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Anti-Gay Protesters at Funerals

studentathletechristian8
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10/7/2010 5:09:26 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
I know this happens relatively frequently, but another one of these rallies occurred. This time, it was a soldier who died fighting for our country. Although he was not gay (which doesn't matter in the first place), a group of anti-gay, anti-military, anti-intelligent Christians shows up at his funeral and completely humiliates the family members and memory of the brave man.

This sh!t is just pissing me off at this point. It feels like we've traveled back in time, and we can't propel into the future. By the way, the family is filing a complaint for an invasion of privacy, and it may be reviewed by the Supreme Court.

Here is a little rap / rant about this travesty.

Why don't you get something else to do,
Instead of pissing us off and leaving residue,
Of a label that endorses hatred and bigotry,
Seems like you couldn't even pass high school trigonometry.
You find joy in protesting at the funeral,
Of a man who defended you and paid with his burial?
What kind of nerve do you have to hate gay people,
When you're as uptight and unimportant as a steeple?
Yeah, that's a reference to your church, which you probably didn't know,
You're too busy using your stupidity to waste our time, and, so,
I think you should f*ck off and read your Bible,
And you'd realize that the sh!t you pull is unreliable.
In fact, this world may be better without all of your notions,
‘Cuz all you do is advocate dissension and backwards motions.
I'd reiterate what I mean to argue, but it would end up with a loss of understanding,
Oh, wait, you've lost so much of it, why should this task be demanding?
It's simple: develop logical conclusions of society's problems, and use your rights,
Without coming off as stupid, irrational, close-minded; or we'll really start a fight.
I'm sick of the crap you pull, you can tell that to others who feel the same,
You think I'm scared of you? F*ck it, I only see your actions and lives as lame.
Truthfully, you all are responsible for society's dilemmas, you're to blame,
What's insane is the fact that God gave you a mind that no one here wants to claim.
Reasoning
Posts: 4,456
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10/7/2010 5:14:50 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/7/2010 5:09:26 PM, studentathletechristian8 wrote:
Of a man who defended you and paid with his burial?

He did no such thing.
"What we really ought to ask the liberal, before we even begin addressing his agenda, is this: In what kind of society would he be a conservative?" - Joseph Sobran
studentathletechristian8
Posts: 5,810
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10/7/2010 5:17:00 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/7/2010 5:14:50 PM, Reasoning wrote:
At 10/7/2010 5:09:26 PM, studentathletechristian8 wrote:
Of a man who defended you and paid with his burial?

He did no such thing.

I am personally not a huge fan of the military.

However, I respect those who serve our country and die fighting to protect us.
PARADIGM_L0ST
Posts: 6,958
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10/7/2010 5:20:14 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/7/2010 5:09:26 PM, studentathletechristian8 wrote:
I know this happens relatively frequently, but another one of these rallies occurred. This time, it was a soldier who died fighting for our country. Although he was not gay (which doesn't matter in the first place), a group of anti-gay, anti-military, anti-intelligent Christians shows up at his funeral and completely humiliates the family members and memory of the brave man.:

Let me guess... Westboro Baptists? Sadly, I can't say that I'm surprised. Even more sadly, noting is getting through the years of indoctrination they sustained.

I wouldn't p!ss on them if they were on fire.
"Have you ever considered suicide? If not, please do." -- Mouthwash (to Inferno)
J.Kenyon
Posts: 4,194
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10/7/2010 5:32:29 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/7/2010 5:20:14 PM, PARADIGM_L0ST wrote:
At 10/7/2010 5:09:26 PM, studentathletechristian8 wrote:
I know this happens relatively frequently, but another one of these rallies occurred. This time, it was a soldier who died fighting for our country. Although he was not gay (which doesn't matter in the first place), a group of anti-gay, anti-military, anti-intelligent Christians shows up at his funeral and completely humiliates the family members and memory of the brave man.:

Let me guess... Westboro Baptists? Sadly, I can't say that I'm surprised. Even more sadly, noting is getting through the years of indoctrination they sustained.

