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Obama isn't that bad of a President?

KevinZ95
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11/4/2014 12:20:20 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
I think he is doing great all empirical evidence show positive figures and growth for the country. His approval rating is growing and how many actual arguments does the opposition really hold?
Emilrose
Posts: 2,479
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11/4/2014 4:18:44 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 11/4/2014 12:20:20 AM, KevinZ95 wrote:
I think he is doing great all empirical evidence show positive figures and growth for the country. His approval rating is growing and how many actual arguments does the opposition really hold?

Many arguments, actually. It's odd that you claim all evidence shows "positive figures"--unemployment has actually increased since Obama has been in term. Moreover, the U.S is currently in billions of debt--that has also extensively added up since his presidency.

In addition, there's his mishandling of foreign affairs; such as events in the Middle East.
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Ore_Ele
Posts: 25,980
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11/4/2014 11:40:45 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 11/4/2014 4:18:44 AM, Emilrose wrote:
At 11/4/2014 12:20:20 AM, KevinZ95 wrote:
I think he is doing great all empirical evidence show positive figures and growth for the country. His approval rating is growing and how many actual arguments does the opposition really hold?

Many arguments, actually. It's odd that you claim all evidence shows "positive figures"--unemployment has actually increased since Obama has been in term. Moreover, the U.S is currently in billions of debt--that has also extensively added up since his presidency.

First off, that is wrong. Unemployment was 7.8% when he stepped into office. Now it is 5.9%. Secondly, he inherited 700,000 jobs being lost a month. Which was turned around very quickly to to point that we are seeing private sector job growth that we haven't seen since the 90's.

As for the debt, yes, it is growing. But the deficit is at its lowest in years and our debt to GDP is going down. If you are only looking at the debt number, then the worst you can say is that he is par for the hole, as almost every president has raised the debt.


In addition, there's his mishandling of foreign affairs; such as events in the Middle East.

That can be subjective depending on what you believe we should be doing in the middle east.
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Fly
Posts: 2,044
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11/4/2014 12:01:41 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
Considering the losing hand dealt, I think the current president has done a decent job. He knew he was working with a losing hand and might not have won in 2008 without the bleak situation, though. But I doubt he foresaw the sheer obstruction he would encounter in congress.

His weak point has been foreign policy. He was elected to get the US out of Iraq, but now it looks as though that should have been another broken promise instead (broken promises aren't necessarily a bad thing when the wellbeing of the country is at stake). His strong point has been economic recovery, which was the main basis for his election. Here is a balanced article about quantitative easing:

http://tinyurl.com...

Seeing as how we are still analyzing what sort of job Reagan did, I doubt we will be coming to any solid conclusions any time soon. Obama has detractors on both sides of the aisle, but they dislike him for the opposite reasons!
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Praesentya
Posts: 195
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11/4/2014 5:53:09 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
Here are my pluses and minuses... Personally, I think Obama is one of the better Presidents we have had.

1. Outstanding economic recovery. America recovered from '08 more successfully than any other nation. To top that, our unemployment is down (yes conservatives, it really is down) as are our taxes (unless you make 450K+ per year, they went down) .
2. Reasonable job curbing the deficit, given it's magnitude, our obligations, and a noncooperative Congress. I would have hoped for some reduction, but maybe I'm being too optimistic.
3. Excellent handling of Iraq and Afghanistan. There was no way for Obama to predict that the Iraqi government we left in place would be so ethnically exclusive, which is largely why IS penetrated Iraq in the first place. Recalling the troops, based on the (at the time) stability of Iraq was the right call. Afghanistan is going to be a thorn in our side for the next twenty years, but I applaud Obama for handling the war they way he did. We seem to be 'winning' now, while we weren't when he took office.

1. I don't like the Affordable Care Act... Obama is a Democrat, but ObamaCare is Republican - it's basically Bob Dole's plan from the nineties. If America want's to reduce our unfunded liabilities, we need single payer health care.
2. He has been weak on foreign policy, almost absent. This isn;t uncommon, for a country to stand back after a major, unpopular war - we did it after Vietnam. But the world has made itself increasingly clear that we need a strong, assertive America. Again, part of our weak foreign policy can be attributed to Congress...
3. Immigration. America should cater to hard working immigrants all over the world, not necessarily just those within walking distance. Immigrants work harder than the average American. Immigrants pay more taxes per dollar earned. Immigrants request fewer benefits but put more into the system. Immigrants are the best thing for this country. We need them.
Vox_Veritas
Posts: 7,070
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11/4/2014 7:43:54 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 11/4/2014 11:40:45 AM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 11/4/2014 4:18:44 AM, Emilrose wrote:
At 11/4/2014 12:20:20 AM, KevinZ95 wrote:
I think he is doing great all empirical evidence show positive figures and growth for the country. His approval rating is growing and how many actual arguments does the opposition really hold?

