator and His activities.

Any way, we are not touching this field because our main line is about the existence of unimaginable God proved through the unimaginable events of human incarnation. Let us not deviate from the main line. Still, this discussion is relevant in view of your projection of science over the scripture.

posted by: surya (disciple of swamiji)
www.universal-spirituality.org

Evolution never said anything about man evolving from a monkey. Where are you getting this stuff?
Then why are prosimians (pre monkey)considered less evolved than the higher primates and broke off from the common ancestor earlier. By definition monkey is merely a semantic argument. That earlier ancestor wouldn't be called a monkey, doesn't mean it wasn't one though, but by all standards it was more "monkeyish" than the great apes. If it wasn't a primate with a long tail,which is really the main difference as far as tail is concerned, what was it?
Speciation from Pan to Homo appears to have been a long, drawn-out process. After the "original" divergence(s), there were, according to Patterson (2006), periods of hybridization between population groups and a process of alternating divergence and hybridization that lasted over several millions of years.[1] Sometime during the late Miocene or early Pliocene the earliest members of the human clade completed a final separation from the lineage of Pan"with dates estimated by several specialists ranging from 13 million [2] to as recent as 4 million years ago.[3] The latter date and the argument for hybridization events are rejected by Wakeley[4] (see current estimates regarding complex speciation).

Richard Wrangham (2001) argued that the CHLCA species was very similar to the common chimpanzee (Pan troglodytes)"so much so that it should be classified as a member of the Pan genus and be given the taxonomic name Pan prior.[5] However, to date no fossil has been identified as a probable candidate for the CHLCA or the taxon Pan prior. Reference wiki...
If no fossil has been identified as a candidate, how do you know it wasn't "monkey"? Ur playing semantics and aren't very good at it either.

Ken
tejretics
Posts: 6,093
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10/19/2015 2:17:28 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/16/2015 4:15:35 AM, n7 wrote:
At 10/15/2015 5:23:35 PM, dattaswami wrote:
(Excerpt from message of Shri Datta Swami)

You say that the man is evolved from the monkey in course of time based on the theory of evolution.
One sentence in and already there's a strawman.

But, we say the reverse of this because a perfect sage existed in the beginning of the creation and in course of time, the sage is degraded to the present man, who is behaving like a monkey. The scripture says that perfect sages (like Manu and Sanaka) were created in the beginning of this universe. Therefore, we have to agree to the theory of entropy only, which is a tendency of proceeding from regularity (Dharma) to irregularity (Adharma) as the time proceeds from Krutayuga to Kaliyuga.

That's not what entropy is. Entropy is simply the number of ways atoms can be arranged. An ordered regular 2 inch box has more entropy than a 1 inch box filled with loose irregular atoms.
http://www.avogadro.co.uk...

Slight problem. Entropy is the number of microstates that energy separates into. Not necessarily atoms. Entropy can be high/low in photons as well.


You cannot say that the tail of monkey disappeared in the man in course of time due to evolution. Even in the time of the existence of monkeys, men without tails existed. Even now the monkeys exist with tails. If your concept is correct all the monkeys should have lost the tails based on the uniform reason of evolution.

Who says all monkeys have to evolve a certain way? Entities evolve within an environment, if some monkeys are in differing environments then their evolution will happen differently.

posted by: surya (disciple of swamiji)
www.universal-spirituality.org

Not a bad epic. I give it an 8/8
"Where justice is denied, where poverty is enforced, where ignorance prevails, and where any one class is made to feel that society is an organized conspiracy to oppress, rob and degrade them, neither persons nor property will be safe." - Frederick Douglass
tejretics
Posts: 6,093
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10/19/2015 2:26:47 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/15/2015 5:23:35 PM, dattaswami wrote:
(Excerpt from message of Shri Datta Swami)

You say that the man is evolved from the monkey in course of time based on the theory of evolution.

Straw man fallacy -- this misrepresents the concept of biological evolution.

But, we say the reverse of this because a perfect sage existed in the beginning of the creation and in course of time, the sage is degraded to the present man, who is behaving like a monkey. The scripture says that perfect sages (like Manu and Sanaka) were created in the beginning of this universe. Therefore, we have to agree to the theory of entropy only, which is a tendency of proceeding from regularity (Dharma) to irregularity (Adharma) as the time proceeds from Krutayuga to Kaliyuga. You cannot say that the tail of monkey disappeared in the man in course of time due to evolution. Even in the time of the existence of monkeys, men without tails existed. Even now the monkeys exist with tails. If your concept is correct all the monkeys should have lost the tails based on the uniform reason of evolution.

(1) I'm afraid your assumptions are entirely false. One species evolving into another does not imply the extinction of the former species, though it often is so. And, humans didn't necessarily evolve from monkey species that are extant -- A. afarensis is an example of a species humans evolved from (not a monkey; an ape).

(2) You've completely misunderstood entropy.


Why some monkeys only have lost the tails and became men?

This makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.

The concept of evolution should be uniform in all the monkeys. Hanuman is the best evolved human being in health of body and mind, but retained the tail. Hence, it is better to accept the concept of entropy as universal phenomenon. We respect the Science, which is a systematic analysis of creation, but not as analysis of the Creator and His activities.

Prove that the creator exists, and demonstrate the historicity of the Ramayana (or, at least, the existence of Hanuman).


Any way, we are not touching this field because our main line is about the existence of unimaginable God proved through the unimaginable events of human incarnation.

If God is unimaginable, why is your "main line" about him, since you can't imagine him? Your position seems contradictory.
"Where justice is denied, where poverty is enforced, where ignorance prevails, and where any one class is made to feel that society is an organized conspiracy to oppress, rob and degrade them, neither persons nor property will be safe." - Frederick Douglass
Fkkize
Posts: 2,149
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10/19/2015 2:33:18 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/19/2015 2:26:47 PM, tejretics wrote:
demonstrate the historicity of the Ramayana (or, at least, the existence of Hanuman).
o.O?
: At 7/2/2016 3:05:07 PM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
:
: space contradicts logic
tejretics
Posts: 6,093
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10/19/2015 2:38:22 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/19/2015 2:33:18 PM, Fkkize wrote:
o.O?

He makes reference to a mythological figure called Hanuman being a man with a monkey's tail to prove "reverse evolution." He assumes this figure existed, and I'm asking him to demonstrate that.
"Where justice is denied, where poverty is enforced, where ignorance prevails, and where any one class is made to feel that society is an organized conspiracy to oppress, rob and degrade them, neither persons nor property will be safe." - Frederick Douglass
Fkkize
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10/19/2015 2:40:52 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/19/2015 2:38:22 PM, tejretics wrote:
At 10/19/2015 2:33:18 PM, Fkkize wrote:
o.O?

He makes reference to a mythological figure called Hanuman being a man with a monkey's tail to prove "reverse evolution." He assumes this figure existed, and I'm asking him to demonstrate that.

Strange stuff is strange.
: At 7/2/2016 3:05:07 PM, Rational_Thinker9119 wrote:
:
: space contradicts logic
tejretics
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10/19/2015 2:44:01 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/19/2015 2:40:52 PM, Fkkize wrote:
At 10/19/2015 2:38:22 PM, tejretics wrote:
At 10/19/2015 2:33:18 PM, Fkkize wrote:
o.O?

He makes reference to a mythological figure called Hanuman being a man with a monkey's tail to prove "reverse evolution." He assumes this figure existed, and I'm asking him to demonstrate that.

Strange stuff is strange.

lol
"Where justice is denied, where poverty is enforced, where ignorance prevails, and where any one class is made to feel that society is an organized conspiracy to oppress, rob and degrade them, neither persons nor property will be safe." - Frederick Douglass
dattaswami
Posts: 322
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10/20/2015 2:44:39 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
You are very correct that future depends on our behavior. But, such behavior can be transformed in to right direction by way of spiritual knowledge or divine knowledge alone.

Divine knowledge only changes a criminal to good... (Excerpt from message of Shri Datta Swami)

The knowledge of God avoids " crime and corruption in devotee.
If individuals are transformed " the society is perfectly peaceful.
You cannot control crime and corruption " by employing controllers.
Controllers become criminal and corrupt, " no end to your effort.

Ancient kings supported " the propagation of spiritual knowledge.
It could control the sin, " crime and corruption are the two halves of
The sin, you are spending ten times " on employing controllers, but
There is no trace of control, - spend a small part of it on scholars
To propagate spiritual knowledge, " the sin is controlled fully.

Similarly the devotee will not be corrupt " by knowing God"s nature.
God will give you whatever is necessary " at the appropriate time.
You are His devotee, why to worry? " no need of corruption.

Even if you accumulate wealth, " it may harm your family.
Your child may be spoiled due to wealth, " then wealth is harmful.
Yes, the wealth is terrible poison, " if it is earned by corruption.
God may bless your child directly " to earn infinite wealth here,
If He is pleased with your selfless service, - which is better?

If somebody beats you, " keep silent and do not even curse him.
You might have beaten him " in the previous birth and now
It is compensated with interest, " the case is now closed forever.
In this case you cannot expect God " to punish him at anytime.
Your long observation about him " will discourage you thoroughly.

However, if he has beaten you " without this back ground,
God will certainly punish him, " you will beat him with interest.
But the time gap is uncertain, " may be now or may be next birth.

The reason is that God punishes anybody " only for transformation.
God might have punished him already " in some other angle,
Which is unknown to you and God is " waiting for the change in him.
If change is not observed " God will use the pending punishments.

Punishment due to you is somewhere " in the list of his cycle.
You are eager to punish him " just to pacify your revenge.
Your aim of punishment differs " from the aim of punishment by God.

