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Mitt Romney, Flip Flopper?

JamesMadison
Posts: 381
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7/30/2012 1:19:19 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
I hear a lot of people say that Mitt Romney is a flip flopper. But, as far as i can tell, he has only changed on one issue, abortion. And, even here, he went from a guy who was personally against abortion but thought it should be legal to a guy who thought it should be illegal... not a huge shift.

But, outside of abortion, where has Mitt flipped?
As a general rule, you'll find that, when a conservative is talking about policy, history, economics, or something serious, liberals are nowhere to be found. But, as soon as a conservative mentions Obama's birthplace or personal life, liberals are everywhere, only to dissappear again when evidence enters the discussion.
Apollo.11
Posts: 3,478
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7/30/2012 1:27:18 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
Immigration.
Healthcare.
Insurance mandates.
Gun control.
Tax cuts.
Global warming.
DADT.
Gay marriage.
Abortion.

That's just off the top of my head.
Sapere Aude!
Ore_Ele
Posts: 25,980
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7/30/2012 1:31:49 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
And it's not just on broad issues, he's flipped flopped on extremely specific issues.

Like how to measure economic success for a president/governor.

When he was governor, his state ranked 47th in economic growth over his 4 years. He defended tooth and nail that because he inherited such a bad economy (which he did), that first year should not count. He was basically saying that you have to look at the whole picture. But for Obama, he only wants to look at from day 1 until now.
"Wanting Red Rhino Pill to have gender"
YYW
Posts: 36,242
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7/30/2012 1:33:33 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 7/30/2012 1:27:18 AM, Apollo.11 wrote:
Immigration.
Healthcare.
Insurance mandates.
Gun control.
Tax cuts.
Global warming.
DADT.
Gay marriage.
Abortion.


That's just off the top of my head.

Sources?
JamesMadison
Posts: 381
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7/30/2012 2:03:46 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 7/30/2012 1:27:18 AM, Apollo.11 wrote:
Immigration.

No change here... always been strict.

Healthcare.

No change here... always been for free market hc.

Insurance mandates.

No change here... always been for at the state lvl, against at the federal.

Gun control.

No change here... always been for balancing second amendment and gun control.

Tax cuts.

No change here... always been for low taxes.

Global warming.

No change here... always thought was real, but opposed big government action.

DADT.

Don't know much about his position here.

Gay marriage.

No change here... always been against.

Abortion.

Yes.



That's just off the top of my head.
As a general rule, you'll find that, when a conservative is talking about policy, history, economics, or something serious, liberals are nowhere to be found. But, as soon as a conservative mentions Obama's birthplace or personal life, liberals are everywhere, only to dissappear again when evidence enters the discussion.
16kadams
Posts: 10,497
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7/30/2012 10:28:19 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 7/30/2012 2:03:46 AM, JamesMadison wrote:
At 7/30/2012 1:27:18 AM, Apollo.11 wrote:
Immigration.

No change here... always been strict.

Healthcare.

No change here... always been for free market hc.

Romney care



Insurance mandates.


No change here... always been for at the state lvl, against at the federal.

Romney 2008 debate "I like mandates."



Gun control.


No change here... always been for balancing second amendment and gun control.

False http://www.thedailybeast.com...



Tax cuts.


No change here... always been for low taxes.

^



Global warming.


No change here... always thought was real, but opposed big government action.

^




DADT.


Don't know much about his position here.


Gay marriage.


No change here... always been against.

^


Abortion.


Yes.




That's just off the top of my head.
https://www.youtube.com...
https://rekonomics.wordpress.com...
"A trend is a trend, but the question is, will it bend? Will it alter its course through some unforeseen force and come to a premature end?" -- Alec Cairncross
JamesMadison
Posts: 381
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7/30/2012 12:28:38 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 7/30/2012 10:28:19 AM, 16kadams wrote:
At 7/30/2012 2:03:46 AM, JamesMadison wrote:
At 7/30/2012 1:27:18 AM, Apollo.11 wrote:
Immigration.

No change here... always been strict.

Healthcare.

No change here... always been for free market hc.

Romney care

Original vision was free market. Democrats fucked up implementation.




Insurance mandates.


No change here... always been for at the state lvl, against at the federal.

Romney 2008 debate "I like mandates."

