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The Neo-Know Nothing Party?

proglib
Posts: 391
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8/22/2013 11:19:58 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
It has occurred to me quite a few times in the last couple years or so that the anti-intellectual far right, including much of the TEA--and unfortunately some of the Grand Old--Party is becoming something of a New Know Nothing Party.*

Probably not coincidentally, they are more likely to have Super-"Patriotic," anti-feminist, nativist, anti-gay, anti-Muslim members, cheerleaders and leaders. Along with this, they seem to have a lot of ignorant, even stupid members and leaders.

They are so stupid...

1. They can't even recognize stupidity in their leaders. [Here is where you all get to blame the public perception of Sarah Palin and George W. Bush as mental midgets on the media. LMAO]

[They are so stupid...]

2. They keep crying wolf long after even most of their own members know it's at worst a fox.**

[They are so stupid...]

3. [Have fun by adding your own example. I'll have more of my own later. Probably based on some of the outraged responses to this intentionally provocative topic.]

Comments?

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

* Others, including William Kristol and Fareed Zakaria have remarked on this: http://en.wikipedia.org...

** https://www.facebook.com...
Yes, this is a test. There are a couple of REALLY STUPID [sorry for shouting] points made by this post. Whether you are left, right or center, if you are past calling the kitty cat--or weasel or fox or ...--a wolf, and don't think other people are stupid enough to keep thinking that way, then you should be embarrassed by the talking points of this post.
"I would remind you that extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice.* And let me remind you also that moderation in the pursuit of justice is no virtue." Barry Goldwater
*Except in a democracy it might lose you an election.

http://unitedwegovern.org...
wrichcirw
Posts: 11,196
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8/23/2013 12:24:12 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
Sadly, this sounds about right.
At 8/9/2013 9:41:24 AM, wrichcirw wrote:
If you are civil with me, I will be civil to you. If you decide to bring unreasonable animosity to bear in a reasonable discussion, then what would you expect other than to get flustered?
ConservativeAmerican
Posts: 1,676
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8/23/2013 12:17:59 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/22/2013 11:19:58 PM, proglib wrote:
It has occurred to me quite a few times in the last couple years or so that the anti-intellectual far right, including much of the TEA--and unfortunately some of the Grand Old--Party is becoming something of a New Know Nothing Party.*

Probably not coincidentally, they are more likely to have Super-"Patriotic," anti-feminist, nativist, anti-gay, anti-Muslim members, cheerleaders and leaders. Along with this, they seem to have a lot of ignorant, even stupid members and leaders.

They are so stupid...

1. They can't even recognize stupidity in their leaders. [Here is where you all get to blame the public perception of Sarah Palin and George W. Bush as mental midgets on the media. LMAO]

[They are so stupid...]

2. They keep crying wolf long after even most of their own members know it's at worst a fox.**

[They are so stupid...]

3. [Have fun by adding your own example. I'll have more of my own later. Probably based on some of the outraged responses to this intentionally provocative topic.]

Comments?


-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

* Others, including William Kristol and Fareed Zakaria have remarked on this: http://en.wikipedia.org...

** https://www.facebook.com...
Yes, this is a test. There are a couple of REALLY STUPID [sorry for shouting] points made by this post. Whether you are left, right or center, if you are past calling the kitty cat--or weasel or fox or ...--a wolf, and don't think other people are stupid enough to keep thinking that way, then you should be embarrassed by the talking points of this post.

Are you mentally incapacitated? Since most of what you are saying isn't even a feasible argument, I don't see why I'm even replying to this troll bait, but if I did want to debate you how would I go about doing so, by coming up with my own idiotic stereotypes about liberals?
Lordknukle
Posts: 12,788
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8/23/2013 1:09:03 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
I'm no fan of the GOP, but saying "they are so stupid" every two sentences about your political opponents really exemplifies your character.
"Easy is the descent to Avernus, for the door to the Underworld lies upon both day and night. But to retrace your steps and return to the breezes above- that's the task, that's the toil."
proglib
Posts: 391
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8/23/2013 8:44:37 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/23/2013 1:09:03 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
I'm no fan of the GOP, but saying "they are so stupid" every two sentences about your political opponents really exemplifies your character.

Lordknukle,

Thanks for your response, and your point is taken.

This Forum topic is not meant to address the GOP as a whole, but a certain anti-intellectual culture that the GOP is currently acquiescing to and encouraging. I am not a Democratic cheerleader or opponent of all things Republican or conservative. (Most of my rather large family is Republican. Some of them are whip smart.)

My presentation was intentionally provocative, and perhaps missed its mark. However, again, I don't mean to paint everyone who disagrees with me as less intelligent than me.

