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Why are you a Conservative/Republican?

LiberalLogic101
Posts: 5
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4/16/2014 4:52:02 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
Let me start by saying that to me, Conservative & Republican, Liberal & Democrat, are not synonymous.

Republican is a political affiliation, and Conservative is a moral/social ideology.

I would like for any Conservative, and/or Republican, to say why they are such.

I would be happy to defend my position as a Liberal and Democrat if you desire that.

- Mac
thett3
Posts: 14,371
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4/16/2014 5:32:17 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
This is a tough question to answer. First of all, I'm definitely not a Republican (but if I had to pick a party, I'd probably bandwagon with them). Part of the reason is because I believe in a natural order between man, God, and the state but I think that's more of an abstract concept that we can never reach. Personally, I don't even know what the ideal *is*, I just believe that it's there. And the idea of a natural order is a very traditional, conservative idea and that's why I've never given up the mantle of "Conservative" even when I was very libertarian. Now my political views could probably best be described as pragmatic more than conservative or libertarian (although my big issues are still super libertarian...maybe I'll get around to changing that one day). However I'll never stop calling myself a conservative because it's what I am.
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: At 11/12/2016 11:49:40 PM, Raisor wrote:
: thett was right
thett3
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4/16/2014 5:42:42 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
Why are you a liberal/democrat?
DDO Vice President

#StandwithBossy

#UnbanTheMadman

#BetOnThett

"Don't quote me, ever." -Max

"My name is max. I'm not a big fan of slacks"- Max rapping

"Walmart should have the opportunity to bribe a politician to it's agenda" -Max

"Thett, you're really good at convincing people you're a decent person"-tulle

"You fit the character of Regina George quite nicely"- Sam

: At 11/12/2016 11:49:40 PM, Raisor wrote:
: thett was right
Skynet
Posts: 674
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4/16/2014 5:44:45 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
Enjoy the cool temperatures. This thread will soon be FLAMED.

But not by me.

I'm a conservative in the American sense partly because the government is made up of other mere humans which don't necessarily know how I should spend my money and live. If my life is going to be run by a mere human, why not let it be a mere human that knows my life better than anyone else? Namely, me. In the end, I have to take responsibility for it anyway.

Economically, I think it is at the least well intentioned, but inefficient, and at it's worst, corrupt, to have large government programs to provide for those who don't work, from the wallets of those who do. Even for those who can't work, and here's why:

Taking money from those who work, no matter how wealthy, to give to those who work less or not at all is unfair, demoralizing, and encourages people to hide what they're doing to keep what they worked for. This partly explains Caiman Islands tax shelters, etc.

For those who can't work, don't mistake my position for cruelty. It is the responsibility of the family to take care of their own. If they have no family, people SHOULD give to the poor, but that moral comes with an important limit. If the giving is compulsory through taxation and redistribution, it is important to remember that the funds will be first filtered through people who are often by nature power hungry, and eager to win popularity contests. (Politicians) Not that the government is innately untrustworthy, but if you have a power-hungry person, they will gravitate towards acquiring positions of power. What's more powerful than sovereignty? Especially a popular sovereign?

The power hungry person does not have the best interests of the masses in mind, but his own ambition. The programs will not be aimed toward helping the poor beneficiaries, but the popularity or power of the sovereign.
One perk to being a dad is you get to watch cartoons again without explaining yourself.
LiberalLogic101
Posts: 5
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4/16/2014 6:54:55 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 4/16/2014 5:42:42 PM, thett3 wrote:
Why are you a liberal/democrat?

Liberal :

I am a liberal because I believe that LGBT people deserve equal rights, that abortion is a choice; in many cases an choice they shouldn't make, but a choice, nonetheless, that gun control, but not the absolutely ban of guns, is a positive change, that everyone deserves the same rights, that we need free healthcare, and that our border control is too harsh. That the death penalty is the idea of an eye and eye. I believe no matter what everyone should have freedom, but they should have protection and safety.

Democrat :

I am a Democrat because I believe the idea of a large government creates an air of "lost in the crowd" - for everyone. If the government is more spread out, you have a chance of actually having a voice. I believe in equality and love and hope for everyone, regardless of who they are. What they've done. I believe that fighting fire with fire is only going to make the forest go up faster.

I hope I answered your question.
thett3
Posts: 14,371
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4/17/2014 10:36:24 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 4/16/2014 6:54:55 PM, LiberalLogic101 wrote:
At 4/16/2014 5:42:42 PM, thett3 wrote:
Why are you a liberal/democrat?

