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Peepette
Posts: 1,238
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11/16/2016 12:10:07 AM
Posted: 3 weeks ago
The Republican Party has catered to the rich and uses the disenfranchisement amongst the population to their advantage. The white nationalist movement, their creation through economic policy, is used to sure up their wealthy members with Caucasian blue collar voters. Spending deficits they create don't matter to them because they are used to gain popular support and can be passed to the next Democratic administration; a vicious cycle. Bush did it, now Trump.

Those who think that Trump is anti-establishment and will save their sorry arses are in for a surprise. With the Republicans behind him, he'll get most of what he wants, less regulation on Wall Street, reversing Frank Dodd which is meant to keep the banks from repeating 2008 or Wells Fargo; a new swindle or crash is in the making. With Harold Hamm on Energy an upshot in off shore drilling and most likely also in our national parks will occur. Fracking and ground water contamination will become an issue. Myron Ebell, a climate change denier, will head the EPA loosening regulations that will be felt here and abroad for years. No worries, the second coming is around the corner, breathable air, clean water and desertification is not an issue. There will be no manufacturing jobs returning to the US, they are gone. With corporatist protections in place they have no impetuous to move back especially when cheap labor and even looser EP standards are in place elsewhere; continued downward pressure on US wages.
Peepette
Posts: 1,238
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11/16/2016 12:11:40 AM
Posted: 3 weeks ago
An impending trade war with China and possible tariffs might cause China to dump their holdings of US Treasury bills devaluating the dollar. For Chinese goods and US manufactures in China who import, cost to purchase will be up 15% or more; slowing consumer spending. China could also ban or highly tax US imports; US jobs lost. Much the same effect with Mexico, essentially taxing imported US goods and increased costs down the supply chain. Spare parts for US made goods from Mexico and China will follow with increases. Our products will be less competitive abroad, more US jobs loss and a recession.

The rich enjoy their tax cuts, sit on some money, invest in foreign money markets due to our dollar"s instability, and stock buy backs will run up the Dow Jones and the S&P painting a very rosy picture of the economy. A little up-tick in job creation initially, but this will crash and burn in a few years time. Very little of the money in tax breaks will hit the ground floor economy; continuation of Bush & Reaganomics. Everything in economic history foretells the disaster that we are about to face, it seems the Republicans have not learned or have chosen to ignore the obvious.

http://www.npr.org...
http://www.redstate.com...
http://www.truth-out.org...
http://www.truth-out.org...
Devilry
Posts: 464
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11/16/2016 12:37:42 AM
Posted: 3 weeks ago
At 11/16/2016 12:36:44 AM, Peepette wrote:
At 11/16/2016 12:20:12 AM, Devilry wrote:
That is a nice write-up dude.

Dudette, thanks

Oh, I should have figured with the astrology! lol
: : : At 11/15/2016 6:22:17 PM, Greyparrot wrote:
: That's not racism. Thats economics.
Peepette
Posts: 1,238
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11/16/2016 5:39:55 PM
Posted: 3 weeks ago
At 11/16/2016 4:33:03 PM, Lynx_N wrote:
I just wanna know one thing: Will he eradicate ISIS altogether?

It looks like Giuliani is in the top space to becoming Secretary of State with no real foreign policy experience and is a big pro spread of democracy supporter. He's not above bending the rules if there's a buck to be made (Qatar, Iran and foreign business dealings). He's big on surveillance at the expense of privacy here and abroad. He has made remarks that nuking Iran is not out of the question if they were to develop a nuke; he's more aggressive in reaction with little depth. Newt Gingrich, second in line has a Ph.D. in modern European history and is more diplomatically driven, not a war hawk. Gingrich has an understanding the the Middle East culture is significantly different than ours and is part of the equation to lessening ISIS activities. Newt would be a better choice in bringing the various non-ISIS factions together under a more unified front.
MakeSensePeopleDont
Posts: 1,106
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11/16/2016 5:56:43 PM
Posted: 3 weeks ago
At 11/16/2016 12:10:07 AM, Peepette wrote:
The Republican Party has catered to the rich and uses the disenfranchisement :amongst the population to their advantage.

Disenfranchisement? Really? How exactly?

The white nationalist movement, their creation through economic policy, is used to :sure up their wealthy members with Caucasian blue collar voters.

White people = racist -- We can dab that square on the "How to left-wing" bingo card. That's almost a free square at this point.

Could you at least be a little creative? Maybe throw in the occasional "Equinsu Ocha" for variety?

Spending deficits they create don't matter to them because they are used to gain popular support and can be passed to the next Democratic administration; a vicious cycle. Bush did it, now Trump.


Ah....blame Bush.......we can check that one off the list and dab that square.

Those who think that Trump is anti-establishment and will save their sorry arses are in for a surprise. With the Republicans behind him, he'll get most of what he wants, less regulation on Wall Street, reversing Frank Dodd which is meant to keep the banks :from repeating 2008 or Wells Fargo;

Hmmmm.....Copying Bill Clinton's horrible failure in the 1990's, Democrats once again force banks to hand out subprime mortgages to people they know can't afford the payments -- while knowing the banks and housing market will crash and burn horribly.

Democrats swoop in like a hero and throw tax dollars at the banks...then airdrops a 2,300 page pimp slap on them which allows government to quietly start gaining more control over the banks and insurance companies.

Hmmmmm.......all republican's faults.....check.

a new swindle or crash is in the making. With Harold Hamm on Energy an upshot in :off shore drilling and most likely also in our national parks will occur.

Interesting one here.....Not allowed to drill for oil in U.S. National Parks, but Republicans will somehow do it anyway.

That one is NOT on my BINGO board.

Fracking and ground water contamination will become an issue.

You mean like how Flint, MI got bent over...no lube?

OK, sooooo Democrats contaminate potable water supply for large population base in Flint, MI....redirect attention to Republicans by saying they are going to do that.....check.

