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Political stances?

AlbinoBunny
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3/11/2013 5:37:24 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
How can I figure out what my political stance is?
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ConservativeAmerican
Posts: 1,676
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3/11/2013 5:44:54 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/11/2013 5:37:24 PM, AlbinoBunny wrote:
How can I figure out what my political stance is?

There are multiple quizzes online, but if you are too lazy, here are some pivotal controversial points atm that would probably determine your stance:

-Gun rights (should they be limited, not at all, no gun rights, etc.)
- Taxation (Progressive, Flat, none, etc.)
- Gay Marriage Rights (For/Against)
- Immigration (Send all illegals back to where they came from, let them stay once they get here, enforce immigration laws with strict border enforcement, no immigration laws)
- Domestic Use of Drones (For/Against)
- Death Penalty (For/Against)
- Abortion (For, For in certain circumstances, against completely)
RoyLatham
Posts: 4,488
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3/11/2013 11:25:50 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
I think the litmus test is free market economics. If you favor free markets, you are a conservative. If not you are liberal. Beyond that if you want very little government, then moves you towards being a libertarian. More regulation and suppression of free enterprise move you towards socialism.

Social issues are not reliable predictors. Harry Reid is anti-abortion and is endorse by the National Rifle Association, but there is no doubt he is a liberal. Many libertarians are anti-abortion. It's the economic issues that tell.
FREEDO
Posts: 21,057
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3/11/2013 11:31:44 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/11/2013 11:25:50 PM, RoyLatham wrote:
I think the litmus test is free market economics. If you favor free markets, you are a conservative. If not you are liberal. Beyond that if you want very little government, then moves you towards being a libertarian. More regulation and suppression of free enterprise move you towards socialism.

Not I, nor several others on this form, fit into that paradigm.
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fnord
RoyLatham
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3/11/2013 11:45:27 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/11/2013 11:31:44 PM, FREEDO wrote:
At 3/11/2013 11:25:50 PM, RoyLatham wrote:
I think the litmus test is free market economics. If you favor free markets, you are a conservative. If not you are liberal. Beyond that if you want very little government, then moves you towards being a libertarian. More regulation and suppression of free enterprise move you towards socialism.

Not I, nor several others on this form, fit into that paradigm.

There is also a category for "confused" that tends to collect anarchists. The pattern is that they deplore all government in principle, but if you ask about any specific government program, they want more of it.

Anyway, do you think there are libertarians and conservatives who do not favor free markets? Or liberals and socialists who do not favor strong government regulation? I don't see it. Name some in Congress.
YYW
Posts: 36,335
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3/12/2013 12:05:59 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/11/2013 11:45:27 PM, RoyLatham wrote:
At 3/11/2013 11:31:44 PM, FREEDO wrote:
At 3/11/2013 11:25:50 PM, RoyLatham wrote:
I think the litmus test is free market economics. If you favor free markets, you are a conservative. If not you are liberal. Beyond that if you want very little government, then moves you towards being a libertarian. More regulation and suppression of free enterprise move you towards socialism.

Not I, nor several others on this form, fit into that paradigm.

There is also a category for "confused" that tends to collect anarchists. The pattern is that they deplore all government in principle, but if you ask about any specific government program, they want more of it.

Anyway, do you think there are libertarians and conservatives who do not favor free markets? Or liberals and socialists who do not favor strong government regulation? I don't see it. Name some in Congress.

Modern conservatism is philosophically predicated (1) on a resistance of governmental intrusion in the economic rights of individuals, (2) resistance to governmental regulation of markets and (3) resistance to social progression which is seen as societal moral deterioration.

The themes necessarily individualistic, and encompass maximized individual economic liberty, minimized government and moral integrity.

Modern Liberalism is philosophically predicated on (1) use of commonly pooled resources towards the advancement of social objectives for the benefit of individuals, (2) regulation of markets to prevent monopolization and the exploitation of the individual and (3) insistence on social progression which is seen as a moral imperative in the name of tolerance and pluralism.

The themes are at individually oriented in a collectivistic framework such that each individual may have the maximum amount of liberty consistent with the liberty of all other individuals.
Tsar of DDO
YYW
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3/12/2013 12:08:01 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/12/2013 12:06:35 AM, FREEDO wrote:
Well, I would definitely be confused.

