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If I Want America to Fail

Ameriman
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5/8/2012 8:51:39 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
This video says it all.
We spend too much our time measuring compassion for those in needs by measuring inputs. How much money are we spending? How many programs are we creating? But we are not focusing on outcomes. Are these programs working? Are people getting out of poverty?
-Paul Ryan
Apollo.11
Posts: 3,478
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5/8/2012 9:06:14 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
If I wanted America to fail, I would create rousing propaganda pieces that destort reality for political gain. If I wanted America to fail, I would deceive innocent Americans with empty emotional pleas while promoting a hidden agenda. If I wanted America to fail, I tarnish and slander all opposition, regardless of fact or logic. I would spew lies about their religion, citizenship, education, and private life-slandering their wives if necesary.

If I wanted America to fail, I would stop at nothing and no one, making my first priority to cowtow to a small elite while undermining the freedoms and liberties of an entire people. I would then convince people that it is not I who wants America to fail, but those who stand in my way.

I suppose, if I wanted America to fail, I wouldn't change a thing.
Sapere Aude!
OberHerr
Posts: 13,062
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5/8/2012 9:08:58 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/8/2012 9:06:14 PM, Apollo.11 wrote:
If I wanted America to fail, I would create rousing propaganda pieces that destort reality for political gain. If I wanted America to fail, I would deceive innocent Americans with empty emotional pleas while promoting a hidden agenda. If I wanted America to fail, I tarnish and slander all opposition, regardless of fact or logic. I would spew lies about their religion, citizenship, education, and private life-slandering their wives if necesary.

If I wanted America to fail, I would stop at nothing and no one, making my first priority to cowtow to a small elite while undermining the freedoms and liberties of an entire people. I would then convince people that it is not I who wants America to fail, but those who stand in my way.

I suppose, if I wanted America to fail, I wouldn't change a thing.

My name is Barack Obama, and I support this propaganda.
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FREEDO
Posts: 21,057
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5/8/2012 9:15:53 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/8/2012 9:06:14 PM, Apollo.11 wrote:
If I wanted America to fail, I would create rousing propaganda pieces that destort reality for political gain. If I wanted America to fail, I would deceive innocent Americans with empty emotional pleas while promoting a hidden agenda. If I wanted America to fail, I tarnish and slander all opposition, regardless of fact or logic. I would spew lies about their religion, citizenship, education, and private life-slandering their wives if necesary.

If I wanted America to fail, I would stop at nothing and no one, making my first priority to cowtow to a small elite while undermining the freedoms and liberties of an entire people. I would then convince people that it is not I who wants America to fail, but those who stand in my way.

I suppose, if I wanted America to fail, I wouldn't change a thing.

hehe
GRAND POOBAH OF DDO

fnord
Apollo.11
Posts: 3,478
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5/8/2012 9:19:45 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/8/2012 9:08:58 PM, OberHerr wrote:
At 5/8/2012 9:06:14 PM, Apollo.11 wrote:
If I wanted America to fail, I would create rousing propaganda pieces that destort reality for political gain. If I wanted America to fail, I would deceive innocent Americans with empty emotional pleas while promoting a hidden agenda. If I wanted America to fail, I tarnish and slander all opposition, regardless of fact or logic. I would spew lies about their religion, citizenship, education, and private life-slandering their wives if necesary.

If I wanted America to fail, I would stop at nothing and no one, making my first priority to cowtow to a small elite while undermining the freedoms and liberties of an entire people. I would then convince people that it is not I who wants America to fail, but those who stand in my way.

I suppose, if I wanted America to fail, I wouldn't change a thing.

My name is Barack Obama, and I support this propaganda.

Am I going to have to spoon feed you every reference in that?
Sapere Aude!
Lordknukle
Posts: 12,788
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5/8/2012 9:51:53 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/8/2012 9:06:14 PM, Apollo.11 wrote:
If I wanted America to fail, I would create rousing propaganda pieces that destort reality for political gain. If I wanted America to fail, I would deceive innocent Americans with empty emotional pleas while promoting a hidden agenda. If I wanted America to fail, I tarnish and slander all opposition, regardless of fact or logic. I would spew lies about their religion, citizenship, education, and private life-slandering their wives if necesary.

If I wanted America to fail, I would stop at nothing and no one, making my first priority to cowtow to a small elite while undermining the freedoms and liberties of an entire people. I would then convince people that it is not I who wants America to fail, but those who stand in my way.

