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God condones rape, sex slaves?

Randall999
Posts: 85
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3/24/2011 1:35:05 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
To Jews and/or Christians-- I am curious how you reconcile with God promoting and condoning the rape of teen girls and the taking of sex slaves (for more rape). That passage in the bible has always been a curiosity, why it never gets preached on Sundays in church stumps me. I would be most appreciative if some religious folk here would explain why they love and worship a God that is pro rape and pro sex slavery. I await an honest, intellectual answer.
FREEDO
Posts: 21,057
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3/25/2011 2:34:28 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
Haha, silly, you haven't gotten any replies yet because Christians don't know shiit about the bible.

I post the verses for them:

"As you approach a town to attack it, first offer its people terms for peace. If they accept your terms and open the gates to you, then all the people inside will serve you in forced labor. But if they refuse to make peace and prepare to fight, you must attack the town. When the LORD your God hands it over to you, kill every man in the town. But you may keep for yourselves all the women, children, livestock, and other plunder. You may enjoy the spoils of your enemies that the LORD your God has given you."
~Deuteronomy 20:10-14

"If a man is caught in the act of raping a young woman who is not engaged, he must pay fifty pieces of silver to her father. Then he must marry the young woman because he violated her, and he will never be allowed to divorce her."
~ Deuteronomy 22:28-29

"When you go out to war against your enemies and the LORD, your God, delivers them into your hand, so that you take captives, if you see a comely woman among the captives and become so enamored of her that you wish to have her as wife, you may take her home to your house."
~Deuteronomy 21:10-11

These three only scratch the surface.
GRAND POOBAH OF DDO

fnord
FREEDO
Posts: 21,057
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3/25/2011 3:13:07 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
Yeah, I don't see why this thread is narrowed to rape. There are plenty of verses endorsing slavery, genocide, torture, and all the rest.
GRAND POOBAH OF DDO

fnord
FREEDO
Posts: 21,057
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3/25/2011 3:16:19 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
It's funny how Christians criticize the Quran on things like this but it turns out, if they knew anything about either of books, that the Quran was miles ahead of the OT in terms of human rights.
GRAND POOBAH OF DDO

fnord
trkwpb
Posts: 15
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3/25/2011 6:17:15 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
It's nothing more than the genocidal Joshua/gentle Jesus ideology. Modern Christians overlook the tribal origins of their deity due to shame. After all, what gentle, loving father would order the mass extermination of so many people?
So long as my actions do not harm the person or property of a non-consenting other, it's none of your business what I do - Peter McWilliams
Cliff.Stamp
Posts: 2,169
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3/25/2011 1:37:33 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 3/25/2011 2:34:28 AM, FREEDO wrote:

Haha, silly, you haven't gotten any replies yet because Christians don't know shiit about the bible.

Or maybe they don't respond well to trolling arguments. Instead of proclaiming hey your God is a rapist, maybe ask how to interpret a particular verse of scripture. For example (King James) :

"10 When thou comest nigh unto a city to fight against it, then proclaim peace unto it.

11 And it shall be, if it make thee answer of peace, and open unto thee, then it shall be, that all the people that is found therein shall be tributaries unto thee, and they shall serve thee.

12 And if it will make no peace with thee, but will make war against thee, then thou shalt besiege it:

13 And when the LORD thy God hath delivered it into thine hands, thou shalt smite every male thereof with the edge of the sword:

14 But the women, and the little ones, and the cattle, and all that is in the city, even all the spoil thereof, shalt thou take unto thyself; and thou shalt eat the spoil of thine enemies, which the LORD thy God hath given thee."

Note the context of this is when war has been declared and actions are to be taken then while you may kill the men, you must not harm the women, children or even property and instead "take them into thyself". Now in context, for a reverent follower of Christianity when it is "taken into thyself" it would have to be given the same respect as the "thyself" which would obviously mean no raping, etc. . Similar arguments are made for the other verses, putting them in context, and interpreting them from the view of someone who follows Christ.

Now all the versions have different translations but again they have to be considered in context for example (English Standard) :

"And you shall enjoy the spoil of your enemies, which the LORD your God has given you."

