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Is this really a fair accusation?

000ike
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10/26/2012 6:02:27 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
I won't argue with anyone I promise.

It seems like every time there's good economic news, the Republicans can no longer continue the narrative that the economy has stalled, so they downplay the progress. Unemployment dipped below 8% last month and GDP growth has bounced back to 2% from 1.5% last month. In fact, in Massachusetts, during Romney's term, GDP growth was at 1.5%. I don't see how he can turn around and call it pitiful now.

My question is this: Is this growth really pitiful, and what actions would have hastened it that Obama didn't do? What actions retarded it, that Obama did? What actions has Mitt Romney proposed that will actually make it faster? Is it fair to yank out the incumbent even AS the economy is growing out of the greatest recession we've had since the late 20s?

Don't care what you have to say: Oberherr, Jaxonraine, geo, and microsuck.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
JaxsonRaine
Posts: 3,606
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10/26/2012 6:09:48 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 10/26/2012 6:02:27 PM, 000ike wrote:
I won't argue with anyone I promise.

It seems like every time there's good economic news, the Republicans can no longer continue the narrative that the economy has stalled, so they downplay the progress. Unemployment dipped below 8% last month and GDP growth has bounced back to 2% from 1.5% last month. In fact, in Massachusetts, during Romney's term, GDP growth was at 1.5%. I don't see how he can turn around and call it pitiful now.

My question is this: Is this growth really pitiful, and what actions would have hastened it that Obama didn't do? What actions retarded it, that Obama did? What actions has Mitt Romney proposed that will actually make it faster? Is it fair to yank out the incumbent even AS the economy is growing out of the greatest recession we've had since the late 20s?

Don't care what you have to say: Oberherr, Jaxonraine, geo, and microsuck.

Too bad.

The problem with U3 for unemployment, is that it means something different than it did in 2007. Where U6 used to follow U3 by about 3-4%, now it follows it by 7-8%. That means millions of Americans that used to be counted in U3, no longer are. That's why it gets downplayed, because it's not as good of news as it sounds. U3 should really be around 10-11% right now.

As for policies, the first policy is Obamacare. It simply adds to the cost of doing business. Whether a business will end up paying fines, or paying for insurance/more insurance, it increases costs. It makes the job creation environment less friendly.

Romney would increase growth by

1 - Lowering corporate tax rates. Attractive is better than unattractive. Competitive is better than not.

2 - Territorial tax system. We could have $1.5 trillion more invested in our economy... every year, if we just let multinational corporations bring their profits to the US for free. Right now, we say 'Meh, you made $100 million in Canada and want to invest that in your operations here? Sure, but let us take $20 million first.'

3 - Get rid of crippling regulations. Obamacare alone adds, in effect, several dollars an hour more to the cost of employing somebody. IIRC, the figure is something like $12.50 compared to $9.00 now. Raising the cost of employing people is not a good way to increase employment.
twocupcakes: 15 = 13
JaxsonRaine
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10/26/2012 6:11:56 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Also, saying you don't care about hearing opinions from 'the other side' is a pretty good way not to learn anything.
twocupcakes: 15 = 13
000ike
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10/26/2012 6:17:02 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 10/26/2012 6:11:56 PM, JaxsonRaine wrote:
Also, saying you don't care about hearing opinions from 'the other side' is a pretty good way not to learn anything.

I listed 3 people that are partisan hacks just like me, and 1 lunatic (geo). I think my credibility as far as this thread is concerned is well intact.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
JaxsonRaine
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10/26/2012 6:19:50 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 10/26/2012 6:17:02 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 10/26/2012 6:11:56 PM, JaxsonRaine wrote:
Also, saying you don't care about hearing opinions from 'the other side' is a pretty good way not to learn anything.

I listed 3 people that are partisan hacks just like me, and 1 lunatic (geo). I think my credibility as far as this thread is concerned is well intact.

Yup... I'm a partisan hack. When I criticize Romney, it's me being a total hack. When I say Obama won a debate, it's me being a total hack.

I'm such a horrible, right-wing hack, I can't see anything over the GOP party line. Like, when I talk about how dangerous draconian budget cuts can be, that's me. When I talk about how deficit spending, used responsibly, can bolster an economy, I'm being crazy right-wing.

