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The gov shutdown discussion for all views.

Sitara
Posts: 745
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10/1/2013 11:12:42 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
This is not an effective solution. Many people have paychecks that depend on the government working (gov employees), many disabled people on welfare, etc. The people shutting down the government over access to healthcare are immature hateful brats with God complexes that need to have their paychecks revoked until they do their job. Hey, they DO say "no work, no pay", right?
ConservativeAmerican
Posts: 1,676
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10/2/2013 8:19:56 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/1/2013 11:12:42 PM, Sitara wrote:
This is not an effective solution. Many people have paychecks that depend on the government working (gov employees), many disabled people on welfare, etc. The people shutting down the government over access to healthcare are immature hateful brats with God complexes that need to have their paychecks revoked until they do their job. Hey, they DO say "no work, no pay", right?

They are representing the views of their constituency, therefore they are working.
Sitara
Posts: 745
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10/2/2013 9:10:40 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/2/2013 8:19:56 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
At 10/1/2013 11:12:42 PM, Sitara wrote:
This is not an effective solution. Many people have paychecks that depend on the government working (gov employees), many disabled people on welfare, etc. The people shutting down the government over access to healthcare are immature hateful brats with God complexes that need to have their paychecks revoked until they do their job. Hey, they DO say "no work, no pay", right?

They are representing the views of their constituency, therefore they are working.

No, they are immature fascist brats throwing temper tantrums because Obama want to give people healthcare. How dare that nice colored boy actually help people?! End satire.
Khaos_Mage
Posts: 23,214
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10/3/2013 3:07:42 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/2/2013 9:10:40 PM, Sitara wrote:
At 10/2/2013 8:19:56 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
At 10/1/2013 11:12:42 PM, Sitara wrote:
This is not an effective solution. Many people have paychecks that depend on the government working (gov employees), many disabled people on welfare, etc. The people shutting down the government over access to healthcare are immature hateful brats with God complexes that need to have their paychecks revoked until they do their job. Hey, they DO say "no work, no pay", right?

They are representing the views of their constituency, therefore they are working.

No, they are immature fascist brats throwing temper tantrums because Obama want to give people healthcare. How dare that nice colored boy actually help people?! End satire.

According to this definition: http://www.merriam-webster.com...
It appears the Democrats are the fascists by forcing people to engage in commerce.

And, whether people will overall be helped remains to be seen. For me personally, this hurts me, since I will now be forced to spend hundreds of dollars on health insurance (and I still can't find a policy I want, because the fascists have minimum requirements), or pay a tax, er, penalty.
My work here is, finally, done.
muzebreak
Posts: 2,781
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10/3/2013 4:33:04 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/3/2013 3:07:42 AM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
At 10/2/2013 9:10:40 PM, Sitara wrote:
At 10/2/2013 8:19:56 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
At 10/1/2013 11:12:42 PM, Sitara wrote:
This is not an effective solution. Many people have paychecks that depend on the government working (gov employees), many disabled people on welfare, etc. The people shutting down the government over access to healthcare are immature hateful brats with God complexes that need to have their paychecks revoked until they do their job. Hey, they DO say "no work, no pay", right?

They are representing the views of their constituency, therefore they are working.

No, they are immature fascist brats throwing temper tantrums because Obama want to give people healthcare. How dare that nice colored boy actually help people?! End satire.

According to this definition: http://www.merriam-webster.com...
It appears the Democrats are the fascists by forcing people to engage in commerce.

And, whether people will overall be helped remains to be seen. For me personally, this hurts me, since I will now be forced to spend hundreds of dollars on health insurance (and I still can't find a policy I want, because the fascists have minimum requirements), or pay a tax, er, penalty.

You; watch this: http://www.upworthy.com...

This should also be watched by everyone else who comes across it, but especially those who don't support government run health care.
"Every kid starts out as a natural-born scientist, and then we beat it out of them. A few trickle through the system with their wonder and enthusiasm for science intact." - Carl Sagan

This is the response of the defenders of Sparta to the Commander of the Roman Army: "If you are a god, you will not hurt those who have never injured you. If you are a man, advance - you will find men equal to yourself. And women.
Khaos_Mage
Posts: 23,214
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10/3/2013 11:01:14 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/3/2013 4:33:04 AM, muzebreak wrote:
At 10/3/2013 3:07:42 AM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
At 10/2/2013 9:10:40 PM, Sitara wrote:
At 10/2/2013 8:19:56 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
At 10/1/2013 11:12:42 PM, Sitara wrote:
This is not an effective solution. Many people have paychecks that depend on the government working (gov employees), many disabled people on welfare, etc. The people shutting down the government over access to healthcare are immature hateful brats with God complexes that need to have their paychecks revoked until they do their job. Hey, they DO say "no work, no pay", right?

They are representing the views of their constituency, therefore they are working.

No, they are immature fascist brats throwing temper tantrums because Obama want to give people healthcare. How dare that nice colored boy actually help people?! End satire.

According to this definition: http://www.merriam-webster.com...
It appears the Democrats are the fascists by forcing people to engage in commerce.

And, whether people will overall be helped remains to be seen. For me personally, this hurts me, since I will now be forced to spend hundreds of dollars on health insurance (and I still can't find a policy I want, because the fascists have minimum requirements), or pay a tax, er, penalty.

