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Conservative to Anti-Statist

jimtimmy
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9/27/2011 9:38:02 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
A few weeks ago, I was a traditional conservative. I supported neo conservative foreign policy positions and all of the other nonsense conservative typically support.

I talked about how bad excessive statism was, even though I advocated further state intervention in many areas...

However, I recently had a break through when I realized that order did not come from the state. I once thought Anarchism was a stupid and utopian ideaology. I know see it as much more consistent, and perhaps logical.

Where I used to quote the Founders at length, I now see the founders as setting the foundation for the modern welfare state...

Basically, I have gone from a conservative to a libertarian, or maybe even a bit of an Anarchist...
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DanT
Posts: 5,693
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9/27/2011 10:22:35 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/27/2011 9:38:02 PM, jimtimmy wrote:
Where I used to quote the Founders at length, I now see the founders as setting the foundation for the modern welfare state...

Basically, I have gone from a conservative to a libertarian, or maybe even a bit of an Anarchist...

WTF?

"With respect to the words general welfare, I have always regarded them as qualified by the detail of powers connected with them.
To take them in a literal and unlimited sense would be a metamorphosis of the Constitution into a character which there is a host of proofs was not contemplated by its creators." ~ James Madison

Libertarianism is anti-welfare state, and the founders was Libertarian
"Chemical weapons are no different than any other types of weapons."~Lordknukle
CosmicAlfonzo
Posts: 5,955
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9/27/2011 10:23:03 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
Just don't tell that to a police officer, you're statistically more likely to get your @ss kicked for no reason. He'll throw you to the ground, shove a billy club up your arse, and then repeatedly whisper in your ear, "How you like the state now, huh, b!tch?"
Official "High Priest of Secular Affairs and Transient Distributor of Sonic Apple Seeds relating to the Reptilian Division of Paperwork Immoliation" of The FREEDO Bureaucracy, a DDO branch of the Erisian Front, a subdivision of the Discordian Back, a Limb of the Illuminatian Cosmic Utensil Corp
DanT
Posts: 5,693
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9/27/2011 10:25:19 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/27/2011 10:23:03 PM, CosmicAlfonzo wrote:
Just don't tell that to a police officer, you're statistically more likely to get your @ss kicked for no reason. He'll throw you to the ground, shove a billy club up your arse, and then repeatedly whisper in your ear, "How you like the state now, huh, b!tch?"

are you speaking from fantasy or experience?
"Chemical weapons are no different than any other types of weapons."~Lordknukle
jimtimmy
Posts: 3,953
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9/27/2011 10:31:24 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/27/2011 10:22:35 PM, DanT wrote:
At 9/27/2011 9:38:02 PM, jimtimmy wrote:
Where I used to quote the Founders at length, I now see the founders as setting the foundation for the modern welfare state...

Basically, I have gone from a conservative to a libertarian, or maybe even a bit of an Anarchist...

WTF?

"With respect to the words general welfare, I have always regarded them as qualified by the detail of powers connected with them.
To take them in a literal and unlimited sense would be a metamorphosis of the Constitution into a character which there is a host of proofs was not contemplated by its creators." ~ James Madison

Libertarianism is anti-welfare state, and the founders was Libertarian

Were they?

The Founders Created a Country, based on a document that gives the government (or majority) virtually unlimited power

Apart from General Welfare, the Constitution can be amended to take away all rights...

Just look at the Second Amendment... If enough of a majority supports Repeal, they will get repeal

The Founders gave the government the ability to take resoures by force of gun... (Taxation)...

This is hardly the foundation of a free nation
President of DDO
DanT
Posts: 5,693
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9/27/2011 11:11:42 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/27/2011 10:31:24 PM, jimtimmy wrote:
At 9/27/2011 10:22:35 PM, DanT wrote:
At 9/27/2011 9:38:02 PM, jimtimmy wrote:
Where I used to quote the Founders at length, I now see the founders as setting the foundation for the modern welfare state...

Basically, I have gone from a conservative to a libertarian, or maybe even a bit of an Anarchist...

WTF?

