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izbo10
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9/8/2011 2:36:50 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
Why is it that most people here are pro education until we get to the nature of the universe and how it got here, then its wah, wah, wah, why don't you just leave me alone and respect my beliefs. Would this be exceptable in a math class if a child said 1+3= 8? I think not, the acceptable thing would be to actually show this person what the truth is. We educate to benefit our society. Education also includes being aware of what answers we do have as well as the ones we don't have, so we can get those answers. We are not entitled to our own truths.
DDO's marketing strategy has certainly paid off just not sure I agree with the target market: http://tinypic.com...
It's amazing to me that you still have yet to grasp the difference between believing something, not believing something, and having no belief at all -JCMT
To respect religion, is to disrespect the Truth!

If this board was a room and you all were the light bulbs, I'm bringing a flashlight.
Just1Voice
Posts: 155
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9/8/2011 2:47:22 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/8/2011 2:36:50 PM, izbo10 wrote:
Why is it that most people here are pro education until we get to the nature of the universe and how it got here, then its wah, wah, wah, why don't you just leave me alone and respect my beliefs. Would this be exceptable in a math class if a child said 1+3= 8? I think not, the acceptable thing would be to actually show this person what the truth is. We educate to benefit our society. Education also includes being aware of what answers we do have as well as the ones we don't have, so we can get those answers. We are not entitled to our own truths.

Science is a method if inquiry, not a religion. It has no preconceived beliefs. It operates on principles of careful observation and study and aims only to provide consistent and reliable data concerning those observations. Nothing more, nothing less. The teaching of that methodology and the findings it has yielded over the years is not indoctrination of any sort.

If circumstances have brought scientific data into conflict with religious belief, that is not the fault of the science. Historically religion has shown that it is capable of adapting itself to scientific data and surviving, and can do so again. There is simply no need for this kind of conflict to take place. Those who strive to supplant the teaching of scientific methods with faith-based teaching are doing a great disservice to their own prosperity. Their descendants will be ashamed of them for making this futile effort.
izbo10
Posts: 2,995
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9/8/2011 2:50:06 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/8/2011 2:47:22 PM, Just1Voice wrote:
At 9/8/2011 2:36:50 PM, izbo10 wrote:
Why is it that most people here are pro education until we get to the nature of the universe and how it got here, then its wah, wah, wah, why don't you just leave me alone and respect my beliefs. Would this be exceptable in a math class if a child said 1+3= 8? I think not, the acceptable thing would be to actually show this person what the truth is. We educate to benefit our society. Education also includes being aware of what answers we do have as well as the ones we don't have, so we can get those answers. We are not entitled to our own truths.

Science is a method if inquiry, not a religion. It has no preconceived beliefs. It operates on principles of careful observation and study and aims only to provide consistent and reliable data concerning those observations. Nothing more, nothing less. The teaching of that methodology and the findings it has yielded over the years is not indoctrination of any sort.

If circumstances have brought scientific data into conflict with religious belief, that is not the fault of the science. Historically religion has shown that it is capable of adapting itself to scientific data and surviving, and can do so again. There is simply no need for this kind of conflict to take place. Those who strive to supplant the teaching of scientific methods with faith-based teaching are doing a great disservice to their own prosperity. Their descendants will be ashamed of them for making this futile effort.

You must not be aware that a lot of the educated western world laughs at the religiousity of this country. Religion is constantly at odds with religion, it has lost every battle, and it retards the progress of science by forcing science to drag the relgious nutjobs kicking and screaming along for the ride. Look at the stats for americans who don't believe evolution. Our descendents will look back on us in shame for our beleif in imaginary sky daddies.
DDO's marketing strategy has certainly paid off just not sure I agree with the target market: http://tinypic.com...
It's amazing to me that you still have yet to grasp the difference between believing something, not believing something, and having no belief at all -JCMT
To respect religion, is to disrespect the Truth!

If this board was a room and you all were the light bulbs, I'm bringing a flashlight.
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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9/8/2011 2:52:27 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/8/2011 2:36:50 PM, izbo10 wrote:
Why is it that most people here are pro education until we get to the nature of the universe and how it got here, then its wah, wah, wah, why don't you just leave me alone and respect my beliefs. Would this be exceptable in a math class if a child said 1+3= 8? I think not, the acceptable thing would be to actually show this person what the truth is. We educate to benefit our society. Education also includes being aware of what answers we do have as well as the ones we don't have, so we can get those answers. We are not entitled to our own truths.

Likewise, in your case izbo, you seem to think 1 + ? = 10 without actually filling in what the ? is. You lack the whole puzzle. Yes, in theory people should be educated on what is truth and what is not, but the fact of reality that makes such education impossible on the subject of the universe, is that the knowledge does not exist upon which it can be taught! People claim to know things and be sure of things that frankly have not the slightest clue about. You, Izbo, being a prime example. You cannot teach that which you do not know.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
izbo10
Posts: 2,995
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9/8/2011 2:54:25 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/8/2011 2:52:27 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 9/8/2011 2:36:50 PM, izbo10 wrote:
Why is it that most people here are pro education until we get to the nature of the universe and how it got here, then its wah, wah, wah, why don't you just leave me alone and respect my beliefs. Would this be exceptable in a math class if a child said 1+3= 8? I think not, the acceptable thing would be to actually show this person what the truth is. We educate to benefit our society. Education also includes being aware of what answers we do have as well as the ones we don't have, so we can get those answers. We are not entitled to our own truths.