You just get hurt when you make baseless accusations and they get destroyed. I present evidence(video and transcript), and that makes me a partisan hack...

lol.
twocupcakes: 15 = 13
000ike
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10/26/2012 6:23:15 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 10/26/2012 6:19:50 PM, JaxsonRaine wrote:
At 10/26/2012 6:17:02 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 10/26/2012 6:11:56 PM, JaxsonRaine wrote:
Also, saying you don't care about hearing opinions from 'the other side' is a pretty good way not to learn anything.

I listed 3 people that are partisan hacks just like me, and 1 lunatic (geo). I think my credibility as far as this thread is concerned is well intact.

Yup... I'm a partisan hack. When I criticize Romney, it's me being a total hack. When I say Obama won a debate, it's me being a total hack.

Oh wow what a feat of moderation and independent thinking! ....You realize I did the same thing in the 1st debate right? Am I not a partisan hack now?

I'm such a horrible, right-wing hack, I can't see anything over the GOP party line. Like, when I talk about how dangerous draconian budget cuts can be, that's me. When I talk about how deficit spending, used responsibly, can bolster an economy, I'm being crazy right-wing.

no one called you a crazy right-winger. I called you a hack with irrational loyalties to the Republican party....which you very clearly have.

You just get hurt when you make baseless accusations and they get destroyed. I present evidence(video and transcript), and that makes me a partisan hack...

lol.

People usually laugh when they've lost the argument.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
bossyburrito
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10/26/2012 6:24:35 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
"Don't care what you have to say: Oberherr, Jaxonraine, geo, and microsuck."
Derpdeherp I don't want to be proved wrong
#UnbanTheMadman

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JaxsonRaine
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10/26/2012 6:26:06 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 10/26/2012 6:23:15 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 10/26/2012 6:19:50 PM, JaxsonRaine wrote:
At 10/26/2012 6:17:02 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 10/26/2012 6:11:56 PM, JaxsonRaine wrote:
Also, saying you don't care about hearing opinions from 'the other side' is a pretty good way not to learn anything.

I listed 3 people that are partisan hacks just like me, and 1 lunatic (geo). I think my credibility as far as this thread is concerned is well intact.

Yup... I'm a partisan hack. When I criticize Romney, it's me being a total hack. When I say Obama won a debate, it's me being a total hack.

Oh wow what a feat of moderation and independent thinking! ....You realize I did the same thing in the 1st debate right? Am I not a partisan hack now?

In the first debate, you said Romney won, and criticized multiple policies of Obama's?

I'm such a horrible, right-wing hack, I can't see anything over the GOP party line. Like, when I talk about how dangerous draconian budget cuts can be, that's me. When I talk about how deficit spending, used responsibly, can bolster an economy, I'm being crazy right-wing.

no one called you a crazy right-winger. I called you a hack with irrational loyalties to the Republican party....which you very clearly have.

Why do you think I have irrational loyalties to the R party? I will explain exactly why I am voting for who I am voting for, and what I despise about their policies. How is that irrational loyalty?

You just get hurt when you make baseless accusations and they get destroyed. I present evidence(video and transcript), and that makes me a partisan hack...

lol.

People usually laugh when they've lost the argument.

So... are you every going to make even ONE SINGLE ARGUMENT to back up your claim about Romney interrupting Obama countless times?

That's what I'm laughing at.
twocupcakes: 15 = 13
darkkermit
Posts: 11,204
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10/26/2012 6:29:06 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Jaxson's partisan but not a partisan hack. The difference is a partisan hack will consistently deny logic and ad homenium attack their opponents who go against their words.

Someone who is partisan obviously sway's one way over another, but will use facts and reasoning to back up his statements.

DanT's someone I would describe as a partisan hack on the right.
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000ike
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10/26/2012 6:30:34 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 10/26/2012 6:24:35 PM, bossyburrito wrote:
"Don't care what you have to say: Oberherr, Jaxonraine, geo, and microsuck."
Derpdeherp I don't want to be proved wrong

If I mentioned, darkkermit, detectableninja, socialpinko, innomen, ...I could go on, MAYBE your comment would make sense. Don't act like idiot bossyburrito.....
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
darkkermit
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10/26/2012 6:33:20 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 10/26/2012 6:30:34 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 10/26/2012 6:24:35 PM, bossyburrito wrote:
"Don't care what you have to say: Oberherr, Jaxonraine, geo, and microsuck."
Derpdeherp I don't want to be proved wrong

If I mentioned, darkkermit, detectableninja, socialpinko, innomen, ...I could go on, MAYBE your comment would make sense. Don't act like idiot bossyburrito.....