"With respect to the words general welfare, I have always regarded them as qualified by the detail of powers connected with them.
To take them in a literal and unlimited sense would be a metamorphosis of the Constitution into a character which there is a host of proofs was not contemplated by its creators." ~ James Madison

Libertarianism is anti-welfare state, and the founders was Libertarian

Were they?

Yes!


The Founders Created a Country, based on a document that gives the government (or majority) virtually unlimited power

Wrong...

The Constitution is based on limited government, and separation of powers


Apart from General Welfare, the Constitution can be amended to take away all rights...

WTF? Where did you read that?

Just look at the Second Amendment... If enough of a majority supports Repeal, they will get repeal

>.< It can only be repealed by another amendment, through the amendment process.

The Founders gave the government the ability to take resources by force of gun... (Taxation)...

But limited the method in which they could tax.... The Progressive income tax was unconstitutional, until it was Amended under Wilson.


This is hardly the foundation of a free nation

Read it now!
http://www.usconstitution.net...
"Chemical weapons are no different than any other types of weapons."~Lordknukle
jimtimmy
Posts: 3,953
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9/27/2011 11:49:05 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/27/2011 11:11:42 PM, DanT wrote:
At 9/27/2011 10:31:24 PM, jimtimmy wrote:
At 9/27/2011 10:22:35 PM, DanT wrote:
At 9/27/2011 9:38:02 PM, jimtimmy wrote:
Where I used to quote the Founders at length, I now see the founders as setting the foundation for the modern welfare state...

Basically, I have gone from a conservative to a libertarian, or maybe even a bit of an Anarchist...

WTF?

"With respect to the words general welfare, I have always regarded them as qualified by the detail of powers connected with them.
To take them in a literal and unlimited sense would be a metamorphosis of the Constitution into a character which there is a host of proofs was not contemplated by its creators." ~ James Madison

Libertarianism is anti-welfare state, and the founders was Libertarian

Were they?

Yes!


The Founders Created a Country, based on a document that gives the government (or majority) virtually unlimited power

Wrong...

The Constitution is based on limited government, and separation of powers


Apart from General Welfare, the Constitution can be amended to take away all rights...

WTF? Where did you read that?

Just look at the Second Amendment... If enough of a majority supports Repeal, they will get repeal

>.< It can only be repealed by another amendment, through the amendment process.

The Founders gave the government the ability to take resources by force of gun... (Taxation)...

But limited the method in which they could tax.... The Progressive income tax was unconstitutional, until it was Amended under Wilson.


This is hardly the foundation of a free nation

Read it now!
http://www.usconstitution.net...

I am talking about the Amendment process.

The question is whether we are "Free" today?

I would say not... And, the constitution is still around
President of DDO
DanT
Posts: 5,693
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9/27/2011 11:52:41 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/27/2011 11:49:05 PM, jimtimmy wrote:
At 9/27/2011 11:11:42 PM, DanT wrote:
At 9/27/2011 10:31:24 PM, jimtimmy wrote:
At 9/27/2011 10:22:35 PM, DanT wrote:
At 9/27/2011 9:38:02 PM, jimtimmy wrote:
Where I used to quote the Founders at length, I now see the founders as setting the foundation for the modern welfare state...

Basically, I have gone from a conservative to a libertarian, or maybe even a bit of an Anarchist...

WTF?

"With respect to the words general welfare, I have always regarded them as qualified by the detail of powers connected with them.
To take them in a literal and unlimited sense would be a metamorphosis of the Constitution into a character which there is a host of proofs was not contemplated by its creators." ~ James Madison

Libertarianism is anti-welfare state, and the founders was Libertarian

Were they?

Yes!


The Founders Created a Country, based on a document that gives the government (or majority) virtually unlimited power

Wrong...

The Constitution is based on limited government, and separation of powers


Apart from General Welfare, the Constitution can be amended to take away all rights...

WTF? Where did you read that?

Just look at the Second Amendment... If enough of a majority supports Repeal, they will get repeal

>.< It can only be repealed by another amendment, through the amendment process.

The Founders gave the government the ability to take resources by force of gun... (Taxation)...