Likewise, in your case izbo, you seem to think 1 + ? = 10 without actually filling in what the ? is. You lack the whole puzzle. Yes, in theory people should be educated on what is truth and what is not, but the fact of reality that makes such education impossible on the subject of the universe, is that the knowledge does not exist upon which it can be taught! People claim to know things and be sure of things that frankly have not the slightest clue about. You, Izbo, being a prime example. You cannot teach that which you do not know.

my position is we don't know beyond the big bang your position is sky daddy and zombie son created world in 7 metaphorical days and wuvs u wong time, so much so he die on cwoss for you. Seems you are the one pretending to know something you don't know.
DDO's marketing strategy has certainly paid off just not sure I agree with the target market: http://tinypic.com...
It's amazing to me that you still have yet to grasp the difference between believing something, not believing something, and having no belief at all -JCMT
To respect religion, is to disrespect the Truth!

If this board was a room and you all were the light bulbs, I'm bringing a flashlight.
izbo10
Posts: 2,995
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9/8/2011 2:56:51 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/8/2011 2:52:27 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 9/8/2011 2:36:50 PM, izbo10 wrote:
Why is it that most people here are pro education until we get to the nature of the universe and how it got here, then its wah, wah, wah, why don't you just leave me alone and respect my beliefs. Would this be exceptable in a math class if a child said 1+3= 8? I think not, the acceptable thing would be to actually show this person what the truth is. We educate to benefit our society. Education also includes being aware of what answers we do have as well as the ones we don't have, so we can get those answers. We are not entitled to our own truths.

Likewise, in your case izbo, you seem to think 1 + ? = 10 without actually filling in what the ? is. You lack the whole puzzle. Yes, in theory people should be educated on what is truth and what is not, but the fact of reality that makes such education impossible on the subject of the universe, is that the knowledge does not exist upon which it can be taught! People claim to know things and be sure of things that frankly have not the slightest clue about. You, Izbo, being a prime example. You cannot teach that which you do not know.

also what we do know is you have no way to demonstrate your answer as correct, so it should not be accepted. If you took half a second to understand the atheist position you wouldn't say such nonsense, but then again that would require reading over 3 paragraphs something you already admitted to not being able to do.
DDO's marketing strategy has certainly paid off just not sure I agree with the target market: http://tinypic.com...
It's amazing to me that you still have yet to grasp the difference between believing something, not believing something, and having no belief at all -JCMT
To respect religion, is to disrespect the Truth!

If this board was a room and you all were the light bulbs, I'm bringing a flashlight.
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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9/8/2011 2:58:39 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/8/2011 2:54:25 PM, izbo10 wrote:
At 9/8/2011 2:52:27 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 9/8/2011 2:36:50 PM, izbo10 wrote:
Why is it that most people here are pro education until we get to the nature of the universe and how it got here, then its wah, wah, wah, why don't you just leave me alone and respect my beliefs. Would this be exceptable in a math class if a child said 1+3= 8? I think not, the acceptable thing would be to actually show this person what the truth is. We educate to benefit our society. Education also includes being aware of what answers we do have as well as the ones we don't have, so we can get those answers. We are not entitled to our own truths.

Likewise, in your case izbo, you seem to think 1 + ? = 10 without actually filling in what the ? is. You lack the whole puzzle. Yes, in theory people should be educated on what is truth and what is not, but the fact of reality that makes such education impossible on the subject of the universe, is that the knowledge does not exist upon which it can be taught! People claim to know things and be sure of things that frankly have not the slightest clue about. You, Izbo, being a prime example. You cannot teach that which you do not know.

my position is we don't know beyond the big bang your position is sky daddy and zombie son created world in 7 metaphorical days and wuvs u wong time, so much so he die on cwoss for you. Seems you are the one pretending to know something you don't know.

You skewed the point, and did not address the crux of the issue. The point was that you cannot teach that which you do not know. You cannot know whether or not a higher power exists. Therefore you cannot teach that a higher power exists and you cannot teach that it doesn't. ...and when did this suddenly get directed at me personally?
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
izbo10
Posts: 2,995
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9/8/2011 3:00:15 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/8/2011 2:58:39 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 9/8/2011 2:54:25 PM, izbo10 wrote:
At 9/8/2011 2:52:27 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 9/8/2011 2:36:50 PM, izbo10 wrote:
Why is it that most people here are pro education until we get to the nature of the universe and how it got here, then its wah, wah, wah, why don't you just leave me alone and respect my beliefs. Would this be exceptable in a math class if a child said 1+3= 8? I think not, the acceptable thing would be to actually show this person what the truth is. We educate to benefit our society. Education also includes being aware of what answers we do have as well as the ones we don't have, so we can get those answers. We are not entitled to our own truths.

Likewise, in your case izbo, you seem to think 1 + ? = 10 without actually filling in what the ? is. You lack the whole puzzle. Yes, in theory people should be educated on what is truth and what is not, but the fact of reality that makes such education impossible on the subject of the universe, is that the knowledge does not exist upon which it can be taught! People claim to know things and be sure of things that frankly have not the slightest clue about. You, Izbo, being a prime example. You cannot teach that which you do not know.

my position is we don't know beyond the big bang your position is sky daddy and zombie son created world in 7 metaphorical days and wuvs u wong time, so much so he die on cwoss for you. Seems you are the one pretending to know something you don't know.

