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A change in political views.

FREEDO
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2/22/2010 10:02:42 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
Now before you go saying "Oh, it's just another post about him!", this is a lot more about your input.

This site didn't initially change my views to Anarchism but it has caused me to now doubt it a lot more.
Here is my political statement:
My political views are that of pragmatism and the scientific method. I think the most viable ideologies should be tested and the most successful implemented. I hold no blind faith in ideological dogma. However, the ideology I see as most possible for highest success, though with some doubts, is Free-Market Anarchism.

So the point of the thread is, I must know, in what ways has this site effected your political views?
GRAND POOBAH OF DDO

fnord
Volkov
Posts: 9,765
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2/22/2010 10:11:27 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/22/2010 10:02:42 PM, FREEDO wrote:
So the point of the thread is, I must know, in what ways has this site affected* your political views?

*Fix'd.

I don't know how many times this has been asked, but its been a lot. Nevertheless...

It's hardened my views. I came to this site a committed liberal, and I'm still one now. I've learned about the diverging views on liberalism, on individualism, and I've essentially learned how everyone comes about to their different conclusions about life and how it should be handled. But, it hasn't brought to me any ideas about changing what I believe in - rather, its just helped me evolve and become a more efficient arguer for my beliefs.
GeoLaureate8
Posts: 12,252
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2/22/2010 10:19:37 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/22/2010 10:02:42 PM, FREEDO wrote:
in what ways has this site effected your political views?

It was a combination of many things, this site being one of them. That being said, I went from no ideology at all ---> Liberal Democrat ----> Communist ----> Libertarian ----> Anarchist -----> Panarchist; while obviously maintaining elements of Conspiracism.
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
FREEDO
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2/22/2010 10:22:01 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/22/2010 10:19:37 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
At 2/22/2010 10:02:42 PM, FREEDO wrote:
in what ways has this site effected your political views?

It was a combination of many things, this site being one of them. That being said, I went from no ideology at all ---> Liberal Democrat ----> Communist ----> Libertarian ----> Anarchist -----> Panarchist; while obviously maintaining elements of Conspiracism.

What's the difference between an Anarchist and a Panarchist?
GRAND POOBAH OF DDO

fnord
TheSkeptic
Posts: 1,362
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2/22/2010 10:23:15 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
My political views are that of pragmatism and the scientific method. I think the most viable ideologies should be tested and the most successful implemented.

?
FREEDO
Posts: 21,057
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2/22/2010 10:25:36 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/22/2010 10:23:15 PM, TheSkeptic wrote:
My political views are that of pragmatism and the scientific method. I think the most viable ideologies should be tested and the most successful implemented.

?

Basically, I want to see the results of a system before I say I like or dislike it.
GRAND POOBAH OF DDO

fnord
InsertNameHere
Posts: 15,699
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2/22/2010 10:28:09 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
Am I the only one who hasn't had their views changed by this site? Then again, many of my political views are based on emotions and my personal life experiences...
Volkov
Posts: 9,765
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2/22/2010 10:29:32 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/22/2010 10:28:09 PM, InsertNameHere wrote:
Am I the only one who hasn't had their views changed by this site? Then again, many of my political views are based on emotions and my personal life experiences...

I know I'm just a Liberal, but jeesh, does everyone ignore what I say? :(
PoeJoe
Posts: 3,822
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2/22/2010 10:30:48 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
Anyway, to answer the OP's question...

I went from being a moderate who knew absolutely nothing about politics to being a leftist who practically knows nothing about politics. :D

I hope that answers your question.
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GeoLaureate8
Posts: 12,252
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2/22/2010 10:31:51 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/22/2010 10:22:01 PM, FREEDO wrote:
At 2/22/2010 10:19:37 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
It was a combination of many things, this site being one of them. That being said, I went from no ideology at all ---> Liberal Democrat ----> Communist ----> Libertarian ----> Anarchist -----> Panarchist; while obviously maintaining elements of Conspiracism.

What's the difference between an Anarchist and a Panarchist?

