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Dept. of Justice: More Guns, Less Crime

GeoLaureate8
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1/14/2013 1:12:40 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
http://static.prisonplanet.com...

Agent_Orange and his Leftist accomplices say they want more crime, less self-defense, and more tyranny.

It's very simple to understand that you want the good guys to have more arms than the bad guys.

Based on their philosophy, we should disarm the United States military and let Al Queda, North Korea, and China have all the weapons. No, we want our military stronger than the enemy. And you don't even need to use the arms to be peaceful. The very fact that we have a strong national defense is why countries don't invade the United States. In fact, a Japanese leader said he would never send troops to invade America because there would be a gun behind every blade of grass because of the 2nd Amendment.

Agent_Orange says that he doesn't want to get rid of guns but that there's 30,000 gun deaths (no there's not) and that we should have an assault weapons ban. But handguns are used in the majority of the crimes so why doesn't he just be honest and say he wants to ban all guns. All guns are capable of killing large numbers, especially a crowd of unarmed. Lanza could have used a bayonet and still came up with the same kill count.

But, the Left insists on making every city into Chicago and further would like to lay the grounds for a tyranny to arise unopposed.

Could you imagine if the Jews and Russians lobbied to have their firearms be taken away? Hitler and Stalin would have been absolutely delighted.

But hey, the Left loves Obama and his charisma so much they'd love an Obama dictatorship and a nation of dependent, collectivist slaves with no self-sufficiency.

"Because there's criminals, I don't lose my rights."
-- Alex Jones
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
imabench
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1/14/2013 1:32:23 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
The amount of fail in Geos post is epic
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innomen
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1/14/2013 1:38:07 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/14/2013 1:32:23 PM, imabench wrote:
The amount of fail in Geos post is epic

Geo's posts aren't all that wrong, but they are heavily distilled.
malcolmxy
Posts: 2,855
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1/14/2013 1:46:03 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
PS - how many gun owners are using their gun to oppose tyranny?

PPS - Al Qaeda is our ally now. Ain't ya heard? We actually are supplying them with weapons as part of the FSA.

Thank God you can buy a Glock and stop all of that, though.
War is over, if you want it.

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16kadams
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1/14/2013 1:48:55 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
"Assault weapons" are used in less than 1% of crime.
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https://rekonomics.wordpress.com...
"A trend is a trend, but the question is, will it bend? Will it alter its course through some unforeseen force and come to a premature end?" -- Alec Cairncross
malcolmxy
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1/14/2013 1:56:22 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/14/2013 1:48:55 PM, 16kadams wrote:
"Assault weapons" are used in less than 1% of crime.

Assault weapons are the only kinds of weapons truly protected by the 2nd amendment. They are the modern day musket. Hand guns need to be eliminated, not assault rifles.
War is over, if you want it.

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GeoLaureate8
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1/14/2013 2:36:41 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/14/2013 1:46:03 PM, malcolmxy wrote:
PS - how many gun owners are using their gun to oppose tyranny?

The mere possession of firearms deters tyranny. How many gun owners are using them in self-defense? Countless.

PPS - Al Qaeda is our ally now. Ain't ya heard? We actually are supplying them with weapons as part of the FSA.

No, they're the ally of the globalists who hijacked America.

Thank God you can buy a Glock and stop all of that, though.

Or an AR-15, a sniper rifle, or a 12 gauge shotgun pump.
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
Buddamoose
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1/14/2013 2:38:37 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/14/2013 1:56:22 PM, malcolmxy wrote:
At 1/14/2013 1:48:55 PM, 16kadams wrote:
"Assault weapons" are used in less than 1% of crime.

Assault weapons are the only kinds of weapons truly protected by the 2nd amendment. They are the modern day musket. Hand guns need to be eliminated, not assault rifles.

Actually eliminating something by making it illegal is a pipe dream you know that right?
"Reality is an illusion created due to a lack of alcohol"
-Airmax1227

"You were the moon all this time, and he was always there to make you shine."

"Was he the sun?"

