Total Posts:108|Showing Posts:1-30|Last Page
Jump to topic:

flogging

Loserboi
Posts: 1,232
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
9/21/2010 11:38:56 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
Wow... when my friend told me about this i thought he was kidding...
Why the hell do people still do this???

Flogging is whipping someone for those who don't know what it is.
P.S i did not know where to put this forum sorry if i posted in a inappropriate forum
tvellalott
Posts: 10,864
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
9/22/2010 12:57:01 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/21/2010 11:38:56 PM, Loserboi wrote:
Wow... when my friend told me about this i thought he was kidding...
Why the hell do people still do this???

Flogging is whipping someone for those who don't know what it is.
P.S i did not know where to put this forum sorry if i posted in a inappropriate forum

Guess what I thought this topic was?

I suppose a good whipping might teach someone a lesson.
"Caitlyn Jenner is an incredibly brave and stunningly beautiful woman."

Muh threads
Using mafia tactics in real-life: http://www.debate.org...
6 years of DDO: http://www.debate.org...
Mirza
Posts: 16,992
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
9/22/2010 1:16:10 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/21/2010 11:38:56 PM, Loserboi wrote:
Wow... when my friend told me about this i thought he was kidding...
Why the hell do people still do this???
What is wrong with it? Please tell me what is logically wrong with it, not emotionally. Please tell how it is worse than life imprisonment, too.
InsertNameHere
Posts: 15,699
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
9/22/2010 2:33:46 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/22/2010 1:16:10 AM, Mirza wrote:
At 9/21/2010 11:38:56 PM, Loserboi wrote:
Wow... when my friend told me about this i thought he was kidding...
Why the hell do people still do this???
What is wrong with it? Please tell me what is logically wrong with it, not emotionally. Please tell how it is worse than life imprisonment, too.

Well considering in your religion you can flog women I don't see how you would have a problem with it. There should be a rule that women can also flog their disobedient husbands... :P
Mirza
Posts: 16,992
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
9/22/2010 2:49:12 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/22/2010 2:33:46 AM, InsertNameHere wrote:
Well considering in your religion you can flog women I don't see how you would have a problem with it. There should be a rule that women can also flog their disobedient husbands... :P
Please do not derail the thread or any other whenever I come with an argument, whatever you think the basis for it is.

Since you mention it, there is nothing between spouses of such kind, neither is it exclusively for women.

Now, let us focus on the original topic, merci beaucoup.
InsertNameHere
Posts: 15,699
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
9/22/2010 2:51:52 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/22/2010 2:49:12 AM, Mirza wrote:
At 9/22/2010 2:33:46 AM, InsertNameHere wrote:
Well considering in your religion you can flog women I don't see how you would have a problem with it. There should be a rule that women can also flog their disobedient husbands... :P
Please do not derail the thread or any other whenever I come with an argument, whatever you think the basis for it is.

Since you mention it, there is nothing between spouses of such kind, neither is it exclusively for women.

Now, let us focus on the original topic, merci beaucoup.

I wasn't trying to intentionally derail. I just thought it was something interesting to bring up how men can beat their wives, but women can't do the same to their husbands. Besides, it's still about flogging(kinda...) so it's relevant.
Mirza
Posts: 16,992
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
9/22/2010 2:53:48 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/22/2010 2:51:52 AM, InsertNameHere wrote:
I wasn't trying to intentionally derail. I just thought it was something interesting to bring up how men can beat their wives, but women can't do the same to their husbands. Besides, it's still about flogging(kinda...) so it's relevant.
It is...

a) Misinformation and
b) too specific.
Mirza
Posts: 16,992
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
9/22/2010 2:59:29 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/22/2010 2:54:53 AM, InsertNameHere wrote:
Hmm...fine. :(

Anyway, I'm generally against corporal punishment.
Why? Using outdated scientific arguments?
InsertNameHere
Posts: 15,699
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
9/22/2010 3:00:01 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/22/2010 2:59:29 AM, Mirza wrote:
At 9/22/2010 2:54:53 AM, InsertNameHere wrote:
Hmm...fine. :(

Anyway, I'm generally against corporal punishment.
Why? Using outdated scientific arguments?

