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Self Sacrifice

Throwback
Posts: 421
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8/11/2016 12:42:23 PM
Posted: 3 months ago
Is there anything worth risking your life? Is there anything for which you would die if necessary?

I'm not entertaining the jackasses who believe in mass murder to get their virgins in the next life. I'm not talking murder/suicide. I'm referring to self defense, or risk of accidental death, or even confronting a violent situation, but with the intent of survival, even if you know survival is unlikely.
When I respond with "OK" don't take it personally. I'm simply being appropriately dismissive.
Deb-8-A-Bull
Posts: 2,181
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8/11/2016 1:23:04 PM
Posted: 3 months ago
At 8/11/2016 12:42:23 PM, Throwback wrote:
Is there anything worth risking your life? Is there anything for which you would die if necessary?

I'm not entertaining the jackasses who believe in mass murder to get their virgins in the next life. I'm not talking murder/suicide. I'm referring to self defense, or risk of accidental death, or even confronting a violent situation, but with the intent of survival, even if you know survival is unlikely.

Loved ones at any cost

And fellow man, for example , if some jackass is murdering people in front of you.
Especially kids and women of any race or religion.
That last part you added . Even if you know survival is unlikely. I would like to think I would help random people from being murdered, but can't be sure . I am sure if thy are being attacked.
I've had a lump of concrete thrown at my face for helping a random in need . I'd still do it again no questions. It's probably not wise , it's just I couldn't help it , it's almost like auto pilot kicks in.
You asking this question , is for me the 1st time I have thought about this scenario I found myself in , in about 4 years . I'm happy I don't think about it and don't lose sleep over it.
Throwback
Posts: 421
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8/11/2016 2:04:51 PM
Posted: 3 months ago
At 8/11/2016 1:23:04 PM, Deb-8-A-Bull wrote:
At 8/11/2016 12:42:23 PM, Throwback wrote:
Is there anything worth risking your life? Is there anything for which you would die if necessary?

I'm not entertaining the jackasses who believe in mass murder to get their virgins in the next life. I'm not talking murder/suicide. I'm referring to self defense, or risk of accidental death, or even confronting a violent situation, but with the intent of survival, even if you know survival is unlikely.

Loved ones at any cost

And fellow man, for example , if some jackass is murdering people in front of you.
Especially kids and women of any race or religion.
That last part you added . Even if you know survival is unlikely. I would like to think I would help random people from being murdered, but can't be sure . I am sure if thy are being attacked.
I've had a lump of concrete thrown at my face for helping a random in need . I'd still do it again no questions. It's probably not wise , it's just I couldn't help it , it's almost like auto pilot kicks in.
You asking this question , is for me the 1st time I have thought about this scenario I found myself in , in about 4 years . I'm happy I don't think about it and don't lose sleep over it.

I like your answers. Sorry I dredge that one up though. That's bad stuff.
When I respond with "OK" don't take it personally. I'm simply being appropriately dismissive.
Heterodox
Posts: 293
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8/11/2016 3:21:15 PM
Posted: 3 months ago
At 8/11/2016 12:42:23 PM, Throwback wrote:
Is there anything worth risking your life? Is there anything for which you would die if necessary?

I'm not entertaining the jackasses who believe in mass murder to get their virgins in the next life. I'm not talking murder/suicide. I'm referring to self defense, or risk of accidental death, or even confronting a violent situation, but with the intent of survival, even if you know survival is unlikely.

I believe you would find the answer to be "yes" for both questions for all people. Though, the requirements would differ as would the "risk evaluation" and what is "necessary".

If you are asking my requirements, you haven't done so clearly. Regardless, they are numerous.
wuliheron
Posts: 105
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8/11/2016 3:45:24 PM
Posted: 3 months ago
Knowing Only the Light