"No honey, he was the darkness"

-Kazekirion
malcolmxy
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1/14/2013 2:44:52 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/14/2013 2:38:37 PM, Buddamoose wrote:
At 1/14/2013 1:56:22 PM, malcolmxy wrote:
At 1/14/2013 1:48:55 PM, 16kadams wrote:
"Assault weapons" are used in less than 1% of crime.

Assault weapons are the only kinds of weapons truly protected by the 2nd amendment. They are the modern day musket. Hand guns need to be eliminated, not assault rifles.

Actually eliminating something by making it illegal is a pipe dream you know that right?

Did I say that was the way to do it?
War is over, if you want it.

Meet Dr. Stupid and his assistants - http://www.debate.org...
Buddamoose
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1/14/2013 2:46:55 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/14/2013 2:44:52 PM, malcolmxy wrote:
At 1/14/2013 2:38:37 PM, Buddamoose wrote:
At 1/14/2013 1:56:22 PM, malcolmxy wrote:
At 1/14/2013 1:48:55 PM, 16kadams wrote:
"Assault weapons" are used in less than 1% of crime.

Assault weapons are the only kinds of weapons truly protected by the 2nd amendment. They are the modern day musket. Hand guns need to be eliminated, not assault rifles.

Actually eliminating something by making it illegal is a pipe dream you know that right?

Did I say that was the way to do it?

Oh you then assume taking steps to remove it via law enforcement and military would do it too? Nope, still a pipe dream.
"Reality is an illusion created due to a lack of alcohol"
-Airmax1227

"You were the moon all this time, and he was always there to make you shine."

"Was he the sun?"

"No honey, he was the darkness"

-Kazekirion
malcolmxy
Posts: 2,855
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1/14/2013 2:51:19 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/14/2013 2:36:41 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
At 1/14/2013 1:46:03 PM, malcolmxy wrote:
PS - how many gun owners are using their gun to oppose tyranny?

The mere possession of firearms deters tyranny. How many gun owners are using them in self-defense? Countless.

Actually, in Washington DC last year, SUCCESSFUL self-defense with a gun - 6 (now, go across the nation and the numbers add up pretty quickly and at a very paltry amount. How many lives would have been saved if not for a gun? MANY more than successfully defended themselves)

Pretty easy to count (for me...once we get over 10, I can foresee issues on your end.)

What, in your mind, is tyranny.


PPS - Al Qaeda is our ally now. Ain't ya heard? We actually are supplying them with weapons as part of the FSA.

No, they're the ally of the globalists who hijacked America.

It's your money. It's your government.

You got a gun. If someone has hijacked your government, why aren't you fighting against tyranny?

I guess the mere presence of guns DIDN'T stop tyranny, and since you're not fighting against it, what was the point of your guns again?


Thank God you can buy a Glock and stop all of that, though.

Or an AR-15, a sniper rifle, or a 12 gauge shotgun pump.

Sweet. Now, if only you would put your money where your mouth is, maybe I would fight for your rights, since you are so averse to fighting for mine...with your gun...that you said puts forth a fight by its mere presence.

Guns don't fight against tyranny. Patriots do.
War is over, if you want it.

Meet Dr. Stupid and his assistants - http://www.debate.org...
malcolmxy
Posts: 2,855
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1/14/2013 2:58:13 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/14/2013 2:46:55 PM, Buddamoose wrote:
At 1/14/2013 2:44:52 PM, malcolmxy wrote:
At 1/14/2013 2:38:37 PM, Buddamoose wrote:
At 1/14/2013 1:56:22 PM, malcolmxy wrote:
At 1/14/2013 1:48:55 PM, 16kadams wrote:
"Assault weapons" are used in less than 1% of crime.

Assault weapons are the only kinds of weapons truly protected by the 2nd amendment. They are the modern day musket. Hand guns need to be eliminated, not assault rifles.

Actually eliminating something by making it illegal is a pipe dream you know that right?

Did I say that was the way to do it?

Oh you then assume taking steps to remove it via law enforcement and military would do it too? Nope, still a pipe dream.

