Total Posts:48|Showing Posts:1-30|Last Page
Jump to topic:

The Angry White Male **

inferno
Posts: 10,660
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/15/2013 10:08:48 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
Now Wikipedia believes that the average Angry White Male is a Conservative traditionalist. We have seen the recent school shootings and other mass murders that seem to reflect the underlying anger that these White males have.......Okay.
We can say it is political, or not. I do believe that there is a racial undertone that lies underneath it all. Yes, we understand that for some it may be a mental health issue here.
However, we cannot deny the fact that most of these brutal crimes of humanity are done mostly by White Males. The line is blurry but is appears to be more obvious than anything else.
It has to do with hate. It is something that is taught, and learned. Some of the crimes here done were by young students who have a racist view about America today hence the journals of some killers in days past. Note Columbine* was one of them. I notice the look that I get from some.....It seems they are depressed, anxious, frustrated, distant, and a bit discouraged by the current demographic in the US more so than any other place. And of course this is also the deal in some foreign European countries as they taunt the propaganda of being extinct. Its a complex issue. But read what one guy said at the bottom of this link. And let me know what you think. Is this the narrative, or ideology of the infamous
Angry White Male. I dont know. You tell me. =)

http://www.examiner.com...
inferno
Posts: 10,660
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/15/2013 10:51:19 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/15/2013 10:08:48 AM, inferno wrote:
Now Wikipedia believes that the average Angry White Male is a Conservative traditionalist. We have seen the recent school shootings and other mass murders that seem to reflect the underlying anger that these White males have.......Okay.
We can say it is political, or not. I do believe that there is a racial undertone that lies underneath it all. Yes, we understand that for some it may be a mental health issue here.
However, we cannot deny the fact that most of these brutal crimes of humanity are done mostly by White Males. The line is blurry but is appears to be more obvious than anything else.
It has to do with hate. It is something that is taught, and learned. Some of the crimes here done were by young students who have a racist view about America today hence the journals of some killers in days past. Note Columbine* was one of them. I notice the look that I get from some.....It seems they are depressed, anxious, frustrated, distant, and a bit discouraged by the current demographic in the US more so than any other place. And of course this is also the deal in some foreign European countries as they taunt the propaganda of being extinct. Its a complex issue. But read what one guy said at the bottom of this link. And let me know what you think. Is this the narrative, or ideology of the infamous
Angry White Male. I dont know. You tell me. =)

http://www.examiner.com...

And none here dares tell it like it is such as yours truly. =)
Khaos_Mage
Posts: 23,214
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/15/2013 12:53:28 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
What I have noticed/believe is that the vast majority of these shootings are personal, with the exception of the Batman shooting. Also, they are committed by middle-class white males. They seem to be initially targeting certain people (bully, girlfriend who just dumped him), and the other deaths are either unintentional or an afterthought because exerting this newfound power just felt so good to them.

I don't think mental issues are to blame, per se, but perhaps they are feeling angry due to entitlement. They have had a life of relative ease, but when faced with real issues, like not being accepted, they can't handle it because they have never failed or been rejected before. They are angry because they are weak.

I could be wrong, as I don't really pay attention to these shootings. This was my thoughts about Columbine, while it was happening.
My work here is, finally, done.
bossyburrito
Posts: 14,075
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/15/2013 1:07:45 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Kill the whites.
#UnbanTheMadman

"Some will sell their dreams for small desires
Or lose the race to rats
Get caught in ticking traps
And start to dream of somewhere
To relax their restless flight
Somewhere out of a memory of lighted streets on quiet nights..."

~ Rush
inferno
Posts: 10,660
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/15/2013 2:12:04 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/15/2013 12:53:28 PM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
What I have noticed/believe is that the vast majority of these shootings are personal, with the exception of the Batman shooting. Also, they are committed by middle-class white males. They seem to be initially targeting certain people (bully, girlfriend who just dumped him), and the other deaths are either unintentional or an afterthought because exerting this newfound power just felt so good to them.

