Total Posts:33|Showing Posts:1-30|Last Page
Jump to topic:

What bothers you the most........

slo1
Posts: 4,318
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
12/11/2015 3:47:13 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
My to items that absolutely frustrate me.

1. The oversimplification of issues which is more intended to give a sound bite to rally those ideologically similar rather than intent to understand and address the issues.

2. Lack of critical thinking. IE: I was just reading Ted Cruz's speech at Liberty University where he made a comment pertaining to an economic possibility that every college graduate should get 5 or so job offers. We all know if that was the norm it would only because there was a labor pool shortage and we would all be dealing with inflation problems, decaying the value of our money.
TBR
Posts: 9,991
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
12/11/2015 4:08:13 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/11/2015 3:47:13 PM, slo1 wrote:
My to items that absolutely frustrate me.

1. The oversimplification of issues which is more intended to give a sound bite to rally those ideologically similar rather than intent to understand and address the issues.



2. Lack of critical thinking. IE: I was just reading Ted Cruz's speech at Liberty University where he made a comment pertaining to an economic possibility that every college graduate should get 5 or so job offers. We all know if that was the norm it would only because there was a labor pool shortage and we would all be dealing with inflation problems, decaying the value of our money.

I agree, but will say politicians - the political message - has always been overly simplistic. A chicken in every pot etc. The message is designed for the lowest common denominator. Now, politicians BELIEVING that policy is this simple is a huge problem. I think Trump does think its this easy. That it's all just a sales job, no actual practical policy necessary.

If I were to find what bothers me, it would be the Rushes etc. What they have done to the general tone of politics is different. They are the ones truly responsible for the "us / them" divide. Even during the turmoil of the 60's this divide existed, but was not encouraged as blatantly as it is now.
GrittyWorm
Posts: 1,566
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
12/11/2015 4:40:28 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
Lies, deception, govenment being bought off, hypocrisy, ideological lines drawn in the sand with no sense of ever being moderate. God forbid a Conservative or Liberal ever meet in the middle. There is no middle ground. This drives self thinking moderates bonkers. I can voice an opinion and ALL Liberals(seemingly) are always against everything "NonLiberal" and the same with Conservatives. Liberals can't imagine one could ever need a gun. Never. Which is madness. Conservatives can't imagine that abortion may sometimes be ethical or okay morally. Never. This is extremism. Liberalism and Conservatism think black and white. Reality is not black and white. I challenged Bush AND Obama. They wete BOTH very deceptive about things. To blindly support everything a leader says simply because he is Liberal or Conservative is madness and could be labeled "lemming theology".
jharry
Posts: 4,984
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
12/11/2015 8:16:01 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
That the average American citizen has become weak, uninformed and spoiled rotten.

The politicians are just capitalizing, can't say that I blame them.
In nomine Patris, et Filii, et Spiritus Sancti. Amen
Greyparrot
Posts: 14,247
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
12/11/2015 8:19:39 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
That the average politician has convinced the average voter that he is too stupid to make decisions, and that only a politician is properly qualified to do that.
BlackFlags
Posts: 904
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
12/11/2015 8:39:30 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/11/2015 8:16:01 PM, jharry wrote:
That the average American citizen has become weak, uninformed and spoiled rotten.

The politicians are just capitalizing, can't say that I blame them.

Agreed.
BlackFlags
Posts: 904
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
12/11/2015 8:41:13 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
What bothers me most is how government has become so ingrained into our daily lives, that people literally have convinced themselves that the world cannot survive with an inactive government.
jharry
Posts: 4,984
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
12/11/2015 8:49:04 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/11/2015 8:41:13 PM, BlackFlags wrote:
What bothers me most is how government has become so ingrained into our daily lives, that people literally have convinced themselves that the world cannot survive with an inactive government.

This

Every side trys to get the government to back their ideals or beliefs. And all the while we are losing our liberty........

This goes for the liberal and the conservative. The bible thumper and the atheist. The pro life and pro choice. Same sex marriage and traditional.

The government shouldn't this entrenched in our lives. They shouldn't be loaning our money to anyone. They shouldn't have any say in who I marry or what I decide to put in my body.

But the American people have become a shell of what they once were.
In nomine Patris, et Filii, et Spiritus Sancti. Amen
BlackFlags
Posts: 904
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
12/11/2015 8:59:47 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/11/2015 8:49:04 PM, jharry wrote:
But the American people have become a shell of what they once were.