LOL at those three. While I do respect innomen, I do think sometimes his attacks on the left can go too far.
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Thaddeus
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10/26/2012 6:40:16 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 10/26/2012 6:02:27 PM, 000ike wrote:
I won't argue with anyone I promise.

It seems like every time there's good economic news, the Republicans can no longer continue the narrative that the economy has stalled, so they downplay the progress. Unemployment dipped below 8% last month and GDP growth has bounced back to 2% from 1.5% last month. In fact, in Massachusetts, during Romney's term, GDP growth was at 1.5%. I don't see how he can turn around and call it pitiful now.

My question is this: Is this growth really pitiful, and what actions would have hastened it that Obama didn't do? What actions retarded it, that Obama did? What actions has Mitt Romney proposed that will actually make it faster? Is it fair to yank out the incumbent even AS the economy is growing out of the greatest recession we've had since the late 20s?

Don't care what you have to say: Oberherr, Jaxonraine, geo, and microsuck.

Firstly, I actually think it is fair enough to say that you don't care about what certain people say this close to the election where people tend to be doing more thinking with their colours than their head.
Onto the questions:

Is this growth really pitiful,
Relative to what is the question to your question. It isn't really possible to say. However, it can't really be described as particularly bad growth in the current market paradigm, unless there had been a seriously major tech innovation in the last few years.
and what actions would have hastened it that Obama didn't do?
Deregulation, ending corporatism, reducing government (I'd say eliminating but I don't want to derail)
What actions retarded it, that Obama did?
Supporting corporatism mostly.
What actions has Mitt Romney proposed that will actually make it faster?
None really. He has been too vague to evaluate his suggestions. There is no reason to believe he will do anything different to Obama however.

Is it fair to yank out the incumbent even AS the economy is growing out of the greatest recession we've had since the late 20s?
Yes, as he didn't have anything to do with it. Growth mostly exists because of the strength of the free market, inspite of government (this holds true for all presidents - the economy succeeds in spite of them, not because of them. Some admittedly get less in the way of growth). No, because they would replace him with Bush 3.0
OberHerr
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10/26/2012 6:40:33 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
How brave of you, disregarding half of those that might prove you wrong.

Oh well, I don't really care, I'll just let DK, as usual, tear your arguments apart.
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OberHerr
Posts: 13,062
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10/26/2012 6:43:34 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Also, I LOVE the loaded language.

"Yank" out the incumbent.

What "retarded" it in the first place(why Bush obviosuly, he's the antichrist!).
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OberHerr
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10/26/2012 6:45:39 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Sig change.
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Official Enforcer for the DDO Elite(if they existed).

"Cases are anti-town." - FourTrouble

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000ike
Posts: 11,196
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10/26/2012 6:47:13 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 10/26/2012 6:40:33 PM, OberHerr wrote:
How brave of you, disregarding half of those that might prove you wrong.

Oh well, I don't really care, I'll just let DK, as usual, tear your arguments apart.

Oh God almighty nonexistent deity, Where do I start?

1. so geo, microsuck, you, and jaxon constitute half of the anti-Obama population of this website? k.

2. Did you actually read the OP or come barreling in here with some half-baked objections? Go and read the OP and then come back and tell me what argument I propounded that DK is to defeat.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
OberHerr
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10/26/2012 6:49:27 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 10/26/2012 6:47:13 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 10/26/2012 6:40:33 PM, OberHerr wrote:
How brave of you, disregarding half of those that might prove you wrong.

Oh well, I don't really care, I'll just let DK, as usual, tear your arguments apart.

Oh God almighty nonexistent deity, Where do I start?

1. so geo, microsuck, you, and jaxon constitute half of the anti-Obama population of this website? k.


hy"per"bo"le/hīˈpərbəlē/Noun: Exaggerated statements or claims not meant to be taken literally.

Derp. :)

2. Did you actually read the OP or come barreling in here with some half-baked objections? Go and read the OP and then come back and tell me what argument I propounded that DK is to defeat.

Oh, but I thought I'm not allowed to speak mista ike. Is dat okey now?
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Official Enforcer for the DDO Elite(if they existed).

"Cases are anti-town." - FourTrouble

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000ike
Posts: 11,196
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10/26/2012 6:50:11 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 10/26/2012 6:40:16 PM, Thaddeus wrote:
At 10/26/2012 6:02:27 PM, 000ike wrote:
I won't argue with anyone I promise.

