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Concealed/open/constitutional carry

Maccabee
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1/11/2016 10:12:12 PM
Posted: 10 months ago
What's your option on this? I think that if you're a law abiding citizen then you don't need a permit at all. BTW, the reason you see so many gun threads from me is to raise awareness of Obama's potential executive order on gun rights.
Scripture, facts, stats, and logic is how I argue

Evolutionism is a religion, not science

When seconds count, the police are just minutes away.

"If guns are the cause of crimes then aren't matches the cause of arson?" D. Boys

"If the death penalty is government sanctioned killing then isn't inprisonment is government sanction kidnapping?" D. B

"Why do you trust the government with machine guns but not honest citizens?" D. B

All those who are pro-death (abortion) is already born
tajshar2k
Posts: 2,378
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1/11/2016 10:24:06 PM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/11/2016 10:12:12 PM, Maccabee wrote:
What's your option on this? I think that if you're a law abiding citizen then you don't need a permit at all. BTW, the reason you see so many gun threads from me is to raise awareness of Obama's potential executive order on gun rights.

How do we know you are law a bidding citizen? Everybody needs a permit obviously.

I support CCW, but I'm strongly against open carry unless it's in rural states like Vermont or some parts of Texas.
"In Guns We Trust" Tajshar2k
thett3
Posts: 14,334
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1/11/2016 10:30:00 PM
Posted: 10 months ago
I'm in favor of open carry even though I doubt I would ever do it. Obviously I'm in favor of concealed carry...I don't see how anyone, even someone who is incredibly liberal and wants to ban all guns, could possibly be against vetted, law abiding citizens carrying concealed weapons to defend themselves or others....which happens more often than people think. https://www.reddit.com...
DDO Vice President

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#UnbanTheMadman

#BetOnThett

"Don't quote me, ever." -Max

"My name is max. I'm not a big fan of slacks"- Max rapping

"Walmart should have the opportunity to bribe a politician to it's agenda" -Max

"Thett, you're really good at convincing people you're a decent person"-tulle

"You fit the character of Regina George quite nicely"- Sam

: At 11/12/2016 11:49:40 PM, Raisor wrote:
: thett was right
tajshar2k
Posts: 2,378
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1/11/2016 10:46:13 PM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/11/2016 10:30:00 PM, thett3 wrote:
I'm in favor of open carry even though I doubt I would ever do it. Obviously I'm in favor of concealed carry...I don't see how anyone, even someone who is incredibly liberal and wants to ban all guns, could possibly be against vetted, law abiding citizens carrying concealed weapons to defend themselves or others....which happens more often than people think. https://www.reddit.com...

Personally I see no benefit in open carry. It's dumb to show your gun, because a criminal would know who his threat is, and would likely just wait for you to leave. You are giving him the element of surprise, since you don't know who he is, but he can identify you.

I guess open carry makes sense in places in Vermont where they hunt for food, since you can't conceal a rifle. (duh)
"In Guns We Trust" Tajshar2k
spacetime
Posts: 449
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1/11/2016 10:47:59 PM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/11/2016 10:12:12 PM, Maccabee wrote:
What's your option on this? I think that if you're a law abiding citizen then you don't need a permit at all.

How exactly is concealed/open-carry going to be limited to law-abiding citizens without the use of permits...?
Call me King Pootie Tang.
thett3
Posts: 14,334
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1/11/2016 10:51:46 PM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/11/2016 10:46:13 PM, tajshar2k wrote:
At 1/11/2016 10:30:00 PM, thett3 wrote:
I'm in favor of open carry even though I doubt I would ever do it. Obviously I'm in favor of concealed carry...I don't see how anyone, even someone who is incredibly liberal and wants to ban all guns, could possibly be against vetted, law abiding citizens carrying concealed weapons to defend themselves or others....which happens more often than people think. https://www.reddit.com...

Personally I see no benefit in open carry. It's dumb to show your gun, because a criminal would know who his threat is, and would likely just wait for you to leave. You are giving him the element of surprise, since you don't know who he is, but he can identify you.

That's the reason I'd never do it, but I also don't see any harm in it. So if the people want it, why not?


