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THE EARTH IS GETTING CLEANER! Look!

Lasagna
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5/24/2012 6:45:02 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
http://www.wimp.com...

Some people on this site are nothing short of f*cking retarded. They will say anything to make their political views seem consistent, including that the Earth is "cleaner than ever." But if they don't get it by now I guess I'm just wasting my time anyway :P
Rob
OberHerr
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5/24/2012 6:46:29 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Actually, I would say we are significantly cleaner than several years ago.

I mean, I could bring up a picture of say Ireland, and use the same reasoning you are.
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ConservativePolitico
Posts: 8,210
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5/24/2012 6:47:07 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Who cares?

Not me.

What you don't understand is that matter can't be created or destroyed so you know the Earth will never fill up with garbage because we're just taking the matter, changing it, using it and then moving it somewhere else.

It's not pretty no but it's not going to consume us.
FREEDO
Posts: 21,057
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5/24/2012 6:49:38 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
I'm someone who you could say is devoid of bias.

And I have to say, any statement such as "the Earth is getting cleaner" makes me WTF.
GRAND POOBAH OF DDO

fnord
FREEDO
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5/24/2012 6:51:42 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/24/2012 6:47:07 PM, ConservativePolitico wrote:
Who cares?

Not me.

What you don't understand is that matter can't be created or destroyed so you know the Earth will never fill up with garbage because we're just taking the matter, changing it, using it and then moving it somewhere else.

It's not pretty no but it's not going to consume us.

Hurr durr, I turned all the sturff into purson, man. But it's all the same aterms, man. No big dearl!
GRAND POOBAH OF DDO

fnord
Lasagna
Posts: 2,440
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5/24/2012 7:22:48 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/24/2012 6:46:29 PM, OberHerr wrote:
Actually, I would say we are significantly cleaner than several years ago.

I mean, I could bring up a picture of say Ireland, and use the same reasoning you are.

LOL that's not the same reasoning. Since the creation of Earth, there have always been pristine areas - they are now decreasing. There haven't always been huge islands of toxic waste. Still trying to defend your political beliefs by spouting BS?
Rob
Lasagna
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5/24/2012 7:29:27 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/24/2012 6:47:07 PM, ConservativePolitico wrote:
Who cares?

Not me.

Your name says "conservative." Conservatives are known for not caring about ethics and the environment.

What you don't understand is that matter can't be created or destroyed so you know the Earth will never fill up with garbage because we're just taking the matter, changing it, using it and then moving it somewhere else.

It's not pretty no but it's not going to consume us.

This is a pathetic argument. By your logic we can pretty much do whatever we want and can never do anything wrong.
Rob
Lasagna
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5/24/2012 7:32:26 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
The really pathetic thing is that people like this have pretty much dominated the discussion on DDO for the last year or two. It's like forced retardation or something.
Rob
DanT
Posts: 5,693
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5/24/2012 8:08:10 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/24/2012 6:49:54 PM, ConservativePolitico wrote:
http://fc01.deviantart.net...

Look how clean it is!

This.

Pointing out one location, and claiming that the single location mentioned represents the earth as a whole, is fallcious. It's called card stacking, and it's nothing more than propaganda.
"Chemical weapons are no different than any other types of weapons."~Lordknukle
DanT
Posts: 5,693
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5/24/2012 8:09:54 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/24/2012 6:49:38 PM, FREEDO wrote:
I'm someone who you could say is devoid of bias.

And I have to say, any statement such as "the Earth is getting cleaner" makes me WTF.

I could say that, but it would be a lie.
"Chemical weapons are no different than any other types of weapons."~Lordknukle
Lasagna
Posts: 2,440
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5/24/2012 8:23:35 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/24/2012 8:08:10 PM, DanT wrote:
At 5/24/2012 6:49:54 PM, ConservativePolitico wrote:
http://fc01.deviantart.net...

Look how clean it is!

This.

Pointing out one location, and claiming that the single location mentioned represents the earth as a whole, is fallcious. It's called card stacking, and it's nothing more than propaganda.

Let's play "choose your logical fallacy." I love how DDOers use logic as a means to its own end... I put a video of a huge toxic wasteland on here and point out that it's pretty stupid to say the Earth is cleaner than it ever was, since *logically* the Earth started out perfectly clean until we started creating toxic waste (and other pollutants). Then somehow I'm engaging in logical fallacy because my viewpoint contradicts conservative/libertarian doctrine.

Obviously I'm not making the claim that this toxic dump represents the entire Earth. Go ahead and throw the rest of your wiki list of logical fallacies at me until you give up and tell me that I'm just unreasonable.
Rob
Lasagna
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5/24/2012 8:25:49 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
I usually don't participate in DDO political discussions...