Myron Ebell, a climate change denier, will head the EPA loosening regulations that will :be felt here and abroad for years.

...throw a hissy fit against Republicans because you were asked to provide evidence to a claim and have nothing verifiable........check.

Every warming, cooling, and "climate change" model we have used has turned out to be completely wrong -- every prediction has been wrong -- Ice caps shrink in one spot, grow in another -- no evidence available that can pass basic scientific method process nor the results recreated for proofing and validation -- ignore countries like China who actually ARE sh!++ing all over everything....

No worries, the second coming is around the corner, breathable air, clean water and :desertification is not an issue.

The middle east and north Africa were once lush, fertile lands, sustaining multitudes of life, including humans for millennia, then poof....gone. We must be polluting the Earth so bad now that our climate change has gained the ability to time travel, changing the course of history.

Failure to understand global weather patterns and shifts while ignoring historical data.....check.

There will be no manufacturing jobs returning to the US, they are gone. With corporatist protections in place they have no impetuous to move back especially when cheap labor and even looser EP standards are in place elsewhere; continued :downward pressure on US wages.

Mentioning those other countries and how bad their polluting is, while somehow willfully ignoring them completely when discussing the "climate change" and EPA points previously......check.
FaustianJustice
Posts: 6,225
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11/16/2016 6:33:31 PM
Posted: 3 weeks ago
Fracking and ground water contamination will become an issue.

You mean like how Flint, MI got bent over...no lube?

OK, sooooo Democrats contaminate potable water supply for large population base in Flint, MI....redirect attention to Republicans by saying they are going to do that.....check.

The water supply was not contaminated. With the change in source waters, treatment processes needed to change to accommodate for that. The water was more aggressive than the previous source, causing the lead in the pipes of the distribution system to get leeched out. These pipes should have been replaced a long time ago due to the SDWA, but since the original source water was not aggressive, the problem was masked. No sense in spending money on a problem that doesn't exist (yet).

On the flip side, fracking directly effects source waters.
Here we have an advocate for Islamic arranged marriages demonstrating that children can consent to sex.
http://www.debate.org...
MakeSensePeopleDont
Posts: 1,106
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11/16/2016 6:51:29 PM
Posted: 3 weeks ago
At 11/16/2016 12:11:40 AM, Peepette wrote:
An impending trade war with China and possible tariffs might cause China to dump their holdings of US Treasury bills :devaluating the dollar.

China has already threatened to claim bonds back around 2012, utter failure.

Western nations have been buying U.S. bonds from China since 2012, to shut China up.

China engaging in a trade war with the U.S. will trigger ally nation agreements which also end trade and business with China, as well as complete and instant shutdown of any and all businesses and consumers from doing business with China in any way. Within 6 months, China's false economy would completely crash and the lack of food and basic necessity imports would further impoverish Chinese citizens and begin a slow and painful starvation of their population. China does not stand a chance in a trade war with the U.S.

For Chinese goods and US manufactures in China who import, cost to purchase will be up 15% or more; slowing consumer :spending.

Nope...imports and exports with China would actually cease completely and any businesses like Apple, operating in China would lose access to their plants and factories over their immediately.

China could also ban or highly tax US imports.

There is already an additional tax on U.S. products. It is done domestically as to bypass the NAFTA laws which ban nations like China from imposing extra tariffs against nations like the U.S. in order to give unfair advantage to nations they wish.

US jobs lost.

If business operations with China are heavily limited or banned.....it would not cause an increase in job outsourcing from the U.S. That's just an ignorant thought process there buddy....makes absolutely no sense.

Much the same effect with Mexico, essentially taxing imported US goods and increased costs down the supply chain. Spare parts for US made goods from Mexico and China will follow with increases. Our products will be less competitive abroad, more US jobs loss and a recession.


The U.S. economy and the amount of exports from the U.S. and being such a massive consumer nation of their imports, their businesses would crash WAY before the U.S......and that doesn't even account for those nations being so utterly poor as it is.

The rich enjoy their tax cuts, sit on some money, invest in foreign money markets due to our dollar"s instability,

Ummmm hey buddy....the U.S. dollar is still the standard of currency for just about every single country on the planet. A few nations have made hard plays to take that away from us over the past 8 years, and failed horribly.....then watched their economies tank.

Two great examples are: China.....and the ENTIRE E.U.

and stock buy backs will run up the Dow Jones and the S&P painting a very rosy picture of the economy.

You mean like the fed has been doing for 8 years now? You do know that the fed is no longer able to purchase and hold stocks any longer without crashing the market right? In order to get around this problem, they started exchanging their matured stocks and bonds for replacement fresh ones...just to hide how HORRIBLY Obama has crashed our economy over the past 8 years.

A little up-tick in job creation initially, but this will crash and burn in a few years time.

Really? And what evidence do you have of this?

Very little of the money in tax breaks will hit the ground floor economy;

Assuming you're referring to the corporate tax breaks.....no it won't hit the ground floor economy. Those tax breaks are meant to incentivize businesses, their owners, and stock holders to move operations back to the U.S. in order to begin generating jobs. These jobs would then begin to generate increased income and raise the national GDP. It should be viewed like two tiered scaffolding....not a slide.

Now, you must also understand that businesses will have to wait until their leases run out on their overseas properties before they move back to the U.S. and lease property for business here.

continuation of Bush & Reaganomics. Everything in economic history foretells the disaster that we are about to face, it seems the Republicans have not learned or have chosen to ignore the obvious.