You; watch this: http://www.upworthy.com...

This should also be watched by everyone else who comes across it, but especially those who don't support government run health care.

Yeah, I've seen it. What's your point?
It doesn't refute my point that it is fascism, since at no point does he address the core issue, IMO, of forcing people to engage in commerce in a country where freedoms are founding principles.

What?!? Monopolies can offer better/more efficient services than 10 companies doing the same thing (i.e. wasting advertising dollars). No way!!
My work here is, finally, done.
Khaos_Mage
Posts: 23,214
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10/3/2013 11:03:17 AM
Posted: 3 years ago
To be fair,
I am actually quite opposed to this shutdown. It is stupid from all levels.

If the Republicans truly believe that Obamacare is bad, then why hinder it at all? If anything, they should accelerate it, and deny any delays or exceptions. This way, when its effects are felt, it rests solely on the Democrats who pasted it.

This would be party politics at its "finest".
My work here is, finally, done.
muzebreak
Posts: 2,781
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10/3/2013 1:39:58 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/3/2013 11:01:14 AM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
At 10/3/2013 4:33:04 AM, muzebreak wrote:
At 10/3/2013 3:07:42 AM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
At 10/2/2013 9:10:40 PM, Sitara wrote:
At 10/2/2013 8:19:56 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
At 10/1/2013 11:12:42 PM, Sitara wrote:
This is not an effective solution. Many people have paychecks that depend on the government working (gov employees), many disabled people on welfare, etc. The people shutting down the government over access to healthcare are immature hateful brats with God complexes that need to have their paychecks revoked until they do their job. Hey, they DO say "no work, no pay", right?

They are representing the views of their constituency, therefore they are working.

No, they are immature fascist brats throwing temper tantrums because Obama want to give people healthcare. How dare that nice colored boy actually help people?! End satire.

According to this definition: http://www.merriam-webster.com...
It appears the Democrats are the fascists by forcing people to engage in commerce.

And, whether people will overall be helped remains to be seen. For me personally, this hurts me, since I will now be forced to spend hundreds of dollars on health insurance (and I still can't find a policy I want, because the fascists have minimum requirements), or pay a tax, er, penalty.

You; watch this: http://www.upworthy.com...

This should also be watched by everyone else who comes across it, but especially those who don't support government run health care.

Yeah, I've seen it. What's your point?
It doesn't refute my point that it is fascism, since at no point does he address the core issue, IMO, of forcing people to engage in commerce in a country where freedoms are founding principles.

What?!? Monopolies can offer better/more efficient services than 10 companies doing the same thing (i.e. wasting advertising dollars). No way!!

A: It's not fascism. If it is, then so are all taxes
B: which would you prefer, a national health care fund that gives the government haggling power, allowing for cheaper medical care. This results in the average middle class joe schmo paying as much as they do now for health care, if not less. And that helps those in dire need of health care? Or would you rather simply paying out the a"" for ridiculously overpriced healthcare, many people, including possibly yourself, dying because they cannot afford said overpriced healthcare?
C: let's say you do end up paying more for healthcare than you do now, even though no other countries do. Are you seriously saying you'd rather have that money, than for it to go to someone who's going to use it pay for cancer treatments, rather than the cushy retirement you'd spend it on?
"Every kid starts out as a natural-born scientist, and then we beat it out of them. A few trickle through the system with their wonder and enthusiasm for science intact." - Carl Sagan

This is the response of the defenders of Sparta to the Commander of the Roman Army: "If you are a god, you will not hurt those who have never injured you. If you are a man, advance - you will find men equal to yourself. And women.
muzebreak
Posts: 2,781
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10/3/2013 1:42:35 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/3/2013 11:03:17 AM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
To be fair,
I am actually quite opposed to this shutdown. It is stupid from all levels.

If the Republicans truly believe that Obamacare is bad, then why hinder it at all? If anything, they should accelerate it, and deny any delays or exceptions. This way, when its effects are felt, it rests solely on the Democrats who pasted it.

This would be party politics at its "finest".

Because the vast majority of republicans aren't intelligent enough to understand that ploy, and they don't want to look bad in front of their stupid masses.
"Every kid starts out as a natural-born scientist, and then we beat it out of them. A few trickle through the system with their wonder and enthusiasm for science intact." - Carl Sagan

This is the response of the defenders of Sparta to the Commander of the Roman Army: "If you are a god, you will not hurt those who have never injured you. If you are a man, advance - you will find men equal to yourself. And women.
Sitara
Posts: 745
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10/3/2013 3:04:13 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/3/2013 3:07:42 AM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
At 10/2/2013 9:10:40 PM, Sitara wrote:
At 10/2/2013 8:19:56 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
At 10/1/2013 11:12:42 PM, Sitara wrote:
This is not an effective solution. Many people have paychecks that depend on the government working (gov employees), many disabled people on welfare, etc. The people shutting down the government over access to healthcare are immature hateful brats with God complexes that need to have their paychecks revoked until they do their job. Hey, they DO say "no work, no pay", right?

They are representing the views of their constituency, therefore they are working.

No, they are immature fascist brats throwing temper tantrums because Obama want to give people healthcare. How dare that nice colored boy actually help people?! End satire.

