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A solution for the poor

PalinFan
Posts: 322
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7/19/2010 2:14:45 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
Scrap welfare and subsidize/ socialize post secondary education. This would insure that the poor are forwarded the opportunity to become successful and would benefit everyone instead of the few.

Discuss...
Super Man does not come close to the power of Jesus Christ - GodSands
InsertNameHere
Posts: 15,699
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7/19/2010 2:31:09 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
I agree with the socializing education bit. I'm not so sure about the welfare bit though, considering people need something in case they lose their job.
PalinFan
Posts: 322
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7/19/2010 2:35:07 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 7/19/2010 2:31:09 AM, InsertNameHere wrote:
I agree with the socializing education bit. I'm not so sure about the welfare bit though, considering people need something in case they lose their job.

They already have employment insurance.
Super Man does not come close to the power of Jesus Christ - GodSands
brian_eggleston
Posts: 3,347
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7/19/2010 2:43:06 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 7/19/2010 2:14:45 AM, PalinFan wrote:
Scrap welfare and subsidize/ socialize post secondary education. This would insure that the poor are forwarded the opportunity to become successful and would benefit everyone instead of the few.

Discuss...

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Feeling sorry for those poor little street urchins are you? How touching, how very noble of you.

"Filthy little blighters but, of course, that's not their fault. Why not chuck them some bones," eh?

"They don't have rich mummies and daddies so they don't deserve decent housing, education or health care," I suppose.

It's a case of "I'm alright, Jack, pull up the ladder" with you isn't it, PalinFan?
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InsertNameHere
Posts: 15,699
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7/19/2010 2:45:08 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 7/19/2010 2:44:25 AM, InsertNameHere wrote:
What do you propose should be done for disabled people who are unable to work?

Addressed @ Palinfan btw.
gerrandesquire
Posts: 1,258
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7/19/2010 2:51:39 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 7/19/2010 2:14:45 AM, PalinFan wrote:
Scrap welfare and subsidize/ socialize post secondary education. This would insure that the poor are forwarded the opportunity to become successful and would benefit everyone instead of the few.

Discuss...

yes, subsidizing/ socializing post secondary education is fine, but we would also need to provide incentives to the parents to send their children to school. Educating them, holding seminars would be beneficial, i think.
Zeitgeist
Posts: 430
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7/19/2010 3:12:03 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
Let's be real about this and face a few unpleasant facts into the bargain.

Almost all Western nations are insolvent. The ONLY reason that many are not bankrupt is the impetus that lets someone buy Government bonds in the knowledge that someone else will buy bonds when their bonds fall due because they in turn know that someone else will etc etc.

And all the time the nations debt increases because in almost all cases the cost of imports is greater than the earnings from exports.

We are all now entering a phase when a great deal of what we have been enjoying we will have to give up because what we have been enjoying has not been paid for by us but by other people lending us money.

It's going to get nasty. VERY nasty. In the case of "welfare" this will have to be cut to the bone. People in need will have to get by with as much of what they need being available rather than what they would like, and even then they will have to work for what they get.

I would like to see from a British perspective a return of what used to be called workhouses, places where the poor and homeless could be provided with bed and board in return for work because to be candid I don't think that the government can or should continue to hand out cash to enable people to remain in houses and flats they can not afford to pay for themselves.

It would also provide a cost effective way of dealing with the disabled who should also do what work they could to help offset the costs of their keep.

In the UK we've gone stark staring insane with "benefits". A recent case illustrates the problem to a tee.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk...

Although an extreme case it is far from untypical of the lunacy that our welfare system has been reduced to. Now we MUST reclaim the economy from its being predated upon by those taking out far more than they need to survive.

Then there's the matter of overseas aid. How on earth can it be sane to borrow money and put ourselves even deeper in debt just to give it away to a third party? Especially to places like India and China let alone the African countries that are and will always be money pits. And foreign wars.

Let Afghanistan sort itself out and deal with any trouble that result in problems in our countries by devastating attacks on those who cause trouble in our lands.

Asylum seekers? Get rid of all but genuine political asylum seekers at once. No if's no but's, OUT.

Illegal Immigrants? Round ‘em up and ship ‘em out and if they won't say where they come from then do a deal with somewhere such as one of the poorer African nations for them to take and house them and we will pay.

Welfare helps no one once it provides more than the essentials of life, it just becomes a demotivator.
brian_eggleston
Posts: 3,347
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7/19/2010 3:45:36 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 7/19/2010 3:12:03 AM, Zeitgeist wrote:
Let's be real about this and face a few unpleasant facts into the bargain.

Almost all Western nations are insolvent. The ONLY reason that many are not bankrupt is the impetus that lets someone buy Government bonds in the knowledge that someone else will buy bonds when their bonds fall due because they in turn know that someone else will etc etc.

And all the time the nations debt increases because in almost all cases the cost of imports is greater than the earnings from exports.

We are all now entering a phase when a great deal of what we have been enjoying we will have to give up because what we have been enjoying has not been paid for by us but by other people lending us money.

It's going to get nasty. VERY nasty. In the case of "welfare" this will have to be cut to the bone. People in need will have to get by with as much of what they need being available rather than what they would like, and even then they will have to work for what they get.