What's to be confused about?
Tsar of DDO
FREEDO
Posts: 21,057
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3/12/2013 12:19:21 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/12/2013 12:08:01 AM, YYW wrote:
At 3/12/2013 12:06:35 AM, FREEDO wrote:
Well, I would definitely be confused.

What's to be confused about?

71
GRAND POOBAH OF DDO

fnord
suttichart.denpruektham
Posts: 1,115
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3/12/2013 12:27:12 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/11/2013 11:25:50 PM, RoyLatham wrote:
I think the litmus test is free market economics. If you favor free markets, you are a conservative. If not you are liberal. Beyond that if you want very little government, then moves you towards being a libertarian. More regulation and suppression of free enterprise move you towards socialism.

Social issues are not reliable predictors. Harry Reid is anti-abortion and is endorse by the National Rifle Association, but there is no doubt he is a liberal. Many libertarians are anti-abortion. It's the economic issues that tell.

If I like free market and strong protection of individual right but also strong and active government activity, where do I fit in?
MichaelGonzales
Posts: 211
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3/12/2013 12:36:10 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/12/2013 12:27:12 AM, suttichart.denpruektham wrote:
At 3/11/2013 11:25:50 PM, RoyLatham wrote:
I think the litmus test is free market economics. If you favor free markets, you are a conservative. If not you are liberal. Beyond that if you want very little government, then moves you towards being a libertarian. More regulation and suppression of free enterprise move you towards socialism.

Social issues are not reliable predictors. Harry Reid is anti-abortion and is endorse by the National Rifle Association, but there is no doubt he is a liberal. Many libertarians are anti-abortion. It's the economic issues that tell.

If I like free market and strong protection of individual right but also strong and active government activity, where do I fit in?

A left-leaning Libertarian, I would think.
YYW
Posts: 36,335
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3/12/2013 1:05:35 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/12/2013 12:27:12 AM, suttichart.denpruektham wrote:
At 3/11/2013 11:25:50 PM, RoyLatham wrote:
I think the litmus test is free market economics. If you favor free markets, you are a conservative. If not you are liberal. Beyond that if you want very little government, then moves you towards being a libertarian. More regulation and suppression of free enterprise move you towards socialism.

Social issues are not reliable predictors. Harry Reid is anti-abortion and is endorse by the National Rifle Association, but there is no doubt he is a liberal. Many libertarians are anti-abortion. It's the economic issues that tell.

If I like free market and strong protection of individual right but also strong and active government activity, where do I fit in?

Center-Left: Liberally inclined, but with conservative tendencies.
Tsar of DDO
YYW
Posts: 36,335
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3/12/2013 1:05:48 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/12/2013 12:36:10 AM, MichaelGonzales wrote:
At 3/12/2013 12:27:12 AM, suttichart.denpruektham wrote:
At 3/11/2013 11:25:50 PM, RoyLatham wrote:
I think the litmus test is free market economics. If you favor free markets, you are a conservative. If not you are liberal. Beyond that if you want very little government, then moves you towards being a libertarian. More regulation and suppression of free enterprise move you towards socialism.

Social issues are not reliable predictors. Harry Reid is anti-abortion and is endorse by the National Rifle Association, but there is no doubt he is a liberal. Many libertarians are anti-abortion. It's the economic issues that tell.

If I like free market and strong protection of individual right but also strong and active government activity, where do I fit in?

A left-leaning Libertarian, I would think.

No.
Tsar of DDO
YYW
Posts: 36,335
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3/12/2013 1:06:20 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/12/2013 12:19:21 AM, FREEDO wrote:
At 3/12/2013 12:08:01 AM, YYW wrote:
At 3/12/2013 12:06:35 AM, FREEDO wrote:
Well, I would definitely be confused.

What's to be confused about?

71

?
Tsar of DDO
suttichart.denpruektham
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3/12/2013 1:34:39 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
I initially thought that left will always go with liberal, what is the definition of right then?

on the second if you can explain both that would be good because I thought Left = liberal, right = conservative.
RyuuKyuzo
Posts: 3,074
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3/12/2013 1:42:40 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/12/2013 1:34:39 AM, suttichart.denpruektham wrote:
I initially thought that left will always go with liberal, what is the definition of right then?

on the second if you can explain both that would be good because I thought Left = liberal, right = conservative.

