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Who is the Most Evil President in History?

charleslb
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2/23/2012 4:13:30 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
A mildly malicious stroke of inspiration has just come to me from another member's thread in which he asks respondents to tell us who their all-time favorite U.S. president is. That is, it's occurred to me that it would perhaps be more provocative to ask my fellow DDO citizens who their least favorite and personally most abhorred holder of the nation's highest office is, and why, if they care to elaborate.

For instance, is the most morally contemptible American head of state Andrew Jackson, who ramped up and made more systematic the holocaust of Native Americans, creating a system of lethal concentration camps, aka "reservations", and driving their inmates to them along a trail of tears that claimed a great many native lives before they ever reached their Sobibor or Treblinka.

Or, perhaps a better candidate for most evil prez would be ole Harry Truman, who dropped A-bombs on Japanese civilians, incinerating many thousands of noncombatant men, women, and children. Nope, it would be something of an understatement to say that he wasn't exactly America's most pro-life commander-in-chief. And no, if they're still teaching you that Hiroshima & Nagasaki were nuked because Truman had no choice, because the Japanese people were feverish fanatics who would have fought to the very last man rather than surrender, resulting in an estimated million dead American servicemen, they, your teachers and textbooks, are openly lying to you. It's now a known fact that Japanese leaders were indeed willing to surrender, virtually unconditionally (the only concession they wished to stipulate was that the emperor not be tried as a common war criminal, a concession which was ultimately granted anyway!). So, the detonation of nuclear bombs in Hiroshima & Nagasaki was quite unnecessary and tantamount to mass murder. Mm-hmm, I would think that this should put Truman up near the top of most people's list of morally vile American leaders.

But then of course in body count Give 'Em Hell Harry may have been topped by William McKinley, who went to his grave with the blood of perhaps over a million Filipinos! Yes, the Philippine-American War is an almost forgotten episode in U.S. history (I would recommend the John Sayles film Amigo), it involved the mass killing of Filipino freedom fighters and the brutal imposition of American rule, and it happened on the watch of 25the president of this republic (who oversaw its transformation into a colonialist empire), William McKinley Jr. Oh yeah, and don't forget about the Spanish-American War, which marked the U.S.'s entry into the game of overseas imperialism.

Well, how about a more recent member of the presidential rogues' gallery, Ronald Wilson Reagan? He was a somewhat unlovely fellow whose heinous Salvadoran henchmen assassinated an outspoken Archbishop, offed progressive priests, and perpetrated the rape-murders of innocent nuns. He, The Gipper, also helped get us trending toward that deregulated state of affairs that resulted in the global Great Recession, which has caused unquantifiable suffering, and who knows how much loss of life in poor countries. Thanks a lot Ronnie! But I suppose that he died with a clean conscience, so to speak, since his Alzheimer's wiped his memory.

Perhaps his successor, George Herbert Walker Bush, who visited a good deal of pain and death on the Iraqi people on the rubbishy pretext of keeping the oil fields of Kuwait safe for democracy.

Or what about Thomas Woodrow Wilson, who broke his promise to keep America out of World War One and subjected thousands of doughboys to a miserable death in the trenches and by mustard gas; who was a racist who opposed integration at Princeton and bestowed words of praise on the KKK; who authorized many of the actions of the Banana Wars in Central America and the Caribbean; who in actuality was anti-labor, etc.

Then there's that overcompensatingly macho character Teddy Roosevelt, who loved war and personally murdered Spaniards on San Juan Hill; who was an unabashed imperialist; who pandered to the populist zeitgeist by playing the champion of the anti-trust cause but who in actuality was, like all presidents, "a consenting party to the status quo", etc.

Or perhaps James Monroe, whose doctrine codified and supposedly legitimized America's sense of having a manifest destiny to dominate "the American continents" – a doctrine that has certainly led the United States to maintain its hemispheric hegemony at the cost of an enormous loss of life in Latin America.

Or, then again, there's James K. Polk, whose personal sense of the nation's manifest destiny helped give us the Mexican-American War.

