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The Value of the Liberal Mindset

GeoLaureate8
Posts: 12,252
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3/26/2012 1:45:54 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
As I'm personally not a Liberal, I think we all need to take a step back and realize the value of Liberalism.

Imagine a world with no Liberals. It would be a pretty cruel and bleak world I think.

We need the tree-huggers, the animal rights activists, the sensitivity to race discrimination, the mentality that sticks up for women, the concern for the environment, the strong anti-war sentiment, religious pluralism/tolerance, the pro-drug legalization, etc.

I'm personally not gonna stick up for trees or be the one to care, but i'm glad there's people who do and I think Liberalism is much needed for balance. Probably more so than Conservatism. Conservatism brings very little value except opposing wealth redistribution, lower taxes, welfare state, etc. Otherwise it's just a bunch family values, religious fanatacism and intolerance nonsense and care very little about freedom.

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"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
Yarely
Posts: 329
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3/26/2012 3:37:53 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
A world without Liberalism would be like a world without idealism
"Anarchism stands for the liberation of the human mind from the dominion of religion and liberation of the human body from the coercion of property; liberation from the shackles and restraint of government. It stands for a social order based on the free grouping of individuals""
-Emma Goldman
Contra
Posts: 3,941
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3/26/2012 4:42:51 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 3/26/2012 3:37:53 PM, Yarely wrote:
A world without Liberalism would be like a world without idealism

Idealism is not always good.
"The solution [for Republicans] is to admit that Bush was a bad president, stop this racist homophobic stuff, stop trying to give most of the tax cuts to the rich, propose a real alternative to Obamacare that actually works, and propose smart free market solutions to our economic problems." - Distraff

"Americans are better off in a dynamic, free-enterprise-based economy that fosters economic growth, opportunity and upward mobility." - Paul Ryan
thett3
Posts: 14,334
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3/26/2012 4:44:07 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Without liberalism we would be languishing in stagnation
DDO Vice President

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"Don't quote me, ever." -Max

"My name is max. I'm not a big fan of slacks"- Max rapping

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: At 11/12/2016 11:49:40 PM, Raisor wrote:
: thett was right
Lordknukle
Posts: 12,788
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3/26/2012 4:56:12 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Without liberalism, we would have never have gotten the free market, property rights, civil liberties, freedom of religion, press, and speech.

Oh wait, are we talking about modern liberalism? In that case:

Without liberalism, the world would be a better place.
"Easy is the descent to Avernus, for the door to the Underworld lies upon both day and night. But to retrace your steps and return to the breezes above- that's the task, that's the toil."
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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3/26/2012 4:59:32 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
I think you're attributing to the ideology what is characteristic of it's people. There are certain qualities such as open-mindedness, valuation of scientific truth, and tolerance which are conducive to a prosperous and progressive society, but that in no way means that only Liberals have this character, and without Liberalism, such character would be lost.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
FREEDO
Posts: 21,057
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3/26/2012 5:04:58 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Everyone has their character to play in the big circus act we call society. Little diversity makes for a boring show.
GRAND POOBAH OF DDO

fnord
Contra
Posts: 3,941
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3/26/2012 5:05:26 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 3/26/2012 4:56:12 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
Without liberalism, we would have never have gotten the free market, property rights, civil liberties, freedom of religion, press, and speech.

Oh wait, are we talking about modern liberalism? In that case:

Without liberalism, the world would be a better place.

That's nice. If you consider all activists liberals, such as the college students campaigning for weed legalization, I am more conservative then that, so I just call myself a Progressive.
"The solution [for Republicans] is to admit that Bush was a bad president, stop this racist homophobic stuff, stop trying to give most of the tax cuts to the rich, propose a real alternative to Obamacare that actually works, and propose smart free market solutions to our economic problems." - Distraff

"Americans are better off in a dynamic, free-enterprise-based economy that fosters economic growth, opportunity and upward mobility." - Paul Ryan
Lordknukle
Posts: 12,788
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3/26/2012 5:34:45 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 3/26/2012 5:05:26 PM, Contra wrote:
At 3/26/2012 4:56:12 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
Without liberalism, we would have never have gotten the free market, property rights, civil liberties, freedom of religion, press, and speech.

Oh wait, are we talking about modern liberalism? In that case:

Without liberalism, the world would be a better place.

