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RIP Megaupload

Thaddeus
Posts: 6,985
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1/19/2012 4:21:22 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Just this morning I was watching tv on megavideo. After being sued for violating copyright laws, the hong kong shut down today.
This is in politics because it is strongly related to SOPA.
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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1/19/2012 4:31:37 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
What the hell? Someone needs to stop them. I've never in my life really felt an intense anger for the governments actions till today.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
Thaddeus
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1/19/2012 4:33:38 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 1/19/2012 4:21:22 PM, Thaddeus wrote:
Just this morning I was watching tv on megavideo. After being sued for violating copyright laws, the hong kong company shut down today.
This is in politics because it is strongly related to SOPA.

*hong kong company

And, though you may well be being sarcastic (really can't tell -sorry), I am really quite pissed.
OMGJustinBieber
Posts: 3,484
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1/19/2012 4:33:48 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Wait, megavideo is down? Permanently?

At 1/19/2012 4:31:37 PM, 000ike wrote:
What the hell? Someone needs to stop them. I've never in my life really felt an intense anger for the governments actions till today.

Someone wasn't an online poker player. =/
Thaddeus
Posts: 6,985
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1/19/2012 4:34:45 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 1/19/2012 4:33:48 PM, OMGJustinBieber wrote:
Wait, megavideo is down? Permanently?

Yeah =(
You might want to watch out Ike. Anger at the government is the first step to libertarianism =P
Ore_Ele
Posts: 25,980
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1/19/2012 4:40:15 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 1/19/2012 4:21:22 PM, Thaddeus wrote:
Just this morning I was watching tv on megavideo. After being sued for violating copyright laws, the hong kong shut down today.
This is in politics because it is strongly related to SOPA.

So... theft shouldn't be stopped? Or is it just theft that you enjoy shouldn't be stopped?
"Wanting Red Rhino Pill to have gender"
Thaddeus
Posts: 6,985
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1/19/2012 4:40:52 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 1/19/2012 4:40:15 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 1/19/2012 4:21:22 PM, Thaddeus wrote:
Just this morning I was watching tv on megavideo. After being sued for violating copyright laws, the hong kong shut down today.
This is in politics because it is strongly related to SOPA.

So... theft shouldn't be stopped? Or is it just theft that you enjoy shouldn't be stopped?

Duplication isn't theft.
Thaddeus
Posts: 6,985
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1/19/2012 4:41:41 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 1/19/2012 4:40:52 PM, Thaddeus wrote:
At 1/19/2012 4:40:15 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 1/19/2012 4:21:22 PM, Thaddeus wrote:
Just this morning I was watching tv on megavideo. After being sued for violating copyright laws, the hong kong shut down today.
This is in politics because it is strongly related to SOPA.

So... theft shouldn't be stopped? Or is it just theft that you enjoy shouldn't be stopped?

Duplication isn't theft.

No-one can own ideas, combinations of frames for tv, or combinations of notes and words.
Ore_Ele
Posts: 25,980
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1/19/2012 4:49:58 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 1/19/2012 4:41:41 PM, Thaddeus wrote:
At 1/19/2012 4:40:52 PM, Thaddeus wrote:
At 1/19/2012 4:40:15 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 1/19/2012 4:21:22 PM, Thaddeus wrote:
Just this morning I was watching tv on megavideo. After being sued for violating copyright laws, the hong kong shut down today.
This is in politics because it is strongly related to SOPA.

So... theft shouldn't be stopped? Or is it just theft that you enjoy shouldn't be stopped?

Duplication isn't theft.

No-one can own ideas, combinations of frames for tv, or combinations of notes and words.

I would disagree, one can own ideas. Under libertarian philosophy of ownership of labor, you own what you put your work into. If you put the work into the ideas, you own it. While it is traditionally used as mixing with land for physical ownership, there is no logical reason as to why that line of reasoning would stop there. Those ideas do have real world value and so should be subject to real world ownership.
"Wanting Red Rhino Pill to have gender"
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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1/19/2012 4:50:08 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 1/19/2012 4:40:15 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 1/19/2012 4:21:22 PM, Thaddeus wrote:
Just this morning I was watching tv on megavideo. After being sued for violating copyright laws, the hong kong shut down today.
This is in politics because it is strongly related to SOPA.