Many arguments, actually. It's odd that you claim all evidence shows "positive figures"--unemployment has actually increased since Obama has been in term. Moreover, the U.S is currently in billions of debt--that has also extensively added up since his presidency.

First off, that is wrong. Unemployment was 7.8% when he stepped into office. Now it is 5.9%. Secondly, he inherited 700,000 jobs being lost a month. Which was turned around very quickly to to point that we are seeing private sector job growth that we haven't seen since the 90's.

That actually depends on how you look at it. Official figures have shown a lower unemployment rate, but that's because they make no distinction between people who are actively seeking a job but don't have one ("unemployed") and those who don't have a job and are not looking for a job. The actual unemployment rate is higher than official figures show.

As for the debt, yes, it is growing. But the deficit is at its lowest in years and our debt to GDP is going down. If you are only looking at the debt number, then the worst you can say is that he is par for the hole, as almost every president has raised the debt.


In addition, there's his mishandling of foreign affairs; such as events in the Middle East.

That can be subjective depending on what you believe we should be doing in the middle east.
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Ore_Ele
Posts: 25,980
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11/4/2014 8:01:12 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 11/4/2014 7:43:54 PM, Vox_Veritas wrote:
At 11/4/2014 11:40:45 AM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 11/4/2014 4:18:44 AM, Emilrose wrote:
At 11/4/2014 12:20:20 AM, KevinZ95 wrote:
I think he is doing great all empirical evidence show positive figures and growth for the country. His approval rating is growing and how many actual arguments does the opposition really hold?

Many arguments, actually. It's odd that you claim all evidence shows "positive figures"--unemployment has actually increased since Obama has been in term. Moreover, the U.S is currently in billions of debt--that has also extensively added up since his presidency.

First off, that is wrong. Unemployment was 7.8% when he stepped into office. Now it is 5.9%. Secondly, he inherited 700,000 jobs being lost a month. Which was turned around very quickly to to point that we are seeing private sector job growth that we haven't seen since the 90's.

That actually depends on how you look at it. Official figures have shown a lower unemployment rate, but that's because they make no distinction between people who are actively seeking a job but don't have one ("unemployed") and those who don't have a job and are not looking for a job. The actual unemployment rate is higher than official figures show.

Still wrong, all unemployment measurements are down from when Obama took office. Looking at U6 (which is what some like to use to make it seem worse) was at 14.2% in Jan 2009. It is currently at 11.8%

The easiest way to tell that the unemployment is going down, not as a result of people giving up, but because the economy is improving is by the private sector job growth. There have been 9.5 million private sector jobs created in the last 4 years (8.6% growth, considering the population growth was less than 4% for the same span).


As for the debt, yes, it is growing. But the deficit is at its lowest in years and our debt to GDP is going down. If you are only looking at the debt number, then the worst you can say is that he is par for the hole, as almost every president has raised the debt.


In addition, there's his mishandling of foreign affairs; such as events in the Middle East.

That can be subjective depending on what you believe we should be doing in the middle east.
"Wanting Red Rhino Pill to have gender"
PotBelliedGeek
Posts: 4,298
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11/5/2014 9:12:33 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 11/4/2014 7:43:54 PM, Vox_Veritas wrote:
At 11/4/2014 11:40:45 AM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 11/4/2014 4:18:44 AM, Emilrose wrote:
At 11/4/2014 12:20:20 AM, KevinZ95 wrote:
I think he is doing great all empirical evidence show positive figures and growth for the country. His approval rating is growing and how many actual arguments does the opposition really hold?

Many arguments, actually. It's odd that you claim all evidence shows "positive figures"--unemployment has actually increased since Obama has been in term. Moreover, the U.S is currently in billions of debt--that has also extensively added up since his presidency.

First off, that is wrong. Unemployment was 7.8% when he stepped into office. Now it is 5.9%. Secondly, he inherited 700,000 jobs being lost a month. Which was turned around very quickly to to point that we are seeing private sector job growth that we haven't seen since the 90's.