Okay, but what about the early presidents, those supposedly above reproach, almost demigodlike figures in the pantheon of America's civil religion? You know, Washington, Jefferson, et al. Yes, lovely slave-owning fellows they were. But then our minds have been socioculturally molded to not hold this tiny sin against them. All right-thinking Americans are supposed to obligingly overlook the complicity of the founding fathers in the ole evil institution. But perhaps like yours truly you aren't a "right-thinking" American and recognize being a slave master as a major black mark (no pun intended) against a president ?

Incidentally, I would be quite reprehensibly remiss if I didn't recall that General George was also a war criminal of sorts, victimizing Native Americans for choosing the wrong side. In 1779, for instance, he ordered a murderous reprisal against the Iroquois, I quote: "lay waste all the settlements around...that the country may not be merely overrun, but destroyed", and as if this wasn't clear enough he enjoined the commander of the troops who perpetrated this action to not "listen to any overture of peace before the total ruin of their settlements is effected". And boy George (Washington as a young officer) was also peace-time criminal, the massacre of Jumonville occurring slightly before the actual outbreak of hostilities known as the French and Indian War.

Jefferson, btw, was of course a rapist. That is, the slave woman that he's known to have fathered children with was obviously in no position to give consent. Well, just imagine that your sister or mother was held prisoner by someone and that she developed a Stockholm-syndromey sexual relationship with her captor, would you not consider her to be a victim rather than a volunteer, would you not consider her keeper to be an abuser? Wasn't the Apostle of Democracy, the Sage of Monticello, Thomas Jefferson, such an abuser, wasn't he in fact something of a predator?

Well, but what about all of the presidential nonentities, all of the presidents whose names are only remembered by schoolchildren? Surely they were harmless enough? Alas, they were all mere political punks of the real plutocratic masters of our society, "consenting parties to the status quo", glorified functionaries of the powers and principalities that run the economic & political show behind the curtain of our democracy. (And if you dig a little you'll no doubt discover that most of them had a p*ss-poor record on human rights vis-à-vis American Indians, African Americans, and immigrants.)

The conclusion is located directly below
Yo, all of my subliterate conservative criticasters who find perusing and processing the sesquipedalian verbiage of my posts to be such a bothersome brain-taxing chore, I have a new nickname for you. Henceforth you shall be known as Pooh Bears. No, not for the obvious apt reasons, i.e., not because you're full of pooh, and not because of your ursine irritability. Rather, you put me in mind of an A.A. Milne quote, "I am a Bear of Very Little Brain, and long words bother me". Love ya, Pooh Bears.
charleslb
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2/23/2012 4:14:22 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Conclusion

Hmm, but there are a handful of good-guy presidents, right? Lincoln, FDR, Jimmy Carter? You mean ole dishonest Abe who was a crafty politician; who is falsely credited with abolishing slavery; who was a racist driven to wage the Civil War by a nationalistic imperative to keep the Union intact, not by the moral imperative to emancipate African Americans; who very well may have infected his wife with syphilis, which may have been more of an etiological factor in her madness than the shock she suffered to her sanity when her hubby was assassinated; who was not always a very kindly Great White Father to our red brothers, etc.?

Or Franklin Roosevelt, whose New Deal was ulteriorly motivated primarily by a desire to stanch a popular uprising against American capitalism with a Keynesian tourniquet, i.e. to pull the fat of the fat cats from the fire being kindled for them by the conditions of the Great Depression; who maneuvered the nation into war with the ultimate realeconomik object of securing the Grand Area for the American economic elite; who ordered the internment of innocent Japanese Americans and snubbed black athlete-heroes after the 1936 Olympics?

Or the same James Earl Carter who began the era of corporate deregulation; who has been called a worse union-buster than Reagan; who helped foment the fundamentalist revolution in Iran by supporting the Shah; who initiated the support of Islamist terrorists (in those days euphemistically called "freedom fighters" even though they had no concept of Western liberal institutions), thus starting history down a path to 9/11 and our post-9/11 world – good going there, Jimmy; who according to Noam Chomsky was the "least violent of American presidents but …did things which …fall under Nuremberg provisions. As the Indonesian atrocities increased to a level of really near-genocide, the U.S. aid under Carter increased. It reached a peak in 1978 as the atrocities peaked", apparently the needle of the record player in Carter's noggin was stuck on that old tune "Stand by your dictatorial regime" But hey, today he builds houses for the victims of economic conditions that he helped set us up for. The man's an angel, but then so was Lucifer.