Liberal :

I am a liberal because I believe that LGBT people deserve equal rights, that abortion is a choice; in many cases an choice they shouldn't make, but a choice, nonetheless, that gun control, but not the absolutely ban of guns, is a positive change, that everyone deserves the same rights, that we need free healthcare, and that our border control is too harsh. That the death penalty is the idea of an eye and eye. I believe no matter what everyone should have freedom, but they should have protection and safety.

Democrat :

I am a Democrat because I believe the idea of a large government creates an air of "lost in the crowd" - for everyone. If the government is more spread out, you have a chance of actually having a voice. I believe in equality and love and hope for everyone, regardless of who they are. What they've done. I believe that fighting fire with fire is only going to make the forest go up faster.

I hope I answered your question.

What I found most interesting about your answer is that you used your policy positions to explain your identification with an ideology, and you ideology for your rationale for supporting a party.

So looking at your response, I'm curious. Should the US pass all the reforms you want, would you cease to consider yourself a liberal and instead a conservative because you want to uphold the status quo?
DDO Vice President

#StandwithBossy

#UnbanTheMadman

#BetOnThett

"Don't quote me, ever." -Max

"My name is max. I'm not a big fan of slacks"- Max rapping

"Walmart should have the opportunity to bribe a politician to it's agenda" -Max

"Thett, you're really good at convincing people you're a decent person"-tulle

"You fit the character of Regina George quite nicely"- Sam

: At 11/12/2016 11:49:40 PM, Raisor wrote:
: thett was right
monty1
Posts: 1,084
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4/17/2014 11:59:49 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
In my opinion Americans are all basically the same politically. Too far right for the most part and the few others don't really matter. They're all just trying to figure out why they've been so thoroughly screwed by the 1 or 2 % and they're not getting a piece of the wealth/the pie.

In fact, the teabagger movement spearheaded by the Koch brothers and their ilk have hijacked too many of those lost souls trying to find their way and are motivating them to do exactly the opposite of what will elevate them out of their morass. And of course, racist hate for Obama made it all that much easier for the 1% to accomplish it.

If Americans are dumb enough to let it go too far then there will not be an opportunity to reverse the rabid right trend.

Say you heard it from a Canadian first!
progressivedem22
Posts: 1,304
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4/17/2014 12:07:40 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 4/17/2014 11:59:49 AM, monty1 wrote:
In my opinion Americans are all basically the same politically. Too far right for the most part and the few others don't really matter. They're all just trying to figure out why they've been so thoroughly screwed by the 1 or 2 % and they're not getting a piece of the wealth/the pie.

In fact, the teabagger movement spearheaded by the Koch brothers and their ilk have hijacked too many of those lost souls trying to find their way and are motivating them to do exactly the opposite of what will elevate them out of their morass. And of course, racist hate for Obama made it all that much easier for the 1% to accomplish it.

If Americans are dumb enough to let it go too far then there will not be an opportunity to reverse the rabid right trend.

Say you heard it from a Canadian first!

Is there a problem that I agree with practically every word you just said -- and I'm an American? I mean, everyone who knows me knows that I'm a super-lib, but seriously, this is so true.
monty1
Posts: 1,084
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4/17/2014 12:24:57 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 4/17/2014 12:07:40 PM, progressivedem22 wrote:
At 4/17/2014 11:59:49 AM, monty1 wrote:
In my opinion Americans are all basically the same politically. Too far right for the most part and the few others don't really matter. They're all just trying to figure out why they've been so thoroughly screwed by the 1 or 2 % and they're not getting a piece of the wealth/the pie.

In fact, the teabagger movement spearheaded by the Koch brothers and their ilk have hijacked too many of those lost souls trying to find their way and are motivating them to do exactly the opposite of what will elevate them out of their morass. And of course, racist hate for Obama made it all that much easier for the 1% to accomplish it.

If Americans are dumb enough to let it go too far then there will not be an opportunity to reverse the rabid right trend.

Say you heard it from a Canadian first!

Is there a problem that I agree with practically every word you just said -- and I'm an American? I mean, everyone who knows me knows that I'm a super-lib, but seriously, this is so true.

Thank you! I only have to wonder why more Americans aren't getting the obvious that you so ably understand. In any case, I think that American politics is at a tipping point now, or at least as close as it will ever get to a complete defeat of the will of the American people.

Thankfully, it appears that teabaggery is being defeated in favour of a more sane and sensible middle ground right. Besides that, I have some condifence that a lot of that kind of trash politics will be defused with the end of Obama's second term and consequently the end of racist hate that has motivated the extremists.