Well buddy...I'd love to hear your explanation on that, cuz here are the facts:

1) Reagan, entering office in 1980, initiated a 25% tax cut split at varying levels, but focused at the top of companies heavily. This to encourage businesses to invest in stocks and company growth.
2) The fed freaked out and predicted failure and interest rate hikes which sabotaged both the domestic and international U.S. economy, skyrocketing import costs, increasing interest on the U.S. dollar internationally which increased cost of U.S. exports, which slowed exports, smashing the GDP and sending the U.S. economy into a deep recession in 1981 & 1982.
3) By 1983, the market stabilized and from that point through both terms in office, the U.S. economy had continual strong growth, bringing back trust to the U.S. dollar internationally.
4) As the economy grew, Reagan started dumping cash into the U.S.. military in order to build a strong force to combat Russia and their nuclear threat.
5) To do this, Reagan wanted to balance the budget by stripping down government fat and also start winding down and closing some of the excess social welfare programs sucking up funds. The Democrats refused to allow any cuts to anything except military spending which would defeat the purpose. This led to a $3 trillion dollar debt when Reagan left office, despite the strong, growing economy.

Moral of the story -- FFS, Reagan's model proved economic growth would happen, but the Democrats and the fed tanked everything else they possibly could.

Obama and the Democrats just spent the past 8 years force feeding America pretty much anything and everything they wanted, and everything the left has been crying for over the past how many decades? Resulting in America teetering on complete implosion at present.

How about you relax and give the right-wing a shot at saving the darn nation now? Guess what -- The fed already tried to tank trump election night, forcing the stock market through the floor, so far, so fast, it had to be frozen all night. And typical Democrats, instead of working with Republicans on compromise, they instead chose to have private meetings over the past week, to develop a plan to stop everything the Republicans want to try to do to save the country....once again, the left is going full on suicide bomber on the right.
Greyparrot
Posts: 14,288
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11/16/2016 7:02:07 PM
Posted: 3 weeks ago
It's exactly this kind of narrow thinking that allowed Trump to win. People are sick of the intellectually lazy generalizations. The cards are getting old. Trump is going to appoint people that won't fight with him and help him to fulfill his campaign promises, even if it means appointing people to get other people on board. There are no surprises here. Get over it; there's no conspiracy.
MakeSensePeopleDont
Posts: 1,106
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11/16/2016 7:38:55 PM
Posted: 3 weeks ago
At 11/16/2016 6:33:31 PM, FaustianJustice wrote:
Fracking and ground water contamination will become an issue.

You mean like how Flint, MI got bent over...no lube?

OK, sooooo Democrats contaminate potable water supply for large population base in Flint, MI....redirect attention to Republicans by saying they are going to do that.....check.

The water supply was not contaminated. With the change in source waters, treatment processes needed to change to accommodate for that. The water was more aggressive than the previous source, causing the lead in the pipes of the distribution system to get leeched out. These pipes should have been replaced a long time ago due to the SDWA, but since the original source water was not aggressive, the problem was masked. No sense in spending money on a problem that doesn't exist (yet).


Yeah....reading that again, I guess I did word that pretty terribly. It reads as though I'm saying oil drilling contaminated the water. Sorry about that, let's rephrase quick:

Starting in the 1960's, Democrats took over Detroit political power, only electing 1 Republican to city council from 1970 - 2013. This single party rule for over 50 years led to the typical Democrat policies...on steroids as it was left to grow unchecked for over a half century. Detroit and the surrounding area obviously collapsed in on itself in the past decade, unable to withstand the weight of massive Democrat Party spending spree, social welfare free-for-all.

Flint was similarly run by a Democrat monopoly, labeled the most liberal city in the U.S., the social welfare spending spree and massive tax bombs dropped on the population, in combination with the collapse of Detroit at the same time, caused utter economic destruction to the area.

Flint, being bankrupt, was put in the state of receivership, which meant an emergency financial manager was placed in charge (A few of these guys made their way through over the years)....yet another Democrat.

Just prior to the emergency manager being assigned, Flint's Democrat leaders decided to change from Detroit area water source, to a regional water supplier (3 year timeline). Angry, the Detroit Democrats immediately cutoff Flint's water, at which time, somebody...nobody knows who of course....decided to use the flint river as a stop gap.

Testing was done and data sent to the federal EPA, Democrat chief, elected by president Obama. For some unknown reason, that federal EPA chief had the data on him, proving a very likely contamination of the water supply...but they did nothing with the information...they sat on it for months and months, until signs of contamination including illness became increasingly visible in the population.

***That's a much better breakdown of Flint for you.***

On the flip side, fracking directly effects source waters.

Not true. The U.S. EPA completed a 5-year, comprehensive study in 2015 of fracking and its effects on potable water supplies. Their findings show no issues found, fracking is approved to continue after debunking this accusation. Straight from the EPA. Make sure to click the download tab to have access to the full report:

https://cfpub.epa.gov...

In January of 2016, the results of a German study into the same accusation were translated into English and summarized in the link below. The findings mirrored those of the EPA:

http://www.reuters.com...
Lynx_N
Posts: 276
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11/16/2016 8:16:54 PM
Posted: 3 weeks ago
At 11/16/2016 7:02:07 PM, Greyparrot wrote:
There are no surprises here. Get over it; there's no conspiracy.

I got one word for you: New World Order according to Trump.
Bronto?
Congrats.

poet
Greyparrot
Posts: 14,288
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11/16/2016 8:19:52 PM
Posted: 3 weeks ago
At 11/16/2016 8:16:54 PM, Lynx_N wrote:
At 11/16/2016 7:02:07 PM, Greyparrot wrote:
There are no surprises here. Get over it; there's no conspiracy.

I got one word for you: New World Order according to Trump.

LOL no, that would have been under Obama and his global dream.
Stymie13
Posts: 2,162
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11/16/2016 8:46:47 PM
Posted: 3 weeks ago
At 11/16/2016 8:19:52 PM, Greyparrot wrote:
At 11/16/2016 8:16:54 PM, Lynx_N wrote:
At 11/16/2016 7:02:07 PM, Greyparrot wrote:
There are no surprises here. Get over it; there's no conspiracy.

