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Why are you correct?

kaido
Posts: 5
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5/8/2016 5:05:32 PM
Posted: 7 months ago
What makes you so sure that -- out of all the millions of intelligent & informed people on this planet -- you have arrived at all the correct beliefs? Why is it that universal academic consensus doesn't exist on any issue, despite everybody having the same cognitive capacities and access to information? If it is really possible to objectively determine the truth, then why doesn't everybody arrive at the same objective truth? How do you explain the massive ideological diversity among intelligent people? Why is it that you, coincidentally, always happen to be on the correct side of every issue? What makes you so sure that your intellectual rivals are wrong?

More to the point, is it possible that epistemology is inherently subjective? i.e. that there isn't any way to objectively determine truth?
~ intellectual humility ~
jdmorgan
Posts: 24
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5/9/2016 3:22:26 AM
Posted: 7 months ago
At 5/8/2016 5:05:32 PM, kaido wrote:
What makes you so sure that -- out of all the millions of intelligent & informed people on this planet -- you have arrived at all the correct beliefs? Why is it that universal academic consensus doesn't exist on any issue, despite everybody having the same cognitive capacities and access to information? If it is really possible to objectively determine the truth, then why doesn't everybody arrive at the same objective truth? How do you explain the massive ideological diversity among intelligent people? Why is it that you, coincidentally, always happen to be on the correct side of every issue? What makes you so sure that your intellectual rivals are wrong?

More to the point, is it possible that epistemology is inherently subjective? i.e. that there isn't any way to objectively determine truth? : :

You're correct. Everything we experience through our created senses is subjective to those senses. That's why Truth has to be revealed to us directly in our minds.
kaido
Posts: 5
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5/9/2016 9:04:24 PM
Posted: 7 months ago
At 5/9/2016 3:22:26 AM, jdmorgan wrote:
You're correct. Everything we experience through our created senses is subjective to those senses. That's why Truth has to be revealed to us directly in our minds.

What?
~ intellectual humility ~
Hayd
Posts: 4,022
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5/10/2016 12:14:12 AM
Posted: 7 months ago
At 5/8/2016 5:05:32 PM, kaido wrote:
What makes you so sure that -- out of all the millions of intelligent & informed people on this planet -- you have arrived at all the correct beliefs? Why is it that universal academic consensus doesn't exist on any issue, despite everybody having the same cognitive capacities and access to information? If it is really possible to objectively determine the truth, then why doesn't everybody arrive at the same objective truth? How do you explain the massive ideological diversity among intelligent people? Why is it that you, coincidentally, always happen to be on the correct side of every issue? What makes you so sure that your intellectual rivals are wrong?

I hope that no one believes that their belief is completely right, for that rules out listening to the other side. Thats what debate is for. To find out the correct belief.

More to the point, is it possible that epistemology is inherently subjective? i.e. that there isn't any way to objectively determine truth?

There are different kinds of truths. Universal truths, etc. Some are truisms, others can be debated.

Whats your experience in philosophy? Im curious
kaido
Posts: 5
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5/10/2016 12:21:14 AM
Posted: 7 months ago
At 5/10/2016 12:14:12 AM, Hayd wrote:
I hope that no one believes that their belief is completely right, for that rules out listening to the other side. Thats what debate is for. To find out the correct belief.

But at any given moment, you believe that the views you currently hold are correct, no?

Whats your experience in philosophy? Im curious

I've studied it as a hobby since I was 14, although I'm considering minoring in it now that I'm in college.
~ intellectual humility ~
Hayd
Posts: 4,022
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5/10/2016 12:38:14 AM
Posted: 7 months ago
At 5/10/2016 12:21:14 AM, kaido wrote:
At 5/10/2016 12:14:12 AM, Hayd wrote:
I hope that no one believes that their belief is completely right, for that rules out listening to the other side. Thats what debate is for. To find out the correct belief.

But at any given moment, you believe that the views you currently hold are correct, no?

Yeah, but Im open to the possibility they could be wrong

Whats your experience in philosophy? Im curious

I've studied it as a hobby since I was 14, although I'm considering minoring in it now that I'm in college.

Thats awesome. Im thinking of minoring too
Sidewalker
Posts: 3,713
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5/10/2016 2:39:11 AM
Posted: 7 months ago
At 5/8/2016 5:05:32 PM, kaido wrote:
What makes you so sure that -- out of all the millions of intelligent & informed people on this planet -- you have arrived at all the correct beliefs?