I wouldn't p!ss on them if they were on fire.

Peeing on them would likely help put the fire out. Use kerosene instead.
Korashk
Posts: 4,597
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10/7/2010 5:33:42 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/7/2010 5:20:14 PM, PARADIGM_L0ST wrote:
At 10/7/2010 5:09:26 PM, studentathletechristian8 wrote:
I know this happens relatively frequently, but another one of these rallies occurred. This time, it was a soldier who died fighting for our country. Although he was not gay (which doesn't matter in the first place), a group of anti-gay, anti-military, anti-intelligent Christians shows up at his funeral and completely humiliates the family members and memory of the brave man.:

Let me guess... Westboro Baptists? Sadly, I can't say that I'm surprised. Even more sadly, noting is getting through the years of indoctrination they sustained.

I wouldn't p!ss on them if they were on fire.

Don't worry, they'll eventually die out. Most of the church is directly related to one another.
When large numbers of otherwise-law abiding people break specific laws en masse, it's usually a fault that lies with the law. - Unknown
Reasoning
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10/7/2010 5:51:55 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/7/2010 5:17:00 PM, studentathletechristian8 wrote:
However, I respect those who serve our country and die fighting to protect us.

"In practical terms, dying for one's country really means dying for one's government–and there's nothing noble in that. To paraphrase Paddy Chayefsky, we perpetuate war by believing there is something noble in it." - Sheldon Richman

Furthermore, murder oversees doesn't protect me.
"What we really ought to ask the liberal, before we even begin addressing his agenda, is this: In what kind of society would he be a conservative?" - Joseph Sobran
Freeman
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10/7/2010 7:22:39 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/7/2010 5:20:14 PM, PARADIGM_L0ST wrote:
At 10/7/2010 5:09:26 PM, studentathletechristian8 wrote:
I know this happens relatively frequently, but another one of these rallies occurred. This time, it was a soldier who died fighting for our country. Although he was not gay (which doesn't matter in the first place), a group of anti-gay, anti-military, anti-intelligent Christians shows up at his funeral and completely humiliates the family members and memory of the brave man.:

Let me guess... Westboro Baptists? Sadly, I can't say that I'm surprised. Even more sadly, noting is getting through the years of indoctrination they sustained.

I wouldn't p!ss on them if they were on fire.

How can you possibly be mad at them?

They are just broken machines (I'm referring to the architecture of their brains), with bad parents, that happen to be running some rather pernicious software in their heads. If you had been raised by them, then you would probably be with them holding one of their signs.
Chancellor of Propaganda and Foreign Relations in the Franklin administration.

"I intend to live forever. So far, so good." -- Steven Wright
belle
Posts: 4,113
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10/7/2010 7:25:13 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/7/2010 7:22:39 PM, Freeman wrote:
At 10/7/2010 5:20:14 PM, PARADIGM_L0ST wrote:
At 10/7/2010 5:09:26 PM, studentathletechristian8 wrote:
I know this happens relatively frequently, but another one of these rallies occurred. This time, it was a soldier who died fighting for our country. Although he was not gay (which doesn't matter in the first place), a group of anti-gay, anti-military, anti-intelligent Christians shows up at his funeral and completely humiliates the family members and memory of the brave man.:

Let me guess... Westboro Baptists? Sadly, I can't say that I'm surprised. Even more sadly, noting is getting through the years of indoctrination they sustained.

I wouldn't p!ss on them if they were on fire.

How can you possibly be mad at them?