I don't think mental issues are to blame, per se, but perhaps they are feeling angry due to entitlement. They have had a life of relative ease, but when faced with real issues, like not being accepted, they can't handle it because they have never failed or been rejected before. They are angry because they are weak.

I could be wrong, as I don't really pay attention to these shootings. This was my thoughts about Columbine, while it was happening.

Thanks. Interesting response here.
Heineken
Posts: 1,230
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/15/2013 2:27:53 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Absurd.

Asian - The Virginia Tech shooter.
Mexican - Eduardo Sencion had a total victim count of 12 when he opened up in an IHOP.
Asian - One L. Goh had a victim list of 10 when he shot up his nursing class.
Mexican / American - Jennifer San Marco killed 8 people in her Post Office.
Middle Eastern - Midal Malik Hassan (Army Psychiatrist at Fort Hood) had a victim count of 43.

Let's not forget the "silent" body count.
In Jacksonville, Florida, approximately three years ago, a gang initiation spike resulted in several random executions. The gang-members walked up behind people waiting in line at dunkin doughnuts, McDonalds, etc...and shot them in the head.

This morning, two people got shot by black gang members in a pedestrian mall in Atlanta. Before that, arson in a low-income housing community. 4 kids dead.

The total body count by race make the white male.....(ready for the results?).....the model citizen.
Vidi, vici, veni.
(I saw, I conquered, I came.)
Buddamoose
Posts: 19,449
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/15/2013 2:47:51 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
This kind of sh!t sickens me. People need to grow the fack up and stop equating sh!t to pointless goddang things like race. I'm sorry, does the color of your skin affect the type of person you are? Last time i checked, no it didnt.

dang children needing to find an excuse to blame sh1t on pathetic stuff like the color of somebodies skin.

^^i've had a few beers so yeah, /endrant
"Reality is an illusion created due to a lack of alcohol"
-Airmax1227

"You were the moon all this time, and he was always there to make you shine."

"Was he the sun?"

"No honey, he was the darkness"

-Kazekirion
Sidewalker
Posts: 3,713
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/15/2013 4:15:01 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
I think it's crazy white males we are talking about here. It's less about color and more about unhinged minds.
"It is one of the commonest of mistakes to consider that the limit of our power of perception is also the limit of all there is to perceive." " C. W. Leadbeater
Buddamoose
Posts: 19,449
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/15/2013 6:18:20 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/15/2013 4:15:01 PM, Sidewalker wrote:
I think it's crazy white males we are talking about here. It's less about color and more about unhinged minds.

Then why use the term "white?" And not just "crazy males?"
"Reality is an illusion created due to a lack of alcohol"
-Airmax1227

"You were the moon all this time, and he was always there to make you shine."

"Was he the sun?"

"No honey, he was the darkness"

-Kazekirion
popculturepooka
Posts: 7,924
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/15/2013 7:04:21 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/15/2013 2:27:53 PM, Heineken wrote:
Absurd.

The total body count by race make the white male.....(ready for the results?).....the model citizen.

I can't tell if you're being serious or not but I think it's time to start racially profiling white men. :P

http://www.salon.com...
At 10/3/2016 11:49:13 PM, thett3 wrote:
BLACK LIVES MATTER!
Heineken
Posts: 1,230
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/16/2013 4:34:24 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/15/2013 7:04:21 PM, popculturepooka wrote:
At 1/15/2013 2:27:53 PM, Heineken wrote:
Absurd.

The total body count by race make the white male.....(ready for the results?).....the model citizen.

I can't tell if you're being serious or not but I think it's time to start racially profiling white men. :P

http://www.salon.com...

This would get very confusing for the police.

Cop: "Pulled over "white" male. Looks educated and possibly middle-income. Tags are not expired and license is in good standing. It looks as if he owns his own car. He is accompanied by a moderately attractive female of the same age.

Dispatch:" Why did you pull them over?