According to this definition: http://www.merriam-webster.com...
It appears the Democrats are the fascists by forcing people to engage in commerce.

And, whether people will overall be helped remains to be seen. For me personally, this hurts me, since I will now be forced to spend hundreds of dollars on health insurance (and I still can't find a policy I want, because the fascists have minimum requirements), or pay a tax, er, penalty.
No, the Democrats espouse a variety of views, but most are socialist. There is a difference between, capitalism, fascism, socialism, and communism. Please do not post again until you know the difference.
Sitara
Posts: 745
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10/3/2013 3:05:33 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/3/2013 1:39:58 PM, muzebreak wrote:
At 10/3/2013 11:01:14 AM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
At 10/3/2013 4:33:04 AM, muzebreak wrote:
At 10/3/2013 3:07:42 AM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
At 10/2/2013 9:10:40 PM, Sitara wrote:
At 10/2/2013 8:19:56 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
At 10/1/2013 11:12:42 PM, Sitara wrote:
This is not an effective solution. Many people have paychecks that depend on the government working (gov employees), many disabled people on welfare, etc. The people shutting down the government over access to healthcare are immature hateful brats with God complexes that need to have their paychecks revoked until they do their job. Hey, they DO say "no work, no pay", right?

They are representing the views of their constituency, therefore they are working.

No, they are immature fascist brats throwing temper tantrums because Obama want to give people healthcare. How dare that nice colored boy actually help people?! End satire.

According to this definition: http://www.merriam-webster.com...
It appears the Democrats are the fascists by forcing people to engage in commerce.

And, whether people will overall be helped remains to be seen. For me personally, this hurts me, since I will now be forced to spend hundreds of dollars on health insurance (and I still can't find a policy I want, because the fascists have minimum requirements), or pay a tax, er, penalty.

You; watch this: http://www.upworthy.com...

This should also be watched by everyone else who comes across it, but especially those who don't support government run health care.

Yeah, I've seen it. What's your point?
It doesn't refute my point that it is fascism, since at no point does he address the core issue, IMO, of forcing people to engage in commerce in a country where freedoms are founding principles.

What?!? Monopolies can offer better/more efficient services than 10 companies doing the same thing (i.e. wasting advertising dollars). No way!!

A: It's not fascism. If it is, then so are all taxes
B: which would you prefer, a national health care fund that gives the government haggling power, allowing for cheaper medical care. This results in the average middle class joe schmo paying as much as they do now for health care, if not less. And that helps those in dire need of health care? Or would you rather simply paying out the a"" for ridiculously overpriced healthcare, many people, including possibly yourself, dying because they cannot afford said overpriced healthcare?
C: let's say you do end up paying more for healthcare than you do now, even though no other countries do. Are you seriously saying you'd rather have that money, than for it to go to someone who's going to use it pay for cancer treatments, rather than the cushy retirement you'd spend it on?
Awesome person of the week: you.
Khaos_Mage
Posts: 23,214
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10/3/2013 3:24:16 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/3/2013 3:04:13 PM, Sitara wrote:
At 10/3/2013 3:07:42 AM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
At 10/2/2013 9:10:40 PM, Sitara wrote:
At 10/2/2013 8:19:56 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
At 10/1/2013 11:12:42 PM, Sitara wrote:
This is not an effective solution. Many people have paychecks that depend on the government working (gov employees), many disabled people on welfare, etc. The people shutting down the government over access to healthcare are immature hateful brats with God complexes that need to have their paychecks revoked until they do their job. Hey, they DO say "no work, no pay", right?

They are representing the views of their constituency, therefore they are working.

No, they are immature fascist brats throwing temper tantrums because Obama want to give people healthcare. How dare that nice colored boy actually help people?! End satire.

According to this definition: http://www.merriam-webster.com...
It appears the Democrats are the fascists by forcing people to engage in commerce.

And, whether people will overall be helped remains to be seen. For me personally, this hurts me, since I will now be forced to spend hundreds of dollars on health insurance (and I still can't find a policy I want, because the fascists have minimum requirements), or pay a tax, er, penalty.
No, the Democrats espouse a variety of views, but most are socialist. There is a difference between, capitalism, fascism, socialism, and communism. Please do not post again until you know the difference.

Wow, what a civil response...
That's okay, since you are clearly not the brightest.

Why do you not tell me what these differences are, when clearly I am incapable of finding the answer?
My work here is, finally, done.
Khaos_Mage
Posts: 23,214
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10/3/2013 3:34:26 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/3/2013 3:04:13 PM, Sitara wrote:
At 10/3/2013 3:07:42 AM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
At 10/2/2013 9:10:40 PM, Sitara wrote:
At 10/2/2013 8:19:56 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
At 10/1/2013 11:12:42 PM, Sitara wrote:
This is not an effective solution. Many people have paychecks that depend on the government working (gov employees), many disabled people on welfare, etc. The people shutting down the government over access to healthcare are immature hateful brats with God complexes that need to have their paychecks revoked until they do their job. Hey, they DO say "no work, no pay", right?

They are representing the views of their constituency, therefore they are working.

No, they are immature fascist brats throwing temper tantrums because Obama want to give people healthcare. How dare that nice colored boy actually help people?! End satire.

