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Student Loan Relief from Obama

HandsOff
Posts: 504
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10/26/2011 3:27:22 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
Once again Obama forgets that government is here to enforce contracts-- not help people weasel out of them. Now he's using his unconstitutional powers to undermine repayment agreements made by students who borrowed college tuition. Guess who's picking up the tab? You got it-- innocent taxpayers who did not borrow or benefit from the money. Does that sound like the government is encouraging accountability or helping people default on their obligations once again? More of the same.
Aaronroy
Posts: 749
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10/26/2011 4:25:13 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
Not to mention that condescending troglodye snuck in the student loan relief into the Healthcare Reform bill. This is almost as corrupt as when the Hughes Amendment was passed.
turn down for h'what
Lordknukle
Posts: 12,788
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10/26/2011 4:54:05 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/26/2011 3:27:22 PM, HandsOff wrote:
Once again Obama forgets that government is here to enforce contracts-- not help people weasel out of them. Now he's using his unconstitutional powers to undermine repayment agreements made by students who borrowed college tuition. Guess who's picking up the tab? You got it-- innocent taxpayers who did not borrow or benefit from the money. Does that sound like the government is encouraging accountability or helping people default on their obligations once again? More of the same.

What do you expect from a socialist?

Obama is the president ever.
"Easy is the descent to Avernus, for the door to the Underworld lies upon both day and night. But to retrace your steps and return to the breezes above- that's the task, that's the toil."
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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10/26/2011 5:04:28 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
You guys are infernal morons. Sorry for the ad hominem, but it was necessary.

He is a liberal, not a socialist, and as such he recognizes that it is the government's responsibility to ease the financial struggles for college students due to the ailing economy. Rising tuition is really creating a problem for highschool students going to college, and loans are creating a problem for the graduates. less and less people are finding to feasible to go to college, and ultimately, that's bad for the work force and employment.

In the 1930s, FDR for one saw it as a necessity above all else to provide relief to American citizens, and this took the form of social security checks and progressive reform to lessen layoffs and paycuts. How this is bad in your view is frankly silly and asinine. He's helping people as he should, and he's getting the country back on track. lets not forget the conservative private initiative ( adopted by Hoover) is what CAUSED the depression from the stock market crash.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
HandsOff
Posts: 504
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10/26/2011 5:09:41 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
He is a liberal, not a socialist, and as such he recognizes that it is the government's responsibility to ease the financial struggles for college students....

That has, and never will, be the government's responsibility. One of the very few constitutional roles of government is to enforce contracts, not undermine them. Helping people sidestep their contractual obligations is not the role of government.
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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10/26/2011 5:14:33 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/26/2011 5:09:41 PM, HandsOff wrote:
He is a liberal, not a socialist, and as such he recognizes that it is the government's responsibility to ease the financial struggles for college students....


That has, and never will, be the government's responsibility. One of the very few constitutional roles of government is to enforce contracts, not undermine them. Helping people sidestep their contractual obligations is not the role of government.

wow you don't know what empathy is do you? Regardless of you cold and apathetic demeanor, you're still wrong. The government is a social agent for the prosperity of the people it governs FIRST AND FOREMOST. It is a legal contractual enforcer SECOND.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
Ren
Posts: 7,102
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10/26/2011 5:16:25 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/26/2011 5:09:41 PM, HandsOff wrote:
He is a liberal, not a socialist, and as such he recognizes that it is the government's responsibility to ease the financial struggles for college students....


That has, and never will, be the government's responsibility. One of the very few constitutional roles of government is to enforce contracts, not undermine them. Helping people sidestep their contractual obligations is not the role of government.

That's funny, I could have sworn that this decade was rife with taxpayer's money going to rich white collar criminals that allowed their illegal behavior to cause their large and economically influential corporations to go bankrupt.

I would prefer to improve this society with tax money by improving the overall education of our citizens as well as their capacity to use it to our overall benefit, rather than to use those taxes to give to @ssholes that are already rich and don't pay nearly as large a proportion of taxes as the educated middle class.
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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10/26/2011 5:16:59 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/26/2011 5:14:33 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 10/26/2011 5:09:41 PM, HandsOff wrote:
He is a liberal, not a socialist, and as such he recognizes that it is the government's responsibility to ease the financial struggles for college students....