Cop: "Romney/Ryan bumpersticker."
Vidi, vici, veni.
(I saw, I conquered, I came.)
Sidewalker
Posts: 3,713
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/16/2013 5:02:32 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/15/2013 6:18:20 PM, Buddamoose wrote:
At 1/15/2013 4:15:01 PM, Sidewalker wrote:
I think it's crazy white males we are talking about here. It's less about color and more about unhinged minds.

Then why use the term "white?" And not just "crazy males?"

I'm responding to the OP which stated "most of these brutal crimes of humanity are done mostly by White Males".

I certainly don't think white's have any kind of monopoly on unhinged minds or violent crimes against humanity, but it does seem that these tragic crimes like the school and theater shootings that come to mind have all been done by white males. I don't think it's fair to say that in general, whites are more angry than blacks per se, that doesn't seem to be the case, but there is probably some context that seems to result in the fact that white males are overrpresented in this type of crime. We are all looking for answers and it's certainly an aspect worthy of pursuit if we want to understand this phenomenon.
"It is one of the commonest of mistakes to consider that the limit of our power of perception is also the limit of all there is to perceive." " C. W. Leadbeater
Sidewalker
Posts: 3,713
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/16/2013 5:40:13 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/15/2013 7:04:21 PM, popculturepooka wrote:
At 1/15/2013 2:27:53 PM, Heineken wrote:
Absurd.

The total body count by race make the white male.....(ready for the results?).....the model citizen.

I can't tell if you're being serious or not but I think it's time to start racially profiling white men. :P

http://www.salon.com...

As the article says, racial profiling doesn't work and it is unjust to try to bring sanctions against the many for the acts of a few, that is the essence of bigotry, but if you want to understand a phenomena like school shootings there is nothing wrong with profiling the perpetrators, and when you do that, white, male, unhinged minds, and guns jump right out at you.

One of the last places it's still culturally respectable to be prejudiced is against people with disabilities, especially the mentally ill. I happen to be a very active advocate for equal treatment for people with disabilities, I'm especially focused on the neurodiversity movement, but even I can make a strong argument for why the mentally ill and guns don't go together, that argument is just common sense.

The gun lobby throws out a lot of emotionally charged terms in an effort to shut down the conversation, racially profiling whites is one of them, but the fact is we have a problem on our hands. If we are going to understand it we are going to have to look at what these perpetrators have in common investigate that profile in our search for cause/effect, and perhaps find solutions.
"It is one of the commonest of mistakes to consider that the limit of our power of perception is also the limit of all there is to perceive." " C. W. Leadbeater
Sidewalker
Posts: 3,713
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/16/2013 6:29:04 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
There is one thing that all of these perpetrators have in common, and it"s the most relevant thing of all. Somewhere along the way, in their emotionally charged unhinged minds, their victims stopped being seen as human beings and came to be seen as symbols for something else.

When I look at all the rhetoric coming from both sides of the debate, I see angry people being manipulated by extremists who are exploiting that anger, fanning the flames so to speak. I see a society very quick to characterize the other side of almost every issue in mostly dehumanizing terms. The powerful people pulling the strings tell us that the "them" of our "us/them" thinking is just evil, inhuman, dangerous, and out to get you, the people manipulating us use fear and paranoia like Picasso used paint. Somewhere along the way, in our national discourse, the opposition has stopped being seen as human beings and comes to be seen as nothing but a symbol for something else, the evil and inhuman "them" that want to destroy our way of life.

Then, when somebody with an unhinged mind lashes out, killing innocent people who in their minds are no longer seen as human beings, but only symbols for some angry agenda, we wonder why and we engage in a national discourse in which the whole dehumanizing process gains momentum.

I think that societal trend is more explanatory than anything else.
"It is one of the commonest of mistakes to consider that the limit of our power of perception is also the limit of all there is to perceive." " C. W. Leadbeater
Sidewalker
Posts: 3,713
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/16/2013 7:37:49 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
The people in the gun lobby aren't really people, they are shapeshifting, middle earth dwelling reptiloids that are out to get us.