State levl.




Gun control.


No change here... always been for balancing second amendment and gun control.

False http://www.thedailybeast.com...

Maybe.




Tax cuts.


No change here... always been for low taxes.

^



Global warming.


No change here... always thought was real, but opposed big government action.

^




DADT.


Don't know much about his position here.


Gay marriage.


No change here... always been against.


^


Abortion.


Yes.




That's just off the top of my head.
As a general rule, you'll find that, when a conservative is talking about policy, history, economics, or something serious, liberals are nowhere to be found. But, as soon as a conservative mentions Obama's birthplace or personal life, liberals are everywhere, only to dissappear again when evidence enters the discussion.
inferno
Posts: 10,556
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7/30/2012 12:36:06 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 7/30/2012 1:19:19 AM, JamesMadison wrote:
I hear a lot of people say that Mitt Romney is a flip flopper. But, as far as i can tell, he has only changed on one issue, abortion. And, even here, he went from a guy who was personally against abortion but thought it should be legal to a guy who thought it should be illegal... not a huge shift.

But, outside of abortion, where has Mitt flipped?

Romney is still the same. A member of the status quo who has the ability to deceive the naive, hurt, and weak.
So he will be word offer you a better deal.
And then not deliver when his time has come to lead.
Apollo.11
Posts: 3,478
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7/30/2012 2:36:12 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 7/30/2012 1:27:18 AM, Apollo.11 wrote:
Immigration.
whether illegals should get a special pathway to citizenship. He was for it, then republicans were against it so he flipped to gain support.

Healthcare.
Mandates. His own healthcare bill.

Insurance mandates.
Obvious.

Gun control
gun bans flop. NRA support flop. Whether or not he owns again flop.

Tax cuts.
He wasn't for the Bush Tax Cuts. But nope...that's a Republican platform so he had to be for them if he wanted votes.

Global warming.
First, he said that it existed. But nope...republicans don't agree with science so he had to flop and now he's undecided.

DADT.
For repeal, but the Gays being able to serve their country is not in line with republican values so he flopped to keeping it in place.

Gay marriage.
First he was against a constitutional ban on gay marriage. But denying civil rights is republican policy so he has now signed the petition to have a ban.

Abortion.
Pro-choice to neither to pro-choice and now to pro-life.


That's just off the top of my head.
Sapere Aude!
Apollo.11
Posts: 3,478
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7/30/2012 3:08:00 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 7/30/2012 2:03:46 AM, JamesMadison wrote:
At 7/30/2012 1:27:18 AM, Apollo.11 wrote:
Immigration.

No change here... always been strict.

Healthcare.

No change here... always been for free market hc.


Insurance mandates.


No change here... always been for at the state lvl, against at the federal.


Gun control.


No change here... always been for balancing second amendment and gun control.


Tax cuts.


No change here... always been for low taxes.


Global warming.


No change here... always thought was real, but opposed big government action.



DADT.


Don't know much about his position here.


Gay marriage.


No change here... always been against.


Abortion.


Yes.




That's just off the top of my head.
Why would you respond if you haven't researched it or have any idea what you're talking about?
Sapere Aude!
Lasagna
Posts: 2,440
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7/30/2012 3:26:44 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Why is "flip-flopping" so wrong? Isn't it a good thing to be able to show that, when presented with a good argument, you have the humility to change your mind? Changing your mind is one of the most noble endeavors around... Come on! Sing it with me!
Rob
mongeese
Posts: 5,387
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7/30/2012 3:34:56 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 7/30/2012 3:26:44 PM, Lasagna wrote:
Why is "flip-flopping" so wrong? Isn't it a good thing to be able to show that, when presented with a good argument, you have the humility to change your mind? Changing your mind is one of the most noble endeavors around... Come on! Sing it with me!

The thing is, Romney clearly isn't changing his mind to be more right, but to be more Right. All of his flips were politically convenient.
NixonianVolkswagen
Posts: 481
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7/30/2012 3:38:22 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 7/30/2012 3:34:56 PM, mongeese wrote:
At 7/30/2012 3:26:44 PM, Lasagna wrote:
Why is "flip-flopping" so wrong? Isn't it a good thing to be able to show that, when presented with a good argument, you have the humility to change your mind? Changing your mind is one of the most noble endeavors around... Come on! Sing it with me!