I suppose, if I wanted America to fail, I wouldn't change a thing.

http://lh5.ggpht.com...
"Easy is the descent to Avernus, for the door to the Underworld lies upon both day and night. But to retrace your steps and return to the breezes above- that's the task, that's the toil."
Ameriman
Posts: 622
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5/8/2012 10:15:57 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/8/2012 9:06:14 PM, Apollo.11 wrote:
If I wanted America to fail, I would create rousing propaganda pieces that destort reality for political gain. If I wanted America to fail, I would deceive innocent Americans with empty emotional pleas while promoting a hidden agenda. If I wanted America to fail, I tarnish and slander all opposition, regardless of fact or logic. I would spew lies about their religion, citizenship, education, and private life-slandering their wives if necesary.

If I wanted America to fail, I would stop at nothing and no one, making my first priority to cowtow to a small elite while undermining the freedoms and liberties of an entire people. I would then convince people that it is not I who wants America to fail, but those who stand in my way.

I suppose, if I wanted America to fail, I wouldn't change a thing.

No, if I wanted to America to fail I would respond to some very valid ideaological points with ad hominem.
We spend too much our time measuring compassion for those in needs by measuring inputs. How much money are we spending? How many programs are we creating? But we are not focusing on outcomes. Are these programs working? Are people getting out of poverty?
-Paul Ryan
FREEDO
Posts: 21,057
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5/9/2012 1:20:37 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/9/2012 12:50:30 AM, Jon1 wrote:
Basically, we will end up with Europe.

Most European countries, especially the Nordic, report high life-satisfaction and are regarded by many different systems of measurement as having higher standards of living that the US. Doesn't sound that bad.
GRAND POOBAH OF DDO

fnord
Ragnar_Rahl
Posts: 19,297
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5/9/2012 1:24:18 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/8/2012 9:19:45 PM, Apollo.11 wrote:
At 5/8/2012 9:08:58 PM, OberHerr wrote:
At 5/8/2012 9:06:14 PM, Apollo.11 wrote:
If I wanted America to fail, I would create rousing propaganda pieces that destort reality for political gain. If I wanted America to fail, I would deceive innocent Americans with empty emotional pleas while promoting a hidden agenda. If I wanted America to fail, I tarnish and slander all opposition, regardless of fact or logic. I would spew lies about their religion, citizenship, education, and private life-slandering their wives if necesary.

If I wanted America to fail, I would stop at nothing and no one, making my first priority to cowtow to a small elite while undermining the freedoms and liberties of an entire people. I would then convince people that it is not I who wants America to fail, but those who stand in my way.

I suppose, if I wanted America to fail, I wouldn't change a thing.

My name is Barack Obama, and I support this propaganda.

Am I going to have to spoon feed you every reference in that?
There weren't any references in that. There might be innuendo, but it wasn't even good innuendo (it failed to, shall we say, innuend), let alone something so concrete as a reference.

The video, on the other hand, had a mix of references and innuendo that, shall we say, managed to innuend.
It came to be at its height. It was commanded to command. It was a capital before its first stone was laid. It was a monument to the spirit of man.
Ragnar_Rahl
Posts: 19,297
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5/9/2012 1:26:57 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/9/2012 1:20:37 AM, FREEDO wrote:
At 5/9/2012 12:50:30 AM, Jon1 wrote:
Basically, we will end up with Europe.

Most European countries, especially the Nordic, report high life-satisfaction and are regarded by many different systems of measurement as having higher standards of living that the US. Doesn't sound that bad.

A chimp can be trained to report high life satisfaction, that's no reason to paste on some fur.

Also, look at the other side of that eurocoin. How's the south of the continent doing?
It came to be at its height. It was commanded to command. It was a capital before its first stone was laid. It was a monument to the spirit of man.
Stephen_Hawkins
Posts: 5,316
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5/9/2012 1:45:42 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/9/2012 1:26:57 AM, Ragnar_Rahl wrote:
At 5/9/2012 1:20:37 AM, FREEDO wrote:
At 5/9/2012 12:50:30 AM, Jon1 wrote:
Basically, we will end up with Europe.

Most European countries, especially the Nordic, report high life-satisfaction and are regarded by many different systems of measurement as having higher standards of living that the US. Doesn't sound that bad.

A chimp can be trained to report high life satisfaction, that's no reason to paste on some fur.

Also, look at the other side of that eurocoin. How's the south of the continent doing?

Let's just look at happiness results and what affects them:

http://positivepsychologynews.com...

Societal Condition
1. Tolerance+.68
2. Economic affluence+.61
3. Rule of law+.58
4. Political freedom+.54
5. State welfare+.22
6. Income inequality+.18
7. % Health budget spent on mental health+.55
8. Psychologists in mental health care+.49

Tolerance, State welfare and healthcare are seen as the highest factors in happiness, as well as "[countries that] invests more in its education system"

Italy, a southern country, has the highest increase of happiness in the last 35 years btw. Economic downturn =/= happiness.
Give a man a fish, he'll eat for a day. Teach him how to be Gay, he'll positively influence the GDP.

