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Is Ron Paul really libertarian?

DanT
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9/27/2012 4:28:02 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Is Ron Paul really libertarian, or is it just an act?

Ron Paul requested 51 earmarks requests totaling $358,303,155. Included in those earmarks was things like $2.5 million for a "Revelation Missionary Baptist Community Outreach Center," and $2 million for a "Clean Energy" pilot project.

After requesting these earmarks, he voted against them so he could deny responsibility, and claim that he upheld his promise to vote against earmarks. He requested the earmarks so others could vote for them, doing his dirty work while he walks away looking like a white knight.

In reality Ron Paul is not a libertarian, he is just attacked to fringe groups.

At the age of 21 Ron Paul joined the Republican party. Ron Paul has remained a Republican ever since. The only time he ever ran as a libertarian was when he ran against Bush Sr. in the 1988 election.

In 1992 Ron Paul endorsed paleoconservative Pat Buchanan for President over Bush Sr. Pat Buchanan than endorsed Ron Paul, helping him regain a seat in the house of representatives (just barely). Pat Buchanan went on to join the reform party (established in 1995). The reform party believes in economic nationalism, and social populism, with conservative overtones.

During that 1997 congressional election, Ron Paul released a series of racist, homophobic, and antisemitic newsletters. This was the reason he barely got reelected, even after getting in bed with Buchanan.

After dropping out of the 2008 presidential election, Ron Paul endorsed Green Party candidate Cynthia McKinney. Cynthia McKinney is a socialist, who supported both Hamas and the Gaddafi regime.

Ron Paul continues to endorse Statist-Collectivists, simply because they are fringe. He promotes the expansion of government in a way that he can deny responsibility. He is racist, homophobic, and antisemitic.
On top of all of this he is corrupt. Over a decade he has doubled billed the US tax payer for 52 flights.

Is Ron Paul really libertarian, or is this just a facade?
"Chemical weapons are no different than any other types of weapons."~Lordknukle
socialpinko
Posts: 10,458
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9/27/2012 4:54:19 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/27/2012 4:28:02 PM, DanT wrote:
Is Ron Paul really libertarian, or is it just an act?

Ron Paul requested 51 earmarks requests totaling $358,303,155. Included in those earmarks was things like $2.5 million for a "Revelation Missionary Baptist Community Outreach Center," and $2 million for a "Clean Energy" pilot project.

After requesting these earmarks, he voted against them so he could deny responsibility, and claim that he upheld his promise to vote against earmarks. He requested the earmarks so others could vote for them, doing his dirty work while he walks away looking like a white knight.

Meh.

In reality Ron Paul is not a libertarian, he is just attacked to fringe groups.

At the age of 21 Ron Paul joined the Republican party. Ron Paul has remained a Republican ever since. The only time he ever ran as a libertarian was when he ran against Bush Sr. in the 1988 election.

Third partys get no attention. Running as a Republican gets him into the debates. Besides, has Paul actually supported the non-libertarian policies of the Republicans? No, it seems like every time I hear him talk he's talking about why the Republican Party needs to change, going back to the time of the Old Right. But hey if he's a member of the Party he must endorse everything it stands for right?

In 1992 Ron Paul endorsed paleoconservative Pat Buchanan for President over Bush Sr. Pat Buchanan than endorsed Ron Paul, helping him regain a seat in the house of representatives (just barely). Pat Buchanan went on to join the reform party (established in 1995). The reform party believes in economic nationalism, and social populism, with conservative overtones.

Murray Rothbard, the founder of anarcho-capitalism also endorsed Buchanan in that election. But that doesn't mean he's not an anarchist. Besides, Buchanan was a paleo-conservative and that's essentially what right libertarian is with a few exceptions. They're strongly critical of the neo's and big into anti-federalism. Again, Rothbard also identified with the group at some points even being an anarchist.

During that 1997 congressional election, Ron Paul released a series of racist, homophobic, and antisemitic newsletters. This was the reason he barely got reelected, even after getting in bed with Buchanan.

Stop being retarded. Let me guess Romney hasn't paid taxes in ten years and Obama was born in Kenya.

