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Ethics of piracy?

n7
Posts: 1,360
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6/16/2016 6:54:06 PM
Posted: 5 months ago
Is piracy ethically wrong?

If I go to a free public library and rent a book for a week. Over a span of that week I read it and return it. This is totally legal and no one would bat an eye at it. However, let's say I pirate the book and over a span of a week I read it, then delete it. This is illegal, yet the end result is the same. I paid no money, yet read the book. Why is one considered wrong and the other isn't?

One could make the same argument with the borrowing of a movie, so is piracy really that different than sharing?

Plus piracy is what made the vikings and pirates prosper.
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Uphold Marxist-Leninist-Maoist-Sargonist-n7ism.
matt8800
Posts: 2,077
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6/16/2016 7:16:07 PM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 6/16/2016 6:54:06 PM, n7 wrote:
Is piracy ethically wrong?

If I go to a free public library and rent a book for a week. Over a span of that week I read it and return it. This is totally legal and no one would bat an eye at it. However, let's say I pirate the book and over a span of a week I read it, then delete it. This is illegal, yet the end result is the same. I paid no money, yet read the book. Why is one considered wrong and the other isn't?

One could make the same argument with the borrowing of a movie, so is piracy really that different than sharing?

Plus piracy is what made the vikings and pirates prosper.

Yes, stealing can make people prosper financially but I don't think that is a good argument for it.

People didnt invest money and time into music, movies and programs just so they could be freely shared. Because it is appropriated without their permission, it is stealing.

With that said, I am guilty of it. I would rather be honest with myself than lie to myself however. Lets keep our character shortcomings to a minimum.
n7
Posts: 1,360
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6/16/2016 10:06:15 PM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 6/16/2016 7:16:07 PM, matt8800 wrote:
At 6/16/2016 6:54:06 PM, n7 wrote:
Is piracy ethically wrong?

If I go to a free public library and rent a book for a week. Over a span of that week I read it and return it. This is totally legal and no one would bat an eye at it. However, let's say I pirate the book and over a span of a week I read it, then delete it. This is illegal, yet the end result is the same. I paid no money, yet read the book. Why is one considered wrong and the other isn't?

One could make the same argument with the borrowing of a movie, so is piracy really that different than sharing?

Plus piracy is what made the vikings and pirates prosper.

Yes, stealing can make people prosper financially but I don't think that is a good argument for it.

thatsthejoke.jpg
People didnt invest money and time into music, movies and programs just so they could be freely shared. Because it is appropriated without their permission, it is stealing.

So, why isn't borrowing a movie or going to the public library stealing?
With that said, I am guilty of it. I would rather be honest with myself than lie to myself however. Lets keep our character shortcomings to a minimum.
404 coherent debate topic not found. Please restart the debate with clear resolution.


Uphold Marxist-Leninist-Maoist-Sargonist-n7ism.
Subutai
Posts: 3,187
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6/16/2016 10:26:20 PM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 6/16/2016 6:54:06 PM, n7 wrote:
Is piracy ethically wrong?

If I go to a free public library and rent a book for a week. Over a span of that week I read it and return it. This is totally legal and no one would bat an eye at it. However, let's say I pirate the book and over a span of a week I read it, then delete it. This is illegal, yet the end result is the same. I paid no money, yet read the book. Why is one considered wrong and the other isn't?

One could make the same argument with the borrowing of a movie, so is piracy really that different than sharing?

Plus piracy is what made the vikings and pirates prosper.

Assuming the book is paper and not digital, it's probably because a book can't be copied (at least with a lot of effort), and thus can't be distributed and profited from illegally. Renting a book from the library only gives you the ability to read it freely, and you are unable to profit from that book in any illegal fashion. This argument breaks down, however, for digital books and movies, as those can be copied. For these, I can see no justification for deeming piracy unethical.
I'm becoming less defined as days go by, fading away, and well you might say, I'm losing focus, kinda drifting into the abstract in terms of how I see myself.
keithprosser
Posts: 1,948
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6/17/2016 8:11:37 AM
Posted: 5 months ago
At least in the UK and many European countries authors do receive payments for books borrowed from libraries under 'Public Lending Rights' regulations and royalties are/were paid for 'legit' video rentals.

Obviously piracy is not ethical - authors and movie-makers are entitles to the full fruits of their labours, but I confess to being a consumer of pirated movies. I have enough interest in, say, Star Trek 4 to pay 1.99 but not enough to pay 24.99 for it. A pirate purchase is not a legit purchase lost so the real impact of piracy is hard to quantify.
I also buy legit stuff, but the pirates let me see a lot of movies I wouldn't have seen otherwise without spending half my money on cinema trips and videos.

