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Getting High without Drugs

Hayd
Posts: 4,022
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1/3/2016 7:10:06 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
This is so cool, and I was wondering if you guys think I should try this. Please read!

ASC stands for Altered State of Consciousness. Examples of this are ordinary waking state, nondreaming sleep, dreaming sleep, hypnosis, alcohol intoxication, marijuana intoxication, and meditative states.

This interests me, but since drugs and alcohol are prohibited for my age, I can achieve ASC through sleeping, meditation, hypnosis, or binaural beats. Sleeping is boring, so I will focus on meditation and binaural beats.

bSoC=baseline State of Consciousness= The b-SoC is an active, stable, overall patterning of psychological functions which, via multiple stabilization relationships (loading, positive and negative feedback, and limiting) among its constituent parts, maintains it identity in spite of environmental changes. [1]

To achieve an ASC, you must disrupt the stabilization of your b-SoC, to do this you must interfere with the loading, positive and negative feedback, and limiting processes/structures that keep your psychological structures operating within their ordinary range. Several stabilization processes must be disrupted. If, for example, someone were to clap his hands loudly right now while you are reading, you would be somewhat startled. Your level of activation would be increased and you might even jump, but it is doubtful that you would enter a d-ASC. Throwing a totally unexpected and intense stimulus into your own mind could cause a momentary shift within the pattern of your ordinary d-SoC but not a transition to a d-ASC. If you were drowsy it might totally disrupt one or two stabilization processes for a moment, but since multiple stabilization processes are ongoing on, this would not be sufficient to alter your state of consciousness. (paraphrased from 1)

So the first operation in inducing a d-ASC is to disrupt enough stabilization process to a great enough extent that the baseline pattern of consciousness cannot maintain its integrity. [1]

Drugs (and alcohol) are useful to achieve a desirable ASC, but can also be achieved through meditation, and binaural beats.

This interests me, but since drugs and alcohol are prohibited for my age, I can achieve ASC through sleeping, meditation, hypnosis, or binaural beats. Sleeping is boring, so I will focus on meditation and binaural beats. I won't do hypnosis because meditation and binaural beats will take up too much room.

For meditation:

"Most meditation techniques involve, as the initial step, sitting absolutely still in a posture that is not only comfortable, but that involves keeping the head, neck, and spine in a straight vertical line. A small but significant amount of muscular effort is needed to maintain this posture. Like the comfortable position assumed for inducing sleep or hypnosis, the comfortable posture in meditation allows various kinesthetic receptors to adapt out, so the body image generally fades. In contrast with going to sleep, the fact that a slight amount of muscular effort is needed to hold the body in this upright position prevents sleep from occurring for most people. Hypnotic induction procedures can allow the subject to slip in and out of actual sleep, but this is usually quite disruptive in meditative procedures, as the person begins to fall over.
Since much of a person's sense of identity comes from his body image, the fading of the body in a comfortable, steady posture also tends to reduce his sense of identity, thus helping to destabilize his b-SoC and to free energy.
Sitting absolutely still, not acting, also frees energy that would otherwise be automatically absorbed in acting: meditation is a technically simplified situation in this way.
The vertical posture for head, neck, and spine is also of theoretical importance in meditation systems that believe that a latent human potentiality, the Kundalini force, is stored at the base of the spine and may flow upward, activating various other postulated latent potentials, the psychic energy centers or chakras, as it rises.

Since the meditator is sitting absolutely still, his muscular subsystem similarly has little to do beyond postural maintenance. This further reduces loading stabilization. Thus many sources of activity that maintain ordinary d-SoC fade out when the meditative posture is assumed." [1]


Binaural beats:
"A binaural beat is an auditory illusion perceived when two different pure-tone sine waves, both with frequencies lower than 1500 Hz, with less than a 40 Hz difference between them, are presented to a listener dichotically, that is one through each ear. For example, if a 530 Hz pure tone is presented to a subject's right ear, while a 520 Hz pure tone is presented to the subject's left ear, the listener will perceive the auditory illusion of a third tone, in addition to the two pure-tones presented to each ear. The third sound is called a binaural beat, and in this example would have a perceived pitch correlating to a frequency of 10 Hz, that being the difference between the 530 Hz and 520 Hz pure tones presented to each ear." [2]

Somehow, it disrupts your processes and you transition to an ASC, and you basically become high, I'm kinda scared to try it. What do you guys think?

[1] http://www.psychedelic-library.org...
[2] https://en.wikipedia.org...
n7
Posts: 1,360
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1/3/2016 11:48:36 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
I've actually tried binaural beats before. I don't know if it's a placebo effect or not, but there is something to them. The sleep ones absolutely work with me, as do the general relaxation ones. The ones that try simulate alertness work to an extent, but it never felt like I've just taken a powerful stimulant.