After dropping out of the 2008 presidential election, Ron Paul endorsed Green Party candidate Cynthia McKinney. Cynthia McKinney is a socialist, who supported both Hamas and the Gaddafi regime.

Where did you find this? He endorsed Chuck Baldwin in '08.
http://www.ronpaul.com...

Ron Paul continues to endorse Statist-Collectivists, simply because they are fringe. He promotes the expansion of government in a way that he can deny responsibility. He is racist, homophobic, and antisemitic.
On top of all of this he is corrupt. Over a decade he has doubled billed the US tax payer for 52 flights.

Is Ron Paul really libertarian, or is this just a facade?

I think it's relative. If you're talking to an average person, he's incredibly libertarian because he's more so than they are. If you're talking to me he's not as much so because I'm more libertarian then him. I think the term libertarian is simply a relative term. Words that would concretely describe him are constitutionalist or paleo-conservative or old right conservative.
: At 9/29/2014 10:55:59 AM, imabench wrote:
: : At 9/29/2014 9:43:46 AM, kbub wrote:
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: : DDO should discredit support of sexual violence at any time and in every way.
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GeoLaureate8
Posts: 12,252
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9/27/2012 5:19:53 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/27/2012 4:28:02 PM, DanT wrote:
Is Ron Paul really libertarian, or is it just an act?

Ron Paul requested 51 earmarks requests totaling $358,303,155. Included in those earmarks was things like $2.5 million for a "Revelation Missionary Baptist Community Outreach Center," and $2 million for a "Clean Energy" pilot project.

Ron Paul always said we should be spending money here at home rather than overseas.

I support earmarks, that is the sole most important role of our Federal government. To give money to the states so they can spend it on infrastructure to make their state better.

After requesting these earmarks, he voted against them so he could deny responsibility, and claim that he upheld his promise to vote against earmarks. He requested the earmarks so others could vote for them, doing his dirty work while he walks away looking like a white knight.

In reality Ron Paul is not a libertarian, he is just attacked to fringe groups.

At the age of 21 Ron Paul joined the Republican party. Ron Paul has remained a Republican ever since. The only time he ever ran as a libertarian was when he ran against Bush Sr. in the 1988 election.

In 1992 Ron Paul endorsed paleoconservative Pat Buchanan for President over Bush Sr. Pat Buchanan than endorsed Ron Paul, helping him regain a seat in the house of representatives (just barely). Pat Buchanan went on to join the reform party (established in 1995). The reform party believes in economic nationalism, and social populism, with conservative overtones.

Buchanan is Paleo-Conservative as you admitted. Paleo-Conservative closely aligns with Libertarianism.

During that 1997 congressional election, Ron Paul released a series of racist, homophobic, and antisemitic newsletters. This was the reason he barely got reelected, even after getting in bed with Buchanan.

1. Ron Paul didn't write those. One glance at the dialect, vocabulary, and speech patterns and a retard could figure out that he didn't write those.

2. Whoever did, did so to appeal to more people, to get more votes, more party support. Is it a dirty, dishonest move? Yes. Is it racist? No. Did Ron Paul write it? No.

Ron Paul continues to endorse Statist-Collectivists, simply because they are fringe.

1. No he doesn't endorse such people.

2. He's not fringe and he doesn't support people on the fringe.

He promotes the expansion of government in a way that he can deny responsibility.
He is racist, homophobic, and antisemitic.

False. You can't show me ONE single racist comment out of Ron Pauls mouth and there's 30 years worth of video footage for you to search through. You won't find him saying anything remotely racist.

On top of all of this he is corrupt. Over a decade he has doubled billed the US tax payer for 52 flights.

I'd say it's his money handlers or campaign planners responsible. I doubt any of that went into his pocket in his personal bank account. Prolly went to campaign funds.

Also, that amounts to pennies compared to Obama, Bernanke, and Geithners theft of trillions if dollars.

Is Ron Paul really libertarian, or is this just a facade?

Libertarian. Youre the one putting up a facade.

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DanT
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9/27/2012 5:26:03 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/27/2012 4:54:19 PM, socialpinko wrote:
At 9/27/2012 4:28:02 PM, DanT wrote:
Is Ron Paul really libertarian, or is it just an act?