Who exactly are you talking to? Hardly anybody thinks they have arrived at all the correct beliefs, there is no certainty and I think there are very few well-adjusted people who claim certainty about all of their beliefs.

Why is it that universal academic consensus doesn't exist on any issue, despite everybody having the same cognitive capacities and access to information? If it is really possible to objectively determine the truth, then why doesn't everybody arrive at the same objective truth? How do you explain the massive ideological diversity among intelligent people?

Because we are all different, we are individuals, we have different points of view, different life experiences, different ways of thinking, and different ways of being.

Why is it that you, coincidentally, always happen to be on the correct side of every issue? What makes you so sure that your intellectual rivals are wrong?

Why is it that you assume that all others think they are on the correct side of every issue, are you projecting perhaps?

More to the point, is it possible that epistemology is inherently subjective? i.e. that there isn't any way to objectively determine truth?

Probably not.
"It is one of the commonest of mistakes to consider that the limit of our power of perception is also the limit of all there is to perceive." " C. W. Leadbeater
kaido
Posts: 5
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5/10/2016 8:54:26 PM
Posted: 7 months ago
At 5/10/2016 2:39:11 AM, Sidewalker wrote:
At 5/8/2016 5:05:32 PM, kaido wrote:
What makes you so sure that -- out of all the millions of intelligent & informed people on this planet -- you have arrived at all the correct beliefs?
Who exactly are you talking to? Hardly anybody thinks they have arrived at all the correct beliefs, there is no certainty and I think there are very few well-adjusted people who claim certainty about all of their beliefs.

You're making the same mistake as Hayd. At any given moment, don't you operate under the assumption that the views you currently hold are the correct ones? That's the 'timeframe' under which these questions are being asked.

Why is it that universal academic consensus doesn't exist on any issue, despite everybody having the same cognitive capacities and access to information? If it is really possible to objectively determine the truth, then why doesn't everybody arrive at the same objective truth? How do you explain the massive ideological diversity among intelligent people?
Because we are all different, we are individuals, we have different points of view, different life experiences, different ways of thinking, and different ways of being.

Seems like you agree that epistemology is subjective, then.

The intention of this post was to get non-subjectivists to consider the subjectivist point of view.
~ intellectual humility ~
Emmarie
Posts: 1,907
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5/10/2016 9:56:44 PM
Posted: 7 months ago
At 5/8/2016 5:05:32 PM, kaido wrote:
What makes you so sure that -- out of all the millions of intelligent & informed people on this planet -- you have arrived at all the correct beliefs? Why is it that universal academic consensus doesn't exist on any issue, despite everybody having the same cognitive capacities and access to information? If it is really possible to objectively determine the truth, then why doesn't everybody arrive at the same objective truth? How do you explain the massive ideological diversity among intelligent people? Why is it that you, coincidentally, always happen to be on the correct side of every issue? What makes you so sure that your intellectual rivals are wrong?

More to the point, is it possible that epistemology is inherently subjective? i.e. that there isn't any way to objectively determine truth?
John 8:31 Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed;
32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

I am not quoting this to preach, I am quoting this to explain.

In my opinion, Jesus word that he referred to, is the words that he spoke - while he was a man who walked the earth, not the entire Bible being the word - like many religious people claim. To continue in his word means to apply his teachings to life, and if his word is applied to living, the truth will become known and will set us free.

Free from what? Free from the teachings of those who teach falsehood, of course. Free to know the truth because His teachings have been applied to living and proven by the results within my own spirit, is my experience with with this scripture.

Now don't anybody get their underwear in a bundle, and start questioning me like you question religious people who try to damn others to hell. I am writing about the truth of living according to Jesus' teaching and how that has personally led me to know truth from within, that no amount of reasoning will remove from me.
keithprosser
Posts: 2,066
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5/11/2016 12:20:29 AM
Posted: 7 months ago
You're making the same mistake as Hayd. At any given moment, don't you operate under the assumption that the views you currently hold are the correct ones? That's the 'timeframe' under which these questions are being asked.

I feel as if my views are 'tagged' with an estimate of their likelihood of being correct. I think it is only impossible - logically and psychologically - to think one's current views are definitely false. That is to say I can't sustain simultaneously having the view Paris is the capital of Belgium and thinking that that Paris the is not the captial of Belgium. Without looking it up, I'd say I was 70% sure Pretoria is the capital of South Africa and I would operate on the basis that I was probably right on that, but hedge my bets just in case.

(*after looking it up, South Africa has 3 capitals, of which Pretoria is one. The others are Cape Town and Bloemfontein. At least I didn't guess Jo'burg!).