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National DNA Databases

royalpaladin
Posts: 22,357
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12/18/2012 2:26:57 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Ok, so I don't like this idea very much because I'd rather not have corrupt government officials have access to my DNA, but I do think it has some benefits. What are your thoughts?

Benefits
1. Identification of crime victims is easier since the DNA could be compared to sequences in the database.
Addendum: A national database would also allow for quicker identification of serial killer victims. A lot of victims are dumped along interstate highways because long-haul trucking is an ideal career for serial killers (they can just pick up a hitchhiker in one state, kill him/her in another state, and dump the body several states over so that law enforcement has a hard time identifying the victim based on local "missing persons" registries"). A lot of the victims also happen to be prostitutes whom nobody really cares about since they are so nomadic :/

2. Easier to catch criminal if they leave behind DNA evidence on the victim. This also creates a disincentive for crime, especially for the truckers who are really serial killers, since it will be easier to catch them.

3. Reduction in identity fraud since it is more difficult to forge an individual's DNA than to his or her social security number. It also will limit cases in which the identity thief launches a counterclaim against the victim and pretends that the victim has stolen the identity.

Addendum 1: This also makes it more difficult for illegal immigrants to obtain employment if people are checked against their DNA samples in the database when they apply for job.

Addendum 2: Reduces voter fraud and also eliminates the need for voter IDs.
badger
Posts: 11,793
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12/18/2012 2:37:20 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
kinda scary like in how if a wizard learns your true name, he can fvck you over rightly. but cool otherwise, yeah.
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inferno
Posts: 10,655
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12/18/2012 2:38:01 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 12/18/2012 2:26:57 PM, royalpaladin wrote:
Ok, so I don't like this idea very much because I'd rather not have corrupt government officials have access to my DNA, but I do think it has some benefits. What are your thoughts?

Benefits
1. Identification of crime victims is easier since the DNA could be compared to sequences in the database.
Addendum: A national database would also allow for quicker identification of serial killer victims. A lot of victims are dumped along interstate highways because long-haul trucking is an ideal career for serial killers (they can just pick up a hitchhiker in one state, kill him/her in another state, and dump the body several states over so that law enforcement has a hard time identifying the victim based on local "missing persons" registries"). A lot of the victims also happen to be prostitutes whom nobody really cares about since they are so nomadic :/

2. Easier to catch criminal if they leave behind DNA evidence on the victim. This also creates a disincentive for crime, especially for the truckers who are really serial killers, since it will be easier to catch them.

3. Reduction in identity fraud since it is more difficult to forge an individual's DNA than to his or her social security number. It also will limit cases in which the identity thief launches a counterclaim against the victim and pretends that the victim has stolen the identity.

Addendum 1: This also makes it more difficult for illegal immigrants to obtain employment if people are checked against their DNA samples in the database when they apply for job.

Addendum 2: Reduces voter fraud and also eliminates the need for voter IDs.

The Government can read your mind as well. They are master manipulators.
You being a student at Columbia University.............They have already mapped things out for you. They have found out what your strengths are.
They know what makes you weak. They know how you respond to adversity.
They know the limitations of your mind. They know what you love, and admire.
And they also know what you deplore.
Mark my words Royale. They are watching...........=)
16kadams
Posts: 10,497
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12/18/2012 2:43:18 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 12/18/2012 2:38:01 PM, inferno wrote:
At 12/18/2012 2:26:57 PM, royalpaladin wrote:
Ok, so I don't like this idea very much because I'd rather not have corrupt government officials have access to my DNA, but I do think it has some benefits. What are your thoughts?

Benefits
1. Identification of crime victims is easier since the DNA could be compared to sequences in the database.
Addendum: A national database would also allow for quicker identification of serial killer victims. A lot of victims are dumped along interstate highways because long-haul trucking is an ideal career for serial killers (they can just pick up a hitchhiker in one state, kill him/her in another state, and dump the body several states over so that law enforcement has a hard time identifying the victim based on local "missing persons" registries"). A lot of the victims also happen to be prostitutes whom nobody really cares about since they are so nomadic :/

2. Easier to catch criminal if they leave behind DNA evidence on the victim. This also creates a disincentive for crime, especially for the truckers who are really serial killers, since it will be easier to catch them.