But when I do, I wipe the floor with a bunch of young, overconfident libertarians.
Rob
OberHerr
Posts: 13,062
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5/24/2012 8:28:46 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/24/2012 8:25:49 PM, Lasagna wrote:
I usually don't participate in DDO political discussions...

But when I do, I wipe the floor with a bunch of young, overconfident libertarians.

No, we all just see your arguments for the fallacies they are, and ignore you.
-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-OBERHERR'S SIGNATURE-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-

Official Enforcer for the DDO Elite(if they existed).

"Cases are anti-town." - FourTrouble

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darkkermit
Posts: 11,204
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5/24/2012 8:29:13 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/24/2012 8:23:35 PM, Lasagna wrote:
At 5/24/2012 8:08:10 PM, DanT wrote:
At 5/24/2012 6:49:54 PM, ConservativePolitico wrote:
http://fc01.deviantart.net...

Look how clean it is!

This.

Pointing out one location, and claiming that the single location mentioned represents the earth as a whole, is fallcious. It's called card stacking, and it's nothing more than propaganda.

Let's play "choose your logical fallacy." I love how DDOers use logic as a means to its own end... I put a video of a huge toxic wasteland on here and point out that it's pretty stupid to say the Earth is cleaner than it ever was, since *logically* the Earth started out perfectly clean until we started creating toxic waste (and other pollutants). Then somehow I'm engaging in logical fallacy because my viewpoint contradicts conservative/libertarian doctrine.

Obviously I'm not making the claim that this toxic dump represents the entire Earth. Go ahead and throw the rest of your wiki list of logical fallacies at me until you give up and tell me that I'm just unreasonable.

Well what is defined as "cleaned" is relative? How are you defining clean? If we're referring to how much toxic gases are in the air, then the air is much cleaner then it was 50 years ago. It isn't cleaner then it was pre-industrial revolution, but I would rather live in modern society in which we have access to modern healthcare rather then live in prehistoric times where children died young.

http://maggiesfarm.anotherdotcom.com...
Open borders debate:
http://www.debate.org...
Lasagna
Posts: 2,440
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5/24/2012 8:33:51 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/24/2012 8:28:46 PM, OberHerr wrote:
At 5/24/2012 8:25:49 PM, Lasagna wrote:
I usually don't participate in DDO political discussions...

But when I do, I wipe the floor with a bunch of young, overconfident libertarians.

No, we all just see your arguments for the fallacies they are, and ignore you.

Yes proof by ignorance.
Rob
Lasagna
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5/24/2012 8:41:50 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/24/2012 8:29:13 PM, darkkermit wrote:
At 5/24/2012 8:23:35 PM, Lasagna wrote:
At 5/24/2012 8:08:10 PM, DanT wrote:
At 5/24/2012 6:49:54 PM, ConservativePolitico wrote:
http://fc01.deviantart.net...

Look how clean it is!

This.

Pointing out one location, and claiming that the single location mentioned represents the earth as a whole, is fallcious. It's called card stacking, and it's nothing more than propaganda.

Let's play "choose your logical fallacy." I love how DDOers use logic as a means to its own end... I put a video of a huge toxic wasteland on here and point out that it's pretty stupid to say the Earth is cleaner than it ever was, since *logically* the Earth started out perfectly clean until we started creating toxic waste (and other pollutants). Then somehow I'm engaging in logical fallacy because my viewpoint contradicts conservative/libertarian doctrine.

Obviously I'm not making the claim that this toxic dump represents the entire Earth. Go ahead and throw the rest of your wiki list of logical fallacies at me until you give up and tell me that I'm just unreasonable.

Well what is defined as "cleaned" is relative? How are you defining clean? If we're referring to how much toxic gases are in the air, then the air is much cleaner then it was 50 years ago. It isn't cleaner then it was pre-industrial revolution, but I would rather live in modern society in which we have access to modern healthcare rather then live in prehistoric times where children died young.

http://maggiesfarm.anotherdotcom.com...

OK Kermy so there's no fallacy that deals with taking graphs and conveniently taking the X and Y axes and tayloring them to your argument? Why don't you not start at 1982, at the height of U.S. environmental damage? If you're going to say we're getting "cleaner" only because we're deviating towards the mean after having NO regulations to speak of, watching rivers burn on fire with so much pollution and the like, then yeah we're getting cleaner. This is akin to shooting a terminally-ill cancer patient in the chest and then saying he's getting healthier by only looking at his treatment of the gunshot wound and his recovery thereof.

Why don't you include the ideal natural level of pollution, which is far below where your graph ends arbitrarily?