The thing is, Romney clearly isn't changing his mind to be more right, but to be more Right. All of his flips were politically convenient.

This.

If he were moving from principled position to rethought principled position that would be fine. But like virtually all politicians, he probably began by swallowing some policies he wasn't that keen on, and has since further amended himself for personal gain.
"There is an almost universal tendency, perhaps an inborn tendency, to suspect the good faith of a man who holds opinions that differ from our own opinions."

- Karl "Spartacus" Popper
Aaronroy
Posts: 749
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7/30/2012 4:05:46 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 7/30/2012 3:38:22 PM, NixonianVolkswagen wrote:
At 7/30/2012 3:34:56 PM, mongeese wrote:
At 7/30/2012 3:26:44 PM, Lasagna wrote:
Why is "flip-flopping" so wrong? Isn't it a good thing to be able to show that, when presented with a good argument, you have the humility to change your mind? Changing your mind is one of the most noble endeavors around... Come on! Sing it with me!

The thing is, Romney clearly isn't changing his mind to be more right, but to be more Right. All of his flips were politically convenient.

This.

If he were moving from principled position to rethought principled position that would be fine. But like virtually all politicians, he probably began by swallowing some policies he wasn't that keen on, and has since further amended himself for personal gain.

Hence why I fear him; he who sacrifices his conviction for a position of power will be the ruin of a nation. He is truly just trying to appeal to the South, much like Nixon did with his 'Southern Strategy'.

I also plan to purchase a pair of these.

http://dailyelection.files.wordpress.com...
turn down for h'what
ConservativePolitico
Posts: 8,210
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7/30/2012 4:06:45 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
All politicians flip flop.

Obama flip flopped on:

debt
Afghanistan
gay marriage
spending
ear marks
Israel

just to name a few right off the top of my head
HelterSkelter
Posts: 281
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7/30/2012 4:11:07 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 7/30/2012 4:06:45 PM, ConservativePolitico wrote:
All politicians flip flop.

Obama flip flopped on:

debt
Afghanistan
gay marriage
That one doesn't really count. He pretty much always had the position he currently is advocating.
spending
ear marks
Israel

just to name a few right off the top of my head
JamesMadison
Posts: 381
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7/30/2012 4:28:02 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 7/30/2012 2:36:12 PM, Apollo.11 wrote:
At 7/30/2012 1:27:18 AM, Apollo.11 wrote:
Immigration.
whether illegals should get a special pathway to citizenship. He was for it, then republicans were against it so he flipped to gain support.

He was tough on illegals in 1994, he was tough on illegals as governor, he is tough on illegals now.


Healthcare.
Mandates. His own healthcare bill.

Yes, but this was a conservative idea at the time... and it was on a state level.


Insurance mandates.
Obvious.

Gun control
gun bans flop. NRA support flop. Whether or not he owns again flop.

Fair enough.


Tax cuts.
He wasn't for the Bush Tax Cuts. But nope...that's a Republican platform so he had to be for them if he wanted votes.

He was against Clinton tax hikes, he was for tax cuts as governor (lowering the tax rate from 5.3% to 5%... which the voters approved but legislature blocked), and he implied support for the Bush tax cuts as early as 2004...

It is true that he refused to endorse bush tax cuts in 2003... but he also refused to oppose them. Not taking a position on something is different from opposing.


Global warming.
First, he said that it existed. But nope...republicans don't agree with science so he had to flop and now he's undecided.

He still says he thinks it exists.


DADT.
For repeal, but the Gays being able to serve their country is not in line with republican values so he flopped to keeping it in place.

Fair enough.


Gay marriage.
First he was against a constitutional ban on gay marriage. But denying civil rights is republican policy so he has now signed the petition to have a ban.

ALways been against gay marriage... That is the big isssue here.. and he has been consistent.


Abortion.
Pro-choice to neither to pro-choice and now to pro-life.

Been acknowledged.



That's just off the top of my head.
As a general rule, you'll find that, when a conservative is talking about policy, history, economics, or something serious, liberals are nowhere to be found. But, as soon as a conservative mentions Obama's birthplace or personal life, liberals are everywhere, only to dissappear again when evidence enters the discussion.
Aaronroy
Posts: 749
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7/30/2012 4:31:01 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 7/30/2012 4:06:45 PM, ConservativePolitico wrote:
All politicians flip flop.