If you realize the administration of God " or the cycle of deeds here,
You are not anxious to punish him, - law and order in God"s hands only.
Now the criminal nature is put off, " society becomes peaceful.

posted by: surya (disciple of swamiji)

At 10/17/2015 5:37:03 PM, fromantle wrote:
From what I gather of this you are saying the first thing that ever existed was perfection. and over the course of time this has devolved to the present state of mankind.
Well looking around the world it certainly seems to have devolved in many ways but this is due to scientific progress unbridled by moral compass.
Let us suppose you are correct what do you propose we do now?
For what untimately creates the future is our behaviour.
dattaswami
Posts: 322
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10/20/2015 2:54:53 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
Rama and Krishna are not imaginary, - they are the absolute truth,
This world is imaginary for God, - the stone bridge in the ocean
Towards Lanka and the immersed " Dwaraka traced now in the sea
Stand as historical proof for truth

At 10/19/2015 2:26:47 PM, tejretics wrote:
Prove that the creator exists, and demonstrate the historicity of the Ramayana (or, at least, the existence of Hanuman).
tejretics
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10/20/2015 2:58:24 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/20/2015 2:54:53 PM, dattaswami wrote:
Rama and Krishna are not imaginary, - they are the absolute truth,

Ipse dixit fallacy.

This world is imaginary for God, - the stone bridge in the ocean towards Lanka and...

(1) The "stone bridge in the ocean" (i.e. Adam's bridge) is merely a scene of tectonic plate divergence in the Palk Strait. Human activity didn't influence it.

(2) Why do you conclude that "Lanka" refers to present-day Sri Lanka?

...the immersed " Dwaraka traced now in the sea

An immersed city near Gujarat does not necessitate the existence of Dwaraka, etc. And Krishna and Dwaraka are irrelevant to this conversation -- this regards the existence of *Hanuman,* not Krishna.

Additionally, even many events described in the Ramayana being proven as true doesn't entail the Vanaras existed just as described in the Ramayana. Evolution has much more evidence behind it than the weak historical evidence you present.
"Where justice is denied, where poverty is enforced, where ignorance prevails, and where any one class is made to feel that society is an organized conspiracy to oppress, rob and degrade them, neither persons nor property will be safe." - Frederick Douglass
fromantle
Posts: 274
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10/20/2015 4:02:35 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
There has been plenty of time for the transformation that you write about but there is no evidence among men. For centuries religion has been trying to change our behaviour with no success. Our natures are not all.sweetness and light
The world reflects our activity which comes from our nature
Where does our nature come from? From our biological history and our environment
' Human evil is a natural phenomenon, and some level of predatory violence is innate in us.'. Sam Harris well known atheist.
n7
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10/20/2015 4:16:05 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/18/2015 4:12:53 PM, Hayd wrote:
At 10/16/2015 4:15:35 AM, n7 wrote:
At 10/15/2015 5:23:35 PM, dattaswami wrote:
(Excerpt from message of Shri Datta Swami)

You say that the man is evolved from the monkey in course of time based on the theory of evolution.
One sentence in and already there's a strawman.

But, we say the reverse of this because a perfect sage existed in the beginning of the creation and in course of time, the sage is degraded to the present man, who is behaving like a monkey. The scripture says that perfect sages (like Manu and Sanaka) were created in the beginning of this universe. Therefore, we have to agree to the theory of entropy only, which is a tendency of proceeding from regularity (Dharma) to irregularity (Adharma) as the time proceeds from Krutayuga to Kaliyuga.

That's not what entropy is. Entropy is simply the number of ways atoms can be arranged. An ordered regular 2 inch box has more entropy than a 1 inch box filled with loose irregular atoms.
http://www.avogadro.co.uk...

You cannot say that the tail of monkey disappeared in the man in course of time due to evolution. Even in the time of the existence of monkeys, men without tails existed. Even now the monkeys exist with tails. If your concept is correct all the monkeys should have lost the tails based on the uniform reason of evolution.

Who says all monkeys have to evolve a certain way? Entities evolve within an environment, if some monkeys are in differing environments then their evolution will happen differently.

posted by: surya (disciple of swamiji)
www.universal-spirituality.org

Not a bad epic. I give it an 8/8

We did not evolve from monkeys n7, what he is saying is complete and utter_bullshit because he lacks any understanding of evolution, he says that our tails couldn't have fallen off, we didn't evolve from monkeys, we evolved from apes (no tales) that's why we share 99% of our DNA with a chimpanzee.

I know, I said "Not a bad epic." as a joke because it is bad and it's not an epic.
404 coherent debate topic not found. Please restart the debate with clear resolution.


Uphold Marxist-Leninist-Maoist-Sargonist-n7ism.
Hayd
Posts: 4,022
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10/20/2015 10:05:06 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/20/2015 4:16:05 PM, n7 wrote:
I know, I said "Not a bad epic." as a joke because it is bad and it's not an epic.

Aye