I've also used self-hypnosis before. It definitely is an ASC, it's not so much a high, but a completely unique feeling. I have used it to step out of the shower into 29 degree F weather and found it tolerable.
404 coherent debate topic not found. Please restart the debate with clear resolution.


Uphold Marxist-Leninist-Maoist-Sargonist-n7ism.
Hayd
Posts: 4,022
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1/4/2016 1:56:16 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 1/3/2016 11:48:36 PM, n7 wrote:
I've actually tried binaural beats before. I don't know if it's a placebo effect or not, but there is something to them. The sleep ones absolutely work with me, as do the general relaxation ones. The ones that try simulate alertness work to an extent, but it never felt like I've just taken a powerful stimulant.

I've also used self-hypnosis before. It definitely is an ASC, it's not so much a high, but a completely unique feeling. I have used it to step out of the shower into 29 degree F weather and found it tolerable.

So the binaural beats feels relaxing and calming?

I used "high" to attract attention XD
Diqiucun_Cunmin
Posts: 2,710
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1/6/2016 3:26:40 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
I think that if I see a peer-reviewed journal article that follows the scientific method confirming that they work, then they likely work.

There aren't many sources that corroborate this claim, but I found this peer-reviewed study on Google scholar:
http://prosopopeia.sics.se...

The article looks... kinda boring lol, but I've read the abstract, and if the researchers were honest, binaural beats do seem to be capable of altering mood. Dunno about the mechanisms behind it, but it looks promising to me. A few more studies in independent journals and I'll probably believe it :P
The thing is, I hate relativism. I hate relativism more than I hate everything else, excepting, maybe, fibreglass powerboats... What it overlooks, to put it briefly and crudely, is the fixed structure of human nature. - Jerry Fodor

Don't be a stat cynic:
http://www.debate.org...

Response to conservative views on deforestation:
http://www.debate.org...

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sadolite
Posts: 8,842
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1/7/2016 12:54:34 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
Having hobbies works just as well.
It's not your views that divide us, it's what you think my views should be that divides us.

If you think I will give up my rights and forsake social etiquette to make you "FEEL" better you are sadly mistaken

If liberal democrats would just stop shooting people gun violence would drop by 90%
wembley
Posts: 58
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1/7/2016 3:07:10 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 1/3/2016 7:10:06 PM, Hayd wrote:
This is so cool, and I was wondering if you guys think I should try this. Please read!

ASC stands for Altered State of Consciousness. Examples of this are ordinary waking state, nondreaming sleep, dreaming sleep, hypnosis, alcohol intoxication, marijuana intoxication, and meditative states.

This interests me, but since drugs and alcohol are prohibited for my age, I can achieve ASC through sleeping, meditation, hypnosis, or binaural beats. Sleeping is boring, so I will focus on meditation and binaural beats.

bSoC=baseline State of Consciousness= The b-SoC is an active, stable, overall patterning of psychological functions which, via multiple stabilization relationships (loading, positive and negative feedback, and limiting) among its constituent parts, maintains it identity in spite of environmental changes. [1]

To achieve an ASC, you must disrupt the stabilization of your b-SoC, to do this you must interfere with the loading, positive and negative feedback, and limiting processes/structures that keep your psychological structures operating within their ordinary range. Several stabilization processes must be disrupted. If, for example, someone were to clap his hands loudly right now while you are reading, you would be somewhat startled. Your level of activation would be increased and you might even jump, but it is doubtful that you would enter a d-ASC. Throwing a totally unexpected and intense stimulus into your own mind could cause a momentary shift within the pattern of your ordinary d-SoC but not a transition to a d-ASC. If you were drowsy it might totally disrupt one or two stabilization processes for a moment, but since multiple stabilization processes are ongoing on, this would not be sufficient to alter your state of consciousness. (paraphrased from 1)

So the first operation in inducing a d-ASC is to disrupt enough stabilization process to a great enough extent that the baseline pattern of consciousness cannot maintain its integrity. [1]

Drugs (and alcohol) are useful to achieve a desirable ASC, but can also be achieved through meditation, and binaural beats.

This interests me, but since drugs and alcohol are prohibited for my age, I can achieve ASC through sleeping, meditation, hypnosis, or binaural beats. Sleeping is boring, so I will focus on meditation and binaural beats. I won't do hypnosis because meditation and binaural beats will take up too much room.