This may be harder to explain than I thought, but I have no problem with folks who say that a mixed economy doesn't work as well as a less regulated economy. Some true geniuses, including Hayek, von Mises, Friedman, et. al., made that point very well, and I'm willing to have that discussion anytime. (For Pete's sake, I'm old enough to have voted for Clark (L) for President and to have been pleased that Reagan agreed with some of my libertarian thinking on economics.)

It is more the knee-jerk, groupthink responses that the right has been encouraging that bug me. Folks feel they don't need to read economics or even know who Adam Smith is, and yet they will claim that Obama is a socialist, ruining the economy with stimulus spending.

Let me try another tack:

You may not have read the Facebook post that I referred to, and that's fine, of course. Someone posted a picture that highlighted President Obama reading a book by Fareed Zakaria, called The Post-American World. In very conspiratorial tones, the Facebook poster mentions that the book was "written by a fellow Muslim.(Fareed Zakaria)" and " I believe this is one photo that really should be passed around."

As I said earlier, a half-bright child knows the fable of the boy who cried wolf. This type of right wing histrionics is passed around by college educated people on the right who should know better, but encourage each to circulate such drek.

This is the particular bone that I have to pick with the right. Not their positions, but some of their embarrassingly anti-intellectual claims.

I fear I haven't cleared it up, yet, but will try more later, if anyone is still listening.

Cheers
"I would remind you that extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice.* And let me remind you also that moderation in the pursuit of justice is no virtue." Barry Goldwater
*Except in a democracy it might lose you an election.

http://unitedwegovern.org...
Lordknukle
Posts: 12,788
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8/23/2013 10:05:23 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
So essentially, you're pissed off that the GOP has retards in the mix? You know, I could say the same about any party.
"Easy is the descent to Avernus, for the door to the Underworld lies upon both day and night. But to retrace your steps and return to the breezes above- that's the task, that's the toil."
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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8/23/2013 10:06:57 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/23/2013 10:05:23 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
So essentially, you're pissed off that the GOP has retards in the mix? You know, I could say the same about any party.

more retards than is tolerable or normal.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
Lordknukle
Posts: 12,788
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8/23/2013 10:10:59 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/23/2013 10:06:57 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 8/23/2013 10:05:23 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
So essentially, you're pissed off that the GOP has retards in the mix? You know, I could say the same about any party.

more retards than is tolerable or normal.

Come on, that's dishonest. Sure, the religious fanatics are retards. But I could say the same about every high school and college educated pretentious liberal with their hipster glasses. Yes, the idiots in the GOP are more prominent- no doubt thanks to the obvious left wing bias in most mainstream media sources. Nevertheless, idiocy comes in many different forms, including ones that the GOP does not have an exclusive right to.
"Easy is the descent to Avernus, for the door to the Underworld lies upon both day and night. But to retrace your steps and return to the breezes above- that's the task, that's the toil."
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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8/23/2013 10:16:15 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/23/2013 10:10:59 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
At 8/23/2013 10:06:57 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 8/23/2013 10:05:23 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
So essentially, you're pissed off that the GOP has retards in the mix? You know, I could say the same about any party.

more retards than is tolerable or normal.

Come on, that's dishonest. Sure, the religious fanatics are retards. But I could say the same about every high school and college educated pretentious liberal with their hipster glasses. Yes, the idiots in the GOP are more prominent- no doubt thanks to the obvious left wing bias in most mainstream media sources. Nevertheless, idiocy comes in many different forms, including ones that the GOP does not have an exclusive right to.

No. I've seen annoying liberals and annoying conservatives. The annoying conservatives/libertarians are worse. ..... maybe because they're so homogeneous and loud....maybe its because the GOP is too stupid to keep them in check and actually elects of few of them to office. I don't know. All I do know is that, there are definitely more politically active idiots from the GOP.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
Lordknukle
Posts: 12,788
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8/23/2013 10:18:04 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/23/2013 10:16:15 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 8/23/2013 10:10:59 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
At 8/23/2013 10:06:57 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 8/23/2013 10:05:23 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
So essentially, you're pissed off that the GOP has retards in the mix? You know, I could say the same about any party.

more retards than is tolerable or normal.

Come on, that's dishonest. Sure, the religious fanatics are retards. But I could say the same about every high school and college educated pretentious liberal with their hipster glasses. Yes, the idiots in the GOP are more prominent- no doubt thanks to the obvious left wing bias in most mainstream media sources. Nevertheless, idiocy comes in many different forms, including ones that the GOP does not have an exclusive right to.

No. I've seen annoying liberals and annoying conservatives. The annoying conservatives/libertarians are worse. ..... maybe because they're so homogeneous and loud....maybe its because the GOP is too stupid to keep them in check and actually elects of few of them to office. I don't know. All I do know is that, there are definitely more politically active idiots from the GOP.

