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Podesta Email

slo1
Posts: 4,351
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10/20/2016 3:13:31 PM
Posted: 1 month ago
http://www.vox.com...

This is an excellent article that gives a good overview of what is in the wikileaks dump of podesta emails.

I agree with the underlining premise that the revelations are not surprising and a person's view on the details were predetermined.

I find this level of hidden motives and political manuvering very dishartening. That includes the places I have worked at.

If I ran a political party, I would have open email, meaning they would be published. Only personal private info like phone numbers would be redacted.

That is why I give zero credence to claims that Trump is an outsider and can take on the establishment. Anyone who can operate with the typical level of privacy in public office becomes the establishment simply by the fact that information is hidden.

Trump has a consistent message on the importance of secrets and surprise from a military standpoint. It would not be unreasonable to assume he would use such tactics in all areas.

You can argue he is rich and wouldn't be tempted by the power to further enrich himself. I call bs on that argument and respond that may be your hunch, but you don't really know.

We all squabble all day trying to decipher motives and conflicts of interest. Would it be nice to have more information to make those decisions?

One of Obama's biggest failures was not delivering on his commitment to be more accountable via opening visibility into government.

If we are going to eliminate the moral hazards and abuse of power we are going to need more openness and information, not authoritarianism and lack of over sight.

Power to the people means more information not less.
Stymie13
Posts: 2,162
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10/20/2016 3:32:35 PM
Posted: 1 month ago
At 10/20/2016 3:13:31 PM, slo1 wrote:
http://www.vox.com...

This is an excellent article that gives a good overview of what is in the wikileaks dump of podesta emails.

I agree with the underlining premise that the revelations are not surprising and a person's view on the details were predetermined.

I find this level of hidden motives and political manuvering very dishartening. That includes the places I have worked at.

If I ran a political party, I would have open email, meaning they would be published. Only personal private info like phone numbers would be redacted.

That is why I give zero credence to claims that Trump is an outsider and can take on the establishment. Anyone who can operate with the typical level of privacy in public office becomes the establishment simply by the fact that information is hidden.

Trump has a consistent message on the importance of secrets and surprise from a military standpoint. It would not be unreasonable to assume he would use such tactics in all areas.

You can argue he is rich and wouldn't be tempted by the power to further enrich himself. I call bs on that argument and respond that may be your hunch, but you don't really know.

We all squabble all day trying to decipher motives and conflicts of interest. Would it be nice to have more information to make those decisions?

One of Obama's biggest failures was not delivering on his commitment to be more accountable via opening visibility into government.

If we are going to eliminate the moral hazards and abuse of power we are going to need more openness and information, not authoritarianism and lack of over sight.

Power to the people means more information not less.

Sounds like you want Sarbanbes Oxley to apply to all gov workers?
kevin24018
Posts: 1,880
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10/20/2016 3:58:51 PM
Posted: 1 month ago
At 10/20/2016 3:13:31 PM, slo1 wrote:
http://www.vox.com...

This is an excellent article that gives a good overview of what is in the wikileaks dump of podesta emails.

I agree with the underlining premise that the revelations are not surprising and a person's view on the details were predetermined.

I find this level of hidden motives and political manuvering very dishartening. That includes the places I have worked at.

If I ran a political party, I would have open email, meaning they would be published. Only personal private info like phone numbers would be redacted.

That is why I give zero credence to claims that Trump is an outsider and can take on the establishment. Anyone who can operate with the typical level of privacy in public office becomes the establishment simply by the fact that information is hidden.

Trump has a consistent message on the importance of secrets and surprise from a military standpoint. It would not be unreasonable to assume he would use such tactics in all areas.

You can argue he is rich and wouldn't be tempted by the power to further enrich himself. I call bs on that argument and respond that may be your hunch, but you don't really know.

We all squabble all day trying to decipher motives and conflicts of interest. Would it be nice to have more information to make those decisions?

One of Obama's biggest failures was not delivering on his commitment to be more accountable via opening visibility into government.

If we are going to eliminate the moral hazards and abuse of power we are going to need more openness and information, not authoritarianism and lack of over sight.