Social Contract Theory debate: http://www.debate.org...
Ragnar_Rahl
Posts: 19,297
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5/9/2012 1:50:35 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
Let's just look at happiness results
That would require us to assume the concept to be coherent.
Interpersonal comparisons of utility are impossible. Mind-reading is too. People lie. People have incomplete information. People have different ideas of what "happiness" means-- most of them don't have an IDEA what it means at all.

And when people don't have ideas, it's easy to put ideas that aren't there in their head for the purposes of nonsensical research to make your favored polity look good.
It came to be at its height. It was commanded to command. It was a capital before its first stone was laid. It was a monument to the spirit of man.
darkkermit
Posts: 11,204
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5/9/2012 3:40:43 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/9/2012 1:20:37 AM, FREEDO wrote:
At 5/9/2012 12:50:30 AM, Jon1 wrote:
Basically, we will end up with Europe.

Most European countries, especially the Nordic, report high life-satisfaction and are regarded by many different systems of measurement as having higher standards of living that the US. Doesn't sound that bad.

Don't understand why people think America is the model for free markets while Europe is the model for socialism.
Open borders debate:
http://www.debate.org...
FREEDO
Posts: 21,057
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5/9/2012 3:41:55 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/9/2012 3:40:43 AM, darkkermit wrote:
At 5/9/2012 1:20:37 AM, FREEDO wrote:
At 5/9/2012 12:50:30 AM, Jon1 wrote:
Basically, we will end up with Europe.

Most European countries, especially the Nordic, report high life-satisfaction and are regarded by many different systems of measurement as having higher standards of living that the US. Doesn't sound that bad.

Don't understand why people think America is the model for free markets while Europe is the model for socialism.

You make a great point. I'd actually have to say that Europe tends to have freer markets.
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fnord
Jon1
Posts: 314
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5/9/2012 4:56:49 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/9/2012 1:20:37 AM, FREEDO wrote:
At 5/9/2012 12:50:30 AM, Jon1 wrote:
Basically, we will end up with Europe.

Most European countries, especially the Nordic, report high life-satisfaction and are regarded by many different systems of measurement as having higher standards of living that the US. Doesn't sound that bad.

Are you sure? I go to eastern Europe during summers and the trend there is something along the lines of "We're all f@cked" and "Get me out of here!". Indeed, outward migration is very common there.

As for the western Europe. Yeah, so far it's so-so, but for how long? France, for example, is disintegrating. They have a population decline of natives (this is true across Europe). There's a lot of inward migration, hence growth of ghettos and growth of unappreciated diversity. Do I need to remind you the controversial ban on Muslims' veils? And, all that came on-the-fly from a guy who has no interest in France or European politics and has been there only 3 to 4 times. That's not bad, I'd say. :)

The happiness rate being higher, I can believe. When the government makes it so that not having a job is sometimes more profitable for the average family, happiness level will increase. Until the economy crashes. En la conclusion (not sure if that's French or Spanish XD), the lazy men are okay for now, only for now.

Such a long response o.o, I feel like charleslb.
Jon1
Posts: 314
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5/9/2012 5:02:51 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/9/2012 4:56:49 AM, Jon1 wrote:
At 5/9/2012 1:20:37 AM, FREEDO wrote:
At 5/9/2012 12:50:30 AM, Jon1 wrote:
Basically, we will end up with Europe.

Most European countries, especially the Nordic, report high life-satisfaction and are regarded by many different systems of measurement as having higher standards of living that the US. Doesn't sound that bad.

Are you sure? I go to eastern Europe during summers and the trend there is something along the lines of "We're all f@cked" and "Get me out of here!". Indeed, outward migration is very common there.

As for the western Europe. Yeah, so far it's so-so, but for how long? France, for example, is disintegrating. They have a population decline of natives (this is true across Europe). There's a lot of inward migration, hence growth of ghettos and growth of unappreciated diversity. Do I need to remind you the controversial ban on Muslims' veils? And, all that came on-the-fly from a guy who has no interest in France or European politics and has been there only 3 to 4 times. That's not bad, I'd say. :)

The happiness rate being higher, I can believe. When the government makes it so that not having a job is sometimes more profitable for the average family, happiness level will increase. Until the economy crashes. En la conclusion (not sure if that's French or Spanish XD), the lazy men are okay for now, only for now.

Such a long response o.o, I feel like charleslb.