Outdated? How exactly?
Mirza
Posts: 16,992
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
9/22/2010 3:00:51 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/22/2010 3:00:01 AM, InsertNameHere wrote:
At 9/22/2010 2:59:29 AM, Mirza wrote:
At 9/22/2010 2:54:53 AM, InsertNameHere wrote:
Hmm...fine. :(

Anyway, I'm generally against corporal punishment.
Why? Using outdated scientific arguments?

Outdated? How exactly?
Are you against imprisonment, or life imprisonment?
Cerebral_Narcissist
Posts: 10,806
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
9/22/2010 3:02:03 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/22/2010 1:16:10 AM, Mirza wrote:
At 9/21/2010 11:38:56 PM, Loserboi wrote:
Wow... when my friend told me about this i thought he was kidding...
Why the hell do people still do this???
What is wrong with it? Please tell me what is logically wrong with it, not emotionally. Please tell how it is worse than life imprisonment, too.

Though it feels strange to agree with Mirza on a point of law/punishment I have to agree, what is fundamentally wrong with flogging as a form of punishment?
I am voting for Innomen because of his intelligence, common sense, humility and the fact that Juggle appears to listen to him. Any other Presidential style would have a large sub-section of the site up in arms. If I was President I would destroy the site though elitism, others would let it run riot. Innomen represents a middle way that works, neither draconian nor anarchic and that is the only way things can work. Plus he does it all without ego trips.
Mirza
Posts: 16,992
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
9/22/2010 3:05:59 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/22/2010 3:01:36 AM, InsertNameHere wrote:
At 9/22/2010 3:00:51 AM, Mirza wrote:

Are you against imprisonment, or life imprisonment?

Nope.
Good, so you are against physical pain but not mental pain.

This outdated ruling was (and unfortunately still is) based on an outdated, scientific argument that physical pain = physical --> mental, and mental pain = exclusively mental.

However, thanks to scientific progress, we know that psychological pain or mistreatment can indeed lead to negative effects to the physical part of one's body. That is why choosing one above another of these two forms of punishment is egregious and sort of an insult to a scientific progressive society.
InsertNameHere
Posts: 15,699
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
9/22/2010 3:07:55 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/22/2010 3:05:59 AM, Mirza wrote:
At 9/22/2010 3:01:36 AM, InsertNameHere wrote:
At 9/22/2010 3:00:51 AM, Mirza wrote:

Are you against imprisonment, or life imprisonment?

Nope.
Good, so you are against physical pain but not mental pain.

This outdated ruling was (and unfortunately still is) based on an outdated, scientific argument that physical pain = physical --> mental, and mental pain = exclusively mental.

However, thanks to scientific progress, we know that psychological pain or mistreatment can indeed lead to negative effects to the physical part of one's body. That is why choosing one above another of these two forms of punishment is egregious and sort of an insult to a scientific progressive society.

Flogging could be considered torture in some circles depending on the severity of it. Torture is unacceptable. I suppose I can't really speak out against it though, considering I believe criminals should do hard labour and give up most of their rights upon committing their crime.
Mirza
Posts: 16,992
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
9/22/2010 3:10:09 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/22/2010 3:07:55 AM, InsertNameHere wrote:
Flogging could be considered torture in some circles depending on the severity of it. Torture is unacceptable. I suppose I can't really speak out against it though, considering I believe criminals should do hard labour and give up most of their rights upon committing their crime.
Once more you think that mental torture is fine and physical is not.

Furthermore, it is punishment that serves justice and warns people about crimes. Under certain circumstances this punishment is indeed good.
InsertNameHere
Posts: 15,699
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
9/22/2010 3:10:47 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/22/2010 3:10:09 AM, Mirza wrote:
At 9/22/2010 3:07:55 AM, InsertNameHere wrote:
Flogging could be considered torture in some circles depending on the severity of it. Torture is unacceptable. I suppose I can't really speak out against it though, considering I believe criminals should do hard labour and give up most of their rights upon committing their crime.
Once more you think that mental torture is fine and physical is not.