Here people will argue that it condones rape of the women, but again they are to be treated as gifts from God and thus treated with respect that is due such, by making this proclamation God has essentially made them part of his covenant.
Randall999
Posts: 85
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3/25/2011 1:46:04 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
JUDGES 21:10-24 is particularly troublesome for Judeo-Christianity. Talk about sex slavery, rape, terrorizing teen girls. Wow.
http://www.biblegateway.com...

10 So the assembly sent twelve thousand fighting men with instructions to go to Jabesh Gilead and put to the sword those living there, including the women and children. 11 "This is what you are to do," they said. "Kill every male and every woman who is not a virgin." 12 They found among the people living in Jabesh Gilead four hundred young women who had never slept with a man, and they took them to the camp at Shiloh in Canaan.

13 Then the whole assembly sent an offer of peace to the Benjamites at the rock of Rimmon. 14 So the Benjamites returned at that time and were given the women of Jabesh Gilead who had been spared. But there were not enough for all of them.

15 The people grieved for Benjamin, because the LORD had made a gap in the tribes of Israel. 16 And the elders of the assembly said, "With the women of Benjamin destroyed, how shall we provide wives for the men who are left? 17 The Benjamite survivors must have heirs," they said, "so that a tribe of Israel will not be wiped out. 18 We can't give them our daughters as wives, since we Israelites have taken this oath: ‘Cursed be anyone who gives a wife to a Benjamite.' 19 But look, there is the annual festival of the LORD in Shiloh, which lies north of Bethel, east of the road that goes from Bethel to Shechem, and south of Lebonah."

20 So they instructed the Benjamites, saying, "Go and hide in the vineyards 21 and watch. When the young women of Shiloh come out to join in the dancing, rush from the vineyards and each of you seize one of them to be your wife. Then return to the land of Benjamin. 22 When their fathers or brothers complain to us, we will say to them, ‘Do us the favor of helping them, because we did not get wives for them during the war. You will not be guilty of breaking your oath because you did not give your daughters to them.'"

23 So that is what the Benjamites did. While the young women were dancing, each man caught one and carried her off to be his wife. Then they returned to their inheritance and rebuilt the towns and settled in them.

24 At that time the Israelites left that place and went home to their tribes and clans, each to his own inheritance.
Randall999
Posts: 85
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3/25/2011 1:49:06 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
And then there is Number 31:7-18 where the LORD tells Moses to have his posse kill all the women except for the virgins, that they can take the virgins (likely teen girls) for themselves. Wow. What a religion to be proud of an follow, christians. Shame.
http://www.biblegateway.com...

7 They fought against Midian, as the LORD commanded Moses, and killed every man. 8 Among their victims were Evi, Rekem, Zur, Hur and Reba—the five kings of Midian. They also killed Balaam son of Beor with the sword. 9 The Israelites captured the Midianite women and children and took all the Midianite herds, flocks and goods as plunder. 10 They burned all the towns where the Midianites had settled, as well as all their camps. 11 They took all the plunder and spoils, including the people and animals, 12 and brought the captives, spoils and plunder to Moses and Eleazar the priest and the Israelite assembly at their camp on the plains of Moab, by the Jordan across from Jericho.

13 Moses, Eleazar the priest and all the leaders of the community went to meet them outside the camp. 14 Moses was angry with the officers of the army—the commanders of thousands and commanders of hundreds—who returned from the battle.

15 "Have you allowed all the women to live?" he asked them. 16 "They were the ones who followed Balaam's advice and enticed the Israelites to be unfaithful to the LORD in the Peor incident, so that a plague struck the LORD's people. 17 Now kill all the boys. And kill every woman who has slept with a man, 18 but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a man.
Cliff.Stamp
Posts: 2,169
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3/25/2011 1:51:02 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 3/25/2011 1:46:04 PM, Randall999 wrote:

JUDGES 21:10-24 is particularly troublesome for Judeo-Christianity.

You need to read what comes before it, and again consider it in the context of all those involved being brought into the embrace of a loving God.
Randall999
Posts: 85
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3/25/2011 2:00:11 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 3/25/2011 1:51:02 PM, Cliff.Stamp wrote:
At 3/25/2011 1:46:04 PM, Randall999 wrote:

JUDGES 21:10-24 is particularly troublesome for Judeo-Christianity.