Is it too early to say that it was a 'very close call' with total corruption of the American system of capitalism? Can socially responsible capitalism arise out of this mess the right has created?
SemperVI
Posts: 294
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4/18/2014 1:16:44 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 4/16/2014 4:52:02 PM, LiberalLogic101 wrote:
Let me start by saying that to me, Conservative & Republican, Liberal & Democrat, are not synonymous.

Republican is a political affiliation, and Conservative is a moral/social ideology.

I would like for any Conservative, and/or Republican, to say why they are such.

I would be happy to defend my position as a Liberal and Democrat if you desire that.

- Mac

The problem is not ideology, if it was - our society would not be so polarized. The problem is there is no difference between a democrat or republican. It is about power and influence over you. Its about politics, it is about money and control. They both are serving to the same end, getting you to carry the water for them. If and when you finally realize this, you will realize your opinion really does not matter, never did and that it was all a con. It does not matter what side of the politics you fall under. The only thing that matters is that you pick a side, and agree with everything they tell you to agree with.
monty1
Posts: 1,084
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4/18/2014 1:22:25 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 4/18/2014 1:16:44 PM, SemperVI wrote:
At 4/16/2014 4:52:02 PM, LiberalLogic101 wrote:
Let me start by saying that to me, Conservative & Republican, Liberal & Democrat, are not synonymous.

Republican is a political affiliation, and Conservative is a moral/social ideology.

I would like for any Conservative, and/or Republican, to say why they are such.

I would be happy to defend my position as a Liberal and Democrat if you desire that.

- Mac

The problem is not ideology, if it was - our society would not be so polarized. The problem is there is no difference between a democrat or republican. It is about power and influence over you. Its about politics, it is about money and control. They both are serving to the same end, getting you to carry the water for them. If and when you finally realize this, you will realize your opinion really does not matter, never did and that it was all a con. It does not matter what side of the politics you fall under. The only thing that matters is that you pick a side, and agree with everything they tell you to agree with.

Here's something more accurate for you. The problem is that America's poor and middle class have been snookered by teabaggery and they no longer understand what side their bread is buttered on. Get it?

If you all don't get it pretty soon then you will have lost any chance to turn around the rot the Koch brothers and their ilk have visited on your democratic republic!
SemperVI
Posts: 294
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4/18/2014 1:31:21 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 4/18/2014 1:22:25 PM, monty1 wrote:
At 4/18/2014 1:16:44 PM, SemperVI wrote:
At 4/16/2014 4:52:02 PM, LiberalLogic101 wrote:
Let me start by saying that to me, Conservative & Republican, Liberal & Democrat, are not synonymous.

Republican is a political affiliation, and Conservative is a moral/social ideology.

I would like for any Conservative, and/or Republican, to say why they are such.

I would be happy to defend my position as a Liberal and Democrat if you desire that.

- Mac

The problem is not ideology, if it was - our society would not be so polarized. The problem is there is no difference between a democrat or republican. It is about power and influence over you. Its about politics, it is about money and control. They both are serving to the same end, getting you to carry the water for them. If and when you finally realize this, you will realize your opinion really does not matter, never did and that it was all a con. It does not matter what side of the politics you fall under. The only thing that matters is that you pick a side, and agree with everything they tell you to agree with.

Here's something more accurate for you. The problem is that America's poor and middle class have been snookered by teabaggery and they no longer understand what side their bread is buttered on. Get it?

If you all don't get it pretty soon then you will have lost any chance to turn around the rot the Koch brothers and their ilk have visited on your democratic republic!

Don't strain yourself carrying all that water - let me help you.

The Congo is a Democratic Republic, the USA is a Constitutional Republic. The Tea Party is a joke and I care about as much about the Koch brothers as I do George Soros. I hate the game, not the players.
monty1
Posts: 1,084
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4/18/2014 1:50:04 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 4/18/2014 1:31:21 PM, SemperVI wrote:
At 4/18/2014 1:22:25 PM, monty1 wrote:
At 4/18/2014 1:16:44 PM, SemperVI wrote:
At 4/16/2014 4:52:02 PM, LiberalLogic101 wrote:
Let me start by saying that to me, Conservative & Republican, Liberal & Democrat, are not synonymous.

Republican is a political affiliation, and Conservative is a moral/social ideology.

I would like for any Conservative, and/or Republican, to say why they are such.

