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Does voting even matter

liltankjj
Posts: 430
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2/23/2016 10:29:12 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
I have for a while believed that voting on a federal level really dosesn't matter. If this is true why are we encouraged to vote so adamantly? Why do candidates campaign so hard? If this is not true and votes do count, please help me to understand how. This is my first time ever paying attention to a presidential election and also my first time voting.
TBR
Posts: 9,991
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2/23/2016 11:17:30 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/23/2016 10:29:12 PM, liltankjj wrote:
I have for a while believed that voting on a federal level really dosesn't matter. If this is true why are we encouraged to vote so adamantly? Why do candidates campaign so hard? If this is not true and votes do count, please help me to understand how. This is my first time ever paying attention to a presidential election and also my first time voting.

Well... Let me ask why you think it doesn't matter? The party platforms are NOT the same. The results of either victory NOT the same. Why on earth do you think it would NOT matter who you vote for?
liltankjj
Posts: 430
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2/24/2016 2:33:42 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/23/2016 11:17:30 PM, TBR wrote:
At 2/23/2016 10:29:12 PM, liltankjj wrote:
I have for a while believed that voting on a federal level really dosesn't matter. If this is true why are we encouraged to vote so adamantly? Why do candidates campaign so hard? If this is not true and votes do count, please help me to understand how. This is my first time ever paying attention to a presidential election and also my first time voting.

Well... Let me ask why you think it doesn't matter? The party platforms are NOT the same. The results of either victory NOT the same. Why on earth do you think it would NOT matter who you vote for?

Well, I've noticed a lot of things in just the primaries. One, in particular, the superdelegates with the DNC; furthermore, both parties have conventions that can completely ignore votes over a few deals. Another that is confusing is after primaries it is based on the electoral college. Too much to say that the voice of the people even matters.
liltankjj
Posts: 430
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2/24/2016 2:36:53 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/23/2016 10:31:40 PM, Greyparrot wrote:
it helps to determine what things the Congress is going to push for legislation and how the Congress will compromise.

The Legislative Branch is the only branch I can see voting truly effects, even though it can use some tweaking. I don't see why there is a need for electoral college in today's time for the Executive branch.
EndarkenedRationalist
Posts: 14,201
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2/24/2016 2:59:45 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/24/2016 2:33:42 PM, liltankjj wrote:
At 2/23/2016 11:17:30 PM, TBR wrote:
At 2/23/2016 10:29:12 PM, liltankjj wrote:
I have for a while believed that voting on a federal level really dosesn't matter. If this is true why are we encouraged to vote so adamantly? Why do candidates campaign so hard? If this is not true and votes do count, please help me to understand how. This is my first time ever paying attention to a presidential election and also my first time voting.

Well... Let me ask why you think it doesn't matter? The party platforms are NOT the same. The results of either victory NOT the same. Why on earth do you think it would NOT matter who you vote for?

Well, I've noticed a lot of things in just the primaries. One, in particular, the superdelegates with the DNC; furthermore, both parties have conventions that can completely ignore votes over a few deals. Another that is confusing is after primaries it is based on the electoral college. Too much to say that the voice of the people even matters.

The superdelegates would never ignore the people's voice.
liltankjj
Posts: 430
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2/24/2016 3:02:08 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/24/2016 2:59:45 PM, EndarkenedRationalist wrote:
At 2/24/2016 2:33:42 PM, liltankjj wrote:
At 2/23/2016 11:17:30 PM, TBR wrote:
At 2/23/2016 10:29:12 PM, liltankjj wrote:
I have for a while believed that voting on a federal level really dosesn't matter. If this is true why are we encouraged to vote so adamantly? Why do candidates campaign so hard? If this is not true and votes do count, please help me to understand how. This is my first time ever paying attention to a presidential election and also my first time voting.

Well... Let me ask why you think it doesn't matter? The party platforms are NOT the same. The results of either victory NOT the same. Why on earth do you think it would NOT matter who you vote for?