As for the crook and creep Richard Nixon, and the mass murderer of the Vietnamese, LBJ, they are such obvious selections that I needn't comment on their presidential-size penchant for evil.

Well, behind the charisma of the office, we disappointingly find that all of this country's presidents, past and present (Obama is just another elected employee of the plutocracy who didn't do the morally right thing and promptly end Dubya's unjust wars or the dangerously deregulated state of the nation's financial system) are ethically-challenged wretches, so, which one, I ask, do you love to loathe the most?
Yo, all of my subliterate conservative criticasters who find perusing and processing the sesquipedalian verbiage of my posts to be such a bothersome brain-taxing chore, I have a new nickname for you. Henceforth you shall be known as Pooh Bears. No, not for the obvious apt reasons, i.e., not because you're full of pooh, and not because of your ursine irritability. Rather, you put me in mind of an A.A. Milne quote, "I am a Bear of Very Little Brain, and long words bother me". Love ya, Pooh Bears.
jimtimmy
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2/23/2012 4:18:40 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
The worst two presidents are Barack Obama and Franklin Roosevelt.

Oh, and Charleslb, I would recommend you look up "Historical Context".
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charleslb
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2/23/2012 4:20:22 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 2/23/2012 4:18:40 PM, jimtimmy wrote:
The worst two presidents are Barack Obama and Franklin Roosevelt.

Oh, and Charleslb, I would recommend you look up "Historical Context".

Would you care to elaborate?
Yo, all of my subliterate conservative criticasters who find perusing and processing the sesquipedalian verbiage of my posts to be such a bothersome brain-taxing chore, I have a new nickname for you. Henceforth you shall be known as Pooh Bears. No, not for the obvious apt reasons, i.e., not because you're full of pooh, and not because of your ursine irritability. Rather, you put me in mind of an A.A. Milne quote, "I am a Bear of Very Little Brain, and long words bother me". Love ya, Pooh Bears.
jimtimmy
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2/23/2012 4:24:59 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 2/23/2012 4:20:22 PM, charleslb wrote:
At 2/23/2012 4:18:40 PM, jimtimmy wrote:
The worst two presidents are Barack Obama and Franklin Roosevelt.

Oh, and Charleslb, I would recommend you look up "Historical Context".

Would you care to elaborate?

Franklin Roosevelt created the modern welfare state and was the leader behind the New Deal which extended the Great Depression.

Barack Obama has added inconceivable amounts to the national debt, greatly expanded the welfare state, and has simply been a weak leader.
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UnStupendousMan
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2/23/2012 4:29:24 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
And I would vote for the modern congress as the most evil congress; they have done NOTHING. And I'm not just blaming the republicans or the democrats, I'm blaming almost EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THEM.
thett3
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2/23/2012 4:29:57 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
William Henry Harrison.
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: At 11/12/2016 11:49:40 PM, Raisor wrote:
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johnnyboy54
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2/23/2012 4:33:37 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
You know someone is crazy when they insinuate the President Lincoln is evil

BTW, the dropping of the A-Bomb is justifiable.
I didn't order assholes with my whiskey.
charleslb
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2/23/2012 4:35:54 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 2/23/2012 4:29:57 PM, thett3 wrote:
William Henry Harrison.

Please feel free to tell us why.
Yo, all of my subliterate conservative criticasters who find perusing and processing the sesquipedalian verbiage of my posts to be such a bothersome brain-taxing chore, I have a new nickname for you. Henceforth you shall be known as Pooh Bears. No, not for the obvious apt reasons, i.e., not because you're full of pooh, and not because of your ursine irritability. Rather, you put me in mind of an A.A. Milne quote, "I am a Bear of Very Little Brain, and long words bother me". Love ya, Pooh Bears.
lewis20
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2/23/2012 4:37:03 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 2/23/2012 4:33:37 PM, johnnyboy54 wrote:
You know someone is crazy when they insinuate the President Lincoln is evil

BTW, the dropping of the A-Bomb is justifiable.