You are preaching to the choir here. Is there no actual faith in people anymore? Maybe it is a stretch to say that people can coexist and live peacefully without the state, but the least we can ask for is to resolve our own conflicts as individuals, and advance society through human error, as opposed to government policy.

I resent the majority of the American people. The majority of the American people, whether the majority constitutes conservatives or liberals, are complete idiots who are incapable of governing themselves, much less others.

On the other hand, I do believe in the potential of the American people. I believe every man has what it takes to live empowered and independent from the state. We are not embracing strength though, and are instead subscribing to ideals of dependency and weakness, such as class-based entitlements and social obligation.

The enlightenment thinkers that influenced the American revolution would find our modern day society to be disgraceful. Do people lack all backbone, or are they really incapable of surving without their precious welfare and police force?
jharry
Posts: 4,984
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
12/11/2015 9:30:22 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/11/2015 8:59:47 PM, BlackFlags wrote:
At 12/11/2015 8:49:04 PM, jharry wrote:
But the American people have become a shell of what they once were.

You are preaching to the choir here. Is there no actual faith in people anymore? Maybe it is a stretch to say that people can coexist and live peacefully without the state, but the least we can ask for is to resolve our own conflicts as individuals, and advance society through human error, as opposed to government policy.

I resent the majority of the American people. The majority of the American people, whether the majority constitutes conservatives or liberals, are complete idiots who are incapable of governing themselves, much less others.

On the other hand, I do believe in the potential of the American people. I believe every man has what it takes to live empowered and independent from the state. We are not embracing strength though, and are instead subscribing to ideals of dependency and weakness, such as class-based entitlements and social obligation.

The enlightenment thinkers that influenced the American revolution would find our modern day society to be disgraceful. Do people lack all backbone, or are they really incapable of surving without their precious welfare and police force?

I wish I had as much faith in the American people. I would go full Ancap but I just don't seeing it working. It could be possible except for the fact the average citizen can't.

It's going to take a massive decline in the American population with the inability to depend on the government to get anywhereclose to the people being ready for that.

But as every day goes by I feel like we need to thin the herd.....sad buy true.
In nomine Patris, et Filii, et Spiritus Sancti. Amen
Toad-Uoff
Posts: 206
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
12/11/2015 10:20:08 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
Politics are always Opinion based and to force anyone to live by anyone else's Opinion, qualifies as Slavery.

So the thing that bothers me the most about Politics is the inherent enslavement-nature that always sources out of Politics.

"Faith replaces Logic when Ignorance rules the Roost, then that Ignorance based Faith supplants Common Sense with Duality Perception sourced Morals/Opinion, to then form the most perfect closed minded idiot possible, also known as a sheeple." - Old Toad Proverb (aka: Law of Fools)

"Common Sense, rather than Faith, is the ONLY answer to uncovering the Truth, which then forms the Dynamic System known as Life. Faith is only good for creating a Static System, which then sources Entropy, which always ends in Death." - Old Toad Proverb

Ribbit :)
smelisox
Posts: 849
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
12/12/2015 6:18:32 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/11/2015 8:49:04 PM, jharry wrote:
At 12/11/2015 8:41:13 PM, BlackFlags wrote:
What bothers me most is how government has become so ingrained into our daily lives, that people literally have convinced themselves that the world cannot survive with an inactive government.

This

Every side trys to get the government to back their ideals or beliefs. And all the while we are losing our liberty........

This goes for the liberal and the conservative. The bible thumper and the atheist. The pro life and pro choice. Same sex marriage and traditional.

The government shouldn't this entrenched in our lives. They shouldn't be loaning our money to anyone. They shouldn't have any say in who I marry or what I decide to put in my body.

But the American people have become a shell of what they once were.

You aren't "losing your liberty".
BlackFlags
Posts: 904
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
12/12/2015 7:08:22 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/12/2015 6:18:32 AM, smelisox wrote:
You aren't "losing your liberty".

Yeah, he is. The government has integrated itself into our daily routines moreso than ever in the past 15 years. A few isolated incidents of socially progressive legislation being passed does not excuse the massive overstepping of bounds being committed by the federal government.
stealspell
Posts: 980
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
12/12/2015 7:52:46 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/12/2015 7:08:22 AM, BlackFlags wrote:
At 12/12/2015 6:18:32 AM, smelisox wrote:
You aren't "losing your liberty".

