Total Posts:12|Showing Posts:1-12
Jump to topic:

Cashless Society

Cerebral_Narcissist
Posts: 10,806
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/5/2010 5:52:21 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
We are increasingly moving towards a cashless society, wages are paid directly into bank accounts (minus the tax), debit cards, credit cards, chip and pin etc etc.

It's all rather more convenient that way, however it also grants Government and similar bodies more power over our financial lives. If ultimately all transactions are carried via a single chip installed in your hand (or similar) how secure are our financial and economic freedoms? If we are not free financially, can we be free politically?

Do we now have the right to demand our employers to pay us in cash, do we have the right to calculate our own tax? Should we be resisting the march of the cashless society?
I am voting for Innomen because of his intelligence, common sense, humility and the fact that Juggle appears to listen to him. Any other Presidential style would have a large sub-section of the site up in arms. If I was President I would destroy the site though elitism, others would let it run riot. Innomen represents a middle way that works, neither draconian nor anarchic and that is the only way things can work. Plus he does it all without ego trips.
Chrysippus
Posts: 2,173
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/5/2010 6:33:00 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/5/2010 5:52:21 AM, Cerebral_Narcissist wrote:
We are increasingly moving towards a cashless society, wages are paid directly into bank accounts (minus the tax), debit cards, credit cards, chip and pin etc etc.

It's all rather more convenient that way, however it also grants Government and similar bodies more power over our financial lives. If ultimately all transactions are carried via a single chip installed in your hand (or similar) how secure are our financial and economic freedoms? If we are not free financially, can we be free politically?

Do we now have the right to demand our employers to pay us in cash, do we have the right to calculate our own tax? Should we be resisting the march of the cashless society?

I'm rapidly joining the cashless society perforce, as my job ends on Friday. Blasted seasonal work...

Your labour is your own, and you can choose to withhold it from those who refuse to pay you in the way you deem acceptable. It's called a strike. That's a right only slaves don't have. If you doubt your ability in this area, you might just be a slave. Better check.

I find cash very convenient. It's accepted everywhere, unlike credit cards; it's anonymous, unlike credit cards; when I run out, no one charges me henious mounlty fees, unlike credit cards; and if it get stolen, I'm only out the amount stolen, unlike credit cards which can be run up thousands more than I can pay along with destroying my good name.

If we are not free financially, can we be free politically?

He who owns your wallet owns your life. See Feudalism, Communism, Theocracy.

Putting in my $.02 before Reasoning says "Rothbar."
Cavete mea inexorabilis legiones mimus!
wjmelements
Posts: 8,206
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/5/2010 8:22:02 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
I believe we are allowed to calculate our own taxes, yes. But who would want to?
in the blink of an eye you finally see the light
badger
Posts: 11,793
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/9/2010 9:33:34 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/9/2010 9:31:39 PM, badger wrote:
who's marching? and i can't see it happening in my lifetime.

i could i suppose.
signature
lovelife
Posts: 14,629
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/9/2010 10:08:33 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/5/2010 6:33:00 PM, Chrysippus wrote:
At 10/5/2010 5:52:21 AM, Cerebral_Narcissist wrote:
We are increasingly moving towards a cashless society, wages are paid directly into bank accounts (minus the tax), debit cards, credit cards, chip and pin etc etc.

It's all rather more convenient that way, however it also grants Government and similar bodies more power over our financial lives. If ultimately all transactions are carried via a single chip installed in your hand (or similar) how secure are our financial and economic freedoms? If we are not free financially, can we be free politically?

Do we now have the right to demand our employers to pay us in cash, do we have the right to calculate our own tax? Should we be resisting the march of the cashless society?

I'm rapidly joining the cashless society perforce, as my job ends on Friday. Blasted seasonal work...

I'm sorry to hear that.

Your labour is your own, and you can choose to withhold it from those who refuse to pay you in the way you deem acceptable. It's called a strike. That's a right only slaves don't have. If you doubt your ability in this area, you might just be a slave. Better check.

I think no union job allows strikes. I know my dad can't strike, because he's an engineer, and my mom can't because she's a teacher, and I don't think my stepdad can and he works customer service for AT&T

I find cash very convenient. It's accepted everywhere, unlike credit cards; it's anonymous, unlike credit cards; when I run out, no one charges me henious mounlty fees, unlike credit cards; and if it get stolen, I'm only out the amount stolen, unlike credit cards which can be run up thousands more than I can pay along with destroying my good name.