That's why we need our guns, you can't kill reptiloids without big clips and assault rifles, a single shot just doesn't do the job with shapeshifting reptiloids.
"It is one of the commonest of mistakes to consider that the limit of our power of perception is also the limit of all there is to perceive." " C. W. Leadbeater
CarefulNow
Posts: 780
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/16/2013 7:46:46 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/16/2013 5:40:13 AM, Sidewalker wrote:
As the article says, racial profiling doesn't work and it is unjust to try to bring sanctions against the many for the acts of a few, that is the essence of bigotry, but if you want to understand a phenomena like school shootings there is nothing wrong with profiling the perpetrators, and when you do that, white, male, unhinged minds, and guns jump right out at you.

Guns are actually implied by "shooting", and one could argue that whites and Asians like the VT massacrist are implied by "school", if less strongly. Also implicit is high body counts, which in turn implies expensive arsenals such as those a white relative might have the means to piss away money on. And the problem isn't so much privileged classes being reluctant to be the subject of vengeful profiling as our attention being fixated on the occasions in which victims are from said privileged classes (the poor aren't coming for your children; they're safely confined to ghettos, and their violence against each other is a healthy, continuous release of the pressure flip side of your privilege).
Sidewalker
Posts: 3,713
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/16/2013 9:36:50 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/16/2013 7:46:46 AM, CarefulNow wrote:
At 1/16/2013 5:40:13 AM, Sidewalker wrote:
As the article says, racial profiling doesn't work and it is unjust to try to bring sanctions against the many for the acts of a few, that is the essence of bigotry, but if you want to understand a phenomena like school shootings there is nothing wrong with profiling the perpetrators, and when you do that, white, male, unhinged minds, and guns jump right out at you.

Guns are actually implied by "shooting", and one could argue that whites and Asians like the VT massacrist are implied by "school", if less strongly. Also implicit is high body counts, which in turn implies expensive arsenals such as those a white relative might have the means to piss away money on. And the problem isn't so much privileged classes being reluctant to be the subject of vengeful profiling as our attention being fixated on the occasions in which victims are from said privileged classes (the poor aren't coming for your children; they're safely confined to ghettos, and their violence against each other is a healthy, continuous release of the pressure flip side of your privilege).

Aren't these school shooting coming from the "priveledged class" safely confined to suburbs? Does this mean thier violence against each other is a healthy, continuous release of pressure flip side of anybody that can claim they have been denied equal status with the "priveledged class"?
"It is one of the commonest of mistakes to consider that the limit of our power of perception is also the limit of all there is to perceive." " C. W. Leadbeater
malcolmxy
Posts: 2,855
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/16/2013 9:46:55 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
He's saying that white people are quick to forget when some crazy cracker pulls something like this, because they are still scared of the darkies coming to kill their kids...or get them hooked on the reefer...or whatever the fear du jour is for the soccer mom set.

His comment had nothing to do with the actual "health" of black on black violence or how the underprivileged feel about anything.

He was speaking to the suburbanites feelings about the denizens of the inner cities.
War is over, if you want it.

Meet Dr. Stupid and his assistants - http://www.debate.org...
CarefulNow
Posts: 780
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/16/2013 10:05:27 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/16/2013 9:36:50 AM, Sidewalker wrote:
Aren't these school shooting coming from the "priveledged class" safely confined to suburbs? Does this mean thier violence against each other is a healthy, continuous release of pressure flip side of anybody that can claim they have been denied equal status with the "priveledged class"?

Yes, I suppose this particular kind of shooting doesn't directly threaten the lower classes, but that's irrelevant because the lower classes aren't the ones that dictate policy. And what's the meaning of your brutally misspelled scare quote? If you doubt that class confers privilege ("access" to an inherited trait is of course nonsensical), you ought to just explain yourself.
Sidewalker
Posts: 3,713
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/16/2013 10:56:56 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/16/2013 10:05:27 AM, CarefulNow wrote:
At 1/16/2013 9:36:50 AM, Sidewalker wrote:
Aren't these school shooting coming from the "priveledged class" safely confined to suburbs? Does this mean thier violence against each other is a healthy, continuous release of pressure flip side of anybody that can claim they have been denied equal status with the "priveledged class"?