Furthermore, it is punishment that serves justice and warns people about crimes. Under certain circumstances this punishment is indeed good.

Hard labour is physical punishment.
Mirza
Posts: 16,992
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
9/22/2010 3:12:07 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/22/2010 3:10:47 AM, InsertNameHere wrote:
Hard labour is physical punishment.
Yes, but you called it torture. Why not call imprisonment torture?
InsertNameHere
Posts: 15,699
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
9/22/2010 3:14:49 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/22/2010 3:12:07 AM, Mirza wrote:
At 9/22/2010 3:10:47 AM, InsertNameHere wrote:
Hard labour is physical punishment.
Yes, but you called it torture. Why not call imprisonment torture?

Imprisonment itself is not torture, considering how luxurious many prisons are. Many prisoners have more luxuries than a homeless person. That is not justice.
brian_eggleston
Posts: 3,347
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
9/22/2010 4:02:25 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
I think they should bring flogging back as it is the fairest, most egalitarian way to punish petty crimes.

For example, say someone parks their car illegally and gets a ticket.

It may be a low-paid single father who illegally parked his beaten-up old Vauxhall Cavalier outside the corner shop for a few minutes while he nipped in to get some nappies and baby food or it could be a parasitic aristocrat who illegally parked his brand new Rolls-Royce Phantom Drophead Coupe outside Le Restaurant de la Posh for two hours while he gorged himself on oysters, fois gras, white truffles and caviar – but they will still have to pay exactly the same £120 fine.

But that's not fair is it? The filthy rich aristocrat probably paid more than that for his first course whereas £120 might represent a week's wages for a single father who only has menial part-time work because of childcare issues.

However, half a dozen lashes of the cat o'nine tails [1] will hurt both the offenders equally and will mean that the single father's baby won't be deprived of food and nappies because his dad couldn't afford them because he had to pay a parking fine instead.

[1] http://www.diggerhistory.info...
Visit the burglars' bulletin board: http://www.break-in-news.com...
Mirza
Posts: 16,992
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
9/22/2010 7:30:15 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/22/2010 3:14:49 AM, InsertNameHere wrote:
Imprisonment itself is not torture, considering how luxurious many prisons are. Many prisoners have more luxuries than a homeless person. That is not justice.
You are generalizing prisons, and I agree that many are too luxurious.
lovelife
Posts: 14,629
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
9/22/2010 7:38:18 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/22/2010 4:02:25 AM, brian_eggleston wrote:
I think they should bring flogging back as it is the fairest, most egalitarian way to punish petty crimes.

For example, say someone parks their car illegally and gets a ticket.

It may be a low-paid single father who illegally parked his beaten-up old Vauxhall Cavalier outside the corner shop for a few minutes while he nipped in to get some nappies and baby food or it could be a parasitic aristocrat who illegally parked his brand new Rolls-Royce Phantom Drophead Coupe outside Le Restaurant de la Posh for two hours while he gorged himself on oysters, fois gras, white truffles and caviar – but they will still have to pay exactly the same £120 fine.

But that's not fair is it? The filthy rich aristocrat probably paid more than that for his first course whereas £120 might represent a week's wages for a single father who only has menial part-time work because of childcare issues.

However, half a dozen lashes of the cat o'nine tails [1] will hurt both the offenders equally and will mean that the single father's baby won't be deprived of food and nappies because his dad couldn't afford them because he had to pay a parking fine instead.

[1] http://www.diggerhistory.info...

With brian I never know if he's joking.

I came in agreeing with loserboi and INH, but because of this, I'm more inclined to agree that flogging is the best way mentioned so far, and I'm too lazy to think of something better.
Without Royal there is a hole inside of me, I have no choice but to leave
lovelife
Posts: 14,629
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
9/22/2010 10:27:23 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/22/2010 10:22:45 AM, I-am-a-panda wrote:
Flogging for whom and in what circumstances?

Those that commit petty crimes, parking in the wrong place, theft, stuff of that nature. I'd assume everyone, but he said not women.
Without Royal there is a hole inside of me, I have no choice but to leave
I-am-a-panda
Posts: 15,380
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
9/22/2010 10:29:36 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/22/2010 10:27:23 AM, lovelife wrote:
At 9/22/2010 10:22:45 AM, I-am-a-panda wrote:
Flogging for whom and in what circumstances?

Those that commit petty crimes, parking in the wrong place, theft, stuff of that nature. I'd assume everyone, but he said not women.

I find a fine is more appropriate and less barbaric. Of course that's presuming it's public space. If it's private property the owners can pursue any punishment they want.
Pizza. I have enormous respect for Pizza.
lovelife
Posts: 14,629
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
9/22/2010 10:30:16 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/22/2010 10:29:36 AM, I-am-a-panda wrote:
At 9/22/2010 10:27:23 AM, lovelife wrote:
At 9/22/2010 10:22:45 AM, I-am-a-panda wrote:
Flogging for whom and in what circumstances?

Those that commit petty crimes, parking in the wrong place, theft, stuff of that nature. I'd assume everyone, but he said not women.

I find a fine is more appropriate and less barbaric. Of course that's presuming it's public space. If it's private property the owners can pursue any punishment they want.

The deal is, fines affect poor and rich unequally.
Without Royal there is a hole inside of me, I have no choice but to leave
I-am-a-panda
Posts: 15,380
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
9/22/2010 10:47:17 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/22/2010 10:30:16 AM, lovelife wrote:
At 9/22/2010 10:29:36 AM, I-am-a-panda wrote:
At 9/22/2010 10:27:23 AM, lovelife wrote:
At 9/22/2010 10:22:45 AM, I-am-a-panda wrote:
Flogging for whom and in what circumstances?

Those that commit petty crimes, parking in the wrong place, theft, stuff of that nature. I'd assume everyone, but he said not women.

I find a fine is more appropriate and less barbaric. Of course that's presuming it's public space. If it's private property the owners can pursue any punishment they want.

The deal is, fines affect poor and rich unequally.

So? They both committed the exact same offence, I don't see why we need to resort to musical punishment. It's a monetary punishment, and both lose the exact same amount.

What about weak older people!? It certainly effects them disproportionately to fit, young people.
Pizza. I have enormous respect for Pizza.
Ragnar_Rahl
Posts: 19,297
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
9/22/2010 10:50:23 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
The problem with flogging is BDSM enthusiasts living with an effective immunity to any laws its prescribed for.
It came to be at its height. It was commanded to command. It was a capital before its first stone was laid. It was a monument to the spirit of man.
Loserboi
Posts: 1,232
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
9/22/2010 10:52:23 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
flogging is inhuman and ridiculous. The government should not have the right to willfully inflict physical pain and suffering to a person. Life in prison is a long mental rehabilitation and allows the person to reflect on his crimes. Flogging in replacement to jail time is ridiculous, people won't learn their lesson they will just develop a hate for the government. Flogging is not a appropriate punishment for any situation. Do you agree with Lynching?
I-am-a-panda
Posts: 15,380
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
9/22/2010 10:54:23 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/22/2010 10:52:23 AM, Loserboi wrote:
flogging is inhuman and ridiculous. The government should not have the right to willfully inflict physical pain and suffering to a person.

"Pro War in Afghanistan"

You lie.

Life in prison is a long mental rehabilitation and allows the person to reflect on his crimes. Flogging in replacement to jail time is ridiculous, people won't learn their lesson they will just develop a hate for the government. Flogging is not a appropriate punishment for any situation. Do you agree with Lynching?

Flogging =/= Lynching
Pizza. I have enormous respect for Pizza.