I got one word for you: New World Order according to Trump.

LOL no, that would have been under Obama and his global dream.

Like you I love this crap.... especially those who ignore government findings as sources (EPA, Eia, NASA, etc...) then cite those agencies.

Kind of like comey: he was great in July by a traitor to the Hatch act in October.
MakeSensePeopleDont
Posts: 1,106
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11/16/2016 8:59:07 PM
Posted: 3 weeks ago
At 11/16/2016 8:46:47 PM, Stymie13 wrote:

Like you I love this crap.... especially those who ignore government findings as sources (EPA, Eia, NASA, etc...) then cite those agencies.


Was this at me? I used the EPA in a post above...so wondering if I missed something when I was reading through or something.
Stymie13
Posts: 2,162
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11/16/2016 9:01:27 PM
Posted: 3 weeks ago
At 11/16/2016 8:59:07 PM, MakeSensePeopleDont wrote:
At 11/16/2016 8:46:47 PM, Stymie13 wrote:

Like you I love this crap.... especially those who ignore government findings as sources (EPA, Eia, NASA, etc...) then cite those agencies.


Was this at me? I used the EPA in a post above...so wondering if I missed something when I was reading through or something.

Not at all. It was in support of you.
MakeSensePeopleDont
Posts: 1,106
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11/16/2016 9:07:20 PM
Posted: 3 weeks ago
At 11/16/2016 9:01:27 PM, Stymie13 wrote:
At 11/16/2016 8:59:07 PM, MakeSensePeopleDont wrote:
At 11/16/2016 8:46:47 PM, Stymie13 wrote:

Like you I love this crap.... especially those who ignore government findings as sources (EPA, Eia, NASA, etc...) then cite those agencies.


Was this at me? I used the EPA in a post above...so wondering if I missed something when I was reading through or something.

Not at all. It was in support of you.

Ah cool. I already had to apologize for a poorly written post in this thread earlier, then detail it better. I only get one apology to use each year, so I'm all out already ;)
Stymie13
Posts: 2,162
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11/16/2016 9:12:24 PM
Posted: 3 weeks ago
At 11/16/2016 9:07:20 PM, MakeSensePeopleDont wrote:
At 11/16/2016 9:01:27 PM, Stymie13 wrote:
At 11/16/2016 8:59:07 PM, MakeSensePeopleDont wrote:
At 11/16/2016 8:46:47 PM, Stymie13 wrote:

Like you I love this crap.... especially those who ignore government findings as sources (EPA, Eia, NASA, etc...) then cite those agencies.


Was this at me? I used the EPA in a post above...so wondering if I missed something when I was reading through or something.

Not at all. It was in support of you.

Ah cool. I already had to apologize for a poorly written post in this thread earlier, then detail it better. I only get one apology to use each year, so I'm all out already ;)

I'm independent, I believe you are more conservative. I used to define myself that way but the conservative (politically) also increases gov, reducing individual responsibility and liberty... imo.

But the left loves gov but rarely cites gov findings. I could have also stated NIH, Cmms, CDC... heck even the FDA who I despise.
MakeSensePeopleDont
Posts: 1,106
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11/16/2016 9:22:57 PM
Posted: 3 weeks ago
At 11/16/2016 9:12:24 PM, Stymie13 wrote:
At 11/16/2016 9:07:20 PM, MakeSensePeopleDont wrote:
At 11/16/2016 9:01:27 PM, Stymie13 wrote:
At 11/16/2016 8:59:07 PM, MakeSensePeopleDont wrote:
At 11/16/2016 8:46:47 PM, Stymie13 wrote:

Like you I love this crap.... especially those who ignore government findings as sources (EPA, Eia, NASA, etc...) then cite those agencies.


Was this at me? I used the EPA in a post above...so wondering if I missed something when I was reading through or something.

Not at all. It was in support of you.

Ah cool. I already had to apologize for a poorly written post in this thread earlier, then detail it better. I only get one apology to use each year, so I'm all out already ;)

I'm independent, I believe you are more conservative. I used to define myself that way but the conservative (politically) also increases gov, reducing individual responsibility and liberty... imo.

But the left loves gov but rarely cites gov findings. I could have also stated NIH, Cmms, CDC... heck even the FDA who I despise.

I'm honestly not really sure what I am. I think that the Constitution and Bill of Rights need to be followed with much more logic, with vague writings being approached more from the mindset of the signers and the times, as well as the reasoning behind each individual piece as well as the documents as a whole. Yes, we do need to evolve with the times, but it's going too far.

I also want the size of our federal government shrunk down massively and the social welfare programs scrapped. I agree with short term safety nets and help with stuff like cost of education, but our current social welfare system is unquestionably causing the nation to self destruct.

So yeah...not sure really...
Lynx_N
Posts: 276
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11/16/2016 9:46:46 PM
Posted: 3 weeks ago
At 11/16/2016 8:19:52 PM, Greyparrot wrote:
At 11/16/2016 8:16:54 PM, Lynx_N wrote:
At 11/16/2016 7:02:07 PM, Greyparrot wrote:
There are no surprises here. Get over it; there's no conspiracy.

I got one word for you: New World Order according to Trump.

LOL no, that would have been under Obama and his global dream.

Now that's a beautiful dream, in full Technicolor no less.
Here's hoping Trump's dream won't be some black and white nightmare, from the 1930's.
Bronto?
Congrats.

poet
MakeSensePeopleDont
Posts: 1,106
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11/16/2016 10:42:39 PM
Posted: 2 weeks ago
At 11/16/2016 9:46:46 PM, Lynx_N wrote:
At 11/16/2016 8:19:52 PM, Greyparrot wrote:
At 11/16/2016 8:16:54 PM, Lynx_N wrote:
At 11/16/2016 7:02:07 PM, Greyparrot wrote:
There are no surprises here. Get over it; there's no conspiracy.