But limited the method in which they could tax.... The Progressive income tax was unconstitutional, until it was Amended under Wilson.


This is hardly the foundation of a free nation

Read it now!
http://www.usconstitution.net...

I am talking about the Amendment process.

The question is whether we are "Free" today?

I would say not... And, the constitution is still around

Amendment Process, requires 2/3 of Both Houses to 1st propose a amendment, and 3/4 of the States legislatures to ratify the amendment.

That is 67 Senators, and 290 Reps needed to propose the amendment, and 38 state legislatures to ratify it.
"Chemical weapons are no different than any other types of weapons."~Lordknukle
jimtimmy
Posts: 3,953
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9/28/2011 12:03:48 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/27/2011 11:52:41 PM, DanT wrote:
At 9/27/2011 11:49:05 PM, jimtimmy wrote:
At 9/27/2011 11:11:42 PM, DanT wrote:
At 9/27/2011 10:31:24 PM, jimtimmy wrote:
At 9/27/2011 10:22:35 PM, DanT wrote:
At 9/27/2011 9:38:02 PM, jimtimmy wrote:
Where I used to quote the Founders at length, I now see the founders as setting the foundation for the modern welfare state...

Basically, I have gone from a conservative to a libertarian, or maybe even a bit of an Anarchist...

WTF?

"With respect to the words general welfare, I have always regarded them as qualified by the detail of powers connected with them.
To take them in a literal and unlimited sense would be a metamorphosis of the Constitution into a character which there is a host of proofs was not contemplated by its creators." ~ James Madison

Libertarianism is anti-welfare state, and the founders was Libertarian

Were they?

Yes!


The Founders Created a Country, based on a document that gives the government (or majority) virtually unlimited power

Wrong...

The Constitution is based on limited government, and separation of powers


Apart from General Welfare, the Constitution can be amended to take away all rights...

WTF? Where did you read that?

Just look at the Second Amendment... If enough of a majority supports Repeal, they will get repeal

>.< It can only be repealed by another amendment, through the amendment process.

The Founders gave the government the ability to take resources by force of gun... (Taxation)...

But limited the method in which they could tax.... The Progressive income tax was unconstitutional, until it was Amended under Wilson.


This is hardly the foundation of a free nation

Read it now!
http://www.usconstitution.net...

I am talking about the Amendment process.

The question is whether we are "Free" today?

I would say not... And, the constitution is still around


Amendment Process, requires 2/3 of Both Houses to 1st propose a amendment, and 3/4 of the States legislatures to ratify the amendment.

That is 67 Senators, and 290 Reps needed to propose the amendment, and 38 state legislatures to ratify it.

What about the people that the other 33 senators represented?

Or the people that didnt vote for the 67 senators that voted for it?

Are they free?
President of DDO
jimtimmy
Posts: 3,953
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9/28/2011 12:31:41 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/28/2011 12:25:28 AM, darkkermit wrote:
Wait, are you saying that the constitution should never be amended?

No, Im saying that there should not be a constitution in the first place... I am saying their shouldn't be a state in the first place..,

Hell, I don't know what im saying, its 1.30 in the morning and I should be working, lol
President of DDO
feverish
Posts: 2,716
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9/28/2011 10:33:40 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
Doesn't really surprise me, I've seen plenty of people on this site move from fascism or conservatism towards libertarianism or an-cap.

I guess it's when people realise that their social darwinistic capital elitist aims can be achieved more effectively if their jackboot or rifle is obscured behind a contract outlaying the non aggression principle.
phantom
Posts: 6,774
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9/28/2011 10:51:12 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
Joining this site has caused me to have many doubts on allot of my beliefs. But I've only become a stronger conservative since joining.
"Music is a zen-like ecstatic state where you become the new man of the future, the Nietzschean merger of Apollo and Dionysus." Ray Manzarek (The Doors)
DanT
Posts: 5,693
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9/28/2011 1:41:02 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/28/2011 10:33:40 AM, feverish wrote:
Doesn't really surprise me, I've seen plenty of people on this site move from fascism or conservatism towards libertarianism or an-cap.

