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Happy Fourth of July

1Historygenius
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7/4/2013 12:48:37 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
I hope all of you have a grat time of the greatest day in our nation's history. The day we declared independence to stop those tyrannical taxes and stood up for life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness! God bless America! I hope all of you pray for our country!
"The chief business of the American people is business." - Calvin Coolidge

Latest debate - Reagan was a better President than Obama: http://www.debate.org...
Lordknukle
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7/4/2013 3:29:21 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
It's simple; we kill the Batman.
"Easy is the descent to Avernus, for the door to the Underworld lies upon both day and night. But to retrace your steps and return to the breezes above- that's the task, that's the toil."
DetectableNinja
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7/4/2013 3:32:21 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
No.

I celebrate Independence Day as much as the next guy. But seriously. it wasn't as simple as us standing up to "tyrannical taxation and preserving liberty" or whatever.

PS: I respectfully will not be praying for the country. I'm fine jubilating.
Think'st thou heaven is such a glorious thing?
I tell thee, 'tis not half so fair as thou
Or any man that breathes on earth.

- Christopher Marlowe, Doctor Faustus
DanT
Posts: 5,693
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7/4/2013 4:05:53 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 7/4/2013 3:32:21 PM, DetectableNinja wrote:
No.

I celebrate Independence Day as much as the next guy. But seriously. it wasn't as simple as us standing up to "tyrannical taxation and preserving liberty" or whatever.

The colonies were taxed before. What was new about the stamp act was that it imposed direct taxes on the colonies for the first time; prior to which the colonies were only taxed indirectly.

Modern Historians often claim the taxes were insignificant, but they fail to take into account the recession caused by the Bank of England.

As Franklin put it, "The Colonies would gladly have borne the little tax on tea and other matters, had it not been the poverty caused by the bad influence of the English bankers on the Parliament: which has caused in the Colonies hatred of England, and the Revolutionary War."

Prior to the currency act of 1764 Franklin said that "In the Colonies we issue our own money. It is called Colonial Scrip. We issue it in proper proportion to make the products pass easily from the producers to the consumers. In this manner, creating ourselves our own paper money, we control its purchasing power, and we have no interest to pay to no one." noting that it would have been "Impossible to find a happier and more prosperous population on all the surface of the globe."

After the coinage act was passed Franklin said "In one year, the conditions were so reversed that the era of prosperity ended, and a depression set in, to such an extent that the streets of the Colonies were filled with unemployed."

Conditions got worse when the British began restricting colonial trade. The British assumed control of the East India Trading Company via the Regulating Act of 1773 aka "An Act for establishing certain Regulations for the better Management of the Affairs of the East India Company, as well in India as in Europe". Also in 1773 the Tea act was passed, which resulted in the Boston Tea Party.

The reason the colonies opposed the Tea Act was because it eliminated the middle man, thereby putting many legitimate merchants out of business. The Tea act also placed many other financial burdens on the colonies.

As a result of the Boston tea party the British closed Boston Harbor via a blockade. This obliterated what remained of the economy in Massachusetts.

The growing military action against the colonies pushed us into war. The first battle of the revolution took place because;
A.) the British were ordered to seize colonial arms.
and
B.) the British were ordered to arrest President Hancock and other members of the Continental Congress.

PS: I respectfully will not be praying for the country. I'm fine jubilating.

PS means post script
"Chemical weapons are no different than any other types of weapons."~Lordknukle
charleslb
Posts: 4,740
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7/4/2013 4:24:14 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 7/4/2013 12:48:37 PM, 1Historygenius wrote:
I hope all of you have a grat time of the greatest day in our nation's history. The day we declared independence to stop those tyrannical taxes and stood up for life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness! God bless America! I hope all of you pray for our country!