You skewed the point, and did not address the crux of the issue. The point was that you cannot teach that which you do not know. You cannot know whether or not a higher power exists. Therefore you cannot teach that a higher power exists and you cannot teach that it doesn't. ...and when did this suddenly get directed at me personally?

we can teach that we do not know these answers so there is no reason to believe them to be true. Like we teach there is a reason to believe in wolves and we have evidence so our children learn they are real, in comparison there is no reason to believe in werewolves so we teach them as mythology that is not true.
DDO's marketing strategy has certainly paid off just not sure I agree with the target market: http://tinypic.com...
It's amazing to me that you still have yet to grasp the difference between believing something, not believing something, and having no belief at all -JCMT
To respect religion, is to disrespect the Truth!

If this board was a room and you all were the light bulbs, I'm bringing a flashlight.
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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9/8/2011 3:06:37 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/8/2011 3:00:15 PM, izbo10 wrote:
we can teach that we do not know these answers so there is no reason to believe them to be true. Like we teach there is a reason to believe in wolves and we have evidence so our children learn they are real, in comparison there is no reason to believe in werewolves so we teach them as mythology that is not true.

Werewolves are supposed to exist on the conscious and observable level, therefore, proof of the existence of werewolves is bound by legitimate evidence. If werewolves do exist within our consciousness, then their actions will be observable. HOWEVER, if there is a concept that is said to exist OUTSIDE the conscious and observable level, then it cannot be observed whether it existed or not. Therefore, lack of evidence will not equate to lack of existence where as, lack of evidence of an observable concept DOES equate to lack of existence.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
izbo10
Posts: 2,995
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9/8/2011 3:09:52 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/8/2011 3:06:37 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 9/8/2011 3:00:15 PM, izbo10 wrote:
we can teach that we do not know these answers so there is no reason to believe them to be true. Like we teach there is a reason to believe in wolves and we have evidence so our children learn they are real, in comparison there is no reason to believe in werewolves so we teach them as mythology that is not true.

Werewolves are supposed to exist on the conscious and observable level, therefore, proof of the existence of werewolves is bound by legitimate evidence. If werewolves do exist within our consciousness, then their actions will be observable. HOWEVER, if there is a concept that is said to exist OUTSIDE the conscious and observable level, then it cannot be observed whether it existed or not. Therefore, lack of evidence will not equate to lack of existence where as, lack of evidence of an observable concept DOES equate to lack of existence.

I love this board the fallacy of defining into existence.
DDO's marketing strategy has certainly paid off just not sure I agree with the target market: http://tinypic.com...
It's amazing to me that you still have yet to grasp the difference between believing something, not believing something, and having no belief at all -JCMT
To respect religion, is to disrespect the Truth!

If this board was a room and you all were the light bulbs, I'm bringing a flashlight.
izbo10
Posts: 2,995
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9/8/2011 3:15:39 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/8/2011 3:09:52 PM, izbo10 wrote:
At 9/8/2011 3:06:37 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 9/8/2011 3:00:15 PM, izbo10 wrote:
we can teach that we do not know these answers so there is no reason to believe them to be true. Like we teach there is a reason to believe in wolves and we have evidence so our children learn they are real, in comparison there is no reason to believe in werewolves so we teach them as mythology that is not true.

Werewolves are supposed to exist on the conscious and observable level, therefore, proof of the existence of werewolves is bound by legitimate evidence. If werewolves do exist within our consciousness, then their actions will be observable. HOWEVER, if there is a concept that is said to exist OUTSIDE the conscious and observable level, then it cannot be observed whether it existed or not. Therefore, lack of evidence will not equate to lack of existence where as, lack of evidence of an observable concept DOES equate to lack of existence.

I love this board the fallacy of defining into existence.

we can also teach that there is currently no evidence to suggest that a supreme being is responsible for the universe.
DDO's marketing strategy has certainly paid off just not sure I agree with the target market: http://tinypic.com...
It's amazing to me that you still have yet to grasp the difference between believing something, not believing something, and having no belief at all -JCMT
To respect religion, is to disrespect the Truth!

If this board was a room and you all were the light bulbs, I'm bringing a flashlight.
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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9/8/2011 3:16:43 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/8/2011 3:09:52 PM, izbo10 wrote:
At 9/8/2011 3:06:37 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 9/8/2011 3:00:15 PM, izbo10 wrote:
we can teach that we do not know these answers so there is no reason to believe them to be true. Like we teach there is a reason to believe in wolves and we have evidence so our children learn they are real, in comparison there is no reason to believe in werewolves so we teach them as mythology that is not true.

Werewolves are supposed to exist on the conscious and observable level, therefore, proof of the existence of werewolves is bound by legitimate evidence. If werewolves do exist within our consciousness, then their actions will be observable. HOWEVER, if there is a concept that is said to exist OUTSIDE the conscious and observable level, then it cannot be observed whether it existed or not. Therefore, lack of evidence will not equate to lack of existence where as, lack of evidence of an observable concept DOES equate to lack of existence.

I love this board the fallacy of defining into existence.

Wow, what an d!ck move. I take the time to respond, treating your post with respect, and you give me a half@$$ and meaningless remark.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
izbo10
Posts: 2,995
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9/8/2011 3:18:00 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/8/2011 3:16:43 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 9/8/2011 3:09:52 PM, izbo10 wrote:
At 9/8/2011 3:06:37 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 9/8/2011 3:00:15 PM, izbo10 wrote:
we can teach that we do not know these answers so there is no reason to believe them to be true. Like we teach there is a reason to believe in wolves and we have evidence so our children learn they are real, in comparison there is no reason to believe in werewolves so we teach them as mythology that is not true.