The blue eyed Arabs? Well, they've oil. Lots of oil.
Ameriman
Posts: 622
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5/9/2012 4:12:18 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
There are three reasons why Northern European countries have done so well, culture, culture, and culture.

Selectively picking countries with high levels of social capital and small populations does not help your point that much.
We spend too much our time measuring compassion for those in needs by measuring inputs. How much money are we spending? How many programs are we creating? But we are not focusing on outcomes. Are these programs working? Are people getting out of poverty?
-Paul Ryan
thett3
Posts: 14,375
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5/9/2012 6:07:42 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
DDO Vice President

#StandwithBossy

#UnbanTheMadman

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16kadams
Posts: 10,497
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5/9/2012 6:12:02 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
I posted this a few days ago
https://www.youtube.com...
https://rekonomics.wordpress.com...
"A trend is a trend, but the question is, will it bend? Will it alter its course through some unforeseen force and come to a premature end?" -- Alec Cairncross
Ameriman
Posts: 622
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5/13/2012 12:42:55 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/9/2012 6:12:02 PM, 16kadams wrote:
I posted this a few days ago

It is a great video.
We spend too much our time measuring compassion for those in needs by measuring inputs. How much money are we spending? How many programs are we creating? But we are not focusing on outcomes. Are these programs working? Are people getting out of poverty?
-Paul Ryan
LibertyCampbell
Posts: 288
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5/13/2012 1:17:59 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/9/2012 1:45:42 AM, Stephen_Hawkins wrote:
At 5/9/2012 1:26:57 AM, Ragnar_Rahl wrote:
At 5/9/2012 1:20:37 AM, FREEDO wrote:
At 5/9/2012 12:50:30 AM, Jon1 wrote:
Basically, we will end up with Europe.

Most European countries, especially the Nordic, report high life-satisfaction and are regarded by many different systems of measurement as having higher standards of living that the US. Doesn't sound that bad.

A chimp can be trained to report high life satisfaction, that's no reason to paste on some fur.

Also, look at the other side of that eurocoin. How's the south of the continent doing?

Let's just look at happiness results and what affects them:

http://positivepsychologynews.com...

Societal Condition
1. Tolerance+.68
2. Economic affluence+.61
3. Rule of law+.58
4. Political freedom+.54
5. State welfare+.22
6. Income inequality+.18
7. % Health budget spent on mental health+.55
8. Psychologists in mental health care+.49

Tolerance, State welfare and healthcare are seen as the highest factors in happiness, as well as "[countries that] invests more in its education system"

Italy, a southern country, has the highest increase of happiness in the last 35 years btw. Economic downturn =/= happiness.

1. I'm sure the residents of Oceana would also say their lives have improved since the revolution.
2. Countries that have a more homogeneous population, such as the Euro ones, will obviously have people who are more contented with themselves, as there is an outstanding lack of diversity.
3. No wars to worry about. Big bad America will protect them.
"[Society] has no vested interest in continuing to exist." -RP
lannan13
Posts: 23,103
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5/14/2012 7:35:26 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
I can easily take out the U.S. How Step 1: assassinate Obama and Vice.
Step 2: Bomb pentigon
Step 3: Create EMP and fry power grid
Step 4: Invade Ft. Knox
Step 5: sell gold and brid nation to invade U.S.
Step 6:
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If the sky's the limit then why do we have footprints on the Moon? I'm shooting my aspirations for the stars.

"If you are going through hell, keep going." "Sir Winston Churchill

"No one can make you feel inferior without your consent." "Eleanor Roosevelt

Topics I want to debate. (http://tinyurl.com...)
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royalpaladin
Posts: 22,357
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5/14/2012 9:20:17 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
The only reason that you would think that ethnically homogenous nations are happier is that you were taught to hate others of different ethnic backgrounds.

Your ideas would mandate that the European Americans return to Europe . . .
Stephen_Hawkins
Posts: 5,316
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5/14/2012 9:36:01 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/13/2012 1:17:59 AM, LibertyCampbell wrote:
At 5/9/2012 1:45:42 AM, Stephen_Hawkins wrote:
At 5/9/2012 1:26:57 AM, Ragnar_Rahl wrote:
At 5/9/2012 1:20:37 AM, FREEDO wrote:
At 5/9/2012 12:50:30 AM, Jon1 wrote:
Basically, we will end up with Europe.

Most European countries, especially the Nordic, report high life-satisfaction and are regarded by many different systems of measurement as having higher standards of living that the US. Doesn't sound that bad.

A chimp can be trained to report high life satisfaction, that's no reason to paste on some fur.

Also, look at the other side of that eurocoin. How's the south of the continent doing?