Well, I've noticed a lot of things in just the primaries. One, in particular, the superdelegates with the DNC; furthermore, both parties have conventions that can completely ignore votes over a few deals. Another that is confusing is after primaries it is based on the electoral college. Too much to say that the voice of the people even matters.

The superdelegates would never ignore the people's voice.
I don't know enough about them to say that this is true are false.
EndarkenedRationalist
Posts: 14,201
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2/24/2016 3:03:21 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/24/2016 3:02:08 PM, liltankjj wrote:
At 2/24/2016 2:59:45 PM, EndarkenedRationalist wrote:
At 2/24/2016 2:33:42 PM, liltankjj wrote:
At 2/23/2016 11:17:30 PM, TBR wrote:
At 2/23/2016 10:29:12 PM, liltankjj wrote:
I have for a while believed that voting on a federal level really dosesn't matter. If this is true why are we encouraged to vote so adamantly? Why do candidates campaign so hard? If this is not true and votes do count, please help me to understand how. This is my first time ever paying attention to a presidential election and also my first time voting.

Well... Let me ask why you think it doesn't matter? The party platforms are NOT the same. The results of either victory NOT the same. Why on earth do you think it would NOT matter who you vote for?

Well, I've noticed a lot of things in just the primaries. One, in particular, the superdelegates with the DNC; furthermore, both parties have conventions that can completely ignore votes over a few deals. Another that is confusing is after primaries it is based on the electoral college. Too much to say that the voice of the people even matters.

The superdelegates would never ignore the people's voice.
I don't know enough about them to say that this is true are false.

Then take my word for it.
liltankjj
Posts: 430
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2/24/2016 3:03:25 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/24/2016 3:02:08 PM, liltankjj wrote:
At 2/24/2016 2:59:45 PM, EndarkenedRationalist wrote:
At 2/24/2016 2:33:42 PM, liltankjj wrote:
At 2/23/2016 11:17:30 PM, TBR wrote:
At 2/23/2016 10:29:12 PM, liltankjj wrote:
I have for a while believed that voting on a federal level really dosesn't matter. If this is true why are we encouraged to vote so adamantly? Why do candidates campaign so hard? If this is not true and votes do count, please help me to understand how. This is my first time ever paying attention to a presidential election and also my first time voting.

Well... Let me ask why you think it doesn't matter? The party platforms are NOT the same. The results of either victory NOT the same. Why on earth do you think it would NOT matter who you vote for?

Well, I've noticed a lot of things in just the primaries. One, in particular, the superdelegates with the DNC; furthermore, both parties have conventions that can completely ignore votes over a few deals. Another that is confusing is after primaries it is based on the electoral college. Too much to say that the voice of the people even matters.

The superdelegates would never ignore the people's voice.
I don't know enough about them to say that this is true or* false.
liltankjj
Posts: 430
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2/24/2016 3:08:41 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/24/2016 3:03:21 PM, EndarkenedRationalist wrote:
At 2/24/2016 3:02:08 PM, liltankjj wrote:
At 2/24/2016 2:59:45 PM, EndarkenedRationalist wrote:
At 2/24/2016 2:33:42 PM, liltankjj wrote:
At 2/23/2016 11:17:30 PM, TBR wrote:
At 2/23/2016 10:29:12 PM, liltankjj wrote:
I have for a while believed that voting on a federal level really dosesn't matter. If this is true why are we encouraged to vote so adamantly? Why do candidates campaign so hard? If this is not true and votes do count, please help me to understand how. This is my first time ever paying attention to a presidential election and also my first time voting.

Well... Let me ask why you think it doesn't matter? The party platforms are NOT the same. The results of either victory NOT the same. Why on earth do you think it would NOT matter who you vote for?

Well, I've noticed a lot of things in just the primaries. One, in particular, the superdelegates with the DNC; furthermore, both parties have conventions that can completely ignore votes over a few deals. Another that is confusing is after primaries it is based on the electoral college. Too much to say that the voice of the people even matters.

The superdelegates would never ignore the people's voice.
I don't know enough about them to say that this is true are false.