Step 1 - buyback program
Step 2 - tax, tax, tax
Step 3 - advertising campaign
Step 4 - eliminate new imports of foreign handguns via tariffs
Step 4.5 - destroy all handguns confiscated a evidence in a criminal proceeding (compensate those found "not guilty", no $$$ for the guilty)
Step 5 - outlaw ammunition reloaders
Step 6 - incentivize domestic handgun manufacturers to shift production to long guns (heck...including assault rifles)
Step 7 - NOW - outlaw handguns
War is over, if you want it.

Meet Dr. Stupid and his assistants - http://www.debate.org...
Buddamoose
Posts: 19,450
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1/14/2013 3:15:20 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/14/2013 2:58:13 PM, malcolmxy wrote:
At 1/14/2013 2:46:55 PM, Buddamoose wrote:
At 1/14/2013 2:44:52 PM, malcolmxy wrote:
At 1/14/2013 2:38:37 PM, Buddamoose wrote:
At 1/14/2013 1:56:22 PM, malcolmxy wrote:
At 1/14/2013 1:48:55 PM, 16kadams wrote:
"Assault weapons" are used in less than 1% of crime.

Assault weapons are the only kinds of weapons truly protected by the 2nd amendment. They are the modern day musket. Hand guns need to be eliminated, not assault rifles.

Actually eliminating something by making it illegal is a pipe dream you know that right?

Did I say that was the way to do it?

Oh you then assume taking steps to remove it via law enforcement and military would do it too? Nope, still a pipe dream.

Step 1 - buyback program
Step 2 - tax, tax, tax
Step 3 - advertising campaign
Step 4 - eliminate new imports of foreign handguns via tariffs
Step 4.5 - destroy all handguns confiscated a evidence in a criminal proceeding (compensate those found "not guilty", no $$$ for the guilty)
Step 5 - outlaw ammunition reloaders
Step 6 - incentivize domestic handgun manufacturers to shift production to long guns (heck...including assault rifles)
Step 7 - NOW - outlaw handguns

As awesome as those all sound in theory, you realize there is a big difference between theory and practice? Please explain to me how the government has shown itself to be capable of actually effectively taking steps such as these in eliminating illegal things?

Cause its not like prohibition didnt work?

Its not like drug use hasnt continued to steadily rise despite the war on drugs?
"Reality is an illusion created due to a lack of alcohol"
-Airmax1227

"You were the moon all this time, and he was always there to make you shine."

"Was he the sun?"

"No honey, he was the darkness"

-Kazekirion
GeoLaureate8
Posts: 12,252
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1/14/2013 3:18:03 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/14/2013 1:32:23 PM, imabench wrote:
The amount of fail in Geos post is epic

The amount of fail in your rebuttal of the OP is epic.

You can't refute the OP, if so, let's see it.
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
Buddamoose
Posts: 19,450
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1/14/2013 3:22:28 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Fact remains, in instances where the government decided to outlaw something(prime examples being probibition and the war on drugs). All it does is create a vacuum in which organized crime is more than haply to step in and fill the continued demand for these things.

Organized crime fully got a foothold in this country in large part because of probibition, and like Pandora's box, once you open it, its too late to close cause everything bad has already gotten out.
"Reality is an illusion created due to a lack of alcohol"
-Airmax1227

"You were the moon all this time, and he was always there to make you shine."

"Was he the sun?"

"No honey, he was the darkness"

-Kazekirion
GeoLaureate8
Posts: 12,252
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1/14/2013 3:24:00 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/14/2013 2:58:13 PM, malcolmxy wrote:
Step 1 - buyback program
Step 2 - tax, tax, tax
Step 3 - advertising campaign
Step 4 - eliminate new imports of foreign handguns via tariffs
Step 4.5 - destroy all handguns confiscated a evidence in a criminal proceeding (compensate those found "not guilty", no $$$ for the guilty)
Step 5 - outlaw ammunition reloaders
Step 6 - incentivize domestic handgun manufacturers to shift production to long guns (heck...including assault rifles)
Step 7 - NOW - outlaw handguns

Translation: Create black market.

U.K. had a total gun ban on the island of Britain yet a machine gun factory still popped up and ran for a significant time period.

Imagine how many black market machine gun factories would pop up in the U.S.

