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Question for Objectvist

FREEDO
Posts: 21,057
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3/25/2011 7:27:38 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
How is it your Minarchist ideology rationally follows from your principle of self-interest?

Isn't it true that you say a welfare state will create free-loaders living off the labor of others?

Would it not be in your self-interest to be one of those free-loaders?

Your support for a system which supposedly maximizes others working for their self-interest really means that you are not only looking out for your own but theirs as well.
GRAND POOBAH OF DDO

fnord
FREEDO
Posts: 21,057
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3/25/2011 7:37:45 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 3/25/2011 7:37:11 PM, darkkermit wrote:
If everyone's a freeloader, society produces a lot less, which is not in one's self interest.

Ha.
GRAND POOBAH OF DDO

fnord
Fabian_CH
Posts: 232
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3/25/2011 7:43:09 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
Well, I'm not an Objectivist, but that one's easy to answer.

As far as Objectivism, "rational self-interest" only applies within the limits of everybody's equal individual rights. Thus it cannot by definition be your "rational self-interest" to disregard other's individual rights (in this case, the poperty rights of those that produce the things you want to steal by way of government or otherwise).
"What are we doing? Do we want to feed a starved humanity in order to let it live? Or do we want to strangle its life in order to feed it?"
- Andrei Taganov, We The Living (Ayn Rand)
Ragnar_Rahl
Posts: 19,297
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3/25/2011 8:07:53 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 3/25/2011 7:27:38 PM, FREEDO wrote:
How is it your Minarchist ideology rationally follows from your principle of self-interest?

Isn't it true that you say a welfare state will create free-loaders living off the labor of others?

Would it not be in your self-interest to be one of those free-loaders?
Generally no (people often become such because they are lazy, or because they have no other options, not because they are rational), but remember, Objectivism doesn't declare you can't use the welfare state, it just advocates abolishing it. It is not inconsistent even if you believe that within the context of the welfare state it is better to be free rider than mule, to believe that it is better yet to be outside the context of the welfare state and fly on one's own wings. What one can earn for oneself in a free market is greater than the cost of earning it, even if a 6 billionth share of what can earn (what you get from laboring in a consistent welfare state) is not.
It came to be at its height. It was commanded to command. It was a capital before its first stone was laid. It was a monument to the spirit of man.
FREEDO
Posts: 21,057
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3/25/2011 8:10:06 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 3/25/2011 8:07:53 PM, Ragnar_Rahl wrote:
At 3/25/2011 7:27:38 PM, FREEDO wrote:
How is it your Minarchist ideology rationally follows from your principle of self-interest?

Isn't it true that you say a welfare state will create free-loaders living off the labor of others?

Would it not be in your self-interest to be one of those free-loaders?
Generally no (people often become such because they are lazy, or because they have no other options, not because they are rational), but remember, Objectivism doesn't declare you can't use the welfare state, it just advocates abolishing it. It is not inconsistent even if you believe that within the context of the welfare state it is better to be free rider than mule, to believe that it is better yet to be outside the context of the welfare state and fly on one's own wings. What one can earn for oneself in a free market is greater than the cost of earning it, even if a 6 billionth share of what can earn (what you get from laboring in a consistent welfare state) is not.

This is an okay answer.
GRAND POOBAH OF DDO

fnord