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Education - Taxation with no Benefit.

Quadrunner
Posts: 3,481
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11/28/2016 7:09:26 PM
Posted: 7 months ago
I was thinking about the education system and how a lot of people end up paying for something they'll never benefit from. If you pay income and property tax in your state, and you send your children to private school, you ought not have to pay taxes for a service you are providing your kids yourself and will never receive the benefit of by the state. Only a handful of states offer tax deductions at the moment for parents who want to put their kids through a better education system. Why??? Stand up for yourselves people. Everyone wants better education. We should stop giving the state an unequal advantage for providing sub-par standards, and allow the private sector the opportunity to compete by eliminating parents' need to pay for education twice through tax deductions.

Why on earth are people okay to keep public education funding on a local level this day in age? That means if you grow up poor, your "safety net" school is poor. It can't pay the best staff enough to hang onto them, or fund advantageous programs for your success, or in some cases even buy all of the books the kids need. This creates political chaos in the school districts from unhappy parents, who will mistakenly pressure good teachers to seek a better work environment. We have all of this talk of "racial inequality", and by happenstance do nothing about the tax system that is working against the groups that start and live poor, like say....a class derived from freed slaves. This is literally the BIGGEST contributing factor to opportunity in America, and we ignore it, and complain about 'racial inequality', coincidentally with these oppressed races residing heavily in poor urban environments of lacking education. Its disheartening that millions just sit around like a bunch of cows in the heard bitching about their problems with systematic racism (that's fine, but...), when we have an obvious, measurable, preventable, real system of perpetual inequality that we can do something about. I am constantly in awe that federal politicians claim they will somehow overcome this lacking state level service, and people just buy it because, I don't know....It sounds good doesn't it?

The current government practices are insufficient, provide regressive funding, and yet have the ability to stack the deck in their favor against better options. Open the floodgates of your state and allow winning formulas to succeed wherever you live. We could go much deeper, but at the very least, competition is what your public school system needs, and what our private institutions are already living on.
Vox_Veritas
Posts: 7,251
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11/28/2016 9:56:59 PM
Posted: 7 months ago
The taxpayer himself once benefited from public school education, did he not?
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Stymie13
Posts: 3,119
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11/28/2016 10:31:47 PM
Posted: 7 months ago
At 11/28/2016 7:09:26 PM, Quadrunner wrote:
I was thinking about the education system and how a lot of people end up paying for something they'll never benefit from. If you pay income and property tax in your state, and you send your children to private school, you ought not have to pay taxes for a service you are providing your kids yourself and will never receive the benefit of by the state. Only a handful of states offer tax deductions at the moment for parents who want to put their kids through a better education system. Why??? Stand up for yourselves people. Everyone wants better education. We should stop giving the state an unequal advantage for providing sub-par standards, and allow the private sector the opportunity to compete by eliminating parents' need to pay for education twice through tax deductions.

Why on earth are people okay to keep public education funding on a local level this day in age? That means if you grow up poor, your "safety net" school is poor. It can't pay the best staff enough to hang onto them, or fund advantageous programs for your success, or in some cases even buy all of the books the kids need. This creates political chaos in the school districts from unhappy parents, who will mistakenly pressure good teachers to seek a better work environment. We have all of this talk of "racial inequality", and by happenstance do nothing about the tax system that is working against the groups that start and live poor, like say....a class derived from freed slaves. This is literally the BIGGEST contributing factor to opportunity in America, and we ignore it, and complain about 'racial inequality', coincidentally with these oppressed races residing heavily in poor urban environments of lacking education. Its disheartening that millions just sit around like a bunch of cows in the heard bitching about their problems with systematic racism (that's fine, but...), when we have an obvious, measurable, preventable, real system of perpetual inequality that we can do something about. I am constantly in awe that federal politicians claim they will somehow overcome this lacking state level service, and people just buy it because, I don't know....It sounds good doesn't it?


The current government practices are insufficient, provide regressive funding, and yet have the ability to stack the deck in their favor against better options. Open the floodgates of your state and allow winning formulas to succeed wherever you live. We could go much deeper, but at the very least, competition is what your public school system needs, and what our private institutions are already living on.

Interesting concept. It will probably not fly but here's what occurs here:

All schools are now magnet. This means a kid can go to their home school but they can also apply to any school in any part of the city. They may not get in year 1 but are guaranteed year 2. This has actually had a perceived contradictory, but beneficial effect. Those schools that were once underperforming that one would think kids would be fleeing from have dramatically improved in both academics and sports. Our once bottom of the barrel education system (at least in my county which has 1/4 of the states population) is now in the top 20 in the country (our private schools have always been excellent). The 1 drawback if one calls it that is our school buses put more mileage on them then any other comparable municipality.

Not a bad trade off.
Death23
Posts: 1,016
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11/28/2016 11:07:29 PM
Posted: 7 months ago
I don't see how depriving the public school system of the income and property tax revenue derived from wealthy taxpayers who send their children to private schools is going to help fund the educations of poor black pupils.
Stymie13
Posts: 3,119
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11/28/2016 11:22:14 PM
Posted: 7 months ago
At 11/28/2016 11:07:29 PM, Death23 wrote:
I don't see how depriving the public school system of the income and property tax revenue derived from wealthy taxpayers who send their children to private schools is going to help fund the educations of poor black pupils.