Let's just look at happiness results and what affects them:

http://positivepsychologynews.com...

Societal Condition
1. Tolerance+.68
2. Economic affluence+.61
3. Rule of law+.58
4. Political freedom+.54
5. State welfare+.22
6. Income inequality+.18
7. % Health budget spent on mental health+.55
8. Psychologists in mental health care+.49

Tolerance, State welfare and healthcare are seen as the highest factors in happiness, as well as "[countries that] invests more in its education system"

Italy, a southern country, has the highest increase of happiness in the last 35 years btw. Economic downturn =/= happiness.

1. I'm sure the residents of Oceana would also say their lives have improved since the revolution.

2. Countries that have a more homogeneous population, such as the Euro ones, will obviously have people who are more contented with themselves, as there is an outstanding lack of diversity.

US ethnic majority: white American, 80%
UK Ethnic majority: White English, 83%
Belgian ethnic majority: Fleming, 58%
Netherlands: 80%
France: Unknown (predicted 75-80%)
Italy: Unknown (predicted 65-75%)
Spain: Unknown
Portugal: Unknown
Russia: 80%
Germany: 90%
Luxembourg: 63%

That's a load from http://www.nationmaster.com....

But I've ignored religious diversity! Let's do that instead:

US : 79%
UK : 72%
France: 58%
Spain: 59%
Germany: 60% (and going down very quickly)
I can go on. The only exception is Italy, with 90% Christian, 83% catholic, for obvious reasons.
Give a man a fish, he'll eat for a day. Teach him how to be Gay, he'll positively influence the GDP.

Social Contract Theory debate: http://www.debate.org...
unitedandy
Posts: 1,173
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5/14/2012 10:56:29 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/8/2012 8:51:39 PM, Ameriman wrote:
This video says it all.



It sounds like a fairly standard right-wing attack on environmental policy. Global warming doesn't exist, bla, bla bla.

The thing that annoys me about stuff like this it simply isn't a political issue. What to do in the face of GW is a political debate, but the fact of the matter is for scientists, and as far as I know, the consensus among scientists is overwhelming in favour of GW. The only issue is the extent of human impact, and whether it is worthwhile to try and reduce emissions. To characterise GW is a manufactured concern seems to me not only demonstrably wrong, but totally irresponsible.

BTW, if I wanted America to fail, I'd let it continue to spend its way into oblivion on policing the world. I'd also champion some of the idiots in Washington - people like Palin, Biden, Huckabee, Santorum and others. They're the kind of folk you wouldn't trust to run a bath, never mind a country.
unitedandy
Posts: 1,173
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5/14/2012 10:58:41 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/14/2012 10:56:29 AM, unitedandy wrote:
At 5/8/2012 8:51:39 PM, Ameriman wrote:
This video says it all.



It sounds like a fairly standard right-wing attack on environmental policy. Global warming doesn't exist, bla, bla bla.

The thing that annoys me about stuff like this it simply isn't a political issue. What to do in the face of GW is a political debate, but the fact of the matter is for scientists, and as far as I know, the consensus among scientists is overwhelming in favour of GW. The only issue is the extent of human impact, and whether it is worthwhile to try and reduce emissions. To characterise GW is a manufactured concern seems to me not only demonstrably wrong, but totally irresponsible.

BTW, if I wanted America to fail, I'd let it continue to spend its way into oblivion on policing the world. I'd also champion some of the idiots in or aspiring to Washington - people like Palin, Biden, Huckabee, Santorum and others. They're the kind of folk you wouldn't trust to run a bath, never mind a country.

Fixd
Ragnar_Rahl
Posts: 19,297
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5/14/2012 2:02:56 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
US ethnic majority: white American, 80%
UK Ethnic majority: White English, 83%
Belgian ethnic majority: Fleming, 58%
Netherlands: 80%
France: Unknown (predicted 75-80%)
Italy: Unknown (predicted 65-75%)
Spain: Unknown
Portugal: Unknown
Russia: 80%
Germany: 90%
Luxembourg: 63%
Hierarchy problem. You're comparing a broad category (White) to narrow ethnicities like "English" or "Fleming." (American isn't an ethnicity, nor is "White American." German-Americans are a distinct ethnic group from Irish-Americans. Cherokee are a distinct ethnic group from Inuit.
It came to be at its height. It was commanded to command. It was a capital before its first stone was laid. It was a monument to the spirit of man.
Ragnar_Rahl
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5/14/2012 2:04:01 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Same with religion. American protestants are split among many more denominations than, say, German protestants.
It came to be at its height. It was commanded to command. It was a capital before its first stone was laid. It was a monument to the spirit of man.