That actually depends on how you look at it. Official figures have shown a lower unemployment rate, but that's because they make no distinction between people who are actively seeking a job but don't have one ("unemployed") and those who don't have a job and are not looking for a job. The actual unemployment rate is higher than official figures show.

The problem that I have with this argument is the lack of data. The argument is literally "we lack data on a hypothetical segment of the workforce, therefore Obama made the unemployment rate go up". What proponents of this logic fail to realize is that the unemployment rate of the populous is not a self reporting statistic. It can be gauged by watching the market. All signs show a low unemployment rate.


As for the debt, yes, it is growing. But the deficit is at its lowest in years and our debt to GDP is going down. If you are only looking at the debt number, then the worst you can say is that he is par for the hole, as almost every president has raised the debt.


In addition, there's his mishandling of foreign affairs; such as events in the Middle East.

That can be subjective depending on what you believe we should be doing in the middle east.
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PotBelliedGeek
Posts: 4,298
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11/5/2014 9:14:16 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 11/4/2014 5:53:09 PM, Praesentya wrote:
Here are my pluses and minuses... Personally, I think Obama is one of the better Presidents we have had.

1. Outstanding economic recovery. America recovered from '08 more successfully than any other nation. To top that, our unemployment is down (yes conservatives, it really is down) as are our taxes (unless you make 450K+ per year, they went down) .
2. Reasonable job curbing the deficit, given it's magnitude, our obligations, and a noncooperative Congress. I would have hoped for some reduction, but maybe I'm being too optimistic.
3. Excellent handling of Iraq and Afghanistan. There was no way for Obama to predict that the Iraqi government we left in place would be so ethnically exclusive, which is largely why IS penetrated Iraq in the first place. Recalling the troops, based on the (at the time) stability of Iraq was the right call. Afghanistan is going to be a thorn in our side for the next twenty years, but I applaud Obama for handling the war they way he did. We seem to be 'winning' now, while we weren't when he took office.

1. I don't like the Affordable Care Act... Obama is a Democrat, but ObamaCare is Republican - it's basically Bob Dole's plan from the nineties. If America want's to reduce our unfunded liabilities, we need single payer health care.
2. He has been weak on foreign policy, almost absent. This isn;t uncommon, for a country to stand back after a major, unpopular war - we did it after Vietnam. But the world has made itself increasingly clear that we need a strong, assertive America. Again, part of our weak foreign policy can be attributed to Congress...
3. Immigration. America should cater to hard working immigrants all over the world, not necessarily just those within walking distance. Immigrants work harder than the average American. Immigrants pay more taxes per dollar earned. Immigrants request fewer benefits but put more into the system. Immigrants are the best thing for this country. We need them.

In short, Obama is too conservative for your tastes.
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Greyparrot
Posts: 14,247
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11/5/2014 9:30:36 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 11/4/2014 8:01:12 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
The easiest way to tell that the unemployment is going down, not as a result of people giving up, but because the economy is improving is by the private sector job growth. There have been 9.5 million private sector jobs created in the last 4 years (8.6% growth, considering the population growth was less than 4% for the same span).


Is that 9.5 million NET jobs?
Greyparrot
Posts: 14,247
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11/5/2014 9:35:34 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
As of December, the economy had gained a net total of 3,246,000 jobs since Obama first took office, and the unemployment rate had fallen to 6.7 percent, down from 7.8 percent.

Despite the gains, more than 10 million people remained unemployed, including 3.9 million who had been out of work for 27 weeks or longer. That"s an increase of nearly 1.2 million "long-term unemployed" since the start of the Obama presidency.

The average time that an unemployed person in December had been looking for work was 37 weeks, nearly double the average at the time Obama entered the White House.

Another troubling jobs statistic is the civilian labor force participation rate, which has now declined by 2.9 percentage points since Obama became president, to the lowest point since 1978. But that"s not entirely due to "discouraged workers" dropping out because they believe no jobs are available, as some Obama critics would have you believe.

Other labor-force dropouts include members of the baby-boom generation, who are retiring in droves. They also include disabled workers gaining Social Security disability benefits (a number that has doubled in the past 17 years, and is up 20 percent just since Obama took office).