And the kicker is each of these terms means something a little different depending on which country you're talking about.

Here's a good place to start >> http://en.wikipedia.org...
If you're reading this, you're awesome and you should feel awesome.
FREEDO
Posts: 21,057
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3/12/2013 2:06:18 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/12/2013 1:06:20 AM, YYW wrote:
At 3/12/2013 12:19:21 AM, FREEDO wrote:
At 3/12/2013 12:08:01 AM, YYW wrote:
At 3/12/2013 12:06:35 AM, FREEDO wrote:
Well, I would definitely be confused.

What's to be confused about?

71

?

It's something to be confused about. Point in case.
GRAND POOBAH OF DDO

fnord
YYW
Posts: 36,335
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3/12/2013 2:42:57 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/12/2013 2:06:18 AM, FREEDO wrote:
At 3/12/2013 1:06:20 AM, YYW wrote:
At 3/12/2013 12:19:21 AM, FREEDO wrote:
At 3/12/2013 12:08:01 AM, YYW wrote:
At 3/12/2013 12:06:35 AM, FREEDO wrote:
Well, I would definitely be confused.

What's to be confused about?

71

?

It's something to be confused about. Point in case.

Fair enough. If I had an angry cat and you were within throwing distance, I might throw the cat at you... so that you are aware, lol.
Tsar of DDO
malcolmxy
Posts: 2,855
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3/12/2013 7:48:09 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/11/2013 11:25:50 PM, RoyLatham wrote:
I think the litmus test is free market economics. If you favor free markets, you are a conservative. If not you are liberal. Beyond that if you want very little government, then moves you towards being a libertarian. More regulation and suppression of free enterprise move you towards socialism.

Social issues are not reliable predictors. Harry Reid is anti-abortion and is endorse by the National Rifle Association, but there is no doubt he is a liberal. Many libertarians are anti-abortion. It's the economic issues that tell.

I am pro-free market for some things and anti-free market for others.

In fact, most people are. Very few people are so pro-free market that they believe law enforcement or fire abatement should be left to the free market.

What does that make me?

No one is completely anything...social AND economic issues shape a person's philosophy.

Olympia Snowe voted for The ACA...that's a decidedly social and economic issue that most consider to be liberal...Snowe was, of course, a Republican...who voted against her party @35% of the time.

Does that make her liberal?

In my mind, given what I know about the votes she's made, it makes her a free thinker who doesn't feel bound by the general opinion of her party, but instead weighs all the information available on any given legislation and then makes a decision, as opposed to most (on both sides of the aisle) who make up their mind before looking at any information or listening/participating in debate.

Frankly, I don't care what anybody is. I care about what they should be - independent.
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pozessed
Posts: 1,034
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3/12/2013 7:56:36 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/12/2013 7:48:09 AM, malcolmxy wrote:
At 3/11/2013 11:25:50 PM, RoyLatham wrote:
I think the litmus test is free market economics. If you favor free markets, you are a conservative. If not you are liberal. Beyond that if you want very little government, then moves you towards being a libertarian. More regulation and suppression of free enterprise move you towards socialism.

Social issues are not reliable predictors. Harry Reid is anti-abortion and is endorse by the National Rifle Association, but there is no doubt he is a liberal. Many libertarians are anti-abortion. It's the economic issues that tell.

I am pro-free market for some things and anti-free market for others.

In fact, most people are. Very few people are so pro-free market that they believe law enforcement or fire abatement should be left to the free market.

What does that make me?


No one is completely anything...social AND economic issues shape a person's philosophy.

Olympia Snowe voted for The ACA...that's a decidedly social and economic issue that most consider to be liberal...Snowe was, of course, a Republican...who voted against her party @35% of the time.

Does that make her liberal?

In my mind, given what I know about the votes she's made, it makes her a free thinker who doesn't feel bound by the general opinion of her party, but instead weighs all the information available on any given legislation and then makes a decision, as opposed to most (on both sides of the aisle) who make up their mind before looking at any information or listening/participating in debate.

Frankly, I don't care what anybody is. I care about what they should be - independent.

Kudos
MichaelGonzales
Posts: 211
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3/12/2013 1:13:03 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/12/2013 1:34:39 AM, suttichart.denpruektham wrote:
I initially thought that left will always go with liberal, what is the definition of right then?

on the second if you can explain both that would be good because I thought Left = liberal, right = conservative.