For meditation:

"Most meditation techniques involve, as the initial step, sitting absolutely still in a posture that is not only comfortable, but that involves keeping the head, neck, and spine in a straight vertical line. A small but significant amount of muscular effort is needed to maintain this posture. Like the comfortable position assumed for inducing sleep or hypnosis, the comfortable posture in meditation allows various kinesthetic receptors to adapt out, so the body image generally fades. In contrast with going to sleep, the fact that a slight amount of muscular effort is needed to hold the body in this upright position prevents sleep from occurring for most people. Hypnotic induction procedures can allow the subject to slip in and out of actual sleep, but this is usually quite disruptive in meditative procedures, as the person begins to fall over.
Since much of a person's sense of identity comes from his body image, the fading of the body in a comfortable, steady posture also tends to reduce his sense of identity, thus helping to destabilize his b-SoC and to free energy.
Sitting absolutely still, not acting, also frees energy that would otherwise be automatically absorbed in acting: meditation is a technically simplified situation in this way.
The vertical posture for head, neck, and spine is also of theoretical importance in meditation systems that believe that a latent human potentiality, the Kundalini force, is stored at the base of the spine and may flow upward, activating various other postulated latent potentials, the psychic energy centers or chakras, as it rises.

Since the meditator is sitting absolutely still, his muscular subsystem similarly has little to do beyond postural maintenance. This further reduces loading stabilization. Thus many sources of activity that maintain ordinary d-SoC fade out when the meditative posture is assumed." [1]


Binaural beats:
"A binaural beat is an auditory illusion perceived when two different pure-tone sine waves, both with frequencies lower than 1500 Hz, with less than a 40 Hz difference between them, are presented to a listener dichotically, that is one through each ear. For example, if a 530 Hz pure tone is presented to a subject's right ear, while a 520 Hz pure tone is presented to the subject's left ear, the listener will perceive the auditory illusion of a third tone, in addition to the two pure-tones presented to each ear. The third sound is called a binaural beat, and in this example would have a perceived pitch correlating to a frequency of 10 Hz, that being the difference between the 530 Hz and 520 Hz pure tones presented to each ear." [2]

Somehow, it disrupts your processes and you transition to an ASC, and you basically become high, I'm kinda scared to try it. What do you guys think?

[1] http://www.psychedelic-library.org...
[2] https://en.wikipedia.org...

Anything is possible with God.
wembley
Posts: 58
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1/7/2016 3:11:05 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 1/7/2016 3:08:58 AM, Hayd wrote:
At 1/7/2016 3:07:10 AM, wembley wrote:
Anything is possible with God.

fvck off :

God made that possible too.
Hayd
Posts: 4,022
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1/7/2016 3:14:40 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 1/7/2016 3:11:05 AM, wembley wrote:
At 1/7/2016 3:08:58 AM, Hayd wrote:
At 1/7/2016 3:07:10 AM, wembley wrote:
Anything is possible with God.

fvck off :

God made that possible too.

Sadly God didn't give you the intelligence to get the hint to fvck off and stop derailing this thread.
wembley
Posts: 58
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1/7/2016 3:16:49 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 1/7/2016 3:14:40 AM, Hayd wrote:
At 1/7/2016 3:11:05 AM, wembley wrote:
At 1/7/2016 3:08:58 AM, Hayd wrote:
At 1/7/2016 3:07:10 AM, wembley wrote:
Anything is possible with God.

fvck off :

God made that possible too.

Sadly God didn't give you the intelligence to get the hint to fvck off and stop derailing this thread. :

You're the one who derailed it. I was saying anything is possible with God when it comes to getting high without drugs. He is the author of all things.
sdavio
Posts: 1,801
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1/7/2016 6:24:25 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
If people get an effect from binaural beats, it's just from the sound, like there's no difference between them and the feeling you would get from listening to music. So it's just really bad drone music, pretty much.
"Logic is the money of the mind." - Karl Marx
sadolite
Posts: 8,842
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1/7/2016 10:31:24 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 1/7/2016 3:09:56 AM, Hayd wrote:
At 1/7/2016 12:54:34 AM, sadolite wrote:
Having hobbies works just as well.

They don't alter your state of consciousness

Oh really, I disagree.
It's not your views that divide us, it's what you think my views should be that divides us.

If you think I will give up my rights and forsake social etiquette to make you "FEEL" better you are sadly mistaken

If liberal democrats would just stop shooting people gun violence would drop by 90%
Hayd
Posts: 4,022
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1/8/2016 2:40:55 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 1/7/2016 10:31:24 PM, sadolite wrote:
At 1/7/2016 3:09:56 AM, Hayd wrote:
At 1/7/2016 12:54:34 AM, sadolite wrote:
Having hobbies works just as well.

They don't alter your state of consciousness

Oh really, I disagree.

If you would have read my post, in order to ASC you have to input intense stimuli to shutdown the functions of you b-SoC and thus transfer into an ASC. How does having a hobby overload your functions?
sadolite
Posts: 8,842
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1/9/2016 3:38:20 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 1/8/2016 2:40:55 AM, Hayd wrote:
At 1/7/2016 10:31:24 PM, sadolite wrote:
At 1/7/2016 3:09:56 AM, Hayd wrote:
At 1/7/2016 12:54:34 AM, sadolite wrote:
Having hobbies works just as well.