There"s a lively debate among economists about the causes " and implications " of the shrinking participation rate, which started long before Obama took office. The rate actually peaked in early 2000 and declined 1.5 percent under Obama"s predecessor. A Labor Department economist, looking at current demographic trends, predicts further declines through at least 2022 " long after the end of Obama"s presidency.
chaedd
Posts: 37
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11/5/2014 9:45:21 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
although Emilrose's argument makes a lot of sense, I take into consideration that nobody else could solve the problems we had at the beginning of his term.
Obama is the best Black president a country ever had.
, so I have to agree with Presaentya
Greyparrot
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11/5/2014 9:55:58 AM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 11/5/2014 9:45:21 AM, chaedd wrote:
although Emilrose's argument makes a lot of sense, I take into consideration that nobody else could solve the problems we had at the beginning of his term.
Obama is the best Black president a country ever had.
, so I have to agree with Presaentya

Mandela would approve of this political ad.
Ore_Ele
Posts: 25,980
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11/5/2014 1:46:48 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 11/5/2014 9:30:36 AM, Greyparrot wrote:
At 11/4/2014 8:01:12 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
The easiest way to tell that the unemployment is going down, not as a result of people giving up, but because the economy is improving is by the private sector job growth. There have been 9.5 million private sector jobs created in the last 4 years (8.6% growth, considering the population growth was less than 4% for the same span).


Is that 9.5 million NET jobs?

Net, PRIVATE sector jobs (not counting government jobs) in the last 4 years. It has been growing pretty consistently about 2.2-2.5 million per year since the bottom of the crash.
"Wanting Red Rhino Pill to have gender"
Ore_Ele
Posts: 25,980
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11/5/2014 1:47:51 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 11/5/2014 9:45:21 AM, chaedd wrote:
although Emilrose's argument makes a lot of sense, I take into consideration that nobody else could solve the problems we had at the beginning of his term.
Obama is the best Black president a country ever had.
, so I have to agree with Presaentya

He's also the worst black president we've ever had, lol.
"Wanting Red Rhino Pill to have gender"
Greyparrot
Posts: 14,247
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11/5/2014 1:49:11 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 11/5/2014 1:46:48 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 11/5/2014 9:30:36 AM, Greyparrot wrote:
At 11/4/2014 8:01:12 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
The easiest way to tell that the unemployment is going down, not as a result of people giving up, but because the economy is improving is by the private sector job growth. There have been 9.5 million private sector jobs created in the last 4 years (8.6% growth, considering the population growth was less than 4% for the same span).


Is that 9.5 million NET jobs?

Net, PRIVATE sector jobs (not counting government jobs) in the last 4 years. It has been growing pretty consistently about 2.2-2.5 million per year since the bottom of the crash.

The number of Jobs doesn't equal prosperity anyway. Employment numbers are just a stat for the uneducated.

In 2013, real median household income was 8.0% lower than the 2007 pre-recession level of $56,436

People know when the economy sucks, they don't believe the rhetoric.
Ore_Ele
Posts: 25,980
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11/5/2014 1:55:59 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 11/5/2014 1:49:11 PM, Greyparrot wrote:
At 11/5/2014 1:46:48 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 11/5/2014 9:30:36 AM, Greyparrot wrote:
At 11/4/2014 8:01:12 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
The easiest way to tell that the unemployment is going down, not as a result of people giving up, but because the economy is improving is by the private sector job growth. There have been 9.5 million private sector jobs created in the last 4 years (8.6% growth, considering the population growth was less than 4% for the same span).


Is that 9.5 million NET jobs?

Net, PRIVATE sector jobs (not counting government jobs) in the last 4 years. It has been growing pretty consistently about 2.2-2.5 million per year since the bottom of the crash.

The number of Jobs doesn't equal prosperity anyway. Employment numbers are just a stat for the uneducated.

In 2013, real median household income was 8.0% lower than the 2007 pre-recession level of $56,436

People know when the economy sucks, they don't believe the rhetoric.

Cherry picked data, lol. Let's pick the highest point pre-collapse and compare it to now, and blame Obama for it. Wages have gone up faster than inflation every year in the last four years. There are more jobs and better pay every year. Regardless to how political pundits trick you into feeling, th economy is improving.
"Wanting Red Rhino Pill to have gender"
Greyparrot
Posts: 14,247
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11/5/2014 1:57:19 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 11/5/2014 1:55:59 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 11/5/2014 1:49:11 PM, Greyparrot wrote:
At 11/5/2014 1:46:48 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 11/5/2014 9:30:36 AM, Greyparrot wrote:
At 11/4/2014 8:01:12 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
The easiest way to tell that the unemployment is going down, not as a result of people giving up, but because the economy is improving is by the private sector job growth. There have been 9.5 million private sector jobs created in the last 4 years (8.6% growth, considering the population growth was less than 4% for the same span).


