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Anarchy: Who would build the roads?

darkkermit
Posts: 11,204
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11/17/2012 12:32:54 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
Aren't the roads already built. Unless the anarchy takes place in some undeveloped nation (like African countries), most developed nations already have roads. If anything, shouldn't the question be who would build the new roads, own the roads, and maintain the roads?
Open borders debate:
http://www.debate.org...
Ore_Ele
Posts: 25,980
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11/17/2012 12:40:42 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 11/17/2012 12:32:54 PM, darkkermit wrote:
Aren't the roads already built. Unless the anarchy takes place in some undeveloped nation (like African countries), most developed nations already have roads. If anything, shouldn't the question be who would build the new roads, own the roads, and maintain the roads?

Yes, the current question, when applied to our existing society is on road ownership and maintenance. Though there is new road construction all the time with new housing and business developments.
"Wanting Red Rhino Pill to have gender"
tulle
Posts: 4,445
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11/17/2012 12:41:24 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 11/17/2012 12:32:54 PM, darkkermit wrote:
Aren't the roads already built. Unless the anarchy takes place in some undeveloped nation (like African countries), most developed nations already have roads. If anything, shouldn't the question be who would build the new roads, own the roads, and maintain the roads?

Yes. What's the answer? Forgive my ignorance, in all the years I've been on DDO I've never paid any attention to the anarchy threads.
yang.
Ore_Ele
Posts: 25,980
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11/17/2012 1:05:19 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 11/17/2012 12:41:24 PM, tulle wrote:
At 11/17/2012 12:32:54 PM, darkkermit wrote:
Aren't the roads already built. Unless the anarchy takes place in some undeveloped nation (like African countries), most developed nations already have roads. If anything, shouldn't the question be who would build the new roads, own the roads, and maintain the roads?

Yes. What's the answer? Forgive my ignorance, in all the years I've been on DDO I've never paid any attention to the anarchy threads.

The answer depends on who you ask (and if we're talking about highways or substreets). I'm not going to go through all the arguing again, but the common answer is that roads would be maintained by a homeowners association (or business association). The questions have then gone to whether a "homeowners association" is technically a small state rather than anarchy.
"Wanting Red Rhino Pill to have gender"
Ore_Ele
Posts: 25,980
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11/17/2012 1:06:22 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 11/17/2012 1:05:19 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 11/17/2012 12:41:24 PM, tulle wrote:
At 11/17/2012 12:32:54 PM, darkkermit wrote:
Aren't the roads already built. Unless the anarchy takes place in some undeveloped nation (like African countries), most developed nations already have roads. If anything, shouldn't the question be who would build the new roads, own the roads, and maintain the roads?

Yes. What's the answer? Forgive my ignorance, in all the years I've been on DDO I've never paid any attention to the anarchy threads.

The answer depends on who you ask (and if we're talking about highways or substreets). I'm not going to go through all the arguing again, but the common answer is that roads would be maintained by a homeowners association (or business association). The questions have then gone to whether a "homeowners association" is technically a small state rather than anarchy.

Rather than going over all this again, here is the most recent thread.

http://www.debate.org...

And to shamelessly pimp out my debate a bit more.

http://www.debate.org...
"Wanting Red Rhino Pill to have gender"
tulle
Posts: 4,445
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11/17/2012 1:16:04 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 11/17/2012 1:06:22 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 11/17/2012 1:05:19 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 11/17/2012 12:41:24 PM, tulle wrote:
At 11/17/2012 12:32:54 PM, darkkermit wrote:
Aren't the roads already built. Unless the anarchy takes place in some undeveloped nation (like African countries), most developed nations already have roads. If anything, shouldn't the question be who would build the new roads, own the roads, and maintain the roads?

Yes. What's the answer? Forgive my ignorance, in all the years I've been on DDO I've never paid any attention to the anarchy threads.

The answer depends on who you ask (and if we're talking about highways or substreets). I'm not going to go through all the arguing again, but the common answer is that roads would be maintained by a homeowners association (or business association). The questions have then gone to whether a "homeowners association" is technically a small state rather than anarchy.

Rather than going over all this again, here is the most recent thread.

http://www.debate.org...