They don't alter your state of consciousness

Oh really, I disagree.

If you would have read my post, in order to ASC you have to input intense stimuli to shutdown the functions of you b-SoC and thus transfer into an ASC. How does having a hobby overload your functions?

Adrenalin rush
It's not your views that divide us, it's what you think my views should be that divides us.

If you think I will give up my rights and forsake social etiquette to make you "FEEL" better you are sadly mistaken

If liberal democrats would just stop shooting people gun violence would drop by 90%
RyuuKyuzo
Posts: 3,074
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1/9/2016 3:48:21 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
The highest I get sans drugs (or maybe even counting those times) is first thing when I wake up in the morning. For whatever reason, if I get a full night's sleep, I wake up feeling like my blood is made of heroin. I assume it's because of the testosterone-boost the body gets in the morning.

Feels good, man.
If you're reading this, you're awesome and you should feel awesome.
zmikecuber
Posts: 4,093
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1/11/2016 3:28:34 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 1/9/2016 3:48:21 PM, RyuuKyuzo wrote:
The highest I get sans drugs (or maybe even counting those times) is first thing when I wake up in the morning. For whatever reason, if I get a full night's sleep, I wake up feeling like my blood is made of heroin. I assume it's because of the testosterone-boost the body gets in the morning.

Feels good, man.

Yup. And since you're a weightlifter thats boosting your test alot.
"Delete your fvcking sig" -1hard

"primal man had the habit, when he came into contact with fire, of satisfying the infantile desire connected with it, by putting it out with a stream of his urine... Putting out the fire by micturating was therefore a kind of sexual act with a male, an enjoyment of sexual potency in a homosexual competition."
RyuuKyuzo
Posts: 3,074
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1/11/2016 3:31:55 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 1/11/2016 3:28:34 AM, zmikecuber wrote:
At 1/9/2016 3:48:21 PM, RyuuKyuzo wrote:
The highest I get sans drugs (or maybe even counting those times) is first thing when I wake up in the morning. For whatever reason, if I get a full night's sleep, I wake up feeling like my blood is made of heroin. I assume it's because of the testosterone-boost the body gets in the morning.

Feels good, man.

Yup. And since you're a weightlifter thats boosting your test alot.

I guess, but the human body has so little test in it that even someone with high-T has virtually no testosterone in their body. It's strange to think such a trace hormone could make such a big difference in mood.
If you're reading this, you're awesome and you should feel awesome.
zmikecuber
Posts: 4,093
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1/11/2016 3:34:05 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 1/11/2016 3:31:55 AM, RyuuKyuzo wrote:
At 1/11/2016 3:28:34 AM, zmikecuber wrote:
At 1/9/2016 3:48:21 PM, RyuuKyuzo wrote:
The highest I get sans drugs (or maybe even counting those times) is first thing when I wake up in the morning. For whatever reason, if I get a full night's sleep, I wake up feeling like my blood is made of heroin. I assume it's because of the testosterone-boost the body gets in the morning.

Feels good, man.

Yup. And since you're a weightlifter thats boosting your test alot.

I guess, but the human body has so little test in it that even someone with high-T has virtually no testosterone in their body. It's strange to think such a trace hormone could make such a big difference in mood.

Hmmm... that's true. Weird how that is, considering how much it affects your body too
"Delete your fvcking sig" -1hard

"primal man had the habit, when he came into contact with fire, of satisfying the infantile desire connected with it, by putting it out with a stream of his urine... Putting out the fire by micturating was therefore a kind of sexual act with a male, an enjoyment of sexual potency in a homosexual competition."
RyuuKyuzo
Posts: 3,074
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1/11/2016 3:47:05 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 1/11/2016 3:34:05 AM, zmikecuber wrote:
At 1/11/2016 3:31:55 AM, RyuuKyuzo wrote:
At 1/11/2016 3:28:34 AM, zmikecuber wrote:
At 1/9/2016 3:48:21 PM, RyuuKyuzo wrote:
The highest I get sans drugs (or maybe even counting those times) is first thing when I wake up in the morning. For whatever reason, if I get a full night's sleep, I wake up feeling like my blood is made of heroin. I assume it's because of the testosterone-boost the body gets in the morning.

Feels good, man.

Yup. And since you're a weightlifter thats boosting your test alot.

I guess, but the human body has so little test in it that even someone with high-T has virtually no testosterone in their body. It's strange to think such a trace hormone could make such a big difference in mood.