Yeah, he is. The government has integrated itself into our daily routines moreso than ever in the past 15 years.

Some examples?
HououinKyouma
Posts: 1,030
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
12/12/2015 8:59:27 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/11/2015 3:42:52 PM, slo1 wrote:
What bothers you the most about politics?

Where to begin?

1) The oversimplification of issues and their solutions.

2) The substitution of catch-phrases and mottos for actual policies (making America better, taking the country back, etc).

3) Slanted and overly-politicized reporting on political stories.

4) The pandering on the part of politicians to the feelings of the rabble in order to gain votes.

5) The radicalization of political parties.

6) The popularization of delusional views of politics. On the left, that government can and should solve all problems. On the right, that we can all get along just fine with barely any government.

7) The incredible amount of ignorance and self-delusion concerning key political issues not just on the part of the mob but on those who should educating them--the journalists and intellectuals.

8) The silencing of any dissenting opinion that does not satisfy the ideological check-box of either side in the political spectrum.

9) The excessive religiosity on the part of politicians, mostly on the right.
"Here the ways of men part: if you wish to strive for peace of soul and pleasure, then believe; if you wish to be a devotee of truth, then inquire." F. Nietzsche.

"Freedom is always freedom for the one who thinks differently." R. Luxemburg.

"The principle of the masochistic left is that, in general, two blacks make a white, half a loaf is the same as no bread." G. Orwell, paraphrase.

"Islamophobia is a word created by fascists, used by cowards, to manipulate morons". Andrew Cummins.
ironslippers
Posts: 509
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
12/12/2015 9:58:13 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/11/2015 3:42:52 PM, slo1 wrote:
What bothers you the most about politics?

Complacency of the masses to accept politicians self interests sans the their constituents interest
Everyone stands on their own dung hill and speaks out about someone else's - Nathan Krusemark
Its easier to criticize and hate than it is to support and create - I Ron Slippers
Diqiucun_Cunmin
Posts: 2,710
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
12/12/2015 4:56:31 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
Much of what was said above applies to Hong Kong too (apart from the religiosity thing). What's scary is that we're not even fully democratised yet, and we're already experiencing these ills...

Since starting our transition from a 'benevolent dictatorship' to a democracy, we've been experiencing more of the dark side of partisan politics by the day. Currently (this will probably change in a matter of years; the political ecology was drastically different even five years ago) politicians are divided into four camps:

-Government loyalists who have all sorts of tricks up their sleeves to keep themselves elected (from gerrymandering to less subtle tricks).
-'Mainstream' democrats who sit back and get the middle class vote.
-Silly anti-government left-wing politicians (the 'leftards', similar to 'libtards' in the West).
-Crazy anti-government far-right politicians (the 'hot dogs' - these are the scariest, and similar to far-right groups in the West except they stress 'Hongkongism' rather than nationalism).

None of these groups are aiming to improve Hong Kong in any way. Only some of the 'hot dogs' claim to stand for Confucian values (and BTW, they grossly misinterpret the very values they say they stand for). All of them are just in politics for money. Unfortunately, all of them have die-hard fans (or, in the government loyalists' case, voters who don't even know they're fans) who keep them in office.

/endrant, I know nobody cares.
The thing is, I hate relativism. I hate relativism more than I hate everything else, excepting, maybe, fibreglass powerboats... What it overlooks, to put it briefly and crudely, is the fixed structure of human nature. - Jerry Fodor

Don't be a stat cynic:
http://www.debate.org...

Response to conservative views on deforestation:
http://www.debate.org...

Topics I'd like to debate (not debating ATM): http://tinyurl.com...
UtherPenguin
Posts: 3,681
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
12/12/2015 4:59:26 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
1. Too much quralleing, not enough compromise.
2. In the US at least, Politics have become so ridiculously polarized that nothing could get done.
3. The NDP could just never seem to get a majority government >__<
4. Democracy is treated as if it's infallible and dogmatic.
5. People view non democratic countries, no matter how effective their governments are, as some how inferior, kind of like the White Man's Burden, but just replace 'civilization' and Christianity with Democracy.
6. Same thing as #5 and #6, just replace Democracy with secularism
"Praise Allah."
~YYW
smelisox
Posts: 849
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
12/12/2015 10:06:22 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/12/2015 7:52:46 AM, stealspell wrote:
At 12/12/2015 7:08:22 AM, BlackFlags wrote:
At 12/12/2015 6:18:32 AM, smelisox wrote:
You aren't "losing your liberty".