According to this definition: http://www.merriam-webster.com...
It appears the Democrats are the fascists by forcing people to engage in commerce.

And, whether people will overall be helped remains to be seen. For me personally, this hurts me, since I will now be forced to spend hundreds of dollars on health insurance (and I still can't find a policy I want, because the fascists have minimum requirements), or pay a tax, er, penalty.
No, the Democrats espouse a variety of views, but most are socialist. There is a difference between, capitalism, fascism, socialism, and communism. Please do not post again until you know the difference.

Given your definition here: http://www.debate.org...
How is Obamacare not a fascist policy?
It:
1. forces you to engage in commerce (economy)
2. regulates the product that is consumed/offered
3. regulates how the business operates
4. certain corporations are granted access to these exchanges

How does this not fit the definition of fascism?
If it doesn't what policy does this fall under?
My work here is, finally, done.
Sitara
Posts: 745
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10/3/2013 3:49:30 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/3/2013 3:24:16 PM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
At 10/3/2013 3:04:13 PM, Sitara wrote:
At 10/3/2013 3:07:42 AM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
At 10/2/2013 9:10:40 PM, Sitara wrote:
At 10/2/2013 8:19:56 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
At 10/1/2013 11:12:42 PM, Sitara wrote:
This is not an effective solution. Many people have paychecks that depend on the government working (gov employees), many disabled people on welfare, etc. The people shutting down the government over access to healthcare are immature hateful brats with God complexes that need to have their paychecks revoked until they do their job. Hey, they DO say "no work, no pay", right?

They are representing the views of their constituency, therefore they are working.

No, they are immature fascist brats throwing temper tantrums because Obama want to give people healthcare. How dare that nice colored boy actually help people?! End satire.

According to this definition: http://www.merriam-webster.com...
It appears the Democrats are the fascists by forcing people to engage in commerce.

And, whether people will overall be helped remains to be seen. For me personally, this hurts me, since I will now be forced to spend hundreds of dollars on health insurance (and I still can't find a policy I want, because the fascists have minimum requirements), or pay a tax, er, penalty.
No, the Democrats espouse a variety of views, but most are socialist. There is a difference between, capitalism, fascism, socialism, and communism. Please do not post again until you know the difference.

Wow, what a civil response...
That's okay, since you are clearly not the brightest.

Why do you not tell me what these differences are, when clearly I am incapable of finding the answer?
And clearly you are incapable of logic and civility. Do I have to define those for you too?
muzebreak
Posts: 2,781
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10/3/2013 3:51:14 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/3/2013 3:34:26 PM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
At 10/3/2013 3:04:13 PM, Sitara wrote:
At 10/3/2013 3:07:42 AM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
At 10/2/2013 9:10:40 PM, Sitara wrote:
At 10/2/2013 8:19:56 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
At 10/1/2013 11:12:42 PM, Sitara wrote:
This is not an effective solution. Many people have paychecks that depend on the government working (gov employees), many disabled people on welfare, etc. The people shutting down the government over access to healthcare are immature hateful brats with God complexes that need to have their paychecks revoked until they do their job. Hey, they DO say "no work, no pay", right?

They are representing the views of their constituency, therefore they are working.

No, they are immature fascist brats throwing temper tantrums because Obama want to give people healthcare. How dare that nice colored boy actually help people?! End satire.

According to this definition: http://www.merriam-webster.com...
It appears the Democrats are the fascists by forcing people to engage in commerce.

And, whether people will overall be helped remains to be seen. For me personally, this hurts me, since I will now be forced to spend hundreds of dollars on health insurance (and I still can't find a policy I want, because the fascists have minimum requirements), or pay a tax, er, penalty.
No, the Democrats espouse a variety of views, but most are socialist. There is a difference between, capitalism, fascism, socialism, and communism. Please do not post again until you know the difference.

Given your definition here: http://www.debate.org...
How is Obamacare not a fascist policy?
It:
1. forces you to engage in commerce (economy)
2. regulates the product that is consumed/offered
3. regulates how the business operates
4. certain corporations are granted access to these exchanges

How does this not fit the definition of fascism?
If it doesn't what policy does this fall under?

Under these paradigms: fascism is stealing from the poor to give to the rich, communism is the opposite. Obamacare is communism, assuming taxation is equivalent to stealing.
"Every kid starts out as a natural-born scientist, and then we beat it out of them. A few trickle through the system with their wonder and enthusiasm for science intact." - Carl Sagan

This is the response of the defenders of Sparta to the Commander of the Roman Army: "If you are a god, you will not hurt those who have never injured you. If you are a man, advance - you will find men equal to yourself. And women.
Sitara
Posts: 745
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10/3/2013 3:51:21 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/3/2013 3:24:16 PM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
At 10/3/2013 3:04:13 PM, Sitara wrote:
At 10/3/2013 3:07:42 AM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
At 10/2/2013 9:10:40 PM, Sitara wrote:
At 10/2/2013 8:19:56 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
At 10/1/2013 11:12:42 PM, Sitara wrote:
This is not an effective solution. Many people have paychecks that depend on the government working (gov employees), many disabled people on welfare, etc. The people shutting down the government over access to healthcare are immature hateful brats with God complexes that need to have their paychecks revoked until they do their job. Hey, they DO say "no work, no pay", right?

