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Which debate to choose?

Crede
Posts: 455
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9/12/2011 5:09:28 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
So which of the following debates would be most interesting to everybody?

1. The human predicament is true
- Man cannot live with an atheistic worldview and be consistent and objectively happy at the same time. Either he is consistent in his worldview and is objectively unhappy, or is happy but living in a lie to his worldview.

2. The Christian God still exists in face of "the problem of evil."

Whatcha think?
izbo10
Posts: 2,995
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9/12/2011 5:10:50 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/12/2011 5:09:28 PM, Crede wrote:
So which of the following debates would be most interesting to everybody?

1. The human predicament is true
- Man cannot live with an atheistic worldview and be consistent and objectively happy at the same time. Either he is consistent in his worldview and is objectively unhappy, or is happy but living in a lie to his worldview.

2. The Christian God still exists in face of "the problem of evil."


Whatcha think?

lol objective happiness? Where is cerebral to have a coniption fit.
DDO's marketing strategy has certainly paid off just not sure I agree with the target market: http://tinypic.com...
It's amazing to me that you still have yet to grasp the difference between believing something, not believing something, and having no belief at all -JCMT
To respect religion, is to disrespect the Truth!

If this board was a room and you all were the light bulbs, I'm bringing a flashlight.
Cerebral_Narcissist
Posts: 10,806
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9/12/2011 5:13:41 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/12/2011 5:09:28 PM, Crede wrote:
So which of the following debates would be most interesting to everybody?

1. The human predicament is true
- Man cannot live with an atheistic worldview and be consistent and objectively happy at the same time. Either he is consistent in his worldview and is objectively unhappy, or is happy but living in a lie to his worldview.

What is objective happines? Isn't that a contradiction in terms?


2. The Christian God still exists in face of "the problem of evil."


Whatcha think?

Both are quite interesting.
I am voting for Innomen because of his intelligence, common sense, humility and the fact that Juggle appears to listen to him. Any other Presidential style would have a large sub-section of the site up in arms. If I was President I would destroy the site though elitism, others would let it run riot. Innomen represents a middle way that works, neither draconian nor anarchic and that is the only way things can work. Plus he does it all without ego trips.
CosmicAlfonzo
Posts: 5,955
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9/12/2011 5:14:57 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/12/2011 5:09:28 PM, Crede wrote:
So which of the following debates would be most interesting to everybody?

1. The human predicament is true
- Man cannot live with an atheistic worldview and be consistent and objectively happy at the same time. Either he is consistent in his worldview and is objectively unhappy, or is happy but living in a lie to his worldview.


I have no idea how you'd be able to argue for the first one.

First, what do you think an atheistic worldview is?

Secondly, how do objectively measure happiness?

Thirdly, how can you say that an atheist is living a lie? An atheist is someone who hasn't been convinced that a God exists. What makes that depressing?
Official "High Priest of Secular Affairs and Transient Distributor of Sonic Apple Seeds relating to the Reptilian Division of Paperwork Immoliation" of The FREEDO Bureaucracy, a DDO branch of the Erisian Front, a subdivision of the Discordian Back, a Limb of the Illuminatian Cosmic Utensil Corp
Cerebral_Narcissist
Posts: 10,806
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9/12/2011 5:17:43 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/12/2011 5:14:57 PM, CosmicAlfonzo wrote:
At 9/12/2011 5:09:28 PM, Crede wrote:
So which of the following debates would be most interesting to everybody?

1. The human predicament is true
- Man cannot live with an atheistic worldview and be consistent and objectively happy at the same time. Either he is consistent in his worldview and is objectively unhappy, or is happy but living in a lie to his worldview.


I have no idea how you'd be able to argue for the first one.

First, what do you think an atheistic worldview is?

Secondly, how do objectively measure happiness?

Thirdly, how can you say that an atheist is living a lie? An atheist is someone who hasn't been convinced that a God exists. What makes that depressing?