That has, and never will, be the government's responsibility. One of the very few constitutional roles of government is to enforce contracts, not undermine them. Helping people sidestep their contractual obligations is not the role of government.

wow you don't know what empathy is do you? Regardless of you cold and apathetic demeanor, you're still wrong. The government is a social agent for the prosperity of the people it governs FIRST AND FOREMOST. It is a legal contractual enforcer SECOND.

The government does not work for companies and contracts, it works for us, the people! This is the fundamental difference between a sensible liberal administration, and a conservative one. And if you want to know how conservatism fails, just look at Hoover.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
quarterexchange
Posts: 1,549
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10/26/2011 8:02:14 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/26/2011 5:04:28 PM, 000ike wrote:
You guys are infernal morons. Sorry for the ad hominem, but it was necessary.

You're such a dope

He is a liberal, not a socialist, and as such he recognizes that it is the government's responsibility to ease the financial struggles for college students due to the ailing economy. Rising tuition is really creating a problem for highschool students going to college, and loans are creating a problem for the graduates. less and less people are finding to feasible to go to college, and ultimately, that's bad for the work force and employment.

The reason tuition costs are rising is becaue of the artificial demand the government puts toward them in the form of government subsidies such as "federal assistance" and what Obama is doing now by having a government guarantee to pay for an education. Abolish the Dept of Education and cut off government subsidies to education and a college degree would be much cheaper than it is now. And if you can't pay to go to a prestigious school and pay it off yourself with whatever job you find you should have thought twice about spending so much on a useless degree.

In the 1930s, FDR for one saw it as a necessity above all else to provide relief to American citizens, and this took the form of

social security checks

Ponzi Scheme

and progressive reform to lessen layoffs and paycuts.

Which made it harder to get hired in the first place.

Hence you will find that unemployment was higher when FDR took office during the Depression

How this is bad in your view is frankly silly and asinine. He's helping people as he should, and he's getting the country back on track. lets not forget the conservative private initiative ( adopted by Hoover) is what CAUSED the depression from the stock market crash.

Hoover was not a fiscal conservative by any means and additionally what caused the Great Depression was the New Deal, which turned the Stock Market Crash into a depression.
I don't discriminate....I hate everybody.
DetectableNinja
Posts: 6,043
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10/26/2011 8:16:02 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/26/2011 5:16:59 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 10/26/2011 5:14:33 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 10/26/2011 5:09:41 PM, HandsOff wrote:
He is a liberal, not a socialist, and as such he recognizes that it is the government's responsibility to ease the financial struggles for college students....


That has, and never will, be the government's responsibility. One of the very few constitutional roles of government is to enforce contracts, not undermine them. Helping people sidestep their contractual obligations is not the role of government.

wow you don't know what empathy is do you? Regardless of you cold and apathetic demeanor, you're still wrong. The government is a social agent for the prosperity of the people it governs FIRST AND FOREMOST. It is a legal contractual enforcer SECOND.

The government does not work for companies and contracts, it works for us, the people! This is the fundamental difference between a sensible liberal administration, and a conservative one. And if you want to know how conservatism fails, just look at Hoover.

Oy. You're starting to sound like my ultra-liberal friend who insists that a multi-party system is important but "wishes the Republicans would just let us take control." Exact quote, too.
Think'st thou heaven is such a glorious thing?
I tell thee, 'tis not half so fair as thou
Or any man that breathes on earth.

- Christopher Marlowe, Doctor Faustus
Lordknukle
Posts: 12,788
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10/26/2011 8:40:23 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/26/2011 5:04:28 PM, 000ike wrote:
You guys are infernal morons. Sorry for the ad hominem, but it was necessary.

He is a liberal, not a socialist, and as such he recognizes that it is the government's responsibility to ease the financial struggles for college students due to the ailing economy. Rising tuition is really creating a problem for highschool students going to college, and loans are creating a problem for the graduates. less and less people are finding to feasible to go to college, and ultimately, that's bad for the work force and employment.

In the 1930s, FDR for one saw it as a necessity above all else to provide relief to American citizens, and this took the form of social security checks and progressive reform to lessen layoffs and paycuts. How this is bad in your view is frankly silly and asinine. He's helping people as he should, and he's getting the country back on track. lets not forget the conservative private initiative ( adopted by Hoover) is what CAUSED the depression from the stock market crash.