And to shamelessly pimp out my debate a bit more.

http://www.debate.org...

My immediate reaction to anarchy is it seems everything is left to corporations and people with money, who have no incentive or accountability for people's best interests. Consequently people who don't have money are left with even less of a voice than they have now. Thanks for the links, I'll have to add them to my favourites and check them out later.
yang.
drafterman
Posts: 18,870
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11/17/2012 1:28:37 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 11/17/2012 12:32:54 PM, darkkermit wrote:
Aren't the roads already built.

Yep. No new roads have been built since Einsenhower's interstate system.

Unless the anarchy takes place in some undeveloped nation (like African countries), most developed nations already have roads. If anything, shouldn't the question be who would build the new roads, own the roads, and maintain the roads?

Yes, which is aptly summed up in the question: "Who would build the roads?"
OMGJustinBieber
Posts: 3,484
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11/17/2012 2:18:23 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
I hate to be "that guy" but it would seem that before any of these business are established to fulfill these necessary functions there needs to be security. Security isn't one of those things that arises naturally though the free market or via consent of the consumer, rather, it's nature is much more nebulous after the fall of the state. What you have is a lot of ex-military guys wandering around; are they hired out to corporations? Do they re-group with old loyalties and maintain the establishment? Regardless, there's still likely to be a sovereign with a monopoly of power within a given territory and anarchy doesn't have any check against that whatsoever. If that's not the case, then it probably turns into a power struggle...I don't know how anarchy avoids that.
jharry
Posts: 4,984
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11/17/2012 4:04:34 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 11/17/2012 12:32:54 PM, darkkermit wrote:
Aren't the roads already built. Unless the anarchy takes place in some undeveloped nation (like African countries), most developed nations already have roads. If anything, shouldn't the question be who would build the new roads, own the roads, and maintain the roads?

Yep, I've thought about this happening in the county I live in. I can't imagine how it would actually happen all at once, security, utilities, roads and courts. But I've tried to break it down one at a time for the best odds for a successful transition.

The best estimate I could find.........

250,000.00 per rural mile. Two lanes.

350,000.00 per city mile two lanes.

500,000.00 mile Four lanes with turning lanes in City

750,000.00 per mile Four lane with center divider high way.

This is all that I have in my county, bigger cities with over passes ect would probably be higher

Let's just look at a 1 mile by one 1 mile subdivision with 5 roads going north to south and 5 roads going east to west. That is roughly 10 miles of 2 lane roads with curb and gutters. And none of this takes storm water drains, piping or containment.

I think you could pack 500 homes with tiny yards and be able to lay down in between each house. A living hell for me but acceptable to others.

Now I don't know how often these roads would need to be resurfaced but 5 years sounds fair.

300,000.00 per mile would end up being 3,000,000.00 a year split between 500 households every five years.

If it was a HA some "council" over it would need to collect 1200.00 a year to finance the roads resurfacing every five years. And that would nor cover tolls each household would probably need to spend once they leave their subdivision

I think the average property tax in the nearest city is roughly 400.00 a year. And this includes more than just roads.
In nomine Patris, et Filii, et Spiritus Sancti. Amen
BennyW
Posts: 698
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8/22/2014 12:39:41 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
I don't want o be a ressurector of threads but I figured this would be the best place to advertise my debate.
http://www.debate.org...
You didn't build that-Obama
It's pretty lazy to quote things you disagree with, call it stupid and move on, rather than arguing with the person. -000ike
Dazz
Posts: 1,163
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8/22/2014 1:13:07 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 11/17/2012 12:32:54 PM, darkkermit wrote:
Aren't the roads already built. Unless the anarchy takes place in some undeveloped nation (like African countries), most developed nations already have roads. If anything, shouldn't the question be who would build the new roads, own the roads, and maintain the roads?

It's not only about roads, it's much more than that. There are many decisions that must be taken by some deliberated personnel to sustain the prolific management. You can't work and choose as a mob, no matter how gregarious society becomes.
Remove the "I want", remainder is the "peace". ~Al-Ghazali~
"This time will also pass", a dose to cure both; the excitement & the grievance. ~Ayaz~