So... theft shouldn't be stopped? Or is it just theft that you enjoy shouldn't be stopped?

sharing is not theft. We have a right to share. If I buy a DVD, I have every right to show it to 100 other people or as many people as I like. If a company sees this as a problem, then it must solve it independently, not try to use the government. The Supreme Court needs to intervene.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
Ore_Ele
Posts: 25,980
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1/19/2012 4:52:31 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 1/19/2012 4:50:08 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 1/19/2012 4:40:15 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 1/19/2012 4:21:22 PM, Thaddeus wrote:
Just this morning I was watching tv on megavideo. After being sued for violating copyright laws, the hong kong shut down today.
This is in politics because it is strongly related to SOPA.

So... theft shouldn't be stopped? Or is it just theft that you enjoy shouldn't be stopped?

sharing is not theft. We have a right to share. If I buy a DVD, I have every right to show it to 100 other people or as many people as I like. If a company sees this as a problem, then it must solve it independently, not try to use the government. The Supreme Court needs to intervene.

False, when you buy a DVD, part of the sales agreement is that you will not duplicat it without the expressed concent of the manufacturer. Since agreeing to that is a requirement of sale, violation of that agreement is a violation of a contract. Or should people be allowed to violate contracts consequence free?
"Wanting Red Rhino Pill to have gender"
Thaddeus
Posts: 6,985
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1/19/2012 4:54:11 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 1/19/2012 4:49:58 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 1/19/2012 4:41:41 PM, Thaddeus wrote:
At 1/19/2012 4:40:52 PM, Thaddeus wrote:
At 1/19/2012 4:40:15 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 1/19/2012 4:21:22 PM, Thaddeus wrote:
Just this morning I was watching tv on megavideo. After being sued for violating copyright laws, the hong kong shut down today.
This is in politics because it is strongly related to SOPA.

So... theft shouldn't be stopped? Or is it just theft that you enjoy shouldn't be stopped?

Duplication isn't theft.

No-one can own ideas, combinations of frames for tv, or combinations of notes and words.

I would disagree, one can own ideas. Under libertarian philosophy of ownership of labor, you own what you put your work into. If you put the work into the ideas, you own it. While it is traditionally used as mixing with land for physical ownership, there is no logical reason as to why that line of reasoning would stop there. Those ideas do have real world value and so should be subject to real world ownership.

Property is a mechanic for solving the economic problem; limited resources, unlimited wants.
With ideas, the resource becomes infinite. Property is no longer necessary.
GeoLaureate8
Posts: 12,252
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1/19/2012 4:56:07 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 1/19/2012 4:52:31 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 1/19/2012 4:50:08 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 1/19/2012 4:40:15 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 1/19/2012 4:21:22 PM, Thaddeus wrote:
Just this morning I was watching tv on megavideo. After being sued for violating copyright laws, the hong kong shut down today.
This is in politics because it is strongly related to SOPA.

So... theft shouldn't be stopped? Or is it just theft that you enjoy shouldn't be stopped?

sharing is not theft. We have a right to share. If I buy a DVD, I have every right to show it to 100 other people or as many people as I like. If a company sees this as a problem, then it must solve it independently, not try to use the government. The Supreme Court needs to intervene.

False, when you buy a DVD, part of the sales agreement is that you will not duplicat it without the expressed concent of the manufacturer. Since agreeing to that is a requirement of sale, violation of that agreement is a violation of a contract. Or should people be allowed to violate contracts consequence free?

Sharing =/= Duplicating

.
.
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
GeoLaureate8
Posts: 12,252
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1/19/2012 4:58:38 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Supposedly Anonymous has shut down government sites and record label sites 15 minutes after government shutdown Megaupload

Win.
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
Thaddeus
Posts: 6,985
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1/19/2012 5:01:41 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 1/19/2012 4:52:31 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 1/19/2012 4:50:08 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 1/19/2012 4:40:15 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 1/19/2012 4:21:22 PM, Thaddeus wrote:
Just this morning I was watching tv on megavideo. After being sued for violating copyright laws, the hong kong shut down today.
This is in politics because it is strongly related to SOPA.