Then take my word for it.
That's half done. I don't take anyone's word for things without further research and forming my own opinion. Nice try though.
imabench
Posts: 21,206
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2/24/2016 3:22:43 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/23/2016 10:29:12 PM, liltankjj wrote:
I have for a while believed that voting on a federal level really dosesn't matter. If this is true why are we encouraged to vote so adamantly? Why do candidates campaign so hard? If this is not true and votes do count, please help me to understand how. This is my first time ever paying attention to a presidential election and also my first time voting.

In a presidential election, swing states hold far greater power than other states in determining who will be president since the rest of the nation is so polarized that a swing state could determine the outcome of an entire election (Florida 2000, Ohio 2004). A Democrat in Texas overall has no voice or power with their vote, as does a Republican in California, but if you suddenly put those two in swing states like Florida or Ohio, then that same vote now holds significantly greater weight because now they are cast in a state that could very well prove to be the tie-breaker for who emerges as president.
Kevin24018 : "He's just so mean it makes me want to ball up my fists and stamp on the ground"

7/14/16 = The Presidency Dies

DDO: THE MOVIE = http://www.debate.org...
http://www.debate.org...

VP of DDO from Dec 14th 2014 to Jan 1st 2015
imabench
Posts: 21,206
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2/24/2016 3:52:20 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/24/2016 3:08:41 PM, liltankjj wrote:
At 2/24/2016 3:03:21 PM, EndarkenedRationalist wrote:
At 2/24/2016 3:02:08 PM, liltankjj wrote:
At 2/24/2016 2:59:45 PM, EndarkenedRationalist wrote:
At 2/24/2016 2:33:42 PM, liltankjj wrote:
At 2/23/2016 11:17:30 PM, TBR wrote:
At 2/23/2016 10:29:12 PM, liltankjj wrote:
I have for a while believed that voting on a federal level really dosesn't matter. If this is true why are we encouraged to vote so adamantly? Why do candidates campaign so hard? If this is not true and votes do count, please help me to understand how. This is my first time ever paying attention to a presidential election and also my first time voting.

Well... Let me ask why you think it doesn't matter? The party platforms are NOT the same. The results of either victory NOT the same. Why on earth do you think it would NOT matter who you vote for?

Well, I've noticed a lot of things in just the primaries. One, in particular, the superdelegates with the DNC; furthermore, both parties have conventions that can completely ignore votes over a few deals. Another that is confusing is after primaries it is based on the electoral college. Too much to say that the voice of the people even matters.

The superdelegates would never ignore the people's voice.
I don't know enough about them to say that this is true are false.

Then take my word for it.
That's half done. I don't take anyone's word for things without further research and forming my own opinion. Nice try though.

Just throwing this out there: Super-delegates only make up 20% of the vote at the Democratic Convention, meaning that delegates assigned by primary results make up the other 80%. Superdelegates only have enough influence in choosing a winner in very close primary contests, like the one in 2008. If a candidate wins primary races by a large enough margin, then superdelegates wouldnt be able to change the outcome even if all of them united against the winning candidate.

http://www.bloombergview.com...

So it can be argued that a vote doesnt matter in a close primary contest due to superdelegates, but if one candidate pulls away from the rest of the field substantially (like Romney did for the GOP in 2012), the argument/worry becomes irrelevant.
Kevin24018 : "He's just so mean it makes me want to ball up my fists and stamp on the ground"

7/14/16 = The Presidency Dies

DDO: THE MOVIE = http://www.debate.org...
http://www.debate.org...

VP of DDO from Dec 14th 2014 to Jan 1st 2015
liltankjj
Posts: 430
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2/24/2016 6:16:27 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/24/2016 3:22:43 PM, imabench wrote:
At 2/23/2016 10:29:12 PM, liltankjj wrote:
I have for a while believed that voting on a federal level really dosesn't matter. If this is true why are we encouraged to vote so adamantly? Why do candidates campaign so hard? If this is not true and votes do count, please help me to understand how. This is my first time ever paying attention to a presidential election and also my first time voting.

