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Lionheart
Posts: 520
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4/27/2011 6:59:01 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
People should be allowed to use their money to play poker or to gamble in any other way if they wish.

It is their money.
"Knowing others is intelligence;
knowing yourself is true wisdom.
Mastering others is strength;
mastering yourself is true power."


- Lionheart -
Reasoning
Posts: 4,456
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4/27/2011 7:02:22 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
Gambling is wrong.
"What we really ought to ask the liberal, before we even begin addressing his agenda, is this: In what kind of society would he be a conservative?" - Joseph Sobran
Lionheart
Posts: 520
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4/27/2011 7:48:18 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
Gambling is entertainment.

It is no more wrong than me giving money for movie ticket and going to the movies.

I'm allowed to spend money online, therefor I should be allowed to spend it my money playing a game online.

The government doesn't like it because they can't tax it efficiently. Greedy American politicians tax every thing. It's wrong, but if they have to do it, then tax it. Make sure nobody can take an online gambling payout unless it is taxed. And make sure that every penny the website makes in profit from it's customers is taxed.

Everyone wins.
"Knowing others is intelligence;
knowing yourself is true wisdom.
Mastering others is strength;
mastering yourself is true power."


- Lionheart -
Rob1_Billion
Posts: 1,300
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4/27/2011 10:01:09 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 4/27/2011 7:48:18 PM, Lionheart wrote:
Gambling is entertainment.

It is no more wrong than me giving money for movie ticket and going to the movies.

I'm allowed to spend money online, therefor I should be allowed to spend it my money playing a game online.

The government doesn't like it because they can't tax it efficiently. Greedy American politicians tax every thing. It's wrong, but if they have to do it, then tax it. Make sure nobody can take an online gambling payout unless it is taxed. And make sure that every penny the website makes in profit from it's customers is taxed.

Everyone wins.

Gambling is one of the main ways in which our liberty is stripped. It is a mirage of success that keeps people thinking they have the ability to 'make it' when they don't fully apprehend the odds they are facing. They dump their money into it, turning themselves even poorer than they currently are in the process, under the guise that they don't need to actually produce to achieve a good life. It is one of the most despicable circumstances in the modern world and the only reason I don't attack it directly is because I see money as the root problem.
kfc
Lionheart
Posts: 520
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4/27/2011 10:27:02 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
You assume the worst of gambling. Anything that is done in excess is usually not healthy. If I decide that I want to use $20 to entertain myself tonight, then I have a multitude of options to how I can spend that money. Including online poker as one of those options is in no way unhealthy. In no way does this automatically make me "think" I'm gonna make it do to playing online poker. If this were to happen it would not be at the fault of the game, but at the fault of the person, and there obvious mental and emotional issues.

Online poker is an outlet for entertainment, which you can spend some money on if you want. Used in good measure it is healthy, used in bad measure it is unhealthy, this goes for many forms of entertainment.

Either way, it should be my choice.
"Knowing others is intelligence;
knowing yourself is true wisdom.
Mastering others is strength;
mastering yourself is true power."


- Lionheart -
Fabian_CH
Posts: 232
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4/28/2011 6:14:28 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 4/27/2011 10:01:09 PM, Rob1_Billion wrote:
At 4/27/2011 7:48:18 PM, Lionheart wrote:
Gambling is entertainment.

It is no more wrong than me giving money for movie ticket and going to the movies.

I'm allowed to spend money online, therefor I should be allowed to spend it my money playing a game online.

The government doesn't like it because they can't tax it efficiently. Greedy American politicians tax every thing. It's wrong, but if they have to do it, then tax it. Make sure nobody can take an online gambling payout unless it is taxed. And make sure that every penny the website makes in profit from it's customers is taxed.

Everyone wins.

Gambling is one of the main ways in which our liberty is stripped. It is a mirage of success that keeps people thinking they have the ability to 'make it' when they don't fully apprehend the odds they are facing. They dump their money into it, turning themselves even poorer than they currently are in the process, under the guise that they don't need to actually produce to achieve a good life. It is one of the most despicable circumstances in the modern world and the only reason I don't attack it directly is because I see money as the root problem.