Power to the people means more information not less.

you and many are going to be in for a huge world of disappointment if you think openness etc is going to be part of the future Clinton administration, after all that has been said and done, she knows she's untouchable, Trump would be more transparent because of his ego if not being as deviously clever as Clinton. Even the FOIA request are being adequately thwarted with either delays or deletions. It's ironic how people demands more transparency and accountability and yet we clearing are heading in the opposite direction. People are completely fine withe burying their heads in the sand.
Stymie13
Posts: 2,162
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10/20/2016 4:34:03 PM
Posted: 1 month ago
At 10/20/2016 3:58:51 PM, kevin24018 wrote:
At 10/20/2016 3:13:31 PM, slo1 wrote:
http://www.vox.com...

This is an excellent article that gives a good overview of what is in the wikileaks dump of podesta emails.

I agree with the underlining premise that the revelations are not surprising and a person's view on the details were predetermined.

I find this level of hidden motives and political manuvering very dishartening. That includes the places I have worked at.

If I ran a political party, I would have open email, meaning they would be published. Only personal private info like phone numbers would be redacted.

That is why I give zero credence to claims that Trump is an outsider and can take on the establishment. Anyone who can operate with the typical level of privacy in public office becomes the establishment simply by the fact that information is hidden.

Trump has a consistent message on the importance of secrets and surprise from a military standpoint. It would not be unreasonable to assume he would use such tactics in all areas.

You can argue he is rich and wouldn't be tempted by the power to further enrich himself. I call bs on that argument and respond that may be your hunch, but you don't really know.

We all squabble all day trying to decipher motives and conflicts of interest. Would it be nice to have more information to make those decisions?

One of Obama's biggest failures was not delivering on his commitment to be more accountable via opening visibility into government.

If we are going to eliminate the moral hazards and abuse of power we are going to need more openness and information, not authoritarianism and lack of over sight.

Power to the people means more information not less.

you and many are going to be in for a huge world of disappointment if you think openness etc is going to be part of the future Clinton administration, after all that has been said and done, she knows she's untouchable, Trump would be more transparent because of his ego if not being as deviously clever as Clinton. Even the FOIA request are being adequately thwarted with either delays or deletions. It's ironic how people demands more transparency and accountability and yet we clearing are heading in the opposite direction. People are completely fine withe burying their heads in the sand.

People: I want transparency!
Gov: look over there...
Watchdog group: we filed FOIA and there's some fishy things...
Gov: those are biased sources and have been debunked.
Watchdog group: how were they debunked
Gov: look over there...
People: we forgot what we wanted but we didn't get it
Gov: look over there, we have a program that will...
People: yay!!!
Watchdog group: why do we have to talk to the FBI?
slo1
Posts: 4,351
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10/20/2016 4:48:05 PM
Posted: 1 month ago
At 10/20/2016 3:58:51 PM, kevin24018 wrote:
At 10/20/2016 3:13:31 PM, slo1 wrote:
http://www.vox.com...

This is an excellent article that gives a good overview of what is in the wikileaks dump of podesta emails.

I agree with the underlining premise that the revelations are not surprising and a person's view on the details were predetermined.

I find this level of hidden motives and political manuvering very dishartening. That includes the places I have worked at.

If I ran a political party, I would have open email, meaning they would be published. Only personal private info like phone numbers would be redacted.

That is why I give zero credence to claims that Trump is an outsider and can take on the establishment. Anyone who can operate with the typical level of privacy in public office becomes the establishment simply by the fact that information is hidden.

Trump has a consistent message on the importance of secrets and surprise from a military standpoint. It would not be unreasonable to assume he would use such tactics in all areas.

You can argue he is rich and wouldn't be tempted by the power to further enrich himself. I call bs on that argument and respond that may be your hunch, but you don't really know.

We all squabble all day trying to decipher motives and conflicts of interest. Would it be nice to have more information to make those decisions?

One of Obama's biggest failures was not delivering on his commitment to be more accountable via opening visibility into government.

If we are going to eliminate the moral hazards and abuse of power we are going to need more openness and information, not authoritarianism and lack of over sight.

Power to the people means more information not less.

you and many are going to be in for a huge world of disappointment if you think openness etc is going to be part of the future Clinton administration, after all that has been said and done, she knows she's untouchable, Trump would be more transparent because of his ego if not being as deviously clever as Clinton. Even the FOIA request are being adequately thwarted with either delays or deletions. It's ironic how people demands more transparency and accountability and yet we clearing are heading in the opposite direction. People are completely fine withe burying their heads in the sand.

I will not be disappointed as I have no illusions about Hillary bringing in a new level of accountability and openness. In fact the article I posted mentions that she wishes there was less opportunity for the media to have access to certain information.