I got one word for you: New World Order according to Trump.

LOL no, that would have been under Obama and his global dream.

Now that's a beautiful dream, in full Technicolor no less.
Here's hoping Trump's dream won't be some black and white nightmare, from the 1930's.

Every time a person plays this whole "Trump's a racist" card, it just shows how ignorant and lazy they are.
Peepette
Posts: 1,238
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11/17/2016 12:12:54 AM
Posted: 2 weeks ago
At 11/16/2016 5:56:43 PM, MakeSensePeopleDont wrote:
At 11/16/2016 12:10:07 AM, Peepette wrote:
The Republican Party has catered to the rich and uses the disenfranchisement :amongst the population to their advantage.

Disenfranchisement? Really? How exactly?

The whites who feel that they have been left behind. Latinos have taken their jobs and affirmative action is reverse discrimination, etc, etc. The very people who voted for Trump because the Dems had made promises but never delivered.


The white nationalist movement, their creation through economic policy, is used to :sure up their wealthy members with Caucasian blue collar voters.

White people = racist -- We can dab that square on the "How to left-wing" bingo card. That's almost a free square at this point.

A few are racists, most are not, but feel they have lost their American dream through immigrants. They are low skilled and not college educated. Full time employment for uneducated white men has dropped in the last 10 years. They feel the Dems "coddle minorities, taking jobs and tax dollars from whites"., and have done nothing to preserve unions. The reality is MFG jobs, for the most part, have displaced workers via technology, but that's not the Trump message (trade). The recent voter ID laws especially prevalent in red states are aimed to shut out the poor and minorities from voting, that's racist in itself.

Could you at least be a little creative? Maybe throw in the occasional "Equinsu Ocha" for variety?

Smug


Spending deficits they create don't matter to them because they are used to gain popular support and can be passed to the next Democratic administration; a vicious cycle. Bush did it, now Trump.


Ah....blame Bush.......we can check that one off the list and dab that square.

Not only did Bush add almost 6T in debt but also raided SS to the tune of 2.7T.
https://www.cato.org...


Those who think that Trump is anti-establishment and will save their sorry arses are in for a surprise. With the Republicans behind him, he'll get most of what he wants, less regulation on Wall Street, reversing Frank Dodd which is meant to keep the banks :from repeating 2008 or Wells Fargo;

Hmmmm.....Copying Bill Clinton's horrible failure in the 1990's, Democrats once again force banks to hand out sub prime mortgages to people they know can't afford the payments -- while knowing the banks and housing market will crash and burn horribly.

The Clinton Administration did promote loaning to low income through Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac in 1993. But they were not the only ones riding the sub-prime wave. If it was just them, we would not have ended up where we did in 2008. Bush had a hand to play in it. Bush upped the anti with Fannie and Freddie with affordable housing tax incentives and no money down mortgages. He was warned in 2006 of the possibility to both institutions failing, but did nothing. Everything exasperated with the financial markets scooping up montage bundled securities backed by CDO's. Commercial and Financial institutions played the risk game due to the repeal of Glass-Steagall, a bad Clinton move. Bush was also made aware of the growth in derivatives. Franklin D. Raines of Fannie wished to take his alarm to Treasury officials, but was fired before delivery. The Treasury department and Bush's economic adviser, warned Bush of over inflated housing values in 2007 and numbers of failing mortgages, his solution was to throw $150 billion in tax rebates at new home buyers which resulted in the charging train full speed into the wall.

Democrats swoop in like a hero and throw tax dollars at the banks...then airdrops a 2,300 page pimp slap on them which allows government to quietly start gaining more control over the banks and insurance companies.

Hmmmmm.......all republicans faults.....check.

I'm not saying the Dems don't share blame, financial institutions were in their back pocket. What should have been done with the bail out was to take over the banks and oust those running them and replacing them with new management. Slaps on wrists did no good. Frank-Dodd was a start, more regulation, not less is needed.


a new swindle or crash is in the making. With Harold Hamm on Energy an upshot in :off shore drilling and most likely also in our national parks will occur.

Interesting one here.....Not allowed to drill for oil in U.S. National Parks, but Republicans will somehow do it anyway.

Right now 12 national parks have over 500 wells drilling oil/gas and fracking. 2/3rds are not under NPS 9B Regulations due to grandfathering. A 20 member tea party group has put forth proposals to privatize and develop national parks, Cruz at its head; Koch bros. Republicans have also pushed for fed divestment of public lands. Trump is looking to place "drill baby drill" Sarah Palin as secretary of the interior and to stream line the permitting process, which means what?

That one is NOT on my BINGO board.

Fracking and ground water contamination will become an issue.

Wyoming, Pennsylvania, Arkansas, Colorado, Michigan, New Mexico & NY have experienced ground water pollution due to fracking.

You mean like how Flint, MI got bent over...no lube?

OK, sooooo Democrats contaminate potable water supply for large population base in Flint, MI....redirect attention to Republicans by saying they are going to do that.....check.

Dems contaminated the water? think not. Governor Rick Snyder (R) did the switch over to save money, logical enough, but when the sh#t hit the fan he ingnored & refused to switch back until backed into a corner.

Not saying that Dems are blame free, they are not. But Rep will loosen regulations which will pose even greater risks.

Myron Ebell, a climate change denier, will head the EPA loosening regulations that will :be felt here and abroad for years.

...throw a hissy fit against Republicans because you were asked to provide evidence to a claim and have nothing verifiable........check.

Really!!!! Climate change is not real. I bet you read the Exxon and Koch Bros, reports. No need to have any discussion on this point.

Every warming, cooling, and "climate change" model we have used has turned out to be completely wrong -- every prediction has been wrong -- Ice caps shrink in one spot, grow in another -- no evidence available that can pass basic scientific method process nor the results recreated for proofing and validation -- ignore countries like China who actually ARE sh!++ing all over everything....