Werewolves are supposed to exist on the conscious and observable level, therefore, proof of the existence of werewolves is bound by legitimate evidence. If werewolves do exist within our consciousness, then their actions will be observable. HOWEVER, if there is a concept that is said to exist OUTSIDE the conscious and observable level, then it cannot be observed whether it existed or not. Therefore, lack of evidence will not equate to lack of existence where as, lack of evidence of an observable concept DOES equate to lack of existence.

I love this board the fallacy of defining into existence.

Wow, what an d!ck move. I take the time to respond, treating your post with respect, and you give me a half@$$ and meaningless remark.

I have told you people 10 times trying to define your favorite diety into likihood is the fallacy of special pleading you have failed to learn again and again.
DDO's marketing strategy has certainly paid off just not sure I agree with the target market: http://tinypic.com...
It's amazing to me that you still have yet to grasp the difference between believing something, not believing something, and having no belief at all -JCMT
To respect religion, is to disrespect the Truth!

If this board was a room and you all were the light bulbs, I'm bringing a flashlight.
Ore_Ele
Posts: 25,980
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9/8/2011 3:18:48 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/8/2011 2:36:50 PM, izbo10 wrote:
Why is it that most people here are pro education until we get to the nature of the universe and how it got here, then its wah, wah, wah, why don't you just leave me alone and respect my beliefs. Would this be exceptable in a math class if a child said 1+3= 8? I think not, the acceptable thing would be to actually show this person what the truth is. We educate to benefit our society. Education also includes being aware of what answers we do have as well as the ones we don't have, so we can get those answers. We are not entitled to our own truths.

When you have proof that there is no creator, then you can compare it to 1+3=8.
"Wanting Red Rhino Pill to have gender"
000ike
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9/8/2011 3:19:52 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/8/2011 3:18:48 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 9/8/2011 2:36:50 PM, izbo10 wrote:
Why is it that most people here are pro education until we get to the nature of the universe and how it got here, then its wah, wah, wah, why don't you just leave me alone and respect my beliefs. Would this be exceptable in a math class if a child said 1+3= 8? I think not, the acceptable thing would be to actually show this person what the truth is. We educate to benefit our society. Education also includes being aware of what answers we do have as well as the ones we don't have, so we can get those answers. We are not entitled to our own truths.

When you have proof that there is no creator, then you can compare it to 1+3=8.

You said much more clearly what I was trying to say.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
izbo10
Posts: 2,995
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9/8/2011 3:21:31 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/8/2011 3:18:48 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 9/8/2011 2:36:50 PM, izbo10 wrote:
Why is it that most people here are pro education until we get to the nature of the universe and how it got here, then its wah, wah, wah, why don't you just leave me alone and respect my beliefs. Would this be exceptable in a math class if a child said 1+3= 8? I think not, the acceptable thing would be to actually show this person what the truth is. We educate to benefit our society. Education also includes being aware of what answers we do have as well as the ones we don't have, so we can get those answers. We are not entitled to our own truths.

When you have proof that there is no creator, then you can compare it to 1+3=8.

If you believe there is a creator and there is no reason for believing that, you are wrong for having that belief.
DDO's marketing strategy has certainly paid off just not sure I agree with the target market: http://tinypic.com...
It's amazing to me that you still have yet to grasp the difference between believing something, not believing something, and having no belief at all -JCMT
To respect religion, is to disrespect the Truth!

If this board was a room and you all were the light bulbs, I'm bringing a flashlight.
Ore_Ele
Posts: 25,980
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9/8/2011 3:22:30 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/8/2011 3:00:15 PM, izbo10 wrote:
At 9/8/2011 2:58:39 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 9/8/2011 2:54:25 PM, izbo10 wrote:
At 9/8/2011 2:52:27 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 9/8/2011 2:36:50 PM, izbo10 wrote:
Why is it that most people here are pro education until we get to the nature of the universe and how it got here, then its wah, wah, wah, why don't you just leave me alone and respect my beliefs. Would this be exceptable in a math class if a child said 1+3= 8? I think not, the acceptable thing would be to actually show this person what the truth is. We educate to benefit our society. Education also includes being aware of what answers we do have as well as the ones we don't have, so we can get those answers. We are not entitled to our own truths.

Likewise, in your case izbo, you seem to think 1 + ? = 10 without actually filling in what the ? is. You lack the whole puzzle. Yes, in theory people should be educated on what is truth and what is not, but the fact of reality that makes such education impossible on the subject of the universe, is that the knowledge does not exist upon which it can be taught! People claim to know things and be sure of things that frankly have not the slightest clue about. You, Izbo, being a prime example. You cannot teach that which you do not know.

my position is we don't know beyond the big bang your position is sky daddy and zombie son created world in 7 metaphorical days and wuvs u wong time, so much so he die on cwoss for you. Seems you are the one pretending to know something you don't know.

You skewed the point, and did not address the crux of the issue. The point was that you cannot teach that which you do not know. You cannot know whether or not a higher power exists. Therefore you cannot teach that a higher power exists and you cannot teach that it doesn't. ...and when did this suddenly get directed at me personally?

we can teach that we do not know these answers so there is no reason to believe them to be true. Like we teach there is a reason to believe in wolves and we have evidence so our children learn they are real, in comparison there is no reason to believe in werewolves so we teach them as mythology that is not true.