It seems like every time there's good economic news, the Republicans can no longer continue the narrative that the economy has stalled, so they downplay the progress. Unemployment dipped below 8% last month and GDP growth has bounced back to 2% from 1.5% last month. In fact, in Massachusetts, during Romney's term, GDP growth was at 1.5%. I don't see how he can turn around and call it pitiful now.

My question is this: Is this growth really pitiful, and what actions would have hastened it that Obama didn't do? What actions retarded it, that Obama did? What actions has Mitt Romney proposed that will actually make it faster? Is it fair to yank out the incumbent even AS the economy is growing out of the greatest recession we've had since the late 20s?

Don't care what you have to say: Oberherr, Jaxonraine, geo, and microsuck.

Firstly, I actually think it is fair enough to say that you don't care about what certain people say this close to the election where people tend to be doing more thinking with their colours than their head.
Onto the questions:

Is this growth really pitiful,
Relative to what is the question to your question. It isn't really possible to say. However, it can't really be described as particularly bad growth in the current market paradigm, unless there had been a seriously major tech innovation in the last few years.
and what actions would have hastened it that Obama didn't do?
Deregulation, ending corporatism, reducing government (I'd say eliminating but I don't want to derail)
What actions retarded it, that Obama did?
Supporting corporatism mostly.
What actions has Mitt Romney proposed that will actually make it faster?
None really. He has been too vague to evaluate his suggestions. There is no reason to believe he will do anything different to Obama however.

Is it fair to yank out the incumbent even AS the economy is growing out of the greatest recession we've had since the late 20s?
Yes, as he didn't have anything to do with it. Growth mostly exists because of the strength of the free market, inspite of government (this holds true for all presidents - the economy succeeds in spite of them, not because of them. Some admittedly get less in the way of growth). No, because they would replace him with Bush 3.0

Fair answer. You live in Britain right? How you know so much about American politics? I can't name you any modern politician from Britain except Cameron, Churchill, and Thatcher....2 of which can hardly be considered contemporary.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
OberHerr
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10/26/2012 6:53:12 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 10/26/2012 6:50:11 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 10/26/2012 6:40:16 PM, Thaddeus wrote:
At 10/26/2012 6:02:27 PM, 000ike wrote:
I won't argue with anyone I promise.

It seems like every time there's good economic news, the Republicans can no longer continue the narrative that the economy has stalled, so they downplay the progress. Unemployment dipped below 8% last month and GDP growth has bounced back to 2% from 1.5% last month. In fact, in Massachusetts, during Romney's term, GDP growth was at 1.5%. I don't see how he can turn around and call it pitiful now.

My question is this: Is this growth really pitiful, and what actions would have hastened it that Obama didn't do? What actions retarded it, that Obama did? What actions has Mitt Romney proposed that will actually make it faster? Is it fair to yank out the incumbent even AS the economy is growing out of the greatest recession we've had since the late 20s?

Don't care what you have to say: Oberherr, Jaxonraine, geo, and microsuck.

Firstly, I actually think it is fair enough to say that you don't care about what certain people say this close to the election where people tend to be doing more thinking with their colours than their head.
Onto the questions:

Is this growth really pitiful,
Relative to what is the question to your question. It isn't really possible to say. However, it can't really be described as particularly bad growth in the current market paradigm, unless there had been a seriously major tech innovation in the last few years.
and what actions would have hastened it that Obama didn't do?
Deregulation, ending corporatism, reducing government (I'd say eliminating but I don't want to derail)
What actions retarded it, that Obama did?
Supporting corporatism mostly.
What actions has Mitt Romney proposed that will actually make it faster?
None really. He has been too vague to evaluate his suggestions. There is no reason to believe he will do anything different to Obama however.

Is it fair to yank out the incumbent even AS the economy is growing out of the greatest recession we've had since the late 20s?
Yes, as he didn't have anything to do with it. Growth mostly exists because of the strength of the free market, inspite of government (this holds true for all presidents - the economy succeeds in spite of them, not because of them. Some admittedly get less in the way of growth). No, because they would replace him with Bush 3.0

Fair answer. You live in Britain right? How you know so much about American politics? I can't name you any modern politician from Britain except Cameron, Churchill, and Thatcher....2 of which can hardly be considered contemporary.