Obama flip flopped on:

debt
Afghanistan
I don't think the Obama administration ever had a hardline anti-war policy. They originally wanted the war to be over by September 2012 but moved back that date due to that it wasn't feasible.
gay marriage
lol, I think he has been saying his views on gay marriage has been slowly changing since, what, 1996? A flip-flop is a politically convenient and sudden change in politics, not a gradual change of views
spending
earmarks
Israel

just to name a few right off the top of my head
turn down for h'what
JamesMadison
Posts: 381
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7/30/2012 4:39:05 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 7/30/2012 3:34:56 PM, mongeese wrote:
At 7/30/2012 3:26:44 PM, Lasagna wrote:
Why is "flip-flopping" so wrong? Isn't it a good thing to be able to show that, when presented with a good argument, you have the humility to change your mind? Changing your mind is one of the most noble endeavors around... Come on! Sing it with me!

The thing is, Romney clearly isn't changing his mind to be more right, but to be more Right. All of his flips were politically convenient.

Really?

He supported abolishing the Department of Education in 1994. Today, he wants to keep it.

That seems like a move to the LEFT... not the right.
As a general rule, you'll find that, when a conservative is talking about policy, history, economics, or something serious, liberals are nowhere to be found. But, as soon as a conservative mentions Obama's birthplace or personal life, liberals are everywhere, only to dissappear again when evidence enters the discussion.
Apollo.11
Posts: 3,478
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7/30/2012 4:39:23 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 7/30/2012 4:06:45 PM, ConservativePolitico wrote:
All politicians flip flop.

Obama flip flopped on:

debt
Afghanistan
gay marriage
spending
ear marks
Israel

just to name a few right off the top of my head

What are the flip flops?
Sapere Aude!
HelterSkelter
Posts: 281
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7/30/2012 4:42:16 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 7/30/2012 4:39:05 PM, JamesMadison wrote:
At 7/30/2012 3:34:56 PM, mongeese wrote:
At 7/30/2012 3:26:44 PM, Lasagna wrote:
Why is "flip-flopping" so wrong? Isn't it a good thing to be able to show that, when presented with a good argument, you have the humility to change your mind? Changing your mind is one of the most noble endeavors around... Come on! Sing it with me!

The thing is, Romney clearly isn't changing his mind to be more right, but to be more Right. All of his flips were politically convenient.


Really?

He supported abolishing the Department of Education in 1994. Today, he wants to keep it.

That seems like a move to the LEFT... not the right.

Aren't conservatives the ones who want to standardize education through national exams?
Apollo.11
Posts: 3,478
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7/30/2012 5:10:20 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 7/30/2012 4:28:02 PM, JamesMadison wrote:
At 7/30/2012 2:36:12 PM, Apollo.11 wrote:
At 7/30/2012 1:27:18 AM, Apollo.11 wrote:
Immigration.
whether illegals should get a special pathway to citizenship. He was for it, then republicans were against it so he flipped to gain support.


He was tough on illegals in 1994, he was tough on illegals as governor, he is tough on illegals now.
That's unsubstantiated rhetoric and irrelevant. It was a flip-flop to conform to his party.




Healthcare.
Mandates. His own healthcare bill.



Yes, but this was a conservative idea at the time... and it was on a state level.
I don't care. He flopped to get votes.




Insurance mandates.
Obvious.
Conceded.

Gun control
gun bans flop. NRA support flop. Whether or not he owns again flop.




Fair enough.




Tax cuts.
He wasn't for the Bush Tax Cuts. But nope...that's a Republican platform so he had to be for them if he wanted votes.



He was against Clinton tax hikes, he was for tax cuts as governor (lowering the tax rate from 5.3% to 5%... which the voters approved but legislature blocked), and he implied support for the Bush tax cuts as early as 2004...

It is true that he refused to endorse bush tax cuts in 2003... but he also refused to oppose them. Not taking a position on something is different from opposing.
Yes, but it is yet another example of him conforming to his party rhetoric and changing from a previous position to do so.




Global warming.
First, he said that it existed. But nope...republicans don't agree with science so he had to flop and now he's undecided.