The only role of the government is to protect its people from threats and maintain liberty and democracy.

Since when is the role of the government to alleviate stresses of higher education?

Capitalism is pretty much "survival of the fittest". If you get a education, get past the debt, and make a salary... then kudos to you. Many people had to pay of their loans and debt the hard way, by working (the ultimate swear for liberals and socialists).

In conclusion... suck it up. The economy is down, but that doesn't mean that the government is responsible for your economic well being.
"Easy is the descent to Avernus, for the door to the Underworld lies upon both day and night. But to retrace your steps and return to the breezes above- that's the task, that's the toil."
DetectableNinja
Posts: 6,043
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10/26/2011 8:43:01 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/26/2011 8:40:23 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
At 10/26/2011 5:04:28 PM, 000ike wrote:
You guys are infernal morons. Sorry for the ad hominem, but it was necessary.

He is a liberal, not a socialist, and as such he recognizes that it is the government's responsibility to ease the financial struggles for college students due to the ailing economy. Rising tuition is really creating a problem for highschool students going to college, and loans are creating a problem for the graduates. less and less people are finding to feasible to go to college, and ultimately, that's bad for the work force and employment.

In the 1930s, FDR for one saw it as a necessity above all else to provide relief to American citizens, and this took the form of social security checks and progressive reform to lessen layoffs and paycuts. How this is bad in your view is frankly silly and asinine. He's helping people as he should, and he's getting the country back on track. lets not forget the conservative private initiative ( adopted by Hoover) is what CAUSED the depression from the stock market crash.

The only role of the government is to protect its people from threats and maintain liberty and democracy.

Since when is the role of the government to alleviate stresses of higher education?

Capitalism is pretty much "survival of the fittest". If you get a education, get past the debt, and make a salary... then kudos to you. Many people had to pay of their loans and debt the hard way, by working (the ultimate swear for liberals and socialists).

In conclusion... suck it up. The economy is down, but that doesn't mean that the government is responsible for your economic well being.
Think'st thou heaven is such a glorious thing?
I tell thee, 'tis not half so fair as thou
Or any man that breathes on earth.

- Christopher Marlowe, Doctor Faustus
thett3
Posts: 14,382
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10/26/2011 8:45:50 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
I view the role of the government and its citizens as related. If you expect the government to take care of you and provide your education, a safety net, retirement fund, ect. than you can hardly complain when the government starts to control aspects of your life as well. No one is going to help you without some benefit in return, same with governemnts.

If you view (as I do) the governments primary role as protecting and defending society, than you have a moral obligation to risk your life for your country (when called upon).
DDO Vice President

#StandwithBossy

#UnbanTheMadman

#BetOnThett

"Don't quote me, ever." -Max

"My name is max. I'm not a big fan of slacks"- Max rapping

"Walmart should have the opportunity to bribe a politician to it's agenda" -Max

"Thett, you're really good at convincing people you're a decent person"-tulle

"You fit the character of Regina George quite nicely"- Sam

: At 11/12/2016 11:49:40 PM, Raisor wrote:
: thett was right
seraine
Posts: 734
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10/26/2011 9:15:28 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/26/2011 5:14:33 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 10/26/2011 5:09:41 PM, HandsOff wrote:
He is a liberal, not a socialist, and as such he recognizes that it is the government's responsibility to ease the financial struggles for college students....


That has, and never will, be the government's responsibility. One of the very few constitutional roles of government is to enforce contracts, not undermine them. Helping people sidestep their contractual obligations is not the role of government.

wow you don't know what empathy is do you? Regardless of you cold and apathetic demeanor, you're still wrong. The government is a social agent for the prosperity of the people it governs FIRST AND FOREMOST. It is a legal contractual enforcer SECOND.

Empathy-stealing from person A and giving to Person B?
mongoose
Posts: 3,500
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10/26/2011 9:35:01 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
I find it especially strange that, through the Affordable Care Act of all things, Obama managed to prevent almost all banks from giving student loans, because they were benefiting too much from being "middlemen." Actually, part of their job was to look at a person's record and their probability of success to determine if the college education would provide that person with enough additional future income to eventually pay it off. The federal government manages to save all those calculating costs by giving anybody the money, thus resulting in more people being in debt.
It is odd when one's capacity for compassion is measured not in what he is willing to do by his own time, effort, and property, but what he will force others to do with their own property instead.
Lordknukle
Posts: 12,788
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10/26/2011 9:40:36 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/26/2011 9:35:01 PM, mongoose wrote:
I find it especially strange that, through the Affordable Care Act of all things, Obama managed to prevent almost all banks from giving student loans, because they were benefiting too much from being "middlemen." Actually, part of their job was to look at a person's record and their probability of success to determine if the college education would provide that person with enough additional future income to eventually pay it off. The federal government manages to save all those calculating costs by giving anybody the money, thus resulting in more people being in debt.