Yes, happy 4th everyone, but, http://www.debate.org...
Yo, all of my subliterate conservative criticasters who find perusing and processing the sesquipedalian verbiage of my posts to be such a bothersome brain-taxing chore, I have a new nickname for you. Henceforth you shall be known as Pooh Bears. No, not for the obvious apt reasons, i.e., not because you're full of pooh, and not because of your ursine irritability. Rather, you put me in mind of an A.A. Milne quote, "I am a Bear of Very Little Brain, and long words bother me". Love ya, Pooh Bears.
1Historygenius
Posts: 1,639
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7/4/2013 5:08:47 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 7/4/2013 4:24:14 PM, charleslb wrote:
At 7/4/2013 12:48:37 PM, 1Historygenius wrote:
I hope all of you have a grat time of the greatest day in our nation's history. The day we declared independence to stop those tyrannical taxes and stood up for life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness! God bless America! I hope all of you pray for our country!

Yes, happy 4th everyone, but, http://www.debate.org...

Nevertheless, it's our Independence Day! The most important day in our history!
"The chief business of the American people is business." - Calvin Coolidge

Latest debate - Reagan was a better President than Obama: http://www.debate.org...
Subutai
Posts: 3,213
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7/4/2013 5:12:54 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 7/4/2013 4:24:14 PM, charleslb wrote:
At 7/4/2013 12:48:37 PM, 1Historygenius wrote:
I hope all of you have a grat time of the greatest day in our nation's history. The day we declared independence to stop those tyrannical taxes and stood up for life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness! God bless America! I hope all of you pray for our country!

Yes, happy 4th everyone, but, http://www.debate.org...

Go take your holiday bashing somewhere else.
I'm becoming less defined as days go by, fading away, and well you might say, I'm losing focus, kinda drifting into the abstract in terms of how I see myself.
THE_OPINIONATOR
Posts: 575
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7/4/2013 5:17:54 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
We the people of the United States, in order to form a more perfect union, establish justice, insure domestic tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general welfare, and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America. -Preamble to the U.S Constitution

WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO AMERICA :D
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charleslb
Posts: 4,740
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7/4/2013 7:56:11 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 7/4/2013 5:12:54 PM, Subutai wrote:
At 7/4/2013 4:24:14 PM, charleslb wrote:
At 7/4/2013 12:48:37 PM, 1Historygenius wrote:
I hope all of you have a grat time of the greatest day in our nation's history. The day we declared independence to stop those tyrannical taxes and stood up for life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness! God bless America! I hope all of you pray for our country!

Yes, happy 4th everyone, but, http://www.debate.org...

Go take your holiday bashing somewhere else.

An intolerant response. Go take your intolerance and ...
Yo, all of my subliterate conservative criticasters who find perusing and processing the sesquipedalian verbiage of my posts to be such a bothersome brain-taxing chore, I have a new nickname for you. Henceforth you shall be known as Pooh Bears. No, not for the obvious apt reasons, i.e., not because you're full of pooh, and not because of your ursine irritability. Rather, you put me in mind of an A.A. Milne quote, "I am a Bear of Very Little Brain, and long words bother me". Love ya, Pooh Bears.
DetectableNinja
Posts: 6,043
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7/4/2013 8:28:40 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 7/4/2013 5:08:47 PM, 1Historygenius wrote:
At 7/4/2013 4:24:14 PM, charleslb wrote:
At 7/4/2013 12:48:37 PM, 1Historygenius wrote:
I hope all of you have a grat time of the greatest day in our nation's history. The day we declared independence to stop those tyrannical taxes and stood up for life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness! God bless America! I hope all of you pray for our country!

Yes, happy 4th everyone, but, http://www.debate.org...

Nevertheless, it's our Independence Day! The most important day in our history!

That's debatable. Probably when the Treaty of Paris. THAT I could see as the most important day in our history.
Think'st thou heaven is such a glorious thing?
I tell thee, 'tis not half so fair as thou
Or any man that breathes on earth.

- Christopher Marlowe, Doctor Faustus
charleslb
Posts: 4,740
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7/4/2013 8:46:46 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 7/4/2013 8:28:40 PM, DetectableNinja wrote:
At 7/4/2013 5:08:47 PM, 1Historygenius wrote:
At 7/4/2013 4:24:14 PM, charleslb wrote:
At 7/4/2013 12:48:37 PM, 1Historygenius wrote:
I hope all of you have a grat time of the greatest day in our nation's history. The day we declared independence to stop those tyrannical taxes and stood up for life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness! God bless America! I hope all of you pray for our country!