That's nice. If you consider all activists liberals, such as the college students campaigning for weed legalization, I am more conservative then that, so I just call myself a Progressive.

Those people are not liberals.

In purely economic sense, liberals are generally for regulation and State intrusion in private and public economic lives to make the world a "better" place. Conservatives are for less government intervention in economic lives.

Is regulating weed a liberal or conservative principle? Liberal.

We've established that they are economic right wingers.

Authoritarians want more government intervention in social lives. Libertarians want less government intervention in social lives. These protesters are libertarians.

In conclusion, they are conservative libertarians.
"Easy is the descent to Avernus, for the door to the Underworld lies upon both day and night. But to retrace your steps and return to the breezes above- that's the task, that's the toil."
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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3/26/2012 5:40:06 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 3/26/2012 5:34:45 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
At 3/26/2012 5:05:26 PM, Contra wrote:
At 3/26/2012 4:56:12 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
Without liberalism, we would have never have gotten the free market, property rights, civil liberties, freedom of religion, press, and speech.

Oh wait, are we talking about modern liberalism? In that case:

Without liberalism, the world would be a better place.

That's nice. If you consider all activists liberals, such as the college students campaigning for weed legalization, I am more conservative then that, so I just call myself a Progressive.

Those people are not liberals.

In purely economic sense, liberals are generally for regulation and State intrusion in private and public economic lives to make the world a "better" place. Conservatives are for less government intervention in economic lives.

Is regulating weed a liberal or conservative principle? Liberal.

We've established that they are economic right wingers.

Authoritarians want more government intervention in social lives. Libertarians want less government intervention in social lives. These protesters are libertarians.

In conclusion, they are conservative libertarians.

You're adhering to the political spectrum of eons ago, and really it is neither insightful nor impressive to claim in the 21st century that Liberalism is economically right-wing. It just makes you look retarded. Ideologies and what they stand for change, as do the respective wings of political leaning. Get over it.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
Lordknukle
Posts: 12,788
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3/26/2012 5:43:07 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 3/26/2012 5:40:06 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 3/26/2012 5:34:45 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
At 3/26/2012 5:05:26 PM, Contra wrote:
At 3/26/2012 4:56:12 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
Without liberalism, we would have never have gotten the free market, property rights, civil liberties, freedom of religion, press, and speech.

Oh wait, are we talking about modern liberalism? In that case:

Without liberalism, the world would be a better place.

That's nice. If you consider all activists liberals, such as the college students campaigning for weed legalization, I am more conservative then that, so I just call myself a Progressive.

Those people are not liberals.

In purely economic sense, liberals are generally for regulation and State intrusion in private and public economic lives to make the world a "better" place. Conservatives are for less government intervention in economic lives.

Is regulating weed a liberal or conservative principle? Liberal.

We've established that they are economic right wingers.

Authoritarians want more government intervention in social lives. Libertarians want less government intervention in social lives. These protesters are libertarians.

In conclusion, they are conservative libertarians.

You're adhering to the political spectrum of eons ago, and really it is neither insightful nor impressive to claim in the 21st century that Liberalism is economically right-wing. It just makes you look retarded. Ideologies and what they stand for change, as do the respective wings of political leaning. Get over it.

When did I ever say that liberalism is right wing? Get your ears cleaned.

Liberalism is left wing State intervention in the economy. These students are protesting to lessen government intervention in economic sector.
"Easy is the descent to Avernus, for the door to the Underworld lies upon both day and night. But to retrace your steps and return to the breezes above- that's the task, that's the toil."
Yarely
Posts: 329
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3/26/2012 5:53:22 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 3/26/2012 4:42:51 PM, Contra wrote:
At 3/26/2012 3:37:53 PM, Yarely wrote:
A world without Liberalism would be like a world without idealism

Idealism is not always good.

Well no it's not always a good thing but that doesn't necessarily mean much. Because without idealism and visionaries, we wouldn't have pushed the boundaries of American society. Women's suffrage/Civil Rights movement etc. Without idealists believing they could change the way society worked, society would of remained stagnant oppressive
"Anarchism stands for the liberation of the human mind from the dominion of religion and liberation of the human body from the coercion of property; liberation from the shackles and restraint of government. It stands for a social order based on the free grouping of individuals""
-Emma Goldman
thett3
Posts: 14,334
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3/26/2012 6:21:52 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 3/26/2012 5:43:07 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
At 3/26/2012 5:40:06 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 3/26/2012 5:34:45 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
At 3/26/2012 5:05:26 PM, Contra wrote:
At 3/26/2012 4:56:12 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
Without liberalism, we would have never have gotten the free market, property rights, civil liberties, freedom of religion, press, and speech.