Is that 9.5 million NET jobs?

Net, PRIVATE sector jobs (not counting government jobs) in the last 4 years. It has been growing pretty consistently about 2.2-2.5 million per year since the bottom of the crash.

The number of Jobs doesn't equal prosperity anyway. Employment numbers are just a stat for the uneducated.

In 2013, real median household income was 8.0% lower than the 2007 pre-recession level of $56,436

People know when the economy sucks, they don't believe the rhetoric.

Cherry picked data, lol. Let's pick the highest point pre-collapse and compare it to now, and blame Obama for it. Wages have gone up faster than inflation every year in the last four years. There are more jobs and better pay every year. Regardless to how political pundits trick you into feeling, th economy is improving.

Median income isnt cherry picked data. It is a real number. People feel it.
Ore_Ele
Posts: 25,980
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11/5/2014 2:21:43 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 11/5/2014 1:57:19 PM, Greyparrot wrote:
At 11/5/2014 1:55:59 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 11/5/2014 1:49:11 PM, Greyparrot wrote:
At 11/5/2014 1:46:48 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 11/5/2014 9:30:36 AM, Greyparrot wrote:
At 11/4/2014 8:01:12 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
The easiest way to tell that the unemployment is going down, not as a result of people giving up, but because the economy is improving is by the private sector job growth. There have been 9.5 million private sector jobs created in the last 4 years (8.6% growth, considering the population growth was less than 4% for the same span).


Is that 9.5 million NET jobs?

Net, PRIVATE sector jobs (not counting government jobs) in the last 4 years. It has been growing pretty consistently about 2.2-2.5 million per year since the bottom of the crash.

The number of Jobs doesn't equal prosperity anyway. Employment numbers are just a stat for the uneducated.

In 2013, real median household income was 8.0% lower than the 2007 pre-recession level of $56,436

People know when the economy sucks, they don't believe the rhetoric.

Cherry picked data, lol. Let's pick the highest point pre-collapse and compare it to now, and blame Obama for it. Wages have gone up faster than inflation every year in the last four years. There are more jobs and better pay every year. Regardless to how political pundits trick you into feeling, th economy is improving.

Median income isnt cherry picked data. It is a real number. People feel it.

The years were cherry picked.
"Wanting Red Rhino Pill to have gender"
Greyparrot
Posts: 14,247
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11/5/2014 2:39:30 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 11/5/2014 2:21:43 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 11/5/2014 1:57:19 PM, Greyparrot wrote:
At 11/5/2014 1:55:59 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 11/5/2014 1:49:11 PM, Greyparrot wrote:
At 11/5/2014 1:46:48 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 11/5/2014 9:30:36 AM, Greyparrot wrote:
At 11/4/2014 8:01:12 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
The easiest way to tell that the unemployment is going down, not as a result of people giving up, but because the economy is improving is by the private sector job growth. There have been 9.5 million private sector jobs created in the last 4 years (8.6% growth, considering the population growth was less than 4% for the same span).


Is that 9.5 million NET jobs?

Net, PRIVATE sector jobs (not counting government jobs) in the last 4 years. It has been growing pretty consistently about 2.2-2.5 million per year since the bottom of the crash.

The number of Jobs doesn't equal prosperity anyway. Employment numbers are just a stat for the uneducated.

In 2013, real median household income was 8.0% lower than the 2007 pre-recession level of $56,436

People know when the economy sucks, they don't believe the rhetoric.

Cherry picked data, lol. Let's pick the highest point pre-collapse and compare it to now, and blame Obama for it. Wages have gone up faster than inflation every year in the last four years. There are more jobs and better pay every year. Regardless to how political pundits trick you into feeling, th economy is improving.

Median income isnt cherry picked data. It is a real number. People feel it.

