Total Posts:107|Showing Posts:1-30|Last Page
Jump to topic:

National Debt has increased more under Obama

Microsuck
Posts: 1,562
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/13/2012 4:40:42 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
National Debt has increased more under Obama than under Bush

This shouldn't come as a surprise to most people, but Obama has increased the debt more in his first 4 years as President than Bush did in his 8 years of President.

"The Debt rose $4.899 trillion during the two terms of the Bush presidency. It has now gone up $4.939 trillion since President Obama took office."

http://www.cbsnews.com...
Wall of Fail

Devil worship much? - SD
Newsflash: Atheists do not believe in the Devil! - Me
Newsflash: I doesnt matter if you think you do or not.....You do - SD

"you [imabench] are very naive and so i do not consider your opinions as having any merit. you must still be in highschool" - falconduler
16kadams
Posts: 10,497
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/13/2012 4:44:26 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
It's higher for Obama, the source you cited is march
https://www.youtube.com...
https://rekonomics.wordpress.com...
"A trend is a trend, but the question is, will it bend? Will it alter its course through some unforeseen force and come to a premature end?" -- Alec Cairncross
Apollo.11
Posts: 3,478
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/13/2012 4:46:04 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
As a percentage, Bush is still worse. And it's not like the debt is going up mostly because of Obama's policies.
Sapere Aude!
JamesMadison
Posts: 381
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/13/2012 4:46:32 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Corporations! Koch Brothers! Mitt Romney tax returns! 1% vs 99%! George Bush! Tax Cuts for the Rich! Profits!
As a general rule, you'll find that, when a conservative is talking about policy, history, economics, or something serious, liberals are nowhere to be found. But, as soon as a conservative mentions Obama's birthplace or personal life, liberals are everywhere, only to dissappear again when evidence enters the discussion.
JamesMadison
Posts: 381
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/13/2012 4:50:32 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 8/13/2012 4:46:04 PM, Apollo.11 wrote:
As a percentage, Bush is still worse. And it's not like the debt is going up mostly because of Obama's policies.

Let's not forget that the slow economic recovery is the result of Obama's policies (note that I am saying the slow recovery not the initial decline). This slow recovery has increased the debt.
As a general rule, you'll find that, when a conservative is talking about policy, history, economics, or something serious, liberals are nowhere to be found. But, as soon as a conservative mentions Obama's birthplace or personal life, liberals are everywhere, only to dissappear again when evidence enters the discussion.
Microsuck
Posts: 1,562
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/13/2012 4:51:02 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 8/13/2012 4:44:26 PM, 16kadams wrote:
It's higher for Obama, the source you cited is march

YeH. Either way you look at it, it shows Obama failed
Wall of Fail

Devil worship much? - SD
Newsflash: Atheists do not believe in the Devil! - Me
Newsflash: I doesnt matter if you think you do or not.....You do - SD

"you [imabench] are very naive and so i do not consider your opinions as having any merit. you must still be in highschool" - falconduler
inferno
Posts: 10,660
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/13/2012 4:52:49 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 8/13/2012 4:51:02 PM, Microsuck wrote:
At 8/13/2012 4:44:26 PM, 16kadams wrote:
It's higher for Obama, the source you cited is march

YeH. Either way you look at it, it shows Obama failed

So whats the point of this all right here. More nonsense and unrealistic views about an issue you have no knowledge about. Its The Federal Reserve who controls
this, not Obama. Wow, you are clueless.
JamesMadison
Posts: 381
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/13/2012 4:53:59 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 8/13/2012 4:52:49 PM, inferno wrote:
At 8/13/2012 4:51:02 PM, Microsuck wrote:
At 8/13/2012 4:44:26 PM, 16kadams wrote:
It's higher for Obama, the source you cited is march

YeH. Either way you look at it, it shows Obama failed

So whats the point of this all right here. More nonsense and unrealistic views about an issue you have no knowledge about. Its The Federal Reserve who controls
this, not Obama. Wow, you are clueless.

You think the fed controls the deficits?