So should we teach that the Big Bang is not true, because it is still just a theory that cannot be proven?
"Wanting Red Rhino Pill to have gender"
izbo10
Posts: 2,995
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9/8/2011 3:23:36 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/8/2011 3:22:30 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 9/8/2011 3:00:15 PM, izbo10 wrote:
At 9/8/2011 2:58:39 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 9/8/2011 2:54:25 PM, izbo10 wrote:
At 9/8/2011 2:52:27 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 9/8/2011 2:36:50 PM, izbo10 wrote:
Why is it that most people here are pro education until we get to the nature of the universe and how it got here, then its wah, wah, wah, why don't you just leave me alone and respect my beliefs. Would this be exceptable in a math class if a child said 1+3= 8? I think not, the acceptable thing would be to actually show this person what the truth is. We educate to benefit our society. Education also includes being aware of what answers we do have as well as the ones we don't have, so we can get those answers. We are not entitled to our own truths.

Likewise, in your case izbo, you seem to think 1 + ? = 10 without actually filling in what the ? is. You lack the whole puzzle. Yes, in theory people should be educated on what is truth and what is not, but the fact of reality that makes such education impossible on the subject of the universe, is that the knowledge does not exist upon which it can be taught! People claim to know things and be sure of things that frankly have not the slightest clue about. You, Izbo, being a prime example. You cannot teach that which you do not know.

my position is we don't know beyond the big bang your position is sky daddy and zombie son created world in 7 metaphorical days and wuvs u wong time, so much so he die on cwoss for you. Seems you are the one pretending to know something you don't know.

You skewed the point, and did not address the crux of the issue. The point was that you cannot teach that which you do not know. You cannot know whether or not a higher power exists. Therefore you cannot teach that a higher power exists and you cannot teach that it doesn't. ...and when did this suddenly get directed at me personally?

we can teach that we do not know these answers so there is no reason to believe them to be true. Like we teach there is a reason to believe in wolves and we have evidence so our children learn they are real, in comparison there is no reason to believe in werewolves so we teach them as mythology that is not true.

So should we teach that the Big Bang is not true, because it is still just a theory that cannot be proven?

wow, are you that uneducated that you really don't understand scientific theories that have lots of evidence supporting them, compared to religious assertions which have constantly been backtracking to keep from being eliminated.
DDO's marketing strategy has certainly paid off just not sure I agree with the target market: http://tinypic.com...
It's amazing to me that you still have yet to grasp the difference between believing something, not believing something, and having no belief at all -JCMT
To respect religion, is to disrespect the Truth!

If this board was a room and you all were the light bulbs, I'm bringing a flashlight.
Ore_Ele
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9/8/2011 3:24:44 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/8/2011 3:21:31 PM, izbo10 wrote:
At 9/8/2011 3:18:48 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 9/8/2011 2:36:50 PM, izbo10 wrote:
Why is it that most people here are pro education until we get to the nature of the universe and how it got here, then its wah, wah, wah, why don't you just leave me alone and respect my beliefs. Would this be exceptable in a math class if a child said 1+3= 8? I think not, the acceptable thing would be to actually show this person what the truth is. We educate to benefit our society. Education also includes being aware of what answers we do have as well as the ones we don't have, so we can get those answers. We are not entitled to our own truths.

When you have proof that there is no creator, then you can compare it to 1+3=8.


If you believe there is a creator and there is no reason for believing that, you are wrong for having that belief.

If you believe there is no creator and there is no reason for believe that, you are wrong for having that belief.
"Wanting Red Rhino Pill to have gender"
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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9/8/2011 3:25:28 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/8/2011 3:23:36 PM, izbo10 wrote:

wow, are you that uneducated that you really don't understand scientific theories that have lots of evidence supporting them, compared to religious assertions which have constantly been backtracking to keep from being eliminated.

No, you have knotted the logic and diverted the conversation. When did religion come in? We were talking about the existence of a higher power.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
izbo10
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9/8/2011 3:26:02 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/8/2011 3:24:44 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 9/8/2011 3:21:31 PM, izbo10 wrote:
At 9/8/2011 3:18:48 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 9/8/2011 2:36:50 PM, izbo10 wrote:
Why is it that most people here are pro education until we get to the nature of the universe and how it got here, then its wah, wah, wah, why don't you just leave me alone and respect my beliefs. Would this be exceptable in a math class if a child said 1+3= 8? I think not, the acceptable thing would be to actually show this person what the truth is. We educate to benefit our society. Education also includes being aware of what answers we do have as well as the ones we don't have, so we can get those answers. We are not entitled to our own truths.

When you have proof that there is no creator, then you can compare it to 1+3=8.


If you believe there is a creator and there is no reason for believing that, you are wrong for having that belief.

If you believe there is no creator and there is no reason for believe that, you are wrong for having that belief.

No, not really once we look at the possibilities of other options, we see that the odds against the existence of the creator make it far more rational to believe against it then for it.
DDO's marketing strategy has certainly paid off just not sure I agree with the target market: http://tinypic.com...
It's amazing to me that you still have yet to grasp the difference between believing something, not believing something, and having no belief at all -JCMT
To respect religion, is to disrespect the Truth!