Yes, I suppose this particular kind of shooting doesn't directly threaten the lower classes, but that's irrelevant because the lower classes aren't the ones that dictate policy.

My point is you are trying to make this about the "them" of your "us/them" thinking, as if these guys are walking into a different social classroom to do the shooting. It isn't that, they are walking into the classrooms of thier own neighborhood and shooting thier own social peers. My primary argument is that the dehumanizing nature of "us/them" thinking is the problem, and in an unhinged mind it turns into these tragedies, the fact that there are different social classes doesn't appear to figure into this all that well, it cerainly didn't follow from what I posted..

And what's the meaning of your brutally misspelled scare quote? If you doubt that class confers privilege ("access" to an inherited trait is of course nonsensical), you ought to just explain yourself.

The meaning of the misspelling is only that I can't spell and forgot to spellcheck it....and I was paraphrasing you, so you own the "scare quote". Go back and read my earlier posts again, my position is that it's those very scare tactics in the national discourse that is a big part of the problem.
"It is one of the commonest of mistakes to consider that the limit of our power of perception is also the limit of all there is to perceive." " C. W. Leadbeater
Sidewalker
Posts: 3,713
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/16/2013 11:00:09 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/16/2013 9:46:55 AM, malcolmxy wrote:
He's saying that white people are quick to forget when some crazy cracker pulls something like this, because they are still scared of the darkies coming to kill their kids...or get them hooked on the reefer...or whatever the fear du jour is for the soccer mom set.

His comment had nothing to do with the actual "health" of black on black violence or how the underprivileged feel about anything.

He was speaking to the suburbanites feelings about the denizens of the inner cities.

OK, and I don't see that as particularly explanatory in understanding why these maniacs are walking into schools in thier own neighborhoods and killing thier own people.
"It is one of the commonest of mistakes to consider that the limit of our power of perception is also the limit of all there is to perceive." " C. W. Leadbeater
inferno
Posts: 10,660
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/16/2013 12:02:40 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/16/2013 9:36:50 AM, Sidewalker wrote:
At 1/16/2013 7:46:46 AM, CarefulNow wrote:
At 1/16/2013 5:40:13 AM, Sidewalker wrote:
As the article says, racial profiling doesn't work and it is unjust to try to bring sanctions against the many for the acts of a few, that is the essence of bigotry, but if you want to understand a phenomena like school shootings there is nothing wrong with profiling the perpetrators, and when you do that, white, male, unhinged minds, and guns jump right out at you.

Guns are actually implied by "shooting", and one could argue that whites and Asians like the VT massacrist are implied by "school", if less strongly. Also implicit is high body counts, which in turn implies expensive arsenals such as those a white relative might have the means to piss away money on. And the problem isn't so much privileged classes being reluctant to be the subject of vengeful profiling as our attention being fixated on the occasions in which victims are from said privileged classes (the poor aren't coming for your children; they're safely confined to ghettos, and their violence against each other is a healthy, continuous release of the pressure flip side of your privilege).

Aren't these school shooting coming from the "priveledged class" safely confined to suburbs? Does this mean thier violence against each other is a healthy, continuous release of pressure flip side of anybody that can claim they have been denied equal status with the "priveledged class"?

Ill get back with you later on this issue my friend. You dont wanna miss this........
inferno
Posts: 10,660
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/16/2013 12:09:12 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/15/2013 4:15:01 PM, Sidewalker wrote:
I think it's crazy white males we are talking about here. It's less about color and more about unhinged minds.

Not when most of these crimes are done by White Males. Now why do you think this is so. Since most people associate violence with minorities, reality just threw you a curve ball. Now deal with that.
CarefulNow
Posts: 780
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/16/2013 12:28:15 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/16/2013 10:56:56 AM, Sidewalker wrote:
My point is you are trying to make this about the "them" of your "us/them" thinking, as if these guys are walking into a different social classroom to do the shooting. It isn't that, they are walking into the classrooms of thier own neighborhood and shooting thier own social peers. My primary argument is that the dehumanizing nature of "us/them" thinking is the problem, and in an unhinged mind it turns into these tragedies, the fact that there are different social classes doesn't appear to figure into this all that well, it cerainly didn't follow from what I posted..