It's a full spectrum. Liberal and conservative are just some of the ideologies which rest in the left-right political spectrum.
ConservativeAmerican
Posts: 1,676
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3/12/2013 1:32:01 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/12/2013 1:13:03 PM, MichaelGonzales wrote:
At 3/12/2013 1:34:39 AM, suttichart.denpruektham wrote:
I initially thought that left will always go with liberal, what is the definition of right then?

on the second if you can explain both that would be good because I thought Left = liberal, right = conservative.

It's a full spectrum. Liberal and conservative are just some of the ideologies which rest in the left-right political spectrum.

Traditional, pure liberals simply want policy that maximizes the freedom of the individual in every aspect.

http://en.wikipedia.org...

Early liberals came along during the enlightenment age, when they rejected things (that are now typically universally rejected), like hereditary privilege, state religion, absolute monarchy, and the Divine Right of Kings

All things that I can respect, but obviously as time progressed they moved too far left. :P
ConservativeAmerican
Posts: 1,676
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3/12/2013 1:33:08 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/12/2013 1:32:01 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
At 3/12/2013 1:13:03 PM, MichaelGonzales wrote:
At 3/12/2013 1:34:39 AM, suttichart.denpruektham wrote:
I initially thought that left will always go with liberal, what is the definition of right then?

on the second if you can explain both that would be good because I thought Left = liberal, right = conservative.

It's a full spectrum. Liberal and conservative are just some of the ideologies which rest in the left-right political spectrum.

Traditional, pure liberals simply want policy that maximizes the freedom of the individual in every aspect.

http://en.wikipedia.org...

Early liberals came along during the enlightenment age, when they rejected things (that are now typically universally rejected), like hereditary privilege, state religion, absolute monarchy, and the Divine Right of Kings

All things that I can respect, but obviously as time progressed they moved too far left. :P

We no longer see traditional/classic liberalism, but social liberalism and the like.
MichaelGonzales
Posts: 211
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3/12/2013 1:44:22 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/12/2013 1:32:01 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
All things that I can respect, but obviously as time progressed they moved too far left. :P

Some things, yes. Some things, no. This country, as a whole, is still very very far right compared to the rest of the world. Even our left is center-right compared to the rest of the world. The only true "lefties" we have, such as Dennis Kucinich or Naom Chomsky, are barely listened to or taken seriously. We should not be debating global warming. We should not be debating evolution. Creationism isn't a separate, yet equal theory to the origin of life. We put forth this false equivalency in this country, and that's part of the reason we are so far right. We try to give both sides some sort of equal merit as-if both sides were right. That's not the case. Now, I'm not saying that everything to the left is correct, nor am I saying that about everything to the right. However, some very basic things in this country, such as healthcare, can't be overhauled without hyperbole and verbal gymnastics.
Noumena
Posts: 6,047
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3/12/2013 1:51:07 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/12/2013 1:44:22 PM, MichaelGonzales wrote:
At 3/12/2013 1:32:01 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
All things that I can respect, but obviously as time progressed they moved too far left. :P

Some things, yes. Some things, no. This country, as a whole, is still very very far right compared to the rest of the world. Even our left is center-right compared to the rest of the world. The only true "lefties" we have, such as Dennis Kucinich or Naom Chomsky, are barely listened to or taken seriously. We should not be debating global warming. We should not be debating evolution. Creationism isn't a separate, yet equal theory to the origin of life. We put forth this false equivalency in this country, and that's part of the reason we are so far right. We try to give both sides some sort of equal merit as-if both sides were right. That's not the case. Now, I'm not saying that everything to the left is correct, nor am I saying that about everything to the right. However, some very basic things in this country, such as healthcare, can't be overhauled without hyperbole and verbal gymnastics.

Lol@ the focus on scientific issues in politics. Creationism and evolution have no real political bearing on anything, save for who some hick in Missouri will vote for in Congress.
: At 5/13/2014 7:05:20 PM, Crescendo wrote:
: The difference is that the gay movement is currently pushing their will on Churches, as shown in the link to gay marriage in Denmark. Meanwhile, the Inquisition ended several centuries ago.
Noumena
Posts: 6,047
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3/12/2013 1:54:51 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/11/2013 11:45:27 PM, RoyLatham wrote:

There is also a category for "confused" that tends to collect anarchists. The pattern is that they deplore all government in principle, but if you ask about any specific government program, they want more of it.