Ron Paul requested 51 earmarks requests totaling $358,303,155. Included in those earmarks was things like $2.5 million for a "Revelation Missionary Baptist Community Outreach Center," and $2 million for a "Clean Energy" pilot project.

After requesting these earmarks, he voted against them so he could deny responsibility, and claim that he upheld his promise to vote against earmarks. He requested the earmarks so others could vote for them, doing his dirty work while he walks away looking like a white knight.

Meh.
Mehis not an arguement

In reality Ron Paul is not a libertarian, he is just attacked to fringe groups.

At the age of 21 Ron Paul joined the Republican party. Ron Paul has remained a Republican ever since. The only time he ever ran as a libertarian was when he ran against Bush Sr. in the 1988 election.

Third partys get no attention. Running as a Republican gets him into the debates. Besides, has Paul actually supported the non-libertarian policies of the Republicans? No, it seems like every time I hear him talk he's talking about why the Republican Party needs to change, going back to the time of the Old Right. But hey if he's a member of the Party he must endorse everything it stands for right?

Facade

In 1992 Ron Paul endorsed paleoconservative Pat Buchanan for President over Bush Sr. Pat Buchanan than endorsed Ron Paul, helping him regain a seat in the house of representatives (just barely). Pat Buchanan went on to join the reform party (established in 1995). The reform party believes in economic nationalism, and social populism, with conservative overtones.

Murray Rothbard, the founder of anarcho-capitalism also endorsed Buchanan in that election. But that doesn't mean he's not an anarchist. Besides, Buchanan was a paleo-conservative and that's essentially what right libertarian is with a few exceptions. They're strongly critical of the neo's and big into anti-federalism. Again, Rothbard also identified with the group at some points even being an anarchist.

No right wing libertarianism is classic liberalism, not paleoconservatism.

During that 1997 congressional election, Ron Paul released a series of racist, homophobic, and antisemitic newsletters. This was the reason he barely got reelected, even after getting in bed with Buchanan.

Stop being retarded. Let me guess Romney hasn't paid taxes in ten years and Obama was born in Kenya.
This is not an appeal to ignorance, it's an appeal to written evidence.

Some of the newsletters were written in the first person (in his voice), others had his signature. All of them bore his name, and were published by his people.

After dropping out of the 2008 presidential election, Ron Paul endorsed Green Party candidate Cynthia McKinney. Cynthia McKinney is a socialist, who supported both Hamas and the Gaddafi regime.

Where did you find this? He endorsed Chuck Baldwin in '08.
http://www.ronpaul.com...
He is also a Paleoconservative.

He initially endorsed Barr (Libertarian), Baldwin (Paleoconservative), McKinney (Socialist) and Nader (populist). Once again, he supports the fringe, just because they are fringe.


Ron Paul continues to endorse Statist-Collectivists, simply because they are fringe. He promotes the expansion of government in a way that he can deny responsibility. He is racist, homophobic, and antisemitic.
On top of all of this he is corrupt. Over a decade he has doubled billed the US tax payer for 52 flights.

Is Ron Paul really libertarian, or is this just a facade?

I think it's relative. If you're talking to an average person, he's incredibly libertarian because he's more so than they are. If you're talking to me he's not as much so because I'm more libertarian then him. I think the term libertarian is simply a relative term. Words that would concretely describe him are constitutionalist or paleo-conservative or old right conservative.

Libertarianism is not a relative term. That's like saying Bush and Obama are both libertarian because Hitler was more fascist than they were.
"Chemical weapons are no different than any other types of weapons."~Lordknukle
socialpinko
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9/27/2012 5:39:13 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/27/2012 5:26:03 PM, DanT wrote:
At 9/27/2012 4:54:19 PM, socialpinko wrote:
At 9/27/2012 4:28:02 PM, DanT wrote:
Is Ron Paul really libertarian, or is it just an act?

Ron Paul requested 51 earmarks requests totaling $358,303,155. Included in those earmarks was things like $2.5 million for a "Revelation Missionary Baptist Community Outreach Center," and $2 million for a "Clean Energy" pilot project.