If this board was a room and you all were the light bulbs, I'm bringing a flashlight.
Ore_Ele
Posts: 25,980
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9/8/2011 3:26:24 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/8/2011 3:23:36 PM, izbo10 wrote:
At 9/8/2011 3:22:30 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 9/8/2011 3:00:15 PM, izbo10 wrote:
At 9/8/2011 2:58:39 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 9/8/2011 2:54:25 PM, izbo10 wrote:
At 9/8/2011 2:52:27 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 9/8/2011 2:36:50 PM, izbo10 wrote:
Why is it that most people here are pro education until we get to the nature of the universe and how it got here, then its wah, wah, wah, why don't you just leave me alone and respect my beliefs. Would this be exceptable in a math class if a child said 1+3= 8? I think not, the acceptable thing would be to actually show this person what the truth is. We educate to benefit our society. Education also includes being aware of what answers we do have as well as the ones we don't have, so we can get those answers. We are not entitled to our own truths.

Likewise, in your case izbo, you seem to think 1 + ? = 10 without actually filling in what the ? is. You lack the whole puzzle. Yes, in theory people should be educated on what is truth and what is not, but the fact of reality that makes such education impossible on the subject of the universe, is that the knowledge does not exist upon which it can be taught! People claim to know things and be sure of things that frankly have not the slightest clue about. You, Izbo, being a prime example. You cannot teach that which you do not know.

my position is we don't know beyond the big bang your position is sky daddy and zombie son created world in 7 metaphorical days and wuvs u wong time, so much so he die on cwoss for you. Seems you are the one pretending to know something you don't know.

You skewed the point, and did not address the crux of the issue. The point was that you cannot teach that which you do not know. You cannot know whether or not a higher power exists. Therefore you cannot teach that a higher power exists and you cannot teach that it doesn't. ...and when did this suddenly get directed at me personally?

we can teach that we do not know these answers so there is no reason to believe them to be true. Like we teach there is a reason to believe in wolves and we have evidence so our children learn they are real, in comparison there is no reason to believe in werewolves so we teach them as mythology that is not true.

So should we teach that the Big Bang is not true, because it is still just a theory that cannot be proven?


wow, are you that uneducated that you really don't understand scientific theories that have lots of evidence supporting them, compared to religious assertions which have constantly been backtracking to keep from being eliminated.

wow, are you that uneducated that you really don't understand that scientific theories cannot rely on circular logic as evidence?
"Wanting Red Rhino Pill to have gender"
izbo10
Posts: 2,995
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9/8/2011 3:27:28 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/8/2011 3:26:24 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 9/8/2011 3:23:36 PM, izbo10 wrote:
At 9/8/2011 3:22:30 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 9/8/2011 3:00:15 PM, izbo10 wrote:
At 9/8/2011 2:58:39 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 9/8/2011 2:54:25 PM, izbo10 wrote:
At 9/8/2011 2:52:27 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 9/8/2011 2:36:50 PM, izbo10 wrote:
Why is it that most people here are pro education until we get to the nature of the universe and how it got here, then its wah, wah, wah, why don't you just leave me alone and respect my beliefs. Would this be exceptable in a math class if a child said 1+3= 8? I think not, the acceptable thing would be to actually show this person what the truth is. We educate to benefit our society. Education also includes being aware of what answers we do have as well as the ones we don't have, so we can get those answers. We are not entitled to our own truths.

Likewise, in your case izbo, you seem to think 1 + ? = 10 without actually filling in what the ? is. You lack the whole puzzle. Yes, in theory people should be educated on what is truth and what is not, but the fact of reality that makes such education impossible on the subject of the universe, is that the knowledge does not exist upon which it can be taught! People claim to know things and be sure of things that frankly have not the slightest clue about. You, Izbo, being a prime example. You cannot teach that which you do not know.

my position is we don't know beyond the big bang your position is sky daddy and zombie son created world in 7 metaphorical days and wuvs u wong time, so much so he die on cwoss for you. Seems you are the one pretending to know something you don't know.

You skewed the point, and did not address the crux of the issue. The point was that you cannot teach that which you do not know. You cannot know whether or not a higher power exists. Therefore you cannot teach that a higher power exists and you cannot teach that it doesn't. ...and when did this suddenly get directed at me personally?

we can teach that we do not know these answers so there is no reason to believe them to be true. Like we teach there is a reason to believe in wolves and we have evidence so our children learn they are real, in comparison there is no reason to believe in werewolves so we teach them as mythology that is not true.

So should we teach that the Big Bang is not true, because it is still just a theory that cannot be proven?


wow, are you that uneducated that you really don't understand scientific theories that have lots of evidence supporting them, compared to religious assertions which have constantly been backtracking to keep from being eliminated.

wow, are you that uneducated that you really don't understand that scientific theories cannot rely on circular logic as evidence?

whats the circular logic?
DDO's marketing strategy has certainly paid off just not sure I agree with the target market: http://tinypic.com...
It's amazing to me that you still have yet to grasp the difference between believing something, not believing something, and having no belief at all -JCMT
To respect religion, is to disrespect the Truth!

If this board was a room and you all were the light bulbs, I'm bringing a flashlight.
Ore_Ele
Posts: 25,980
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9/8/2011 3:27:51 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/8/2011 3:26:02 PM, izbo10 wrote:
At 9/8/2011 3:24:44 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 9/8/2011 3:21:31 PM, izbo10 wrote:
At 9/8/2011 3:18:48 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 9/8/2011 2:36:50 PM, izbo10 wrote:
Why is it that most people here are pro education until we get to the nature of the universe and how it got here, then its wah, wah, wah, why don't you just leave me alone and respect my beliefs. Would this be exceptable in a math class if a child said 1+3= 8? I think not, the acceptable thing would be to actually show this person what the truth is. We educate to benefit our society. Education also includes being aware of what answers we do have as well as the ones we don't have, so we can get those answers. We are not entitled to our own truths.