I guess open carry makes sense in places in Vermont where they hunt for food, since you can't conceal a rifle. (duh)

Agreed.
DDO Vice President

#StandwithBossy

#UnbanTheMadman

#BetOnThett

"Don't quote me, ever." -Max

"My name is max. I'm not a big fan of slacks"- Max rapping

"Walmart should have the opportunity to bribe a politician to it's agenda" -Max

"Thett, you're really good at convincing people you're a decent person"-tulle

"You fit the character of Regina George quite nicely"- Sam

: At 11/12/2016 11:49:40 PM, Raisor wrote:
: thett was right
tajshar2k
Posts: 2,378
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1/11/2016 10:56:50 PM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/11/2016 10:51:46 PM, thett3 wrote:
At 1/11/2016 10:46:13 PM, tajshar2k wrote:
At 1/11/2016 10:30:00 PM, thett3 wrote:
I'm in favor of open carry even though I doubt I would ever do it. Obviously I'm in favor of concealed carry...I don't see how anyone, even someone who is incredibly liberal and wants to ban all guns, could possibly be against vetted, law abiding citizens carrying concealed weapons to defend themselves or others....which happens more often than people think. https://www.reddit.com...

Personally I see no benefit in open carry. It's dumb to show your gun, because a criminal would know who his threat is, and would likely just wait for you to leave. You are giving him the element of surprise, since you don't know who he is, but he can identify you.

That's the reason I'd never do it, but I also don't see any harm in it. So if the people want it, why not?

Well this is just my opinion, but personally I don't like people just carrying an M4 on their back, because it doesn't reflect a stable society. Most guys just want to show off, or "exercise their 2nd Amendment rights". I'll admit it does look pretty bada$$, but at the same time it looks stupid if you know what I mean.

Also, it gives law enforcement trouble. When these fools open carry, cops need to check whether they have permits, and most of the time, they create a lot of trouble. These cops could be doing something else more productive.


I guess open carry makes sense in places in Vermont where they hunt for food, since you can't conceal a rifle. (duh)

Agreed.
"In Guns We Trust" Tajshar2k
thett3
Posts: 14,334
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1/11/2016 11:05:03 PM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/11/2016 10:56:50 PM, tajshar2k wrote:
At 1/11/2016 10:51:46 PM, thett3 wrote:
At 1/11/2016 10:46:13 PM, tajshar2k wrote:
At 1/11/2016 10:30:00 PM, thett3 wrote:
I'm in favor of open carry even though I doubt I would ever do it. Obviously I'm in favor of concealed carry...I don't see how anyone, even someone who is incredibly liberal and wants to ban all guns, could possibly be against vetted, law abiding citizens carrying concealed weapons to defend themselves or others....which happens more often than people think. https://www.reddit.com...

Personally I see no benefit in open carry. It's dumb to show your gun, because a criminal would know who his threat is, and would likely just wait for you to leave. You are giving him the element of surprise, since you don't know who he is, but he can identify you.

That's the reason I'd never do it, but I also don't see any harm in it. So if the people want it, why not?

Well this is just my opinion, but personally I don't like people just carrying an M4 on their back, because it doesn't reflect a stable society. Most guys just want to show off, or "exercise their 2nd Amendment rights". I'll admit it does look pretty bada$$, but at the same time it looks stupid if you know what I mean.

I know exactly what you mean. Until really recently in Texas open carry of long guns was allowed but handguns were prohibited, and people would always open carry AR-15s to make some kind of political statement. It's definitely off putting and not something I like, but I don't see any reason to prohibit it just because I don't like it.


Also, it gives law enforcement trouble. When these fools open carry, cops need to check whether they have permits, and most of the time, they create a lot of trouble. These cops could be doing something else more productive.


I guess open carry makes sense in places in Vermont where they hunt for food, since you can't conceal a rifle. (duh)

Agreed.
DDO Vice President

#StandwithBossy

#UnbanTheMadman

#BetOnThett

"Don't quote me, ever." -Max

"My name is max. I'm not a big fan of slacks"- Max rapping

"Walmart should have the opportunity to bribe a politician to it's agenda" -Max

"Thett, you're really good at convincing people you're a decent person"-tulle

"You fit the character of Regina George quite nicely"- Sam

: At 11/12/2016 11:49:40 PM, Raisor wrote:
: thett was right
TBR
Posts: 9,991
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1/11/2016 11:14:10 PM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/11/2016 10:12:12 PM, Maccabee wrote:
What's your option on this? I think that if you're a law abiding citizen then you don't need a permit at all. BTW, the reason you see so many gun threads from me is to raise awareness of Obama's potential executive order on gun rights.

You are simply wrong. Look at the SCOTUS, and you will see, this has been tested. Your right is not without limit or oversight.
Maccabee
Posts: 1,234
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1/11/2016 11:24:06 PM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/11/2016 10:24:06 PM, tajshar2k wrote:
At 1/11/2016 10:12:12 PM, Maccabee wrote:
What's your option on this? I think that if you're a law abiding citizen then you don't need a permit at all. BTW, the reason you see so many gun threads from me is to raise awareness of Obama's potential executive order on gun rights.