They are representing the views of their constituency, therefore they are working.

No, they are immature fascist brats throwing temper tantrums because Obama want to give people healthcare. How dare that nice colored boy actually help people?! End satire.

According to this definition: http://www.merriam-webster.com...
It appears the Democrats are the fascists by forcing people to engage in commerce.

And, whether people will overall be helped remains to be seen. For me personally, this hurts me, since I will now be forced to spend hundreds of dollars on health insurance (and I still can't find a policy I want, because the fascists have minimum requirements), or pay a tax, er, penalty.
No, the Democrats espouse a variety of views, but most are socialist. There is a difference between, capitalism, fascism, socialism, and communism. Please do not post again until you know the difference.

Wow, what a civil response...
That's okay, since you are clearly not the brightest.

Why do you not tell me what these differences are, when clearly I am incapable of finding the answer?

http://www.debate.org...
Khaos_Mage
Posts: 23,214
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10/3/2013 3:52:39 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/3/2013 3:49:30 PM, Sitara wrote:
At 10/3/2013 3:24:16 PM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
At 10/3/2013 3:04:13 PM, Sitara wrote:
At 10/3/2013 3:07:42 AM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
At 10/2/2013 9:10:40 PM, Sitara wrote:
At 10/2/2013 8:19:56 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
At 10/1/2013 11:12:42 PM, Sitara wrote:
This is not an effective solution. Many people have paychecks that depend on the government working (gov employees), many disabled people on welfare, etc. The people shutting down the government over access to healthcare are immature hateful brats with God complexes that need to have their paychecks revoked until they do their job. Hey, they DO say "no work, no pay", right?

They are representing the views of their constituency, therefore they are working.

No, they are immature fascist brats throwing temper tantrums because Obama want to give people healthcare. How dare that nice colored boy actually help people?! End satire.

According to this definition: http://www.merriam-webster.com...
It appears the Democrats are the fascists by forcing people to engage in commerce.

And, whether people will overall be helped remains to be seen. For me personally, this hurts me, since I will now be forced to spend hundreds of dollars on health insurance (and I still can't find a policy I want, because the fascists have minimum requirements), or pay a tax, er, penalty.
No, the Democrats espouse a variety of views, but most are socialist. There is a difference between, capitalism, fascism, socialism, and communism. Please do not post again until you know the difference.

Wow, what a civil response...
That's okay, since you are clearly not the brightest.

Why do you not tell me what these differences are, when clearly I am incapable of finding the answer?
And clearly you are incapable of logic and civility. Do I have to define those for you too?

How is Obamacare anything other than fascist, given your four choices and their definitions?

Why should I be civil when you are being condescending?
Further, whose being illogical? Look at my comment about fascists. How many policies of Democrats force one to engage in commerce? None that I can think of, except for ACA. So, clearly, I was referring to one specific policy.
My work here is, finally, done.
Sitara
Posts: 745
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10/3/2013 3:52:53 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/3/2013 11:03:17 AM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
To be fair,
I am actually quite opposed to this shutdown. It is stupid from all levels.

If the Republicans truly believe that Obamacare is bad, then why hinder it at all? If anything, they should accelerate it, and deny any delays or exceptions. This way, when its effects are felt, it rests solely on the Democrats who pasted it.

This would be party politics at its "finest".

Yeah, shame on that colored boy for offering healthcare. The horror! End satire.
Khaos_Mage
Posts: 23,214
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10/3/2013 3:57:17 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/3/2013 3:51:14 PM, muzebreak wrote:
At 10/3/2013 3:34:26 PM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
At 10/3/2013 3:04:13 PM, Sitara wrote:
At 10/3/2013 3:07:42 AM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
At 10/2/2013 9:10:40 PM, Sitara wrote:
At 10/2/2013 8:19:56 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
At 10/1/2013 11:12:42 PM, Sitara wrote:
This is not an effective solution. Many people have paychecks that depend on the government working (gov employees), many disabled people on welfare, etc. The people shutting down the government over access to healthcare are immature hateful brats with God complexes that need to have their paychecks revoked until they do their job. Hey, they DO say "no work, no pay", right?

They are representing the views of their constituency, therefore they are working.

No, they are immature fascist brats throwing temper tantrums because Obama want to give people healthcare. How dare that nice colored boy actually help people?! End satire.

According to this definition: http://www.merriam-webster.com...
It appears the Democrats are the fascists by forcing people to engage in commerce.

And, whether people will overall be helped remains to be seen. For me personally, this hurts me, since I will now be forced to spend hundreds of dollars on health insurance (and I still can't find a policy I want, because the fascists have minimum requirements), or pay a tax, er, penalty.
No, the Democrats espouse a variety of views, but most are socialist. There is a difference between, capitalism, fascism, socialism, and communism. Please do not post again until you know the difference.

Given your definition here: http://www.debate.org...
How is Obamacare not a fascist policy?
It:
1. forces you to engage in commerce (economy)
2. regulates the product that is consumed/offered
3. regulates how the business operates
4. certain corporations are granted access to these exchanges

How does this not fit the definition of fascism?
If it doesn't what policy does this fall under?