When you have proof that there is no creator, then you can compare it to 1+3=8.


If you believe there is a creator and there is no reason for believing that, you are wrong for having that belief.

If you believe there is no creator and there is no reason for believe that, you are wrong for having that belief.

No, not really once we look at the possibilities of other options, we see that the odds against the existence of the creator make it far more rational to believe against it then for it.

really? what are those odds, please give me the numbers.
"Wanting Red Rhino Pill to have gender"
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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9/8/2011 3:28:06 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/8/2011 3:27:28 PM, izbo10 wrote:

wow, are you that uneducated that you really don't understand that scientific theories cannot rely on circular logic as evidence?

what is circular logic?

Fixed*
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
izbo10
Posts: 2,995
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9/8/2011 3:31:09 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/8/2011 3:27:51 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 9/8/2011 3:26:02 PM, izbo10 wrote:
At 9/8/2011 3:24:44 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 9/8/2011 3:21:31 PM, izbo10 wrote:
At 9/8/2011 3:18:48 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 9/8/2011 2:36:50 PM, izbo10 wrote:
Why is it that most people here are pro education until we get to the nature of the universe and how it got here, then its wah, wah, wah, why don't you just leave me alone and respect my beliefs. Would this be exceptable in a math class if a child said 1+3= 8? I think not, the acceptable thing would be to actually show this person what the truth is. We educate to benefit our society. Education also includes being aware of what answers we do have as well as the ones we don't have, so we can get those answers. We are not entitled to our own truths.

When you have proof that there is no creator, then you can compare it to 1+3=8.


If you believe there is a creator and there is no reason for believing that, you are wrong for having that belief.

If you believe there is no creator and there is no reason for believe that, you are wrong for having that belief.

No, not really once we look at the possibilities of other options, we see that the odds against the existence of the creator make it far more rational to believe against it then for it.

really? what are those odds, please give me the numbers.

Multiverses, the universe is a brute fact, a repeating cycle of universes, many other natural causes, are all more porbable then asserting something we don't even know can possibly exist therefore even if they were equal odds of a creator is 1 in 5.
DDO's marketing strategy has certainly paid off just not sure I agree with the target market: http://tinypic.com...
It's amazing to me that you still have yet to grasp the difference between believing something, not believing something, and having no belief at all -JCMT
To respect religion, is to disrespect the Truth!

If this board was a room and you all were the light bulbs, I'm bringing a flashlight.
Ore_Ele
Posts: 25,980
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9/8/2011 3:36:55 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/8/2011 3:27:28 PM, izbo10 wrote:
At 9/8/2011 3:26:24 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 9/8/2011 3:23:36 PM, izbo10 wrote:
At 9/8/2011 3:22:30 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 9/8/2011 3:00:15 PM, izbo10 wrote:
At 9/8/2011 2:58:39 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 9/8/2011 2:54:25 PM, izbo10 wrote:
At 9/8/2011 2:52:27 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 9/8/2011 2:36:50 PM, izbo10 wrote:
Why is it that most people here are pro education until we get to the nature of the universe and how it got here, then its wah, wah, wah, why don't you just leave me alone and respect my beliefs. Would this be exceptable in a math class if a child said 1+3= 8? I think not, the acceptable thing would be to actually show this person what the truth is. We educate to benefit our society. Education also includes being aware of what answers we do have as well as the ones we don't have, so we can get those answers. We are not entitled to our own truths.

Likewise, in your case izbo, you seem to think 1 + ? = 10 without actually filling in what the ? is. You lack the whole puzzle. Yes, in theory people should be educated on what is truth and what is not, but the fact of reality that makes such education impossible on the subject of the universe, is that the knowledge does not exist upon which it can be taught! People claim to know things and be sure of things that frankly have not the slightest clue about. You, Izbo, being a prime example. You cannot teach that which you do not know.

my position is we don't know beyond the big bang your position is sky daddy and zombie son created world in 7 metaphorical days and wuvs u wong time, so much so he die on cwoss for you. Seems you are the one pretending to know something you don't know.

You skewed the point, and did not address the crux of the issue. The point was that you cannot teach that which you do not know. You cannot know whether or not a higher power exists. Therefore you cannot teach that a higher power exists and you cannot teach that it doesn't. ...and when did this suddenly get directed at me personally?

we can teach that we do not know these answers so there is no reason to believe them to be true. Like we teach there is a reason to believe in wolves and we have evidence so our children learn they are real, in comparison there is no reason to believe in werewolves so we teach them as mythology that is not true.

So should we teach that the Big Bang is not true, because it is still just a theory that cannot be proven?


wow, are you that uneducated that you really don't understand scientific theories that have lots of evidence supporting them, compared to religious assertions which have constantly been backtracking to keep from being eliminated.

wow, are you that uneducated that you really don't understand that scientific theories cannot rely on circular logic as evidence?

whats the circular logic?

We see a lot of stuff around us in the cosmos, and so we fit a theory that fits snuggly with what we see. However, we cannot go back and take what we see as evidence for what we theoretically designed to fit with them. No more than I can look up into the stars and see that "the galaxies are all moving away from each other." So from there, I can formulate theory "God is pushing all the galaxies away from each other." But I cannot go back and say "see the galaxies are moving away from each other, that is evidence for my theory!"