Hmmm... that's true. Weird how that is, considering how much it affects your body too

Ironically, testosterone is actually pretty sh*tty at building muscle. Someone with 300ng/dl test has about the same capacity for building muscle as someone with 1000 ng/dl. This is why bodybuilders will shoot up 500-1000mg+ of test, because higher test levels really only boost muscle growth if you can increase your free-testosterone levels an absurd amount.

Like, even 300mg of test per week isn't enough to do jack sh*t for you, and for most people that's already about 2,000,000x their natural test level. This is also why natural test-boosters don't do much for muscle-growth, because a 40% boost in testosterone doesn't even come close to what you'd need.
If you're reading this, you're awesome and you should feel awesome.
zmikecuber
Posts: 4,093
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1/11/2016 3:49:13 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 1/11/2016 3:47:05 AM, RyuuKyuzo wrote:
At 1/11/2016 3:34:05 AM, zmikecuber wrote:
At 1/11/2016 3:31:55 AM, RyuuKyuzo wrote:
At 1/11/2016 3:28:34 AM, zmikecuber wrote:
At 1/9/2016 3:48:21 PM, RyuuKyuzo wrote:
The highest I get sans drugs (or maybe even counting those times) is first thing when I wake up in the morning. For whatever reason, if I get a full night's sleep, I wake up feeling like my blood is made of heroin. I assume it's because of the testosterone-boost the body gets in the morning.

Feels good, man.

Yup. And since you're a weightlifter thats boosting your test alot.

I guess, but the human body has so little test in it that even someone with high-T has virtually no testosterone in their body. It's strange to think such a trace hormone could make such a big difference in mood.

Hmmm... that's true. Weird how that is, considering how much it affects your body too

Ironically, testosterone is actually pretty sh*tty at building muscle. Someone with 300ng/dl test has about the same capacity for building muscle as someone with 1000 ng/dl. This is why bodybuilders will shoot up 500-1000mg+ of test, because higher test levels really only boost muscle growth if you can increase your free-testosterone levels an absurd amount.

Like, even 300mg of test per week isn't enough to do jack sh*t for you, and for most people that's already about 2,000,000x their natural test level. This is also why natural test-boosters don't do much for muscle-growth, because a 40% boost in testosterone doesn't even come close to what you'd need.

Really? That's interesting... I've known a couple guys on gear who offered to sell to me, but I didn't take them up on the offer, lol.
"Delete your fvcking sig" -1hard

"primal man had the habit, when he came into contact with fire, of satisfying the infantile desire connected with it, by putting it out with a stream of his urine... Putting out the fire by micturating was therefore a kind of sexual act with a male, an enjoyment of sexual potency in a homosexual competition."
RyuuKyuzo
Posts: 3,074
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1/11/2016 3:57:13 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 1/11/2016 3:49:13 AM, zmikecuber wrote:
At 1/11/2016 3:47:05 AM, RyuuKyuzo wrote:
At 1/11/2016 3:34:05 AM, zmikecuber wrote:
At 1/11/2016 3:31:55 AM, RyuuKyuzo wrote:
At 1/11/2016 3:28:34 AM, zmikecuber wrote:
At 1/9/2016 3:48:21 PM, RyuuKyuzo wrote:
The highest I get sans drugs (or maybe even counting those times) is first thing when I wake up in the morning. For whatever reason, if I get a full night's sleep, I wake up feeling like my blood is made of heroin. I assume it's because of the testosterone-boost the body gets in the morning.

Feels good, man.

Yup. And since you're a weightlifter thats boosting your test alot.

I guess, but the human body has so little test in it that even someone with high-T has virtually no testosterone in their body. It's strange to think such a trace hormone could make such a big difference in mood.

Hmmm... that's true. Weird how that is, considering how much it affects your body too

Ironically, testosterone is actually pretty sh*tty at building muscle. Someone with 300ng/dl test has about the same capacity for building muscle as someone with 1000 ng/dl. This is why bodybuilders will shoot up 500-1000mg+ of test, because higher test levels really only boost muscle growth if you can increase your free-testosterone levels an absurd amount.

Like, even 300mg of test per week isn't enough to do jack sh*t for you, and for most people that's already about 2,000,000x their natural test level. This is also why natural test-boosters don't do much for muscle-growth, because a 40% boost in testosterone doesn't even come close to what you'd need.

Really? That's interesting... I've known a couple guys on gear who offered to sell to me, but I didn't take them up on the offer, lol.