Isn't our government smart?
"Easy is the descent to Avernus, for the door to the Underworld lies upon both day and night. But to retrace your steps and return to the breezes above- that's the task, that's the toil."
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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10/26/2011 9:45:26 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
I wish I had the energy to make the angry refutations you so richly deserve. In the morning :)
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
DetectableNinja
Posts: 6,043
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10/26/2011 9:47:06 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/26/2011 9:45:26 PM, 000ike wrote:
I wish I had the energy to make the angry refutations you so richly deserve. In the morning :)

We deserve angry refutations...for being Constitutionalists?
Think'st thou heaven is such a glorious thing?
I tell thee, 'tis not half so fair as thou
Or any man that breathes on earth.

- Christopher Marlowe, Doctor Faustus
000ike
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10/26/2011 9:47:36 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/26/2011 9:47:06 PM, DetectableNinja wrote:
At 10/26/2011 9:45:26 PM, 000ike wrote:
I wish I had the energy to make the angry refutations you so richly deserve. In the morning :)

We deserve angry refutations...for being Unconstitutionalists?

Yes.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
sadolite
Posts: 8,842
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10/26/2011 9:49:02 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
The end of capitolism is near.
It's not your views that divide us, it's what you think my views should be that divides us.

If you think I will give up my rights and forsake social etiquette to make you "FEEL" better you are sadly mistaken

If liberal democrats would just stop shooting people gun violence would drop by 90%
Man-is-good
Posts: 6,871
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10/26/2011 9:49:55 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/26/2011 9:47:36 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 10/26/2011 9:47:06 PM, DetectableNinja wrote:
At 10/26/2011 9:45:26 PM, 000ike wrote:
I wish I had the energy to make the angry refutations you so richly deserve. In the morning :)

We deserve angry refutations...for being Unconstitutionalists?

Yes.

Of course. That's what Ikeialogy is...
"Homo sum, humani nihil a me alienum puto." --Terence

"I believe that the mind can be permanently profaned by the habit of attending to trivial things, so that all our thoughts shall be tinged with triviality."--Thoreau
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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10/26/2011 9:50:14 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/26/2011 9:49:02 PM, sadolite wrote:
The end of capitolism is near.

....no one say anything, this is too funny to correct.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
DetectableNinja
Posts: 6,043
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10/26/2011 9:50:18 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/26/2011 9:47:36 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 10/26/2011 9:47:06 PM, DetectableNinja wrote:
At 10/26/2011 9:45:26 PM, 000ike wrote:
I wish I had the energy to make the angry refutations you so richly deserve. In the morning :)

We deserve angry refutations...for being CONSTITUTIONALISTS?

Yes.

Care to cite where it says in the Constitution that these acts were okay? BESIDES the "general welfare" phrase in the Preamble?
Think'st thou heaven is such a glorious thing?
I tell thee, 'tis not half so fair as thou
Or any man that breathes on earth.

- Christopher Marlowe, Doctor Faustus
Lordknukle
Posts: 12,788
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10/26/2011 9:57:05 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/26/2011 9:50:18 PM, DetectableNinja wrote:
At 10/26/2011 9:47:36 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 10/26/2011 9:47:06 PM, DetectableNinja wrote:
At 10/26/2011 9:45:26 PM, 000ike wrote:
I wish I had the energy to make the angry refutations you so richly deserve. In the morning :)

We deserve angry refutations...for being CONSTITUTIONALISTS?

Yes.

Care to cite where it says in the Constitution that these acts were okay? BESIDES the "general welfare" phrase in the Preamble?

I agree with you on the matter at hand, however a citing the constitution doesn't make it correct.

Times have changed. Amendment 18 used to say that liquor should be prohibited, now it has been repealed.