It has to predict something "other" than what it originally was based around.
"Wanting Red Rhino Pill to have gender"
Ore_Ele
Posts: 25,980
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9/8/2011 3:38:09 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/8/2011 3:31:09 PM, izbo10 wrote:
At 9/8/2011 3:27:51 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 9/8/2011 3:26:02 PM, izbo10 wrote:
At 9/8/2011 3:24:44 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 9/8/2011 3:21:31 PM, izbo10 wrote:
At 9/8/2011 3:18:48 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 9/8/2011 2:36:50 PM, izbo10 wrote:
Why is it that most people here are pro education until we get to the nature of the universe and how it got here, then its wah, wah, wah, why don't you just leave me alone and respect my beliefs. Would this be exceptable in a math class if a child said 1+3= 8? I think not, the acceptable thing would be to actually show this person what the truth is. We educate to benefit our society. Education also includes being aware of what answers we do have as well as the ones we don't have, so we can get those answers. We are not entitled to our own truths.

When you have proof that there is no creator, then you can compare it to 1+3=8.


If you believe there is a creator and there is no reason for believing that, you are wrong for having that belief.

If you believe there is no creator and there is no reason for believe that, you are wrong for having that belief.

No, not really once we look at the possibilities of other options, we see that the odds against the existence of the creator make it far more rational to believe against it then for it.

really? what are those odds, please give me the numbers.

Multiverses, the universe is a brute fact, a repeating cycle of universes, many other natural causes, are all more porbable then asserting something we don't even know can possibly exist therefore even if they were equal odds of a creator is 1 in 5.

you provided no numbers for god, nor for competing theories (other than the two you just made up). Congrats.
"Wanting Red Rhino Pill to have gender"
izbo10
Posts: 2,995
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9/8/2011 3:40:56 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/8/2011 3:38:09 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 9/8/2011 3:31:09 PM, izbo10 wrote:
At 9/8/2011 3:27:51 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 9/8/2011 3:26:02 PM, izbo10 wrote:
At 9/8/2011 3:24:44 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 9/8/2011 3:21:31 PM, izbo10 wrote:
At 9/8/2011 3:18:48 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 9/8/2011 2:36:50 PM, izbo10 wrote:
Why is it that most people here are pro education until we get to the nature of the universe and how it got here, then its wah, wah, wah, why don't you just leave me alone and respect my beliefs. Would this be exceptable in a math class if a child said 1+3= 8? I think not, the acceptable thing would be to actually show this person what the truth is. We educate to benefit our society. Education also includes being aware of what answers we do have as well as the ones we don't have, so we can get those answers. We are not entitled to our own truths.

When you have proof that there is no creator, then you can compare it to 1+3=8.


If you believe there is a creator and there is no reason for believing that, you are wrong for having that belief.

If you believe there is no creator and there is no reason for believe that, you are wrong for having that belief.

No, not really once we look at the possibilities of other options, we see that the odds against the existence of the creator make it far more rational to believe against it then for it.

really? what are those odds, please give me the numbers.

Multiverses, the universe is a brute fact, a repeating cycle of universes, many other natural causes, are all more porbable then asserting something we don't even know can possibly exist therefore even if they were equal odds of a creator is 1 in 5.

you provided no numbers for god, nor for competing theories (other than the two you just made up). Congrats.

Pascals wager with everything else equal the solution with the least extra assumptions( ie no new unknown beings is a good start) is preferrable.
DDO's marketing strategy has certainly paid off just not sure I agree with the target market: http://tinypic.com...
It's amazing to me that you still have yet to grasp the difference between believing something, not believing something, and having no belief at all -JCMT
To respect religion, is to disrespect the Truth!

If this board was a room and you all were the light bulbs, I'm bringing a flashlight.
izbo10
Posts: 2,995
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9/8/2011 3:42:15 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/8/2011 3:38:09 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 9/8/2011 3:31:09 PM, izbo10 wrote:
At 9/8/2011 3:27:51 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 9/8/2011 3:26:02 PM, izbo10 wrote:
At 9/8/2011 3:24:44 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 9/8/2011 3:21:31 PM, izbo10 wrote:
At 9/8/2011 3:18:48 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
At 9/8/2011 2:36:50 PM, izbo10 wrote:
Why is it that most people here are pro education until we get to the nature of the universe and how it got here, then its wah, wah, wah, why don't you just leave me alone and respect my beliefs. Would this be exceptable in a math class if a child said 1+3= 8? I think not, the acceptable thing would be to actually show this person what the truth is. We educate to benefit our society. Education also includes being aware of what answers we do have as well as the ones we don't have, so we can get those answers. We are not entitled to our own truths.

When you have proof that there is no creator, then you can compare it to 1+3=8.


If you believe there is a creator and there is no reason for believing that, you are wrong for having that belief.

If you believe there is no creator and there is no reason for believe that, you are wrong for having that belief.

No, not really once we look at the possibilities of other options, we see that the odds against the existence of the creator make it far more rational to believe against it then for it.

really? what are those odds, please give me the numbers.

Multiverses, the universe is a brute fact, a repeating cycle of universes, many other natural causes, are all more porbable then asserting something we don't even know can possibly exist therefore even if they were equal odds of a creator is 1 in 5.

you provided no numbers for god, nor for competing theories (other than the two you just made up). Congrats.

this is why education is so badly needed, people like you.
DDO's marketing strategy has certainly paid off just not sure I agree with the target market: http://tinypic.com...
It's amazing to me that you still have yet to grasp the difference between believing something, not believing something, and having no belief at all -JCMT
To respect religion, is to disrespect the Truth!

If this board was a room and you all were the light bulbs, I'm bringing a flashlight.