Oh wait, are we talking about modern liberalism? In that case:

Without liberalism, the world would be a better place.

That's nice. If you consider all activists liberals, such as the college students campaigning for weed legalization, I am more conservative then that, so I just call myself a Progressive.

Those people are not liberals.

In purely economic sense, liberals are generally for regulation and State intrusion in private and public economic lives to make the world a "better" place. Conservatives are for less government intervention in economic lives.

Is regulating weed a liberal or conservative principle? Liberal.

We've established that they are economic right wingers.

Authoritarians want more government intervention in social lives. Libertarians want less government intervention in social lives. These protesters are libertarians.

In conclusion, they are conservative libertarians.

You're adhering to the political spectrum of eons ago, and really it is neither insightful nor impressive to claim in the 21st century that Liberalism is economically right-wing. It just makes you look retarded. Ideologies and what they stand for change, as do the respective wings of political leaning. Get over it.

When did I ever say that liberalism is right wing? Get your eyes cleaned.

Liberalism is left wing State intervention in the economy. These students are protesting to lessen government intervention in economic sector.

Fixed ^.^
DDO Vice President

#StandwithBossy

#UnbanTheMadman

#BetOnThett

"Don't quote me, ever." -Max

"My name is max. I'm not a big fan of slacks"- Max rapping

"Walmart should have the opportunity to bribe a politician to it's agenda" -Max

"Thett, you're really good at convincing people you're a decent person"-tulle

"You fit the character of Regina George quite nicely"- Sam

: At 11/12/2016 11:49:40 PM, Raisor wrote:
: thett was right
Contra
Posts: 3,941
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3/26/2012 6:54:06 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 3/26/2012 5:53:22 PM, Yarely wrote:
At 3/26/2012 4:42:51 PM, Contra wrote:
At 3/26/2012 3:37:53 PM, Yarely wrote:
A world without Liberalism would be like a world without idealism

Idealism is not always good.

Well no it's not always a good thing but that doesn't necessarily mean much. Because without idealism and visionaries, we wouldn't have pushed the boundaries of American society. Women's suffrage/Civil Rights movement etc. Without idealists believing they could change the way society worked, society would of remained stagnant oppressive

This is true, but if you are a hardcore idealist, you are likely to prevent any progress from being made. Look at the GOP in Congress. The Nazis in WW2 Germany, the near debt default of the US last year (GOP again).
"The solution [for Republicans] is to admit that Bush was a bad president, stop this racist homophobic stuff, stop trying to give most of the tax cuts to the rich, propose a real alternative to Obamacare that actually works, and propose smart free market solutions to our economic problems." - Distraff

"Americans are better off in a dynamic, free-enterprise-based economy that fosters economic growth, opportunity and upward mobility." - Paul Ryan
Lordknukle
Posts: 12,788
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3/26/2012 7:10:29 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 3/26/2012 6:54:06 PM, Contra wrote:
At 3/26/2012 5:53:22 PM, Yarely wrote:
At 3/26/2012 4:42:51 PM, Contra wrote:
At 3/26/2012 3:37:53 PM, Yarely wrote:
A world without Liberalism would be like a world without idealism

Idealism is not always good.

Well no it's not always a good thing but that doesn't necessarily mean much. Because without idealism and visionaries, we wouldn't have pushed the boundaries of American society. Women's suffrage/Civil Rights movement etc. Without idealists believing they could change the way society worked, society would of remained stagnant oppressive

This is true, but if you are a hardcore idealist, you are likely to prevent any progress from being made. Look at the GOP in Congress. The Nazis in WW2 Germany, the near debt default of the US last year (GOP again).