Mortality, the lack of justice in the world, the fact that santa never brings presents.
I am voting for Innomen because of his intelligence, common sense, humility and the fact that Juggle appears to listen to him. Any other Presidential style would have a large sub-section of the site up in arms. If I was President I would destroy the site though elitism, others would let it run riot. Innomen represents a middle way that works, neither draconian nor anarchic and that is the only way things can work. Plus he does it all without ego trips.
CosmicAlfonzo
Posts: 5,955
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9/12/2011 5:24:26 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/12/2011 5:17:43 PM, Cerebral_Narcissist wrote:
At 9/12/2011 5:14:57 PM, CosmicAlfonzo wrote:
At 9/12/2011 5:09:28 PM, Crede wrote:
So which of the following debates would be most interesting to everybody?

1. The human predicament is true
- Man cannot live with an atheistic worldview and be consistent and objectively happy at the same time. Either he is consistent in his worldview and is objectively unhappy, or is happy but living in a lie to his worldview.


I have no idea how you'd be able to argue for the first one.

First, what do you think an atheistic worldview is?

Secondly, how do objectively measure happiness?

Thirdly, how can you say that an atheist is living a lie? An atheist is someone who hasn't been convinced that a God exists. What makes that depressing?

Mortality, the lack of justice in the world, the fact that santa never brings presents.

Yeah, and this is what causes depression.

The inability to accept reality for how it is. There is nothing depressing about any of that stuff. If those things are depressing, it is because you have a strong desire for those things.

It is desire that is at the root of that suffering, and desire frequently makes people incontent with how things actually are.

No, reality will not always line up with what you want it to be, but longing for something that can never be will just make you suffer even more.

In my experience, theists, especially the ones who have the craziest views, tend to be the most depressed.
Official "High Priest of Secular Affairs and Transient Distributor of Sonic Apple Seeds relating to the Reptilian Division of Paperwork Immoliation" of The FREEDO Bureaucracy, a DDO branch of the Erisian Front, a subdivision of the Discordian Back, a Limb of the Illuminatian Cosmic Utensil Corp
Wnope
Posts: 6,924
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9/12/2011 5:31:33 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/12/2011 5:09:28 PM, Crede wrote:
So which of the following debates would be most interesting to everybody?

1. The human predicament is true
- Man cannot live with an atheistic worldview and be consistent and objectively happy at the same time. Either he is consistent in his worldview and is objectively unhappy, or is happy but living in a lie to his worldview.

2. The Christian God still exists in face of "the problem of evil."


Whatcha think?

First one. The second has been done to death.
Cerebral_Narcissist
Posts: 10,806
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9/12/2011 5:58:57 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/12/2011 5:24:26 PM, CosmicAlfonzo wrote:
At 9/12/2011 5:17:43 PM, Cerebral_Narcissist wrote:
At 9/12/2011 5:14:57 PM, CosmicAlfonzo wrote:
At 9/12/2011 5:09:28 PM, Crede wrote:
So which of the following debates would be most interesting to everybody?

1. The human predicament is true
- Man cannot live with an atheistic worldview and be consistent and objectively happy at the same time. Either he is consistent in his worldview and is objectively unhappy, or is happy but living in a lie to his worldview.


I have no idea how you'd be able to argue for the first one.

First, what do you think an atheistic worldview is?

Secondly, how do objectively measure happiness?

Thirdly, how can you say that an atheist is living a lie? An atheist is someone who hasn't been convinced that a God exists. What makes that depressing?

Mortality, the lack of justice in the world, the fact that santa never brings presents.

Yeah, and this is what causes depression.

The inability to accept reality for how it is. There is nothing depressing about any of that stuff. If those things are depressing, it is because you have a strong desire for those things.

It is desire that is at the root of that suffering, and desire frequently makes people incontent with how things actually are.

No, reality will not always line up with what you want it to be, but longing for something that can never be will just make you suffer even more.


In my experience, theists, especially the ones who have the craziest views, tend to be the most depressed.