Under these paradigms: fascism is stealing from the poor to give to the rich, communism is the opposite. Obamacare is communism, assuming taxation is equivalent to stealing.

I would agree with you if the state controlled and provided the product.
It is not, the companies are.
Also, Obamacare will hurt the poor/middle class more than the rich. Who is being stolen from? It boils down to a flat tax, which liberals say is regressive. For me personally, I'll have to spend money on either insurance I can't afford (although the government says I can) or between $190 - $2% of my income. The rich are in the same boat, but it hurts them less.
My work here is, finally, done.
Khaos_Mage
Posts: 23,214
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10/3/2013 3:58:14 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/3/2013 3:52:53 PM, Sitara wrote:
At 10/3/2013 11:03:17 AM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
To be fair,
I am actually quite opposed to this shutdown. It is stupid from all levels.

If the Republicans truly believe that Obamacare is bad, then why hinder it at all? If anything, they should accelerate it, and deny any delays or exceptions. This way, when its effects are felt, it rests solely on the Democrats who pasted it.

This would be party politics at its "finest".

Yeah, shame on that colored boy for offering healthcare. The horror! End satire.
Civility?
My work here is, finally, done.
Khaos_Mage
Posts: 23,214
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10/3/2013 3:59:31 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/3/2013 3:51:21 PM, Sitara wrote:
At 10/3/2013 3:24:16 PM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
At 10/3/2013 3:04:13 PM, Sitara wrote:
At 10/3/2013 3:07:42 AM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
At 10/2/2013 9:10:40 PM, Sitara wrote:
At 10/2/2013 8:19:56 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
At 10/1/2013 11:12:42 PM, Sitara wrote:
This is not an effective solution. Many people have paychecks that depend on the government working (gov employees), many disabled people on welfare, etc. The people shutting down the government over access to healthcare are immature hateful brats with God complexes that need to have their paychecks revoked until they do their job. Hey, they DO say "no work, no pay", right?

They are representing the views of their constituency, therefore they are working.

No, they are immature fascist brats throwing temper tantrums because Obama want to give people healthcare. How dare that nice colored boy actually help people?! End satire.

According to this definition: http://www.merriam-webster.com...
It appears the Democrats are the fascists by forcing people to engage in commerce.

And, whether people will overall be helped remains to be seen. For me personally, this hurts me, since I will now be forced to spend hundreds of dollars on health insurance (and I still can't find a policy I want, because the fascists have minimum requirements), or pay a tax, er, penalty.
No, the Democrats espouse a variety of views, but most are socialist. There is a difference between, capitalism, fascism, socialism, and communism. Please do not post again until you know the difference.

Wow, what a civil response...
That's okay, since you are clearly not the brightest.

Why do you not tell me what these differences are, when clearly I am incapable of finding the answer?

http://www.debate.org...

Cute.
You are aware that I posted that post about three minutes after you started that thread, right?
Further, I have already referenced it.
My work here is, finally, done.
muzebreak
Posts: 2,781
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10/3/2013 4:04:04 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/3/2013 3:52:39 PM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
At 10/3/2013 3:49:30 PM, Sitara wrote:
At 10/3/2013 3:24:16 PM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
At 10/3/2013 3:04:13 PM, Sitara wrote:
At 10/3/2013 3:07:42 AM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
At 10/2/2013 9:10:40 PM, Sitara wrote:
At 10/2/2013 8:19:56 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
At 10/1/2013 11:12:42 PM, Sitara wrote:
This is not an effective solution. Many people have paychecks that depend on the government working (gov employees), many disabled people on welfare, etc. The people shutting down the government over access to healthcare are immature hateful brats with God complexes that need to have their paychecks revoked until they do their job. Hey, they DO say "no work, no pay", right?

They are representing the views of their constituency, therefore they are working.

No, they are immature fascist brats throwing temper tantrums because Obama want to give people healthcare. How dare that nice colored boy actually help people?! End satire.

According to this definition: http://www.merriam-webster.com...
It appears the Democrats are the fascists by forcing people to engage in commerce.

And, whether people will overall be helped remains to be seen. For me personally, this hurts me, since I will now be forced to spend hundreds of dollars on health insurance (and I still can't find a policy I want, because the fascists have minimum requirements), or pay a tax, er, penalty.
No, the Democrats espouse a variety of views, but most are socialist. There is a difference between, capitalism, fascism, socialism, and communism. Please do not post again until you know the difference.

Wow, what a civil response...
That's okay, since you are clearly not the brightest.

Why do you not tell me what these differences are, when clearly I am incapable of finding the answer?
And clearly you are incapable of logic and civility. Do I have to define those for you too?

How is Obamacare anything other than fascist, given your four choices and their definitions?

Why should I be civil when you are being condescending?
Further, whose being illogical? Look at my comment about fascists. How many policies of Democrats force one to engage in commerce? None that I can think of, except for ACA. So, clearly, I was referring to one specific policy.