Lincoln wasn't as great as everyone always told us growing up.
"If you are a racist I will attack you with the north"- Abraham Lincoln

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johnnyboy54
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2/23/2012 4:38:29 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 2/23/2012 4:37:03 PM, lewis20 wrote:
At 2/23/2012 4:33:37 PM, johnnyboy54 wrote:
You know someone is crazy when they insinuate the President Lincoln is evil

BTW, the dropping of the A-Bomb is justifiable.

Lincoln wasn't as great as everyone always told us growing up.

True, but overall he was a good president.
I didn't order assholes with my whiskey.
johnnyboy54
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2/23/2012 4:39:08 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 2/23/2012 4:37:03 PM, lewis20 wrote:
At 2/23/2012 4:33:37 PM, johnnyboy54 wrote:
You know someone is crazy when they insinuate the President Lincoln is evil

BTW, the dropping of the A-Bomb is justifiable.

Lincoln wasn't as great as everyone always told us growing up.

Nearly everything when it comes to the legacies of presidents is exaggerated.
I didn't order assholes with my whiskey.
charleslb
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2/23/2012 4:45:06 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 2/23/2012 4:33:37 PM, johnnyboy54 wrote:
You know someone is crazy when they insinuate the President Lincoln is evil

You know that someone has been thoroughly inculcated with the conventional worldview, the dominant ideology of our society when they reflexively respond to any criticism of Saint Abraham Lincoln (or has he made it to archangel status in the American popular imagination?) by hurling the ole "crazy" epithet.

BTW, the dropping of the A-Bomb is justifiable.

How so, did you even read my post where I cover fairly extensively the lack of justification for dropping the A-bomb?!
Yo, all of my subliterate conservative criticasters who find perusing and processing the sesquipedalian verbiage of my posts to be such a bothersome brain-taxing chore, I have a new nickname for you. Henceforth you shall be known as Pooh Bears. No, not for the obvious apt reasons, i.e., not because you're full of pooh, and not because of your ursine irritability. Rather, you put me in mind of an A.A. Milne quote, "I am a Bear of Very Little Brain, and long words bother me". Love ya, Pooh Bears.
charleslb
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2/23/2012 4:47:27 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 2/23/2012 4:39:08 PM, johnnyboy54 wrote:
At 2/23/2012 4:37:03 PM, lewis20 wrote:
At 2/23/2012 4:33:37 PM, johnnyboy54 wrote:
You know someone is crazy when they insinuate the President Lincoln is evil

BTW, the dropping of the A-Bomb is justifiable.

Lincoln wasn't as great as everyone always told us growing up.

Nearly everything when it comes to the legacies of presidents is exaggerated.

And likewise the considerable evil they've done is downplayed.
Yo, all of my subliterate conservative criticasters who find perusing and processing the sesquipedalian verbiage of my posts to be such a bothersome brain-taxing chore, I have a new nickname for you. Henceforth you shall be known as Pooh Bears. No, not for the obvious apt reasons, i.e., not because you're full of pooh, and not because of your ursine irritability. Rather, you put me in mind of an A.A. Milne quote, "I am a Bear of Very Little Brain, and long words bother me". Love ya, Pooh Bears.
Ron-Paul
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2/23/2012 4:51:09 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 2/23/2012 4:37:03 PM, lewis20 wrote:
At 2/23/2012 4:33:37 PM, johnnyboy54 wrote:
You know someone is crazy when they insinuate the President Lincoln is evil

BTW, the dropping of the A-Bomb is justifiable.

Lincoln wasn't as great as everyone always told us growing up.

+1.
UnStupendousMan
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2/23/2012 4:55:33 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
BTW, the dropping of the A-Bomb is justifiable.

How so, did you even read my post where I cover fairly extensively the lack of justification for dropping the A-bomb?!

I'm going to have to derail the thread for a little bit. I'm going to propose a hypothetical question.