I'm not sure it is Microsuck who has no knowledge about this.
As a general rule, you'll find that, when a conservative is talking about policy, history, economics, or something serious, liberals are nowhere to be found. But, as soon as a conservative mentions Obama's birthplace or personal life, liberals are everywhere, only to dissappear again when evidence enters the discussion.
Microsuck
Posts: 1,562
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/13/2012 4:55:14 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 8/13/2012 4:53:59 PM, JamesMadison wrote:
At 8/13/2012 4:52:49 PM, inferno wrote:
At 8/13/2012 4:51:02 PM, Microsuck wrote:
At 8/13/2012 4:44:26 PM, 16kadams wrote:
It's higher for Obama, the source you cited is march

YeH. Either way you look at it, it shows Obama failed

So whats the point of this all right here. More nonsense and unrealistic views about an issue you have no knowledge about. Its The Federal Reserve who controls
this, not Obama. Wow, you are clueless.


You think the fed controls the deficits?

I'm not sure it is Microsuck who has no knowledge about this.
Wall of Fail

Devil worship much? - SD
Newsflash: Atheists do not believe in the Devil! - Me
Newsflash: I doesnt matter if you think you do or not.....You do - SD

"you [imabench] are very naive and so i do not consider your opinions as having any merit. you must still be in highschool" - falconduler
Apollo.11
Posts: 3,478
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/13/2012 4:55:26 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 8/13/2012 4:50:32 PM, JamesMadison wrote:
At 8/13/2012 4:46:04 PM, Apollo.11 wrote:
As a percentage, Bush is still worse. And it's not like the debt is going up mostly because of Obama's policies.


Let's not forget that the slow economic recovery
I agree
is the result of Obama's policies
Only to the extent of increased regulatory burden. His policies have granted businesses unprecedented tax cuts. So I disagree.
(note that I am saying the slow recovery not the initial decline). This slow recovery has increased the debt.
That logic is weak at best. Yes, economic recession yields lower tax revenues, but corporate profits are at an all-time high and taxes are at a three decade low. I don't need to point out the disconnect. Obama wants to change that. He wants to increase revenue in addition to spending cuts.

Why Medicare and SS aren't more on the chopping block, I don't know. But his approach is far better than Romney/Ryan's.
Sapere Aude!
JamesMadison
Posts: 381
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/13/2012 5:00:09 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 8/13/2012 4:55:26 PM, Apollo.11 wrote:
At 8/13/2012 4:50:32 PM, JamesMadison wrote:
At 8/13/2012 4:46:04 PM, Apollo.11 wrote:
As a percentage, Bush is still worse. And it's not like the debt is going up mostly because of Obama's policies.


Let's not forget that the slow economic recovery
I agree
is the result of Obama's policies
Only to the extent of increased regulatory burden. His policies have granted businesses unprecedented tax cuts. So I disagree.

We disagree on whether or not they are tax cuts.

However, we should agree that the tax policies of Obama (higher MTRs and more uncertainty) are bad for growth.

(note that I am saying the slow recovery not the initial decline). This slow recovery has increased the debt.
That logic is weak at best. Yes, economic recession yields lower tax revenues, but corporate profits are at an all-time high and taxes are at a three decade low. I don't need to point out the disconnect. Obama wants to change that. He wants to increase revenue in addition to spending cuts.

Obama does not want to cut spending, unless you are talking about defense. Outside of that, he is proposing increases. In fact, under Obama's budgets, the Federal gov. would take up a permanently larger share of GDP.


Why Medicare and SS aren't more on the chopping block, I don't know. But his approach is far better than Romney/Ryan's.

You said, correctly, that the increased regulatory burden was bad for the economy. The Romney/Ryan approach is to cut and simplify regulations, reduce marginal tax rates and simplify the code, and cut domestic spending while reforming entitlements to make them sustainable.

That approach seems much better than the don't cut spenidng (outside of defense), tax the rich more populism of Barack Obama... good politically but bad economically.
As a general rule, you'll find that, when a conservative is talking about policy, history, economics, or something serious, liberals are nowhere to be found. But, as soon as a conservative mentions Obama's birthplace or personal life, liberals are everywhere, only to dissappear again when evidence enters the discussion.
JamesMadison
Posts: 381
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/13/2012 5:14:25 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 8/13/2012 5:05:00 PM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
Unless the President has some kind of devil magic that permits him to exercise control over economic policy.