The constitution changes over time. A pure constitutionalist (Ron Paul) is deemed to fail.
"Easy is the descent to Avernus, for the door to the Underworld lies upon both day and night. But to retrace your steps and return to the breezes above- that's the task, that's the toil."
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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10/26/2011 9:58:46 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/26/2011 9:50:18 PM, DetectableNinja wrote:
At 10/26/2011 9:47:36 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 10/26/2011 9:47:06 PM, DetectableNinja wrote:
At 10/26/2011 9:45:26 PM, 000ike wrote:
I wish I had the energy to make the angry refutations you so richly deserve. In the morning :)

We deserve angry refutations...for being CONSTITUTIONALISTS?

Yes.

Care to cite where it says in the Constitution that these acts were okay? BESIDES the "general welfare" phrase in the Preamble?

"To make Rules for the Government and Regulation of the land..." The same provisions that give the federal government the power to do anything. Now, what about Obama's actions is Unconstitutional?
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
DetectableNinja
Posts: 6,043
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10/26/2011 10:00:01 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/26/2011 9:57:05 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
At 10/26/2011 9:50:18 PM, DetectableNinja wrote:
At 10/26/2011 9:47:36 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 10/26/2011 9:47:06 PM, DetectableNinja wrote:
At 10/26/2011 9:45:26 PM, 000ike wrote:
I wish I had the energy to make the angry refutations you so richly deserve. In the morning :)

We deserve angry refutations...for being CONSTITUTIONALISTS?

Yes.

Care to cite where it says in the Constitution that these acts were okay? BESIDES the "general welfare" phrase in the Preamble?

I agree with you on the matter at hand, however a citing the constitution doesn't make it correct.

Times have changed. Amendment 18 used to say that liquor should be prohibited, now it has been repealed.

The constitution changes over time. A pure constitutionalist (Ron Paul) is deemed to fail.

I understand. I was only asking for a citation because when he first replied, he changed "constitutioalists," to "unconstitutionalists." Which is why I'm asking him to show where we're being unconstitutional.
Think'st thou heaven is such a glorious thing?
I tell thee, 'tis not half so fair as thou
Or any man that breathes on earth.

- Christopher Marlowe, Doctor Faustus
seraine
Posts: 734
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10/26/2011 10:00:24 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/26/2011 9:49:55 PM, Man-is-good wrote:
At 10/26/2011 9:47:36 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 10/26/2011 9:47:06 PM, DetectableNinja wrote:
At 10/26/2011 9:45:26 PM, 000ike wrote:
I wish I had the energy to make the angry refutations you so richly deserve. In the morning :)

We deserve angry refutations...for being Unconstitutionalists?

Yes.

Of course. That's what Ikeialogy is...

Oh my gosh... please not this again.
thett3
Posts: 14,382
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10/26/2011 10:00:40 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/26/2011 9:58:46 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 10/26/2011 9:50:18 PM, DetectableNinja wrote:
At 10/26/2011 9:47:36 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 10/26/2011 9:47:06 PM, DetectableNinja wrote:
At 10/26/2011 9:45:26 PM, 000ike wrote:
I wish I had the energy to make the angry refutations you so richly deserve. In the morning :)

We deserve angry refutations...for being CONSTITUTIONALISTS?

Yes.

Care to cite where it says in the Constitution that these acts were okay? BESIDES the "general welfare" phrase in the Preamble?

"To make Rules for the Government and Regulation of the land..." The same provisions that give the federal government the power to do anything. Now, what about Obama's actions is Unconstitutional?

*facepalm*
DDO Vice President

#StandwithBossy

#UnbanTheMadman

#BetOnThett

"Don't quote me, ever." -Max

"My name is max. I'm not a big fan of slacks"- Max rapping

"Walmart should have the opportunity to bribe a politician to it's agenda" -Max

"Thett, you're really good at convincing people you're a decent person"-tulle

"You fit the character of Regina George quite nicely"- Sam

: At 11/12/2016 11:49:40 PM, Raisor wrote:
: thett was right
seraine
Posts: 734
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10/26/2011 10:01:02 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/26/2011 9:47:06 PM, DetectableNinja wrote:
At 10/26/2011 9:45:26 PM, 000ike wrote:
I wish I had the energy to make the angry refutations you so richly deserve. In the morning :)

We deserve angry refutations...for being Constitutionalists?

Does it really matter that the Constitution supports our beliefs?