Total Posts:23|Showing Posts:1-23
Jump to topic:

Ding dong the witch is dead :(

Thaddeus
Posts: 6,985
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/8/2013 8:43:55 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
So dear old maggie has slipped the mortal coil, she's pushing up the daisies and she has ceased to be. she was alright really. A damn sight better than those after her and many before her.
muzebreak
Posts: 2,781
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/8/2013 9:37:41 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
Yeah, a guy in my college class was rejoicing. My mother loved her though, so I wonder how she is going to react. I don't know much about her, why do you hate her?
"Every kid starts out as a natural-born scientist, and then we beat it out of them. A few trickle through the system with their wonder and enthusiasm for science intact." - Carl Sagan

This is the response of the defenders of Sparta to the Commander of the Roman Army: "If you are a god, you will not hurt those who have never injured you. If you are a man, advance - you will find men equal to yourself. And women.
unitedandy
Posts: 1,173
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/8/2013 9:53:51 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
Let's just say I disagree with everything she stood for (to put very, very mildly). But folk rejoicing at her death is just dehumanising. I think those (like myself) who despise Thatcherism should be compassionate enough to let her family grieve before judging her legacy, at least publicly.

That being said, the inevitable historical revisionism surrounding Thatcher is outrageous. Obama calling her a champion of freedom, for instance is just complete ignorance of the facts.
Thaddeus
Posts: 6,985
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/8/2013 10:22:27 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 4/8/2013 9:37:41 AM, muzebreak wrote:
Yeah, a guy in my college class was rejoicing. My mother loved her though, so I wonder how she is going to react. I don't know much about her, why do you hate her?

I dont hate her. She was the best pm in the last 50 years
Citrakayah
Posts: 1,500
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/8/2013 11:22:45 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 4/8/2013 9:53:51 AM, unitedandy wrote:
Let's just say I disagree with everything she stood for (to put very, very mildly). But folk rejoicing at her death is just dehumanising. I think those (like myself) who despise Thatcherism should be compassionate enough to let her family grieve before judging her legacy, at least publicly.

That being said, the inevitable historical revisionism surrounding Thatcher is outrageous. Obama calling her a champion of freedom, for instance is just complete ignorance of the facts.

Seconded, for the most part. Granted, she was hardly the most compassionate individual, and apparently had no problem with endorsing policies that resulted in large numbers of people suffering on the grounds that it was somehow 'their fault' but that would be a reason to rejoice at her not being in office--not at her death.
lewis20
Posts: 5,093
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/8/2013 12:00:14 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 4/8/2013 9:53:51 AM, unitedandy wrote:
Let's just say I disagree with everything she stood for (to put very, very mildly). But folk rejoicing at her death is just dehumanising. I think those (like myself) who despise Thatcherism should be compassionate enough to let her family grieve before judging her legacy, at least publicly.

That being said, the inevitable historical revisionism surrounding Thatcher is outrageous. Obama calling her a champion of freedom, for instance is just complete ignorance of the facts.

Obama is ignorant of the tacts eh? Say it ain't so
"If you are a racist I will attack you with the north"- Abraham Lincoln

"Do not wear clothing woven of two kinds of material" - Leviticus 19 19

"War is a racket" - Smedley Butler
GeoLaureate8
Posts: 12,252
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/8/2013 12:14:31 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
"The problem with socialism is eventually you will run out of other people's money."
-- Margaret Thatcher
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
muzebreak
Posts: 2,781
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/8/2013 12:18:10 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 4/8/2013 10:22:27 AM, Thaddeus wrote:
At 4/8/2013 9:37:41 AM, muzebreak wrote:
Yeah, a guy in my college class was rejoicing. My mother loved her though, so I wonder how she is going to react. I don't know much about her, why do you hate her?

I dont hate her. She was the best pm in the last 50 years

Sorry the "ding dong the witch is dead" threw me off.
"Every kid starts out as a natural-born scientist, and then we beat it out of them. A few trickle through the system with their wonder and enthusiasm for science intact." - Carl Sagan

This is the response of the defenders of Sparta to the Commander of the Roman Army: "If you are a god, you will not hurt those who have never injured you. If you are a man, advance - you will find men equal to yourself. And women.
unitedandy
Posts: 1,173
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/8/2013 12:22:46 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 4/8/2013 12:00:14 PM, lewis20 wrote:
At 4/8/2013 9:53:51 AM, unitedandy wrote:
Let's just say I disagree with everything she stood for (to put very, very mildly). But folk rejoicing at her death is just dehumanising. I think those (like myself) who despise Thatcherism should be compassionate enough to let her family grieve before judging her legacy, at least publicly.

