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Shame on Ron Paul

DoubtingDave
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2/6/2013 10:09:25 AM
Posted: 3 years ago

Former presidential candidate Ron Paul is taking heat for a tweet he sent out Monday afternoon about the Navy SEAL who was killed at a Texas gun range over the weekend.

Chris Kyle, 38, a decorated Iraq war veteran, a former SEAL and author of "American Sniper," was shot and killed Saturday. Police arrested Eddie Ray Routh, 25, a veteran authorities say may have a mental illness related to his military service.

In response to the news, Paul tweeted: "Chris Kyle"s death seems to confirm that "he who lives by the sword dies by the sword." Treating PTSD at a firing range doesn"t make sense."

The tweet set off a chain reaction of criticism online.

Aaron Worthing (@AaronWorthing) responded: "What the Hell, @RonPaul? Are you actually blaming Chris Kyle for his own death?"

Michelle Lancaster (@SkiGarmisch) added, "Very disrespectful commentary to this man, his memory and his family. Shame on you."


Read more: http://www.foxnews.com...

I am a Libertarian and use to greatly admire Ron Paul, but from what I have seen from him, this and many other things, I believe that Ron Paul is clearly a fraud. Ron Paul, you ought to be ashamed of yourself.
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GeoLaureate8
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2/6/2013 10:11:32 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
How is he a fraud?

It's no secret that Ron Paul is anti-war and a Christian. He quoted Jesus and condemned militaristic violence. How is that shocking?
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
ZakYoungTheLibertarian
Posts: 253
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2/6/2013 10:14:27 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
What goes around comes around. You spend half a decade murdering people who are trying to defend their country from your invasion, and then get murdered yourself. I've got one word for you :

Karma.
lewis20
Posts: 5,093
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2/6/2013 10:19:15 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
I remember when Ron Paul was booed loudly in on of the debates for his belief in the golden rule in the context of foreign policy.
"If you are a racist I will attack you with the north"- Abraham Lincoln

"Do not wear clothing woven of two kinds of material" - Leviticus 19 19

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lewis20
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2/6/2013 10:22:42 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/6/2013 10:09:25 AM, DoubtingDave wrote:
I am a Libertarian and use to greatly admire Ron Paul, but from what I have seen from him, this and many other things, I believe that Ron Paul is clearly a fraud. Ron Paul, you ought to be ashamed of yourself.

What did he say that makes him a fraud? He's clearly very anti-war. Or is it just that criticism of any US serviceman is always heresy.
"If you are a racist I will attack you with the north"- Abraham Lincoln

"Do not wear clothing woven of two kinds of material" - Leviticus 19 19

"War is a racket" - Smedley Butler
imabench
Posts: 21,204
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2/6/2013 10:32:50 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/6/2013 10:09:25 AM, DoubtingDave wrote:

Former presidential candidate Ron Paul is taking heat for a tweet he sent out Monday afternoon about the Navy SEAL who was killed at a Texas gun range over the weekend.

Chris Kyle, 38, a decorated Iraq war veteran, a former SEAL and author of "American Sniper," was shot and killed Saturday. Police arrested Eddie Ray Routh, 25, a veteran authorities say may have a mental illness related to his military service.

In response to the news, Paul tweeted: "Chris Kyle"s death seems to confirm that "he who lives by the sword dies by the sword." Treating PTSD at a firing range doesn"t make sense."

The tweet set off a chain reaction of criticism online.

Aaron Worthing (@AaronWorthing) responded: "What the Hell, @RonPaul? Are you actually blaming Chris Kyle for his own death?"

Michelle Lancaster (@SkiGarmisch) added, "Very disrespectful commentary to this man, his memory and his family. Shame on you."


Read more: http://www.foxnews.com...

I am a Libertarian and use to greatly admire Ron Paul, but from what I have seen from him, this and many other things, I believe that Ron Paul is clearly a fraud. Ron Paul, you ought to be ashamed of yourself.

I wouldn't call him a fraud, just someone who uses tragedies to further his own political agenda...

In other words, he's just like any other politician now...
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GeoLaureate8
Posts: 12,252
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2/6/2013 10:36:10 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
How did it further his own political agenda? If anything it set back his agenda.

How can you even say Ron Paul is a typical opportunistic politician when he says things in GOP debates that get him booed?
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
lewis20
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2/6/2013 10:38:10 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/6/2013 10:32:50 AM, imabench wrote::
I wouldn't call him a fraud, just someone who uses tragedies to further his own political agenda...