In his first two years, he kinda did... it's called Democratic majorities in both the Senate and House.
As a general rule, you'll find that, when a conservative is talking about policy, history, economics, or something serious, liberals are nowhere to be found. But, as soon as a conservative mentions Obama's birthplace or personal life, liberals are everywhere, only to dissappear again when evidence enters the discussion.
inferno
Posts: 10,660
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/13/2012 5:17:34 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 8/13/2012 4:53:59 PM, JamesMadison wrote:
At 8/13/2012 4:52:49 PM, inferno wrote:
At 8/13/2012 4:51:02 PM, Microsuck wrote:
At 8/13/2012 4:44:26 PM, 16kadams wrote:
It's higher for Obama, the source you cited is march

YeH. Either way you look at it, it shows Obama failed

So whats the point of this all right here. More nonsense and unrealistic views about an issue you have no knowledge about. Its The Federal Reserve who controls
this, not Obama. Wow, you are clueless.


You think the fed controls the deficits?

I'm not sure it is Microsuck who has no knowledge about this.

Federal Reserve controls the finances of this country. This deficit was created to oust the general middle class of American and create a different class worldwide.
This is yet another agenda of the NEW WORLD ORDER.
George Bush Jr warned you about it over 20 years ago in one of his most
unforseen speeches ever. You missed that one apparently.
JamesMadison
Posts: 381
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/13/2012 5:18:54 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 8/13/2012 5:17:34 PM, inferno wrote:
At 8/13/2012 4:53:59 PM, JamesMadison wrote:
At 8/13/2012 4:52:49 PM, inferno wrote:
At 8/13/2012 4:51:02 PM, Microsuck wrote:
At 8/13/2012 4:44:26 PM, 16kadams wrote:
It's higher for Obama, the source you cited is march

YeH. Either way you look at it, it shows Obama failed

So whats the point of this all right here. More nonsense and unrealistic views about an issue you have no knowledge about. Its The Federal Reserve who controls
this, not Obama. Wow, you are clueless.


You think the fed controls the deficits?

I'm not sure it is Microsuck who has no knowledge about this.

Federal Reserve controls the finances of this country. This deficit was created to oust the general middle class of American and create a different class worldwide.
This is yet another agenda of the NEW WORLD ORDER.
George Bush Jr warned you about it over 20 years ago in one of his most
unforseen speeches ever. You missed that one apparently.

Where is this speech?
As a general rule, you'll find that, when a conservative is talking about policy, history, economics, or something serious, liberals are nowhere to be found. But, as soon as a conservative mentions Obama's birthplace or personal life, liberals are everywhere, only to dissappear again when evidence enters the discussion.
inferno
Posts: 10,660
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/13/2012 5:47:28 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 8/13/2012 5:18:54 PM, JamesMadison wrote:
At 8/13/2012 5:17:34 PM, inferno wrote:
At 8/13/2012 4:53:59 PM, JamesMadison wrote:
At 8/13/2012 4:52:49 PM, inferno wrote:
At 8/13/2012 4:51:02 PM, Microsuck wrote:
At 8/13/2012 4:44:26 PM, 16kadams wrote:
It's higher for Obama, the source you cited is march

YeH. Either way you look at it, it shows Obama failed

So whats the point of this all right here. More nonsense and unrealistic views about an issue you have no knowledge about. Its The Federal Reserve who controls
this, not Obama. Wow, you are clueless.


You think the fed controls the deficits?

I'm not sure it is Microsuck who has no knowledge about this.

Federal Reserve controls the finances of this country. This deficit was created to oust the general middle class of American and create a different class worldwide.
This is yet another agenda of the NEW WORLD ORDER.
George Bush Jr warned you about it over 20 years ago in one of his most
unforseen speeches ever. You missed that one apparently.


Where is this speech?