The years were cherry picked.
I'd use a year 2000 number if I wanted to cherrypick. 2007 is more recent and relevant.
Ore_Ele
Posts: 25,980
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11/5/2014 3:12:39 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 11/5/2014 2:39:30 PM, Greyparrot wrote:
At 11/5/2014 2:21:43 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 11/5/2014 1:57:19 PM, Greyparrot wrote:
At 11/5/2014 1:55:59 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 11/5/2014 1:49:11 PM, Greyparrot wrote:
At 11/5/2014 1:46:48 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 11/5/2014 9:30:36 AM, Greyparrot wrote:
At 11/4/2014 8:01:12 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
The easiest way to tell that the unemployment is going down, not as a result of people giving up, but because the economy is improving is by the private sector job growth. There have been 9.5 million private sector jobs created in the last 4 years (8.6% growth, considering the population growth was less than 4% for the same span).


Is that 9.5 million NET jobs?

Net, PRIVATE sector jobs (not counting government jobs) in the last 4 years. It has been growing pretty consistently about 2.2-2.5 million per year since the bottom of the crash.

The number of Jobs doesn't equal prosperity anyway. Employment numbers are just a stat for the uneducated.

In 2013, real median household income was 8.0% lower than the 2007 pre-recession level of $56,436

People know when the economy sucks, they don't believe the rhetoric.

Cherry picked data, lol. Let's pick the highest point pre-collapse and compare it to now, and blame Obama for it. Wages have gone up faster than inflation every year in the last four years. There are more jobs and better pay every year. Regardless to how political pundits trick you into feeling, th economy is improving.

Median income isnt cherry picked data. It is a real number. People feel it.

The years were cherry picked.
I'd use a year 2000 number if I wanted to cherrypick. 2007 is more recent and relevant.

How about 2009, since that is when he took office. Or 2010, when the recovery began? If you want to look at how Obama has done, or how the recovery is doing, it is best to not murky it up with the failures of past presidents.
"Wanting Red Rhino Pill to have gender"
Ore_Ele
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11/5/2014 3:36:39 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
Median income by year

2000-62544
2001-62516
2002-61770
2003-61208
2004-60550
2005-61017
2006-62054
2007-62182
2008-60229
2009-59950
2010-58636
2011-57689
2012-58092
2013-58125

So it was just coincidence that you picked to start your comparison right on a peak just before the single worst drop in recent history to try to make Obama look worse? 2014 is going to be the 3rd year in a row of income growth in this recovery.

As the numbers are showing, jobs are coming back, as is income. Just looking at the trends.
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Greyparrot
Posts: 14,247
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11/5/2014 3:53:13 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 11/5/2014 3:36:39 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
Median income by year

2000-62544
2001-62516
2002-61770
2003-61208
2004-60550
2005-61017
2006-62054
2007-62182
2008-60229
2009-59950
2010-58636
2011-57689
2012-58092
2013-58125

So it was just coincidence that you picked to start your comparison right on a peak just before the single worst drop in recent history to try to make Obama look worse? 2014 is going to be the 3rd year in a row of income growth in this recovery.

As the numbers are showing, jobs are coming back, as is income. Just looking at the trends.

Nobody cares about trends. People want what they had before Later Bush and all of Obama. Sucks to be Obama.
Ore_Ele
Posts: 25,980
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11/5/2014 6:48:04 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 11/5/2014 3:53:13 PM, Greyparrot wrote:
At 11/5/2014 3:36:39 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
Median income by year

2000-62544
2001-62516
2002-61770
2003-61208
2004-60550
2005-61017
2006-62054
2007-62182
2008-60229
2009-59950
2010-58636
2011-57689
2012-58092
2013-58125

So it was just coincidence that you picked to start your comparison right on a peak just before the single worst drop in recent history to try to make Obama look worse? 2014 is going to be the 3rd year in a row of income growth in this recovery.

As the numbers are showing, jobs are coming back, as is income. Just looking at the trends.

Nobody cares about trends. People want what they had before Later Bush and all of Obama. Sucks to be Obama.

Yes, people are illogical. But that doesn't support what you were implying early that Obama had not been helping the economy and that we've been having a good recovery.
"Wanting Red Rhino Pill to have gender"
Greyparrot
Posts: 14,247
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11/5/2014 8:33:07 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 11/5/2014 6:48:04 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 11/5/2014 3:53:13 PM, Greyparrot wrote:
At 11/5/2014 3:36:39 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
Median income by year

2000-62544
2001-62516
2002-61770
2003-61208
2004-60550
2005-61017
2006-62054
2007-62182
2008-60229
2009-59950
2010-58636
2011-57689
2012-58092
2013-58125

So it was just coincidence that you picked to start your comparison right on a peak just before the single worst drop in recent history to try to make Obama look worse? 2014 is going to be the 3rd year in a row of income growth in this recovery.