After requesting these earmarks, he voted against them so he could deny responsibility, and claim that he upheld his promise to vote against earmarks. He requested the earmarks so others could vote for them, doing his dirty work while he walks away looking like a white knight.

Meh.
Mehis not an arguement

Sorry, I just didn't think that was much of an argument. Every politician spends a shlt ton more but Paul does a bit and suddenly he's some unprincipled monster? Besides, this doesn't seem to be opposed to his professed principles i.e., spending billions of dollars nation building in the Middle East while our bridges and infrastructure are crumbling over here (I think he used that example exactly).

In reality Ron Paul is not a libertarian, he is just attacked to fringe groups.

At the age of 21 Ron Paul joined the Republican party. Ron Paul has remained a Republican ever since. The only time he ever ran as a libertarian was when he ran against Bush Sr. in the 1988 election.

Third partys get no attention. Running as a Republican gets him into the debates. Besides, has Paul actually supported the non-libertarian policies of the Republicans? No, it seems like every time I hear him talk he's talking about why the Republican Party needs to change, going back to the time of the Old Right. But hey if he's a member of the Party he must endorse everything it stands for right?

Facade

Conjecture is not an argument hurr durr.

In 1992 Ron Paul endorsed paleoconservative Pat Buchanan for President over Bush Sr. Pat Buchanan than endorsed Ron Paul, helping him regain a seat in the house of representatives (just barely). Pat Buchanan went on to join the reform party (established in 1995). The reform party believes in economic nationalism, and social populism, with conservative overtones.

Murray Rothbard, the founder of anarcho-capitalism also endorsed Buchanan in that election. But that doesn't mean he's not an anarchist. Besides, Buchanan was a paleo-conservative and that's essentially what right libertarian is with a few exceptions. They're strongly critical of the neo's and big into anti-federalism. Again, Rothbard also identified with the group at some points even being an anarchist.

No right wing libertarianism is classic liberalism, not paleoconservatism.

There are striking similarities between all three.

During that 1997 congressional election, Ron Paul released a series of racist, homophobic, and antisemitic newsletters. This was the reason he barely got reelected, even after getting in bed with Buchanan.

Stop being retarded. Let me guess Romney hasn't paid taxes in ten years and Obama was born in Kenya.
This is not an appeal to ignorance, it's an appeal to written evidence.

Not really. Paul denied writing them as soon as they were brought to his attention, his history clearly supports the opposite view (i.e., opposing things like the death penalty and the drug war because they disproportionately hurt minorities), and because the linguistic structure in the letters isn't anything like Paul's.

Some of the newsletters were written in the first person (in his voice), others had his signature. All of them bore his name, and were published by his people.

None if this means he wrote them. Head of forgery anyone?

After dropping out of the 2008 presidential election, Ron Paul endorsed Green Party candidate Cynthia McKinney. Cynthia McKinney is a socialist, who supported both Hamas and the Gaddafi regime.

Where did you find this? He endorsed Chuck Baldwin in '08.
http://www.ronpaul.com...
He is also a Paleoconservative.

I know, that's probably why he endorsed him.

He initially endorsed Barr (Libertarian), Baldwin (Paleoconservative), McKinney (Socialist) and Nader (populist). Once again, he supports the fringe, just because they are fringe.

Not really. He said he wished third parties luck (presumably because the Repblocrats need to be displaced) but he only ever explicitly endorsed Baldwin. Although he spoke favorably of Barr. And on another note you're still jumping to unsupported conclusions.

P1: Paul supports third party candidates.
C: Paul supports the fringe because it's the fringe.

How the hell does that follow?


Ron Paul continues to endorse Statist-Collectivists, simply because they are fringe. He promotes the expansion of government in a way that he can deny responsibility. He is racist, homophobic, and antisemitic.
On top of all of this he is corrupt. Over a decade he has doubled billed the US tax payer for 52 flights.

Oh ma gawd that's probably why the U.S. is bankrupt! Lynch him!

Is Ron Paul really libertarian, or is this just a facade?