They are just broken machines (I'm referring to the architecture of their brains), with bad parents, that happen to be running some rather pernicious software in their heads. If you had been raised by them, then you would probably be with them holding one of their signs.

can't tell if you're being serious or not. never a good sign....
evidently i only come to ddo to avoid doing homework...
Freeman
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10/7/2010 7:28:21 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/7/2010 7:25:13 PM, belle wrote:
At 10/7/2010 7:22:39 PM, Freeman wrote:
At 10/7/2010 5:20:14 PM, PARADIGM_L0ST wrote:
At 10/7/2010 5:09:26 PM, studentathletechristian8 wrote:
I know this happens relatively frequently, but another one of these rallies occurred. This time, it was a soldier who died fighting for our country. Although he was not gay (which doesn't matter in the first place), a group of anti-gay, anti-military, anti-intelligent Christians shows up at his funeral and completely humiliates the family members and memory of the brave man.:

Let me guess... Westboro Baptists? Sadly, I can't say that I'm surprised. Even more sadly, noting is getting through the years of indoctrination they sustained.

I wouldn't p!ss on them if they were on fire.

How can you possibly be mad at them?

They are just broken machines (I'm referring to the architecture of their brains), with bad parents, that happen to be running some rather pernicious software in their heads. If you had been raised by them, then you would probably be with them holding one of their signs.

can't tell if you're being serious or not. never a good sign....

I am. Perhaps the metaphors were too vague. I am not suggesting that their brains are literally running computer software; it's just an analogy.
Chancellor of Propaganda and Foreign Relations in the Franklin administration.

"I intend to live forever. So far, so good." -- Steven Wright
studentathletechristian8
Posts: 5,810
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10/7/2010 7:30:56 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/7/2010 7:28:21 PM, Freeman wrote:
At 10/7/2010 7:25:13 PM, belle wrote:
At 10/7/2010 7:22:39 PM, Freeman wrote:
At 10/7/2010 5:20:14 PM, PARADIGM_L0ST wrote:
At 10/7/2010 5:09:26 PM, studentathletechristian8 wrote:
I know this happens relatively frequently, but another one of these rallies occurred. This time, it was a soldier who died fighting for our country. Although he was not gay (which doesn't matter in the first place), a group of anti-gay, anti-military, anti-intelligent Christians shows up at his funeral and completely humiliates the family members and memory of the brave man.:

Let me guess... Westboro Baptists? Sadly, I can't say that I'm surprised. Even more sadly, noting is getting through the years of indoctrination they sustained.

I wouldn't p!ss on them if they were on fire.

How can you possibly be mad at them?

They are just broken machines (I'm referring to the architecture of their brains), with bad parents, that happen to be running some rather pernicious software in their heads. If you had been raised by them, then you would probably be with them holding one of their signs.

can't tell if you're being serious or not. never a good sign....

I am. Perhaps the metaphors were too vague. I am not suggesting that their brains are literally running computer software; it's just an analogy.

I disagree with your sentiments.

I understand what you mean, by I believe the protesters themselves to be largely at fault; not just the way they were raised and the like.

In the end, we have our own choice whether or not to act on certain viewpoints and beliefs. They choose to remain ignorant, and they choose to embarrass themselves in the attempts of humiliating a dead man's funeral.

These people are pathetic. It seems that they have nothing better to do than harass.
J.Kenyon
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10/7/2010 7:41:52 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/7/2010 7:22:39 PM, Freeman wrote:
How can you possibly be mad at them?

They are just broken machines (I'm referring to the architecture of their brains), with bad parents, that happen to be running some rather pernicious software in their heads. If you had been raised by them, then you would probably be with them holding one of their signs.

Probably because his brain is running that sort of software that makes him inclined to dislike idiots.
belle
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10/7/2010 7:50:52 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/7/2010 7:28:21 PM, Freeman wrote:
I am. Perhaps the metaphors were too vague. I am not suggesting that their brains are literally running computer software; it's just an analogy.