Yes, happy 4th everyone, but, http://www.debate.org...

Nevertheless, it's our Independence Day! The most important day in our history!

That's debatable. Probably when the Treaty of Paris. THAT I could see as the most important day in our history.

Or how about the day during the Cuban missle crisis when matters turned in the direction of not initiating a nuclear conflagration that would have ended the United States?
Yo, all of my subliterate conservative criticasters who find perusing and processing the sesquipedalian verbiage of my posts to be such a bothersome brain-taxing chore, I have a new nickname for you. Henceforth you shall be known as Pooh Bears. No, not for the obvious apt reasons, i.e., not because you're full of pooh, and not because of your ursine irritability. Rather, you put me in mind of an A.A. Milne quote, "I am a Bear of Very Little Brain, and long words bother me". Love ya, Pooh Bears.
1Historygenius
Posts: 1,639
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7/4/2013 8:54:32 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 7/4/2013 8:46:46 PM, charleslb wrote:
At 7/4/2013 8:28:40 PM, DetectableNinja wrote:
At 7/4/2013 5:08:47 PM, 1Historygenius wrote:
At 7/4/2013 4:24:14 PM, charleslb wrote:
At 7/4/2013 12:48:37 PM, 1Historygenius wrote:
I hope all of you have a grat time of the greatest day in our nation's history. The day we declared independence to stop those tyrannical taxes and stood up for life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness! God bless America! I hope all of you pray for our country!

Yes, happy 4th everyone, but, http://www.debate.org...

Nevertheless, it's our Independence Day! The most important day in our history!

That's debatable. Probably when the Treaty of Paris. THAT I could see as the most important day in our history.

Or how about the day during the Cuban missle crisis when matters turned in the direction of not initiating a nuclear conflagration that would have ended the United States?

The day of the independence was the very birth of our nation. With that, we set our course as a role model against tyranny. We shattered the myth of British imperial dominance. We now could expand west in our own, going from sea to shining sea. Without the United States, who's to say there would even be a Cold War?
"The chief business of the American people is business." - Calvin Coolidge

Latest debate - Reagan was a better President than Obama: http://www.debate.org...
Contra
Posts: 3,941
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7/4/2013 11:26:01 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 7/4/2013 8:49:39 PM, rockwater wrote:
On this Fourth of July, I have to say, God bless taxes!

God bless America. This nation is great because of our unique freedom and diverse culture.

Taxes shouldn't be applauded.
"The solution [for Republicans] is to admit that Bush was a bad president, stop this racist homophobic stuff, stop trying to give most of the tax cuts to the rich, propose a real alternative to Obamacare that actually works, and propose smart free market solutions to our economic problems." - Distraff

"Americans are better off in a dynamic, free-enterprise-based economy that fosters economic growth, opportunity and upward mobility." - Paul Ryan
charleslb
Posts: 4,740
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7/4/2013 11:59:50 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 7/4/2013 8:54:32 PM, 1Historygenius wrote:
At 7/4/2013 8:46:46 PM, charleslb wrote:
At 7/4/2013 8:28:40 PM, DetectableNinja wrote:
At 7/4/2013 5:08:47 PM, 1Historygenius wrote:
At 7/4/2013 4:24:14 PM, charleslb wrote:
At 7/4/2013 12:48:37 PM, 1Historygenius wrote:
I hope all of you have a grat time of the greatest day in our nation's history. The day we declared independence to stop those tyrannical taxes and stood up for life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness! God bless America! I hope all of you pray for our country!

Yes, happy 4th everyone, but, http://www.debate.org...

Nevertheless, it's our Independence Day! The most important day in our history!

That's debatable. Probably when the Treaty of Paris. THAT I could see as the most important day in our history.

Or how about the day during the Cuban missle crisis when matters turned in the direction of not initiating a nuclear conflagration that would have ended the United States?

... we set our course as a role model against tyranny...

LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

We shattered the myth of British imperial dominance.

And eventually went on to replace the British Empire as the dominant imperialistic power with delusions of benevolence.