So, you just ignore his arguments and ask him why he knows so much? :P

But, I can say, Americans are somewhat....more inclosed in their politics. Part of it is to do with our size, but I find a lot of forigen people know a fair bit out our politics.. Also, this forums revolves around American politics, so if you wanna talk about them, you gotta know em.
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"Cases are anti-town." - FourTrouble

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OberHerr
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10/26/2012 6:56:07 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 10/26/2012 6:50:49 PM, Thaddeus wrote:
Ike, surely by responding to them, you've defeated the point of saying you didn't care what they say...

Secretly, me and ike have a bromance going. But he doesn't know it yet, so keep it a secret.
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Official Enforcer for the DDO Elite(if they existed).

"Cases are anti-town." - FourTrouble

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Thaddeus
Posts: 6,985
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10/26/2012 6:56:25 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 10/26/2012 6:50:11 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 10/26/2012 6:40:16 PM, Thaddeus wrote:
At 10/26/2012 6:02:27 PM, 000ike wrote:
I won't argue with anyone I promise.

It seems like every time there's good economic news, the Republicans can no longer continue the narrative that the economy has stalled, so they downplay the progress. Unemployment dipped below 8% last month and GDP growth has bounced back to 2% from 1.5% last month. In fact, in Massachusetts, during Romney's term, GDP growth was at 1.5%. I don't see how he can turn around and call it pitiful now.

My question is this: Is this growth really pitiful, and what actions would have hastened it that Obama didn't do? What actions retarded it, that Obama did? What actions has Mitt Romney proposed that will actually make it faster? Is it fair to yank out the incumbent even AS the economy is growing out of the greatest recession we've had since the late 20s?

Don't care what you have to say: Oberherr, Jaxonraine, geo, and microsuck.

Firstly, I actually think it is fair enough to say that you don't care about what certain people say this close to the election where people tend to be doing more thinking with their colours than their head.
Onto the questions:

Is this growth really pitiful,
Relative to what is the question to your question. It isn't really possible to say. However, it can't really be described as particularly bad growth in the current market paradigm, unless there had been a seriously major tech innovation in the last few years.
and what actions would have hastened it that Obama didn't do?
Deregulation, ending corporatism, reducing government (I'd say eliminating but I don't want to derail)
What actions retarded it, that Obama did?
Supporting corporatism mostly.
What actions has Mitt Romney proposed that will actually make it faster?
None really. He has been too vague to evaluate his suggestions. There is no reason to believe he will do anything different to Obama however.

Is it fair to yank out the incumbent even AS the economy is growing out of the greatest recession we've had since the late 20s?
Yes, as he didn't have anything to do with it. Growth mostly exists because of the strength of the free market, inspite of government (this holds true for all presidents - the economy succeeds in spite of them, not because of them. Some admittedly get less in the way of growth). No, because they would replace him with Bush 3.0

Fair answer. You live in Britain right? How you know so much about American politics? I can't name you any modern politician from Britain except Cameron, Churchill, and Thatcher....2 of which can hardly be considered contemporary.

World politics is somewhat of hobby of a significant number of people at my university. I also help run the freedom society which is populated with a decent number of americans.
000ike
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10/26/2012 6:57:46 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 10/26/2012 6:53:12 PM, OberHerr wrote:

So, you just ignore his arguments and ask him why he knows so much? :P

But, I can say, Americans are somewhat....more inclosed in their politics. Part of it is to do with our size, but I find a lot of forigen people know a fair bit out our politics.. Also, this forums revolves around American politics, so if you wanna talk about them, you gotta know em.

Go back and re-read the OP you annoying dipsh!t, I don't intend on contravening anyone who provides an answer to the questions posed in the OP. I just want a holistic view of what unbias people think.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
OberHerr
Posts: 13,062
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10/26/2012 7:00:55 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 10/26/2012 6:57:46 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 10/26/2012 6:53:12 PM, OberHerr wrote:

So, you just ignore his arguments and ask him why he knows so much? :P

But, I can say, Americans are somewhat....more inclosed in their politics. Part of it is to do with our size, but I find a lot of forigen people know a fair bit out our politics.. Also, this forums revolves around American politics, so if you wanna talk about them, you gotta know em.

Go back and re-read the OP you annoying dipsh!t, I don't intend on contravening anyone who provides an answer to the questions posed in the OP. I just want a holistic view of what unbias people think.

Well, gosh.