You lead Imperial Japan, Charles. You have basically lost the war, and yet you want to keep fighting. Would you rather have two nuclear bombs dropped on your country or would you rather endure a D-Day like invasion? I know there is a debate like that somewhere on the site, but I can't find it.
16kadams
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2/23/2012 5:01:18 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Andrew Jackson ---> trail of tears
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charleslb
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2/23/2012 5:05:16 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 2/23/2012 4:24:59 PM, jimtimmy wrote:
At 2/23/2012 4:20:22 PM, charleslb wrote:
At 2/23/2012 4:18:40 PM, jimtimmy wrote:
The worst two presidents are Barack Obama and Franklin Roosevelt.

Oh, and Charleslb, I would recommend you look up "Historical Context".

Would you care to elaborate?


Franklin Roosevelt created the modern welfare state and was the leader behind the New Deal which extended the Great Depression.

Barack Obama has ... greatly expanded the welfare state, ....

So, essentially you detest Franklin Roosevelt and Obama because of their popular image of being decently progressive chaps. And what fault would you find with ole William McKinley, that he wasn't enough of a Republican tool of the robber barons and imperialists of his day?! But then I suppose that no one can seriously accuse him of not having been quite the tool of the capitalist elite, and I suppose that he's probably your idea of an okay president?!
Yo, all of my subliterate conservative criticasters who find perusing and processing the sesquipedalian verbiage of my posts to be such a bothersome brain-taxing chore, I have a new nickname for you. Henceforth you shall be known as Pooh Bears. No, not for the obvious apt reasons, i.e., not because you're full of pooh, and not because of your ursine irritability. Rather, you put me in mind of an A.A. Milne quote, "I am a Bear of Very Little Brain, and long words bother me". Love ya, Pooh Bears.
jimtimmy
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2/23/2012 5:11:04 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 2/23/2012 5:05:16 PM, charleslb wrote:
At 2/23/2012 4:24:59 PM, jimtimmy wrote:
At 2/23/2012 4:20:22 PM, charleslb wrote:
At 2/23/2012 4:18:40 PM, jimtimmy wrote:
The worst two presidents are Barack Obama and Franklin Roosevelt.

Oh, and Charleslb, I would recommend you look up "Historical Context".

Would you care to elaborate?


Franklin Roosevelt created the modern welfare state and was the leader behind the New Deal which extended the Great Depression.

Barack Obama has ... greatly expanded the welfare state, ....

So, essentially you detest Franklin Roosevelt and Obama because of their popular image of being decently progressive chaps. And what fault would you find with ole William McKinley, that he wasn't enough of a Republican tool of the robber barons and imperialists of his day?! But then I suppose that no one can seriously accuse him of not having been quite the tool of the capitalist elite, and I suppose that he's probably your idea of an okay president?!

The welfare state has been far more destructive than any "capitalist elite" could ever hope to be.
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ConservativePolitico
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2/23/2012 5:14:32 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 2/23/2012 4:55:33 PM, UnStupendousMan wrote:
BTW, the dropping of the A-Bomb is justifiable.

How so, did you even read my post where I cover fairly extensively the lack of justification for dropping the A-bomb?!

I'm going to have to derail the thread for a little bit. I'm going to propose a hypothetical question.

You lead Imperial Japan, Charles. You have basically lost the war, and yet you want to keep fighting. Would you rather have two nuclear bombs dropped on your country or would you rather endure a D-Day like invasion? I know there is a debate like that somewhere on the site, but I can't find it.

I did one and won it.
Contra
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2/23/2012 5:24:03 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 2/23/2012 4:48:44 PM, Ron-Paul wrote:
Barack Obama and Franklin Roosevelt.


How can you people say this? At least FDR? He got us out of the depression. It is true that the unemployment rate fell slowly and it took many years to recover, but he put in the regulation to prevent a repeat of the Depression (although was later removed by Bill Clinton - his biggest error as President). FDR also made the economy have a stronger foundation and also established a safety net in the USA, and don't forget Social Security. The economy did really well after WW2 as well, as we all know, because of massive economic spending.

Besides the price controls, I think that FDR was a fine President.