You never heard this speech before.
JamesMadison
Posts: 381
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/13/2012 5:58:45 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 8/13/2012 5:47:28 PM, inferno wrote:
At 8/13/2012 5:18:54 PM, JamesMadison wrote:
At 8/13/2012 5:17:34 PM, inferno wrote:
At 8/13/2012 4:53:59 PM, JamesMadison wrote:
At 8/13/2012 4:52:49 PM, inferno wrote:
At 8/13/2012 4:51:02 PM, Microsuck wrote:
At 8/13/2012 4:44:26 PM, 16kadams wrote:
It's higher for Obama, the source you cited is march

YeH. Either way you look at it, it shows Obama failed

So whats the point of this all right here. More nonsense and unrealistic views about an issue you have no knowledge about. Its The Federal Reserve who controls
this, not Obama. Wow, you are clueless.


You think the fed controls the deficits?

I'm not sure it is Microsuck who has no knowledge about this.

Federal Reserve controls the finances of this country. This deficit was created to oust the general middle class of American and create a different class worldwide.
This is yet another agenda of the NEW WORLD ORDER.
George Bush Jr warned you about it over 20 years ago in one of his most
unforseen speeches ever. You missed that one apparently.


Where is this speech?

You never heard this speech before.

Sr. or Jr.?

If it is Sr, I may know. If it is Jr, then I dont.
As a general rule, you'll find that, when a conservative is talking about policy, history, economics, or something serious, liberals are nowhere to be found. But, as soon as a conservative mentions Obama's birthplace or personal life, liberals are everywhere, only to dissappear again when evidence enters the discussion.
imabench
Posts: 21,220
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/13/2012 6:21:03 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 8/13/2012 4:45:42 PM, Wnope wrote:
: Damn good thing the economy under Obama's first term is so comparable to Bush's.
Kevin24018 : "He's just so mean it makes me want to ball up my fists and stamp on the ground"
Geogeer: "Nobody is dumb enough to become my protege."

7/14/16 = The Presidency Dies

DDO: THE MOVIE = http://www.debate.org...
http://www.debate.org...

VP of DDO from Dec 14th 2014 to Jan 1st 2015
Contra
Posts: 3,941
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/13/2012 6:45:27 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Empirical evidence is going to turn this thread upside down:

http://cloudfront.mediamatters.org...

Kaboom.
"The solution [for Republicans] is to admit that Bush was a bad president, stop this racist homophobic stuff, stop trying to give most of the tax cuts to the rich, propose a real alternative to Obamacare that actually works, and propose smart free market solutions to our economic problems." - Distraff

"Americans are better off in a dynamic, free-enterprise-based economy that fosters economic growth, opportunity and upward mobility." - Paul Ryan
Cody_Franklin
Posts: 9,483
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/13/2012 6:52:25 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
That's really stupid, because the debt obviously increases in absolute dollars. Since the debt keeps getting larger and larger every year, then it's a big duh that contributions to the total debt would be a smaller percentage every term. If I go into debt $1,000,000, that's 100%. If I pass the debt along, and the next guy does the SAME THING, he only increases it by 50%. Next guy, same thing, but 25%. So, even though Obama has spent substantially more in dollar terms, it looks like he's making a smaller contribution to the debt because you can predict that the percentage will tend to decrease over time.
Lordknukle
Posts: 12,788
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/13/2012 6:53:43 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 8/13/2012 6:45:27 PM, Contra wrote:
Empirical evidence is going to turn this thread upside down:

http://cloudfront.mediamatters.org...

Kaboom.

Lol no.

http://www.davemanuel.com...

2008 $455 Billion Deficit

2009 $1416 Billion Deficit

2010 $1294 Billion Deficit

2011 $1299 Billion Deficit

2012 $1330 Billion Deficit

Change from 2008--->2009= More than a 300% increase in the deficit.

Try again.
"Easy is the descent to Avernus, for the door to the Underworld lies upon both day and night. But to retrace your steps and return to the breezes above- that's the task, that's the toil."
imabench
Posts: 21,220
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/13/2012 7:03:49 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 8/13/2012 6:53:43 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
At 8/13/2012 6:45:27 PM, Contra wrote:
Empirical evidence is going to turn this thread upside down:

http://cloudfront.mediamatters.org...

Kaboom.

Lol no.

http://www.davemanuel.com...

2008 $455 Billion Deficit

2009 $1416 Billion Deficit

2010 $1294 Billion Deficit

2011 $1299 Billion Deficit

2012 $1330 Billion Deficit

Change from 2008--->2009= More than a 300% increase in the deficit.