But, regardless, I might give my thoughts later. I'm not too good with all these numbers and plans. Need to make sure all of what you say is true, then make sure what all I would say is true, ect. So, later.
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DetectableNinja
Posts: 6,043
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10/26/2012 8:01:57 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 10/26/2012 6:02:27 PM, 000ike wrote:
I won't argue with anyone I promise.

It seems like every time there's good economic news, the Republicans can no longer continue the narrative that the economy has stalled, so they downplay the progress. Unemployment dipped below 8% last month and GDP growth has bounced back to 2% from 1.5% last month. In fact, in Massachusetts, during Romney's term, GDP growth was at 1.5%. I don't see how he can turn around and call it pitiful now.

My question is this: Is this growth really pitiful

I would not say pitiful, but I WOULD say not at a satisfactory rate.

, and what actions would have hastened it that Obama didn't do?

A lot more budget cutting, primarily if not exclusively in the DoD.

What actions retarded it, that Obama did?

The failed government stimuli, the Affordable Healthcare Act (although not so much affecting us now as in the near future).

What actions has Mitt Romney proposed that will actually make it faster?

Budget cutting (although not in areas I'd be looking to cut first), maintenance/reduction of taxes.

Is it fair to yank out the incumbent even AS the economy is growing out of the greatest recession we've had since the late 20s?

A bit of a loaded question with loaded language, but absolutely.

Don't care what you have to say: Oberherr, Jaxonraine, geo, and microsuck.
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imabench
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10/26/2012 8:56:47 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 10/26/2012 8:01:57 PM, DetectableNinja wrote:
At 10/26/2012 6:02:27 PM, 000ike wrote:
I won't argue with anyone I promise.

It seems like every time there's good economic news, the Republicans can no longer continue the narrative that the economy has stalled, so they downplay the progress. Unemployment dipped below 8% last month and GDP growth has bounced back to 2% from 1.5% last month. In fact, in Massachusetts, during Romney's term, GDP growth was at 1.5%. I don't see how he can turn around and call it pitiful now.

My question is this: Is this growth really pitiful

I would not say pitiful, but I WOULD say not at a satisfactory rate.

Agreed depending on your definition of satisfactory

, and what actions would have hastened it that Obama didn't do?

A lot more budget cutting, primarily if not exclusively in the DoD.

I think a little more trimming to other programs would help too, I am heavily in favor of raising the age to collect social security

What actions retarded it, that Obama did?

The failed government stimuli, the Affordable Healthcare Act (although not so much affecting us now as in the near future).

I wouldnt say the stimuli failed, just that they delivered way below some people's expectations. As for Obamacare, im still on the fence on that one money wise but I do like that people cant be denied for pre-existing conditions and that kids can stay on their parents healthcare for a while longer

What actions has Mitt Romney proposed that will actually make it faster?

Budget cutting (although not in areas I'd be looking to cut first), maintenance/reduction of taxes.

He proposes a lot of stuff but I doubt hell be able to deliver 10% of what hes proposed.

Is it fair to yank out the incumbent even AS the economy is growing out of the greatest recession we've had since the late 20s?

A bit of a loaded question with loaded language, but absolutely.

Agreed

Don't care what you have to say: Oberherr, Jaxonraine, geo, and microsuck.

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DetectableNinja
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10/26/2012 9:09:37 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 10/26/2012 8:56:47 PM, imabench wrote:
At 10/26/2012 8:01:57 PM, DetectableNinja wrote:
At 10/26/2012 6:02:27 PM, 000ike wrote:
I won't argue with anyone I promise.

It seems like every time there's good economic news, the Republicans can no longer continue the narrative that the economy has stalled, so they downplay the progress. Unemployment dipped below 8% last month and GDP growth has bounced back to 2% from 1.5% last month. In fact, in Massachusetts, during Romney's term, GDP growth was at 1.5%. I don't see how he can turn around and call it pitiful now.

My question is this: Is this growth really pitiful

I would not say pitiful, but I WOULD say not at a satisfactory rate.

Agreed depending on your definition of satisfactory

, and what actions would have hastened it that Obama didn't do?

A lot more budget cutting, primarily if not exclusively in the DoD.

I think a little more trimming to other programs would help too, I am heavily in favor of raising the age to collect social security

I'm for cutting to many programs personally. I said "exclusively," from a generally more pragmatic viewpoint, that it generally wouldn't be feasible to immediately slash all forms of social welfare.

As for social security, I think it's a weak system, and should go, or at least, be HEAVILY revamped.

What actions retarded it, that Obama did?