How do we know you are law a bidding citizen? Everybody needs a permit obviously.

They need guns to do so and most often they get from a gun shop that did a background check on them. Carrying a gun shouldn't be a crime in it of itself unless you are threatening someone with it.

I support CCW, but I'm strongly against open carry unless it's in rural states like Vermont or some parts of Texas.

Open carry allows for leeway for those who conceal carry but accidentally show their gun in public. In places like New York they put you in jail for that.
Scripture, facts, stats, and logic is how I argue

Evolutionism is a religion, not science

When seconds count, the police are just minutes away.

"If guns are the cause of crimes then aren't matches the cause of arson?" D. Boys

"If the death penalty is government sanctioned killing then isn't inprisonment is government sanction kidnapping?" D. B

"Why do you trust the government with machine guns but not honest citizens?" D. B

All those who are pro-death (abortion) is already born
Maccabee
Posts: 1,234
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1/11/2016 11:38:12 PM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/11/2016 11:14:10 PM, TBR wrote:
At 1/11/2016 10:12:12 PM, Maccabee wrote:
What's your option on this? I think that if you're a law abiding citizen then you don't need a permit at all. BTW, the reason you see so many gun threads from me is to raise awareness of Obama's potential executive order on gun rights.

You are simply wrong. Look at the SCOTUS, and you will see, this has been tested. Your right is not without limit or oversight.

They also ruled that same sex marriage is a right when in fact the constitution never mentioned it. They also ruled that slaves were the property of their masters before it was overturned. Just because the SCOTUS say so doesn't make it right. And don't get me started on Roe vs Wade.
Scripture, facts, stats, and logic is how I argue

Evolutionism is a religion, not science

When seconds count, the police are just minutes away.

"If guns are the cause of crimes then aren't matches the cause of arson?" D. Boys

"If the death penalty is government sanctioned killing then isn't inprisonment is government sanction kidnapping?" D. B

"Why do you trust the government with machine guns but not honest citizens?" D. B

All those who are pro-death (abortion) is already born
TBR
Posts: 9,991
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1/11/2016 11:52:36 PM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/11/2016 11:38:12 PM, Maccabee wrote:
At 1/11/2016 11:14:10 PM, TBR wrote:
At 1/11/2016 10:12:12 PM, Maccabee wrote:
What's your option on this? I think that if you're a law abiding citizen then you don't need a permit at all. BTW, the reason you see so many gun threads from me is to raise awareness of Obama's potential executive order on gun rights.

You are simply wrong. Look at the SCOTUS, and you will see, this has been tested. Your right is not without limit or oversight.

They also ruled that same sex marriage is a right when in fact the constitution never mentioned it. They also ruled that slaves were the property of their masters before it was overturned. Just because the SCOTUS say so doesn't make it right. And don't get me started on Roe vs Wade.

Buddy... I think you don't like the constitution very much if that is how you feel.
Chuz-Life
Posts: 1,788
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1/12/2016 12:27:38 AM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/11/2016 11:38:12 PM, Maccabee wrote:
At 1/11/2016 11:14:10 PM, TBR wrote:
At 1/11/2016 10:12:12 PM, Maccabee wrote:
What's your option on this? I think that if you're a law abiding citizen then you don't need a permit at all. BTW, the reason you see so many gun threads from me is to raise awareness of Obama's potential executive order on gun rights.

You are simply wrong. Look at the SCOTUS, and you will see, this has been tested. Your right is not without limit or oversight.

They also ruled that same sex marriage is a right when in fact the constitution never mentioned it. They also ruled that slaves were the property of their masters before it was overturned. Just because the SCOTUS say so doesn't make it right. And don't get me started on Roe vs Wade.

+1

Friend request sent your way!
"Sooner or later, the Supreme Court of the Unites States is going to have explain how a 'child in the womb' is a person enough to be recognized as a MURDER victim under our fetal homicide laws but how they are not persons enough to qualify for any other Constitutional protections" ~ Chuz Life

http://www.debate.org...
tajshar2k
Posts: 2,378
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1/12/2016 1:09:38 AM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/11/2016 11:24:06 PM, Maccabee wrote:
At 1/11/2016 10:24:06 PM, tajshar2k wrote:
At 1/11/2016 10:12:12 PM, Maccabee wrote:
What's your option on this? I think that if you're a law abiding citizen then you don't need a permit at all. BTW, the reason you see so many gun threads from me is to raise awareness of Obama's potential executive order on gun rights.

How do we know you are law a bidding citizen? Everybody needs a permit obviously.