I'm not obliged to follow you. You dutifully accepted the bourgeois narrowing of the issue of gun violence to the rare case of violence against the bourgoisie. So it's no wonder that you divided society into males and females, whites and minorities, sane and insane, those with access to guns and those without--anything but the economic inequality that is the number one predictor of gun violence and violence generally.

The meaning of the misspelling is only that I can't spell and forgot to spellcheck it....and I was paraphrasing you, so you own the "scare quote". Go back and read my earlier posts again, my position is that it's those very scare tactics in the national discourse that is a big part of the problem.

No, I don't think Lanza or anybody in the mainstream discourse invokes class. Both sides have rather dutifully framed the issue around your preferred thems, particularly the mentally ill and especially either gun-owners or gun regulators, depending on which faction of the Property Party one belongs to. It's impossible, though, to propose a solution that couldn't be construed as an attack on some group or that would be Pareto efficient, so hopefully now that I've pointed out your hypocrisy these accusations of divisiveness can stop.
Sidewalker
Posts: 3,713
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/16/2013 12:44:38 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/16/2013 12:09:12 PM, inferno wrote:
At 1/15/2013 4:15:01 PM, Sidewalker wrote:
I think it's crazy white males we are talking about here. It's less about color and more about unhinged minds.

Not when most of these crimes are done by White Males. Now why do you think this is so. Since most people associate violence with minorities, reality just threw you a curve ball. Now deal with that.

I don't associate violence with minorities, so that is no curve ball at all that I have to deal with.
"It is one of the commonest of mistakes to consider that the limit of our power of perception is also the limit of all there is to perceive." " C. W. Leadbeater
Sidewalker
Posts: 3,713
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/16/2013 1:34:27 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/16/2013 12:28:15 PM, CarefulNow wrote:
At 1/16/2013 10:56:56 AM, Sidewalker wrote:
My point is you are trying to make this about the "them" of your "us/them" thinking, as if these guys are walking into a different social classroom to do the shooting. It isn't that, they are walking into the classrooms of thier own neighborhood and shooting thier own social peers. My primary argument is that the dehumanizing nature of "us/them" thinking is the problem, and in an unhinged mind it turns into these tragedies, the fact that there are different social classes doesn't appear to figure into this all that well, it cerainly didn't follow from what I posted..

I'm not obliged to follow you.

Nope, you are certainly entitled to reply to my post with non sequiturs.

You dutifully accepted the bourgeois narrowing of the issue of gun violence to the rare case of violence against the bourgoisie. So it's no wonder that you divided society into males and females, whites and minorities, sane and insane, those with access to guns and those without--anything but the economic inequality that is the number one predictor of gun violence and violence generally.

Non-sequitur"yeah, yeah, you don"t know anything about me but I"m the "them" of your "us/them" thinking, blah blah blah.

The meaning of the misspelling is only that I can't spell and forgot to spellcheck it....and I was paraphrasing you, so you own the "scare quote". Go back and read my earlier posts again, my position is that it's those very scare tactics in the national discourse that is a big part of the problem.

No, I don't think Lanza or anybody in the mainstream discourse invokes class. Both sides have rather dutifully framed the issue around your preferred thems, particularly the mentally ill and especially either gun-owners or gun regulators, depending on which faction of the Property Party one belongs to. It's impossible, though, to propose a solution that couldn't be construed as an attack on some group or that would be Pareto efficient, so hopefully now that I've pointed out your hypocrisy these accusations of divisiveness can stop.

Yeah, yeah, I"m the evil hypocrite, bourgeois shape shifting reptilian, workers of the world unite against Sidewalker"s oppression, let the revolution begin, blah blah blah.
"It is one of the commonest of mistakes to consider that the limit of our power of perception is also the limit of all there is to perceive." " C. W. Leadbeater
CarefulNow
Posts: 780
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/16/2013 2:14:07 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/16/2013 1:34:27 PM, Sidewalker wrote:
Non-sequitur"yeah, yeah, you don"t know anything about me but I"m the "them" of your "us/them" thinking, blah blah blah.