I always agreed with this.

If we are not free financially, can we be free politically?

Are we ever?

He who owns your wallet owns your life. See Feudalism, Communism, Theocracy.

he-he-he I gotta steal some wallets (j/k)

Putting in my $.02 before Reasoning says "Rothbar."
Without Royal there is a hole inside of me, I have no choice but to leave
losedotexe
Posts: 15
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/26/2010 1:28:40 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
It's too easy to violate human rights (in this case, the right to privacy) without cash. for example,

Not everyone WANTS there to be a paper trail of what they buy. This does not mean it's necessarily illegal, but perhaps it's something personal? Like Depends, controversial books of the region (example being, Atheist books by Richard Dawkins in the South, Books about communism, The Anarchists' cookbook), and etc.

Also, how would individuals exchange money between themselves? For example, a teenage youth may earn money by house sitting, or walking dogs, or car washes. How would exchanges occur? Cash makes it simple.

As far as forcing our employees to pay in cash ; I don't think it's logical to do so. It provides WAY too much liability towards the company. However, you SHOULD be able to cash a check at a local establishment, such as a bank.

Taxes are tricky. It's an entirely separate issue than the ones at hand, I believe. I'd gladly discuss them in a separate topic :)

Summary :
Cash = Good
Cash reduces the risk of human rights violations
Cash allows for anonymity of purchases
Cash allows for ease of non-business cash exchanges
Companies shouldn't pay with cash ; as it provides too much liability.
jharry
Posts: 4,984
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/26/2010 8:24:08 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/5/2010 8:22:02 PM, wjmelements wrote:
I believe we are allowed to calculate our own taxes, yes. But who would want to?

Actually I do that myself. If you fill out the W-2 correctly by what questions it asks then only the amount you will be held out. On a regular pay check the Feds hold 0.00. I don't get anything back at the end of the year but I get my money now and I get to earn the interest on my money instead of the government. I dump it into retirement.

If my check is bigger then normal they hold it out, bonuses too.
In nomine Patris, et Filii, et Spiritus Sancti. Amen
Ren
Posts: 7,102
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/26/2010 8:52:43 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/5/2010 5:52:21 AM, Cerebral_Narcissist wrote:
We are increasingly moving towards a cashless society, wages are paid directly into bank accounts (minus the tax), debit cards, credit cards, chip and pin etc etc.

It's all rather more convenient that way, however it also grants Government and similar bodies more power over our financial lives.

This isn't really true. It doesn't really affect much of anything, given that we've always had a credit-based system; we just don't need anything material when we liquidate. It all translates as the same thing, as the government determines how much their tender is worth, as well as how and what quantity of that tender should be allocated.

If you mean that it hinders you from opening a bank account in your mattress, then I'd question how you pay your bills, make large purchases, and invest.

If ultimately all transactions are carried via a single chip installed in your hand (or similar) how secure are our financial and economic freedoms? If we are not free financially, can we be free politically?

About as secure as your bank, just as it is now.

Do we now have the right to demand our employers to pay us in cash, do we have the right to calculate our own tax? Should we be resisting the march of the cashless society?

We never had that right. Employers reserve the right to render payment in the method of their choice.

Resistance to a cashless society is like resistance to an information-based society.

I mean, you can try...
Ren
Posts: 7,102
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
10/26/2010 9:04:28 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
Oh, and also:

Credit and checks are far more secure than cash. Someone steals your cash, that's it--it's gone. If someone steals your credit card, you can get that money back, and you may even be able to catch the thief.

To buy things with both checks and credit cards, you need identification. This is why the merchant is responsible for fraudulent purchases. It's because with something that requires authorization like a check or credit purchase, mistakes should be easily avoided.

This is all not to mention that there are no space constraints, both in transport and regarding remote purchasing, and accounting is rendered a million times easier.

For those that spend their money on legitimate purchases without worrying whether they will be accused of some sort of subversion, that is actually a benefit. For purchases with which you would prefer discretion, usually the merchant accommodates. Many send fake labels to institutions so that payment reports display something irrelevant.

This is not to say that I think we will ever come to a point where paper money is 100% obsolete, as there will surely always be establishments that do not wish to invest in any alternative forms of payment.