They need guns to do so and most often they get from a gun shop that did a background check on them. Carrying a gun shouldn't be a crime in it of itself unless you are threatening someone with it.

Yes, but how you know that? You can't just say I won't threaten somebody, somebody needs to verify it. A permit should always be required.


I support CCW, but I'm strongly against open carry unless it's in rural states like Vermont or some parts of Texas.

Open carry allows for leeway for those who conceal carry but accidentally show their gun in public. In places like New York they put you in jail for that.

So do you support it?
"In Guns We Trust" Tajshar2k
tajshar2k
Posts: 2,378
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1/12/2016 1:13:50 AM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/11/2016 11:38:12 PM, Maccabee wrote:
At 1/11/2016 11:14:10 PM, TBR wrote:
At 1/11/2016 10:12:12 PM, Maccabee wrote:
What's your option on this? I think that if you're a law abiding citizen then you don't need a permit at all. BTW, the reason you see so many gun threads from me is to raise awareness of Obama's potential executive order on gun rights.

You are simply wrong. Look at the SCOTUS, and you will see, this has been tested. Your right is not without limit or oversight.

They also ruled that same sex marriage is a right when in fact the constitution never mentioned it. They also ruled that slaves were the property of their masters before it was overturned. Just because the SCOTUS say so doesn't make it right. And don't get me started on Roe vs Wade.

SSM is a negative right, since it doesn't burden anybody or effect anybody in anyway. So technically it should be a right. Also, the ban on SSM is actually unconstitutional according to the 14th amendment. Everybody is equal under the law.

Abortion is a tricky case I'll admit.
"In Guns We Trust" Tajshar2k
Maccabee
Posts: 1,234
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1/12/2016 2:04:47 AM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/11/2016 11:52:36 PM, TBR wrote:
At 1/11/2016 11:38:12 PM, Maccabee wrote:
At 1/11/2016 11:14:10 PM, TBR wrote:
At 1/11/2016 10:12:12 PM, Maccabee wrote:
What's your option on this? I think that if you're a law abiding citizen then you don't need a permit at all. BTW, the reason you see so many gun threads from me is to raise awareness of Obama's potential executive order on gun rights.

You are simply wrong. Look at the SCOTUS, and you will see, this has been tested. Your right is not without limit or oversight.

They also ruled that same sex marriage is a right when in fact the constitution never mentioned it. They also ruled that slaves were the property of their masters before it was overturned. Just because the SCOTUS say so doesn't make it right. And don't get me started on Roe vs Wade.

Buddy... I think you don't like the constitution very much if that is how you feel.
Uh no, I'm saying that the SCOTUS doesn't always rule according to the constitution. Do you deny that they ruled that slavery was ok when the Declaration of Independence and I think the constitution says that all men are created equal?
Scripture, facts, stats, and logic is how I argue

Evolutionism is a religion, not science

When seconds count, the police are just minutes away.

"If guns are the cause of crimes then aren't matches the cause of arson?" D. Boys

"If the death penalty is government sanctioned killing then isn't inprisonment is government sanction kidnapping?" D. B

"Why do you trust the government with machine guns but not honest citizens?" D. B

All those who are pro-death (abortion) is already born
Maccabee
Posts: 1,234
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1/12/2016 2:05:43 AM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/12/2016 12:27:38 AM, Chuz-Life wrote:
At 1/11/2016 11:38:12 PM, Maccabee wrote:
At 1/11/2016 11:14:10 PM, TBR wrote:
At 1/11/2016 10:12:12 PM, Maccabee wrote:
What's your option on this? I think that if you're a law abiding citizen then you don't need a permit at all. BTW, the reason you see so many gun threads from me is to raise awareness of Obama's potential executive order on gun rights.

You are simply wrong. Look at the SCOTUS, and you will see, this has been tested. Your right is not without limit or oversight.

They also ruled that same sex marriage is a right when in fact the constitution never mentioned it. They also ruled that slaves were the property of their masters before it was overturned. Just because the SCOTUS say so doesn't make it right. And don't get me started on Roe vs Wade.

+1

Friend request sent your way!

Thanks. Accepted.
Scripture, facts, stats, and logic is how I argue

Evolutionism is a religion, not science

When seconds count, the police are just minutes away.