No. I've seen annoying liberals and annoying conservatives. The annoying democrats/socialists are worse. ..... maybe because they're so homogeneous and loud....maybe its because the Democratic Party is too stupid to keep them in check and actually elects of few of them to office. I don't know. All I do know is that, there are definitely more politically active idiots from the Democratic Party.
"Easy is the descent to Avernus, for the door to the Underworld lies upon both day and night. But to retrace your steps and return to the breezes above- that's the task, that's the toil."
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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8/23/2013 10:20:39 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/23/2013 10:18:04 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
At 8/23/2013 10:16:15 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 8/23/2013 10:10:59 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
At 8/23/2013 10:06:57 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 8/23/2013 10:05:23 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
So essentially, you're pissed off that the GOP has retards in the mix? You know, I could say the same about any party.

more retards than is tolerable or normal.

Come on, that's dishonest. Sure, the religious fanatics are retards. But I could say the same about every high school and college educated pretentious liberal with their hipster glasses. Yes, the idiots in the GOP are more prominent- no doubt thanks to the obvious left wing bias in most mainstream media sources. Nevertheless, idiocy comes in many different forms, including ones that the GOP does not have an exclusive right to.

No. I've seen annoying liberals and annoying conservatives. The annoying conservatives/libertarians are worse. ..... maybe because they're so homogeneous and loud....maybe its because the GOP is too stupid to keep them in check and actually elects of few of them to office. I don't know. All I do know is that, there are definitely more politically active idiots from the GOP.


No. I've seen annoying liberals and annoying conservatives. The annoying democrats/socialists are worse. ..... maybe because they're so homogeneous and loud....maybe its because the Democratic Party is too stupid to keep them in check and actually elects of few of them to office. I don't know. All I do know is that, there are definitely more politically active idiots from the Democratic Party.

liberals tend to be pretty ethnically diverse and many of them are too lazy to actually coalesce into a directed movement (OWS was something like a brief hang out to be in the middle or chaos for no apparent reason). So your reference is unsuccessful on multiple grounds.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
Lordknukle
Posts: 12,788
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8/23/2013 10:25:20 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/23/2013 10:20:39 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 8/23/2013 10:18:04 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
At 8/23/2013 10:16:15 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 8/23/2013 10:10:59 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
At 8/23/2013 10:06:57 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 8/23/2013 10:05:23 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
So essentially, you're pissed off that the GOP has retards in the mix? You know, I could say the same about any party.

more retards than is tolerable or normal.

Come on, that's dishonest. Sure, the religious fanatics are retards. But I could say the same about every high school and college educated pretentious liberal with their hipster glasses. Yes, the idiots in the GOP are more prominent- no doubt thanks to the obvious left wing bias in most mainstream media sources. Nevertheless, idiocy comes in many different forms, including ones that the GOP does not have an exclusive right to.

No. I've seen annoying liberals and annoying conservatives. The annoying conservatives/libertarians are worse. ..... maybe because they're so homogeneous and loud....maybe its because the GOP is too stupid to keep them in check and actually elects of few of them to office. I don't know. All I do know is that, there are definitely more politically active idiots from the GOP.


No. I've seen annoying liberals and annoying conservatives. The annoying democrats/socialists are worse. ..... maybe because they're so homogeneous and loud....maybe its because the Democratic Party is too stupid to keep them in check and actually elects of few of them to office. I don't know. All I do know is that, there are definitely more politically active idiots from the Democratic Party.

liberals tend to be pretty ethnically diverse and many of them are too lazy to actually coalesce into a directed movement (OWS was something like a brief hang out to be in the middle or chaos for no apparent reason). So your reference is unsuccessful on multiple grounds.

http://i.stack.imgur.com...
"Easy is the descent to Avernus, for the door to the Underworld lies upon both day and night. But to retrace your steps and return to the breezes above- that's the task, that's the toil."
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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8/23/2013 10:26:26 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/23/2013 10:25:20 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
At 8/23/2013 10:20:39 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 8/23/2013 10:18:04 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
At 8/23/2013 10:16:15 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 8/23/2013 10:10:59 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
At 8/23/2013 10:06:57 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 8/23/2013 10:05:23 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
So essentially, you're pissed off that the GOP has retards in the mix? You know, I could say the same about any party.

more retards than is tolerable or normal.

Come on, that's dishonest. Sure, the religious fanatics are retards. But I could say the same about every high school and college educated pretentious liberal with their hipster glasses. Yes, the idiots in the GOP are more prominent- no doubt thanks to the obvious left wing bias in most mainstream media sources. Nevertheless, idiocy comes in many different forms, including ones that the GOP does not have an exclusive right to.