I guess it's when people realise that their social darwinistic capital elitist aims can be achieved more effectively if their jackboot or rifle is obscured behind a contract outlaying the non aggression principle.

Only Left wing Libertarians are anarchists

Right wing libertarians are minarchists
"Chemical weapons are no different than any other types of weapons."~Lordknukle
DanT
Posts: 5,693
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9/28/2011 1:43:46 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/28/2011 12:03:48 AM, jimtimmy wrote:
At 9/27/2011 11:52:41 PM, DanT wrote:
At 9/27/2011 11:49:05 PM, jimtimmy wrote:
At 9/27/2011 11:11:42 PM, DanT wrote:
At 9/27/2011 10:31:24 PM, jimtimmy wrote:
At 9/27/2011 10:22:35 PM, DanT wrote:
At 9/27/2011 9:38:02 PM, jimtimmy wrote:
Where I used to quote the Founders at length, I now see the founders as setting the foundation for the modern welfare state...

Basically, I have gone from a conservative to a libertarian, or maybe even a bit of an Anarchist...

WTF?

"With respect to the words general welfare, I have always regarded them as qualified by the detail of powers connected with them.
To take them in a literal and unlimited sense would be a metamorphosis of the Constitution into a character which there is a host of proofs was not contemplated by its creators." ~ James Madison

Libertarianism is anti-welfare state, and the founders was Libertarian

Were they?

Yes!


The Founders Created a Country, based on a document that gives the government (or majority) virtually unlimited power

Wrong...

The Constitution is based on limited government, and separation of powers


Apart from General Welfare, the Constitution can be amended to take away all rights...

WTF? Where did you read that?

Just look at the Second Amendment... If enough of a majority supports Repeal, they will get repeal

>.< It can only be repealed by another amendment, through the amendment process.

The Founders gave the government the ability to take resources by force of gun... (Taxation)...

But limited the method in which they could tax.... The Progressive income tax was unconstitutional, until it was Amended under Wilson.


This is hardly the foundation of a free nation

Read it now!
http://www.usconstitution.net...

I am talking about the Amendment process.

The question is whether we are "Free" today?

I would say not... And, the constitution is still around


Amendment Process, requires 2/3 of Both Houses to 1st propose a amendment, and 3/4 of the States legislatures to ratify the amendment.

That is 67 Senators, and 290 Reps needed to propose the amendment, and 38 state legislatures to ratify it.

What about the people that the other 33 senators represented?

Or the people that didnt vote for the 67 senators that voted for it?

Are they free?

well good luck getting 100% of the American population to agree on anything
"Chemical weapons are no different than any other types of weapons."~Lordknukle
feverish
Posts: 2,716
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9/28/2011 2:28:37 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/28/2011 1:41:02 PM, DanT wrote:
Only Left wing Libertarians are anarchists

Right wing libertarians are minarchists

Have you never encoutered an anarcho-capitalist?
socialpinko
Posts: 10,458
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9/28/2011 2:34:43 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/28/2011 1:41:02 PM, DanT wrote:
At 9/28/2011 10:33:40 AM, feverish wrote:
Doesn't really surprise me, I've seen plenty of people on this site move from fascism or conservatism towards libertarianism or an-cap.

I guess it's when people realise that their social darwinistic capital elitist aims can be achieved more effectively if their jackboot or rifle is obscured behind a contract outlaying the non aggression principle.

Only Left wing Libertarians are anarchists

Right wing libertarians are minarchists

What do you mean? Anarcho capitalists with a right wing viewpoint on economics are clearly anarchists.
: At 9/29/2014 10:55:59 AM, imabench wrote:
: : At 9/29/2014 9:43:46 AM, kbub wrote:
: :
: : DDO should discredit support of sexual violence at any time and in every way.
:
: I disagree.
socialpinko
Posts: 10,458
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9/28/2011 2:36:06 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/28/2011 1:43:46 PM, DanT wrote:
At 9/28/2011 12:03:48 AM, jimtimmy wrote:
At 9/27/2011 11:52:41 PM, DanT wrote:
At 9/27/2011 11:49:05 PM, jimtimmy wrote:
At 9/27/2011 11:11:42 PM, DanT wrote:
At 9/27/2011 10:31:24 PM, jimtimmy wrote:
At 9/27/2011 10:22:35 PM, DanT wrote:
At 9/27/2011 9:38:02 PM, jimtimmy wrote:
Where I used to quote the Founders at length, I now see the founders as setting the foundation for the modern welfare state...