Smart move. It's really not worth the trade-off unless you're a professional athlete.
If you're reading this, you're awesome and you should feel awesome.
zmikecuber
Posts: 4,093
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1/11/2016 3:58:51 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 1/11/2016 3:57:13 AM, RyuuKyuzo wrote:
At 1/11/2016 3:49:13 AM, zmikecuber wrote:
At 1/11/2016 3:47:05 AM, RyuuKyuzo wrote:
At 1/11/2016 3:34:05 AM, zmikecuber wrote:
At 1/11/2016 3:31:55 AM, RyuuKyuzo wrote:
At 1/11/2016 3:28:34 AM, zmikecuber wrote:
At 1/9/2016 3:48:21 PM, RyuuKyuzo wrote:
The highest I get sans drugs (or maybe even counting those times) is first thing when I wake up in the morning. For whatever reason, if I get a full night's sleep, I wake up feeling like my blood is made of heroin. I assume it's because of the testosterone-boost the body gets in the morning.

Feels good, man.

Yup. And since you're a weightlifter thats boosting your test alot.

I guess, but the human body has so little test in it that even someone with high-T has virtually no testosterone in their body. It's strange to think such a trace hormone could make such a big difference in mood.

Hmmm... that's true. Weird how that is, considering how much it affects your body too

Ironically, testosterone is actually pretty sh*tty at building muscle. Someone with 300ng/dl test has about the same capacity for building muscle as someone with 1000 ng/dl. This is why bodybuilders will shoot up 500-1000mg+ of test, because higher test levels really only boost muscle growth if you can increase your free-testosterone levels an absurd amount.

Like, even 300mg of test per week isn't enough to do jack sh*t for you, and for most people that's already about 2,000,000x their natural test level. This is also why natural test-boosters don't do much for muscle-growth, because a 40% boost in testosterone doesn't even come close to what you'd need.

Really? That's interesting... I've known a couple guys on gear who offered to sell to me, but I didn't take them up on the offer, lol.

Smart move. It's really not worth the trade-off unless you're a professional athlete.

Any opinion on creatine?
"Delete your fvcking sig" -1hard

"primal man had the habit, when he came into contact with fire, of satisfying the infantile desire connected with it, by putting it out with a stream of his urine... Putting out the fire by micturating was therefore a kind of sexual act with a male, an enjoyment of sexual potency in a homosexual competition."
RyuuKyuzo
Posts: 3,074
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1/11/2016 4:02:12 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 1/11/2016 3:58:51 AM, zmikecuber wrote:
At 1/11/2016 3:57:13 AM, RyuuKyuzo wrote:
At 1/11/2016 3:49:13 AM, zmikecuber wrote:
At 1/11/2016 3:47:05 AM, RyuuKyuzo wrote:
At 1/11/2016 3:34:05 AM, zmikecuber wrote:
At 1/11/2016 3:31:55 AM, RyuuKyuzo wrote:
At 1/11/2016 3:28:34 AM, zmikecuber wrote:
At 1/9/2016 3:48:21 PM, RyuuKyuzo wrote:
The highest I get sans drugs (or maybe even counting those times) is first thing when I wake up in the morning. For whatever reason, if I get a full night's sleep, I wake up feeling like my blood is made of heroin. I assume it's because of the testosterone-boost the body gets in the morning.

Feels good, man.

Yup. And since you're a weightlifter thats boosting your test alot.

I guess, but the human body has so little test in it that even someone with high-T has virtually no testosterone in their body. It's strange to think such a trace hormone could make such a big difference in mood.

Hmmm... that's true. Weird how that is, considering how much it affects your body too

Ironically, testosterone is actually pretty sh*tty at building muscle. Someone with 300ng/dl test has about the same capacity for building muscle as someone with 1000 ng/dl. This is why bodybuilders will shoot up 500-1000mg+ of test, because higher test levels really only boost muscle growth if you can increase your free-testosterone levels an absurd amount.

Like, even 300mg of test per week isn't enough to do jack sh*t for you, and for most people that's already about 2,000,000x their natural test level. This is also why natural test-boosters don't do much for muscle-growth, because a 40% boost in testosterone doesn't even come close to what you'd need.

Really? That's interesting... I've known a couple guys on gear who offered to sell to me, but I didn't take them up on the offer, lol.

Smart move. It's really not worth the trade-off unless you're a professional athlete.

Any opinion on creatine?

I'm a non-responder, but from what I've read, creatine monohydrate is the best.
If you're reading this, you're awesome and you should feel awesome.
zmikecuber
Posts: 4,093
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1/11/2016 4:03:39 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 1/11/2016 4:02:12 AM, RyuuKyuzo wrote:
At 1/11/2016 3:58:51 AM, zmikecuber wrote:
At 1/11/2016 3:57:13 AM, RyuuKyuzo wrote:
At 1/11/2016 3:49:13 AM, zmikecuber wrote:
At 1/11/2016 3:47:05 AM, RyuuKyuzo wrote:
At 1/11/2016 3:34:05 AM, zmikecuber wrote:
At 1/11/2016 3:31:55 AM, RyuuKyuzo wrote:
At 1/11/2016 3:28:34 AM, zmikecuber wrote:
At 1/9/2016 3:48:21 PM, RyuuKyuzo wrote:
The highest I get sans drugs (or maybe even counting those times) is first thing when I wake up in the morning. For whatever reason, if I get a full night's sleep, I wake up feeling like my blood is made of heroin. I assume it's because of the testosterone-boost the body gets in the morning.