He still says he thinks it exists.
But he's had to back off that statement and uses the "scientists don't have a consensus" defense.



DADT.
For repeal, but the Gays being able to serve their country is not in line with republican values so he flopped to keeping it in place.





Fair enough.




Gay marriage.
First he was against a constitutional ban on gay marriage. But denying civil rights is republican policy so he has now signed the petition to have a ban.




ALways been against gay marriage... That is the big isssue here.. and he has been consistent.
So has Obama on moral grounds until recently. But we're talking about policy here. He opposed withholding gays civl rights. But he has to pander to the right to deceive people into supporting him and flopped to being against gay rights for marriage.



Abortion.
Pro-choice to neither to pro-choice and now to pro-life.



Been acknowledged.





That's just off the top of my head.
Sapere Aude!
JamesMadison
Posts: 381
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7/30/2012 5:10:22 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 7/30/2012 4:42:16 PM, HelterSkelter wrote:
At 7/30/2012 4:39:05 PM, JamesMadison wrote:
At 7/30/2012 3:34:56 PM, mongeese wrote:
At 7/30/2012 3:26:44 PM, Lasagna wrote:
Why is "flip-flopping" so wrong? Isn't it a good thing to be able to show that, when presented with a good argument, you have the humility to change your mind? Changing your mind is one of the most noble endeavors around... Come on! Sing it with me!

The thing is, Romney clearly isn't changing his mind to be more right, but to be more Right. All of his flips were politically convenient.


Really?

He supported abolishing the Department of Education in 1994. Today, he wants to keep it.

That seems like a move to the LEFT... not the right.

Aren't conservatives the ones who want to standardize education through national exams?

Um, no... we're the ones who want to introduce competition into education through charter schools and private schools.

But, yes, we do see standards as better than the current system... because at least teachers will be held somewhat accountable...

But, competition is prefferable.
As a general rule, you'll find that, when a conservative is talking about policy, history, economics, or something serious, liberals are nowhere to be found. But, as soon as a conservative mentions Obama's birthplace or personal life, liberals are everywhere, only to dissappear again when evidence enters the discussion.
JamesMadison
Posts: 381
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7/30/2012 5:13:11 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 7/30/2012 5:10:20 PM, Apollo.11 wrote:
At 7/30/2012 4:28:02 PM, JamesMadison wrote:
At 7/30/2012 2:36:12 PM, Apollo.11 wrote:
At 7/30/2012 1:27:18 AM, Apollo.11 wrote:
Immigration.
whether illegals should get a special pathway to citizenship. He was for it, then republicans were against it so he flipped to gain support.


He was tough on illegals in 1994, he was tough on illegals as governor, he is tough on illegals now.
That's unsubstantiated rhetoric and irrelevant. It was a flip-flop to conform to his party.

Well, he vetoed a bill to give instate tuition breaks to illegals... was that unsubstantiated rhetoric?

I think not.





Healthcare.
Mandates. His own healthcare bill.



Yes, but this was a conservative idea at the time... and it was on a state level.
I don't care. He flopped to get votes.





Insurance mandates.
Obvious.
Conceded.

Hardly. You conceded this point.


Gun control
gun bans flop. NRA support flop. Whether or not he owns again flop.




Fair enough.




Tax cuts.
He wasn't for the Bush Tax Cuts. But nope...that's a Republican platform so he had to be for them if he wanted votes.



He was against Clinton tax hikes, he was for tax cuts as governor (lowering the tax rate from 5.3% to 5%... which the voters approved but legislature blocked), and he implied support for the Bush tax cuts as early as 2004...

It is true that he refused to endorse bush tax cuts in 2003... but he also refused to oppose them. Not taking a position on something is different from opposing.
Yes, but it is yet another example of him conforming to his party rhetoric and changing from a previous position to do so.

What?

He has always been a low tax guy. That is what matters.





Global warming.
First, he said that it existed. But nope...republicans don't agree with science so he had to flop and now he's undecided.



He still says he thinks it exists.
But he's had to back off that statement and uses the "scientists don't have a consensus" defense.

When?




DADT.
For repeal, but the Gays being able to serve their country is not in line with republican values so he flopped to keeping it in place.





Fair enough.