"If guns are the cause of crimes then aren't matches the cause of arson?" D. Boys

"If the death penalty is government sanctioned killing then isn't inprisonment is government sanction kidnapping?" D. B

"Why do you trust the government with machine guns but not honest citizens?" D. B

All those who are pro-death (abortion) is already born
Maccabee
Posts: 1,234
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1/12/2016 2:12:49 AM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/12/2016 1:09:38 AM, tajshar2k wrote:
At 1/11/2016 11:24:06 PM, Maccabee wrote:
At 1/11/2016 10:24:06 PM, tajshar2k wrote:
At 1/11/2016 10:12:12 PM, Maccabee wrote:
What's your option on this? I think that if you're a law abiding citizen then you don't need a permit at all. BTW, the reason you see so many gun threads from me is to raise awareness of Obama's potential executive order on gun rights.

How do we know you are law a bidding citizen? Everybody needs a permit obviously.

They need guns to do so and most often they get from a gun shop that did a background check on them. Carrying a gun shouldn't be a crime in it of itself unless you are threatening someone with it.

Yes, but how you know that? You can't just say I won't threaten somebody, somebody needs to verify it. A permit should always be required.

Not if it violates the second amendment which states that the right to keep and bear arms shall NOT be infringed. Plus, look at states like Vermont and Alaska (where I'm from). See how much crime is there. Granted Alaska has a low population but look at the ratio.


I support CCW, but I'm strongly against open carry unless it's in rural states like Vermont or some parts of Texas.

Open carry allows for leeway for those who conceal carry but accidentally show their gun in public. In places like New York they put you in jail for that.

So do you support it?

Sure, criminal don't open carry so why ban it? I don't mind it at all. Now I personally wouldn't open carry because I don't like to advertise my arsenal and I ales like to keep the element of surprise. But if someone wants to carry a full fledged M16 with select fire then I say "have at it". It's not my style but I do support his right to do so.
Scripture, facts, stats, and logic is how I argue

Evolutionism is a religion, not science

When seconds count, the police are just minutes away.

"If guns are the cause of crimes then aren't matches the cause of arson?" D. Boys

"If the death penalty is government sanctioned killing then isn't inprisonment is government sanction kidnapping?" D. B

"Why do you trust the government with machine guns but not honest citizens?" D. B

All those who are pro-death (abortion) is already born
Maccabee
Posts: 1,234
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1/12/2016 2:14:33 AM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/12/2016 1:13:50 AM, tajshar2k wrote:
At 1/11/2016 11:38:12 PM, Maccabee wrote:
At 1/11/2016 11:14:10 PM, TBR wrote:
At 1/11/2016 10:12:12 PM, Maccabee wrote:
What's your option on this? I think that if you're a law abiding citizen then you don't need a permit at all. BTW, the reason you see so many gun threads from me is to raise awareness of Obama's potential executive order on gun rights.

You are simply wrong. Look at the SCOTUS, and you will see, this has been tested. Your right is not without limit or oversight.

They also ruled that same sex marriage is a right when in fact the constitution never mentioned it. They also ruled that slaves were the property of their masters before it was overturned. Just because the SCOTUS say so doesn't make it right. And don't get me started on Roe vs Wade.

SSM is a negative right, since it doesn't burden anybody or effect anybody in anyway. So technically it should be a right. Also, the ban on SSM is actually unconstitutional according to the 14th amendment. Everybody is equal under the law.

No where in the 14th amendment does it mentions marriage.

Abortion is a tricky case I'll admit.

Then lets stick to obvious like slavery.
Scripture, facts, stats, and logic is how I argue

Evolutionism is a religion, not science

When seconds count, the police are just minutes away.

"If guns are the cause of crimes then aren't matches the cause of arson?" D. Boys

"If the death penalty is government sanctioned killing then isn't inprisonment is government sanction kidnapping?" D. B

"Why do you trust the government with machine guns but not honest citizens?" D. B

All those who are pro-death (abortion) is already born
tajshar2k
Posts: 2,378
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1/12/2016 2:17:55 AM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/12/2016 2:12:49 AM, Maccabee wrote:
At 1/12/2016 1:09:38 AM, tajshar2k wrote:
At 1/11/2016 11:24:06 PM, Maccabee wrote:
At 1/11/2016 10:24:06 PM, tajshar2k wrote:
At 1/11/2016 10:12:12 PM, Maccabee wrote:
What's your option on this? I think that if you're a law abiding citizen then you don't need a permit at all. BTW, the reason you see so many gun threads from me is to raise awareness of Obama's potential executive order on gun rights.

How do we know you are law a bidding citizen? Everybody needs a permit obviously.

They need guns to do so and most often they get from a gun shop that did a background check on them. Carrying a gun shouldn't be a crime in it of itself unless you are threatening someone with it.

Yes, but how you know that? You can't just say I won't threaten somebody, somebody needs to verify it. A permit should always be required.