In other words, he's just like any other politician now...

Now? Now that he's not a politician and he's saying things he'd have said any time during his career?
"If you are a racist I will attack you with the north"- Abraham Lincoln

"Do not wear clothing woven of two kinds of material" - Leviticus 19 19

"War is a racket" - Smedley Butler
Noumena
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2/6/2013 11:00:08 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
Political agenda? I thought he was retired.
: At 5/13/2014 7:05:20 PM, Crescendo wrote:
: The difference is that the gay movement is currently pushing their will on Churches, as shown in the link to gay marriage in Denmark. Meanwhile, the Inquisition ended several centuries ago.
GeoLaureate8
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2/6/2013 11:02:14 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/6/2013 11:00:08 AM, Noumena wrote:
Political agenda? I thought he was retired.

He's still campaigning. He took over the Campaign for Liberty. He's doing a college tour around the nation this year.
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
Noumena
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2/6/2013 11:12:18 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/6/2013 11:06:15 AM, Danielle wrote:
Completely random: Rand Paul should be an embarrassment to his father.

True dat hombre.
: At 5/13/2014 7:05:20 PM, Crescendo wrote:
: The difference is that the gay movement is currently pushing their will on Churches, as shown in the link to gay marriage in Denmark. Meanwhile, the Inquisition ended several centuries ago.
ZakYoungTheLibertarian
Posts: 253
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2/6/2013 11:21:58 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
I'm not sure where I stand on Rand Paul. Is he just pandering to the GOP in order to secure the presidential nomination? Is he a pro war neocon in sheep's clothing? For now I'm in favour of him. Surely he's going to be better than any other potential candidate for president in 2016? Or are you guys and gals eager to see Joe Biden to take over the throne?
Noumena
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2/6/2013 11:32:53 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/6/2013 11:21:58 AM, ZakYoungTheLibertarian wrote:
I'm not sure where I stand on Rand Paul. Is he just pandering to the GOP in order to secure the presidential nomination?

If he is then that's the worst pandering I've ever seen. The GOP like their soldiers.

Is he a pro war neocon in sheep's clothing?

Opposite. He's an anti-war paleocon in leather clothing.

For now I'm in favour of him. Surely he's going to be better than any other potential candidate for president in 2016? Or are you guys and gals eager to see Joe Biden to take over the throne?

I didn't know Paul was running.
: At 5/13/2014 7:05:20 PM, Crescendo wrote:
: The difference is that the gay movement is currently pushing their will on Churches, as shown in the link to gay marriage in Denmark. Meanwhile, the Inquisition ended several centuries ago.
GeoLaureate8
Posts: 12,252
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2/6/2013 11:44:14 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
Rand Paul is very non-interventionist but he's also very practical with regards to the reality of our current situation. Rand Paul has an excellent stance on Foreign Policy and agree with it entirely (minus the pro-Israel comment, that was pandering).

Listen to his speech he just gave an hour ago laying out his views on Foreign Policy. He has a very detailed, knowledgeable and strategic outlook on Foreign Policy, his intelligence may surprise you here.

Video: Restoring the Founders Vision of Foreign Policy - Rand Paul
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
1Percenter
Posts: 781
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2/6/2013 11:55:54 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/6/2013 10:14:27 AM, ZakYoungTheLibertarian wrote:
What goes around comes around. You spend half a decade murdering people who are trying to defend their country from your invasion, and then get murdered yourself. I've got one word for you :


Karma.
Slap yourself.
1Percenter
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2/6/2013 11:59:42 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
Ron/Rand Paul are some of the most naive politicians when it comes to foreign policy. His tweets just confirm it even further.
Lordknukle
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2/6/2013 12:04:08 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
God forbid the largest serial killer and mass murderer in U.S. history is killed. Oh the horror!
"Easy is the descent to Avernus, for the door to the Underworld lies upon both day and night. But to retrace your steps and return to the breezes above- that's the task, that's the toil."
GeoLaureate8
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2/6/2013 12:18:06 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/6/2013 11:59:42 AM, 1Percenter wrote:
Ron/Rand Paul are some of the most naive politicians when it comes to foreign policy. His tweets just confirm it even further.

Did you watch Rand Paul's speech he gave today to the Heritage Foundation? No. That's why you're painfully ignorant of the fact that Rand Paul has incredible detailed knowledge of Foreign Policy.
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
darkkermit
Posts: 11,204
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2/6/2013 12:23:08 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/6/2013 11:59:42 AM, 1Percenter wrote:
Ron/Rand Paul are some of the most naive politicians when it comes to foreign policy. His tweets just confirm it even further.