its not your metaphors that bother me, its your perspective. i actually agree that they are technically automatons. what i disagree with is your ridiculous simplification of the causality of their actions. "bad parenting" doesn't make someone a hateful bigot. the causes are much more complex and probably as much internal to the individual than they are imposed from outside. given what we actually know about the causality of personality on such a basic physical or even psychological level, it makes absolutely no sense to attempt to analyze behavior on that level. applying an intentional assessment to their behavior (which includes them being responsible for choices) actually allows us to make better predictions about what they will do, and make more sense of what they do do. so even if we know its inaccurate in the sense that their apparent control over their actions is illusionary, the normal kinds of evaluations people in this thread are doing capture a fuller understanding of the behavior of these people. "getting angry" is a way of evaluating their actions as desirable or not in the context of certain goals. its a useful shortcut.
evidently i only come to ddo to avoid doing homework...
studentathletechristian8
Posts: 5,810
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10/7/2010 8:00:13 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/7/2010 7:50:52 PM, belle wrote:
At 10/7/2010 7:28:21 PM, Freeman wrote:
I am. Perhaps the metaphors were too vague. I am not suggesting that their brains are literally running computer software; it's just an analogy.

its not your metaphors that bother me, its your perspective. i actually agree that they are technically automatons. what i disagree with is your ridiculous simplification of the causality of their actions. "bad parenting" doesn't make someone a hateful bigot. the causes are much more complex and probably as much internal to the individual than they are imposed from outside. given what we actually know about the causality of personality on such a basic physical or even psychological level, it makes absolutely no sense to attempt to analyze behavior on that level. applying an intentional assessment to their behavior (which includes them being responsible for choices) actually allows us to make better predictions about what they will do, and make more sense of what they do do. so even if we know its inaccurate in the sense that their apparent control over their actions is illusionary, the normal kinds of evaluations people in this thread are doing capture a fuller understanding of the behavior of these people. "getting angry" is a way of evaluating their actions as desirable or not in the context of certain goals. its a useful shortcut.

Agreed.
jharry
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10/7/2010 8:14:35 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/7/2010 5:09:26 PM, studentathletechristian8 wrote:
I know this happens relatively frequently, but another one of these rallies occurred. This time, it was a soldier who died fighting for our country. Although he was not gay (which doesn't matter in the first place), a group of anti-gay, anti-military, anti-intelligent Christians shows up at his funeral and completely humiliates the family members and memory of the brave man.

This sh!t is just pissing me off at this point. It feels like we've traveled back in time, and we can't propel into the future. By the way, the family is filing a complaint for an invasion of privacy, and it may be reviewed by the Supreme Court.

I have to admit, there are some strange folks. As far as I can tell only 71 people are going to Heaven by there standards.

But I picked up on something else too. They seem to have a very specific dislike for Catholics, the Pope especially. The odd thing is I have seen the same language towards the Pope echoed here by many people, reckon the computer program runs in the same operating system in more then just Westboro Baptist?
In nomine Patris, et Filii, et Spiritus Sancti. Amen
lovelife
Posts: 14,629
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10/7/2010 9:42:37 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/7/2010 5:51:55 PM, Reasoning wrote:
At 10/7/2010 5:17:00 PM, studentathletechristian8 wrote:
However, I respect those who serve our country and die fighting to protect us.

"In practical terms, dying for one's country really means dying for one's government–and there's nothing noble in that. To paraphrase Paddy Chayefsky, we perpetuate war by believing there is something noble in it." - Sheldon Richman

Furthermore, murder oversees doesn't protect me.

I agree with that. I don't think that sexuality, or if they murdered people overseas etc should be cause for protection from such things. I however do believe everyone is entitled to such protection. I don't believe in giving extra rights/protection to people because they murder others, nor for their race, gender, national orgin, sexuality, or religion.
Without Royal there is a hole inside of me, I have no choice but to leave
annhasle
Posts: 6,657
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10/7/2010 11:11:09 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/7/2010 5:09:26 PM, studentathletechristian8 wrote:
I know this happens relatively frequently, but another one of these rallies occurred. This time, it was a soldier who died fighting for our country. Although he was not gay (which doesn't matter in the first place), a group of anti-gay, anti-military, anti-intelligent Christians shows up at his funeral and completely humiliates the family members and memory of the brave man.

This sh!t is just pissing me off at this point. It feels like we've traveled back in time, and we can't propel into the future. By the way, the family is filing a complaint for an invasion of privacy, and it may be reviewed by the Supreme Court.