Feels good, man.

Yup. And since you're a weightlifter thats boosting your test alot.

I guess, but the human body has so little test in it that even someone with high-T has virtually no testosterone in their body. It's strange to think such a trace hormone could make such a big difference in mood.

Hmmm... that's true. Weird how that is, considering how much it affects your body too

Ironically, testosterone is actually pretty sh*tty at building muscle. Someone with 300ng/dl test has about the same capacity for building muscle as someone with 1000 ng/dl. This is why bodybuilders will shoot up 500-1000mg+ of test, because higher test levels really only boost muscle growth if you can increase your free-testosterone levels an absurd amount.

Like, even 300mg of test per week isn't enough to do jack sh*t for you, and for most people that's already about 2,000,000x their natural test level. This is also why natural test-boosters don't do much for muscle-growth, because a 40% boost in testosterone doesn't even come close to what you'd need.

Really? That's interesting... I've known a couple guys on gear who offered to sell to me, but I didn't take them up on the offer, lol.

Smart move. It's really not worth the trade-off unless you're a professional athlete.

Any opinion on creatine?

I'm a non-responder, but from what I've read, creatine monohydrate is the best.

Ahh... I recently cycled off, and lost like four or five pounds, despite eating a ton over Christmas, so I think it does work for me at least to some degree...
"Delete your fvcking sig" -1hard

"primal man had the habit, when he came into contact with fire, of satisfying the infantile desire connected with it, by putting it out with a stream of his urine... Putting out the fire by micturating was therefore a kind of sexual act with a male, an enjoyment of sexual potency in a homosexual competition."
RyuuKyuzo
Posts: 3,074
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1/11/2016 4:09:19 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 1/11/2016 4:03:39 AM, zmikecuber wrote:
At 1/11/2016 4:02:12 AM, RyuuKyuzo wrote:
At 1/11/2016 3:58:51 AM, zmikecuber wrote:
At 1/11/2016 3:57:13 AM, RyuuKyuzo wrote:
At 1/11/2016 3:49:13 AM, zmikecuber wrote:
At 1/11/2016 3:47:05 AM, RyuuKyuzo wrote:
At 1/11/2016 3:34:05 AM, zmikecuber wrote:
At 1/11/2016 3:31:55 AM, RyuuKyuzo wrote:
At 1/11/2016 3:28:34 AM, zmikecuber wrote:
At 1/9/2016 3:48:21 PM, RyuuKyuzo wrote:
The highest I get sans drugs (or maybe even counting those times) is first thing when I wake up in the morning. For whatever reason, if I get a full night's sleep, I wake up feeling like my blood is made of heroin. I assume it's because of the testosterone-boost the body gets in the morning.

Feels good, man.

Yup. And since you're a weightlifter thats boosting your test alot.

I guess, but the human body has so little test in it that even someone with high-T has virtually no testosterone in their body. It's strange to think such a trace hormone could make such a big difference in mood.

Hmmm... that's true. Weird how that is, considering how much it affects your body too

Ironically, testosterone is actually pretty sh*tty at building muscle. Someone with 300ng/dl test has about the same capacity for building muscle as someone with 1000 ng/dl. This is why bodybuilders will shoot up 500-1000mg+ of test, because higher test levels really only boost muscle growth if you can increase your free-testosterone levels an absurd amount.

Like, even 300mg of test per week isn't enough to do jack sh*t for you, and for most people that's already about 2,000,000x their natural test level. This is also why natural test-boosters don't do much for muscle-growth, because a 40% boost in testosterone doesn't even come close to what you'd need.

Really? That's interesting... I've known a couple guys on gear who offered to sell to me, but I didn't take them up on the offer, lol.

Smart move. It's really not worth the trade-off unless you're a professional athlete.

Any opinion on creatine?

I'm a non-responder, but from what I've read, creatine monohydrate is the best.

Ahh... I recently cycled off, and lost like four or five pounds, despite eating a ton over Christmas, so I think it does work for me at least to some degree...

Well, any weight loss from coming off creatine is just water-weight, so it's no big deal.
If you're reading this, you're awesome and you should feel awesome.
shnarkle
Posts: 68
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7/3/2016 8:14:01 PM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 1/3/2016 7:10:06 PM, Hayd wrote:
This is so cool, and I was wondering if you guys think I should try this. Please read!