I have zero faith that Trump would bring a new level of openness for the reasons already described.
slo1
Posts: 4,351
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10/20/2016 4:53:20 PM
Posted: 1 month ago
At 10/20/2016 3:32:35 PM, Stymie13 wrote:
At 10/20/2016 3:13:31 PM, slo1 wrote:
http://www.vox.com...

This is an excellent article that gives a good overview of what is in the wikileaks dump of podesta emails.

I agree with the underlining premise that the revelations are not surprising and a person's view on the details were predetermined.

I find this level of hidden motives and political manuvering very dishartening. That includes the places I have worked at.

If I ran a political party, I would have open email, meaning they would be published. Only personal private info like phone numbers would be redacted.

That is why I give zero credence to claims that Trump is an outsider and can take on the establishment. Anyone who can operate with the typical level of privacy in public office becomes the establishment simply by the fact that information is hidden.

Trump has a consistent message on the importance of secrets and surprise from a military standpoint. It would not be unreasonable to assume he would use such tactics in all areas.

You can argue he is rich and wouldn't be tempted by the power to further enrich himself. I call bs on that argument and respond that may be your hunch, but you don't really know.

We all squabble all day trying to decipher motives and conflicts of interest. Would it be nice to have more information to make those decisions?

One of Obama's biggest failures was not delivering on his commitment to be more accountable via opening visibility into government.

If we are going to eliminate the moral hazards and abuse of power we are going to need more openness and information, not authoritarianism and lack of over sight.

Power to the people means more information not less.

Sounds like you want Sarbanbes Oxley to apply to all gov workers?

No, but I do think if one wants to serve government, especially the highest levels all businesses and non-profit should be relinquished via blind trusts for the duration of their service.

I don't believe any meeting with a public officer should be private with exception of national security or investigations. There obviously need to be instances of privacy, but we as a nation and in business error way too far to hide all communication.
Stymie13
Posts: 2,162
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10/20/2016 4:59:32 PM
Posted: 1 month ago
At 10/20/2016 4:53:20 PM, slo1 wrote:
At 10/20/2016 3:32:35 PM, Stymie13 wrote:
At 10/20/2016 3:13:31 PM, slo1 wrote:
http://www.vox.com...

This is an excellent article that gives a good overview of what is in the wikileaks dump of podesta emails.

I agree with the underlining premise that the revelations are not surprising and a person's view on the details were predetermined.

I find this level of hidden motives and political manuvering very dishartening. That includes the places I have worked at.

If I ran a political party, I would have open email, meaning they would be published. Only personal private info like phone numbers would be redacted.

That is why I give zero credence to claims that Trump is an outsider and can take on the establishment. Anyone who can operate with the typical level of privacy in public office becomes the establishment simply by the fact that information is hidden.

Trump has a consistent message on the importance of secrets and surprise from a military standpoint. It would not be unreasonable to assume he would use such tactics in all areas.

You can argue he is rich and wouldn't be tempted by the power to further enrich himself. I call bs on that argument and respond that may be your hunch, but you don't really know.

We all squabble all day trying to decipher motives and conflicts of interest. Would it be nice to have more information to make those decisions?

One of Obama's biggest failures was not delivering on his commitment to be more accountable via opening visibility into government.

If we are going to eliminate the moral hazards and abuse of power we are going to need more openness and information, not authoritarianism and lack of over sight.

Power to the people means more information not less.

Sounds like you want Sarbanbes Oxley to apply to all gov workers?

No, but I do think if one wants to serve government, especially the highest levels all businesses and non-profit should be relinquished via blind trusts for the duration of their service.

I don't believe any meeting with a public officer should be private with exception of national security or investigations. There obviously need to be instances of privacy, but we as a nation and in business error way too far to hide all communication.

That begs the question: SOX was for transparency in business due to outrage over Enron and worldcom. So are we more outraged over those vs our government? A step further: why do we have to file to get info?
kevin24018
Posts: 1,880
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10/20/2016 5:32:54 PM
Posted: 1 month ago
At 10/20/2016 4:59:32 PM, Stymie13 wrote:
At 10/20/2016 4:53:20 PM, slo1 wrote:
At 10/20/2016 3:32:35 PM, Stymie13 wrote:
At 10/20/2016 3:13:31 PM, slo1 wrote:
http://www.vox.com...