We can deal with the argument of whether we are better off with modern tech later, without confusing the issue we are speaking of right now. I would disagree that we are necessarily better off, but I am more interested in getting to the bottom of why people are so atrociously ignorant of the environment on this site.
Rob
darkkermit
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5/24/2012 9:49:05 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/24/2012 8:41:50 PM, Lasagna wrote:
At 5/24/2012 8:29:13 PM, darkkermit wrote:
At 5/24/2012 8:23:35 PM, Lasagna wrote:
At 5/24/2012 8:08:10 PM, DanT wrote:
At 5/24/2012 6:49:54 PM, ConservativePolitico wrote:
http://fc01.deviantart.net...

Look how clean it is!

This.

Pointing out one location, and claiming that the single location mentioned represents the earth as a whole, is fallcious. It's called card stacking, and it's nothing more than propaganda.

Let's play "choose your logical fallacy." I love how DDOers use logic as a means to its own end... I put a video of a huge toxic wasteland on here and point out that it's pretty stupid to say the Earth is cleaner than it ever was, since *logically* the Earth started out perfectly clean until we started creating toxic waste (and other pollutants). Then somehow I'm engaging in logical fallacy because my viewpoint contradicts conservative/libertarian doctrine.

Obviously I'm not making the claim that this toxic dump represents the entire Earth. Go ahead and throw the rest of your wiki list of logical fallacies at me until you give up and tell me that I'm just unreasonable.

Well what is defined as "cleaned" is relative? How are you defining clean? If we're referring to how much toxic gases are in the air, then the air is much cleaner then it was 50 years ago. It isn't cleaner then it was pre-industrial revolution, but I would rather live in modern society in which we have access to modern healthcare rather then live in prehistoric times where children died young.

http://maggiesfarm.anotherdotcom.com...

OK Kermy so there's no fallacy that deals with taking graphs and conveniently taking the X and Y axes and tayloring them to your argument? Why don't you not start at 1982, at the height of U.S. environmental damage? If you're going to say we're getting "cleaner" only because we're deviating towards the mean after having NO regulations to speak of, watching rivers burn on fire with so much pollution and the like, then yeah we're getting cleaner. This is akin to shooting a terminally-ill cancer patient in the chest and then saying he's getting healthier by only looking at his treatment of the gunshot wound and his recovery thereof.

Well I am right though, the earth is getting cleaner, based on the timecale. If you wanted to use pre-industrial civilization as your timescale, that's fine and I will agree with you.

Why don't you include the ideal natural level of pollution, which is far below where your graph ends arbitrarily?

Whats the ideal natural level of pollution?

We can deal with the argument of whether we are better off with modern tech later, without confusing the issue we are speaking of right now. I would disagree that we are necessarily better off, but I am more interested in getting to the bottom of why people are so atrociously ignorant of the environment on this site.

My point is that there are trade-offs between air pollution and standard of living.
Open borders debate:
http://www.debate.org...
cbrhawk1
Posts: 588
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5/24/2012 10:33:25 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/24/2012 6:45:02 PM, Lasagna wrote:
http://www.wimp.com...

Some people on this site are nothing short of f*cking retarded. They will say anything to make their political views seem consistent, including that the Earth is "cleaner than ever." But if they don't get it by now I guess I'm just wasting my time anyway :P

That's not a picture of the Earth.

That is a picture of a hump of garbage.

*insert picture of clean portion of sea*
BOOM! HEADSHOT!

I think that we are cleaner than we were 70 years ago when we were releasing so many CFCs, and loads upon loads of pollution, even considering China's introduction, we're still way better than we were.
"All science is 'wrong.'" ~ drafterman
DanT
Posts: 5,693
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5/25/2012 12:14:03 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/24/2012 10:33:25 PM, cbrhawk1 wrote:
At 5/24/2012 6:45:02 PM, Lasagna wrote:
http://www.wimp.com...

Some people on this site are nothing short of f*cking retarded. They will say anything to make their political views seem consistent, including that the Earth is "cleaner than ever." But if they don't get it by now I guess I'm just wasting my time anyway :P

That's not a picture of the Earth.

That is a picture of a hump of garbage.

*insert picture of clean portion of sea*
BOOM! HEADSHOT!

I think that we are cleaner than we were 70 years ago when we were releasing so many CFCs, and loads upon loads of pollution, even considering China's introduction, we're still way better than we were.

CFCs are not the cause of the ozone hole. The fact that the ozone hole is shrinking before the CFC's lifespan expires is proof of this. The regulations on CFCs are too recent to have any effect, yet the ozone hole is shrinking; does not get any more obvious.
"Chemical weapons are no different than any other types of weapons."~Lordknukle
DanT
Posts: 5,693
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5/25/2012 12:29:52 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/24/2012 8:23:35 PM, Lasagna wrote:
At 5/24/2012 8:08:10 PM, DanT wrote:
At 5/24/2012 6:49:54 PM, ConservativePolitico wrote:
http://fc01.deviantart.net...