As I understand it, Anarchy is the absence of any order or structure, and the most common form seems to also include the free market/private sector replacing government. Panarchy does involve order where everyone has equal power, which results in no one having authority over another. Anarchy on the other hand, allows for authorities (in most cases private power) to arise.
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
InsertNameHere
Posts: 15,699
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2/22/2010 10:31:57 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/22/2010 10:29:32 PM, Volkov wrote:
At 2/22/2010 10:28:09 PM, InsertNameHere wrote:
Am I the only one who hasn't had their views changed by this site? Then again, many of my political views are based on emotions and my personal life experiences...

I know I'm just a Liberal, but jeesh, does everyone ignore what I say? :(

Aww. :( Make that two I suppose? I dunno, I just find it almost impossible to change my views which have developed as a result of my personal experiences. Unlike most of this site I have almost no education in areas such as economics to base my viewpoints off of.
InsertNameHere
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2/22/2010 10:33:16 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/22/2010 10:30:48 PM, PoeJoe wrote:
Anyway, to answer the OP's question...

I went from being a moderate who knew absolutely nothing about politics to being a leftist who practically knows nothing about politics. :D

I hope that answers your question.

High-five! I know very little about politics too! :D
Volkov
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2/22/2010 10:33:56 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/22/2010 10:31:57 PM, InsertNameHere wrote:
Aww. :( Make that two I suppose? I dunno, I just find it almost impossible to change my views which have developed as a result of my personal experiences. Unlike most of this site I have almost no education in areas such as economics to base my viewpoints off of.

That's my exact basis as well, though I base a lot of my ideas of foreign policy and etc. based on what I read and see, and not necessarily experience. Though, I'd love to be involved with Iranian nuclear negotiations... xD

But hey, I know next to nothing about economics. I can crunch basic numbers and nail down basic concepts, but outside of that, I'm way over my head.
PoeJoe
Posts: 3,822
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2/22/2010 10:35:21 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/22/2010 10:33:16 PM, InsertNameHere wrote:
At 2/22/2010 10:30:48 PM, PoeJoe wrote:
Anyway, to answer the OP's question...

I went from being a moderate who knew absolutely nothing about politics to being a leftist who practically knows nothing about politics. :D

I hope that answers your question.

High-five! I know very little about politics too! :D

You need two to high-five! *high-fives back*

Ignorance ftw!
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InsertNameHere
Posts: 15,699
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2/22/2010 10:36:48 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/22/2010 10:35:21 PM, PoeJoe wrote:
At 2/22/2010 10:33:16 PM, InsertNameHere wrote:
At 2/22/2010 10:30:48 PM, PoeJoe wrote:
Anyway, to answer the OP's question...

I went from being a moderate who knew absolutely nothing about politics to being a leftist who practically knows nothing about politics. :D

I hope that answers your question.

High-five! I know very little about politics too! :D

You need two to high-five! *high-fives back*

Ignorance ftw!

Definitely. I'm sure many people on this site would argue that my ignorance results in my socialist viewpoints. xD
Ragnar_Rahl
Posts: 19,297
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2/22/2010 10:41:28 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/22/2010 10:11:27 PM, Volkov wrote:
At 2/22/2010 10:02:42 PM, FREEDO wrote:
So the point of the thread is, I must know, in what ways has this site affected* your political views?

*Fix'd.
Actually, it was a legit question in its original form, just a less broad one than your "fix'd" one.
I don't know of many people who would say the site effected their views, knowing the difference of what that means-- s0m31john might have, can't remember-- but it remains a theoretically viable question.

In any case mine have neither been effected nor to my remembrance significantly affected by the site. I might have tied up a few loose ends here and there, but if so I don't remember what they are.

My political views are that of pragmatism and the scientific method.
Those are epistemological views new***.

High-five! I know very little about politics too! :D
You're both leftists, we already knew that.
It came to be at its height. It was commanded to command. It was a capital before its first stone was laid. It was a monument to the spirit of man.
belle
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2/22/2010 10:43:57 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/22/2010 10:41:28 PM, Ragnar_Rahl wrote:
You're both leftists, we already knew that.

i was waiting for that one
evidently i only come to ddo to avoid doing homework...
Ragnar_Rahl
Posts: 19,297
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2/22/2010 10:45:17 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/22/2010 10:43:57 PM, belle wrote:
At 2/22/2010 10:41:28 PM, Ragnar_Rahl wrote:
You're both leftists, we already knew that.

i was waiting for that one

Yeah, so was InsertName. Still couldn't resist.
It came to be at its height. It was commanded to command. It was a capital before its first stone was laid. It was a monument to the spirit of man.
InsertNameHere
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2/22/2010 10:45:27 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/22/2010 10:41:28 PM, Ragnar_Rahl wrote:

High-five! I know very little about politics too! :D
You're both leftists, we already knew that.