People have to stop with the automatic assumption of black-poor, poor-black. How about just say poor pupils?
Death23
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11/28/2016 11:43:17 PM
Posted: 7 months ago
At 11/28/2016 11:22:14 PM, Stymie13 wrote:
At 11/28/2016 11:07:29 PM, Death23 wrote:
I don't see how depriving the public school system of the income and property tax revenue derived from wealthy taxpayers who send their children to private schools is going to help fund the educations of poor black pupils.

People have to stop with the automatic assumption of black-poor, poor-black. How about just say poor pupils?

Well, he was talking about poor black people specifically.

We have all of this talk of "racial inequality", and by happenstance do nothing about the tax system that is working against the groups that start and live poor, like say....a class derived from freed slaves. This is literally the BIGGEST contributing factor to opportunity in America, and we ignore it, and complain about 'racial inequality', coincidentally with these oppressed races residing heavily in poor urban environments of lacking education.

So, my response reflected that.
Stymie13
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11/29/2016 12:31:49 AM
Posted: 7 months ago
At 11/28/2016 11:43:17 PM, Death23 wrote:
At 11/28/2016 11:22:14 PM, Stymie13 wrote:
At 11/28/2016 11:07:29 PM, Death23 wrote:
I don't see how depriving the public school system of the income and property tax revenue derived from wealthy taxpayers who send their children to private schools is going to help fund the educations of poor black pupils.

People have to stop with the automatic assumption of black-poor, poor-black. How about just say poor pupils?

Well, he was talking about poor black people specifically.

We have all of this talk of "racial inequality", and by happenstance do nothing about the tax system that is working against the groups that start and live poor, like say....a class derived from freed slaves. This is literally the BIGGEST contributing factor to opportunity in America, and we ignore it, and complain about 'racial inequality', coincidentally with these oppressed races residing heavily in poor urban environments of lacking education.

So, my response reflected that.

Gotcha :)
Quadrunner
Posts: 3,481
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12/11/2016 2:42:09 PM
Posted: 7 months ago
At 11/28/2016 11:07:29 PM, Death23 wrote:
I don't see how depriving the public school system of the income and property tax revenue derived from wealthy taxpayers who send their children to private schools is going to help fund the educations of poor black pupils.

I never said that. You eliminate local (regressive) funding systems and replace with state funding entirely to balance everything across the board. Its not depriving. Its designing the system the way it always should have been. Schools that need more funding would receive it from a much more stable income source. Vearing off that topic, if you think property tax is only paid by land owners you have a lot to learn as well. It almost seems like you haven't lived in apartments before. The main issue addressed by this however, is the fact that schools in poor areas don't receive the funding of schools from high income areas in many states. Shifting the tax structure for a state-only funded system also enables effective tax reductions, and simplification in school funding systems.

There is no excuse for being against that. None.
Quadrunner
Posts: 3,481
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12/11/2016 2:58:18 PM
Posted: 7 months ago
At 11/28/2016 11:43:17 PM, Death23 wrote:
At 11/28/2016 11:22:14 PM, Stymie13 wrote:
At 11/28/2016 11:07:29 PM, Death23 wrote:
I don't see how depriving the public school system of the income and property tax revenue derived from wealthy taxpayers who send their children to private schools is going to help fund the educations of poor black pupils.

People have to stop with the automatic assumption of black-poor, poor-black. How about just say poor pupils?

Well, he was talking about poor black people specifically.

No I wasn't. I'll explain.

We have all of this talk of "racial inequality", and by happenstance do nothing about the tax system that is working against the groups that start and live poor, like say....a class derived from freed slaves. This is literally the BIGGEST contributing factor to opportunity in America, and we ignore it, and complain about 'racial inequality', coincidentally with these oppressed races residing heavily in poor urban environments of lacking education.

So, my response reflected that.

I was really just taking a stab....I intended to be inclusive, while revealing one of the most real and addressable issues behind the politically charged phenomenon. People get all up in bunches with their blame games, but often don't think of racial inequality as the indicator it is, rarely looking at systematic approaches to real problems proliferating the symptoms. The issue isn't black people being black as it is people who come from deeply seeded cycles of poverty. Its no wonder that blacks are affected disproportionately, but this isn't the heart of the issue. You can argue about the symptoms all day and you won't cure the cause of the disease.
Quadrunner
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12/11/2016 3:01:56 PM
Posted: 7 months ago
At 11/28/2016 9:56:59 PM, Vox_Veritas wrote:
The taxpayer himself once benefited from public school education, did he not?

The tax payer is not affected. I don't see where you are going with this.
Greyparrot
Posts: 16,918
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12/11/2016 3:02:24 PM
Posted: 7 months ago
At 11/28/2016 11:07:29 PM, Death23 wrote:
I don't see how depriving the public school system of the income and property tax revenue derived from wealthy taxpayers who send their children to private schools is going to help fund the educations of poor black pupils.

Eww property taxes..

http://www.npr.org...

Property taxes ensure school segregation will continue.
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Quadrunner
Posts: 3,481
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12/11/2016 3:05:34 PM
Posted: 7 months ago
At 11/28/2016 9:56:59 PM, Vox_Veritas wrote:
The taxpayer himself once benefited from public school education, did he not?

Actually I take that back. This would be more fair for people choosing to go to private schools because they would not pay for education twice. They would simply be provided what is due to their children had they attended public school.