Right.... It totally wasn't the trillion of dollars WASTED on useless social programs put together by the liberals.
"Easy is the descent to Avernus, for the door to the Underworld lies upon both day and night. But to retrace your steps and return to the breezes above- that's the task, that's the toil."
Contra
Posts: 3,941
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3/26/2012 7:20:47 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 3/26/2012 7:10:29 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
At 3/26/2012 6:54:06 PM, Contra wrote:
At 3/26/2012 5:53:22 PM, Yarely wrote:
At 3/26/2012 4:42:51 PM, Contra wrote:
At 3/26/2012 3:37:53 PM, Yarely wrote:
A world without Liberalism would be like a world without idealism

Idealism is not always good.

Well no it's not always a good thing but that doesn't necessarily mean much. Because without idealism and visionaries, we wouldn't have pushed the boundaries of American society. Women's suffrage/Civil Rights movement etc. Without idealists believing they could change the way society worked, society would of remained stagnant oppressive

This is true, but if you are a hardcore idealist, you are likely to prevent any progress from being made. Look at the GOP in Congress. The Nazis in WW2 Germany, the near debt default of the US last year (GOP again).


Right.... It totally wasn't the trillion of dollars WASTED on useless social programs put together by the liberals.

Not as expensive as the Bush tax cuts and overseas wars
"The solution [for Republicans] is to admit that Bush was a bad president, stop this racist homophobic stuff, stop trying to give most of the tax cuts to the rich, propose a real alternative to Obamacare that actually works, and propose smart free market solutions to our economic problems." - Distraff

"Americans are better off in a dynamic, free-enterprise-based economy that fosters economic growth, opportunity and upward mobility." - Paul Ryan
jimtimmy
Posts: 3,953
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3/26/2012 7:22:26 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 3/26/2012 7:20:47 PM, Contra wrote:
At 3/26/2012 7:10:29 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
At 3/26/2012 6:54:06 PM, Contra wrote:
At 3/26/2012 5:53:22 PM, Yarely wrote:
At 3/26/2012 4:42:51 PM, Contra wrote:
At 3/26/2012 3:37:53 PM, Yarely wrote:
A world without Liberalism would be like a world without idealism

Idealism is not always good.

Well no it's not always a good thing but that doesn't necessarily mean much. Because without idealism and visionaries, we wouldn't have pushed the boundaries of American society. Women's suffrage/Civil Rights movement etc. Without idealists believing they could change the way society worked, society would of remained stagnant oppressive

This is true, but if you are a hardcore idealist, you are likely to prevent any progress from being made. Look at the GOP in Congress. The Nazis in WW2 Germany, the near debt default of the US last year (GOP again).


Right.... It totally wasn't the trillion of dollars WASTED on useless social programs put together by the liberals.

Not as expensive as the Bush tax cuts and overseas wars

Right, because the Bush tax cuts and wars are far more expensive than entitlements....

Wait, that isn't even close to being true.
President of DDO
Contra
Posts: 3,941
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3/26/2012 8:26:49 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 3/26/2012 7:22:26 PM, jimtimmy wrote:
At 3/26/2012 7:20:47 PM, Contra wrote:
At 3/26/2012 7:10:29 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
At 3/26/2012 6:54:06 PM, Contra wrote:
At 3/26/2012 5:53:22 PM, Yarely wrote:
At 3/26/2012 4:42:51 PM, Contra wrote:
At 3/26/2012 3:37:53 PM, Yarely wrote:
A world without Liberalism would be like a world without idealism

Idealism is not always good.

Well no it's not always a good thing but that doesn't necessarily mean much. Because without idealism and visionaries, we wouldn't have pushed the boundaries of American society. Women's suffrage/Civil Rights movement etc. Without idealists believing they could change the way society worked, society would of remained stagnant oppressive

This is true, but if you are a hardcore idealist, you are likely to prevent any progress from being made. Look at the GOP in Congress. The Nazis in WW2 Germany, the near debt default of the US last year (GOP again).


Right.... It totally wasn't the trillion of dollars WASTED on useless social programs put together by the liberals.

Not as expensive as the Bush tax cuts and overseas wars


Right, because the Bush tax cuts and wars are far more expensive than entitlements....

Wait, that isn't even close to being true.