Basically, I have gone from a conservative to a libertarian, or maybe even a bit of an Anarchist...

WTF?

"With respect to the words general welfare, I have always regarded them as qualified by the detail of powers connected with them.
To take them in a literal and unlimited sense would be a metamorphosis of the Constitution into a character which there is a host of proofs was not contemplated by its creators." ~ James Madison

Libertarianism is anti-welfare state, and the founders was Libertarian

Were they?

Yes!


The Founders Created a Country, based on a document that gives the government (or majority) virtually unlimited power

Wrong...

The Constitution is based on limited government, and separation of powers


Apart from General Welfare, the Constitution can be amended to take away all rights...

WTF? Where did you read that?

Just look at the Second Amendment... If enough of a majority supports Repeal, they will get repeal

>.< It can only be repealed by another amendment, through the amendment process.

The Founders gave the government the ability to take resources by force of gun... (Taxation)...

But limited the method in which they could tax.... The Progressive income tax was unconstitutional, until it was Amended under Wilson.


This is hardly the foundation of a free nation

Read it now!
http://www.usconstitution.net...

I am talking about the Amendment process.

The question is whether we are "Free" today?

I would say not... And, the constitution is still around


Amendment Process, requires 2/3 of Both Houses to 1st propose a amendment, and 3/4 of the States legislatures to ratify the amendment.

That is 67 Senators, and 290 Reps needed to propose the amendment, and 38 state legislatures to ratify it.

What about the people that the other 33 senators represented?

Or the people that didnt vote for the 67 senators that voted for it?

Are they free?

well good luck getting 100% of the American population to agree on anything

That's pretty much the point. Just because you think something is rift doesn't mean you have the right to force the policy on others.
: At 9/29/2014 10:55:59 AM, imabench wrote:
: : At 9/29/2014 9:43:46 AM, kbub wrote:
: :
: : DDO should discredit support of sexual violence at any time and in every way.
:
: I disagree.
DanT
Posts: 5,693
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9/28/2011 2:45:36 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/28/2011 2:34:43 PM, socialpinko wrote:
At 9/28/2011 1:41:02 PM, DanT wrote:
At 9/28/2011 10:33:40 AM, feverish wrote:
Doesn't really surprise me, I've seen plenty of people on this site move from fascism or conservatism towards libertarianism or an-cap.

I guess it's when people realise that their social darwinistic capital elitist aims can be achieved more effectively if their jackboot or rifle is obscured behind a contract outlaying the non aggression principle.

Only Left wing Libertarians are anarchists

Right wing libertarians are minarchists

What do you mean? Anarcho capitalists with a right wing viewpoint on economics are clearly anarchists.

Right wing is traditionalists
Left wing is Reformist

Anarchy is Reformist
Capitalist is traditionalist

Anarcho-Capitalism is Left-Right, or centrist
"Chemical weapons are no different than any other types of weapons."~Lordknukle
Ragnar_Rahl
Posts: 19,297
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9/28/2011 2:48:34 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
Capitalist is traditionalist
Capitalism has never before been seen on this planet.
It came to be at its height. It was commanded to command. It was a capital before its first stone was laid. It was a monument to the spirit of man.
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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9/28/2011 2:52:07 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/28/2011 2:48:34 PM, Ragnar_Rahl wrote:
Capitalist is traditionalist
Capitalism has never before been seen on this planet.

Which planet is that? because I would think that the gilded age in America, of Earth, qualifies as the existence of capitalism.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
socialpinko
Posts: 10,458
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9/28/2011 2:52:22 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/28/2011 2:45:36 PM, DanT wrote:
At 9/28/2011 2:34:43 PM, socialpinko wrote:
At 9/28/2011 1:41:02 PM, DanT wrote:
At 9/28/2011 10:33:40 AM, feverish wrote:
Doesn't really surprise me, I've seen plenty of people on this site move from fascism or conservatism towards libertarianism or an-cap.