We now could expand west in our own, going from sea to shining sea.

Internal imperialism that entailed the ethnic cleansing of the native population, an unjust war with Mexico, the near extinction of the bison, and so on. The realization of the white American's manifest destiny to "expand west" was one of history's great crimes, a truly and deeply lamentable not a laudable episode, a human tragedy not an American triumph.

Without the United States, who's to say there would even be a Cold War?

The Cold War, in large measure, was merely what the current "war on terror" is, a sham cloak and justification for the moralistic American way of practicing realpolitik; of imposing and exercising its hegemony; of militarism; and of the DOD money laundering racket known as the military-industrial complex, which transferred billions of tax dollars every year to military contractors and other corporations in the name of building and maintaining our defenses against the overblown "communist" threat.
Yo, all of my subliterate conservative criticasters who find perusing and processing the sesquipedalian verbiage of my posts to be such a bothersome brain-taxing chore, I have a new nickname for you. Henceforth you shall be known as Pooh Bears. No, not for the obvious apt reasons, i.e., not because you're full of pooh, and not because of your ursine irritability. Rather, you put me in mind of an A.A. Milne quote, "I am a Bear of Very Little Brain, and long words bother me". Love ya, Pooh Bears.
1Historygenius
Posts: 1,639
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7/5/2013 7:25:14 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 7/4/2013 11:59:50 PM, charleslb wrote:
At 7/4/2013 8:54:32 PM, 1Historygenius wrote:
At 7/4/2013 8:46:46 PM, charleslb wrote:
At 7/4/2013 8:28:40 PM, DetectableNinja wrote:
At 7/4/2013 5:08:47 PM, 1Historygenius wrote:
At 7/4/2013 4:24:14 PM, charleslb wrote:
At 7/4/2013 12:48:37 PM, 1Historygenius wrote:
I hope all of you have a grat time of the greatest day in our nation's history. The day we declared independence to stop those tyrannical taxes and stood up for life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness! God bless America! I hope all of you pray for our country!

Yes, happy 4th everyone, but, http://www.debate.org...

Nevertheless, it's our Independence Day! The most important day in our history!

That's debatable. Probably when the Treaty of Paris. THAT I could see as the most important day in our history.

Or how about the day during the Cuban missle crisis when matters turned in the direction of not initiating a nuclear conflagration that would have ended the United States?

... we set our course as a role model against tyranny...

LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
No really, even if you think the revolution is controversial, think not the many others that occurred after us. This was very noticeable in France and South America.

We shattered the myth of British imperial dominance.

And eventually went on to replace the British Empire as the dominant imperialistic power with delusions of benevolence.

We have a couple territories, but we don't own half of Africa or have spheres of influence in China.

We now could expand west in our own, going from sea to shining sea.

Internal imperialism that entailed the ethnic cleansing of the native population, an unjust war with Mexico, the near extinction of the bison, and so on. The realization of the white American's manifest destiny to "expand west" was one of history's great crimes, a truly and deeply lamentable not a laudable episode, a human tragedy not an American triumph.

Nevertheless, a great feat for settles to move so far west under such hardships and its very good that we had a west coast or else the US Pacific Fleet would not be there. Moving troops into the Pacific would be very difficult.


Without the United States, who's to say there would even be a Cold War?

The Cold War, in large measure, was merely what the current "war on terror" is, a sham cloak and justification for the moralistic American way of practicing realpolitik; of imposing and exercising its hegemony; of militarism; and of the DOD money laundering racket known as the military-industrial complex, which transferred billions of tax dollars every year to military contractors and other corporations in the name of building and maintaining our defenses against the overblown "communist" threat.

No, it was an ideological and military struggle after World War 2 and both sides had the right to be in it. That's even it's definition:

"The Cold War, often dated from 1947 to 1991, was a sustained state of political and military tension between powers in the Western Bloc, dominated by the United States with NATO among its allies, and powers in the Eastern Bloc, dominated by the Soviet Union along with the Warsaw Pact. "

http://en.wikipedia.org...
"The chief business of the American people is business." - Calvin Coolidge

Latest debate - Reagan was a better President than Obama: http://www.debate.org...
rockwater
Posts: 273
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7/5/2013 8:58:46 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 7/4/2013 11:26:01 PM, Contra wrote:
At 7/4/2013 8:49:39 PM, rockwater wrote:
On this Fourth of July, I have to say, God bless taxes!