Yeah, he is. The government has integrated itself into our daily routines moreso than ever in the past 15 years.

Some examples?

Can't even give one. Says everything, doesn't it?
Contra
Posts: 3,941
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
12/13/2015 12:34:17 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
1) The fact that too many people of all political beliefs resort to demagoguery.

There are liberals who claim that conservatives "hate poor people", who think that the conservatives only care about rich people, and those who think that Republicans are mostly stupid, white, evangelical Christians. Right-wingers too often see liberals as unwilling to "look at the facts", as "baby-killers", and they see Obama as a "Muslim" who doesn't love his country. The truth is most people share the same goals when it comes to outcomes, people are just unwilling to discuss issues rationally. There is too much hate.

2) Republicans don't tolerate different viewpoints. Whether it comes to supporting same-sex marriage, supporting the Iran nuclear deal, saying that Israel receives too many of our tax dollars, or admitting that the Iraqi War was a very bad idea, Republicans are usually shunned. There is a sense of tribalism that I think is unhealthy.

3) America seems incompetent. If Akon can help bring electricity to 600 million Africans (if it is successful) (http://www.huffingtonpost.com...), if China can bring electricity to third world states, and if the allies were able to rebuild Europe after WW2, why has the US failed to bring about successful states in the Middle East?
"The solution [for Republicans] is to admit that Bush was a bad president, stop this racist homophobic stuff, stop trying to give most of the tax cuts to the rich, propose a real alternative to Obamacare that actually works, and propose smart free market solutions to our economic problems." - Distraff

"Americans are better off in a dynamic, free-enterprise-based economy that fosters economic growth, opportunity and upward mobility." - Paul Ryan
slo1
Posts: 4,318
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
12/13/2015 3:35:14 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/13/2015 12:34:17 AM, Contra wrote:
1) The fact that too many people of all political beliefs resort to demagoguery.

There are liberals who claim that conservatives "hate poor people", who think that the conservatives only care about rich people, and those who think that Republicans are mostly stupid, white, evangelical Christians. Right-wingers too often see liberals as unwilling to "look at the facts", as "baby-killers", and they see Obama as a "Muslim" who doesn't love his country. The truth is most people share the same goals when it comes to outcomes, people are just unwilling to discuss issues rationally. There is too much hate.

2) Republicans don't tolerate different viewpoints. Whether it comes to supporting same-sex marriage, supporting the Iran nuclear deal, saying that Israel receives too many of our tax dollars, or admitting that the Iraqi War was a very bad idea, Republicans are usually shunned. There is a sense of tribalism that I think is unhealthy.

3) America seems incompetent. If Akon can help bring electricity to 600 million Africans (if it is successful) (http://www.huffingtonpost.com...), if China can bring electricity to third world states, and if the allies were able to rebuild Europe after WW2, why has the US failed to bring about successful states in the Middle East?

Very good points. On 3 I might add that part of the issue is that we might very well have an over inflated ego which gives us over inflated expectations. Democratization of the Middle East is a good example. It originally was a discussion of years rather than decades or even centuries. To our defense we are fundamentally trying change the culture of the people in the Middle East a much more difficult feat than solar technology.
slo1
Posts: 4,318
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
12/13/2015 3:46:18 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/11/2015 8:41:13 PM, BlackFlags wrote:
What bothers me most is how government has become so ingrained into our daily lives, that people literally have convinced themselves that the world cannot survive with an inactive government.

What bothers me the most is that people don't understand how there are certain functions that require the scale of the government to pull off. Our fore fathers understood this when they put the postal system under the Fed. People also generally understand that transportation infrastructure is another area that requires full scale.

With that said, it irritates me that people are not willing to be open minded to shuffle programs in and out of the scope of the Fed and state gov. In this day and age, there isn't much need for daily mail service run by government.

In this day and age there is a need for a safety net for catastrophic emergency coverage for everyone. Forcing hospitals to be finance companies and debt collectors is crazy. They should know they will get paid up front for services rendered.
MakeSensePeopleDont
Posts: 1,104
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
12/13/2015 4:01:45 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/11/2015 3:42:52 PM, slo1 wrote:
What bothers you the most about politics?