That being said, the inevitable historical revisionism surrounding Thatcher is outrageous. Obama calling her a champion of freedom, for instance is just complete ignorance of the facts.

Obama is ignorant of the tacts eh? Say it ain't so

He's just one of the examples in the business of rewriting history, but I take your point.
BigRat
Posts: 465
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/8/2013 3:58:46 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 4/8/2013 9:53:51 AM, unitedandy wrote:
Let's just say I disagree with everything she stood for (to put very, very mildly). But folk rejoicing at her death is just dehumanising. I think those (like myself) who despise Thatcherism should be compassionate enough to let her family grieve before judging her legacy, at least publicly.

That being said, the inevitable historical revisionism surrounding Thatcher is outrageous. Obama calling her a champion of freedom, for instance is just complete ignorance of the facts.

Let us not forget that Thatcher's economic policies were very successful.

The pre Thatcher UK was on its way to being one of the poorest countries in Europe. Thatcher's policies allowed growth to be restored.
Citrakayah
Posts: 1,500
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/8/2013 4:41:57 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 4/8/2013 12:14:31 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
"The problem with socialism is eventually you will run out of other people's money."
-- Margaret Thatcher

That's not correct. A socialist country can be self-sustaining.
OberHerr
Posts: 13,062
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/8/2013 4:46:09 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 4/8/2013 4:41:57 PM, Citrakayah wrote:
At 4/8/2013 12:14:31 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
"The problem with socialism is eventually you will run out of other people's money."
-- Margaret Thatcher

That's not correct. A socialist country can be self-sustaining.

Big can.
-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-OBERHERR'S SIGNATURE-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-

Official Enforcer for the DDO Elite(if they existed).

"Cases are anti-town." - FourTrouble

-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-
Thaddeus
Posts: 6,985
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/8/2013 4:50:42 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 4/8/2013 9:53:51 AM, unitedandy wrote:
That being said, the inevitable historical revisionism surrounding Thatcher is outrageous. Obama calling her a champion of freedom, for instance is just complete ignorance of the facts.

Lol?
Economic freedom is pretty damn important too y'know. To quote the dead bitch; "there can be no liberty without economic liberty"
Lordknukle
Posts: 12,788
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/8/2013 4:51:35 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 4/8/2013 4:41:57 PM, Citrakayah wrote:
At 4/8/2013 12:14:31 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
"The problem with socialism is eventually you will run out of other people's money."
-- Margaret Thatcher

That's not correct. A socialist country can be self-sustaining.

For a short-term period, yes. No way in hell can it sustain itself over a long period of time.
"Easy is the descent to Avernus, for the door to the Underworld lies upon both day and night. But to retrace your steps and return to the breezes above- that's the task, that's the toil."
Mustachero
Posts: 84
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/8/2013 5:08:04 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 4/8/2013 4:51:35 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
At 4/8/2013 4:41:57 PM, Citrakayah wrote:
At 4/8/2013 12:14:31 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
"The problem with socialism is eventually you will run out of other people's money."
-- Margaret Thatcher

That's not correct. A socialist country can be self-sustaining.

For a short-term period, yes. No way in hell can it sustain itself over a long period of time.

Just look at Quebec, that's the flip side of socialism. Here we've been "progressives" (maybe not consistently) for the last 40 years and what do we have to show for it? Not a whole lot. Maybe just the most corrupt government in Canada, ridiculous social programs such as an IVF clinic in montreal which the province gives 70 MILLION dollars a year, the cheapest tuition and lowest college enrollment in Canada, and the list just goes on and on.
unitedandy
Posts: 1,173
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/9/2013 1:32:25 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 4/8/2013 3:58:46 PM, BigRat wrote:
At 4/8/2013 9:53:51 AM, unitedandy wrote:
Let's just say I disagree with everything she stood for (to put very, very mildly). But folk rejoicing at her death is just dehumanising. I think those (like myself) who despise Thatcherism should be compassionate enough to let her family grieve before judging her legacy, at least publicly.

That being said, the inevitable historical revisionism surrounding Thatcher is outrageous. Obama calling her a champion of freedom, for instance is just complete ignorance of the facts.


Let us not forget that Thatcher's economic policies were very successful.