Therefore, it should be illegal - which means people should punished for it. ->?
"What are we doing? Do we want to feed a starved humanity in order to let it live? Or do we want to strangle its life in order to feed it?"
- Andrei Taganov, We The Living (Ayn Rand)
Rob1_Billion
Posts: 1,300
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4/28/2011 7:57:30 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 4/27/2011 10:27:02 PM, Lionheart wrote:
You assume the worst of gambling. Anything that is done in excess is usually not healthy. If I decide that I want to use $20 to entertain myself tonight, then I have a multitude of options to how I can spend that money. Including online poker as one of those options is in no way unhealthy. In no way does this automatically make me "think" I'm gonna make it do to playing online poker. If this were to happen it would not be at the fault of the game, but at the fault of the person, and there obvious mental and emotional issues.

Online poker is an outlet for entertainment, which you can spend some money on if you want. Used in good measure it is healthy, used in bad measure it is unhealthy, this goes for many forms of entertainment.

Either way, it should be my choice.

I have no desire to make it illegal because it would be as retarded to make gambling illegal as it would making cannabis illegal - what for? Anyone and everyone could still do it all they want without any hope of making a dent using police officers.

What I am saying is that
a) gambling is an excuse for many not to be successful, because they put their stock into gambling. As I've said several times before, I've been to AA meetings and the like with some very 'down and out' people and they overwhelmingly believe that the lottery is the way they are going to finally turn their life around. They just need to play it consistently until they win. It's pathetic.

b) Our system uses currency, which enables gambling. Gambling is an aspect of currency, one of the many reasons why I hold these views.
kfc
Rob1_Billion
Posts: 1,300
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4/28/2011 7:58:04 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 4/28/2011 6:14:28 AM, Fabian_CH wrote:
At 4/27/2011 10:01:09 PM, Rob1_Billion wrote:
At 4/27/2011 7:48:18 PM, Lionheart wrote:
Gambling is entertainment.

It is no more wrong than me giving money for movie ticket and going to the movies.

I'm allowed to spend money online, therefor I should be allowed to spend it my money playing a game online.

The government doesn't like it because they can't tax it efficiently. Greedy American politicians tax every thing. It's wrong, but if they have to do it, then tax it. Make sure nobody can take an online gambling payout unless it is taxed. And make sure that every penny the website makes in profit from it's customers is taxed.

Everyone wins.

Gambling is one of the main ways in which our liberty is stripped. It is a mirage of success that keeps people thinking they have the ability to 'make it' when they don't fully apprehend the odds they are facing. They dump their money into it, turning themselves even poorer than they currently are in the process, under the guise that they don't need to actually produce to achieve a good life. It is one of the most despicable circumstances in the modern world and the only reason I don't attack it directly is because I see money as the root problem.

Therefore, it should be illegal - which means people should punished for it. ->?

Yes anyone who uses money should be punished immediately.
kfc
PARADIGM_L0ST
Posts: 6,958
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4/28/2011 9:37:33 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 4/27/2011 6:59:01 PM, Lionheart wrote:
People should be allowed to use their money to play poker or to gamble in any other way if they wish.

It is their money.:

Yep, if you want to gamble your money, that's your business. It's not smart, at all, but if you want to risk squandering all your money, that is entirely up to you.
"Have you ever considered suicide? If not, please do." -- Mouthwash (to Inferno)
PARADIGM_L0ST
Posts: 6,958
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4/28/2011 9:38:43 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 4/27/2011 10:16:19 PM, nonentity wrote:
The only people who have a problem with money are people who don't have it.:

Sigged ^_^
"Have you ever considered suicide? If not, please do." -- Mouthwash (to Inferno)
Ore_Ele
Posts: 25,980
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4/28/2011 10:55:26 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 4/27/2011 7:48:18 PM, Lionheart wrote:
Gambling is entertainment.