If forcing one to act in commerce is fascism, then all taxes are fascism. But it isn't fascism. Fascism is a regime ruled by a dictator, this is a democracy. If you'd like to compare obamacare to Mussolini's reign, then I suggest you talk to some survivors of his time in power, and see how they feel about that comparison. They'll likely laugh, if they aren't to busy being disgusted by your naivety.
"Every kid starts out as a natural-born scientist, and then we beat it out of them. A few trickle through the system with their wonder and enthusiasm for science intact." - Carl Sagan

This is the response of the defenders of Sparta to the Commander of the Roman Army: "If you are a god, you will not hurt those who have never injured you. If you are a man, advance - you will find men equal to yourself. And women.
Khaos_Mage
Posts: 23,214
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10/3/2013 4:09:15 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/3/2013 4:04:04 PM, muzebreak wrote:
At 10/3/2013 3:52:39 PM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
At 10/3/2013 3:49:30 PM, Sitara wrote:
At 10/3/2013 3:24:16 PM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
At 10/3/2013 3:04:13 PM, Sitara wrote:
At 10/3/2013 3:07:42 AM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
At 10/2/2013 9:10:40 PM, Sitara wrote:
At 10/2/2013 8:19:56 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
At 10/1/2013 11:12:42 PM, Sitara wrote:
This is not an effective solution. Many people have paychecks that depend on the government working (gov employees), many disabled people on welfare, etc. The people shutting down the government over access to healthcare are immature hateful brats with God complexes that need to have their paychecks revoked until they do their job. Hey, they DO say "no work, no pay", right?

They are representing the views of their constituency, therefore they are working.

No, they are immature fascist brats throwing temper tantrums because Obama want to give people healthcare. How dare that nice colored boy actually help people?! End satire.

According to this definition: http://www.merriam-webster.com...
It appears the Democrats are the fascists by forcing people to engage in commerce.

And, whether people will overall be helped remains to be seen. For me personally, this hurts me, since I will now be forced to spend hundreds of dollars on health insurance (and I still can't find a policy I want, because the fascists have minimum requirements), or pay a tax, er, penalty.
No, the Democrats espouse a variety of views, but most are socialist. There is a difference between, capitalism, fascism, socialism, and communism. Please do not post again until you know the difference.

Wow, what a civil response...
That's okay, since you are clearly not the brightest.

Why do you not tell me what these differences are, when clearly I am incapable of finding the answer?
And clearly you are incapable of logic and civility. Do I have to define those for you too?

How is Obamacare anything other than fascist, given your four choices and their definitions?

Why should I be civil when you are being condescending?
Further, whose being illogical? Look at my comment about fascists. How many policies of Democrats force one to engage in commerce? None that I can think of, except for ACA. So, clearly, I was referring to one specific policy.

If forcing one to act in commerce is fascism, then all taxes are fascism. But it isn't fascism. Fascism is a regime ruled by a dictator, this is a democracy. If you'd like to compare obamacare to Mussolini's reign, then I suggest you talk to some survivors of his time in power, and see how they feel about that comparison. They'll likely laugh, if they aren't to busy being disgusted by your naivety.

I wasn't aware that my being taxed was engaging in commerce.
If I choose not to work, I am not taxed, am I?
There is a difference between being taxed as a result of commerce (income tax, sales tax) and being taxed for refusing to engage (ACA). Can you name me one other tax that I am assessed for not engaging in commerce?

If we are a democracy, and therefore no policy can be akin to another government type, then Republicans need to stop being called fascists, and Democrats need to stop being called Comunists/Socialists.
My work here is, finally, done.
muzebreak
Posts: 2,781
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10/3/2013 4:12:02 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/3/2013 3:57:17 PM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
At 10/3/2013 3:51:14 PM, muzebreak wrote:
At 10/3/2013 3:34:26 PM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
At 10/3/2013 3:04:13 PM, Sitara wrote:
At 10/3/2013 3:07:42 AM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
At 10/2/2013 9:10:40 PM, Sitara wrote:
At 10/2/2013 8:19:56 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
At 10/1/2013 11:12:42 PM, Sitara wrote:
This is not an effective solution. Many people have paychecks that depend on the government working (gov employees), many disabled people on welfare, etc. The people shutting down the government over access to healthcare are immature hateful brats with God complexes that need to have their paychecks revoked until they do their job. Hey, they DO say "no work, no pay", right?

They are representing the views of their constituency, therefore they are working.

No, they are immature fascist brats throwing temper tantrums because Obama want to give people healthcare. How dare that nice colored boy actually help people?! End satire.

According to this definition: http://www.merriam-webster.com...
It appears the Democrats are the fascists by forcing people to engage in commerce.

And, whether people will overall be helped remains to be seen. For me personally, this hurts me, since I will now be forced to spend hundreds of dollars on health insurance (and I still can't find a policy I want, because the fascists have minimum requirements), or pay a tax, er, penalty.
No, the Democrats espouse a variety of views, but most are socialist. There is a difference between, capitalism, fascism, socialism, and communism. Please do not post again until you know the difference.

Given your definition here: http://www.debate.org...
How is Obamacare not a fascist policy?
It:
1. forces you to engage in commerce (economy)
2. regulates the product that is consumed/offered
3. regulates how the business operates
4. certain corporations are granted access to these exchanges

How does this not fit the definition of fascism?
If it doesn't what policy does this fall under?

Under these paradigms: fascism is stealing from the poor to give to the rich, communism is the opposite. Obamacare is communism, assuming taxation is equivalent to stealing.