God bless America. This nation is great because of our unique freedom and diverse culture.

Taxes shouldn't be applauded.

This whole thread is about celebrating America. Taxes give the government the money it needs to enforce and defend out rights and freedoms. So I do pray that God bless our tax laws, our tax system, our tax collectors, and our taxpayers!
1Historygenius
Posts: 1,639
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7/5/2013 9:47:42 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 7/5/2013 8:58:46 AM, rockwater wrote:
At 7/4/2013 11:26:01 PM, Contra wrote:
At 7/4/2013 8:49:39 PM, rockwater wrote:
On this Fourth of July, I have to say, God bless taxes!

God bless America. This nation is great because of our unique freedom and diverse culture.

Taxes shouldn't be applauded.

This whole thread is about celebrating America. Taxes give the government the money it needs to enforce and defend out rights and freedoms. So I do pray that God bless our tax laws, our tax system, our tax collectors, and our taxpayers!

Actually, you don't need taxes to keep the freedom. The important thing is what laws are in place in our Constitution. That's priceless.
"The chief business of the American people is business." - Calvin Coolidge

Latest debate - Reagan was a better President than Obama: http://www.debate.org...
charleslb
Posts: 4,740
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7/5/2013 2:51:49 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 7/5/2013 7:25:14 AM, 1Historygenius wrote:
At 7/4/2013 11:59:50 PM, charleslb wrote:
At 7/4/2013 8:54:32 PM, 1Historygenius wrote:
At 7/4/2013 8:46:46 PM, charleslb wrote:
At 7/4/2013 8:28:40 PM, DetectableNinja wrote:
At 7/4/2013 5:08:47 PM, 1Historygenius wrote:
At 7/4/2013 4:24:14 PM, charleslb wrote:
At 7/4/2013 12:48:37 PM, 1Historygenius wrote:
I hope all of you have a grat time of the greatest day in our nation's history. The day we declared independence to stop those tyrannical taxes and stood up for life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness! God bless America! I hope all of you pray for our country!

Yes, happy 4th everyone, but, http://www.debate.org...

Nevertheless, it's our Independence Day! The most important day in our history!

That's debatable. Probably when the Treaty of Paris. THAT I could see as the most important day in our history.

Or how about the day during the Cuban missle crisis when matters turned in the direction of not initiating a nuclear conflagration that would have ended the United States?

... we set our course as a role model against tyranny...

LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
No really, even if you think the revolution is controversial, think not the many others that occurred after us. This was very noticeable in France and South America.

The American Revolution was less bloody than others merely because its vanguard, the "Founding Fathers", were an elite that was only interested in gaining autonomy from the mother country, not in revising the bourgeois power structure of American society. The story was quite different in France, for instance, because although the revolution in that society was also led by the bourgeoisie there was a monarchy and a landed aristocracy and its ancien regime to be extirpated. This of course entailed a bit more bloodshed. Mm-hmm, the bourgeoisie in America was no more morally decent than that of France and would in all likelihood have sunk to the same violence and terror tactics had it needed to to establish its political hegemony.

Also, I should point out that historically the United States has been a major promoter of tyranny, installing and supporting many a despotic regime or undemocratic ally/comprador. And has occasionally been known to employ its own military forces to impose its dominance and crush another people's aspiration to be free. Recall the Philippine-American War, in which the US military was used against Filipino freedom fighters and may have caused the death of as many as 1.4 million human beings. http://en.wikipedia.org...

We shattered the myth of British imperial dominance.

And eventually went on to replace the British Empire as the dominant imperialistic power with delusions of benevolence.

We have a couple territories, but we don't own half of Africa or have spheres of influence in China.

Well, it's the age of neocolonialism, so of course we don't own much of the world in an outright, technical sense, we merely exercise a high degree of coercive economic and political influence and hegemony over it.