3. Reduction in identity fraud since it is more difficult to forge an individual's DNA than to his or her social security number. It also will limit cases in which the identity thief launches a counterclaim against the victim and pretends that the victim has stolen the identity.

Addendum 1: This also makes it more difficult for illegal immigrants to obtain employment if people are checked against their DNA samples in the database when they apply for job.

Addendum 2: Reduces voter fraud and also eliminates the need for voter IDs.

The Government can read your mind as well. They are master manipulators.
You being a student at Columbia University.............They have already mapped things out for you. They have found out what your strengths are.
They know what makes you weak. They know how you respond to adversity.
They know the limitations of your mind. They know what you love, and admire.
And they also know what you deplore.
Mark my words Royale. They are watching...........=)

Okay. If they knew our every move, why do we have unsolved crime?
https://www.youtube.com...
https://rekonomics.wordpress.com...
"A trend is a trend, but the question is, will it bend? Will it alter its course through some unforeseen force and come to a premature end?" -- Alec Cairncross
Cody_Franklin
Posts: 9,483
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12/18/2012 2:48:50 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 12/18/2012 2:43:18 PM, 16kadams wrote:
At 12/18/2012 2:38:01 PM, inferno wrote:
At 12/18/2012 2:26:57 PM, royalpaladin wrote:
Ok, so I don't like this idea very much because I'd rather not have corrupt government officials have access to my DNA, but I do think it has some benefits. What are your thoughts?

Benefits
1. Identification of crime victims is easier since the DNA could be compared to sequences in the database.
Addendum: A national database would also allow for quicker identification of serial killer victims. A lot of victims are dumped along interstate highways because long-haul trucking is an ideal career for serial killers (they can just pick up a hitchhiker in one state, kill him/her in another state, and dump the body several states over so that law enforcement has a hard time identifying the victim based on local "missing persons" registries"). A lot of the victims also happen to be prostitutes whom nobody really cares about since they are so nomadic :/

2. Easier to catch criminal if they leave behind DNA evidence on the victim. This also creates a disincentive for crime, especially for the truckers who are really serial killers, since it will be easier to catch them.

3. Reduction in identity fraud since it is more difficult to forge an individual's DNA than to his or her social security number. It also will limit cases in which the identity thief launches a counterclaim against the victim and pretends that the victim has stolen the identity.

Addendum 1: This also makes it more difficult for illegal immigrants to obtain employment if people are checked against their DNA samples in the database when they apply for job.

Addendum 2: Reduces voter fraud and also eliminates the need for voter IDs.

The Government can read your mind as well. They are master manipulators.
You being a student at Columbia University.............They have already mapped things out for you. They have found out what your strengths are.
They know what makes you weak. They know how you respond to adversity.
They know the limitations of your mind. They know what you love, and admire.
And they also know what you deplore.
Mark my words Royale. They are watching...........=)


Okay. If they knew our every move, why do we have unsolved crime?

Hurr hurr literalism, I'm clever cuz I use "every move" to disqualify the argument.

Get over yourself. When someone says "the government watches our every move", they obviously mean that there exist pervasive surveillance programs of many different kinds--not that the government literally knows everything we do.
DetectableNinja
Posts: 6,043
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12/18/2012 2:57:49 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
No National DNA Databases for me, pl0x.
Think'st thou heaven is such a glorious thing?
I tell thee, 'tis not half so fair as thou
Or any man that breathes on earth.

- Christopher Marlowe, Doctor Faustus
GeoLaureate8
Posts: 12,252
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12/18/2012 5:42:22 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 12/18/2012 2:43:18 PM, 16kadams wrote:
Okay. If they knew our every move, why do we have unsolved crime?

I forgot that the goal of authoritarian big brother surveillance states exist to solve crime. C'mon, grow a brain.

You don't even know about this: http://en.m.wikipedia.org...
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
Double_R
Posts: 4,886
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12/18/2012 5:49:50 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 12/18/2012 2:26:57 PM, royalpaladin wrote:
Ok, so I don't like this idea very much because I'd rather not have corrupt government officials have access to my DNA, but I do think it has some benefits. What are your thoughts?

I like the idea of a national DNA database. As far as them having access to your DNA, what are you afraid they going to do with it?
GeoLaureate8
Posts: 12,252
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12/18/2012 6:02:51 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 12/18/2012 5:49:50 PM, Double_R wrote:
At 12/18/2012 2:26:57 PM, royalpaladin wrote:
Ok, so I don't like this idea very much because I'd rather not have corrupt government officials have access to my DNA, but I do think it has some benefits. What are your thoughts?

I like the idea of a national DNA database. As far as them having access to your DNA, what are you afraid they going to do with it?

Hey, lets just have government speakers in your house like North Korea. While were at it, lets have the television set spy on you. Whats the big deal, what are they gonna do?

You know what they'll do with a DNA database? Eugenics. Think about it. Joseph Mengele would have a field day with a DNA database.

You have a certain DNA type? Forced sterilization. Bam, no kids. They've already had courts rule in favor of eugenics ordering that a certain special needs woman not be allowed to reproduce.
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
Double_R
Posts: 4,886
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12/18/2012 6:08:24 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 12/18/2012 6:02:51 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
At 12/18/2012 5:49:50 PM, Double_R wrote:
At 12/18/2012 2:26:57 PM, royalpaladin wrote:
Ok, so I don't like this idea very much because I'd rather not have corrupt government officials have access to my DNA, but I do think it has some benefits. What are your thoughts?

I like the idea of a national DNA database. As far as them having access to your DNA, what are you afraid they going to do with it?

Hey, lets just have government speakers in your house like North Korea. While were at it, lets have the television set spy on you. Whats the big deal, what are they gonna do?

thanks for the response that has absolutely nothing to do with my comment.

You know what they'll do with a DNA database? Eugenics. Think about it.

OK... Thought about it. No.
GeoLaureate8
Posts: 12,252
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12/18/2012 6:48:50 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 12/18/2012 6:37:25 PM, Greyparrot wrote:
so social securty number tracking is ok, BUT Dna is not?

One leads to eugenics, the other does not. Also, a number is not as personal as DNA information. How can you think DNA tracking is the same as social security numbers?
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
tulle
Posts: 4,445
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12/18/2012 7:19:15 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 12/18/2012 6:02:51 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:

You have a certain DNA type? Forced sterilization. Bam, no kids. They've already had courts rule in favor of eugenics ordering that a certain special needs woman not be allowed to reproduce.

Just out of curiosity, what do you think would happen to that baby?
yang.
TheElderScroll
Posts: 643
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12/18/2012 8:36:54 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 12/18/2012 2:26:57 PM, royalpaladin wrote:
Ok, so I don't like this idea very much because I'd rather not have corrupt government officials have access to my DNA, but I do think it has some benefits. What are your thoughts?

Benefits
1. Identification of crime victims is easier since the DNA could be compared to sequences in the database.
Addendum: A national database would also allow for quicker identification of serial killer victims. A lot of victims are dumped along interstate highways because long-haul trucking is an ideal career for serial killers (they can just pick up a hitchhiker in one state, kill him/her in another state, and dump the body several states over so that law enforcement has a hard time identifying the victim based on local "missing persons" registries"). A lot of the victims also happen to be prostitutes whom nobody really cares about since they are so nomadic :/

There are many practical concerns
First, you need get people to give their DNA to the Federal Government. Or you can just ask criminals to submit their DNA samples, which I think is a normal procedure already. It is going to cost governments a of money to mobilize people and no one is even sure whether people would actually come.

Second, you need someone to analyze DNA samples. That is going to take a very very long time. Besides, that is going to cost a lot of money as well.

Third, as for the illegal immigrants, I guess "Show me your paper" in Arizona is adequate. Besides, it is not the identity problem that illegal immigrants can obtain employment. It is because the Federal government does not enforce the existing law. So DNA database may not be useful at all.

Last but not least, voter fraud never appears to be a trouble. Besides, I guess it would take a long time to get DNA sample confirmed when voters come to vote. (You need test blood, analyze the sequence, match the database and perhaps fill several forms afterward.)

So in conclusion, I believe it is a bad idea to have national DNA database, and I do not see any benefits.