I would like to see from a British perspective a return of what used to be called workhouses, places where the poor and homeless could be provided with bed and board in return for work because to be candid I don't think that the government can or should continue to hand out cash to enable people to remain in houses and flats they can not afford to pay for themselves.

It would also provide a cost effective way of dealing with the disabled who should also do what work they could to help offset the costs of their keep.

In the UK we've gone stark staring insane with "benefits". A recent case illustrates the problem to a tee.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk...

Although an extreme case it is far from untypical of the lunacy that our welfare system has been reduced to. Now we MUST reclaim the economy from its being predated upon by those taking out far more than they need to survive.

Then there's the matter of overseas aid. How on earth can it be sane to borrow money and put ourselves even deeper in debt just to give it away to a third party? Especially to places like India and China let alone the African countries that are and will always be money pits. And foreign wars.

Let Afghanistan sort itself out and deal with any trouble that result in problems in our countries by devastating attacks on those who cause trouble in our lands.

Asylum seekers? Get rid of all but genuine political asylum seekers at once. No if's no but's, OUT.

Illegal Immigrants? Round ‘em up and ship ‘em out and if they won't say where they come from then do a deal with somewhere such as one of the poorer African nations for them to take and house them and we will pay.

Welfare helps no one once it provides more than the essentials of life, it just becomes a demotivator.

Did you know that benefit fraud costs the UK economy £1 billion a year. That's why the DWP employs thousands of investigators to crack down on the problem - and quite right too.

But did you also know that tax evasion costs the UK economy £16 billion a year, yet the SFO is chronically under-staffed and can only investigate the most serious cases.

So while Cameron bangs on about dole scroungers, he turns a blind eye to the activities of his snooty chums in the City who are robbing the taxpayer blind.
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Zeitgeist
Posts: 430
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7/19/2010 4:03:05 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 7/19/2010 3:45:36 AM, brian_eggleston wrote:
Did you know that benefit fraud costs the UK economy £1 billion a year. That's why the DWP employs thousands of investigators to crack down on the problem - and quite right too.

I do wonder what the net cost is after the costs of the investigators is factored in. Much better would be to cut right back on the payment of "benefits" and deliver support to life and limb in a targeted manner.

But did you also know that tax evasion costs the UK economy £16 billion a year, yet the SFO is chronically under-staffed and can only investigate the most serious cases.

Looking at the dogs dinner that the last shower-in-power created it's hardly surprising.

So while Cameron bangs on about dole scroungers, he turns a blind eye to the activities of his snooty chums in the City who are robbing the taxpayer blind.

Give DC a chance. He's making the right noises so far, though I totally disagree about ring fencing NHS and foreign aid spending, and his government must balance doing what has to be done against social unrest or worse.
Lukas
Posts: 110
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7/19/2010 5:07:28 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 7/19/2010 3:45:36 AM, brian_eggleston wrote:
At 7/19/2010 3:12:03 AM, Zeitgeist wrote:
Let's be real about this and face a few unpleasant facts into the bargain.

Almost all Western nations are insolvent. The ONLY reason that many are not bankrupt is the impetus that lets someone buy Government bonds in the knowledge that someone else will buy bonds when their bonds fall due because they in turn know that someone else will etc etc.

And all the time the nations debt increases because in almost all cases the cost of imports is greater than the earnings from exports.

We are all now entering a phase when a great deal of what we have been enjoying we will have to give up because what we have been enjoying has not been paid for by us but by other people lending us money.

It's going to get nasty. VERY nasty. In the case of "welfare" this will have to be cut to the bone. People in need will have to get by with as much of what they need being available rather than what they would like, and even then they will have to work for what they get.

I would like to see from a British perspective a return of what used to be called workhouses, places where the poor and homeless could be provided with bed and board in return for work because to be candid I don't think that the government can or should continue to hand out cash to enable people to remain in houses and flats they can not afford to pay for themselves.

It would also provide a cost effective way of dealing with the disabled who should also do what work they could to help offset the costs of their keep.

In the UK we've gone stark staring insane with "benefits". A recent case illustrates the problem to a tee.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk...

Although an extreme case it is far from untypical of the lunacy that our welfare system has been reduced to. Now we MUST reclaim the economy from its being predated upon by those taking out far more than they need to survive.

Then there's the matter of overseas aid. How on earth can it be sane to borrow money and put ourselves even deeper in debt just to give it away to a third party? Especially to places like India and China let alone the African countries that are and will always be money pits. And foreign wars.

Let Afghanistan sort itself out and deal with any trouble that result in problems in our countries by devastating attacks on those who cause trouble in our lands.

Asylum seekers? Get rid of all but genuine political asylum seekers at once. No if's no but's, OUT.

Illegal Immigrants? Round ‘em up and ship ‘em out and if they won't say where they come from then do a deal with somewhere such as one of the poorer African nations for them to take and house them and we will pay.

Welfare helps no one once it provides more than the essentials of life, it just becomes a demotivator.

Did you know that benefit fraud costs the UK economy £1 billion a year. That's why the DWP employs thousands of investigators to crack down on the problem - and quite right too.

But did you also know that tax evasion costs the UK economy £16 billion a year, yet the SFO is chronically under-staffed and can only investigate the most serious cases.

So while Cameron bangs on about dole scroungers, he turns a blind eye to the activities of his snooty chums in the City who are robbing the taxpayer blind.

Amen, brother!