Look how clean it is!

This.

Pointing out one location, and claiming that the single location mentioned represents the earth as a whole, is fallcious. It's called card stacking, and it's nothing more than propaganda.

Let's play "choose your logical fallacy." I love how DDOers use logic as a means to its own end... I put a video of a huge toxic wasteland on here and point out that it's pretty stupid to say the Earth is cleaner than it ever was, since *logically* the Earth started out perfectly clean until we started creating toxic waste (and other pollutants). Then somehow I'm engaging in logical fallacy because my viewpoint contradicts conservative/libertarian doctrine.

Obviously I'm not making the claim that this toxic dump represents the entire Earth. Go ahead and throw the rest of your wiki list of logical fallacies at me until you give up and tell me that I'm just unreasonable.

"Clean" is a subjective concept, invented by the human mind. My dog eats things I would consider "unclean", because he sees no issue with it. Some cultures believe pork is "unclean", because of the lifestyle of pigs.

If you mean earth is less "polluted", you need to realize that humans are not the only things in nature that "pollutes". Many animals pollute, and volcanoes and cosmic space junk pollute the earth as well.

There are signs of ancient radioactivity in many spots on earth, which causes biohazards, possibly caused by a meteor.

Some volcanoes spew chlorine into the atmosphere, and surrounding environment.

In some places salt deposits build up to the point of being dangerous to animals.
"Chemical weapons are no different than any other types of weapons."~Lordknukle
Lickdafoot
Posts: 5,599
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5/25/2012 12:52:39 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/25/2012 12:27:22 AM, Greyparrot wrote:


i love this clip by george carlin :P

Yes, we make the world progressively dirty and we deteriorate the ecosystem with our mindless destruction. one day we could potentially run our resources dry if consumerism collapsed the ecosystem. This is a product of our physical subordinance to the environment.

But we will probably get wiped out before that because the earth has shown time and time again that it is self-sustaining, in relation to its temporary inhabitants, at least. The earth is a boss, comparatively speaking, yes?
WAKE UP AND READ THIS: http://www.debate.org...
FREEDO
Posts: 21,057
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5/25/2012 1:03:12 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/24/2012 8:09:54 PM, DanT wrote:
At 5/24/2012 6:49:38 PM, FREEDO wrote:
I'm someone who you could say is devoid of bias.

And I have to say, any statement such as "the Earth is getting cleaner" makes me WTF.

I could say that, but it would be a lie.

Yes, it absolutely would. Thanks for noticing.
GRAND POOBAH OF DDO

fnord
Lasagna
Posts: 2,440
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5/26/2012 10:46:38 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/24/2012 9:49:05 PM, darkkermit wrote:

Why don't you include the ideal natural level of pollution, which is far below where your graph ends arbitrarily?

Whats the ideal natural level of pollution?

As close to what the Earth would have naturally produced without our influence as we can get it.

We can deal with the argument of whether we are better off with modern tech later, without confusing the issue we are speaking of right now. I would disagree that we are necessarily better off, but I am more interested in getting to the bottom of why people are so atrociously ignorant of the environment on this site.

My point is that there are trade-offs between air pollution and standard of living.

Standard of living is subjective; pollution is not.
Rob
Lasagna
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5/26/2012 10:49:14 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 5/24/2012 10:33:25 PM, cbrhawk1 wrote:
At 5/24/2012 6:45:02 PM, Lasagna wrote:
http://www.wimp.com...

Some people on this site are nothing short of f*cking retarded. They will say anything to make their political views seem consistent, including that the Earth is "cleaner than ever." But if they don't get it by now I guess I'm just wasting my time anyway :P

That's not a picture of the Earth.

That is a picture of a hump of garbage.

*insert picture of clean portion of sea*
BOOM! HEADSHOT!

This argument has already been debunked. Get with it, man.

I think that we are cleaner than we were 70 years ago when we were releasing so many CFCs, and loads upon loads of pollution, even considering China's introduction, we're still way better than we were.

Our goals should not be based off the worst-case scenario.
Rob
cbrhawk1
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5/26/2012 10:50:14 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
CFCs are not the cause of the ozone hole. The fact that the ozone hole is shrinking before the CFC's lifespan expires is proof of this. The regulations on CFCs are too recent to have any effect, yet the ozone hole is shrinking; does not get any more obvious.

I guess that's what I get for just believing in scientists and not looking things up!

I'll have to look more into that one. I usually like to argue with tree humpers on plant air being a poison or that it'll boil the Earth, but I never really researched CFC effects in great detail.

Moot point though since the tree humpers won that debate before we could research the Ozone.
"All science is 'wrong.'" ~ drafterman