We now could expand west in our own, going from sea to shining sea.

Internal imperialism that entailed the ethnic cleansing of the native population, an unjust war with Mexico, the near extinction of the bison, and so on. The realization of the white American's manifest destiny to "expand west" was one of history's great crimes, a truly and deeply lamentable not a laudable episode, a human tragedy not an American triumph.

Nevertheless, a great feat for settles to move so far west ...

This is almost as egregious as saying that the Holocaust was a great feat of planning and logistics that demonstrated the superior efficiency of the German people. In other words, great feats aren't necessarily reasons to give praise.

and its very good that we had a west coast or else the US Pacific Fleet would not be there. Moving troops into the Pacific would be very difficult.

So strategic needs justify brutally expropriating other people's lands?!

Without the United States, who's to say there would even be a Cold War?

The Cold War, in large measure, was merely what the current "war on terror" is, a sham cloak and justification for the moralistic American way of practicing realpolitik; of imposing and exercising its hegemony; of militarism; and of the DOD money laundering racket known as the military-industrial complex, which transferred billions of tax dollars every year to military contractors and other corporations in the name of building and maintaining our defenses against the overblown "communist" threat.

No, it was an ideological and military struggle after World War 2 and both sides had the right to be in it. That's even it's definition:

Nope, it was, in the main, a beard for American realpolitiking and neocolonialism and an excuse for the existence of the good ole military-industrial complex.

"The Cold War, often dated from 1947 to 1991, was a sustained state of political and military tension between powers in the Western Bloc, dominated by the United States with NATO among its allies, and powers in the Eastern Bloc, dominated by the Soviet Union along with the Warsaw Pact. "

http://en.wikipedia.org...

This is like saying that WWII was a conflict, often dated from 1939 to 1945, between the Axis and the Allies. It says nothing about the causes, motives, crimes, etc. that comprise the truth of a war, hot or cold. It certainly doesn't buttress your point of view.
Yo, all of my subliterate conservative criticasters who find perusing and processing the sesquipedalian verbiage of my posts to be such a bothersome brain-taxing chore, I have a new nickname for you. Henceforth you shall be known as Pooh Bears. No, not for the obvious apt reasons, i.e., not because you're full of pooh, and not because of your ursine irritability. Rather, you put me in mind of an A.A. Milne quote, "I am a Bear of Very Little Brain, and long words bother me". Love ya, Pooh Bears.
Ore_Ele
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7/5/2013 7:26:33 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
It's a day later, but it was a happy 4th. Got to watch one drunken fight, and wander the streets at the beach. A naked picture of me will be up shortly.
"Wanting Red Rhino Pill to have gender"
1Historygenius
Posts: 1,639
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7/5/2013 11:13:38 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 7/5/2013 2:51:49 PM, charleslb wrote:
At 7/5/2013 7:25:14 AM, 1Historygenius wrote:
At 7/4/2013 11:59:50 PM, charleslb wrote:
At 7/4/2013 8:54:32 PM, 1Historygenius wrote:
At 7/4/2013 8:46:46 PM, charleslb wrote:
At 7/4/2013 8:28:40 PM, DetectableNinja wrote:
At 7/4/2013 5:08:47 PM, 1Historygenius wrote:
At 7/4/2013 4:24:14 PM, charleslb wrote:
At 7/4/2013 12:48:37 PM, 1Historygenius wrote:
I hope all of you have a grat time of the greatest day in our nation's history. The day we declared independence to stop those tyrannical taxes and stood up for life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness! God bless America! I hope all of you pray for our country!

Yes, happy 4th everyone, but, http://www.debate.org...

Nevertheless, it's our Independence Day! The most important day in our history!

That's debatable. Probably when the Treaty of Paris. THAT I could see as the most important day in our history.

Or how about the day during the Cuban missle crisis when matters turned in the direction of not initiating a nuclear conflagration that would have ended the United States?

... we set our course as a role model against tyranny...

LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
No really, even if you think the revolution is controversial, think not the many others that occurred after us. This was very noticeable in France and South America.