About Obama, just take a view of all he has done to benefit America:

http://3chicspolitico.com...
"The solution [for Republicans] is to admit that Bush was a bad president, stop this racist homophobic stuff, stop trying to give most of the tax cuts to the rich, propose a real alternative to Obamacare that actually works, and propose smart free market solutions to our economic problems." - Distraff

"Americans are better off in a dynamic, free-enterprise-based economy that fosters economic growth, opportunity and upward mobility." - Paul Ryan
ConservativePolitico
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2/23/2012 5:47:36 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 2/23/2012 5:24:03 PM, Contra wrote:
At 2/23/2012 4:48:44 PM, Ron-Paul wrote:
Barack Obama and Franklin Roosevelt.


How can you people say this? At least FDR? He got us out of the depression. It is true that the unemployment rate fell slowly and it took many years to recover, but he put in the regulation to prevent a repeat of the Depression (although was later removed by Bill Clinton - his biggest error as President). FDR also made the economy have a stronger foundation and also established a safety net in the USA, and don't forget Social Security. The economy did really well after WW2 as well, as we all know, because of massive economic spending.

Besides the price controls, I think that FDR was a fine President.

About Obama, just take a view of all he has done to benefit America:

http://3chicspolitico.com...

Social Security hahahahahaahahahahahahahaha

What a stupid program...
000ike
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2/23/2012 5:51:36 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 2/23/2012 5:24:03 PM, Contra wrote:
At 2/23/2012 4:48:44 PM, Ron-Paul wrote:
Barack Obama and Franklin Roosevelt.


How can you people say this? At least FDR? He got us out of the depression. It is true that the unemployment rate fell slowly and it took many years to recover, but he put in the regulation to prevent a repeat of the Depression (although was later removed by Bill Clinton - his biggest error as President). FDR also made the economy have a stronger foundation and also established a safety net in the USA, and don't forget Social Security. The economy did really well after WW2 as well, as we all know, because of massive economic spending.

Besides the price controls, I think that FDR was a fine President.

About Obama, just take a view of all he has done to benefit America:

http://3chicspolitico.com...

They just say that to assert their status as Conservatives. Opposition to liberalism and liberal policies has become a sport for them like the competitions for who could burp the alphabet in first grade. In short, its opposition derived from ideological fanaticism...and they don't actually believe either Obama or FDR are evil.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
Maikuru
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2/23/2012 5:52:34 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
President Eden from Fallout 3 seems pretty bad, but I haven't beaten the game yet so it's still up in the air.
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thett3
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2/23/2012 5:56:14 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Say what you want about the new deal, but FDR's foreign policy was fantastic.
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"Don't quote me, ever." -Max

"My name is max. I'm not a big fan of slacks"- Max rapping

"Walmart should have the opportunity to bribe a politician to it's agenda" -Max

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"You fit the character of Regina George quite nicely"- Sam

: At 11/12/2016 11:49:40 PM, Raisor wrote:
: thett was right
johnnyboy54
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2/23/2012 5:58:40 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 2/23/2012 5:56:14 PM, thett3 wrote:
Say what you want about the new deal, but FDR's foreign policy was fantastic.

True
I didn't order assholes with my whiskey.
Contra
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2/23/2012 5:59:02 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Social Security hahahahahaahahahahahahahaha

What a stupid program...


I agree. It is a very tragedy that such a program is allowed to exist. Just think, if we dropped the moderate tax on this program, only about 11 million seniors will be plunged into poverty. Only 11 million more people who are no longer consumers. They rich should be encouraged to opt out so that they can use their somewhat larger paychecks to let it sit in their bank, because after all of the rich opt out, the program will collapse and a demand crisis will occur with millions more in poverty. About the defenders of this program saying it helps the poor and middle class ... WHINERS! The rich should voluntarily recycle their extra dollars if they so well please. About SS defenders, this is just the kind of stuff that makes me sick.
"The solution [for Republicans] is to admit that Bush was a bad president, stop this racist homophobic stuff, stop trying to give most of the tax cuts to the rich, propose a real alternative to Obamacare that actually works, and propose smart free market solutions to our economic problems." - Distraff

"Americans are better off in a dynamic, free-enterprise-based economy that fosters economic growth, opportunity and upward mobility." - Paul Ryan