The pre Thatcher UK was on its way to being one of the poorest countries in Europe. Thatcher's policies allowed growth to be restored.

If you are a fan of things like destroying industry, increasing (yes, that's increasing) the welfare bill and mass unemployment, Thatcherism has been wonderful. Given that you've defended Pinochet's record, I'd imagine the huge inequalities that this led to is also something to cheer, as well as remaking Britain in the image of the service sector (particularly the financial market). Just as well that's worked out over the past few years.

In the real world, creating generational unemployment in large parts of the nation for ideological purposes is far less fun than you'd think. Also judging Thatcherism as successful because it made money in the short term (wholly due to selling off these "unsustainable" industries on the cheap and using the profits from underselling oil) is silly.
Greyparrot
Posts: 14,337
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/9/2013 1:33:02 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 4/8/2013 4:41:57 PM, Citrakayah wrote:
At 4/8/2013 12:14:31 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
"The problem with socialism is eventually you will run out of other people's money."
-- Margaret Thatcher

That's not correct. A socialist country can be self-sustaining.

Well if taxes along with public expectations about what the government could sustainably provide were kept reasonably low, then yes, this statement is true.
unitedandy
Posts: 1,173
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/9/2013 1:37:40 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 4/8/2013 4:50:42 PM, Thaddeus wrote:
At 4/8/2013 9:53:51 AM, unitedandy wrote:
That being said, the inevitable historical revisionism surrounding Thatcher is outrageous. Obama calling her a champion of freedom, for instance is just complete ignorance of the facts.

Lol?
Economic freedom is pretty damn important too y'know. To quote the dead bitch; "there can be no liberty without economic liberty"

My own hero from the Thatcher era answers this point, even conceding that she did instill this (which I'd dispute).
BigRat
Posts: 465
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/9/2013 6:03:57 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 4/9/2013 1:32:25 AM, unitedandy wrote:
At 4/8/2013 3:58:46 PM, BigRat wrote:
At 4/8/2013 9:53:51 AM, unitedandy wrote:
Let's just say I disagree with everything she stood for (to put very, very mildly). But folk rejoicing at her death is just dehumanising. I think those (like myself) who despise Thatcherism should be compassionate enough to let her family grieve before judging her legacy, at least publicly.

That being said, the inevitable historical revisionism surrounding Thatcher is outrageous. Obama calling her a champion of freedom, for instance is just complete ignorance of the facts.


Let us not forget that Thatcher's economic policies were very successful.

The pre Thatcher UK was on its way to being one of the poorest countries in Europe. Thatcher's policies allowed growth to be restored.

If you are a fan of things like destroying industry, increasing (yes, that's increasing) the welfare bill and mass unemployment, Thatcherism has been wonderful. Given that you've defended Pinochet's record, I'd imagine the huge inequalities that this led to is also something to cheer, as well as remaking Britain in the image of the service sector (particularly the financial market). Just as well that's worked out over the past few years.

When did I defend Pinochet?

I don't believe I did on DDO. But, if you find evidence to the contrary, I will agree as Pinochet's economic policies were a success.

Getting rid of crony capitalism and state owned industry that were immune for competitive pressures and kept alive by state support and replacing them with industries that are forced to compete on a market is not "destroying industry". It is saving an economy.

And, there is nothing wrong with a shift towards service based employment. Just like there was nothing wrong with a shift away from agriculture and towards manufacturing.

In fact, I would say it reflects an increase in the standard of living.


In the real world, creating generational unemployment in large parts of the nation for ideological purposes is far less fun than you'd think. Also judging Thatcherism as successful because it made money in the short term (wholly due to selling off these "unsustainable" industries on the cheap and using the profits from underselling oil) is silly.

Except, Thatcherism allowed Britain to increase their employment. If you want to see a developed country plagued by persistent high unemployment, look at the more socialized France, which I would assume you think has a better economic model than the UK.

And, the UK has had sustained, strong economic performance in the post Thatcher years.

It really is unbelievable that some people think state owned enterprises and 83% tax rates are good economic policies.
Citrakayah
Posts: 1,500
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/11/2013 8:49:07 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 4/9/2013 6:03:57 PM, BigRat wrote:
When did I defend Pinochet?

You didn't. You started to but forfeited every single round of a five round debate, remember?

Oh, and if you're defending Pinochet, and saying he had good ideas, does that mean I can say your principles have common ideological backing as his? Because that's what you've been doing with progressivism and fascism.