I would be happy to defend my position as a Liberal and Democrat if you desire that.

- Mac

The problem is not ideology, if it was - our society would not be so polarized. The problem is there is no difference between a democrat or republican. It is about power and influence over you. Its about politics, it is about money and control. They both are serving to the same end, getting you to carry the water for them. If and when you finally realize this, you will realize your opinion really does not matter, never did and that it was all a con. It does not matter what side of the politics you fall under. The only thing that matters is that you pick a side, and agree with everything they tell you to agree with.

Here's something more accurate for you. The problem is that America's poor and middle class have been snookered by teabaggery and they no longer understand what side their bread is buttered on. Get it?

If you all don't get it pretty soon then you will have lost any chance to turn around the rot the Koch brothers and their ilk have visited on your democratic republic!

Don't strain yourself carrying all that water - let me help you.

The Congo is a Democratic Republic, the USA is a Constitutional Republic. The Tea Party is a joke and I care about as much about the Koch brothers as I do George Soros. I hate the game, not the players.

My point! You won't care about the Koch brothers and their ilk until it becomes too late. What, me worry? And just accept the dr for what it means and don't try to turn it into a DR for some weird political reason.
SemperVI
Posts: 294
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4/18/2014 1:56:31 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 4/18/2014 1:50:04 PM, monty1 wrote:
At 4/18/2014 1:31:21 PM, SemperVI wrote:
At 4/18/2014 1:22:25 PM, monty1 wrote:
At 4/18/2014 1:16:44 PM, SemperVI wrote:
At 4/16/2014 4:52:02 PM, LiberalLogic101 wrote:
Let me start by saying that to me, Conservative & Republican, Liberal & Democrat, are not synonymous.

Republican is a political affiliation, and Conservative is a moral/social ideology.

I would like for any Conservative, and/or Republican, to say why they are such.

I would be happy to defend my position as a Liberal and Democrat if you desire that.

- Mac

The problem is not ideology, if it was - our society would not be so polarized. The problem is there is no difference between a democrat or republican. It is about power and influence over you. Its about politics, it is about money and control. They both are serving to the same end, getting you to carry the water for them. If and when you finally realize this, you will realize your opinion really does not matter, never did and that it was all a con. It does not matter what side of the politics you fall under. The only thing that matters is that you pick a side, and agree with everything they tell you to agree with.

Here's something more accurate for you. The problem is that America's poor and middle class have been snookered by teabaggery and they no longer understand what side their bread is buttered on. Get it?

If you all don't get it pretty soon then you will have lost any chance to turn around the rot the Koch brothers and their ilk have visited on your democratic republic!

Don't strain yourself carrying all that water - let me help you.

The Congo is a Democratic Republic, the USA is a Constitutional Republic. The Tea Party is a joke and I care about as much about the Koch brothers as I do George Soros. I hate the game, not the players.

My point! You won't care about the Koch brothers and their ilk until it becomes too late. What, me worry? And just accept the dr for what it means and don't try to turn it into a DR for some weird political reason.

Money is power, power is influence. Influence is projected by proxy using tools like you. That is my point. Your carrying Soros water, Some carry Koch water. Both claim their water is pure. In truth, both are selling snake oil.
wrichcirw
Posts: 11,196
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4/18/2014 6:25:29 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 4/18/2014 1:16:44 PM, SemperVI wrote:
At 4/16/2014 4:52:02 PM, LiberalLogic101 wrote:
Let me start by saying that to me, Conservative & Republican, Liberal & Democrat, are not synonymous.

Republican is a political affiliation, and Conservative is a moral/social ideology.

I would like for any Conservative, and/or Republican, to say why they are such.

I would be happy to defend my position as a Liberal and Democrat if you desire that.

- Mac

The problem is not ideology, if it was - our society would not be so polarized. The problem is there is no difference between a democrat or republican. It is about power and influence over you. Its about politics, it is about money and control. They both are serving to the same end, getting you to carry the water for them. If and when you finally realize this, you will realize your opinion really does not matter, never did and that it was all a con. It does not matter what side of the politics you fall under. The only thing that matters is that you pick a side, and agree with everything they tell you to agree with.

Agree with the underlined. Not quite as cynical as the rest, or perhaps I simply don't care to view it that way. I don't see any reason why anyone has to pick a side.
At 8/9/2013 9:41:24 AM, wrichcirw wrote:
If you are civil with me, I will be civil to you. If you decide to bring unreasonable animosity to bear in a reasonable discussion, then what would you expect other than to get flustered?