I suppose then the G8 Paris summit with 196 parties and 174 countries in attendance, supported by 146 climate panels who wrote the agenda were just wasting their time.

No worries, the second coming is around the corner, breathable air, clean water and :desertification is not an issue.

The middle east and north Africa were once lush, fertile lands, sustaining multitudes of life, including humans for millennia, then poof....gone. We must be polluting the Earth so bad now that our climate change has gained the ability to time travel, changing the course of history.

Failure to understand global weather patterns and shifts while ignoring historical data.....check.

See above. An arguments that climate change is not real is a non starter.

There will be no manufacturing jobs returning to the US, they are gone. With corporatist protections in place they have no impetuous to move back especially when cheap labor and even looser EP standards are in place elsewhere; continued :downward pressure on US wages.

Mentioning those other countries and how bad their polluting is, while somehow willfully ignoring them completely when discussing the "climate change" and EPA points previously......check.

Not ignoring countries that allow such pollution
Peepette
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11/17/2016 1:16:23 AM
Posted: 2 weeks ago
At 11/16/2016 6:51:29 PM, MakeSensePeopleDont wrote:
At 11/16/2016 12:11:40 AM, Peepette wrote:
An impending trade war with China and possible tariffs might cause China to dump their holdings of US Treasury bills :devaluating the dollar.

China has already threatened to claim bonds back around 2012, utter failure.

Western nations have been buying U.S. bonds from China since 2012, to shut China up.

China still holds $1.24 trillion in treasury bills, enough to deflate the dollar.

China engaging in a trade war with the U.S. will trigger ally nation agreements which also end trade and business with China, as well as complete and instant shutdown of any and all businesses and consumers from doing business with China in any way. Within 6 months, China's false economy would completely crash and the lack of food and basic necessity imports would further impoverish Chinese citizens and begin a slow and painful starvation of their population. China does not stand a chance in a trade war with the U.S.

For Chinese goods and US manufactures in China who import, cost to purchase will be up 15% or more; slowing consumer :spending.

Nope...imports and exports with China would actually cease completely and any businesses like Apple, operating in China would lose access to their plants and factories over their immediately.

Although the US is the biggest buyer of imports, China has pursuing interest in Latin America for raw materials and ores. Its imports to South America exceed 122B in 2013 and growing and buy 14% of SA"s exports. They have also invested $25B in Africa for infrastructure projects with the aim of extracting raw materials. The Chinese do not worry themselves with strings attached as far as anti-corruption or human rights issues; they just go and do business on that countries playing field. They also trade with Hong Kong, South Korea, Japan Germany, Vietnam, The UK, Netherlands India, Singapore, Taiwan, Malaysia, Australia, Thailand and the United Arab Emirates. I hardly think that the US has the power to shut down all of China"s avenues of trade without hurting other countries doing it. I don"t really think Trump has the balls to shut out the US companies doing business with China because it will cost jobs here.


China could also ban or highly tax US imports.

There is already an additional tax on U.S. products. It is done domestically as to bypass the NAFTA laws which ban nations like China from imposing extra tariffs against nations like the U.S. in order to give unfair advantage to nations they wish.

Canada and Mexico are the 2 biggest importer of US goods, China is third with $113 billion annually. Shut down those exports and what do you get, lost jobs here.

US jobs lost.

If business operations with China are heavily limited or banned.....it would not cause an increase in job outsourcing from the U.S. That's just an ignorant thought process there buddy....makes absolutely no sense.

There are thousands of US companies that either have mfg plants in China or have out sourced to China. I can provide a list with the top 100 if you like.

Ran out of characters
Peepette
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11/17/2016 1:20:42 AM
Posted: 2 weeks ago
At 11/16/2016 7:02:07 PM, Greyparrot wrote:
It's exactly this kind of narrow thinking that allowed Trump to win. People are sick of the intellectually lazy generalizations. The cards are getting old. Trump is going to appoint people that won't fight with him and help him to fulfill his campaign promises, even if it means appointing people to get other people on board. There are no surprises here. Get over it; there's no conspiracy.

There is no conspiracy here just abject stupidity in believing that any good will come out of this. Look at his current appointments, so much for draining the swamp.
Peepette
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11/17/2016 1:21:01 AM
Posted: 2 weeks ago
At 11/16/2016 7:02:07 PM, Greyparrot wrote:
It's exactly this kind of narrow thinking that allowed Trump to win. People are sick of the intellectually lazy generalizations. The cards are getting old. Trump is going to appoint people that won't fight with him and help him to fulfill his campaign promises, even if it means appointing people to get other people on board. There are no surprises here. Get over it; there's no conspiracy.

There is no conspiracy here just abject stupidity in believing that any good will come out of this. Look at his current appointments, so much for draining the swamp.
Greyparrot
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11/17/2016 1:22:16 AM
Posted: 2 weeks ago
At 11/17/2016 1:20:42 AM, Peepette wrote:
At 11/16/2016 7:02:07 PM, Greyparrot wrote:
It's exactly this kind of narrow thinking that allowed Trump to win. People are sick of the intellectually lazy generalizations. The cards are getting old. Trump is going to appoint people that won't fight with him and help him to fulfill his campaign promises, even if it means appointing people to get other people on board. There are no surprises here. Get over it; there's no conspiracy.


There is no conspiracy here just abject stupidity in believing that any good will come out of this. Look at his current appointments, so much for draining the swamp.

Fine, then rejoice in his failures, and move on to the next election. The rest of us have better things to do.
MakeSensePeopleDont
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11/17/2016 3:11:58 AM
Posted: 2 weeks ago
At 11/17/2016 12:12:54 AM, Peepette wrote:
At 11/16/2016 5:56:43 PM, MakeSensePeopleDont wrote:

Disenfranchisement? Really? How exactly?