If the pirates went away I would have to buy more legit videos, but maybe I wouln't buy all that many more. I'd just have to put up with never having seen, say, 'Interstellar' - which would be no great loss.
matt8800
Posts: 2,077
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6/17/2016 6:43:50 PM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 6/16/2016 10:06:15 PM, n7 wrote:
At 6/16/2016 7:16:07 PM, matt8800 wrote:
At 6/16/2016 6:54:06 PM, n7 wrote:
Is piracy ethically wrong?

If I go to a free public library and rent a book for a week. Over a span of that week I read it and return it. This is totally legal and no one would bat an eye at it. However, let's say I pirate the book and over a span of a week I read it, then delete it. This is illegal, yet the end result is the same. I paid no money, yet read the book. Why is one considered wrong and the other isn't?

One could make the same argument with the borrowing of a movie, so is piracy really that different than sharing?

Plus piracy is what made the vikings and pirates prosper.

Yes, stealing can make people prosper financially but I don't think that is a good argument for it.

thatsthejoke.jpg
People didnt invest money and time into music, movies and programs just so they could be freely shared. Because it is appropriated without their permission, it is stealing.

So, why isn't borrowing a movie or going to the public library stealing?

It is done within the law and with their knowledge, it is not unethical. If everyone got their music and movies for free, the creators would not be able to make them any more.

If you are going to do something unethical, at least be honest with yourself about it. I am.
n7
Posts: 1,360
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6/18/2016 2:41:01 AM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 6/17/2016 6:43:50 PM, matt8800 wrote:
At 6/16/2016 10:06:15 PM, n7 wrote:
At 6/16/2016 7:16:07 PM, matt8800 wrote:
At 6/16/2016 6:54:06 PM, n7 wrote:
Is piracy ethically wrong?

If I go to a free public library and rent a book for a week. Over a span of that week I read it and return it. This is totally legal and no one would bat an eye at it. However, let's say I pirate the book and over a span of a week I read it, then delete it. This is illegal, yet the end result is the same. I paid no money, yet read the book. Why is one considered wrong and the other isn't?

One could make the same argument with the borrowing of a movie, so is piracy really that different than sharing?

Plus piracy is what made the vikings and pirates prosper.

Yes, stealing can make people prosper financially but I don't think that is a good argument for it.

thatsthejoke.jpg
People didnt invest money and time into music, movies and programs just so they could be freely shared. Because it is appropriated without their permission, it is stealing.

So, why isn't borrowing a movie or going to the public library stealing?

It is done within the law and with their knowledge, it is not unethical.
Is it? Do you consult the film maker every time you loan out a film? Do creators ever make statements about allowing people to borrow their content? Do authors give permission to libraries? Furthermore, I don't think the law decides what's ethical and what's not. It's the other way around, ethics is a guide to what should be law.
If everyone got their music and movies for free, the creators would not be able to make them any more.

Universalizing something doesn't tell us what is and isn't ethical. If everyone worked at say a saw mill, there would be no doctors. But this doesn't mean working at a saw mill is unethical.

It's also unrealistic to think this will happen. There are a ton of people who pirate content, yet creators still make more. Don't most people pirate because they can't afford to pay for the content or want a preview it before they buy anyway?

Worst case scenario, there is a lot of content that are released for free that's backed by fans.

In any event, this is discussing the ramifications of a belief. Not about the content of the belief itself, which is the purpose of this thread.
If you are going to do something unethical, at least be honest with yourself about it. I am.
I haven't even said if I pirate content or not, so there is no way you can know I have some motive to "deceive" myself. This appears just to be an appeal to motive.
404 coherent debate topic not found. Please restart the debate with clear resolution.


Uphold Marxist-Leninist-Maoist-Sargonist-n7ism.
skipsaweirdo
Posts: 1,863
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6/18/2016 7:19:01 AM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 6/16/2016 6:54:06 PM, n7 wrote:
Is piracy ethically wrong?

If I go to a free public library and rent a book for a week. Over a span of that week I read it and return it. This is totally legal and no one would bat an eye at it. However, let's say I pirate the book and over a span of a week I read it, then delete it. This is illegal, yet the end result is the same. I paid no money, yet read the book. Why is one considered wrong and the other isn't?

One could make the same argument with the borrowing of a movie, so is piracy really that different than sharing?

Plus piracy is what made the vikings and pirates prosper.
There is no such thing as piracy unless you get caught.