Rand Paul is not his father. In terms of foreign policy, Rand Paul is much more aggressive then his father. Don't necessarily agree with it, but there's a clear difference. Rand Paul is quoted as saying "An attack on Israel is an attack on the US"
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GeoLaureate8
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2/6/2013 12:25:55 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
Full text Rand Paul's speech:

http://washingtonexaminer.com...
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
ax123man
Posts: 317
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2/6/2013 12:27:15 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/6/2013 10:09:25 AM, DoubtingDave wrote:

Former presidential candidate Ron Paul is taking heat for a tweet he sent out Monday afternoon about the Navy SEAL who was killed at a Texas gun range over the weekend.

Chris Kyle, 38, a decorated Iraq war veteran, a former SEAL and author of "American Sniper," was shot and killed Saturday. Police arrested Eddie Ray Routh, 25, a veteran authorities say may have a mental illness related to his military service.

In response to the news, Paul tweeted: "Chris Kyle"s death seems to confirm that "he who lives by the sword dies by the sword." Treating PTSD at a firing range doesn"t make sense."

The tweet set off a chain reaction of criticism online.

Aaron Worthing (@AaronWorthing) responded: "What the Hell, @RonPaul? Are you actually blaming Chris Kyle for his own death?"

Michelle Lancaster (@SkiGarmisch) added, "Very disrespectful commentary to this man, his memory and his family. Shame on you."


Read more: http://www.foxnews.com...

I am a Libertarian and use to greatly admire Ron Paul, but from what I have seen from him, this and many other things, I believe that Ron Paul is clearly a fraud. Ron Paul, you ought to be ashamed of yourself.

You're not much of a libertarian and you don't know Ron Paul. You are the one that's a fraud.

This is classic backlash you get from a population that has been brainwashed into a false belief in American Exceptionalism (as it relates to our military). If you're a libertarian, you might get a better understanding of how the system works by reading Hoppe's "The private production of defense". Here's how it works for politicians:

1) tax the crap out of the citizenry. if necessary, use fear mongering to further your agenda. If that doesn't work, use false flags
2) recruit the young, poor and unemployed to fight and die. It's all good, cuz you don't know any of these people
3) use the media to claim how "proud" you are of these poor fools you sent to die (for nothing). The super bowl works well for this
4) collect your (healthy) share of the pie
5) retire early

ps: it doesn't matter how much you screw up. There are too many stupid citizens that believe in American Exceptionalism.
GeoLaureate8
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2/6/2013 12:28:06 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/6/2013 12:23:08 PM, darkkermit wrote:
At 2/6/2013 11:59:42 AM, 1Percenter wrote:
Ron/Rand Paul are some of the most naive politicians when it comes to foreign policy. His tweets just confirm it even further.

Rand Paul is not his father. In terms of foreign policy, Rand Paul is much more aggressive then his father. Don't necessarily agree with it, but there's a clear difference.

Utterly false.

Rand Paul is quoted as saying "An attack on Israel is an attack on the US"

That was a rare moment of pandering after making a prior statement saying that he would cut foreign aid to Israel.
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
DanT
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2/6/2013 12:35:23 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/6/2013 10:11:32 AM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
How is he a fraud?

It's no secret that Ron Paul is anti-war and a Christian. He quoted Jesus and condemned militaristic violence. How is that shocking?

In everything other than war, he is conservative (he may even be nationalist). Ron Paul's foreign and military policy is based on Isolationist ideals. Like Pat Buchanan (who Ron Paul endorsed for President), Ron Paul is an isolationist. Pat Buchanan is a nationalist, who promotes isolationism, stricter immigration policy, Hamiltonian economics, and the replacement of the FED with a Hamiltonian National Bank.
"Chemical weapons are no different than any other types of weapons."~Lordknukle
DanT
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2/6/2013 12:40:05 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/6/2013 11:59:42 AM, 1Percenter wrote:
Ron/Rand Paul are some of the most naive politicians when it comes to foreign policy. His tweets just confirm it even further.

This;

Neutrality didn't work in the Napoleonic Wars (it resulted in the Quasi War, and the War of 1812), it did not work in WWI, and it did not work in WWII. Neutrality never works.