No. I've seen annoying liberals and annoying conservatives. The annoying conservatives/libertarians are worse. ..... maybe because they're so homogeneous and loud....maybe its because the GOP is too stupid to keep them in check and actually elects of few of them to office. I don't know. All I do know is that, there are definitely more politically active idiots from the GOP.


No. I've seen annoying liberals and annoying conservatives. The annoying democrats/socialists are worse. ..... maybe because they're so homogeneous and loud....maybe its because the Democratic Party is too stupid to keep them in check and actually elects of few of them to office. I don't know. All I do know is that, there are definitely more politically active idiots from the Democratic Party.

liberals tend to be pretty ethnically diverse and many of them are too lazy to actually coalesce into a directed movement (OWS was something like a brief hang out to be in the middle or chaos for no apparent reason). So your reference is unsuccessful on multiple grounds.

http://i.stack.imgur.com...

Is this your way of conceding?
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
Lordknukle
Posts: 12,788
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8/23/2013 10:27:14 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/23/2013 10:26:26 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 8/23/2013 10:25:20 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
At 8/23/2013 10:20:39 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 8/23/2013 10:18:04 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
At 8/23/2013 10:16:15 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 8/23/2013 10:10:59 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
At 8/23/2013 10:06:57 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 8/23/2013 10:05:23 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
So essentially, you're pissed off that the GOP has retards in the mix? You know, I could say the same about any party.

more retards than is tolerable or normal.

Come on, that's dishonest. Sure, the religious fanatics are retards. But I could say the same about every high school and college educated pretentious liberal with their hipster glasses. Yes, the idiots in the GOP are more prominent- no doubt thanks to the obvious left wing bias in most mainstream media sources. Nevertheless, idiocy comes in many different forms, including ones that the GOP does not have an exclusive right to.

No. I've seen annoying liberals and annoying conservatives. The annoying conservatives/libertarians are worse. ..... maybe because they're so homogeneous and loud....maybe its because the GOP is too stupid to keep them in check and actually elects of few of them to office. I don't know. All I do know is that, there are definitely more politically active idiots from the GOP.


No. I've seen annoying liberals and annoying conservatives. The annoying democrats/socialists are worse. ..... maybe because they're so homogeneous and loud....maybe its because the Democratic Party is too stupid to keep them in check and actually elects of few of them to office. I don't know. All I do know is that, there are definitely more politically active idiots from the Democratic Party.

liberals tend to be pretty ethnically diverse and many of them are too lazy to actually coalesce into a directed movement (OWS was something like a brief hang out to be in the middle or chaos for no apparent reason). So your reference is unsuccessful on multiple grounds.

http://i.stack.imgur.com...

Is this your way of conceding?

If only there was a way to insert all the internet memes into one link...
"Easy is the descent to Avernus, for the door to the Underworld lies upon both day and night. But to retrace your steps and return to the breezes above- that's the task, that's the toil."
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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8/23/2013 10:29:07 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/23/2013 10:27:14 PM, Lordknukle wrote:

If only there was a way to insert all the internet memes into one link...

What is it you're reacting to?
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
Lordknukle
Posts: 12,788
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8/23/2013 10:30:23 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/23/2013 10:29:07 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 8/23/2013 10:27:14 PM, Lordknukle wrote:

If only there was a way to insert all the internet memes into one link...

What is it you're reacting to?

You.
"Easy is the descent to Avernus, for the door to the Underworld lies upon both day and night. But to retrace your steps and return to the breezes above- that's the task, that's the toil."
proglib
Posts: 391
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8/23/2013 10:34:41 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/23/2013 10:10:59 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
At 8/23/2013 10:06:57 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 8/23/2013 10:05:23 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
So essentially, you're pissed off that the GOP has retards in the mix? You know, I could say the same about any party.

more retards than is tolerable or normal.

Come on, that's dishonest. Sure, the religious fanatics are retards. But I could say the same about every high school and college educated pretentious liberal with their hipster glasses. Yes, the idiots in the GOP are more prominent- no doubt thanks to the obvious left wing bias in most mainstream media sources. Nevertheless, idiocy comes in many different forms, including ones that the GOP does not have an exclusive right to.

What I'm concerned about is the encouragement of anti-intellectualism by the right. [Having an autistic nephew, I avoid the term "retard"--one of the things I give Sarah Palin credit for--she also rejects the word. :) I don't attempt to police others on this.]

A couple examples:

Science is being branded the purview of the left.

People were encouraged to keep crying wolf over Obama's religion and place of birth long after to do so was only counter-productive.

Instead of having an intelligent conversation over government regulation--an argument that Reagan got the better of, by the way, making liberals move more to the center on economics--the argument was about whether he's a socialist or not.