Gay marriage.
First he was against a constitutional ban on gay marriage. But denying civil rights is republican policy so he has now signed the petition to have a ban.




ALways been against gay marriage... That is the big isssue here.. and he has been consistent.
So has Obama on moral grounds until recently. But we're talking about policy here. He opposed withholding gays civl rights. But he has to pander to the right to deceive people into supporting him and flopped to being against gay rights for marriage.

Um, he was very anti gay marriage as gov... when he actually had power.




Abortion.
Pro-choice to neither to pro-choice and now to pro-life.



Been acknowledged.





That's just off the top of my head.
As a general rule, you'll find that, when a conservative is talking about policy, history, economics, or something serious, liberals are nowhere to be found. But, as soon as a conservative mentions Obama's birthplace or personal life, liberals are everywhere, only to dissappear again when evidence enters the discussion.
16kadams
Posts: 10,497
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7/30/2012 6:33:08 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 7/30/2012 12:28:38 PM, JamesMadison wrote:
At 7/30/2012 10:28:19 AM, 16kadams wrote:
At 7/30/2012 2:03:46 AM, JamesMadison wrote:
At 7/30/2012 1:27:18 AM, Apollo.11 wrote:
Immigration.

No change here... always been strict.

Healthcare.

No change here... always been for free market hc.

Romney care


Original vision was free market. Democrats fucked up implementation.

http://en.wikipedia.org...
http://www.cato.org...







Insurance mandates.


No change here... always been for at the state lvl, against at the federal.

Romney 2008 debate "I like mandates."




State levl.

False.

Moderator said you back out on a national basis

Romney respond, no no I like mandates.

By his syntax he means he supports national mandates







Gun control.


No change here... always been for balancing second amendment and gun control.

False http://www.thedailybeast.com...



Maybe.

Haha







Tax cuts.


No change here... always been for low taxes.

^



Global warming.


No change here... always thought was real, but opposed big government action.

^




DADT.


Don't know much about his position here.


Gay marriage.


No change here... always been against.


^


Abortion.


Yes.




That's just off the top of my head.
https://www.youtube.com...
https://rekonomics.wordpress.com...
"A trend is a trend, but the question is, will it bend? Will it alter its course through some unforeseen force and come to a premature end?" -- Alec Cairncross
16kadams
Posts: 10,497
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7/30/2012 6:41:05 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 7/30/2012 4:24:22 PM, mongeese wrote:
At 7/30/2012 4:06:45 PM, ConservativePolitico wrote:
All politicians flip flop.

Ron Paul?

http://newhampshireprimary.blogspot.com...
Capital punishment
DADT

Gary Johnson?

http://www.ronpaulforums.com...
https://www.youtube.com...
https://rekonomics.wordpress.com...
"A trend is a trend, but the question is, will it bend? Will it alter its course through some unforeseen force and come to a premature end?" -- Alec Cairncross
mongeese
Posts: 5,387
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7/30/2012 9:22:48 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 7/30/2012 6:41:05 PM, 16kadams wrote:
At 7/30/2012 4:24:22 PM, mongeese wrote:
At 7/30/2012 4:06:45 PM, ConservativePolitico wrote:
All politicians flip flop.

Ron Paul?

http://newhampshireprimary.blogspot.com...

There is a very large difference between saying that humans play "a role" in global warming and saying that humans are bringing about the apocalypse. It's a rather common belief to say that anthropogenic global warming is occurring, but not to a degree significant to warrant high levels of government intervention.

Capital punishment

Paul changed his mind on the issue and is very open about the change in opinion. He ran in Texas, and Texans are generally in favor of the death penalty, so the change was definitely not for political purposes. All in all, though it was a change, it was not a flip-flop.

DADT

Paul's opinion began to change when he met an individual who was unreasonably discharged from the military, so that he realized just what DADT was doing. I once saw a story of a similar vein in which a state Congressman accidentally attended a meeting of gay couples rallying for the right to marrying, and upon seeing them for what they really were, voted in favor of gay rights the next time the issue came about.

Gary Johnson?

http://www.ronpaulforums.com...

I knew you'd post that link, as it's pretty much the only relevant example in a Google search, but it's wrong. Johnson never stated that he was a complete non-interventionist along the vein of Ron Paul.