Death may be the blissful silence betwixt the notes of a melody,
When time stretches out beyond the reach of space to contain;
For the greater poetry in motion of our paradox of existence,
For the blissful contentment, knowing I yet know nothing.
For the certainty life is greater, than any will ever know,
What lies beyond, any of our mere mortal imaginations,
What all of our more beautiful words, fail to express.
What all of our feeble concepts fail to ever capture,
What great sciences, must always fail to quantify,
What no keen observation might actually clarify.
A singular infinity beyond all our descriptions,
An infinite diversity, in infinite combination,
All passing before me, lost upon the horizon,
Only to return to me yet again as I surrender.
That place which even a Wu Li Master of space-time,
Respects as the fountain spring, the Mother of All!
The origin of our spark within which cannot die!
Our unspeakable, ignorant wisdom and virtue!
Living well, justly, and beautifully are all one thing,
In giving of ourselves we learn how to receive,
In forgiving others, we pardon ourselves,
In pardoning ourselves learn to live.
Learning, how to be free at last,
Learning how to let go again,
Learning to love, once again!
Love thy neighbor, as thyself!
Trespass not, upon one another,
And none shall trespass upon you.
Opening our heart the mind follows,
Treat others, better than they deserve,
For what comes around, goes around!
Sing the praises to mama and papa!
So all might yet celebrate with you,
Singing the song, every heart shares,
None shall hold anything against you.
In order to live we must all learn to accept death and suffering,
In order live we must all find greater forgiveness and acceptance,
As inevitably the sun must rise once again knowing only the light.
Throwback
Posts: 421
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8/11/2016 4:29:06 PM
Posted: 3 months ago
At 8/11/2016 3:45:24 PM, wuliheron wrote:
Knowing Only the Light

Death may be the blissful silence betwixt the notes of a melody,
When time stretches out beyond the reach of space to contain;
For the greater poetry in motion of our paradox of existence,
For the blissful contentment, knowing I yet know nothing.
For the certainty life is greater, than any will ever know,
What lies beyond, any of our mere mortal imaginations,
What all of our more beautiful words, fail to express.
What all of our feeble concepts fail to ever capture,
What great sciences, must always fail to quantify,
What no keen observation might actually clarify.
A singular infinity beyond all our descriptions,
An infinite diversity, in infinite combination,
All passing before me, lost upon the horizon,
Only to return to me yet again as I surrender.
That place which even a Wu Li Master of space-time,
Respects as the fountain spring, the Mother of All!
The origin of our spark within which cannot die!
Our unspeakable, ignorant wisdom and virtue!
Living well, justly, and beautifully are all one thing,
In giving of ourselves we learn how to receive,
In forgiving others, we pardon ourselves,
In pardoning ourselves learn to live.
Learning, how to be free at last,
Learning how to let go again,
Learning to love, once again!
Love thy neighbor, as thyself!
Trespass not, upon one another,
And none shall trespass upon you.
Opening our heart the mind follows,
Treat others, better than they deserve,
For what comes around, goes around!
Sing the praises to mama and papa!
So all might yet celebrate with you,
Singing the song, every heart shares,
None shall hold anything against you.
In order to live we must all learn to accept death and suffering,
In order live we must all find greater forgiveness and acceptance,
As inevitably the sun must rise once again knowing only the light.

OK
When I respond with "OK" don't take it personally. I'm simply being appropriately dismissive.
wuliheron
Posts: 105
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8/11/2016 7:08:47 PM
Posted: 3 months ago
At 8/11/2016 4:29:06 PM, Throwback wrote:

OK

Appropriately dismissive for an endangered species. According to game theory any evolutionary advancement requires generosity and if you can't stay two steps ahead of the competition you become extinct. The same phenomenon has been noted in newborns that are not held and loved in the first few days tending to die from what is euphemistically labeled a "failure to thrive". You can feed them and take care of their other needs, but they'll die anyway. This has also been observed in the desperately poor among us who tend to die that much sooner when they have nothing to give others.

Darwin himself said something to the effect that sex is never about survival of the fittest, but the most creative. Only the Three Stooges believe its merely a dog-eat-dog world which is one reason the Nazis and Bolsheviks have never dominated this world this long. Life for humans is a social affair and those who forget that fact of life tend to become extinct that much sooner.
Throwback
Posts: 421
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8/11/2016 10:07:37 PM
Posted: 3 months ago
At 8/11/2016 7:08:47 PM, wuliheron wrote:
At 8/11/2016 4:29:06 PM, Throwback wrote:

OK

Appropriately dismissive for an endangered species. According to game theory any evolutionary advancement requires generosity and if you can't stay two steps ahead of the competition you become extinct. The same phenomenon has been noted in newborns that are not held and loved in the first few days tending to die from what is euphemistically labeled a "failure to thrive". You can feed them and take care of their other needs, but they'll die anyway. This has also been observed in the desperately poor among us who tend to die that much sooner when they have nothing to give others.

Darwin himself said something to the effect that sex is never about survival of the fittest, but the most creative. Only the Three Stooges believe its merely a dog-eat-dog world which is one reason the Nazis and Bolsheviks have never dominated this world this long. Life for humans is a social affair and those who forget that fact of life tend to become extinct that much sooner.