I guess it's when people realise that their social darwinistic capital elitist aims can be achieved more effectively if their jackboot or rifle is obscured behind a contract outlaying the non aggression principle.

Only Left wing Libertarians are anarchists

Right wing libertarians are minarchists

What do you mean? Anarcho capitalists with a right wing viewpoint on economics are clearly anarchists.

Right wing is traditionalists
Left wing is Reformist

Anarchy is Reformist
Capitalist is traditionalist

Anarcho-Capitalism is Left-Right, or centrist

Lol at not understanding political typology. This is based on economic stances, not whether one wants change. And even if it was anarcho capitalists are for the dismabtling of the state and an end to all forms ofgovernment intervention(federal reserve, minimum wage laws) and protectionism(tariffs, imperialism) They're certainly not for the status quo.
: At 9/29/2014 10:55:59 AM, imabench wrote:
: : At 9/29/2014 9:43:46 AM, kbub wrote:
: :
: : DDO should discredit support of sexual violence at any time and in every way.
:
: I disagree.
socialpinko
Posts: 10,458
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9/28/2011 2:52:59 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/28/2011 2:52:07 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 9/28/2011 2:48:34 PM, Ragnar_Rahl wrote:
Capitalist is traditionalist
Capitalism has never before been seen on this planet.

Which planet is that? because I would think that the gilded age in America, of Earth, qualifies as the existence of capitalism.

Lol
: At 9/29/2014 10:55:59 AM, imabench wrote:
: : At 9/29/2014 9:43:46 AM, kbub wrote:
: :
: : DDO should discredit support of sexual violence at any time and in every way.
:
: I disagree.
DanT
Posts: 5,693
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9/28/2011 2:58:41 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/28/2011 2:52:07 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 9/28/2011 2:48:34 PM, Ragnar_Rahl wrote:
Capitalist is traditionalist
Capitalism has never before been seen on this planet.

Which planet is that? because I would think that the gilded age in America, of Earth, qualifies as the existence of capitalism.

The gilded age in America was State Capitalism, in early American history we had Pure Capitalism or laissez faire economics.

It wasn't until the mid 1800's we started turning State Capitalist
"Chemical weapons are no different than any other types of weapons."~Lordknukle
DanT
Posts: 5,693
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9/28/2011 3:02:40 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/28/2011 2:52:22 PM, socialpinko wrote:
At 9/28/2011 2:45:36 PM, DanT wrote:
At 9/28/2011 2:34:43 PM, socialpinko wrote:
At 9/28/2011 1:41:02 PM, DanT wrote:
At 9/28/2011 10:33:40 AM, feverish wrote:
Doesn't really surprise me, I've seen plenty of people on this site move from fascism or conservatism towards libertarianism or an-cap.

I guess it's when people realise that their social darwinistic capital elitist aims can be achieved more effectively if their jackboot or rifle is obscured behind a contract outlaying the non aggression principle.

Only Left wing Libertarians are anarchists

Right wing libertarians are minarchists

What do you mean? Anarcho capitalists with a right wing viewpoint on economics are clearly anarchists.

Right wing is traditionalists
Left wing is Reformist

Anarchy is Reformist
Capitalist is traditionalist

Anarcho-Capitalism is Left-Right, or centrist

Lol at not understanding political typology. This is based on economic stances, not whether one wants change. And even if it was anarcho capitalists are for the dismabtling of the state and an end to all forms ofgovernment intervention(federal reserve, minimum wage laws) and protectionism(tariffs, imperialism) They're certainly not for the status quo.

(n) right wing: those who support political or social or economic conservatism; those who believe that things are better left unchanged
http://wordnetweb.princeton.edu...