In no specific order:

1) Lying to citizens
2) Hiding or spinning facts
3) The lack of compromise today
4) All those rich politicians and their "fundraising" groups spam calling and emailing citizens begging for money to line their already fat pockets so they don't have to spend their own wealth to run for office
5) Greed
6) Lack of drive to listen to the people
7) The inability to place one's own desires on the back burner and focus on what's best for the nation

There's a quick list for you.
BlackFlags
Posts: 904
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
12/13/2015 9:53:25 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/13/2015 3:46:18 PM, slo1 wrote:
What bothers me the most is that people don't understand how there are certain functions that require the scale of the government to pull off. Our fore fathers understood this when they put the postal system under the Fed. People also generally understand that transportation infrastructure is another area that requires full scale.

Yeah, okay. You are a statist, I expect that from most people.

Not sure where else you could be going with that...
MakeSensePeopleDont
Posts: 1,104
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
12/13/2015 9:55:30 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/13/2015 12:06:56 AM, GrittyWorm wrote:
That Obama hasn't been impeached.

You would rather Joe Biden be in office? The best move Obama made as President was to elect Biden his VP...he made himself impeachment proof with that move.
slo1
Posts: 4,318
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
12/14/2015 2:05:50 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/13/2015 9:53:25 PM, BlackFlags wrote:
At 12/13/2015 3:46:18 PM, slo1 wrote:
What bothers me the most is that people don't understand how there are certain functions that require the scale of the government to pull off. Our fore fathers understood this when they put the postal system under the Fed. People also generally understand that transportation infrastructure is another area that requires full scale.

Yeah, okay. You are a statist, I expect that from most people.

Not sure where else you could be going with that...
I'm a statist because I want to eliminate the postal system? Just so you have the proper definition as it seems you have it mixed up a bit.

stat"ism (st&#257;R42;t&#301;zR42;&#601;m)
n.
The practice or doctrine of giving a centralized government control over economic planning and policy.
jharry
Posts: 4,984
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
12/14/2015 4:51:07 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/12/2015 6:18:32 AM, smelisox wrote:
At 12/11/2015 8:49:04 PM, jharry wrote:
At 12/11/2015 8:41:13 PM, BlackFlags wrote:
What bothers me most is how government has become so ingrained into our daily lives, that people literally have convinced themselves that the world cannot survive with an inactive government.

This

Every side trys to get the government to back their ideals or beliefs. And all the while we are losing our liberty........

This goes for the liberal and the conservative. The bible thumper and the atheist. The pro life and pro choice. Same sex marriage and traditional.

The government shouldn't this entrenched in our lives. They shouldn't be loaning our money to anyone. They shouldn't have any say in who I marry or what I decide to put in my body.

But the American people have become a shell of what they once were.

You aren't "losing your liberty".

I can be murdered:

for not wearing a seat belt.

for not wanting medical insurance.

not wanting to pay for someone else way

Being murdered is a major loss of liberty
In nomine Patris, et Filii, et Spiritus Sancti. Amen
smelisox
Posts: 849
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
12/14/2015 5:15:09 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/14/2015 4:51:07 PM, jharry wrote:
At 12/12/2015 6:18:32 AM, smelisox wrote:
At 12/11/2015 8:49:04 PM, jharry wrote:
At 12/11/2015 8:41:13 PM, BlackFlags wrote:
What bothers me most is how government has become so ingrained into our daily lives, that people literally have convinced themselves that the world cannot survive with an inactive government.

This

Every side trys to get the government to back their ideals or beliefs. And all the while we are losing our liberty........

This goes for the liberal and the conservative. The bible thumper and the atheist. The pro life and pro choice. Same sex marriage and traditional.

The government shouldn't this entrenched in our lives. They shouldn't be loaning our money to anyone. They shouldn't have any say in who I marry or what I decide to put in my body.

But the American people have become a shell of what they once were.

You aren't "losing your liberty".

I can be murdered:

for not wearing a seat belt.

for not wanting medical insurance.

not wanting to pay for someone else way

Being murdered is a major loss of liberty

That's some major cold war angst right there. "Those damn commies are making me wear my seat belt! But I am a true AMERICAN, and in the SIXTY NINTH ammendment it says "ALL AMERICAN HAS THE RIGHT TO NOT WEAR SEATBELTS!" "