That's because they don't believe, they are just lying.
I am voting for Innomen because of his intelligence, common sense, humility and the fact that Juggle appears to listen to him. Any other Presidential style would have a large sub-section of the site up in arms. If I was President I would destroy the site though elitism, others would let it run riot. Innomen represents a middle way that works, neither draconian nor anarchic and that is the only way things can work. Plus he does it all without ego trips.
CosmicAlfonzo
Posts: 5,955
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9/12/2011 6:11:34 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/12/2011 5:58:57 PM, Cerebral_Narcissist wrote:
At 9/12/2011 5:24:26 PM, CosmicAlfonzo wrote:
At 9/12/2011 5:17:43 PM, Cerebral_Narcissist wrote:
At 9/12/2011 5:14:57 PM, CosmicAlfonzo wrote:
At 9/12/2011 5:09:28 PM, Crede wrote:
So which of the following debates would be most interesting to everybody?

1. The human predicament is true
- Man cannot live with an atheistic worldview and be consistent and objectively happy at the same time. Either he is consistent in his worldview and is objectively unhappy, or is happy but living in a lie to his worldview.


I have no idea how you'd be able to argue for the first one.

First, what do you think an atheistic worldview is?

Secondly, how do objectively measure happiness?

Thirdly, how can you say that an atheist is living a lie? An atheist is someone who hasn't been convinced that a God exists. What makes that depressing?

Mortality, the lack of justice in the world, the fact that santa never brings presents.

Yeah, and this is what causes depression.

The inability to accept reality for how it is. There is nothing depressing about any of that stuff. If those things are depressing, it is because you have a strong desire for those things.

It is desire that is at the root of that suffering, and desire frequently makes people incontent with how things actually are.

No, reality will not always line up with what you want it to be, but longing for something that can never be will just make you suffer even more.


In my experience, theists, especially the ones who have the craziest views, tend to be the most depressed.

That's because they don't believe, they are just lying.

I'm not going to argue with you there.
Official "High Priest of Secular Affairs and Transient Distributor of Sonic Apple Seeds relating to the Reptilian Division of Paperwork Immoliation" of The FREEDO Bureaucracy, a DDO branch of the Erisian Front, a subdivision of the Discordian Back, a Limb of the Illuminatian Cosmic Utensil Corp
JustCallMeTarzan
Posts: 1,922
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9/12/2011 7:51:02 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/12/2011 6:17:39 PM, Crede wrote:
So I'm hearing number 1 huh?

Not that there is really any "debate" on the issue of objective happiness, yes.

If you are willing to admit that some activity makes you happy (i.e. dancing in the rain), while the same activity would make me pissed, wet, and unhappy.... then you've admitted that happiness is subjective.
Crede
Posts: 455
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9/12/2011 8:13:05 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
Without showing all of my points I'd basically be stating that objective happiness must be based on something objective. Moreover objective meaning, value, and purpose. These, in order to be objective, would have to be transcendent from man, external from our subjective parameters pushed onto these ideas, and therefore come from God. So under this thought an Atheist could not be objectively happy if he were consistent with the idea that God does not exist. Or he could at some level lie about his worldview (making his worldview inconsistent) in order to be objectively happy in relation to real meaning, value and purpose.
CosmicAlfonzo
Posts: 5,955
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9/12/2011 8:36:39 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
Sure, I'll debate you. Just write it up, and send the challenge.
Official "High Priest of Secular Affairs and Transient Distributor of Sonic Apple Seeds relating to the Reptilian Division of Paperwork Immoliation" of The FREEDO Bureaucracy, a DDO branch of the Erisian Front, a subdivision of the Discordian Back, a Limb of the Illuminatian Cosmic Utensil Corp
medic0506
Posts: 13,450
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9/13/2011 9:52:35 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 9/12/2011 5:09:28 PM, Crede wrote:
So which of the following debates would be most interesting to everybody?

1. The human predicament is true
- Man cannot live with an atheistic worldview and be consistent and objectively happy at the same time. Either he is consistent in his worldview and is objectively unhappy, or is happy but living in a lie to his worldview.

2. The Christian God still exists in face of "the problem of evil."


Whatcha think?

I think either would make for an interesting debate. I'd like to see a decisive victory over the problem of evil.
Crede
Posts: 455
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9/13/2011 11:40:59 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
I will do the problem of evil as well. I have new evidences that I have not seen be brought up in this site. I have logical, philisophical, and emotional evidences.