Try again.

To quote someone else in this very topic (again)

"Damn good thing the economy under Obama's first term is so comparable to Bush's."
Kevin24018 : "He's just so mean it makes me want to ball up my fists and stamp on the ground"
Geogeer: "Nobody is dumb enough to become my protege."

7/14/16 = The Presidency Dies

DDO: THE MOVIE = http://www.debate.org...
http://www.debate.org...

VP of DDO from Dec 14th 2014 to Jan 1st 2015
TheHitchslap
Posts: 1,231
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/13/2012 7:05:30 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 8/13/2012 6:45:27 PM, Contra wrote:
Empirical evidence is going to turn this thread upside down:

http://cloudfront.mediamatters.org...

Kaboom.

I was just gonna post that. LOL Nice find.

Yeah .. Obama had his hands tied. the 2009 budget was submitted by Bush and enacted. Therefore the amount Obama has spent is far lower.
Thank you for voting!
Contra
Posts: 3,941
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/13/2012 7:06:44 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 8/13/2012 6:53:43 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
At 8/13/2012 6:45:27 PM, Contra wrote:
Empirical evidence is going to turn this thread upside down:

http://cloudfront.mediamatters.org...

Kaboom.

Lol no.

http://www.davemanuel.com...

2008 $455 Billion Deficit

2009 $1416 Billion Deficit

2010 $1294 Billion Deficit

2011 $1299 Billion Deficit

2012 $1330 Billion Deficit

Change from 2008--->2009= More than a 300% increase in the deficit.

Try again.

George W. Bush passed the 2009 fiscal budget at the end of Sept. 2008. You knew this. So, it is actually correct to say that under Obama deficits have decreased, as the 2009 fiscal year started several months before Obama was even in office.
"The solution [for Republicans] is to admit that Bush was a bad president, stop this racist homophobic stuff, stop trying to give most of the tax cuts to the rich, propose a real alternative to Obamacare that actually works, and propose smart free market solutions to our economic problems." - Distraff

"Americans are better off in a dynamic, free-enterprise-based economy that fosters economic growth, opportunity and upward mobility." - Paul Ryan
MrBrooks
Posts: 831
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/13/2012 7:08:27 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
"Damn good thing the economy under Obama's first term is so comparable to Bush's."

The economy is bad, therefore we should triple federal spending? What kind of logic is that, and how does it justify what Obama did? Bush inherited the country during a recession too, and he put the country through two wars; despite this he still only spent a third of what Obama spent in the 2008 quarter. You won't see me making excuses for Bush, but Obama seems to be spending far more than Bush and he doesn't seem to have a plan to cut that spending.
TheHitchslap
Posts: 1,231
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/13/2012 7:12:07 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 8/13/2012 6:53:43 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
At 8/13/2012 6:45:27 PM, Contra wrote:
Empirical evidence is going to turn this thread upside down:

http://cloudfront.mediamatters.org...

Kaboom.

Lol no.

http://www.davemanuel.com...

2008 $455 Billion Deficit

2009 $1416 Billion Deficit

2010 $1294 Billion Deficit

2011 $1299 Billion Deficit

2012 $1330 Billion Deficit

Change from 2008--->2009= More than a 300% increase in the deficit.

Try again.

08' Bush ...
09' Bush ...
10' Obama ... 3.46 trillion
11' Obama .. 3.60 trillion

try again LK

http://articles.marketwatch.com...

BOOM!
Thank you for voting!
MrBrooks
Posts: 831
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
8/13/2012 7:13:08 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
George W. Bush passed the 2009 fiscal budget at the end of Sept. 2008. You knew this. So, it is actually correct to say that under Obama deficits have decreased, as the 2009 fiscal year started several months before Obama was even in office.

http://en.wikipedia.org...

I know it is wikipedia, but wikipedia does a good job of presenting the info when it comes to things like these, and the info is sourced. George Bush requested a budget with a deficit of $4 Billion, but he did not pass the budget and the budget has the $1.4 Trillion deficit when it passed.

Obama signed the budget into law, with a Democratic majority in the House and Senate.