It is no more wrong than me giving money for movie ticket and going to the movies.

I'm allowed to spend money online, therefor I should be allowed to spend it my money playing a game online.

That sounds familar to that one fallacy that was given in the fallacy thread. "you have to spend money on crack. spending money is legal. Therefore, spending money on crack is logically legal."

Gambling is entertainment, but not all forms of entertainment are legal. And with gambling, only certain revenues are allowed (to avoid money laundering and fraud)


The government doesn't like it because they can't tax it efficiently. Greedy American politicians tax every thing. It's wrong, but if they have to do it, then tax it. Make sure nobody can take an online gambling payout unless it is taxed. And make sure that every penny the website makes in profit from it's customers is taxed.

They could only do that if they were American based companies, but then, that really isn't the point is it?

The government isn't exactly bursting at the seems to put in countless casinos and other gambling facilities all over the nation. There are often huge hurdles to overcome to get a single casino (not on a reservation).
"Wanting Red Rhino Pill to have gender"
lewis20
Posts: 5,093
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4/28/2011 11:29:21 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 4/28/2011 11:23:11 AM, nonentity wrote:
What's the difference between gambling and investing...?

Well with one you have the potential to make a lot of money but also you could lose a lot of money, the other is completely different hah
"If you are a racist I will attack you with the north"- Abraham Lincoln

"Do not wear clothing woven of two kinds of material" - Leviticus 19 19

"War is a racket" - Smedley Butler
lewis20
Posts: 5,093
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4/28/2011 12:07:27 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 4/28/2011 11:45:56 AM, Greyparrot wrote:
At 4/28/2011 11:23:11 AM, nonentity wrote:
What's the difference between gambling and investing...?

Probability.

so it's smarter to chose one over the other right? It's smarter to play black jack than 5 card stud, doesn't really change the fact that you are taking a gamble either way.
I will say that gambling is basically a zero-sum game, while investing can be beneficial all around.
"If you are a racist I will attack you with the north"- Abraham Lincoln

"Do not wear clothing woven of two kinds of material" - Leviticus 19 19

"War is a racket" - Smedley Butler
Greyparrot
Posts: 14,250
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4/28/2011 12:09:29 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 4/28/2011 12:07:27 PM, lewis20 wrote:
At 4/28/2011 11:45:56 AM, Greyparrot wrote:
At 4/28/2011 11:23:11 AM, nonentity wrote:
What's the difference between gambling and investing...?

Probability.

so it's smarter to chose one over the other right? It's smarter to play black jack than 5 card stud, doesn't really change the fact that you are taking a gamble either way.
I will say that gambling is basically a zero-sum game, while investing can be beneficial all around.

Ask a casino owner or Lottery commissioner if gambling is a zero sum game, while you are chocking on his cigar smoke....
Ore_Ele
Posts: 25,980
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4/28/2011 12:14:01 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 4/28/2011 11:23:11 AM, nonentity wrote:
What's the difference between gambling and investing...?

Investments are a form of gambling.
"Wanting Red Rhino Pill to have gender"
lewis20
Posts: 5,093
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4/28/2011 12:14:46 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 4/28/2011 12:09:29 PM, Greyparrot wrote:
At 4/28/2011 12:07:27 PM, lewis20 wrote:
At 4/28/2011 11:45:56 AM, Greyparrot wrote:
At 4/28/2011 11:23:11 AM, nonentity wrote:
What's the difference between gambling and investing...?

Probability.

so it's smarter to chose one over the other right? It's smarter to play black jack than 5 card stud, doesn't really change the fact that you are taking a gamble either way.
I will say that gambling is basically a zero-sum game, while investing can be beneficial all around.

Ask a casino owner or Lottery commissioner if gambling is a zero sum game, while you are chocking on his cigar smoke....

