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Medicare?

comoncents
Posts: 5,647
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4/6/2011 8:18:34 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
I understand the libertarian rhetoric, getting rid of such a program, but lets look at the real kinesis.

Lets have a catharsis of sorts, ok?

I am all for free markets unless the market is not adequately holding up. Old people have a lot of health problems. When people have health problems they pay money for healthcare. Healthcare is in the business of making money. Healthcare companies hate when people get sick, so they drop people that are more sick; or make them pay astronomical amounts, more than can be made in a middle class life time. There is not a good market to help old people with health problems. They do not get great coverage unless they are rich, so is medicare of pure moral communitarian need over privatizing it?

People pay into it, so the government is obligated to pay out, no?

What would be your real life solution to medicare?

No savings is enough, even if people are given the money they put into medicare?

What should we do?

Think about it and write something worth reading.

(I understand if we gave healthcare to the invisible hand of the market things maybe different, but you're getting caught up in a utopian argument. I am asking you to participate. Please be apart of this dialectic and refuse your ambition to speak of passions against complete government sustenance.)
Ragnar_Rahl
Posts: 19,297
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4/6/2011 9:23:32 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 4/6/2011 8:18:34 PM, comoncents wrote:
I understand the libertarian rhetoric, getting rid of such a program, but lets look at the real kinesis.

Lets have a catharsis of sorts, ok?

I am all for free markets unless the market is not adequately holding up. Old people have a lot of health problems. When people have health problems they pay money for healthcare. Healthcare is in the business of making money. Healthcare companies hate when people get sick, so they drop people that are more sick; or make them pay astronomical amounts, more than can be made in a middle class life time. There is not a good market to help old people with health problems.
One problem-- what good are the old people doing the other people?

One could say the same thing about the "Aristocrat welfare program.

They do not get great coverage unless they are rich, so is medicare of pure moral communitarian need
There is no such thing as community need. There are the needs of those who are subsidized, and then the needs of those who are stolen from.

People pay into it, so the government is obligated to pay out, no?
The government is obligated to pay it BACK.


No savings is enough, even if people are given the money they put into medicare?

If no savings is enough, then no taxes are enough. Unless you're just saying **** you to people who don't live to old age, thinking they should subsidize those who do. After all, the old people made the same kind of money back in the day the people paying now do. If they saved the money they were taxed, they would have had the same, except with interest added on.
It came to be at its height. It was commanded to command. It was a capital before its first stone was laid. It was a monument to the spirit of man.
innomen
Posts: 10,052
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4/7/2011 1:49:05 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 4/6/2011 8:18:34 PM, comoncents wrote:
I understand the libertarian rhetoric, getting rid of such a program, but lets look at the real kinesis.

Lets have a catharsis of sorts, ok?

I am all for free markets unless the market is not adequately holding up. Old people have a lot of health problems. When people have health problems they pay money for healthcare. Healthcare is in the business of making money. Healthcare companies hate when people get sick, so they drop people that are more sick; or make them pay astronomical amounts, more than can be made in a middle class life time. There is not a good market to help old people with health problems. They do not get great coverage unless they are rich, so is medicare of pure moral communitarian need over privatizing it?

People pay into it, so the government is obligated to pay out, no?

What would be your real life solution to medicare?

No savings is enough, even if people are given the money they put into medicare?

What should we do?

Think about it and write something worth reading.

(I understand if we gave healthcare to the invisible hand of the market things maybe different, but you're getting caught up in a utopian argument. I am asking you to participate. Please be apart of this dialectic and refuse your ambition to speak of passions against complete government sustenance.)

I did my taxes about a month ago. In 2010 i paid enough taxes to have purchased a very nice, expensive imported sports car. Now, if my taxes were just half that, and take the other half and put in a health care account for me that i manage, it would be a recommended fund much like my 401K a great deal of the funding would be eliminated.

Then we attack the costs which are largely the result of lawyers and malpractice lawsuits. If we made frivolous lawsuits a criminal liability by those who mount them, and hold those people accountable for their waste of resources this would reduce costs tremendously. Of course lawyers/politicians are not likely to reform their cash cow.

There are other things that could be done, but i don't have the time to address them at the moment.
RoyLatham
Posts: 4,488
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4/7/2011 2:02:48 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
Having government pay for healthcare makes it more expensive, so there is a net loss in taking money away from people then giving it back to them. The alternatives to Medicare are (1) force people to save for their old age so they are not dependent on government, (2) provide vouchers for healthcare rather than attempt to control providers, (3) means test Medicare and other benefit recipients. People plan based upon current policies, so a new system ought to provide for a gradual phase-out of the old system. BTW, the health insurance industry profit margin is around 5.5%. Medicare fraud is around 15%, mainly because the government doesn't check suppliers carefully.

I'm willing to debate this topic.
Greyparrot
Posts: 14,240
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4/7/2011 2:19:24 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 4/7/2011 2:02:48 PM, RoyLatham wrote:
. BTW, the health insurance industry profit margin is around 5.5%. Medicare fraud is around 15%, mainly because the government doesn't check suppliers carefully.

I'm willing to debate this topic.

I always suspected this fact but didn't know till now. I was thinking about this when Obama was claiming reductions in healthcare costs. Thanks Roy!