And more to the historical point of the Know Nothing Party, the far right has encouraged a kind of "go team" patriotism, nativism and fear of the other (currently Muslims rather than Irish Catholics.)
"I would remind you that extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice.* And let me remind you also that moderation in the pursuit of justice is no virtue." Barry Goldwater
*Except in a democracy it might lose you an election.

http://unitedwegovern.org...
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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8/23/2013 10:36:43 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/23/2013 10:30:23 PM, Lordknukle wrote:
At 8/23/2013 10:29:07 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 8/23/2013 10:27:14 PM, Lordknukle wrote:

If only there was a way to insert all the internet memes into one link...

What is it you're reacting to?

You.

If you're reacting to the fact that I invoked OWS when the conversation was about which has more idiots, the left or the right, then I think you may have lost track of the trajectory of our conversation. OWS was mentioned as an example to justify why I find liberals less annoying...that even though they are engaged in something stupid, it's transient and disorganized and most of the attendees are not there for political reasons. It was not intended to show a lack of idiots on the liberal side. Understand?
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
YYW
Posts: 36,303
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8/23/2013 10:44:10 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/22/2013 11:19:58 PM, proglib wrote:
It has occurred to me quite a few times in the last couple years or so that the anti-intellectual far right, including much of the TEA--and unfortunately some of the Grand Old--Party is becoming something of a New Know Nothing Party.*

Not that I'm disagreeing with that assessment, but I would be interested to know what you mean when you say "anti-intelectual."
Tsar of DDO
wrichcirw
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8/23/2013 10:57:25 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/23/2013 12:17:59 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
At 8/22/2013 11:19:58 PM, proglib wrote:

Are you mentally incapacitated? Since most of what you are saying isn't even a feasible argument, I don't see why I'm even replying to this troll bait, but if I did want to debate you how would I go about doing so, by coming up with my own idiotic stereotypes about liberals?

Well, in defense of my own stance on the OP, lol, proglib wasn't aiming his comment at conservatives necessarily, but at die-hard GOP party members. Sometimes I wonder if the two are the same...the stuff proglib talks about is not stuff I associate with a conservative position, yet is indeed stuff that routinely comes out on the news as being associated with GOP leadership. For example, the whole Muslim-bashing and birther movements are epitomes of stupid, IMHO.
At 8/9/2013 9:41:24 AM, wrichcirw wrote:
If you are civil with me, I will be civil to you. If you decide to bring unreasonable animosity to bear in a reasonable discussion, then what would you expect other than to get flustered?
ConservativeAmerican
Posts: 1,676
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8/23/2013 11:00:52 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/23/2013 10:57:25 PM, wrichcirw wrote:
At 8/23/2013 12:17:59 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
At 8/22/2013 11:19:58 PM, proglib wrote:

Are you mentally incapacitated? Since most of what you are saying isn't even a feasible argument, I don't see why I'm even replying to this troll bait, but if I did want to debate you how would I go about doing so, by coming up with my own idiotic stereotypes about liberals?

Well, in defense of my own stance on the OP, lol, proglib wasn't aiming his comment at conservatives necessarily, but at die-hard GOP party members. Sometimes I wonder if the two are the same...the stuff proglib talks about is not stuff I associate with a conservative position, yet is indeed stuff that routinely comes out on the news as being associated with GOP leadership. For example, the whole Muslim-bashing and birther movements are epitomes of stupid, IMHO.

I am against all religion, especially Islam/Muslims. Why is it wrong to bash a bigoted and backwards religion? (All religions are bigoted and backwards if you interpret them how they are meant to be interpreted, not saying Islam is exclusive). Also most major GOP leaders wouldn't be caught dead associating themselves with the birther theory, as there is a thin line there in the public eye when it comes to racism.
wrichcirw
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8/23/2013 11:12:22 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/23/2013 11:00:52 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
At 8/23/2013 10:57:25 PM, wrichcirw wrote:
At 8/23/2013 12:17:59 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
At 8/22/2013 11:19:58 PM, proglib wrote:

Are you mentally incapacitated? Since most of what you are saying isn't even a feasible argument, I don't see why I'm even replying to this troll bait, but if I did want to debate you how would I go about doing so, by coming up with my own idiotic stereotypes about liberals?

Well, in defense of my own stance on the OP, lol, proglib wasn't aiming his comment at conservatives necessarily, but at die-hard GOP party members. Sometimes I wonder if the two are the same...the stuff proglib talks about is not stuff I associate with a conservative position, yet is indeed stuff that routinely comes out on the news as being associated with GOP leadership. For example, the whole Muslim-bashing and birther movements are epitomes of stupid, IMHO.