Not if it violates the second amendment which states that the right to keep and bear arms shall NOT be infringed. Plus, look at states like Vermont and Alaska (where I'm from). See how much crime is there. Granted Alaska has a low population but look at the ratio.

It doesn't infringe it though. Every rights have their limit. I can't yell "fire!" in a movie theater or tell somebody I'm going to kill you. That isn't' protected by the 1st amendment, because it violates a person's negative rights, the right to be safe, and the right to live.

Also, it's in the law that criminals lose their right to bear arms.

http://thelawdictionary.org...


I support CCW, but I'm strongly against open carry unless it's in rural states like Vermont or some parts of Texas.

Open carry allows for leeway for those who conceal carry but accidentally show their gun in public. In places like New York they put you in jail for that.

So do you support it?

Sure, criminal don't open carry so why ban it? I don't mind it at all. Now I personally wouldn't open carry because I don't like to advertise my arsenal and I ales like to keep the element of surprise. But if someone wants to carry a full fledged M16 with select fire then I say "have at it". It's not my style but I do support his right to do so.
"In Guns We Trust" Tajshar2k
tajshar2k
Posts: 2,378
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1/12/2016 2:24:53 AM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/12/2016 2:14:33 AM, Maccabee wrote:
At 1/12/2016 1:13:50 AM, tajshar2k wrote:
At 1/11/2016 11:38:12 PM, Maccabee wrote:
At 1/11/2016 11:14:10 PM, TBR wrote:
At 1/11/2016 10:12:12 PM, Maccabee wrote:
What's your option on this? I think that if you're a law abiding citizen then you don't need a permit at all. BTW, the reason you see so many gun threads from me is to raise awareness of Obama's potential executive order on gun rights.

You are simply wrong. Look at the SCOTUS, and you will see, this has been tested. Your right is not without limit or oversight.

They also ruled that same sex marriage is a right when in fact the constitution never mentioned it. They also ruled that slaves were the property of their masters before it was overturned. Just because the SCOTUS say so doesn't make it right. And don't get me started on Roe vs Wade.

SSM is a negative right, since it doesn't burden anybody or effect anybody in anyway. So technically it should be a right. Also, the ban on SSM is actually unconstitutional according to the 14th amendment. Everybody is equal under the law.

No where in the 14th amendment does it mentions marriage.

Doesn't have to. Everybody is equal under law. Everybody includes homosexuals and the rest of the community. Just because the Bible says something, that doesn't mean that should be the law. Separation of Church and State.

Twitter isn't mentioned in the 1st amendment, but that doesn't mean the government is allowed to regulate it, since it wasn't mentioned.

Abortion is a tricky case I'll admit.

Then lets stick to obvious like slavery.

Yes, Slavery violated a black mans' negative rights, and is unconstitutional, but remember blacks were not considered citizens of the U.S, so it wouldn't apply.
"In Guns We Trust" Tajshar2k
Maccabee
Posts: 1,234
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1/12/2016 3:08:04 AM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/12/2016 2:17:55 AM, tajshar2k wrote:
At 1/12/2016 2:12:49 AM, Maccabee wrote:
At 1/12/2016 1:09:38 AM, tajshar2k wrote:
At 1/11/2016 11:24:06 PM, Maccabee wrote:
At 1/11/2016 10:24:06 PM, tajshar2k wrote:
At 1/11/2016 10:12:12 PM, Maccabee wrote:
What's your option on this? I think that if you're a law abiding citizen then you don't need a permit at all. BTW, the reason you see so many gun threads from me is to raise awareness of Obama's potential executive order on gun rights.

How do we know you are law a bidding citizen? Everybody needs a permit obviously.

They need guns to do so and most often they get from a gun shop that did a background check on them. Carrying a gun shouldn't be a crime in it of itself unless you are threatening someone with it.

Yes, but how you know that? You can't just say I won't threaten somebody, somebody needs to verify it. A permit should always be required.

Not if it violates the second amendment which states that the right to keep and bear arms shall NOT be infringed. Plus, look at states like Vermont and Alaska (where I'm from). See how much crime is there. Granted Alaska has a low population but look at the ratio.

It doesn't infringe it though. Every rights have their limit. I can't yell "fire!" in a movie theater or tell somebody I'm going to kill you. That isn't' protected by the 1st amendment, because it violates a person's negative rights, the right to be safe, and the right to live.

If it causes harm to others (like yelling fire in a theatre or affect society in a bad way) then it should be restricted. Who does constitutional carry harm?

Also, it's in the law that criminals lose their right to bear arms.

http://thelawdictionary.org...