? they would agree, they usually win and the gambler usually loses
"If you are a racist I will attack you with the north"- Abraham Lincoln

"Do not wear clothing woven of two kinds of material" - Leviticus 19 19

"War is a racket" - Smedley Butler
Greyparrot
Posts: 14,250
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4/28/2011 12:19:08 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 4/28/2011 12:14:46 PM, lewis20 wrote:
At 4/28/2011 12:09:29 PM, Greyparrot wrote:
At 4/28/2011 12:07:27 PM, lewis20 wrote:
At 4/28/2011 11:45:56 AM, Greyparrot wrote:
At 4/28/2011 11:23:11 AM, nonentity wrote:
What's the difference between gambling and investing...?

Probability.

so it's smarter to chose one over the other right? It's smarter to play black jack than 5 card stud, doesn't really change the fact that you are taking a gamble either way.
I will say that gambling is basically a zero-sum game, while investing can be beneficial all around.

Ask a casino owner or Lottery commissioner if gambling is a zero sum game, while you are chocking on his cigar smoke....

? they would agree, they usually win and the gambler usually loses
Well you are kind of investing in the casino with gambling, and state education with the lottery.
Ore_Ele
Posts: 25,980
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4/28/2011 12:20:24 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 4/28/2011 12:14:46 PM, lewis20 wrote:
At 4/28/2011 12:09:29 PM, Greyparrot wrote:
At 4/28/2011 12:07:27 PM, lewis20 wrote:
At 4/28/2011 11:45:56 AM, Greyparrot wrote:
At 4/28/2011 11:23:11 AM, nonentity wrote:
What's the difference between gambling and investing...?

Probability.

so it's smarter to chose one over the other right? It's smarter to play black jack than 5 card stud, doesn't really change the fact that you are taking a gamble either way.
I will say that gambling is basically a zero-sum game, while investing can be beneficial all around.

Ask a casino owner or Lottery commissioner if gambling is a zero sum game, while you are chocking on his cigar smoke....

? they would agree, they usually win and the gambler usually loses

It is zero sum (unless there is a gambling fee). Whatever you lose/win, the house win/loses an equal amount. No capital is being created from the act of gambling.

If gambling is viewed as an investment, you have an issue (since that is borderline addiction). If gambling is viewed simple as an unknown variable cost for entertainment, then it is a good thing.
"Wanting Red Rhino Pill to have gender"
Greyparrot
Posts: 14,250
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4/28/2011 12:25:39 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 4/28/2011 12:20:24 PM, OreEle wrote:
At 4/28/2011 12:14:46 PM, lewis20 wrote:
At 4/28/2011 12:09:29 PM, Greyparrot wrote:
At 4/28/2011 12:07:27 PM, lewis20 wrote:
At 4/28/2011 11:45:56 AM, Greyparrot wrote:
At 4/28/2011 11:23:11 AM, nonentity wrote:
What's the difference between gambling and investing...?

Probability.

so it's smarter to chose one over the other right? It's smarter to play black jack than 5 card stud, doesn't really change the fact that you are taking a gamble either way.
I will say that gambling is basically a zero-sum game, while investing can be beneficial all around.

Ask a casino owner or Lottery commissioner if gambling is a zero sum game, while you are chocking on his cigar smoke....

? they would agree, they usually win and the gambler usually loses

It is zero sum (unless there is a gambling fee). Whatever you lose/win, the house win/loses an equal amount. No capital is being created from the act of gambling.

If gambling is viewed as an investment, you have an issue (since that is borderline addiction). If gambling is viewed simple as an unknown variable cost for entertainment, then it is a good thing.