I am against all religion, especially Islam/Muslims. Why is it wrong to bash a bigoted and backwards religion? (All religions are bigoted and backwards if you interpret them how they are meant to be interpreted, not saying Islam is exclusive). Also most major GOP leaders wouldn't be caught dead associating themselves with the birther theory, as there is a thin line there in the public eye when it comes to racism.

The idea is that the birther movement isn't something I'd associate with conservatism, and is certainly something that the Democrats don't advocate at all...which then leaves proponents in the GOP.

As far as GOP leaders not being "caught dead" with the birther issue, how's Richard Shelby, Newt Gingrich, Sarah Palin, Michelle Bachmann, and Mike Huckabee? That's a substantial list of prominent GOP politicians that typically hoard the spotlight.
http://en.wikipedia.org...

There is a difference between bashing religion, and bashing A religion. Most people, especially in the GOP, are extremely religious, and bash Muslims not because of some appeal to rationality, but because of an appeal to Christianity.
At 8/9/2013 9:41:24 AM, wrichcirw wrote:
If you are civil with me, I will be civil to you. If you decide to bring unreasonable animosity to bear in a reasonable discussion, then what would you expect other than to get flustered?
donald.keller
Posts: 3,709
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8/23/2013 11:16:26 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
This is the largest, funniest mosh pit of Ad Hominem I've ever seen lol.

Conservative appear to have more idiots than Liberal because.... They do.

But that's a number.. Not a statistic...

Conservatives make up nearly 2/3rd of the non-moderate Country. They are bound to have 2/3rd's of the idiots. And a few extremists.

Or at least it looks like they have 2/3rd's of the idiots because the media only bashes on them. If the media and the extremely-liberal internet showed some of the Liberal idiots, we'd see how many liberals are stupid too.
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ConservativeAmerican
Posts: 1,676
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8/23/2013 11:18:18 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/23/2013 11:12:22 PM, wrichcirw wrote:
At 8/23/2013 11:00:52 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
At 8/23/2013 10:57:25 PM, wrichcirw wrote:
At 8/23/2013 12:17:59 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
At 8/22/2013 11:19:58 PM, proglib wrote:

Are you mentally incapacitated? Since most of what you are saying isn't even a feasible argument, I don't see why I'm even replying to this troll bait, but if I did want to debate you how would I go about doing so, by coming up with my own idiotic stereotypes about liberals?

Well, in defense of my own stance on the OP, lol, proglib wasn't aiming his comment at conservatives necessarily, but at die-hard GOP party members. Sometimes I wonder if the two are the same...the stuff proglib talks about is not stuff I associate with a conservative position, yet is indeed stuff that routinely comes out on the news as being associated with GOP leadership. For example, the whole Muslim-bashing and birther movements are epitomes of stupid, IMHO.

I am against all religion, especially Islam/Muslims. Why is it wrong to bash a bigoted and backwards religion? (All religions are bigoted and backwards if you interpret them how they are meant to be interpreted, not saying Islam is exclusive). Also most major GOP leaders wouldn't be caught dead associating themselves with the birther theory, as there is a thin line there in the public eye when it comes to racism.

The idea is that the birther movement isn't something I'd associate with conservatism, and is certainly something that the Democrats don't advocate at all...which then leaves proponents in the GOP.

As far as GOP leaders not being "caught dead" with the birther issue, how's Richard Shelby, Newt Gingrich, Sarah Palin, Michelle Bachmann, and Mike Huckabee? That's a substantial list of prominent GOP politicians that typically hoard the spotlight.
http://en.wikipedia.org...

Wow, I was not aware of that. I am not conservative, but I identify more with conservatives and will sometimes jump too quickly to defend them.

There is a difference between bashing religion, and bashing A religion. Most people, especially in the GOP, are extremely religious, and bash Muslims not because of some appeal to rationality, but because of an appeal to Christianity.

That is because most conservatives don't actually interpret the bible the way it should be interpreted, otherwise they would be legislating for laws that call for the stoning of adulterers and punishment for things such as lust for another person's wife.

I think conservatives have more disdain for nations with Shariah Law, which is ironic because a few fringe conservatives still hold on to the idea that we shouldn't have separation of church and state, but I digress.
wrichcirw
Posts: 11,196
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8/23/2013 11:25:35 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/23/2013 11:18:18 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
At 8/23/2013 11:12:22 PM, wrichcirw wrote:
At 8/23/2013 11:00:52 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
At 8/23/2013 10:57:25 PM, wrichcirw wrote:
At 8/23/2013 12:17:59 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
At 8/22/2013 11:19:58 PM, proglib wrote:

Are you mentally incapacitated? Since most of what you are saying isn't even a feasible argument, I don't see why I'm even replying to this troll bait, but if I did want to debate you how would I go about doing so, by coming up with my own idiotic stereotypes about liberals?