ASC stands for Altered State of Consciousness. Examples of this are ordinary waking state, nondreaming sleep, dreaming sleep, hypnosis, alcohol intoxication, marijuana intoxication, and meditative states.

This interests me, but since drugs and alcohol are prohibited for my age, I can achieve ASC through sleeping, meditation, hypnosis, or binaural beats. Sleeping is boring, so I will focus on meditation and binaural beats.

bSoC=baseline State of Consciousness= The b-SoC is an active, stable, overall patterning of psychological functions which, via multiple stabilization relationships (loading, positive and negative feedback, and limiting) among its constituent parts, maintains it identity in spite of environmental changes. [1]

To achieve an ASC, you must disrupt the stabilization of your b-SoC, to do this you must interfere with the loading, positive and negative feedback, and limiting processes/structures that keep your psychological structures operating within their ordinary range. Several stabilization processes must be disrupted. If, for example, someone were to clap his hands loudly right now while you are reading, you would be somewhat startled. Your level of activation would be increased and you might even jump, but it is doubtful that you would enter a d-ASC. Throwing a totally unexpected and intense stimulus into your own mind could cause a momentary shift within the pattern of your ordinary d-SoC but not a transition to a d-ASC. If you were drowsy it might totally disrupt one or two stabilization processes for a moment, but since multiple stabilization processes are ongoing on, this would not be sufficient to alter your state of consciousness. (paraphrased from 1)

So the first operation in inducing a d-ASC is to disrupt enough stabilization process to a great enough extent that the baseline pattern of consciousness cannot maintain its integrity. [1]

Drugs (and alcohol) are useful to achieve a desirable ASC, but can also be achieved through meditation, and binaural beats.

This interests me, but since drugs and alcohol are prohibited for my age, I can achieve ASC through sleeping, meditation, hypnosis, or binaural beats. Sleeping is boring, so I will focus on meditation and binaural beats. I won't do hypnosis because meditation and binaural beats will take up too much room.

For meditation:

"Most meditation techniques involve, as the initial step, sitting absolutely still in a posture that is not only comfortable, but that involves keeping the head, neck, and spine in a straight vertical line. A small but significant amount of muscular effort is needed to maintain this posture. Like the comfortable position assumed for inducing sleep or hypnosis, the comfortable posture in meditation allows various kinesthetic receptors to adapt out, so the body image generally fades. In contrast with going to sleep, the fact that a slight amount of muscular effort is needed to hold the body in this upright position prevents sleep from occurring for most people. Hypnotic induction procedures can allow the subject to slip in and out of actual sleep, but this is usually quite disruptive in meditative procedures, as the person begins to fall over.
Since much of a person's sense of identity comes from his body image, the fading of the body in a comfortable, steady posture also tends to reduce his sense of identity, thus helping to destabilize his b-SoC and to free energy.
Sitting absolutely still, not acting, also frees energy that would otherwise be automatically absorbed in acting: meditation is a technically simplified situation in this way.
The vertical posture for head, neck, and spine is also of theoretical importance in meditation systems that believe that a latent human potentiality, the Kundalini force, is stored at the base of the spine and may flow upward, activating various other postulated latent potentials, the psychic energy centers or chakras, as it rises.

Since the meditator is sitting absolutely still, his muscular subsystem similarly has little to do beyond postural maintenance. This further reduces loading stabilization. Thus many sources of activity that maintain ordinary d-SoC fade out when the meditative posture is assumed." [1]


Binaural beats:
"A binaural beat is an auditory illusion perceived when two different pure-tone sine waves, both with frequencies lower than 1500 Hz, with less than a 40 Hz difference between them, are presented to a listener dichotically, that is one through each ear. For example, if a 530 Hz pure tone is presented to a subject's right ear, while a 520 Hz pure tone is presented to the subject's left ear, the listener will perceive the auditory illusion of a third tone, in addition to the two pure-tones presented to each ear. The third sound is called a binaural beat, and in this example would have a perceived pitch correlating to a frequency of 10 Hz, that being the difference between the 530 Hz and 520 Hz pure tones presented to each ear." [2]

Somehow, it disrupts your processes and you transition to an ASC, and you basically become high, I'm kinda scared to try it. What do you guys think?

[1] http://www.psychedelic-library.org...
[2] https://en.wikipedia.org...

I highly recommend any type of meditation or contemplative prayer. What most people who have never tried it don't realise is that the real effects are during the rest of the day during your normal waking state. The tedious 20 or 30 minute meditative intervals are what make the rest of your life "high".

If you're interested in "fasttracking" it or getting a sneak peak into what it's like, then I would recommend spending a few bucks for some time in a sensory deprivation "float tank". If you like that, you can make your own or buy one, or just do it the old fashioned way and meditate.