In a presidential election, swing states hold far greater power than other states in determining who will be president since the rest of the nation is so polarized that a swing state could determine the outcome of an entire election (Florida 2000, Ohio 2004). A Democrat in Texas overall has no voice or power with their vote, as does a Republican in California, but if you suddenly put those two in swing states like Florida or Ohio, then that same vote now holds significantly greater weight because now they are cast in a state that could very well prove to be the tie-breaker for who emerges as president.

So it's better to live in a swing state if I'm an independent or a state that coincides with my party affiliation am I right?
liltankjj
Posts: 430
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2/24/2016 6:24:03 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/24/2016 3:52:20 PM, imabench wrote:
At 2/24/2016 3:08:41 PM, liltankjj wrote:
At 2/24/2016 3:03:21 PM, EndarkenedRationalist wrote:
At 2/24/2016 3:02:08 PM, liltankjj wrote:
At 2/24/2016 2:59:45 PM, EndarkenedRationalist wrote:
At 2/24/2016 2:33:42 PM, liltankjj wrote:
At 2/23/2016 11:17:30 PM, TBR wrote:
At 2/23/2016 10:29:12 PM, liltankjj wrote:
I have for a while believed that voting on a federal level really dosesn't matter. If this is true why are we encouraged to vote so adamantly? Why do candidates campaign so hard? If this is not true and votes do count, please help me to understand how. This is my first time ever paying attention to a presidential election and also my first time voting.

Well... Let me ask why you think it doesn't matter? The party platforms are NOT the same. The results of either victory NOT the same. Why on earth do you think it would NOT matter who you vote for?

Well, I've noticed a lot of things in just the primaries. One, in particular, the superdelegates with the DNC; furthermore, both parties have conventions that can completely ignore votes over a few deals. Another that is confusing is after primaries it is based on the electoral college. Too much to say that the voice of the people even matters.

The superdelegates would never ignore the people's voice.
I don't know enough about them to say that this is true are false.

Then take my word for it.
That's half done. I don't take anyone's word for things without further research and forming my own opinion. Nice try though.

Just throwing this out there: Super-delegates only make up 20% of the vote at the Democratic Convention, meaning that delegates assigned by primary results make up the other 80%. Superdelegates only have enough influence in choosing a winner in very close primary contests, like the one in 2008. If a candidate wins primary races by a large enough margin, then superdelegates wouldnt be able to change the outcome even if all of them united against the winning candidate.

http://www.bloombergview.com...

So it can be argued that a vote doesnt matter in a close primary contest due to superdelegates, but if one candidate pulls away from the rest of the field substantially (like Romney did for the GOP in 2012), the argument/worry becomes irrelevant.

very well. What you have explained is at a primary level which is determined by each respective party. If I'm not mistaken Superdelegates are unique to the Democratic primary. But delegates sound funky in general to me.
liltankjj
Posts: 430
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2/24/2016 6:25:24 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
Just throwing this out there: Super-delegates only make up 20% of the vote at the Democratic Convention, meaning that delegates assigned by primary results make up the other 80%. Superdelegates only have enough influence in choosing a winner in very close primary contests, like the one in 2008. If a candidate wins primary races by a large enough margin, then superdelegates wouldnt be able to change the outcome even if all of them united against the winning candidate.

http://www.bloombergview.com...

So it can be argued that a vote doesnt matter in a close primary contest due to superdelegates, but if one candidate pulls away from the rest of the field substantially (like Romney did for the GOP in 2012), the argument/worry becomes irrelevant.

Very well. What you have explained is at a primary level which is determined by each respective party. If I'm not mistaken Superdelegates are unique to the Democratic primary. But delegates sound funky in general to me.
imabench
Posts: 21,206
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2/24/2016 6:27:40 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/24/2016 6:16:27 PM, liltankjj wrote:
At 2/24/2016 3:22:43 PM, imabench wrote:
At 2/23/2016 10:29:12 PM, liltankjj wrote:
I have for a while believed that voting on a federal level really dosesn't matter. If this is true why are we encouraged to vote so adamantly? Why do candidates campaign so hard? If this is not true and votes do count, please help me to understand how. This is my first time ever paying attention to a presidential election and also my first time voting.