I think it's relative. If you're talking to an average person, he's incredibly libertarian because he's more so than they are. If you're talking to me he's not as much so because I'm more libertarian then him. I think the term libertarian is simply a relative term. Words that would concretely describe him are constitutionalist or paleo-conservative or old right conservative.

Libertarianism is not a relative term. That's like saying Bush and Obama are both libertarian because Hitler was more fascist than they were.

It's a relational term like authoritarian. Bush would be libertarian when compared to Hitler (obviously). Libertarian simply means inclined to support liberty. What kind of liberty? Well that's what differentiates people. Hitler opposed certain types of liberties that Bush and Obama don't oppose. Therefore in some sense they're libertarian in relation to Hitler. But let me guess you're going to pull out a graph and bore everyone to death.
: At 9/29/2014 10:55:59 AM, imabench wrote:
: : At 9/29/2014 9:43:46 AM, kbub wrote:
: :
: : DDO should discredit support of sexual violence at any time and in every way.
:
: I disagree.
socialpinko
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9/27/2012 5:43:04 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
"Black people look like monkeys and Asian people all look the same and Mexicans are lazy."- DanT

Oh ma gawd look DanT is such a racist! It bares his naaaaaaaame!
: At 9/29/2014 10:55:59 AM, imabench wrote:
: : At 9/29/2014 9:43:46 AM, kbub wrote:
: :
: : DDO should discredit support of sexual violence at any time and in every way.
:
: I disagree.
Koopin
Posts: 12,090
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9/27/2012 6:30:29 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/27/2012 6:30:09 PM, Koopin wrote:
I forget who it was, some professor, said no one is truly 100% Libertarian.

Paul is like, a solid 60%
kfc
FREEDO
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9/27/2012 6:33:14 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/27/2012 6:30:09 PM, Koopin wrote:
I forget who it was, some professor, said no one is truly 100% Libertarian.

The only free man is a dead man.
GRAND POOBAH OF DDO

fnord
imabench
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9/27/2012 6:39:50 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/27/2012 6:33:14 PM, FREEDO wrote:
At 9/27/2012 6:30:09 PM, Koopin wrote:
I forget who it was, some professor, said no one is truly 100% Libertarian.

The only free man is a dead man.

Unless you're Captain Jack Sparrow, then your stuck in your own hallucinations
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lewis20
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9/27/2012 6:58:23 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
He is as Libertarian as DanT is intelligent.
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DanT
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9/27/2012 7:56:53 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/27/2012 6:58:23 PM, lewis20 wrote:
He is as Libertarian as DanT is intelligent.

FU!
"Chemical weapons are no different than any other types of weapons."~Lordknukle
DanT
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9/27/2012 7:58:08 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/27/2012 6:30:09 PM, Koopin wrote:
I forget who it was, some professor, said no one is truly 100% Libertarian.

Your professor is an idiot than.
"Chemical weapons are no different than any other types of weapons."~Lordknukle
FREEDO
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9/29/2012 3:38:18 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/27/2012 6:39:50 PM, imabench wrote:
Unless you're Captain Jack Sparrow, then your stuck in your own hallucinations

You're*

At 9/27/2012 7:58:08 PM, DanT wrote:
Your professor is an idiot than.

Then*
GRAND POOBAH OF DDO

fnord
DetectableNinja
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9/29/2012 10:12:48 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
He's a paleoconservative.
Think'st thou heaven is such a glorious thing?
I tell thee, 'tis not half so fair as thou
Or any man that breathes on earth.

- Christopher Marlowe, Doctor Faustus
Contra
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9/29/2012 10:19:16 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/29/2012 10:12:48 PM, DetectableNinja wrote:
He's a paleoconservative.

Yes, he is somewhat Nativist and is not adamant about the separation of church and state.
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AlwaysMoreThanYou
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9/30/2012 6:17:20 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 9/27/2012 6:58:23 PM, lewis20 wrote:
He is as Libertarian as DanT is intelligent.

He's probably an anarchist, then.
'When the Spirit of truth comes, he will guide you into all the truth; for he will not speak on his own authority, but whatever he hears he will speak, and he will declare to you the things that are to come.' - John 16:13