So... theft shouldn't be stopped? Or is it just theft that you enjoy shouldn't be stopped?

sharing is not theft. We have a right to share. If I buy a DVD, I have every right to show it to 100 other people or as many people as I like. If a company sees this as a problem, then it must solve it independently, not try to use the government. The Supreme Court needs to intervene.

False, when you buy a DVD, part of the sales agreement is that you will not duplicat it without the expressed concent of the manufacturer. Since agreeing to that is a requirement of sale, violation of that agreement is a violation of a contract. Or should people be allowed to violate contracts consequence free?

You are correct, if it is part of the contract (which I curiously seem to have forgotten signing) when I buy it from the manufacturer or any retailer acting as a proxy I should fulfil the contract. However, anyone who didn't buy it from the manufacturer (ie bought it from a friend) is perfectly free to duplicate to their hearts content.
Thaddeus
Posts: 6,985
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1/19/2012 5:02:07 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 1/19/2012 4:58:38 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
Supposedly Anonymous has shut down government sites and record label sites 15 minutes after government shutdown Megaupload

Win.

=)
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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1/19/2012 5:05:17 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 1/19/2012 4:58:38 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
Supposedly Anonymous has shut down government sites and record label sites 15 minutes after government shutdown Megaupload

Win.

what websites got shut down by anonymous?
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
Ore_Ele
Posts: 25,980
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1/19/2012 5:07:49 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 1/19/2012 4:54:11 PM, Thaddeus wrote:
At 1/19/2012 4:49:58 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 1/19/2012 4:41:41 PM, Thaddeus wrote:
At 1/19/2012 4:40:52 PM, Thaddeus wrote:
At 1/19/2012 4:40:15 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 1/19/2012 4:21:22 PM, Thaddeus wrote:
Just this morning I was watching tv on megavideo. After being sued for violating copyright laws, the hong kong shut down today.
This is in politics because it is strongly related to SOPA.

So... theft shouldn't be stopped? Or is it just theft that you enjoy shouldn't be stopped?

Duplication isn't theft.

No-one can own ideas, combinations of frames for tv, or combinations of notes and words.

I would disagree, one can own ideas. Under libertarian philosophy of ownership of labor, you own what you put your work into. If you put the work into the ideas, you own it. While it is traditionally used as mixing with land for physical ownership, there is no logical reason as to why that line of reasoning would stop there. Those ideas do have real world value and so should be subject to real world ownership.

Property is a mechanic for solving the economic problem; limited resources, unlimited wants.
With ideas, the resource becomes infinite. Property is no longer necessary.

False on two levels.

1) Ideas are not infinite. Every thought, every piece of data on a computer has a physical existance on some form of a limited reasource.

2) Even if there is "unlimited" resources, that does not mean the economic problem is solved. Since we still live in a world with limited resources, capital is needed to obtain other limited resources (like food and shelter). By copying and sharing IP, you are altering the supply of it and as such, lowering the value.

The economic problem is not "solved" until EVERYTHING is essentually "unlimited" reasources.
"Wanting Red Rhino Pill to have gender"
Ore_Ele
Posts: 25,980
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1/19/2012 5:11:57 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 1/19/2012 4:56:07 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
At 1/19/2012 4:52:31 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 1/19/2012 4:50:08 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 1/19/2012 4:40:15 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 1/19/2012 4:21:22 PM, Thaddeus wrote:
Just this morning I was watching tv on megavideo. After being sued for violating copyright laws, the hong kong shut down today.
This is in politics because it is strongly related to SOPA.

So... theft shouldn't be stopped? Or is it just theft that you enjoy shouldn't be stopped?

sharing is not theft. We have a right to share. If I buy a DVD, I have every right to show it to 100 other people or as many people as I like. If a company sees this as a problem, then it must solve it independently, not try to use the government. The Supreme Court needs to intervene.