Well, in defense of my own stance on the OP, lol, proglib wasn't aiming his comment at conservatives necessarily, but at die-hard GOP party members. Sometimes I wonder if the two are the same...the stuff proglib talks about is not stuff I associate with a conservative position, yet is indeed stuff that routinely comes out on the news as being associated with GOP leadership. For example, the whole Muslim-bashing and birther movements are epitomes of stupid, IMHO.

I am against all religion, especially Islam/Muslims. Why is it wrong to bash a bigoted and backwards religion? (All religions are bigoted and backwards if you interpret them how they are meant to be interpreted, not saying Islam is exclusive). Also most major GOP leaders wouldn't be caught dead associating themselves with the birther theory, as there is a thin line there in the public eye when it comes to racism.

The idea is that the birther movement isn't something I'd associate with conservatism, and is certainly something that the Democrats don't advocate at all...which then leaves proponents in the GOP.

As far as GOP leaders not being "caught dead" with the birther issue, how's Richard Shelby, Newt Gingrich, Sarah Palin, Michelle Bachmann, and Mike Huckabee? That's a substantial list of prominent GOP politicians that typically hoard the spotlight.
http://en.wikipedia.org...

Wow, I was not aware of that. I am not conservative, but I identify more with conservatives and will sometimes jump too quickly to defend them.

Yeah, same. There's a lot about the GOP that pisses me off because I see them as having veered very, very far from where they were in the 80s and 90s. Guys like John Boehner seem to be a dying breed.

There is a difference between bashing religion, and bashing A religion. Most people, especially in the GOP, are extremely religious, and bash Muslims not because of some appeal to rationality, but because of an appeal to Christianity.

That is because most conservatives don't actually interpret the bible the way it should be interpreted, otherwise they would be legislating for laws that call for the stoning of adulterers and punishment for things such as lust for another person's wife.

I think conservatives have more disdain for nations with Shariah Law, which is ironic because a few fringe conservatives still hold on to the idea that we shouldn't have separation of church and state, but I digress.

The religious right is also not something I care to associate with a conservative position. Maybe that's just me, but I'd rather leave my faith at the door when it comes to politics. Then again, maybe I'm not really conservative but more libertarian, since I'm generally socially progressive...just very fiscally conservative.
At 8/9/2013 9:41:24 AM, wrichcirw wrote:
If you are civil with me, I will be civil to you. If you decide to bring unreasonable animosity to bear in a reasonable discussion, then what would you expect other than to get flustered?
ConservativeAmerican
Posts: 1,676
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8/23/2013 11:27:32 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/23/2013 11:25:35 PM, wrichcirw wrote:
At 8/23/2013 11:18:18 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
At 8/23/2013 11:12:22 PM, wrichcirw wrote:
At 8/23/2013 11:00:52 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
At 8/23/2013 10:57:25 PM, wrichcirw wrote:
At 8/23/2013 12:17:59 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
At 8/22/2013 11:19:58 PM, proglib wrote:

Are you mentally incapacitated? Since most of what you are saying isn't even a feasible argument, I don't see why I'm even replying to this troll bait, but if I did want to debate you how would I go about doing so, by coming up with my own idiotic stereotypes about liberals?

Well, in defense of my own stance on the OP, lol, proglib wasn't aiming his comment at conservatives necessarily, but at die-hard GOP party members. Sometimes I wonder if the two are the same...the stuff proglib talks about is not stuff I associate with a conservative position, yet is indeed stuff that routinely comes out on the news as being associated with GOP leadership. For example, the whole Muslim-bashing and birther movements are epitomes of stupid, IMHO.

I am against all religion, especially Islam/Muslims. Why is it wrong to bash a bigoted and backwards religion? (All religions are bigoted and backwards if you interpret them how they are meant to be interpreted, not saying Islam is exclusive). Also most major GOP leaders wouldn't be caught dead associating themselves with the birther theory, as there is a thin line there in the public eye when it comes to racism.

The idea is that the birther movement isn't something I'd associate with conservatism, and is certainly something that the Democrats don't advocate at all...which then leaves proponents in the GOP.

As far as GOP leaders not being "caught dead" with the birther issue, how's Richard Shelby, Newt Gingrich, Sarah Palin, Michelle Bachmann, and Mike Huckabee? That's a substantial list of prominent GOP politicians that typically hoard the spotlight.
http://en.wikipedia.org...

Wow, I was not aware of that. I am not conservative, but I identify more with conservatives and will sometimes jump too quickly to defend them.

Yeah, same. There's a lot about the GOP that pisses me off because I see them as having veered very, very far from where they were in the 80s and 90s. Guys like John Boehner seem to be a dying breed.