It was presented in a trial yesterday in front of the Supreme Court and apparently the daughter of the 'minister' represented the church. Of course, she said some really ugly things in court and definitely outside of court, but some say she out-argued the Prosecution. <shrugs> The Supreme Court had already issued it's verdict... I don't know what it is though. Sorry! >_<
I'm not back. This idiot just upset me which made me stop lurking.
Freeman
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10/8/2010 7:39:57 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/7/2010 7:50:52 PM, belle wrote:
At 10/7/2010 7:28:21 PM, Freeman wrote:
I am. Perhaps the metaphors were too vague. I am not suggesting that their brains are literally running computer software; it's just an analogy.

its not your metaphors that bother me, its your perspective. i actually agree that they are technically automatons. what i disagree with is your ridiculous simplification of the causality of their actions. "bad parenting" doesn't make someone a hateful bigot.

Hmm... that's a strange view. I bet if you were raised by them, there would be about a 75 - 90% chance you would hold their views. You're not as free as you might think you are. And to be fair, I listed three different factors, not just parenting.

the causes are much more complex and probably as much internal to the individual than they are imposed from outside.

Are you suggesting that our thoughts and intentions are self-generated from within our brains and have nothing to do with causal relationships in the external world?

given what we actually know about the causality of personality on such a basic physical or even psychological level, it makes absolutely no sense to attempt to analyze behavior on that level. applying an intentional assessment to their behavior (which includes them being responsible for choices) actually allows us to make better predictions about what they will do, and make more sense of what they do do.

I am convinced of two basic propositions:

1. The beliefs we generate about the world are (mainly) not consciously chosen. I did not, for instance, "choose" to be an atheist. If you deny this, then please attempt to convince yourself that you are sitting in a log cabin on top of Mt. Everest at the present moment.

2. Our beliefs about the world directly affect our behavior.

I suppose it's possible for one to engage in behavior that is uncoupled from one's beliefs; and in this sense, we might say that they are partially responsible for aspects of their behavior.
Chancellor of Propaganda and Foreign Relations in the Franklin administration.

"I intend to live forever. So far, so good." -- Steven Wright
belle
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10/8/2010 8:35:11 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/8/2010 7:39:57 PM, Freeman wrote:
Hmm... that's a strange view. I bet if you were raised by them, there would be about a 75 - 90% chance you would hold their views. You're not as free as you might think you are. And to be fair, I listed three different factors, not just parenting.

let me rephrase then. bad parenting ALONE doesn't make someone a hateful bigot. theres also genetic predispositions to be certain ways, for example, more easily angered, that make it easier for some people to pick up certain messages.

Are you suggesting that our thoughts and intentions are self-generated from within our brains and have nothing to do with causal relationships in the external world?

absolutely not. i was trying to imply that we are not blank slates at birth but have preferences and predispositions that effect how we react with the messages we are exposed to. otherwise you would expect all siblings to be nearly identical when its obvious they're very different from each other.

I am convinced of two basic propositions:

1. The beliefs we generate about the world are (mainly) not consciously chosen. I did not, for instance, "choose" to be an atheist. If you deny this, then please attempt to convince yourself that you are sitting in a log cabin on top of Mt. Everest at the present moment.

2. Our beliefs about the world directly affect our behavior.

I suppose it's possible for one to engage in behavior that is uncoupled from one's beliefs; and in this sense, we might say that they are partially responsible for aspects of their behavior.

i feel like you didn't even read what i wrote. lol. i'm not saying that we ultimately ARE responsible for out behavior at all. i'm just saying that when we analyze our own and others behavior AS IF we were, we are able to make accurate predictions about what we ourselves and what others will do. so even though we know that the intentional model is not strictly accurate, and we can keep that in mind when we use it, we also know that it gives us pretty darn good approximations and predictions regarding behavior. we have no comparable model that explains how personality develops from physical and social influences. its not JUST bad parenting, just like its not JUST bad genes, or JUST bad nutrition or JUST a bad environment. its all these factors and more, and all of them effect one another. it seems like you are trying to say more than you actually know by attributing their behavior to one or two factors that clearly are not conclusive in themselves.
evidently i only come to ddo to avoid doing homework...
Kleptin
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10/8/2010 8:58:23 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/8/2010 7:39:57 PM, Freeman wrote:
1. The beliefs we generate about the world are (mainly) not consciously chosen. I did not, for instance, "choose" to be an atheist. If you deny this, then please attempt to convince yourself that you are sitting in a log cabin on top of Mt. Everest at the present moment.