What about people who buy casino stocks? :P
Greyparrot
Posts: 14,250
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4/28/2011 12:27:48 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
Everything you do in life is a gamble.
There are no certainties.
Only probabilities.
Embrace the gambler we were all born to be, but be wise.
PARADIGM_L0ST
Posts: 6,958
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4/28/2011 12:59:56 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
Some argue that for a good poker player, it's not gambling... At least not in the sense that Blackjack, slots, and craps are (game of odds). Blackjack, slots, and craps are money makers for the casinos because it's a losing proposition. When left to pure chance and no real skill, the House always wins in the long run.
"Have you ever considered suicide? If not, please do." -- Mouthwash (to Inferno)
Lionheart
Posts: 520
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4/28/2011 1:58:01 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
Investing is no different than any other gambling when you strip it down. You are risking your money to make money. There are many different forms of the game, investing just takes another form. Instead of betting on your favorite horses or sports teams, you are betting on your favorite businesses and corporations. The government has set it up to be legal, because it is there favorite game. Alot more people lose a lot more money "investing" than in playing online poker. If you are seriously trying to say that the majority of poker players thinks they are going to "make it", and in the obsession of of this are willing to risk everything they have to play online poker.. Then you are seriously deluded in your view. Almost everyone gambles in some way. You are comparing a small group of obsessive gamblers, then taking that information and stereotyping everyone who gambles.

To do this is fallacy.
"Knowing others is intelligence;
knowing yourself is true wisdom.
Mastering others is strength;
mastering yourself is true power."


- Lionheart -
Ore_Ele
Posts: 25,980
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4/28/2011 5:52:19 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 4/28/2011 12:25:39 PM, Greyparrot wrote:
At 4/28/2011 12:20:24 PM, OreEle wrote:
At 4/28/2011 12:14:46 PM, lewis20 wrote:
At 4/28/2011 12:09:29 PM, Greyparrot wrote:
At 4/28/2011 12:07:27 PM, lewis20 wrote:
At 4/28/2011 11:45:56 AM, Greyparrot wrote:
At 4/28/2011 11:23:11 AM, nonentity wrote:
What's the difference between gambling and investing...?

Probability.

so it's smarter to chose one over the other right? It's smarter to play black jack than 5 card stud, doesn't really change the fact that you are taking a gamble either way.
I will say that gambling is basically a zero-sum game, while investing can be beneficial all around.

Ask a casino owner or Lottery commissioner if gambling is a zero sum game, while you are chocking on his cigar smoke....

? they would agree, they usually win and the gambler usually loses

It is zero sum (unless there is a gambling fee). Whatever you lose/win, the house win/loses an equal amount. No capital is being created from the act of gambling.

If gambling is viewed as an investment, you have an issue (since that is borderline addiction). If gambling is viewed simple as an unknown variable cost for entertainment, then it is a good thing.

What about people who buy casino stocks? :P

touche.
"Wanting Red Rhino Pill to have gender"
Ore_Ele
Posts: 25,980
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4/28/2011 5:54:40 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 4/28/2011 12:59:56 PM, PARADIGM_L0ST wrote:
Some argue that for a good poker player, it's not gambling... At least not in the sense that Blackjack, slots, and craps are (game of odds). Blackjack, slots, and craps are money makers for the casinos because it's a losing proposition. When left to pure chance and no real skill, the House always wins in the long run.

poker has a skill of reading other people to tell if they are bluffing or not. That doesn't really apply with online poker, since you catch watch the other players to figure out tells (though you can try based on how quick or slow they are to make a decision), it becomes more about odds, and the people that know the odds (namely when they are in your favor and when they are not) rise to the tops.

Just like those that know how to count cards in black jack will naturally rise to the top.
"Wanting Red Rhino Pill to have gender"
Lionheart
Posts: 520
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4/28/2011 9:45:25 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
The fact of the matter is this...

Stocks, Lottery, Horse Races, The Gambling Boats, Online Poker, etc.

All of these things take your money with the promise that you might make a profit.

They are all forms of risking your money, or gambling.

Online poker is no more addicting than Lottery scratch off tickets... But they are legal aren't they? Yes, they are. And so is the rest of the lottery, casinos, and horse races.

Exactly.

Now tell me why online poker should be illegal again?
"Knowing others is intelligence;
knowing yourself is true wisdom.
Mastering others is strength;
mastering yourself is true power."


- Lionheart -