I'm sorry I don't know more about you, but I can only go off of what you write. If you privately understand the relationship between inequality and gun violence, that's great; it's just unfortunate that you chose to focus on factors you know are relatively insignificant or uncontrollable (half the population is bound to be male, for instance).
Sidewalker
Posts: 3,713
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/16/2013 3:33:38 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/16/2013 2:14:07 PM, CarefulNow wrote:
At 1/16/2013 1:34:27 PM, Sidewalker wrote:
Non-sequitur"yeah, yeah, you don"t know anything about me but I"m the "them" of your "us/them" thinking, blah blah blah.

I'm sorry I don't know more about you, but I can only go off of what you write. If you privately understand the relationship between inequality and gun violence, that's great; it's just unfortunate that you chose to focus on factors you know are relatively insignificant or uncontrollable (half the population is bound to be male, for instance).

I think I understand the relationship between inequality and gun violence better than most, not as well as some, but I chose to talk about what the thread is about, which is race and gender in these school shootings. The gun violence we are talking about happens to be within the perpetrators social class, so the inequality issue just isn't applicable to this particular subset of the gun discussion.

I think you and inferno are both trying to get me to swing at curve balls that are outside the strike zone, and I'm just not taking a swing at them, that's all..
"It is one of the commonest of mistakes to consider that the limit of our power of perception is also the limit of all there is to perceive." " C. W. Leadbeater
CarefulNow
Posts: 780
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/16/2013 5:28:46 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/16/2013 3:33:38 PM, Sidewalker wrote:
I think I understand the relationship between inequality and gun violence better than most, not as well as some, but I chose to talk about what the thread is about, which is race and gender in these school shootings. The gun violence we are talking about happens to be within the perpetrators social class, so the inequality issue just isn't applicable to this particular subset of the gun discussion.

But your ignorance of class renders you incable of answering even the racial question. If you were to corner Obama and ask him if his reaction to Newtown is meant to tackle gun violence generally or just that perpetrated against students, you know as well as I he would insist on the former. But in reality, as you say, "we are all looking for answers" to "this phenomenon" of rich people dying instead of poor people. To anyone who permits himself to see that bias, the racial part of the profile isn't a mystery: whites are overrepresented in the relevant socioeconomic class. No racial essentialist BS necessary.
Sidewalker
Posts: 3,713
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/16/2013 6:25:35 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 1/16/2013 5:28:46 PM, CarefulNow wrote:
At 1/16/2013 3:33:38 PM, Sidewalker wrote:
I think I understand the relationship between inequality and gun violence better than most, not as well as some, but I chose to talk about what the thread is about, which is race and gender in these school shootings. The gun violence we are talking about happens to be within the perpetrators social class, so the inequality issue just isn't applicable to this particular subset of the gun discussion.

But your ignorance of class renders you incable of answering even the racial question. If you were to corner Obama and ask him if his reaction to Newtown is meant to tackle gun violence generally or just that perpetrated against students, you know as well as I he would insist on the former. But in reality, as you say, "we are all looking for answers" to "this phenomenon" of rich people dying instead of poor people. To anyone who permits himself to see that bias, the racial part of the profile isn't a mystery: whites are overrepresented in the relevant socioeconomic class. No racial essentialist BS necessary.

If you have a problem with what the thread is about why don't you take it up with inferno, it's his thread.

I don't really understand why inferno's thread get's you all bunged up, and I especially don't understand why you think I'm responsible for it. There's about a dozen gun control threads out there, lot's of different aspects of the problem are being being discussed, if inferno's thread isn't about what you want to discuss, why don't you just go find a thread that interests you?
"It is one of the commonest of mistakes to consider that the limit of our power of perception is also the limit of all there is to perceive." " C. W. Leadbeater