In a presidential election, swing states hold far greater power than other states in determining who will be president since the rest of the nation is so polarized that a swing state could determine the outcome of an entire election (Florida 2000, Ohio 2004). A Democrat in Texas overall has no voice or power with their vote, as does a Republican in California, but if you suddenly put those two in swing states like Florida or Ohio, then that same vote now holds significantly greater weight because now they are cast in a state that could very well prove to be the tie-breaker for who emerges as president.

So it's better to live in a swing state if I'm an independent

Its better to live in a swing state no matter what your party affiliation is since you have more weight in determining who actually becomes the president

or a state that coincides with my party affiliation am I right?

Pretty much
Kevin24018 : "He's just so mean it makes me want to ball up my fists and stamp on the ground"

7/14/16 = The Presidency Dies

DDO: THE MOVIE = http://www.debate.org...
http://www.debate.org...

VP of DDO from Dec 14th 2014 to Jan 1st 2015
liltankjj
Posts: 430
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2/24/2016 6:29:21 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/24/2016 6:27:40 PM, imabench wrote:
At 2/24/2016 6:16:27 PM, liltankjj wrote:
At 2/24/2016 3:22:43 PM, imabench wrote:
At 2/23/2016 10:29:12 PM, liltankjj wrote:
I have for a while believed that voting on a federal level really dosesn't matter. If this is true why are we encouraged to vote so adamantly? Why do candidates campaign so hard? If this is not true and votes do count, please help me to understand how. This is my first time ever paying attention to a presidential election and also my first time voting.

In a presidential election, swing states hold far greater power than other states in determining who will be president since the rest of the nation is so polarized that a swing state could determine the outcome of an entire election (Florida 2000, Ohio 2004). A Democrat in Texas overall has no voice or power with their vote, as does a Republican in California, but if you suddenly put those two in swing states like Florida or Ohio, then that same vote now holds significantly greater weight because now they are cast in a state that could very well prove to be the tie-breaker for who emerges as president.

So it's better to live in a swing state if I'm an independent

Its better to live in a swing state no matter what your party affiliation is since you have more weight in determining who actually becomes the president

or a state that coincides with my party affiliation am I right?

Pretty much

Funny game we Americans play.
liltankjj
Posts: 430
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2/24/2016 6:30:03 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/24/2016 6:27:40 PM, imabench wrote:
At 2/24/2016 6:16:27 PM, liltankjj wrote:
At 2/24/2016 3:22:43 PM, imabench wrote:
At 2/23/2016 10:29:12 PM, liltankjj wrote:
I have for a while believed that voting on a federal level really dosesn't matter. If this is true why are we encouraged to vote so adamantly? Why do candidates campaign so hard? If this is not true and votes do count, please help me to understand how. This is my first time ever paying attention to a presidential election and also my first time voting.

In a presidential election, swing states hold far greater power than other states in determining who will be president since the rest of the nation is so polarized that a swing state could determine the outcome of an entire election (Florida 2000, Ohio 2004). A Democrat in Texas overall has no voice or power with their vote, as does a Republican in California, but if you suddenly put those two in swing states like Florida or Ohio, then that same vote now holds significantly greater weight because now they are cast in a state that could very well prove to be the tie-breaker for who emerges as president.

So it's better to live in a swing state if I'm an independent

Its better to live in a swing state no matter what your party affiliation is since you have more weight in determining who actually becomes the president

or a state that coincides with my party affiliation am I right?

Pretty much

Thanks for the insight.
Greyparrot
Posts: 14,240
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2/24/2016 7:57:49 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/24/2016 6:27:40 PM, imabench wrote:

So it's better to live in a swing state if I'm an independent

Its better to live in a swing state no matter what your party affiliation is since you have more weight in determining who actually becomes the president

or a state that coincides with my party affiliation am I right?

Pretty much

Bench...selecting presidents since the stone age.