THANK YOU. This is the first time I've seen someone else say this.
: At 5/2/2010 2:43:54 PM, innomen wrote:
It isn't about finding a theory, philosophy or doctrine and thinking it's the answer, but a practical application of one's experiences that is the answer.

: At 10/28/2010 2:40:07 PM, jharry wrote: I have already been given the greatest Gift that anyone could ever hope for [Life], I would consider myself selfish if I expected anything more.
Freeman
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10/8/2010 9:34:03 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/8/2010 8:35:11 PM, belle wrote:
At 10/8/2010 7:39:57 PM, Freeman wrote:
Hmm... that's a strange view. I bet if you were raised by them, there would be about a 75 - 90% chance you would hold their views. You're not as free as you might think you are. And to be fair, I listed three different factors, not just parenting.

let me rephrase then. bad parenting ALONE doesn't make someone a hateful bigot. theres also genetic predispositions to be certain ways, for example, more easily angered, that make it easier for some people to pick up certain messages.

Exactly, I completely agree.

Are you suggesting that our thoughts and intentions are self-generated from within our brains and have nothing to do with causal relationships in the external world?

absolutely not. i was trying to imply that we are not blank slates at birth but have preferences and predispositions that effect how we react with the messages we are exposed to. otherwise you would expect all siblings to be nearly identical when its obvious they're very different from each other.

Once again, I agree.

I am convinced of two basic propositions:

1. The beliefs we generate about the world are (mainly) not consciously chosen. I did not, for instance, "choose" to be an atheist. If you deny this, then please attempt to convince yourself that you are sitting in a log cabin on top of Mt. Everest at the present moment.

2. Our beliefs about the world directly affect our behavior.

I suppose it's possible for one to engage in behavior that is uncoupled from one's beliefs; and in this sense, we might say that they are partially responsible for aspects of their behavior.

i feel like you didn't even read what i wrote. lol. i'm not saying that we ultimately ARE responsible for out behavior at all. i'm just saying that when we analyze our own and others behavior AS IF we were, we are able to make accurate predictions about what we ourselves and what others will do. so even though we know that the intentional model is not strictly accurate, and we can keep that in mind when we use it, we also know that it gives us pretty darn good approximations and predictions regarding behavior. we have no comparable model that explains how personality develops from physical and social influences. its not JUST bad parenting, just like its not JUST bad genes, or JUST bad nutrition or JUST a bad environment. its all these factors and more, and all of them effect one another. it seems like you are trying to say more than you actually know by attributing their behavior to one or two factors that clearly are not conclusive in themselves.

Do you have a particular study in mind?

I agree with much of what you said. At no point have I suggested that I think that certain behaviors are only the product of one or two different phenomena.
Chancellor of Propaganda and Foreign Relations in the Franklin administration.

"I intend to live forever. So far, so good." -- Steven Wright
TheSkeptic
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10/8/2010 10:58:25 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/8/2010 8:58:23 PM, Kleptin wrote:
At 10/8/2010 7:39:57 PM, Freeman wrote:
1. The beliefs we generate about the world are (mainly) not consciously chosen. I did not, for instance, "choose" to be an atheist. If you deny this, then please attempt to convince yourself that you are sitting in a log cabin on top of Mt. Everest at the present moment.

THANK YOU. This is the first time I've seen someone else say this.

Point is, even if it's true... doesn't mean we can't hate someone for it.
Loserboi
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10/8/2010 11:38:43 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/7/2010 5:09:26 PM, studentathletechristian8 wrote:

Seems like you couldn't even pass high school trigonometry.