"Pacifism is objectively pro-Fascist. This is elementary common sense. If you hamper the war effort of one side you automatically help that of the other. Nor is there any real way of remaining outside such a war as the present one." ~ George Orwell.
"Chemical weapons are no different than any other types of weapons."~Lordknukle
GeoLaureate8
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2/6/2013 12:44:18 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/6/2013 12:35:23 PM, DanT wrote:
At 2/6/2013 10:11:32 AM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
How is he a fraud?

It's no secret that Ron Paul is anti-war and a Christian. He quoted Jesus and condemned militaristic violence. How is that shocking?

In everything other than war, he is conservative (he may even be nationalist). Ron Paul's foreign and military policy is based on Isolationist ideals. Like Pat Buchanan (who Ron Paul endorsed for President), Ron Paul is an isolationist. Pat Buchanan is a nationalist, who promotes isolationism, stricter immigration policy, Hamiltonian economics, and the replacement of the FED with a Hamiltonian National Bank.

False. Non-interventionism is a Conservative idea.

Look at this video of Ron Paul that Fox banned because he proved he's more Conservative than all the big Republicans.
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
lewis20
Posts: 5,093
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2/6/2013 12:49:06 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/6/2013 12:35:23 PM, DanT wrote:
In everything other than war, he is conservative (he may even be nationalist). Ron Paul's foreign and military policy is based on Isolationist ideals. Like Pat Buchanan (who Ron Paul endorsed for President), Ron Paul is an isolationist. Pat Buchanan is a nationalist, who promotes isolationism, stricter immigration policy, Hamiltonian economics, and the replacement of the FED with a Hamiltonian National Bank.

He's a non interventionist, not isolationist. You know better than that.

Isolationism is the " doctrine of isolating one's country from the affairs of other nations by declining to enter into alliances, foreign economic commitments, foreign trade, international agreements, etc"

non-interventionism "is the belief that political rulers should avoid entangling alliances with other nations and avoid all wars not related to direct territorial differences (self-defense). However, most non-interventionists are supporters of free trade, travel, and support certain international agreements, and therefore differ from isolationists."

As for war he is very much a conservative, a traditional conservative who's position is always to avoid war at all costs. Differing from neo-conservatives who are pro-war, pro big government.
"If you are a racist I will attack you with the north"- Abraham Lincoln

"Do not wear clothing woven of two kinds of material" - Leviticus 19 19

"War is a racket" - Smedley Butler
ax123man
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2/6/2013 12:51:20 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/6/2013 12:40:05 PM, DanT wrote:
At 2/6/2013 11:59:42 AM, 1Percenter wrote:
Ron/Rand Paul are some of the most naive politicians when it comes to foreign policy. His tweets just confirm it even further.

This;

Neutrality didn't work in the Napoleonic Wars (it resulted in the Quasi War, and the War of 1812), it did not work in WWI, and it did not work in WWII. Neutrality never works.

Huh? How do you define "work"? And how do you know it didn't "work" since we obviously got involved? WW1 was unnecessary and likely caused WW 2.


"Pacifism is objectively pro-Fascist. This is elementary common sense. If you hamper the war effort of one side you automatically help that of the other. Nor is there any real way of remaining outside such a war as the present one." ~ George Orwell.

Not sure if this is a statement regarding Paul, libertarians, or what but Paul's not a pacifist. And either am I or the libertarians I know.
lewis20
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2/6/2013 12:52:26 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 2/6/2013 12:40:05 PM, DanT wrote:
At 2/6/2013 11:59:42 AM, 1Percenter wrote:
Ron/Rand Paul are some of the most naive politicians when it comes to foreign policy. His tweets just confirm it even further.

This;

Neutrality didn't work in the Napoleonic Wars (it resulted in the Quasi War, and the War of 1812), it did not work in WWI, and it did not work in WWII. Neutrality never works.

How would we know if neutrality never works when we've never been neutral?
Neutrality works very well for the Swiss for some reason.
"If you are a racist I will attack you with the north"- Abraham Lincoln

"Do not wear clothing woven of two kinds of material" - Leviticus 19 19

"War is a racket" - Smedley Butler
lewis20
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2/6/2013 12:55:55 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
I'd also point out that it was released a few years ago that Paul isn't actually doing the tweeting. It's mainly his staffers and whoever else. Having said that I'm sure he believes and stands behind the statement just as if he'd been the one to tweet it.
"If you are a racist I will attack you with the north"- Abraham Lincoln

"Do not wear clothing woven of two kinds of material" - Leviticus 19 19

"War is a racket" - Smedley Butler