You need to read what comes before it, and again consider it in the context of all those involved being brought into the embrace of a loving God.

How silly of me, I did not consider the notion of it is okay to take virgin girls as sex slaves as long as once kidnapped, the terrified virgins are brought into the loving embrace of God by light of their ordeal. Wow. You have one twisted notion of reality if you really believe that.

I do take verses in context. I have read the bible line by line at least twice. Spent many years in a fundamental bible church, intense bible study. I know the bible, trust me. And I know how xtians will try to justify the evil parts of the bible in some twisted delusional logic, because if if xtianity can not find a way to explain the paradoxes like this one, then your whole world collapses.
tigg13
Posts: 302
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3/25/2011 2:06:45 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 3/25/2011 1:37:33 PM, Cliff.Stamp wrote:
At 3/25/2011 2:34:28 AM, FREEDO wrote:

Haha, silly, you haven't gotten any replies yet because Christians don't know shiit about the bible.

Or maybe they don't respond well to trolling arguments. Instead of proclaiming hey your God is a rapist, maybe ask how to interpret a particular verse of scripture. For example (King James) :

"10 When thou comest nigh unto a city to fight against it, then proclaim peace unto it.

11 And it shall be, if it make thee answer of peace, and open unto thee, then it shall be, that all the people that is found therein shall be tributaries unto thee, and they shall serve thee.

12 And if it will make no peace with thee, but will make war against thee, then thou shalt besiege it:

13 And when the LORD thy God hath delivered it into thine hands, thou shalt smite every male thereof with the edge of the sword:

14 But the women, and the little ones, and the cattle, and all that is in the city, even all the spoil thereof, shalt thou take unto thyself; and thou shalt eat the spoil of thine enemies, which the LORD thy God hath given thee."

Note the context of this is when war has been declared and actions are to be taken then while you may kill the men, you must not harm the women, children or even property and instead "take them into thyself". Now in context, for a reverent follower of Christianity when it is "taken into thyself" it would have to be given the same respect as the "thyself" which would obviously mean no raping, etc. . Similar arguments are made for the other verses, putting them in context, and interpreting them from the view of someone who follows Christ.

Now all the versions have different translations but again they have to be considered in context for example (English Standard) :

"And you shall enjoy the spoil of your enemies, which the LORD your God has given you."

Here people will argue that it condones rape of the women, but again they are to be treated as gifts from God and thus treated with respect that is due such, by making this proclamation God has essentially made them part of his covenant.

Ok, reality check.

I want to point out that Canaanites worshiped a Goddess of fertility and didn't have the kind taboos against sex that the Hebrews had. So there wouldn't have been a lot of females over the age of 15 were still virgins.

Now picture this:

There's this girl that's 15 or14 or maybe even 13 years old. She's just watched her town invaded by Hebrew barbarians who have slaughtered everyone she has ever known; her family, her friends - her entire community. Not just soldiers but civilians; men, women, children, the old and the infirm. They have also taken everything that is of value and burned everything else.

Now one of these brutes approaches her, after having just butchered her neighbors, and informs her that she is to be a gift to him from his god and that she will have the honor of bearing his children effective immediately.

Could you please explain under what context that this would be the will of a just and benevolent God?
Randall999
Posts: 85
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3/25/2011 2:33:07 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 3/25/2011 1:51:02 PM, Cliff.Stamp wrote:
...
You need to read what comes before it, and again consider it in the context of all those involved being brought into the embrace of a loving God.
popculturepooka
Posts: 7,926
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3/25/2011 3:27:44 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 3/25/2011 2:00:11 PM, Randall999 wrote:
And I know how xtians will try to justify the evil parts of the bible in some twisted delusional logic, because if if xtianity can not find a way to explain the paradoxes like this one, then your whole world collapses.

I'm pretty sure he isn't a Christian. Also, troll harder. I'd be happy to debate you once I get done with the tournament on any of these issues.
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Cliff.Stamp
Posts: 2,169
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3/25/2011 8:06:36 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 3/25/2011 2:06:45 PM, tigg13 wrote:

Could you please explain under what context that this would be the will of a just and benevolent God?

It would not, but then again that is not what it describes.