False, when you buy a DVD, part of the sales agreement is that you will not duplicat it without the expressed concent of the manufacturer. Since agreeing to that is a requirement of sale, violation of that agreement is a violation of a contract. Or should people be allowed to violate contracts consequence free?

Sharing =/= Duplicating


Online "sharing" is when you download a "copy" for yourself, so duplicating is occuring in those situations. Merely sharing with a friend (as in letting them borrow a DVD) is not.
"Wanting Red Rhino Pill to have gender"
Thaddeus
Posts: 6,985
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1/19/2012 5:18:37 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 1/19/2012 5:07:49 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 1/19/2012 4:54:11 PM, Thaddeus wrote:
At 1/19/2012 4:49:58 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 1/19/2012 4:41:41 PM, Thaddeus wrote:
At 1/19/2012 4:40:52 PM, Thaddeus wrote:
At 1/19/2012 4:40:15 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 1/19/2012 4:21:22 PM, Thaddeus wrote:
Just this morning I was watching tv on megavideo. After being sued for violating copyright laws, the hong kong shut down today.
This is in politics because it is strongly related to SOPA.

So... theft shouldn't be stopped? Or is it just theft that you enjoy shouldn't be stopped?

Duplication isn't theft.

No-one can own ideas, combinations of frames for tv, or combinations of notes and words.

I would disagree, one can own ideas. Under libertarian philosophy of ownership of labor, you own what you put your work into. If you put the work into the ideas, you own it. While it is traditionally used as mixing with land for physical ownership, there is no logical reason as to why that line of reasoning would stop there. Those ideas do have real world value and so should be subject to real world ownership.

Property is a mechanic for solving the economic problem; limited resources, unlimited wants.
With ideas, the resource becomes infinite. Property is no longer necessary.

False on two levels.

1) Ideas are not infinite. Every thought, every piece of data on a computer has a physical existance on some form of a limited reasource.

Hokai, but by that metric, human desires aren't unlimited either.

2) Even if there is "unlimited" resources, that does not mean the economic problem is solved.

It does in regard to that resource.

Since we still live in a world with limited resources, capital is needed to obtain other limited resources (like food and shelter).

True, which is why the people copying use their own resources (such as digital space and time) to copy instead of demanding that the creator provides it for them.

By copying and sharing IP, you are altering the supply of it and as such, lowering the value.

If I claimed I owned love, charged people loving each other, but some dastardly fiends loved each other without my permission, they would be devaluing my "love". So what? Artificial price controls affect price, this is true, but that justify having them.

The economic problem is not "solved" until EVERYTHING is essentually "unlimited" reasources.

The limited resource costs are on the part of the copier. The non-limited resources do not need property.
GeoLaureate8
Posts: 12,252
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1/19/2012 5:30:36 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 1/19/2012 5:05:17 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 1/19/2012 4:58:38 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
Supposedly Anonymous has shut down government sites and record label sites 15 minutes after government shutdown Megaupload

Win.

what websites got shut down by anonymous?

Dept. of Justice, RIAA, Universal, etc.

http://m.gizmodo.com...
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
Wnope
Posts: 6,924
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1/19/2012 6:22:53 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
I don't know what the hell the government was thinking.

Oddly, it seems like something you'd do if you wanted to DECREASE support for SOPA since it demonstrates the power to shut down illegal sites without the new laws.

Instead, you'd wait till just after SOPA passed then shut them down under the previous laws, claiming that SOPA was responsible and that it wouldn't have been possible beforehand.
PARADIGM_L0ST
Posts: 6,958
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1/19/2012 6:38:03 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
sharing is not theft. We have a right to share. If I buy a DVD, I have every right to show it to 100 other people or as many people as I like. If a company sees this as a problem, then it must solve it independently, not try to use the government.:

DING-DING-DING!!! We have a winner.
"Have you ever considered suicide? If not, please do." -- Mouthwash (to Inferno)
PARADIGM_L0ST
Posts: 6,958
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1/19/2012 6:49:13 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
False, when you buy a DVD, part of the sales agreement is that you will not duplicat it without the expressed concent of the manufacturer.:

If it was necessarily a crime it would be against the law to create blank DVD's, blank CD's, blank cassettes because they only have one purpose -- the express purpose of duplicating. It is not necessarily against the law to duplicate it. It is necessarily against the law to pirate the intellectual property that was copywrited and to sell it for personal gain or to pawn it off as your own material.