So you are talking about programs like Medicare and Social Security, which shouldn't even be on the Federal budget because they are paid for, i.e. lockbox.
"The solution [for Republicans] is to admit that Bush was a bad president, stop this racist homophobic stuff, stop trying to give most of the tax cuts to the rich, propose a real alternative to Obamacare that actually works, and propose smart free market solutions to our economic problems." - Distraff

"Americans are better off in a dynamic, free-enterprise-based economy that fosters economic growth, opportunity and upward mobility." - Paul Ryan
Ragnar_Rahl
Posts: 19,297
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3/26/2012 8:33:30 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 3/26/2012 8:26:49 PM, Contra wrote:
At 3/26/2012 7:22:26 PM, jimtimmy wrote:
At 3/26/2012 7:20:47 PM, Contra wrote:
At 3/26/2012 7:10:29 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
At 3/26/2012 6:54:06 PM, Contra wrote:
At 3/26/2012 5:53:22 PM, Yarely wrote:
At 3/26/2012 4:42:51 PM, Contra wrote:
At 3/26/2012 3:37:53 PM, Yarely wrote:
A world without Liberalism would be like a world without idealism

Idealism is not always good.

Well no it's not always a good thing but that doesn't necessarily mean much. Because without idealism and visionaries, we wouldn't have pushed the boundaries of American society. Women's suffrage/Civil Rights movement etc. Without idealists believing they could change the way society worked, society would of remained stagnant oppressive

This is true, but if you are a hardcore idealist, you are likely to prevent any progress from being made. Look at the GOP in Congress. The Nazis in WW2 Germany, the near debt default of the US last year (GOP again).


Right.... It totally wasn't the trillion of dollars WASTED on useless social programs put together by the liberals.

Not as expensive as the Bush tax cuts and overseas wars


Right, because the Bush tax cuts and wars are far more expensive than entitlements....

Wait, that isn't even close to being true.

So you are talking about programs like Medicare and Social Security, which shouldn't even be on the Federal budget because they are paid for, i.e. lockbox.

The federal government taxes the money.
The federal government pays the money.
Any federal budget that doesn't include them is a lie.
It came to be at its height. It was commanded to command. It was a capital before its first stone was laid. It was a monument to the spirit of man.
Stephen_Hawkins
Posts: 5,316
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3/27/2012 4:54:50 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 3/26/2012 5:43:07 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
At 3/26/2012 5:40:06 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 3/26/2012 5:34:45 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
At 3/26/2012 5:05:26 PM, Contra wrote:
At 3/26/2012 4:56:12 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
Without liberalism, we would have never have gotten the free market, property rights, civil liberties, freedom of religion, press, and speech.

Oh wait, are we talking about modern liberalism? In that case:

Without liberalism, the world would be a better place.

That's nice. If you consider all activists liberals, such as the college students campaigning for weed legalization, I am more conservative then that, so I just call myself a Progressive.

Those people are not liberals.

In purely economic sense, liberals are generally for regulation and State intrusion in private and public economic lives to make the world a "better" place. Conservatives are for less government intervention in economic lives.

Is regulating weed a liberal or conservative principle? Liberal.

We've established that they [liberals] are economic right wingers.

Authoritarians want more government intervention in social lives. Libertarians want less government intervention in social lives. These protesters are libertarians.

In conclusion, they are conservative libertarians.

You're adhering to the political spectrum of eons ago, and really it is neither insightful nor impressive to claim in the 21st century that Liberalism is economically right-wing. It just makes you look retarded. Ideologies and what they stand for change, as do the respective wings of political leaning. Get over it.

When did I ever say that liberalism is right wing? Get your ears cleaned.

Genius. I love typed stuff.
Give a man a fish, he'll eat for a day. Teach him how to be Gay, he'll positively influence the GDP.

Social Contract Theory debate: http://www.debate.org...
inferno
Posts: 10,549
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3/27/2012 4:55:36 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 3/26/2012 1:45:54 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
As I'm personally not a Liberal, I think we all need to take a step back and realize the value of Liberalism.

Imagine a world with no Liberals. It would be a pretty cruel and bleak world I think.

We need the tree-huggers, the animal rights activists, the sensitivity to race discrimination, the mentality that sticks up for women, the concern for the environment, the strong anti-war sentiment, religious pluralism/tolerance, the pro-drug legalization, etc.

I'm personally not gonna stick up for trees or be the one to care, but i'm glad there's people who do and I think Liberalism is much needed for balance. Probably more so than Conservatism. Conservatism brings very little value except opposing wealth redistribution, lower taxes, welfare state, etc. Otherwise it's just a bunch family values, religious fanatacism and intolerance nonsense and care very little about freedom.





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.Were winning the war. Dont worry.