And all the weapons that would flood in from Mexico.
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
Buddamoose
Posts: 19,450
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1/14/2013 3:29:21 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/14/2013 3:24:00 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
At 1/14/2013 2:58:13 PM, malcolmxy wrote:
Step 1 - buyback program
Step 2 - tax, tax, tax
Step 3 - advertising campaign
Step 4 - eliminate new imports of foreign handguns via tariffs
Step 4.5 - destroy all handguns confiscated a evidence in a criminal proceeding (compensate those found "not guilty", no $$$ for the guilty)
Step 5 - outlaw ammunition reloaders
Step 6 - incentivize domestic handgun manufacturers to shift production to long guns (heck...including assault rifles)
Step 7 - NOW - outlaw handguns

Translation: Create black market.

U.K. had a total gun ban on the island of Britain yet a machine gun factory still popped up and ran for a significant time period.

Imagine how many black market machine gun factories would pop up in the U.S.

And all the weapons that would flood in from Mexico.

Pandora's box, nuff said
"Reality is an illusion created due to a lack of alcohol"
-Airmax1227

"You were the moon all this time, and he was always there to make you shine."

"Was he the sun?"

"No honey, he was the darkness"

-Kazekirion
Buddamoose
Posts: 19,450
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1/14/2013 3:32:15 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Black Markets and Organized Crime.

Its something anti-gun advocates would have us ignore cause it doesnt mesh with their delusional view of reality.
"Reality is an illusion created due to a lack of alcohol"
-Airmax1227

"You were the moon all this time, and he was always there to make you shine."

"Was he the sun?"

"No honey, he was the darkness"

-Kazekirion
GeoLaureate8
Posts: 12,252
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1/14/2013 3:42:51 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/14/2013 2:51:19 PM, malcolmxy wrote:
At 1/14/2013 2:36:41 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
The mere possession of firearms deters tyranny. How many gun owners are using them in self-defense? Countless.

Actually, in Washington DC last year, SUCCESSFUL self-defense with a gun - 6 (now, go across the nation and the numbers add up pretty quickly and at a very paltry amount. How many lives would have been saved if not for a gun? MANY more than successfully defended themselves)

Pretty easy to count (for me...once we get over 10, I can foresee issues on your end.)

DC has a near total gun ban. Law abiding citizens can't buy guns for protection. Those numbers make sense.

What, in your mind, is tyranny.

Violating the Constitution, the principles of individual freedom, and the free market.

No, they're the ally of the globalists who hijacked America.

It's your money. It's your government.

Yeah, my sandwich, not my fault a thief is taking a bite out of it and rotting it.

You got a gun. If someone has hijacked your government, why aren't you fighting against tyranny?

I am fighting the Infowar.

I guess the mere presence of guns DIDN'T stop tyranny, and since you're not fighting against it, what was the point of your guns again?

There's varying degrees of tyranny. It's called the Totalitarian tiptoe. They haven't disarmed us or rounded us up into camps.

The 300,000,000 guns make them hesitant to do full confiscation. We're not Australia (the real Crocodile Dundee gunned down 4 gun confiscaters before he died in the firefight when Australia did a gun ban.)

Or an AR-15, a sniper rifle, or a 12 gauge shotgun pump.

Sweet. Now, if only you would put your money where your mouth is, maybe I would fight for your rights, since you are so averse to fighting for mine...with your gun...that you said puts forth a fight by its mere presence.

Guns don't fight against tyranny. Patriots do.


George Washington and the Patriots waited for the enemy to shoot first. You know nothing of strategy.
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
malcolmxy
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1/14/2013 4:14:25 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/14/2013 3:24:00 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
At 1/14/2013 2:58:13 PM, malcolmxy wrote:
Step 1 - buyback program
Step 2 - tax, tax, tax
Step 3 - advertising campaign
Step 4 - eliminate new imports of foreign handguns via tariffs
Step 4.5 - destroy all handguns confiscated a evidence in a criminal proceeding (compensate those found "not guilty", no $$$ for the guilty)
Step 5 - outlaw ammunition reloaders
Step 6 - incentivize domestic handgun manufacturers to shift production to long guns (heck...including assault rifles)
Step 7 - NOW - outlaw handguns

Translation: Create black market.

U.K. had a total gun ban on the island of Britain yet a machine gun factory still popped up and ran for a significant time period.