OK
When I respond with "OK" don't take it personally. I'm simply being appropriately dismissive.
Emmarie
Posts: 1,907
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8/11/2016 10:39:05 PM
Posted: 3 months ago
At 8/11/2016 1:23:04 PM, Deb-8-A-Bull wrote:
At 8/11/2016 12:42:23 PM, Throwback wrote:
Is there anything worth risking your life? Is there anything for which you would die if necessary?

I'm not entertaining the jackasses who believe in mass murder to get their virgins in the next life. I'm not talking murder/suicide. I'm referring to self defense, or risk of accidental death, or even confronting a violent situation, but with the intent of survival, even if you know survival is unlikely.

Loved ones at any cost

And fellow man, for example , if some jackass is murdering people in front of you.
Especially kids and women of any race or religion.
That last part you added . Even if you know survival is unlikely. I would like to think I would help random people from being murdered, but can't be sure . I am sure if thy are being attacked.
I've had a lump of concrete thrown at my face for helping a random in need . I'd still do it again no questions. It's probably not wise , it's just I couldn't help it , it's almost like auto pilot kicks in.
You asking this question , is for me the 1st time I have thought about this scenario I found myself in , in about 4 years . I'm happy I don't think about it and don't lose sleep over it.
+1
Discipulus_Didicit
Posts: 3,089
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8/12/2016 11:44:20 AM
Posted: 3 months ago
At 8/11/2016 12:42:23 PM, Throwback wrote:
Is there anything worth risking your life? Is there anything for which you would die if necessary?

Given the way human nature is, I highly doubt you will find many if any who would say no to either question.
Cobalt - You could be scum too.
Matt - I suppose. But I also might not be.

Kiri - Yeah, I don't know what DD is doing.
Vaarka - He's doin'a thingy do

DD - The best advice most often goes unheeded.
Wise Man - KYS, DD.
DD - Case in point ^
Throwback
Posts: 421
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8/12/2016 3:19:28 PM
Posted: 3 months ago
At 8/12/2016 11:44:20 AM, Discipulus_Didicit wrote:
At 8/11/2016 12:42:23 PM, Throwback wrote:
Is there anything worth risking your life? Is there anything for which you would die if necessary?

Given the way human nature is, I highly doubt you will find many if any who would say no to either question.

I agree, but I'm sure there are some out there.
When I respond with "OK" don't take it personally. I'm simply being appropriately dismissive.
keithprosser
Posts: 2,014
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8/12/2016 4:08:02 PM
Posted: 3 months ago
Loved ones at any cost
Easy to '+1', but surely not literally true for most people. That would mean going into your house on fire with almost no chance (<0.1%)of surviving yourself when there is no real chance (<0.1%)your loved ones are still alive inside.

People are prepared to take much bigger risks for loved ones (aka 'genetically related individuals') than for strangers, but 'at any cost' sounds good but is over egging it.
Diqiucun_Cunmin
Posts: 2,710
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8/13/2016 11:17:45 AM
Posted: 3 months ago
Loved ones is the only reasonable answer IMO. I don't buy into the 'die for your beliefs' thing.
The thing is, I hate relativism. I hate relativism more than I hate everything else, excepting, maybe, fibreglass powerboats... What it overlooks, to put it briefly and crudely, is the fixed structure of human nature. - Jerry Fodor

Don't be a stat cynic:
http://www.debate.org...

Response to conservative views on deforestation:
http://www.debate.org...

Topics I'd like to debate (not debating ATM): http://tinyurl.com...
matt8800
Posts: 2,077
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8/13/2016 7:03:25 PM
Posted: 3 months ago
At 8/11/2016 12:42:23 PM, Throwback wrote:
Is there anything worth risking your life? Is there anything for which you would die if necessary?

I'm not entertaining the jackasses who believe in mass murder to get their virgins in the next life. I'm not talking murder/suicide. I'm referring to self defense, or risk of accidental death, or even confronting a violent situation, but with the intent of survival, even if you know survival is unlikely.

I don't fear death so, sure. The idea of living as a coward repulses me. Those are just my personal values.
I_Wanna_Rawk
Posts: 480
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8/13/2016 11:05:59 PM
Posted: 3 months ago
At 8/11/2016 12:42:23 PM, Throwback wrote:
Is there anything worth risking your life? Is there anything for which you would die if necessary?

I'm not entertaining the jackasses who believe in mass murder to get their virgins in the next life. I'm not talking murder/suicide. I'm referring to self defense, or risk of accidental death, or even confronting a violent situation, but with the intent of survival, even if you know survival is unlikely.

You defend your kin, you defend your friends, you defend those who have earned your respect. You defend anyone who is being attacked or otherwise harmed, especially those who can't help themselves. In my opinion, anyone who does otherwise is either a coward, immoral or both.