If the music or film industry wanted to, they could encript their information so that you have to purchase their outrageously expensive material just so they could maximize their profits that f*ck over the bands (you know, the people who should actually have intellectual property rights over their own material).

But really the piracy isn't the main complaint when it comes to SOPA. Piracy is the pretext of the law, but it's not the net result. There are unintended consequences that have to be addressed before entertaining the bill.

http://www.bradsreader.com...
"Have you ever considered suicide? If not, please do." -- Mouthwash (to Inferno)
TheAtheistAllegiance
Posts: 1,251
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1/19/2012 7:56:11 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 1/19/2012 4:49:58 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 1/19/2012 4:41:41 PM, Thaddeus wrote:
At 1/19/2012 4:40:52 PM, Thaddeus wrote:
At 1/19/2012 4:40:15 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 1/19/2012 4:21:22 PM, Thaddeus wrote:
Just this morning I was watching tv on megavideo. After being sued for violating copyright laws, the hong kong shut down today.
This is in politics because it is strongly related to SOPA.

So... theft shouldn't be stopped? Or is it just theft that you enjoy shouldn't be stopped?

Duplication isn't theft.

No-one can own ideas, combinations of frames for tv, or combinations of notes and words.

I would disagree, one can own ideas. Under libertarian philosophy of ownership of labor, you own what you put your work into. If you put the work into the ideas, you own it. While it is traditionally used as mixing with land for physical ownership, there is no logical reason as to why that line of reasoning would stop there. Those ideas do have real world value and so should be subject to real world ownership.

WRONG! Property and labor are unique in that they're scarce. Ideas are not. The love scenario is a good example why putting a price on ideas is ridiculous.
Reasoning
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1/19/2012 9:20:19 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 1/19/2012 4:31:37 PM, 000ike wrote:
What the hell? Someone needs to stop them. I've never in my life really felt an intense anger for the governments actions till today.

Really? Megaupload is where you draw the line?
"What we really ought to ask the liberal, before we even begin addressing his agenda, is this: In what kind of society would he be a conservative?" - Joseph Sobran
Korashk
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1/20/2012 12:47:14 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 1/19/2012 10:57:33 PM, ConservativePolitico wrote:
Megaupload got shut down for being sued... It was based in Hong Kong this had nothing to do with the US government...

Yah, you're completely 100% wrong.

Release from DoJ website: http://www.justice.gov...

And OreEle, MegaUpload is a filesharing website. Nothing more, nothing less. It's not like The Pirate Bay in that it's express purpose is illegal activity (I refuse to acknowledge sharing files as theft).

In fact, if statements from MegaUpload are to be believed, most of their site's activity was completely legitimate.
When large numbers of otherwise-law abiding people break specific laws en masse, it's usually a fault that lies with the law. - Unknown
Ragnar_Rahl
Posts: 19,297
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1/20/2012 1:01:08 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 1/20/2012 12:47:14 AM, Korashk wrote:
At 1/19/2012 10:57:33 PM, ConservativePolitico wrote:
Megaupload got shut down for being sued... It was based in Hong Kong this had nothing to do with the US government...

Yah, you're completely 100% wrong.

Release from DoJ website: http://www.justice.gov...

And OreEle, MegaUpload is a filesharing website. Nothing more, nothing less. It's not like The Pirate Bay in that it's express purpose is illegal activity (I refuse to acknowledge sharing files as theft).

In fact, if statements from MegaUpload are to be believed, most of their site's activity was completely legitimate.

I'm pretty sure their statements aren't to be believed.
It came to be at its height. It was commanded to command. It was a capital before its first stone was laid. It was a monument to the spirit of man.