Imagine how many black market machine gun factories would pop up in the U.S.

And all the weapons that would flood in from Mexico.

Oh...you mean like the black market for cigarettes that's running rampant across the country? (and if you say that cigarettes are harmful, I swear I'll do a spit-take all over my computer) Or, the black market in Canada or England for handguns?

(I'm not against machine guns. I got no problem with people having fully automatic weapons as long as the barrel is at least 22" long. I just want handguns gone.)


But...but...cigarettes aren't illegal. Nope...not yet. They're pretty inconvenient and expensive and NEW smokers are on a steady decline.

It's a multi-step plan for a reason - pacing will eliminate shock, and PR will drop demand while Tax will have an equal effect on both supply and demand.

You don't execute the final step until virtually no one wants them any longer.

And, by using tax to hype-inflate the price, you make black market handguns one of 2 things - inferior quality or prohibitively expensive.

Since criminals shop the black market, isn't that a good thing?
War is over, if you want it.

Meet Dr. Stupid and his assistants - http://www.debate.org...
malcolmxy
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1/14/2013 4:22:43 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/14/2013 3:42:51 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
At 1/14/2013 2:51:19 PM, malcolmxy wrote:
At 1/14/2013 2:36:41 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
The mere possession of firearms deters tyranny. How many gun owners are using them in self-defense? Countless.

Actually, in Washington DC last year, SUCCESSFUL self-defense with a gun - 6 (now, go across the nation and the numbers add up pretty quickly and at a very paltry amount. How many lives would have been saved if not for a gun? MANY more than successfully defended themselves)

Pretty easy to count (for me...once we get over 10, I can foresee issues on your end.)

DC has a near total gun ban. Law abiding citizens can't buy guns for protection. Those numbers make sense.

POSSESSION

All firearms must be registered with the MPD. To obtain a registration certificate, the applicant must be 21 years old (or be over 18 and have a notorized permission and liability statement signed by his parent or guardian), pass a vision test or have a valid D.C. driver"s license, complete a firearms training course conducted by a state-certified firearms instructor or a certified military firearms instructor that includes one hour of firing training and 4 hours of classroom instruction

(From the NRA website...)


What, in your mind, is tyranny.

Violating the Constitution, the principles of individual freedom, and the free market.

Life, liberty and the pursuit of 1/2 off on Pert Plus? Seriously?

And, this is happening on a wide scale today, right? Where are your guns now? They seem to be doing a piss-poor job of fighting against tyranny.


No, they're the ally of the globalists who hijacked America.

It's your money. It's your government.

Yeah, my sandwich, not my fault a thief is taking a bite out of it and rotting it.

You got a gun. If someone has hijacked your government, why aren't you fighting against tyranny?

I am fighting the Infowar.

you need a gun for the infowar? Unless it shoots information, it seems pretty useless to me in your fight


I guess the mere presence of guns DIDN'T stop tyranny, and since you're not fighting against it, what was the point of your guns again?

There's varying degrees of tyranny. It's called the Totalitarian tiptoe. They haven't disarmed us or rounded us up into camps.

The 300,000,000 guns make them hesitant to do full confiscation. We're not Australia (the real Crocodile Dundee gunned down 4 gun confiscaters before he died in the firefight when Australia did a gun ban.)

Or an AR-15, a sniper rifle, or a 12 gauge shotgun pump.

Sweet. Now, if only you would put your money where your mouth is, maybe I would fight for your rights, since you are so averse to fighting for mine...with your gun...that you said puts forth a fight by its mere presence.

Guns don't fight against tyranny. Patriots do.


George Washington and the Patriots waited for the enemy to shoot first. You know nothing of strategy.

They've already admitted to assassinating american citizens. first blood has been drawn, Rambo.
War is over, if you want it.

Meet Dr. Stupid and his assistants - http://www.debate.org...
GeoLaureate8
Posts: 12,252
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1/15/2013 10:38:05 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/14/2013 1:32:23 PM, imabench wrote:
The amount of fail in Geos post is epic

Still no rebuttal to the OP. In fact, I don't think I've ever seen you put forth any good arguments for gun control.
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat