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Austrians arm themselves against invasion

thett3
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10/29/2015 4:01:51 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
Shotguns are entirely sold out in the country as Austrians scramble for weapons to defend themselves with. Lines to apply for a gun license are out the door. Driving the scrambal is primarily women: unlike men, women cannot afford to delude themselves about what giving away their country really means for the European woman. I bet there are more than a few Europeans who, after years of mocking American gun laws, would be acting the same as the Austrians if their gun laws were as lax.

Good for you, Austrians. I don't know what the self defense laws are like in your country, but never forget that it's always better to be judged by 12 than carried by 6.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk...
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: At 11/12/2016 11:49:40 PM, Raisor wrote:
: thett was right
bsh1
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10/29/2015 4:45:41 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
I've never seen anyone with a firearm here...except the police.
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bsh1
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10/29/2015 4:47:03 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
And, it mentions the city I live, and the licensing house never has a line.
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Mirza
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10/29/2015 4:54:41 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/29/2015 4:47:03 PM, bsh1 wrote:
And, it mentions the city I live, and the licensing house never has a line.
They purchased invisibility cloaks first. :)
Insignifica
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10/29/2015 5:01:54 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/29/2015 4:45:41 PM, bsh1 wrote:
I've never seen anyone with a firearm here...except the police.

You live in Austria? That's strange. You seem thoroughly American-bred to me.
Vox_Veritas
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10/29/2015 5:02:19 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/29/2015 4:01:51 PM, thett3 wrote:
Shotguns are entirely sold out in the country as Austrians scramble for weapons to defend themselves with. Lines to apply for a gun license are out the door. Driving the scrambal is primarily women: unlike men, women cannot afford to delude themselves about what giving away their country really means for the European woman. I bet there are more than a few Europeans who, after years of mocking American gun laws, would be acting the same as the Austrians if their gun laws were as lax.

Good for you, Austrians. I don't know what the self defense laws are like in your country, but never forget that it's always better to be judged by 12 than carried by 6.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk...

What exactly are they scared of?
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thett3
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10/29/2015 5:17:01 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/29/2015 4:45:41 PM, bsh1 wrote:
I've never seen anyone with a firearm here...except the police.

Why would you? I live in Texas of all places, and outside of a gun range I've never seen anyone carrying a firearm in public other than the police. Shotguns are home defense weapons anyway. The article also says they are buying a lot of pepper spray...for obvious reasons
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: At 11/12/2016 11:49:40 PM, Raisor wrote:
: thett was right
thett3
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10/29/2015 5:19:12 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/29/2015 4:47:03 PM, bsh1 wrote:
And, it mentions the city I live, and the licensing house never has a line.

No offense, but I'll take the word of the paper over yours--it's not that I think you're lying, but lines inside an inscure government building aren't something I would expect an American student to notice. It's not germane to the main point anyway: many Austrians are arming themselves for fear of what is coming
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"Don't quote me, ever." -Max

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"Walmart should have the opportunity to bribe a politician to it's agenda" -Max

"Thett, you're really good at convincing people you're a decent person"-tulle

"You fit the character of Regina George quite nicely"- Sam

: At 11/12/2016 11:49:40 PM, Raisor wrote:
: thett was right
thett3
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10/29/2015 5:22:02 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/29/2015 5:02:19 PM, Vox_Veritas wrote:
At 10/29/2015 4:01:51 PM, thett3 wrote:
Shotguns are entirely sold out in the country as Austrians scramble for weapons to defend themselves with. Lines to apply for a gun license are out the door. Driving the scrambal is primarily women: unlike men, women cannot afford to delude themselves about what giving away their country really means for the European woman. I bet there are more than a few Europeans who, after years of mocking American gun laws, would be acting the same as the Austrians if their gun laws were as lax.

Good for you, Austrians. I don't know what the self defense laws are like in your country, but never forget that it's always better to be judged by 12 than carried by 6.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk...

What exactly are they scared of?

Rape. European governments idea of stopping rape is a voluntary, 5 hour course on sex-ed. Also, it's likely that this migrant crisis is going to end in bloodshed one way or another. If I lived there I would be doing the same thing http://m.sputniknews.com...
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"Thett, you're really good at convincing people you're a decent person"-tulle

"You fit the character of Regina George quite nicely"- Sam

: At 11/12/2016 11:49:40 PM, Raisor wrote:
: thett was right
thett3
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10/29/2015 5:30:30 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/29/2015 4:11:25 PM, Mirza wrote:
I think the fear is overblown; we'll see how this all progresses, though.

One can only hope... I don't see how there is a good outcome from this, though.
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"Thett, you're really good at convincing people you're a decent person"-tulle

"You fit the character of Regina George quite nicely"- Sam

: At 11/12/2016 11:49:40 PM, Raisor wrote:
: thett was right
Mirza
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10/29/2015 5:43:06 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/29/2015 5:30:30 PM, thett3 wrote:
One can only hope... I don't see how there is a good outcome from this, though.
There probably won't be. However, as much as I am against mass immigration into Europe - and I've spoken about this before - I think there should be an exception for the refugees for now. If we get a lot of problems, we'll have more grounds on which to limit the influx in the future, should something like this happen again.

For us Europeans, though, it's certainly not a good thing in pragmatic terms. We'll have to spend a huge amount of resources on trying to integrate and educate the refugees, and if things don't go well, crime could become a huge problem, and all the burdens we currently face with immigrants will just become worse.

No matter what we do now, one thing is clear: we'll have to close European borders in the future. I'm extremely protective of my homeland and mass immigration (with this one exception) I will not and cannot tolerate, and neither will many other Europeans.
thett3
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10/29/2015 5:46:56 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/29/2015 5:43:06 PM, Mirza wrote:
At 10/29/2015 5:30:30 PM, thett3 wrote:
One can only hope... I don't see how there is a good outcome from this, though.
There probably won't be. However, as much as I am against mass immigration into Europe - and I've spoken about this before - I think there should be an exception for the refugees for now. If we get a lot of problems, we'll have more grounds on which to limit the influx in the future, should something like this happen again.

For us Europeans, though, it's certainly not a good thing in pragmatic terms. We'll have to spend a huge amount of resources on trying to integrate and educate the refugees, and if things don't go well, crime could become a huge problem, and all the burdens we currently face with immigrants will just become worse.

No matter what we do now, one thing is clear: we'll have to close European borders in the future. I'm extremely protective of my homeland and mass immigration (with this one exception) I will not and cannot tolerate, and neither will many other Europeans.

I think it would be acceptable to give asylum to some refugees, on the condition that they come from a place that is actually under threat and they will leave as and go back as soon as it's safe. Problem is, most of these "refugees" are not refugees. Even a lot of the Syrian ones are leaving a safe life in Turkey because Europe offers more attractive living standards and they don't feel like doing it the legal way.

Agree with what you say about Europe having to close its borders. The current mass immigration era is rapidly coming to an end imo. I just hope it isn't too late
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"You fit the character of Regina George quite nicely"- Sam

: At 11/12/2016 11:49:40 PM, Raisor wrote:
: thett was right
Mirza
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10/29/2015 5:56:45 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/29/2015 5:46:56 PM, thett3 wrote:
I think it would be acceptable to give asylum to some refugees, on the condition that they come from a place that is actually under threat and they will leave as and go back as soon as it's safe. Problem is, most of these "refugees" are not refugees. Even a lot of the Syrian ones are leaving a safe life in Turkey because Europe offers more attractive living standards and they don't feel like doing it the legal way.

Agree with what you say about Europe having to close its borders. The current mass immigration era is rapidly coming to an end imo. I just hope it isn't too late
Some of them face harsh situations in Turkey as well. "Safety" is one thing, but living in very difficult circumstances in what seems like a place of refuge doesn't seem to be ideal. That's why some choose Europe where there's a lot better prospect for having basic needs met.

I'm not so worried for now. I only want there to be fast progress on finding solutions in case of future scenarios, and making sure we make it clear that we cannot function as a magnet to foreigners. Our continent is delicate and precious, and is built upon our sovereignty as peoples and our nation states. Whatever seems like a threat to the strings holding all of this together must not be tolerated.

I'll just say I'm glad my home country hasn't experienced mass immigration in the last few decades. When I see statistics that result from migration, I seriously get really angry inside.
bsh1
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10/29/2015 6:01:58 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/29/2015 5:17:01 PM, thett3 wrote:
At 10/29/2015 4:45:41 PM, bsh1 wrote:
I've never seen anyone with a firearm here...except the police.

Why would you? I live in Texas of all places, and outside of a gun range I've never seen anyone carrying a firearm in public other than the police. Shotguns are home defense weapons anyway. The article also says they are buying a lot of pepper spray...for obvious reasons

I guess, but there are only 3 or 4 shops in my city where they sell guns, and I walk past 2 of them semi-regularly, and they're never busy, and they always look fully stocked.
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thett3
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10/29/2015 6:03:08 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/29/2015 5:56:45 PM, Mirza wrote:

I'll just say I'm glad my home country hasn't experienced mass immigration in the last few decades. When I see statistics that result from migration, I seriously get really angry inside.

Yup. We're expected to celebrate developments like this: http://www.express.co.uk...

It's like the west has been infected with a mind virus, seriously.
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: At 11/12/2016 11:49:40 PM, Raisor wrote:
: thett was right
bsh1
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10/29/2015 6:03:54 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/29/2015 5:19:12 PM, thett3 wrote:
At 10/29/2015 4:47:03 PM, bsh1 wrote:
And, it mentions the city I live, and the licensing house never has a line.

No offense, but I'll take the word of the paper over yours--it's not that I think you're lying, but lines inside an inscure government building aren't something I would expect an American student to notice. It's not germane to the main point anyway: many Austrians are arming themselves for fear of what is coming

For fear of whats coming? You make the refugees sound like an impending Armageddon. The Austrians are totally overblowing it. They're voting for the FPO (nationalist, right-wingers, polling #1, formerly sanctioned by the EU for being anti-democratic) and being idiots about it, when all the refugees have so far been harmless.
Live Long and Prosper

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"Twilight isn't just about obtuse metaphors between cannibalism and premarital sex, it also teaches us the futility of hope." - Raisor

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thett3
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10/29/2015 6:04:00 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/29/2015 6:01:58 PM, bsh1 wrote:
At 10/29/2015 5:17:01 PM, thett3 wrote:
At 10/29/2015 4:45:41 PM, bsh1 wrote:
I've never seen anyone with a firearm here...except the police.

Why would you? I live in Texas of all places, and outside of a gun range I've never seen anyone carrying a firearm in public other than the police. Shotguns are home defense weapons anyway. The article also says they are buying a lot of pepper spray...for obvious reasons

I guess, but there are only 3 or 4 shops in my city where they sell guns, and I walk past 2 of them semi-regularly, and they're never busy, and they always look fully stocked.

Are they fully stocked with shotguns? Those are the guns that don't require permits that the article is claiming are facing a stock out.
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"Walmart should have the opportunity to bribe a politician to it's agenda" -Max

"Thett, you're really good at convincing people you're a decent person"-tulle

"You fit the character of Regina George quite nicely"- Sam

: At 11/12/2016 11:49:40 PM, Raisor wrote:
: thett was right
bsh1
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10/29/2015 6:05:17 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/29/2015 6:04:00 PM, thett3 wrote:
At 10/29/2015 6:01:58 PM, bsh1 wrote:
At 10/29/2015 5:17:01 PM, thett3 wrote:
At 10/29/2015 4:45:41 PM, bsh1 wrote:
I've never seen anyone with a firearm here...except the police.

Why would you? I live in Texas of all places, and outside of a gun range I've never seen anyone carrying a firearm in public other than the police. Shotguns are home defense weapons anyway. The article also says they are buying a lot of pepper spray...for obvious reasons

I guess, but there are only 3 or 4 shops in my city where they sell guns, and I walk past 2 of them semi-regularly, and they're never busy, and they always look fully stocked.

Are they fully stocked with shotguns? Those are the guns that don't require permits that the article is claiming are facing a stock out.

IDK. I mean, I notice the guns, not what kind of guns they are. I can go check it out, though.
Live Long and Prosper

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thett3
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10/29/2015 6:08:38 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/29/2015 6:03:54 PM, bsh1 wrote:
At 10/29/2015 5:19:12 PM, thett3 wrote:
At 10/29/2015 4:47:03 PM, bsh1 wrote:
And, it mentions the city I live, and the licensing house never has a line.

No offense, but I'll take the word of the paper over yours--it's not that I think you're lying, but lines inside an inscure government building aren't something I would expect an American student to notice. It's not germane to the main point anyway: many Austrians are arming themselves for fear of what is coming

For fear of whats coming? You make the refugees sound like an impending Armageddon. The Austrians are totally overblowing it. They're voting for the FPO (nationalist, right-wingers, polling #1, formerly sanctioned by the EU for being anti-democratic) and being idiots about it, when all the refugees have so far been harmless.

The idiots are the ones giving away their country because they want to virtue signal. There's a famous rule in statistics called Cromwell's rule. It's named after a famous Cromwell quote: "I beseech you, in the bowels of Christ, think it possible that you may be mistaken."

Bsh, I beseech you, think it possible you may be mistaken. I know your ideology teaches you that we are all the same and that, deep down, nobody is or wants to be anything except a secular liberal, but that kind of universalism simply isn't true. Some mistakes you can only make once--handing Europe off is one of them.
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"Don't quote me, ever." -Max

"My name is max. I'm not a big fan of slacks"- Max rapping

"Walmart should have the opportunity to bribe a politician to it's agenda" -Max

"Thett, you're really good at convincing people you're a decent person"-tulle

"You fit the character of Regina George quite nicely"- Sam

: At 11/12/2016 11:49:40 PM, Raisor wrote:
: thett was right
bsh1
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10/29/2015 6:11:54 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/29/2015 6:08:38 PM, thett3 wrote:
At 10/29/2015 6:03:54 PM, bsh1 wrote:
At 10/29/2015 5:19:12 PM, thett3 wrote:
At 10/29/2015 4:47:03 PM, bsh1 wrote:
And, it mentions the city I live, and the licensing house never has a line.

No offense, but I'll take the word of the paper over yours--it's not that I think you're lying, but lines inside an inscure government building aren't something I would expect an American student to notice. It's not germane to the main point anyway: many Austrians are arming themselves for fear of what is coming

For fear of whats coming? You make the refugees sound like an impending Armageddon. The Austrians are totally overblowing it. They're voting for the FPO (nationalist, right-wingers, polling #1, formerly sanctioned by the EU for being anti-democratic) and being idiots about it, when all the refugees have so far been harmless.

The idiots are the ones giving away their country because they want to virtue signal. There's a famous rule in statistics called Cromwell's rule. It's named after a famous Cromwell quote: "I beseech you, in the bowels of Christ, think it possible that you may be mistaken."

Bsh, I beseech you, think it possible you may be mistaken. I know your ideology teaches you that we are all the same and that, deep down, nobody is or wants to be anything except a secular liberal, but that kind of universalism simply isn't true. Some mistakes you can only make once--handing Europe off is one of them.

Please tell me your joking. If not, let's debate it: "The EU, on balance, ought to accept refugees fleeing from violence in the Middle East and Africa."
Live Long and Prosper

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"Twilight isn't just about obtuse metaphors between cannibalism and premarital sex, it also teaches us the futility of hope." - Raisor

"[Bsh1] is the Guinan of DDO." - ButterCatX

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thett3
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10/29/2015 6:13:58 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/29/2015 6:11:54 PM, bsh1 wrote:
At 10/29/2015 6:08:38 PM, thett3 wrote:
At 10/29/2015 6:03:54 PM, bsh1 wrote:
At 10/29/2015 5:19:12 PM, thett3 wrote:
At 10/29/2015 4:47:03 PM, bsh1 wrote:
And, it mentions the city I live, and the licensing house never has a line.

No offense, but I'll take the word of the paper over yours--it's not that I think you're lying, but lines inside an inscure government building aren't something I would expect an American student to notice. It's not germane to the main point anyway: many Austrians are arming themselves for fear of what is coming

For fear of whats coming? You make the refugees sound like an impending Armageddon. The Austrians are totally overblowing it. They're voting for the FPO (nationalist, right-wingers, polling #1, formerly sanctioned by the EU for being anti-democratic) and being idiots about it, when all the refugees have so far been harmless.

The idiots are the ones giving away their country because they want to virtue signal. There's a famous rule in statistics called Cromwell's rule. It's named after a famous Cromwell quote: "I beseech you, in the bowels of Christ, think it possible that you may be mistaken."

Bsh, I beseech you, think it possible you may be mistaken. I know your ideology teaches you that we are all the same and that, deep down, nobody is or wants to be anything except a secular liberal, but that kind of universalism simply isn't true. Some mistakes you can only make once--handing Europe off is one of them.

Please tell me your joking. If not, let's debate it: "The EU, on balance, ought to accept refugees fleeing from violence in the Middle East and Africa."

Why would I joke? I'm not debating that topic: I'm okay with conditional acceptance of refugees actually fleeing violence. I'll debate anyone on the topic that Europe should severely curtail the number it's accepting and keep them from invading their borders like they are now
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"Don't quote me, ever." -Max

"My name is max. I'm not a big fan of slacks"- Max rapping

"Walmart should have the opportunity to bribe a politician to it's agenda" -Max

"Thett, you're really good at convincing people you're a decent person"-tulle

"You fit the character of Regina George quite nicely"- Sam

: At 11/12/2016 11:49:40 PM, Raisor wrote:
: thett was right
BlackFlags
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10/29/2015 6:15:06 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
Glock and Steyr Mannlicher. Only Austrian weapon manufacturers I know, and neither of them are any good at making shotguns.

The most likely country to invade Austria is Italy, as Austrians buy Franichi shotguns.
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10/29/2015 6:18:03 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/29/2015 6:13:58 PM, thett3 wrote:
At 10/29/2015 6:11:54 PM, bsh1 wrote:
At 10/29/2015 6:08:38 PM, thett3 wrote:
At 10/29/2015 6:03:54 PM, bsh1 wrote:
At 10/29/2015 5:19:12 PM, thett3 wrote:
At 10/29/2015 4:47:03 PM, bsh1 wrote:
And, it mentions the city I live, and the licensing house never has a line.

No offense, but I'll take the word of the paper over yours--it's not that I think you're lying, but lines inside an inscure government building aren't something I would expect an American student to notice. It's not germane to the main point anyway: many Austrians are arming themselves for fear of what is coming

For fear of whats coming? You make the refugees sound like an impending Armageddon. The Austrians are totally overblowing it. They're voting for the FPO (nationalist, right-wingers, polling #1, formerly sanctioned by the EU for being anti-democratic) and being idiots about it, when all the refugees have so far been harmless.

The idiots are the ones giving away their country because they want to virtue signal. There's a famous rule in statistics called Cromwell's rule. It's named after a famous Cromwell quote: "I beseech you, in the bowels of Christ, think it possible that you may be mistaken."

Bsh, I beseech you, think it possible you may be mistaken. I know your ideology teaches you that we are all the same and that, deep down, nobody is or wants to be anything except a secular liberal, but that kind of universalism simply isn't true. Some mistakes you can only make once--handing Europe off is one of them.

Please tell me your joking. If not, let's debate it: "The EU, on balance, ought to accept refugees fleeing from violence in the Middle East and Africa."

Why would I joke? I'm not debating that topic: I'm okay with conditional acceptance of refugees actually fleeing violence. I'll debate anyone on the topic that Europe should severely curtail the number it's accepting and keep them from invading their borders like they are now

Short of shooting people down at the crossing and mass arrests with little due process, Europe could not secure its borders in the way you are suggesting. And, more than 70% of migrants are refugees or would likely qualify for asylum [http://www.theguardian.com...]. You cannot, ethically-speaking, turn all those people back.
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BlackFlags
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10/29/2015 6:22:05 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/29/2015 6:18:03 PM, bsh1 wrote:
Short of shooting people down at the crossing and mass arrests with little due process, Europe could not secure its borders in the way you are suggesting. And, more than 70% of migrants are refugees or would likely qualify for asylum. You cannot, ethically-speaking, turn all those people back.

Hungary did a great job at turning down migrants. The tide of liberal outrage passed quite quickly too.
bsh1
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10/29/2015 6:25:30 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/29/2015 6:22:05 PM, BlackFlags wrote:
At 10/29/2015 6:18:03 PM, bsh1 wrote:
Short of shooting people down at the crossing and mass arrests with little due process, Europe could not secure its borders in the way you are suggesting. And, more than 70% of migrants are refugees or would likely qualify for asylum. You cannot, ethically-speaking, turn all those people back.

Hungary did a great job at turning down migrants. The tide of liberal outrage passed quite quickly too.

The only reason that the migrants aren't going through Hungary is that it is now easier to go through Slovenia. But, if Slovenia implemented the same measures Hungary did, migrants would just force their way through, irrespective of Hungary's measures. It is all a question of the opportunity costs for the migrants, and if more countries make Hungary-like fences, migrants will stop trying to avoid the fences and just push past the fences.
Live Long and Prosper

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thett3
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10/29/2015 6:29:18 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/29/2015 6:18:03 PM, bsh1 wrote:
At 10/29/2015 6:13:58 PM, thett3 wrote:
At 10/29/2015 6:11:54 PM, bsh1 wrote:
At 10/29/2015 6:08:38 PM, thett3 wrote:
At 10/29/2015 6:03:54 PM, bsh1 wrote:
At 10/29/2015 5:19:12 PM, thett3 wrote:
At 10/29/2015 4:47:03 PM, bsh1 wrote:
And, it mentions the city I live, and the licensing house never has a line.

No offense, but I'll take the word of the paper over yours--it's not that I think you're lying, but lines inside an inscure government building aren't something I would expect an American student to notice. It's not germane to the main point anyway: many Austrians are arming themselves for fear of what is coming

For fear of whats coming? You make the refugees sound like an impending Armageddon. The Austrians are totally overblowing it. They're voting for the FPO (nationalist, right-wingers, polling #1, formerly sanctioned by the EU for being anti-democratic) and being idiots about it, when all the refugees have so far been harmless.

The idiots are the ones giving away their country because they want to virtue signal. There's a famous rule in statistics called Cromwell's rule. It's named after a famous Cromwell quote: "I beseech you, in the bowels of Christ, think it possible that you may be mistaken."

Bsh, I beseech you, think it possible you may be mistaken. I know your ideology teaches you that we are all the same and that, deep down, nobody is or wants to be anything except a secular liberal, but that kind of universalism simply isn't true. Some mistakes you can only make once--handing Europe off is one of them.

Please tell me your joking. If not, let's debate it: "The EU, on balance, ought to accept refugees fleeing from violence in the Middle East and Africa."

Why would I joke? I'm not debating that topic: I'm okay with conditional acceptance of refugees actually fleeing violence. I'll debate anyone on the topic that Europe should severely curtail the number it's accepting and keep them from invading their borders like they are now

Short of shooting people down at the crossing and mass arrests with little due process, Europe could not secure its borders in the way you are suggesting.

Hungarys border wall seems to be successful. Send the coast guard out to turn away any boat that comes. If someone makes it through, send them back immediately until they do it the legal way. The alternative is giving away Europe to anyone who shows up

And, more than 70% of migrants are refugees or would likely qualify for asylum [http://www.theguardian.com...]. You cannot, ethically-speaking, turn all those people back.