The whites who feel that they have been left behind. Latinos have taken their jobs and affirmative action is reverse discrimination, etc, etc. The very people :who voted for Trump because the Dems had made promises but never delivered.

That's not disenfranchisement. Disenfranchisement is removing someone's right to vote or devaluing it.

White people = racist -- We can dab that square on the "How to left-wing" bingo card. That's almost a free square at this point.

A few are racists, most are not, but feel they have lost their American dream through immigrants.

No, most Americans don't even know what "The American Dream" is anymore. It's not rags to riches as is popular. The U.S. dream is "Opportunity to sacrifice and work hard to give your children a chance at a better life than you had." Selflessness and growth.

They feel the Dems "coddle minorities,

Affirmative action. Great idea 1960's -- 2000; not today.

The recent voter ID laws especially prevalent in red states are aimed to shut out the poor and minorities from voting, that's racist in itself.

You're conflating race with wealth. Since all races are represented in the poor communities, does that mean red states are racist against all races including whites? Or is there an exception to voter ID laws for poor white people? BTW, all states offer free or very cheap photo ID for poor.

Could you at least be a little creative? Maybe throw in the occasional "Equinsu Ocha" for variety?

Smug


No, just desperate for some variety from the whole bash whitey community.

Ah....blame Bush.......we can check that one off the list and dab that square.

Not only did Bush add almost 6T in debt but also raided SS to the tune of 2.7T.
https://www.cato.org...

It's Bush's fault Al Qaeda launched a military attack on U.S. soil, leading to U.S. military action in the middle east?

If that's your justification, I would simply say: "If Bill Clinton would have given the green light one of the two chances he had to kill Bin Laden, 9/11 would never happen, no war, no debt. Clinton owns that debt."

Hmmmm.....Copying Bill Clinton's horrible failure in the 1990's, Democrats once again force banks to hand out sub prime mortgages to people they know can't afford the payments -- while knowing the banks and housing market will crash and burn horribly.

The Clinton Administration did promote loaning to low income through Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac in 1993. But they were not the only ones riding the sub-prime wave. If it was just them, we would not have ended up where we did in 2008. Bush had a hand to play in it. Bush upped the anti with Fannie and Freddie with affordable housing tax incentives and no money down mortgages. He was warned in 2006 of the possibility to both institutions failing, but did nothing.

Bush, wrote directly about how much danger we were in due to Clinton's laws in the '90s in his first budget . In 2003, his Treasury secretary proposed a fixed. Barney Frank - Democrat, responded that he didn't think there was any crisis. Thomas Carper - Democrat, backed Barney by saying "If it ain't broke, don't fix it." A few months later, Greg Mankiw, Bush's top economist gave a 2nd warning and offered a fix - Dems ignored him. This continued to happen into 2005. Allen Greenspan, fed chief, in 2005 gave dire warning of impending full financial meltdown if nothing was done. Later in 2005, the Senate Banking Committee drafted a bill to fix it, but the Democrats in the committee, having majority, voted it down on party lines. Republicans kept trying to get the Senate to vote on the issue, but the Democrats kept ignoring them.

Bush and the Republicans tried everything they could to stop the crash from happening.

Democrats swoop in like a hero and throw tax dollars at the banks...then airdrops a 2,300 page pimp slap on them which allows government to quietly start gaining more control over the banks and insurance companies.

Hmmmmm.......all republicans faults.....check.

I'm not saying the Dems don't share blame, financial institutions were in their back pocket. What should have been done with the bail out was to take over :the banks and oust those running them and replacing them with new management.

It was Dems fault.

You think the government should have taken control of the largest, privately owned banks in the U.S. by force? Like a communist dictatorship?

Interesting one here.....Not allowed to drill for oil in U.S. National Parks, but Republicans will somehow do it anyway.

Right now 12 national parks have over 500 wells drilling oil/gas and fracking. 2/3rds are not under NPS 9B Regulations due to grandfathering.

The reason there are oil rigs in or around NPS units is because the oil companies were drilling on or owned those lands first. Then they sold the land rights to the federal government with stipulations to continue drilling and while retaining ownership of the oil and minerals underground. If the government didn't like that, they could have declined to purchase the lands.

Regulations were set up to protect the lands in accordance with the NPS mission. Companies have over the years decreased the number of rigs in NPS units, with only 50% of drills still granted exception. In 2015, the NPS drafted new regs which remove all exceptions including grandfathering. They have provided the oil companies with warning.

Wyoming, Pennsylvania, Arkansas, Colorado, Michigan, New Mexico & NY have experienced ground water pollution due to fracking.

Cite the incident reports and verified evidence for review plz.

Dems contaminated the water? think not. Governor Rick Snyder (R) did the switch over to save money, logical enough, but when the sh#t hit the fan he ingnored & refused to switch back until backed into a corner.


Read post #13, I wrote details on this and also gave evidence from the EPA and a separate German investigation which proves fracking does not contaminate water.


Really!!!! Climate change is not real. I bet you read the Exxon and Koch Bros, reports. No need to have any discussion on this point.

1) Global warming was to melt ice caps and sink global coastlines, destroying the planet by 2012 -- Scientists say models were wrong
2) Global cooling to bring on the next ice age -- Scientists say models wrong again
3) Climate change -- Could you please cite the scientific metrics which properly define this term?

Every warming, cooling, and "climate change" model we have used has turned out to be completely wrong -- every prediction has been wrong

I suppose then the G8 Paris summit with 196 parties and 174 countries in attendance, supported by 146 climate panels who wrote the agenda were just wasting their time.