The failed government stimuli, the Affordable Healthcare Act (although not so much affecting us now as in the near future).

I wouldnt say the stimuli failed, just that they delivered way below some people's expectations. As for Obamacare, im still on the fence on that one money wise but I do like that people cant be denied for pre-existing conditions and that kids can stay on their parents healthcare for a while longer

I think that not meeting expectations IS failure. But, nonetheless, I agree expectations were not met.

There are some nice aspects and/or intentions of ACA, but I think with that, you end up majorly disagreeing in terms of basic philosophy. Meaning any disagreements you and I may have will eventually fall to where our personal political philosophies are.

What actions has Mitt Romney proposed that will actually make it faster?

Budget cutting (although not in areas I'd be looking to cut first), maintenance/reduction of taxes.

He proposes a lot of stuff but I doubt hell be able to deliver 10% of what hes proposed.

Of course not. Few presidents can.

Is it fair to yank out the incumbent even AS the economy is growing out of the greatest recession we've had since the late 20s?

A bit of a loaded question with loaded language, but absolutely.

Agreed

Don't care what you have to say: Oberherr, Jaxonraine, geo, and microsuck.

(I didnt get mentioned :D)

Yay! Bench and I agree! I love agreeing with people!
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Or any man that breathes on earth.

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OberHerr
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10/26/2012 9:11:55 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
WhAt DN and imabench said.
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Contra
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10/26/2012 9:15:45 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 10/26/2012 8:56:47 PM, imabench wrote:
At 10/26/2012 8:01:57 PM, DetectableNinja wrote:
At 10/26/2012 6:02:27 PM, 000ike wrote:
I won't argue with anyone I promise.

It seems like every time there's good economic news, the Republicans can no

The failed government stimuli, the Affordable Healthcare Act (although not so much affecting us now as in the near future).

I wouldnt say the stimuli failed, just that they delivered way below some people's expectations. As for Obamacare, im still on the fence on that one money wise but I do like that people cant be denied for pre-existing conditions and that kids can stay on their parents healthcare for a while longer

The stimulus (as do all stimulus programs) has one main detriment: it procrastinates the economic cycle. All this "new" money will just be taxed out of the economy later. It prevents the economy from naturally correcting itself. The vast blunt of the recession's blade had ended by the time the stimulus took effect, but it inflated the economy, and when the money ran out, the economy slowed.

Long-lasting insurance plans are available in the general market. We should make medicine payed out of pocket, using health savings accounts, instead of using insurance, which is a false use of risk management.

What actions has Mitt Romney proposed that will actually make it faster?

Budget cutting (although not in areas I'd be looking to cut first), maintenance/reduction of taxes.

He proposes a lot of stuff but I doubt hell be able to deliver 10% of what hes proposed.

Probably, though when it comes to the economy his proposals are not that unrealistic if actually carried through.

Is it fair to yank out the incumbent even AS the economy is growing out of the greatest recession we've had since the late 20s?

A bit of a loaded question with loaded language, but absolutely.

Agreed

Don't care what you have to say: Oberherr, Jaxonraine, geo, and microsuck.

(I didnt get mentioned :D)

+2
"The solution [for Republicans] is to admit that Bush was a bad president, stop this racist homophobic stuff, stop trying to give most of the tax cuts to the rich, propose a real alternative to Obamacare that actually works, and propose smart free market solutions to our economic problems." - Distraff

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Microsuck
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10/26/2012 9:20:28 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 10/26/2012 6:02:27 PM, 000ike wrote:
I won't argue with anyone I promise.

It seems like every time there's good economic news, the Republicans can no longer continue the narrative that the economy has stalled, so they downplay the progress. Unemployment dipped below 8% last month and GDP growth has bounced back to 2% from 1.5% last month. In fact, in Massachusetts, during Romney's term, GDP growth was at 1.5%. I don't see how he can turn around and call it pitiful now.

Unemployment is over 14% if we count those who dropped out of the workforce (Politifact) because they were doscouraged by the economy.


My question is this: Is this growth really pitiful, and what actions would have hastened it that Obama didn't do? What actions retarded it, that Obama did? What actions has Mitt Romney proposed that will actually make it faster? Is it fair to yank out the incumbent even AS the economy is growing out of the greatest recession we've had since the late 20s?

Romney has nothing. This, I agree with.


Don't care what you have to say: Oberherr, Jaxonraine, geo, and microsuck.

Too bad.
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