I would agree with you if the state controlled and provided the product.
It is not, the companies are.
Also, Obamacare will hurt the poor/middle class more than the rich. Who is being stolen from? It boils down to a flat tax, which liberals say is regressive. For me personally, I'll have to spend money on either insurance I can't afford (although the government says I can) or between $190 - $2% of my income. The rich are in the same boat, but it hurts them less.

What?

First off, how is Obamacare going on to hurt anyone? Saying it's going to hurt the poor more than the rich is meaningless if it hurts neither.

Secondly, what the hell do you mean you'll have to spend money on health insurance you can't afford, but the government says you can? Are you saying the taxation is too high? If that's the case, then why isn't everyone in your tax bracket up in arms about this?
Finally, it doesn't matter whether the state provides the product, or purchases it on our behalf. That distinction is completely irrelevant to anything I've said.
"Every kid starts out as a natural-born scientist, and then we beat it out of them. A few trickle through the system with their wonder and enthusiasm for science intact." - Carl Sagan

This is the response of the defenders of Sparta to the Commander of the Roman Army: "If you are a god, you will not hurt those who have never injured you. If you are a man, advance - you will find men equal to yourself. And women.
Khaos_Mage
Posts: 23,214
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10/3/2013 4:22:32 PM
Posted: 3 years ago
At 10/3/2013 4:12:02 PM, muzebreak wrote:
At 10/3/2013 3:57:17 PM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
At 10/3/2013 3:51:14 PM, muzebreak wrote:
At 10/3/2013 3:34:26 PM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
At 10/3/2013 3:04:13 PM, Sitara wrote:
At 10/3/2013 3:07:42 AM, Khaos_Mage wrote:
At 10/2/2013 9:10:40 PM, Sitara wrote:
At 10/2/2013 8:19:56 PM, ConservativeAmerican wrote:
At 10/1/2013 11:12:42 PM, Sitara wrote:
This is not an effective solution. Many people have paychecks that depend on the government working (gov employees), many disabled people on welfare, etc. The people shutting down the government over access to healthcare are immature hateful brats with God complexes that need to have their paychecks revoked until they do their job. Hey, they DO say "no work, no pay", right?

They are representing the views of their constituency, therefore they are working.

No, they are immature fascist brats throwing temper tantrums because Obama want to give people healthcare. How dare that nice colored boy actually help people?! End satire.

According to this definition: http://www.merriam-webster.com...
It appears the Democrats are the fascists by forcing people to engage in commerce.

And, whether people will overall be helped remains to be seen. For me personally, this hurts me, since I will now be forced to spend hundreds of dollars on health insurance (and I still can't find a policy I want, because the fascists have minimum requirements), or pay a tax, er, penalty.
No, the Democrats espouse a variety of views, but most are socialist. There is a difference between, capitalism, fascism, socialism, and communism. Please do not post again until you know the difference.

Given your definition here: http://www.debate.org...
How is Obamacare not a fascist policy?
It:
1. forces you to engage in commerce (economy)
2. regulates the product that is consumed/offered
3. regulates how the business operates
4. certain corporations are granted access to these exchanges

How does this not fit the definition of fascism?
If it doesn't what policy does this fall under?

Under these paradigms: fascism is stealing from the poor to give to the rich, communism is the opposite. Obamacare is communism, assuming taxation is equivalent to stealing.

I would agree with you if the state controlled and provided the product.
It is not, the companies are.
Also, Obamacare will hurt the poor/middle class more than the rich. Who is being stolen from? It boils down to a flat tax, which liberals say is regressive. For me personally, I'll have to spend money on either insurance I can't afford (although the government says I can) or between $190 - $2% of my income. The rich are in the same boat, but it hurts them less.

What?

First off, how is Obamacare going on to hurt anyone? Saying it's going to hurt the poor more than the rich is meaningless if it hurts neither.
I am referring to the fact that if insurance is not bought or the cost of purchasing said insurance is akin to a flax tax. It hurts the poor's pocket book more than the rich.

I am not saying there is no benefit (if they bought it, they have insurance, which is good), but me spending an additional 7% of my income for a product I don't want, or 2.5% for a tax because I didn't buy it, is not harming how?

Secondly, what the hell do you mean you'll have to spend money on health insurance you can't afford, but the government says you can? Are you saying the taxation is too high? If that's the case, then why isn't everyone in your tax bracket up in arms about this?
Tax bracket is the wrong term, but income level =/= ability to spend.
I have so much debt that I cannot afford a new pair of shoes. I am assuming most people are not in my particular predicament.
"even though the gov't says I can" is a reference to me not getting free insurance (subsidy or tax credit), so it hurts me, as I would be quite content not having health insurance.

Also, as to why people aren't up in arms about it. Because they are stupid.
Almost everyone I work with was unaware that they will now be forced to buy insurance. Of course, I work with a bunch of stoners at a pizza place, so that isn't all that surprising...
Finally, it doesn't matter whether the state provides the product, or purchases it on our behalf. That distinction is completely irrelevant to anything I've said.
I am unaware that either is being done. I thought I bought the insurance from the company through the exchanges (regulated by the government). But, this was more for my defense of saying its a fascist policy than anything else.
My work here is, finally, done.