HEY HEY HEY i couldnt pass it either...
lovelife
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10/9/2010 8:44:53 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/8/2010 11:38:43 PM, Loserboi wrote:
At 10/7/2010 5:09:26 PM, studentathletechristian8 wrote:

Seems like you couldn't even pass high school trigonometry.

HEY HEY HEY i couldnt pass it either...

And I know it prolly proves nothing but I will most likely fail.
Without Royal there is a hole inside of me, I have no choice but to leave
belle
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10/9/2010 7:06:26 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/8/2010 9:34:03 PM, Freeman wrote:
Do you have a particular study in mind?

no, its a general impression i get from my understanding of the current state of neuroscience and psychology.

I agree with much of what you said. At no point have I suggested that I think that certain behaviors are only the product of one or two different phenomena.

ok then. thats what it sounded like to me. must have been a misunderstanding.
evidently i only come to ddo to avoid doing homework...
jharry
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10/9/2010 7:08:54 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/8/2010 7:39:57 PM, Freeman wrote:


I am convinced of two basic propositions:

1. The beliefs we generate about the world are (mainly) not consciously chosen. I did not, for instance, "choose" to be an atheist. If you deny this, then please attempt to convince yourself that you are sitting in a log cabin on top of Mt. Everest at the present moment.

2. Our beliefs about the world directly affect our behavior.

I suppose it's possible for one to engage in behavior that is uncoupled from one's beliefs; and in this sense, we might say that they are partially responsible for aspects of their behavior.

I fully agree with number two.

But I don't fully understand #1.

Would that mean that I didn't actively chose to leave my fathers path and strike out to find a better way?
In nomine Patris, et Filii, et Spiritus Sancti. Amen
lovelife
Posts: 14,629
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10/9/2010 7:49:45 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/9/2010 7:08:54 PM, jharry wrote:
At 10/8/2010 7:39:57 PM, Freeman wrote:


I am convinced of two basic propositions:

1. The beliefs we generate about the world are (mainly) not consciously chosen. I did not, for instance, "choose" to be an atheist. If you deny this, then please attempt to convince yourself that you are sitting in a log cabin on top of Mt. Everest at the present moment.

2. Our beliefs about the world directly affect our behavior.

I suppose it's possible for one to engage in behavior that is uncoupled from one's beliefs; and in this sense, we might say that they are partially responsible for aspects of their behavior.

I fully agree with number two.

But I don't fully understand #1.

Would that mean that I didn't actively chose to leave my fathers path and strike out to find a better way?

You may have decided to find a better way but you don't really choose what you believe deep down, its all about how you were raised, your personality, and information you have gathered.
Without Royal there is a hole inside of me, I have no choice but to leave
jharry
Posts: 4,984
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10/9/2010 7:54:09 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 10/9/2010 7:49:45 PM, lovelife wrote:
At 10/9/2010 7:08:54 PM, jharry wrote:
At 10/8/2010 7:39:57 PM, Freeman wrote:


I am convinced of two basic propositions:

1. The beliefs we generate about the world are (mainly) not consciously chosen. I did not, for instance, "choose" to be an atheist. If you deny this, then please attempt to convince yourself that you are sitting in a log cabin on top of Mt. Everest at the present moment.

2. Our beliefs about the world directly affect our behavior.

I suppose it's possible for one to engage in behavior that is uncoupled from one's beliefs; and in this sense, we might say that they are partially responsible for aspects of their behavior.

I fully agree with number two.

But I don't fully understand #1.

Would that mean that I didn't actively chose to leave my fathers path and strike out to find a better way?

You may have decided to find a better way but you don't really choose what you believe deep down, its all about how you were raised, your personality, and information you have gathered.

Maybe. But that seems to contradict my life. And my raising is VERY different from how I am raising mine. My personality is very different from where I was to where I am.

I do see the information I have gathered. But that is about it.
In nomine Patris, et Filii, et Spiritus Sancti. Amen