(n) left wing: those who support varying degrees of social or political or economic change designed to promote the public welfare
http://wordnetweb.princeton.edu...
"Chemical weapons are no different than any other types of weapons."~Lordknukle
socialpinko
Posts: 10,458
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9/28/2011 3:17:56 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/28/2011 3:02:40 PM, DanT wrote:
At 9/28/2011 2:52:22 PM, socialpinko wrote:
At 9/28/2011 2:45:36 PM, DanT wrote:
At 9/28/2011 2:34:43 PM, socialpinko wrote:
At 9/28/2011 1:41:02 PM, DanT wrote:
At 9/28/2011 10:33:40 AM, feverish wrote:
Doesn't really surprise me, I've seen plenty of people on this site move from fascism or conservatism towards libertarianism or an-cap.

I guess it's when people realise that their social darwinistic capital elitist aims can be achieved more effectively if their jackboot or rifle is obscured behind a contract outlaying the non aggression principle.

Only Left wing Libertarians are anarchists

Right wing libertarians are minarchists

What do you mean? Anarcho capitalists with a right wing viewpoint on economics are clearly anarchists.

Right wing is traditionalists
Left wing is Reformist

Anarchy is Reformist
Capitalist is traditionalist

Anarcho-Capitalism is Left-Right, or centrist

Lol at not understanding political typology. This is based on economic stances, not whether one wants change. And even if it was anarcho capitalists are for the dismabtling of the state and an end to all forms ofgovernment intervention(federal reserve, minimum wage laws) and protectionism(tariffs, imperialism) They're certainly not for the status quo.

(n) right wing: those who support political or social or economic conservatism; those who believe that things are better left unchanged
http://wordnetweb.princeton.edu...

(n) left wing: those who support varying degrees of social or political or economic change designed to promote the public welfare
http://wordnetweb.princeton.edu...

As I said earlier, even if these are the correct terms(I could find a source showing my point but then it's simple linguistic confusion) anarchocapitalism would still not be minarchistic and capitalism(free market) would not be traditionalist as not only does no country currently have it, but no society has ever had it completely non-regulated or intervened in by government.
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PARADIGM_L0ST
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9/28/2011 6:42:45 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
I am talking about the Amendment process.

The question is whether we are "Free" today?

I would say not... And, the constitution is still around:

That all depends on what you mean by "free." If "free" means that you are allowed to do whatever the hell you want at everyone else's expense, then, no, we aren't free. All freedoms have some confines in order to even make them possible.
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PARADIGM_L0ST
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9/28/2011 6:47:49 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
Only Left wing Libertarians are anarchists

Right wing libertarians are minarchists:

That's not true. With the exception of maybe 2 self-proclaimed leftist anarchists, the rest of the anarchists are right leaning. I'm talking somewhere in the order of at least 30 on this site alone (and that's a very conservative figure).
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jimtimmy
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9/28/2011 6:49:07 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/28/2011 6:42:45 PM, PARADIGM_L0ST wrote:
I am talking about the Amendment process.

The question is whether we are "Free" today?

I would say not... And, the constitution is still around:

That all depends on what you mean by "free." If "free" means that you are allowed to do whatever the hell you want at everyone else's expense, then, no, we aren't free. All freedoms have some confines in order to even make them possible.

Ya...

But, we have a government that forcibly takes people's property to pay for wars and programs...

Why?

Because a majority favors these things... As long as 51% of the people support them. The governmetn can f!ck over the other 49%
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Ragnar_Rahl
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9/28/2011 7:21:01 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/28/2011 2:58:41 PM, DanT wrote:
At 9/28/2011 2:52:07 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 9/28/2011 2:48:34 PM, Ragnar_Rahl wrote:
Capitalist is traditionalist
Capitalism has never before been seen on this planet.

Which planet is that? because I would think that the gilded age in America, of Earth, qualifies as the existence of capitalism.

The gilded age in America was State Capitalism, in early American history we had Pure Capitalism or laissez faire economics.
The Constitution says something about "Regulating interstate commerce." It was enforced, hain't ya heard o' tariffs or the Whiskey rebellion or laws that enslaved people or...? Before that the states ran things, and not laissez-faire. Before that there was Britain, which even those non-laissez-faire types thought was too interventionist.

The gilded age threw a bunch of state-chartered railroad monopolies among other things atop that.
It came to be at its height. It was commanded to command. It was a capital before its first stone was laid. It was a monument to the spirit of man.