No, i'm a leftist because I care about other people.
Ragnar_Rahl
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2/22/2010 10:49:43 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/22/2010 10:45:27 PM, InsertNameHere wrote:
At 2/22/2010 10:41:28 PM, Ragnar_Rahl wrote:

High-five! I know very little about politics too! :D
You're both leftists, we already knew that.

No, i'm a leftist because I care about other people.

Does not follow. People of all political stripes care about other people (the whole POINT of politics is that there is someone else, if you're lucky enough not to have to give a damn about anyone you don't partake of politics), the question is WHICH other people you care about, whether that care is positive or negative and WHAT it is you want to happen to them.
It came to be at its height. It was commanded to command. It was a capital before its first stone was laid. It was a monument to the spirit of man.
Ragnar_Rahl
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2/22/2010 10:50:00 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
And why you care of course.
It came to be at its height. It was commanded to command. It was a capital before its first stone was laid. It was a monument to the spirit of man.
PoeJoe
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2/22/2010 10:54:31 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/22/2010 10:41:28 PM, Ragnar_Rahl wrote:
At 2/22/2010 10:11:27 PM, Volkov wrote:
At 2/22/2010 10:02:42 PM, FREEDO wrote:
Actually, it was a legit question in its original form, just a less broad one than your "fix'd" one.

?

The word "effect" isn't a syntactical error. It's a grammatical error. The word "effect" is an intransitive verb, while "affect" is transitive.

I don't know of many people who would say the site effected their views, knowing the difference of what that means-- s0m31john might have, can't remember-- but it remains a theoretically viable question.

During his stay here, s0m31john did not change ideologies. Interestingly, though, he has since converted into an anarcho-capitalist.

High-five! I know very little about politics too! :D
You're both leftists, we already knew that.

 :P
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Ragnar_Rahl
Posts: 19,297
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2/22/2010 11:07:46 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/22/2010 10:54:31 PM, PoeJoe wrote:
At 2/22/2010 10:41:28 PM, Ragnar_Rahl wrote:
At 2/22/2010 10:11:27 PM, Volkov wrote:
At 2/22/2010 10:02:42 PM, FREEDO wrote:
Actually, it was a legit question in its original form, just a less broad one than your "fix'd" one.

?

The word "effect" isn't a syntactical error. It's a grammatical error. The word "effect" is an intransitive verb, while "affect" is transitive.
Effect: To cause. What's intransitive about it? I can say "I shot someone, this effected their death." It's not a grammar issue, it simply means it was a sufficient cause, instead of merely influencing as in "affect."
http://dictionary.reference.com...
Go to "Verb-- used with object." Incidentally using with object is the very definition of transitive verb.


I don't know of many people who would say the site effected their views, knowing the difference of what that means-- s0m31john might have, can't remember-- but it remains a theoretically viable question.

During his stay here, s0m31john did not change ideologies.
Really? I thought he said he didn't even have an ideology beforehand.

Interestingly, though, he has since converted into an anarcho-capitalist.
Been keeping in touch with him eh?
It came to be at its height. It was commanded to command. It was a capital before its first stone was laid. It was a monument to the spirit of man.
PoeJoe
Posts: 3,822
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2/22/2010 11:16:05 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/22/2010 11:07:46 PM, Ragnar_Rahl wrote:
At 2/22/2010 10:54:31 PM, PoeJoe wrote:
At 2/22/2010 10:41:28 PM, Ragnar_Rahl wrote:
At 2/22/2010 10:11:27 PM, Volkov wrote:
At 2/22/2010 10:02:42 PM, FREEDO wrote:
Actually, it was a legit question in its original form, just a less broad one than your "fix'd" one.

?