This is an excellent article that gives a good overview of what is in the wikileaks dump of podesta emails.

I agree with the underlining premise that the revelations are not surprising and a person's view on the details were predetermined.

I find this level of hidden motives and political manuvering very dishartening. That includes the places I have worked at.

If I ran a political party, I would have open email, meaning they would be published. Only personal private info like phone numbers would be redacted.

That is why I give zero credence to claims that Trump is an outsider and can take on the establishment. Anyone who can operate with the typical level of privacy in public office becomes the establishment simply by the fact that information is hidden.

Trump has a consistent message on the importance of secrets and surprise from a military standpoint. It would not be unreasonable to assume he would use such tactics in all areas.

You can argue he is rich and wouldn't be tempted by the power to further enrich himself. I call bs on that argument and respond that may be your hunch, but you don't really know.

We all squabble all day trying to decipher motives and conflicts of interest. Would it be nice to have more information to make those decisions?

One of Obama's biggest failures was not delivering on his commitment to be more accountable via opening visibility into government.

If we are going to eliminate the moral hazards and abuse of power we are going to need more openness and information, not authoritarianism and lack of over sight.

Power to the people means more information not less.

Sounds like you want Sarbanbes Oxley to apply to all gov workers?

No, but I do think if one wants to serve government, especially the highest levels all businesses and non-profit should be relinquished via blind trusts for the duration of their service.

I don't believe any meeting with a public officer should be private with exception of national security or investigations. There obviously need to be instances of privacy, but we as a nation and in business error way too far to hide all communication.

That begs the question: SOX was for transparency in business due to outrage over Enron and worldcom. So are we more outraged over those vs our government? A step further: why do we have to file to get info?

the sheeple don't understand the "proper channels" are made to frustrate and over complicate to get what you want so that most won't bother or they have a way to deny that sounds legit, it's what red tape is all about and the very backbone which enables them to control and manipulate whatever they wish.
Stymie13
Posts: 2,162
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10/20/2016 5:42:22 PM
Posted: 1 month ago
At 10/20/2016 5:32:54 PM, kevin24018 wrote:
At 10/20/2016 4:59:32 PM, Stymie13 wrote:
At 10/20/2016 4:53:20 PM, slo1 wrote:
At 10/20/2016 3:32:35 PM, Stymie13 wrote:
At 10/20/2016 3:13:31 PM, slo1 wrote:
http://www.vox.com...

This is an excellent article that gives a good overview of what is in the wikileaks dump of podesta emails.

I agree with the underlining premise that the revelations are not surprising and a person's view on the details were predetermined.

I find this level of hidden motives and political manuvering very dishartening. That includes the places I have worked at.

If I ran a political party, I would have open email, meaning they would be published. Only personal private info like phone numbers would be redacted.

That is why I give zero credence to claims that Trump is an outsider and can take on the establishment. Anyone who can operate with the typical level of privacy in public office becomes the establishment simply by the fact that information is hidden.

Trump has a consistent message on the importance of secrets and surprise from a military standpoint. It would not be unreasonable to assume he would use such tactics in all areas.

You can argue he is rich and wouldn't be tempted by the power to further enrich himself. I call bs on that argument and respond that may be your hunch, but you don't really know.

We all squabble all day trying to decipher motives and conflicts of interest. Would it be nice to have more information to make those decisions?

One of Obama's biggest failures was not delivering on his commitment to be more accountable via opening visibility into government.

If we are going to eliminate the moral hazards and abuse of power we are going to need more openness and information, not authoritarianism and lack of over sight.

Power to the people means more information not less.

Sounds like you want Sarbanbes Oxley to apply to all gov workers?

No, but I do think if one wants to serve government, especially the highest levels all businesses and non-profit should be relinquished via blind trusts for the duration of their service.

I don't believe any meeting with a public officer should be private with exception of national security or investigations. There obviously need to be instances of privacy, but we as a nation and in business error way too far to hide all communication.

That begs the question: SOX was for transparency in business due to outrage over Enron and worldcom. So are we more outraged over those vs our government? A step further: why do we have to file to get info?

the sheeple don't understand the "proper channels" are made to frustrate and over complicate to get what you want so that most won't bother or they have a way to deny that sounds legit, it's what red tape is all about and the very backbone which enables them to control and manipulate whatever they wish.

Unfortunately you are right. Its just boggling we put more scrutinize on company es managing money than the entity that creates and controls money... and everything else.