Never said it was a waste of time to do research. I said the full body of evidence available today gives no proof of the claims. Don't you find it odd how so many leaders cry climate change but never give any data, let alone any that can be replicated and verified consistently?
Peepette
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11/17/2016 3:41:02 AM
Posted: 2 weeks ago
At 11/16/2016 6:51:29 PM, MakeSensePeopleDont wrote:
At 11/16/2016 12:11:40 AM, Peepette wrote:


The rich enjoy their tax cuts, sit on some money, invest in foreign money markets due to our dollar"s instability,

Ummmm hey buddy....the U.S. dollar is still the standard of currency for just about every single country on the planet. A few nations have made hard plays to take that away from us over the past 8 years, and failed horribly.....then watched their economies tank.

Yep, foreign nations have invested in the dollar due to value and stability. But when the debt racks up and we have to print more money, along with his protectionist policies it will sink.
http://www.platts.com...

Our economy and jobs , despite what the right wingers state, has been steadily growing since the crash of 2008; a problem Obama inherited.

http://www.forbes.com...
http://www.politifact.com...

Two great examples are: China.....and the ENTIRE E.U.

and stock buy backs will run up the Dow Jones and the S&P painting a very rosy picture of the economy.

You mean like the fed has been doing for 8 years now? You do know that the fed is no longer able to purchase and hold stocks any longer without crashing the market right? In order to get around this problem, they started exchanging their matured stocks and bonds for replacement fresh ones...just to hide how HORRIBLY Obama has crashed our economy over the past 8 years.

I need to see data on this before I will swallow any of this.

Corporate entities buy back stock to create a shortage that artificially inflates their worth. CEO's can get their big bonuses. And whose capital gains on these inflated stocks are not taxed at the same rate as income; such a racket.

A little up-tick in job creation initially, but this will crash and burn in a few years time.

Really? And what evidence do you have of this?

Well let's look at the Kansas experiment in comparison to Trump's policies.

http://www.cbpp.org...

Then lets look at Bloomberg's review.

http://www.bloomberg.com...

Then Moody's Analytics

https://www.economy.com...

I more if you would like.

Very little of the money in tax breaks will hit the ground floor economy;

Assuming you're referring to the corporate tax breaks.....no it won't hit the ground floor economy. Those tax breaks are meant to incentivize businesses, their owners, and stock holders to move operations back to the U.S. in order to begin generating jobs. These jobs would then begin to generate increased income and raise the national GDP. It should be viewed like two tiered scaffolding....not a slide.

You failed to have read what I have stated before. There is no incentive to create jobs here. It's still cheaper abroad, now with less taxes more profitable. Corporation when they get a wind fall, sit on some money, like when the banks got bailed out with no lending, and buy back stocks to inflate worth. Building new facilities and hiring more people here is a long term endeavor beyond the term of this administration. First, they want a more immediate return on investment. second, they will not invest in the risk if things change with the next administration. The big difference will be felt in the stock markets with increased dividends. It will help with 401k portfolios, but if you have no job, or a low paying one your not contributing.

Now, you must also understand that businesses will have to wait until their leases run out on their overseas properties before they move back to the U.S. and lease property for business here.

Cheap labor is still cheap labor and lower EP standards. Also there is nothing stating that a foreign country will not under cut our tax rates, or give a tax reprieve to keep businesses on their soil and their people employed. A win win for corporations and I have no doubt companies have picked up on this and will try to renegotiate tax terms with host countries.

continuation of Bush & Reaganomics. Everything in economic history foretells the disaster that we are about to face, it seems the Republicans have not learned or have chosen to ignore the obvious.


Well buddy...I'd love to hear your explanation on that, cuz here are the facts:

1) Reagan, entering office in 1980, initiated a 25% tax cut split at varying levels, but focused at the top of companies heavily. This to encourage businesses to invest in stocks and company growth.

Yes, but his policies with spending on military and the deficit increased, the trade deficit expanded. The value of the dollar weakened against the yen and the mark which precipitated black Monday in 87; a fall of 22.6%; a recession. Reagan only actually created 2 million jobs during his 8 year term. Those at the top saw their net worth sly rocket while the poor felt social services cuts. The belief that taxes would be compensated through job creation did not materialize, the same occurred during Bush. The Fed increased interest rates to 14% in response to rapid inflation. Things got so out of hand Reagan had to roll back corporate tax cuts by one third and closed tax loop wholes that essentially negated his cuts. It was the federal reserves rate increase to curb rapid inflation that did the trick, when inflation dropped so did the Fed rates which stimulated the economy.

Out of Characters

2) The fed freaked out and predicted failure and interest rate hikes which sabotaged both the domestic and international U.S. economy, skyrocketing import costs, increasing interest on the U.S. dollar internationally which increased cost of U.S. exports, which slowed exports, smashing the GDP and sot Reaganomincsending the U.S. economy into a deep recession in 1981 & 1982.

3) By 1983, the market stabilized and from that point through both terms in office, the U.S. economy had continual strong growth, bringing back trust to the U.S. dollar internationally.
4) As the economy grew, Reagan started dumping cash into the U.S.. military in order to build a strong force to combat Russia and their nuclear threat.
5) To do this, Reagan wanted to balance the budget by stripping down government fat and also start winding down and closing some of the excess social welfare programs sucking up funds. The Democrats refused to allow any cuts to anything except military spending which would defeat the purpose. This led to a $3 trillion dollar debt when Reagan left office, despite the strong, growing economy.

Moral of the story -- FFS, Reagan's model proved economic growth would happen, but the Democrats and the fed tanked everything else they possibly could.

Obama and the Democrats just spent the past 8 years force feeding America pretty much anything and everything they wanted, and everything the left has been crying for over the past how many decades? Resulting in America teetering on complete implosion at present.

How about you relax and give the right-wing a shot at saving the darn nation now? Guess what -- The fed already tried to tank trump election night, forcing the stock market through the floor, so far, so fast, it had to be frozen all night. And typical Democrats, instead of working with Republicans on compromise, they instead chose to have private meetings over the past week, to develop a plan to stop everything the Republicans want to try to do to save the country....once a