I've noticed that about a lot of anarchists actually. In particular Noam Chomsky advocates a lot of State action to combat corporate control of policy. Yet it seems odd that he simultaneously accepts what most right-anarchists accept- that pro-corporate public choice problems pervade any State system. Everyone's consistent. Some though are more consistent than others.

Anyway, do you think there are libertarians and conservatives who do not favor free markets? Or liberals and socialists who do not favor strong government regulation? I don't see it. Name some in Congress.

Socialists who don't favor strong government regulation? I can't think of any in Congress but thinkers like Spooner, Tucker, Carson and the mess of market-oriented libertarian socialists absolutely favor(ed) one without the other. Socialism doesn't conceptually presuppose government regulation or activity.
: At 5/13/2014 7:05:20 PM, Crescendo wrote:
: The difference is that the gay movement is currently pushing their will on Churches, as shown in the link to gay marriage in Denmark. Meanwhile, the Inquisition ended several centuries ago.
suttichart.denpruektham
Posts: 1,115
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3/13/2013 11:48:50 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/12/2013 1:32:01 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
At 3/12/2013 1:13:03 PM, MichaelGonzales wrote:
At 3/12/2013 1:34:39 AM, suttichart.denpruektham wrote:
I initially thought that left will always go with liberal, what is the definition of right then?

on the second if you can explain both that would be good because I thought Left = liberal, right = conservative.

It's a full spectrum. Liberal and conservative are just some of the ideologies which rest in the left-right political spectrum.

Traditional, pure liberals simply want policy that maximizes the freedom of the individual in every aspect.

http://en.wikipedia.org...

Early liberals came along during the enlightenment age, when they rejected things (that are now typically universally rejected), like hereditary privilege, state religion, absolute monarchy, and the Divine Right of Kings

All things that I can respect, but obviously as time progressed they moved too far left. :P

I think I will vote for absolute monarchy, if the monarch is absolutely capable, Guess I am not so liberal after all.
ConservativeAmerican
Posts: 1,676
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3/13/2013 12:45:14 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/12/2013 1:44:22 PM, MichaelGonzales wrote:
At 3/12/2013 1:32:01 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
All things that I can respect, but obviously as time progressed they moved too far left. :P

Some things, yes. Some things, no. This country, as a whole, is still very very far right compared to the rest of the world. Even our left is center-right compared to the rest of the world. The only true "lefties" we have, such as Dennis Kucinich or Naom Chomsky, are barely listened to or taken seriously. We should not be debating global warming. We should not be debating evolution. Creationism isn't a separate, yet equal theory to the origin of life. We put forth this false equivalency in this country, and that's part of the reason we are so far right. We try to give both sides some sort of equal merit as-if both sides were right. That's not the case. Now, I'm not saying that everything to the left is correct, nor am I saying that about everything to the right. However, some very basic things in this country, such as healthcare, can't be overhauled without hyperbole and verbal gymnastics.

Agreed with you up until healthcare. :p
ConservativeAmerican
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3/13/2013 12:48:03 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 3/13/2013 11:48:50 AM, suttichart.denpruektham wrote:
At 3/12/2013 1:32:01 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
At 3/12/2013 1:13:03 PM, MichaelGonzales wrote:
At 3/12/2013 1:34:39 AM, suttichart.denpruektham wrote:
I initially thought that left will always go with liberal, what is the definition of right then?

on the second if you can explain both that would be good because I thought Left = liberal, right = conservative.

It's a full spectrum. Liberal and conservative are just some of the ideologies which rest in the left-right political spectrum.

Traditional, pure liberals simply want policy that maximizes the freedom of the individual in every aspect.

http://en.wikipedia.org...

Early liberals came along during the enlightenment age, when they rejected things (that are now typically universally rejected), like hereditary privilege, state religion, absolute monarchy, and the Divine Right of Kings

All things that I can respect, but obviously as time progressed they moved too far left. :P

I think I will vote for absolute monarchy, if the monarch is absolutely capable, Guess I am not so liberal after all.

I would be fine with monarchy, but even the best of leaders can let power get to their head if they are in an unopposed position with no checks and balances until they die.