Yes you can. If 70% of these young men fleeing safe lives in places other than Syria qualify for asylum, that's a problem with the system itself. Would you just have Europe open its borders to everybody who comes from a place with lower living standards than Europe? Is it wrong for Europe to make policies that benefit the people already there?
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: At 11/12/2016 11:49:40 PM, Raisor wrote:
: thett was right
thett3
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10/29/2015 6:29:52 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
Australia had a similar migrant crisis. They brought in the military to send the people back. Surprise surprise: the boats stopped coming
DDO Vice President

#StandwithBossy

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"Don't quote me, ever." -Max

"My name is max. I'm not a big fan of slacks"- Max rapping

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"Thett, you're really good at convincing people you're a decent person"-tulle

"You fit the character of Regina George quite nicely"- Sam

: At 11/12/2016 11:49:40 PM, Raisor wrote:
: thett was right
BlackFlags
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10/29/2015 6:33:07 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/29/2015 6:25:30 PM, bsh1 wrote:
The only reason that the migrants aren't going through Hungary is that it is now easier to go through Slovenia. But, if Slovenia implemented the same measures Hungary did, migrants would just force their way through, irrespective of Hungary's measures. It is all a question of the opportunity costs for the migrants, and if more countries make Hungary-like fences, migrants will stop trying to avoid the fences and just push past the fences.

Yeah, that is kind of the entire point of why Hungary built their fence and shoved their military down by the border. If Slovenia builds a fence too, then a lot of migrants will just get caught up in Croatia.

This isn't the US border either. Hungary has the military locking down their border pretty well. It isn't as easy as you make it sound to just push through.

You would need to be smuggled in, which you are not going to see a lot of, because these same migrants do not have any money to spend to get past the Hungarian checkpoints.
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10/29/2015 6:33:51 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/29/2015 6:29:18 PM, thett3 wrote:
At 10/29/2015 6:18:03 PM, bsh1 wrote:
At 10/29/2015 6:13:58 PM, thett3 wrote:
At 10/29/2015 6:11:54 PM, bsh1 wrote:
Please tell me your joking. If not, let's debate it: "The EU, on balance, ought to accept refugees fleeing from violence in the Middle East and Africa."

Why would I joke? I'm not debating that topic: I'm okay with conditional acceptance of refugees actually fleeing violence. I'll debate anyone on the topic that Europe should severely curtail the number it's accepting and keep them from invading their borders like they are now

Short of shooting people down at the crossing and mass arrests with little due process, Europe could not secure its borders in the way you are suggesting.

Hungarys border wall seems to be successful. Send the coast guard out to turn away any boat that comes. If someone makes it through, send them back immediately until they do it the legal way. The alternative is giving away Europe to anyone who shows up

See my response to Jif on this.

And, more than 70% of migrants are refugees or would likely qualify for asylum [http://www.theguardian.com...]. You cannot, ethically-speaking, turn all those people back.

Yes you can. If 70% of these young men fleeing safe lives in places other than Syria qualify for asylum, that's a problem with the system itself.

I seriously doubt you could say that qualify people fleeing violence in Darfur, Somalia, Eritrea, Afghanistan, and Syria, for asylum is a "flaw in the system." It's more like common sense. More than 70% of migrants come from one of these conflict zones.

Would you just have Europe open its borders to everybody who comes from a place with lower living standards than Europe? Is it wrong for Europe to make policies that benefit the people already there?

Obviously not. But would I have Europe open its doors to people from those nations? Absolutely. And, it is wrong for Europe to prioritize their self-interest so much that they would condemn people to live in Somalia- or Syria-like conditions.
Live Long and Prosper

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"Twilight isn't just about obtuse metaphors between cannibalism and premarital sex, it also teaches us the futility of hope." - Raisor

"[Bsh1] is the Guinan of DDO." - ButterCatX

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