The word "effect" isn't a syntactical error. It's a grammatical error. The word "effect" is an intransitive verb, while "affect" is transitive.
Effect: To cause. What's intransitive about it? I can say "I shot someone, this effected their death." It's not a grammar issue, it simply means it was a sufficient cause, instead of merely influencing as in "affect."
http://dictionary.reference.com...
Go to "Verb-- used with object." Incidentally using with object is the very definition of transitive verb.

My bad. Still, "affect" is a better choice than "effect" in that example.

I don't know of many people who would say the site effected their views, knowing the difference of what that means-- s0m31john might have, can't remember-- but it remains a theoretically viable question.

During his stay here, s0m31john did not change ideologies.
Really? I thought he said he didn't even have an ideology beforehand.

Well, he's never updated his BIG ISSUES since joining the site, I know that. He has said so a couple of times. If he didn't have an ideology beforehand, then his pre-ideology was certainly libertarian-leaning. Of course, this is in my perspective, which may be biased.

Interestingly, though, he has since converted into an anarcho-capitalist.
Been keeping in touch with him eh?

He changed his 'political beliefs' on facebook. I haven't spoken to him much, though.
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Ragnar_Rahl
Posts: 19,297
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2/22/2010 11:20:57 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/22/2010 11:16:05 PM, PoeJoe wrote:
At 2/22/2010 11:07:46 PM, Ragnar_Rahl wrote:
At 2/22/2010 10:54:31 PM, PoeJoe wrote:
At 2/22/2010 10:41:28 PM, Ragnar_Rahl wrote:
At 2/22/2010 10:11:27 PM, Volkov wrote:
At 2/22/2010 10:02:42 PM, FREEDO wrote:
Actually, it was a legit question in its original form, just a less broad one than your "fix'd" one.

?

The word "effect" isn't a syntactical error. It's a grammatical error. The word "effect" is an intransitive verb, while "affect" is transitive.
Effect: To cause. What's intransitive about it? I can say "I shot someone, this effected their death." It's not a grammar issue, it simply means it was a sufficient cause, instead of merely influencing as in "affect."
http://dictionary.reference.com...
Go to "Verb-- used with object." Incidentally using with object is the very definition of transitive verb.

My bad. Still, "affect" is a better choice than "effect" in that example.

In which example?
In shooting someone? Not for general use, "effect" provides far more specific information with the same amount of mouth time and typing time and reading time.

In Freedo's? Well, yeah, definitely, since it's a question in which I don't doubt he does want a much broader answer to, but it would be better to say "recommend'd" then "fix'd" when his question was legit but subotptimal.


I don't know of many people who would say the site effected their views, knowing the difference of what that means-- s0m31john might have, can't remember-- but it remains a theoretically viable question.

During his stay here, s0m31john did not change ideologies.
Really? I thought he said he didn't even have an ideology beforehand.

Well, he's never updated his BIG ISSUES since joining the site, I know that. He has said so a couple of times.
Yeah, and I remember him saying that in response to me asking why they contradicted his libertarianism-- because he no longer believes them but is too lazy to update :P.
It came to be at its height. It was commanded to command. It was a capital before its first stone was laid. It was a monument to the spirit of man.
PoeJoe
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2/22/2010 11:23:49 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/22/2010 11:20:57 PM, Ragnar_Rahl wrote:
In Freedo's? Well, yeah, definitely, since it's a question in which I don't doubt he does want a much broader answer to, but it would be better to say "recommend'd" then "fix'd" when his question was legit but subotptimal.

I meant Freedo's.

Well, he's never updated his BIG ISSUES since joining the site, I know that. He has said so a couple of times.
Yeah, and I remember him saying that in response to me asking why they contradicted his libertarianism-- because he no longer believes them but is too lazy to update :P.

Tis a shame. I've sent him a message on FB urging him to come back. I hope he does.
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TheSkeptic
Posts: 1,362
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2/23/2010 1:45:59 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 2/22/2010 10:25:36 PM, FREEDO wrote:
At 2/22/2010 10:23:15 PM, TheSkeptic wrote:
My political views are that of pragmatism and the scientific method. I think the most viable ideologies should be tested and the most successful implemented.

?

Basically, I want to see the results of a system before I say I like or dislike it.

The pragmatist makes the stronger claim that whether or not the system works determines the truth of it, so that's why I'm not sure you're a pragmatist.