None voilent felons should have their gun rights restored. In fact if doesn't harm anyone then it shouldn't be a felon. If it harms property, life, or liberty then it should be punished by giving double to triple of the property lost, executing the murderer, and we can decide on taking away liberty.


I support CCW, but I'm strongly against open carry unless it's in rural states like Vermont or some parts of Texas.

Open carry allows for leeway for those who conceal carry but accidentally show their gun in public. In places like New York they put you in jail for that.

So do you support it?

Sure, criminal don't open carry so why ban it? I don't mind it at all. Now I personally wouldn't open carry because I don't like to advertise my arsenal and I ales like to keep the element of surprise. But if someone wants to carry a full fledged M16 with select fire then I say "have at it". It's not my style but I do support his right to do so.
Scripture, facts, stats, and logic is how I argue

Evolutionism is a religion, not science

When seconds count, the police are just minutes away.

"If guns are the cause of crimes then aren't matches the cause of arson?" D. Boys

"If the death penalty is government sanctioned killing then isn't inprisonment is government sanction kidnapping?" D. B

"Why do you trust the government with machine guns but not honest citizens?" D. B

All those who are pro-death (abortion) is already born
Maccabee
Posts: 1,234
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1/12/2016 3:12:28 AM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/12/2016 2:24:53 AM, tajshar2k wrote:
At 1/12/2016 2:14:33 AM, Maccabee wrote:
At 1/12/2016 1:13:50 AM, tajshar2k wrote:
At 1/11/2016 11:38:12 PM, Maccabee wrote:
At 1/11/2016 11:14:10 PM, TBR wrote:
At 1/11/2016 10:12:12 PM, Maccabee wrote:
What's your option on this? I think that if you're a law abiding citizen then you don't need a permit at all. BTW, the reason you see so many gun threads from me is to raise awareness of Obama's potential executive order on gun rights.

You are simply wrong. Look at the SCOTUS, and you will see, this has been tested. Your right is not without limit or oversight.

They also ruled that same sex marriage is a right when in fact the constitution never mentioned it. They also ruled that slaves were the property of their masters before it was overturned. Just because the SCOTUS say so doesn't make it right. And don't get me started on Roe vs Wade.

SSM is a negative right, since it doesn't burden anybody or effect anybody in anyway. So technically it should be a right. Also, the ban on SSM is actually unconstitutional according to the 14th amendment. Everybody is equal under the law.

No where in the 14th amendment does it mentions marriage.

Doesn't have to. Everybody is equal under law. Everybody includes homosexuals and the rest of the community. Just because the Bible says something, that doesn't mean that should be the law. Separation of Church and State.

This could get off track. I'll answer this and then we can get back on topic. Where in the 14th amendment does it rules on marriage? Anything not numerated are left to the states.

Twitter isn't mentioned in the 1st amendment, but that doesn't mean the government is allowed to regulate it, since it wasn't mentioned.

Abortion is a tricky case I'll admit.

Then lets stick to obvious like slavery.

Yes, Slavery violated a black mans' negative rights, and is unconstitutional, but remember blacks were not considered citizens of the U.S, so it wouldn't apply.
Scripture, facts, stats, and logic is how I argue

Evolutionism is a religion, not science

When seconds count, the police are just minutes away.

"If guns are the cause of crimes then aren't matches the cause of arson?" D. Boys

"If the death penalty is government sanctioned killing then isn't inprisonment is government sanction kidnapping?" D. B

"Why do you trust the government with machine guns but not honest citizens?" D. B

All those who are pro-death (abortion) is already born
TBR
Posts: 9,991
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1/12/2016 3:29:16 AM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/12/2016 2:04:47 AM, Maccabee wrote:
At 1/11/2016 11:52:36 PM, TBR wrote:
At 1/11/2016 11:38:12 PM, Maccabee wrote:
At 1/11/2016 11:14:10 PM, TBR wrote:
At 1/11/2016 10:12:12 PM, Maccabee wrote:
What's your option on this? I think that if you're a law abiding citizen then you don't need a permit at all. BTW, the reason you see so many gun threads from me is to raise awareness of Obama's potential executive order on gun rights.

You are simply wrong. Look at the SCOTUS, and you will see, this has been tested. Your right is not without limit or oversight.

They also ruled that same sex marriage is a right when in fact the constitution never mentioned it. They also ruled that slaves were the property of their masters before it was overturned. Just because the SCOTUS say so doesn't make it right. And don't get me started on Roe vs Wade.

Buddy... I think you don't like the constitution very much if that is how you feel.
Uh no, I'm saying that the SCOTUS doesn't always rule according to the constitution. Do you deny that they ruled that slavery was ok when the Declaration of Independence and I think the constitution says that all men are created equal?