There is a difference between bashing religion, and bashing A religion. Most people, especially in the GOP, are extremely religious, and bash Muslims not because of some appeal to rationality, but because of an appeal to Christianity.

That is because most conservatives don't actually interpret the bible the way it should be interpreted, otherwise they would be legislating for laws that call for the stoning of adulterers and punishment for things such as lust for another person's wife.

I think conservatives have more disdain for nations with Shariah Law, which is ironic because a few fringe conservatives still hold on to the idea that we shouldn't have separation of church and state, but I digress.

The religious right is also not something I care to associate with a conservative position. Maybe that's just me, but I'd rather leave my faith at the door when it comes to politics. Then again, maybe I'm not really conservative but more libertarian, since I'm generally socially progressive...just very fiscally conservative.

Same here, except on abortion, but it's not too hard to find Pro-Life libertarians.

Other then that two consenting rational actors should be able to do anything they want, or one (to them-self).
BlackSand
Posts: 21
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8/24/2013 6:40:19 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
I'd say its not so much about education as it is about blindly following politicians/media and pride. And both sides do it. I detest talking with many republicans because they use no logic and refuse to change. I detest many liberals because they believe they are so high and mighty that they listen to no logic that doesnt support their own views. The left has a lot better PR though. The democratic party has got political talk down to a science. Obama is a master at manipulating words. Where as the republicans just kind of fumble all over the place with no real direction.

IMO. Democrats have about the same IQ as republicans. But theyre better politicians. And that's not exactly a good thing.
proglib
Posts: 391
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8/25/2013 12:06:47 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 8/23/2013 10:44:10 PM, YYW wrote:
At 8/22/2013 11:19:58 PM, proglib wrote:
It has occurred to me quite a few times in the last couple years or so that the anti-intellectual far right, including much of the TEA--and unfortunately some of the Grand Old--Party is becoming something of a New Know Nothing Party.*

Not that I'm disagreeing with that assessment, but I would be interested to know what you mean when you say "anti-intelectual."

First, let me say that I'm glad Lordnukle and 000ike, and ConservativeAmerican and wrichcirw had some dialogue. I was starting to think that my poor choice of words would doom this topic.

Also, I'm glad to help provide some laughs for Donald.Keller:

This is the largest, funniest mosh pit of Ad Hominem I've ever seen lol.

Again, I didn't mean to say that conservatives are stupider than liberals, or Republicans than Democrats, though obviously that's what came across.

As YYW is addressing in his question, I meant to raise concern about the acquiescence and encouragement "common sense, the old way is best, we're right, don't confuse me with the evidence" way of thinking, along with a primitive, nativist, love-it-or-leave-it, 'merica right or wrong" culture. Putting rednecks on a pedestal is a part of it. [Don't think I'm anti-redneck. My dad was one. One of my favorite brothers is one.]

Encouraging or turning a blind eye to the snake oil hucksterism of folks like Glenn Beck is a part of what I'm talking about. Sure the left has its Keith Olbermann's and others. (I don't watch that sh!t since we got rid of cable, so I can't name his successors on MSNBC. I will say when I've seen them, I've found them un-watchable.) The thing is, as obnoxious as Olbermann is (and was on MSNBC when my wife and I did watch him), he goes out of his way to be smart, intellectual and challenge his viewers' brains a bit. (Along with a bunch of propagandistic drek, but in a more intellectual, less insulting to the brain, way, IMHO.)

This is what I'm trying to get at with my critique of the anti-intellectualism of the far right.

They do dumb as a board stuff like harping on birtherism long, "palling [sp?] around with terrorists," "fellow Muslim" long after this has been seen by anyone with a three digit IQ as crying wolf.

If the 2012 election had been framed in the majority of voters' minds as a free market, successful businessman with a clear plan to turn the economy around versus a big government, big spending liberal who had failed for four years, we could have had an intelligent conversation about the two choices in economic models. Personally I think Romney would have walked away with the election.

However, well into the summer and perhaps the fall of 2012 many, many people on the right were still questioning Obama's birthplace and religion.

This is just stupid, IMHO. Any half-bright child knows the story of the boy who cried wolf, and knows enough to come up with a more realistic story after being caught in exaggeration several times. A weasel or a fox is dangerous to the chicken coop, too!

Again, call him a big spending liberal. Say it over and over again. Get LOTS of big business folks to say it--over and over again.

You may or may not be right on the economics of it. I may or may not agree with you. But I won't call you stupid.
"I would remind you that extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice.* And let me remind you also that moderation in the pursuit of justice is no virtue." Barry Goldwater
*Except in a democracy it might lose you an election.

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