The American Revolution was less bloody than others merely because its vanguard, the "Founding Fathers", were an elite that was only interested in gaining autonomy from the mother country, not in revising the bourgeois power structure of American society. The story was quite different in France, for instance, because although the revolution in that society was also led by the bourgeoisie there was a monarchy and a landed aristocracy and its ancien regime to be extirpated. This of course entailed a bit more bloodshed. Mm-hmm, the bourgeoisie in America was no more morally decent than that of France and would in all likelihood have sunk to the same violence and terror tactics had it needed to to establish its political hegemony.

That's good, the founding fathers should do what they want. Everyone has a role to play in the revolution. I'm also not talking about the difference, I'm talking about the influence the American Revolution had on oppressed people.

Also, I should point out that historically the United States has been a major promoter of tyranny, installing and supporting many a despotic regime or undemocratic ally/comprador. And has occasionally been known to employ its own military forces to impose its dominance and crush another people's aspiration to be free. Recall the Philippine-American War, in which the US military was used against Filipino freedom fighters and may have caused the death of as many as 1.4 million human beings. http://en.wikipedia.org...


Nobody's perfect, but were better than others. Japanese treatment was just as bad and I will mention that later.

We shattered the myth of British imperial dominance.

And eventually went on to replace the British Empire as the dominant imperialistic power with delusions of benevolence.

We have a couple territories, but we don't own half of Africa or have spheres of influence in China.

Well, it's the age of neocolonialism, so of course we don't own much of the world in an outright, technical sense, we merely exercise a high degree of coercive economic and political influence and hegemony over it.
Incorrect. Private industries mainly control the economy. Political influence is a factor, but it's good that we support our allies in politics like Canada and the United Kingdom.

We now could expand west in our own, going from sea to shining sea.

Internal imperialism that entailed the ethnic cleansing of the native population, an unjust war with Mexico, the near extinction of the bison, and so on. The realization of the white American's manifest destiny to "expand west" was one of history's great crimes, a truly and deeply lamentable not a laudable episode, a human tragedy not an American triumph.

Nevertheless, a great feat for settles to move so far west ...

This is almost as egregious as saying that the Holocaust was a great feat of planning and logistics that demonstrated the superior efficiency of the German people. In other words, great feats aren't necessarily reasons to give praise.

I didn't show superior efficiency, what it showed was how quick the Germans can be in eliminating races and how they did it, which far outweighs the movement west by a couple of settlers.

and its very good that we had a west coast or else the US Pacific Fleet would not be there. Moving troops into the Pacific would be very difficult.

So strategic needs justify brutally expropriating other people's lands?!

Oh yes. This has happened over the course of history. Every country has committed one atrocity or another in a war. The important thing is to see who committed the least and I would take treatment of Native Americans if it means to stop he the Japanese treated the Chinese, the Philippines, the Malayans, British and Commonwealth troops, and etc. Also, this put the United States in a strong economic position in the first place. Think of all the resources coming out of the west!


Without the United States, who's to say there would even be a Cold War?

The Cold War, in large measure, was merely what the current "war on terror" is, a sham cloak and justification for the moralistic American way of practicing realpolitik; of imposing and exercising its hegemony; of militarism; and of the DOD money laundering racket known as the military-industrial complex, which transferred billions of tax dollars every year to military contractors and other corporations in the name of building and maintaining our defenses against the overblown "communist" threat.

No, it was an ideological and military struggle after World War 2 and both sides had the right to be in it. That's even it's definition:

Nope, it was, in the main, a beard for American realpolitiking and neocolonialism and an excuse for the existence of the good ole military-industrial complex.

"The Cold War, often dated from 1947 to 1991, was a sustained state of political and military tension between powers in the Western Bloc, dominated by the United States with NATO among its allies, and powers in the Eastern Bloc, dominated by the Soviet Union along with the Warsaw Pact. "

http://en.wikipedia.org...

This is like saying that WWII was a conflict, often dated from 1939 to 1945, between the Axis and the Allies. It says nothing about the causes, motives, crimes, etc. that comprise the truth of a war, hot or cold. It certainly doesn't buttress your point of view.

Yeah because you don't need that. The most important thing in studying a war is know doubt the engagements.
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