What the SCOTUS decides is the last word in what is and is not constitutional. That is... well constitutional.
kevin24018
Posts: 1,804
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1/12/2016 3:33:49 AM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/12/2016 1:09:38 AM, tajshar2k wrote:

Yes, but how you know that? You can't just say I won't threaten somebody, somebody needs to verify it. A permit should always be required.

background check is required on the federal level, permits are state level if required and to what extent, states differ greatly, someone will jump in and say it anyway so I may as well, the states with the strictest laws have the most gun crimes, the city of Chicago is one of the prime examples for that argument, I'm not interested in looking up stats, but i'm sure someone will.
kevin24018
Posts: 1,804
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1/12/2016 3:43:22 AM
Posted: 10 months ago
it's not uncommon even in my short travels to see someone open carrying, in different type stores etc, doesn't bother me, even seen some women open carry. I never have, not sure if I would or not, at the range is a different story. I believe open carry would deter a criminal more than it would make the person a target. A criminal wouldn't think that clearly in the heat of their crime to look everyone over and assess their strengths and weakness etc, that just happens in the movies. I never heard of one instance where someone who was open carry was targeted first during some sort of robbery or other crime.
those who choose to do so, I really hope they understand the responsibility they are taking on, this isn't a decision anyone should make lightly or for the wrong reasons. Always always always safety first.
Chuz-Life
Posts: 1,788
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1/12/2016 4:48:48 AM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/12/2016 3:29:16 AM, TBR wrote:
At 1/12/2016 2:04:47 AM, Maccabee wrote:
At 1/11/2016 11:52:36 PM, TBR wrote:

Buddy... I think you don't like the constitution very much if that is how you feel.

Uh no, I'm saying that the SCOTUS doesn't always rule according to the constitution. Do you deny that they ruled that slavery was ok when the Declaration of Independence and I think the constitution says that all men are created equal?

What the SCOTUS decides is the last word in what is and is not constitutional. That is... well constitutional.

Is the SCOTUS infallible?

It's a Yes or No question.
"Sooner or later, the Supreme Court of the Unites States is going to have explain how a 'child in the womb' is a person enough to be recognized as a MURDER victim under our fetal homicide laws but how they are not persons enough to qualify for any other Constitutional protections" ~ Chuz Life

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tajshar2k
Posts: 2,378
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1/12/2016 12:34:31 PM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/12/2016 3:33:49 AM, kevin24018 wrote:
At 1/12/2016 1:09:38 AM, tajshar2k wrote:

Yes, but how you know that? You can't just say I won't threaten somebody, somebody needs to verify it. A permit should always be required.

background check is required on the federal level, permits are state level if required and to what extent, states differ greatly, someone will jump in and say it anyway so I may as well, the states with the strictest laws have the most gun crimes, the city of Chicago is one of the prime examples for that argument, I'm not interested in looking up stats, but i'm sure someone will.

Ok, I used to live in Chicago, so you asked the right guy. Guns laws's aren't strict due to permits. It's because a lot of guns are banned, and only until recently CCW was actually allowed. Besides, all the violence is mainly black gangs shooting other black gangs, so if you aren't involved you are pretty safe. Still I believe everybody should have a permit and a background check just as a safety measure. It shouldn't really effect law abiding citizens anyway.
"In Guns We Trust" Tajshar2k
FaustianJustice
Posts: 6,205
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1/12/2016 12:41:46 PM
Posted: 10 months ago

This could get off track. I'll answer this and then we can get back on topic. Where in the 14th amendment does it rules on marriage? Anything not numerated are left to the states.

"Or the people". Directly. If you are going to quote it, quote it all.
Here we have an advocate for Islamic arranged marriages demonstrating that children can consent to sex.
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TBR
Posts: 9,991
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1/12/2016 3:25:31 PM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/12/2016 4:48:48 AM, Chuz-Life wrote:
At 1/12/2016 3:29:16 AM, TBR wrote:
At 1/12/2016 2:04:47 AM, Maccabee wrote:
At 1/11/2016 11:52:36 PM, TBR wrote:

Buddy... I think you don't like the constitution very much if that is how you feel.

Uh no, I'm saying that the SCOTUS doesn't always rule according to the constitution. Do you deny that they ruled that slavery was ok when the Declaration of Independence and I think the constitution says that all men are created equal?

What the SCOTUS decides is the last word in what is and is not constitutional. That is... well constitutional.

Is the SCOTUS infallible?

It's a Yes or No question.

Well, aren't you demanding.

Sure they are fallible, as were the authors of the constitution. They were not gods.