As the numbers are showing, jobs are coming back, as is income. Just looking at the trends.

Nobody cares about trends. People want what they had before Later Bush and all of Obama. Sucks to be Obama.

Yes, people are illogical. But that doesn't support what you were implying early that Obama had not been helping the economy and that we've been having a good recovery.

The general public does not equate rising rates with recovery. Heck, the general public doesn't even care about lowered rates of spending, All they can see is the word "trillion" and an income that wasn't as good as the "good ole days."

Obama would have had to get back to start to get the title. Too bad.
1harderthanyouthink
Posts: 13,100
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11/5/2014 8:38:18 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
If people want a government that works, don't elect a President that you won't bother to support with a workable Congress.
"It's awfully considerate of you to think of me here,
And I'm much obliged to you for making it clear - that I'm not here."

-Syd Barrett

DDO Risk King
Ore_Ele
Posts: 25,980
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11/5/2014 8:45:03 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 11/5/2014 8:33:07 PM, Greyparrot wrote:
At 11/5/2014 6:48:04 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 11/5/2014 3:53:13 PM, Greyparrot wrote:
At 11/5/2014 3:36:39 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
Median income by year

2000-62544
2001-62516
2002-61770
2003-61208
2004-60550
2005-61017
2006-62054
2007-62182
2008-60229
2009-59950
2010-58636
2011-57689
2012-58092
2013-58125

So it was just coincidence that you picked to start your comparison right on a peak just before the single worst drop in recent history to try to make Obama look worse? 2014 is going to be the 3rd year in a row of income growth in this recovery.

As the numbers are showing, jobs are coming back, as is income. Just looking at the trends.

Nobody cares about trends. People want what they had before Later Bush and all of Obama. Sucks to be Obama.

Yes, people are illogical. But that doesn't support what you were implying early that Obama had not been helping the economy and that we've been having a good recovery.

The general public does not equate rising rates with recovery. Heck, the general public doesn't even care about lowered rates of spending, All they can see is the word "trillion" and an income that wasn't as good as the "good ole days."

Obama would have had to get back to start to get the title. Too bad.

That's besides the point. We were talking about (at least I was, and I presume that when you replied you were talking about the same thing, otherwise you just changed the topic without saying you were, also known as shifting goal posts, but whatever) the actual recovery and how the economy IS doing. Not how people perceive it is doing.

After all, if you close your ears and yell loud enough and long enough, you can believe whatever you want to believe.
"Wanting Red Rhino Pill to have gender"
Haroush
Posts: 1,329
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11/5/2014 8:51:44 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 11/4/2014 11:40:45 AM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 11/4/2014 4:18:44 AM, Emilrose wrote:
At 11/4/2014 12:20:20 AM, KevinZ95 wrote:
I think he is doing great all empirical evidence show positive figures and growth for the country. His approval rating is growing and how many actual arguments does the opposition really hold?

Many arguments, actually. It's odd that you claim all evidence shows "positive figures"--unemployment has actually increased since Obama has been in term. Moreover, the U.S is currently in billions of debt--that has also extensively added up since his presidency.

First off, that is wrong. Unemployment was 7.8% when he stepped into office. Now it is 5.9%. Secondly, he inherited 700,000 jobs being lost a month. Which was turned around very quickly to to point that we are seeing private sector job growth that we haven't seen since the 90's.

As for the debt, yes, it is growing. But the deficit is at its lowest in years and our debt to GDP is going down. If you are only looking at the debt number, then the worst you can say is that he is par for the hole, as almost every president has raised the debt.


In addition, there's his mishandling of foreign affairs; such as events in the Middle East.

That can be subjective depending on what you believe we should be doing in the middle east.

Don't forget much of the full time employment was created by Republican governors, not the president. Also, most of the employment created through the Stimulus was temporary jobs and federal jobs. Not middle class blue collar jobs.
Ore_Ele
Posts: 25,980
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11/5/2014 9:02:55 PM
Posted: 2 years ago
At 11/5/2014 9:00:50 PM, Haroush wrote:
Most of the recovery is because of the Republicans, not because of the Democrats and Obama.

That was a very convincing argument. I'm glad you could enlighten us all.
"Wanting Red Rhino Pill to have gender"