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The Lord's Name in vain

CosmicAlfonzo
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10/16/2011 8:04:56 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
Technically, every time you say a prayer in the name of your deity, and it goes unfulfilled, you have used the lord's name in vain.

Lesson learned....

Don't invoke your god to perform magic.
Official "High Priest of Secular Affairs and Transient Distributor of Sonic Apple Seeds relating to the Reptilian Division of Paperwork Immoliation" of The FREEDO Bureaucracy, a DDO branch of the Erisian Front, a subdivision of the Discordian Back, a Limb of the Illuminatian Cosmic Utensil Corp
DetectableNinja
Posts: 6,042
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10/16/2011 8:11:48 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
Think'st thou heaven is such a glorious thing?
I tell thee, 'tis not half so fair as thou
Or any man that breathes on earth.

- Christopher Marlowe, Doctor Faustus
CosmicAlfonzo
Posts: 5,955
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10/16/2011 1:57:43 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
Think about it though, it's totally true, eh?
Official "High Priest of Secular Affairs and Transient Distributor of Sonic Apple Seeds relating to the Reptilian Division of Paperwork Immoliation" of The FREEDO Bureaucracy, a DDO branch of the Erisian Front, a subdivision of the Discordian Back, a Limb of the Illuminatian Cosmic Utensil Corp
Cerebral_Narcissist
Posts: 10,806
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10/16/2011 2:21:25 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/16/2011 1:57:43 PM, CosmicAlfonzo wrote:
Think about it though, it's totally true, eh?

Well no because God still appreciates that you took the time to call him up, even though you should probably be trying to avoid the disaster that motivated you to pray in the first place!
I am voting for Innomen because of his intelligence, common sense, humility and the fact that Juggle appears to listen to him. Any other Presidential style would have a large sub-section of the site up in arms. If I was President I would destroy the site though elitism, others would let it run riot. Innomen represents a middle way that works, neither draconian nor anarchic and that is the only way things can work. Plus he does it all without ego trips.
CosmicAlfonzo
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10/16/2011 2:28:05 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
Well, thanking God for this bountiful harvest and all that wouldn't really be in vain, but praying for your penis to grow 3 inches would probably fall under this category.

Unless you are 11. You'll probably get your wish then.
Official "High Priest of Secular Affairs and Transient Distributor of Sonic Apple Seeds relating to the Reptilian Division of Paperwork Immoliation" of The FREEDO Bureaucracy, a DDO branch of the Erisian Front, a subdivision of the Discordian Back, a Limb of the Illuminatian Cosmic Utensil Corp
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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10/16/2011 4:02:38 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
When you say " God bless America," that's a sin.... stupid christian republicans :p
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
Gileandos
Posts: 2,394
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10/16/2011 7:09:35 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/16/2011 2:12:49 PM, Wnope wrote:
Praying: Just in Case God's Plan Isn't Right

God cannot interfere in your life without you directly requesting it.

He will not violate your freewill.

If you pray for God to help you, He can then help you.
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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10/16/2011 8:26:23 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/16/2011 7:09:35 PM, Gileandos wrote:
At 10/16/2011 2:12:49 PM, Wnope wrote:
Praying: Just in Case God's Plan Isn't Right

God cannot interfere in your life without you directly requesting it.

He will not violate your freewill.

If you pray for God to help you, He can then help you.

The Jews prayed and prayed before they were incinerated in ovens and massacred in the gas chambers. Many of the innocent people In WTC1 and 2 were praying for their lives before the steel gave way and the building collapsed into rubble, murdering them all. I wonder how many people prayed right before the 2004 tsunami in the Indian Ocean drowned them all.

I'm not sure I even care to hear your fabricated explanation for these events, because I'm sure they'd either make me sick or angry. Just know that there is no such thing as a miracle. There cannot be a system where one individual prays to win the lottery, wins, and credits Christianity, while men and women are killed senselessly for no reason despite their pleads and prayers. Reality is not subject to influence by any force beyond this universe. Perhaps there is a heaven, perhaps, I would hope there is, but the notion that the lord can descend on Earth upon demand and steer the course of lives is heinously absurd and intellectually dishonest.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
CosmicAlfonzo
Posts: 5,955
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10/16/2011 8:26:27 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
unless god doesn't, then you are using the lord's name in vain.
Official "High Priest of Secular Affairs and Transient Distributor of Sonic Apple Seeds relating to the Reptilian Division of Paperwork Immoliation" of The FREEDO Bureaucracy, a DDO branch of the Erisian Front, a subdivision of the Discordian Back, a Limb of the Illuminatian Cosmic Utensil Corp
seraine
Posts: 734
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10/16/2011 8:43:40 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/16/2011 7:09:35 PM, Gileandos wrote:
At 10/16/2011 2:12:49 PM, Wnope wrote:
Praying: Just in Case God's Plan Isn't Right

God cannot interfere in your life without you directly requesting it.

He will not violate your freewill.

If you pray for God to help you, He can then help you.

If god is omnibenevolent and omnipotent, why did he deny so many peoples' prayer before they were killed by a tsunami in 2004?
Deathbeforedishonour
Posts: 1,058
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10/16/2011 8:50:52 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/16/2011 7:09:35 PM, Gileandos wrote:
At 10/16/2011 2:12:49 PM, Wnope wrote:
Praying: Just in Case God's Plan Isn't Right

God cannot interfere in your life without you directly requesting it.

He will not violate your freewill.

If you pray for God to help you, He can then help you.

According to the Bible the ancient Isrealites were slaves in Egypt fot 700 years before god decided to do something about. It seems to me that even if god existed, he is a little too late. :P
"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God." ~ John 1:1

Matthew 10:22- "And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that endureth to the end shall be saved."
Gileandos
Posts: 2,394
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10/16/2011 9:14:14 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/16/2011 8:43:40 PM, seraine wrote:
At 10/16/2011 7:09:35 PM, Gileandos wrote:
At 10/16/2011 2:12:49 PM, Wnope wrote:
Praying: Just in Case God's Plan Isn't Right

God cannot interfere in your life without you directly requesting it.

He will not violate your freewill.

If you pray for God to help you, He can then help you.

If god is omnibenevolent and omnipotent, why did he deny so many peoples' prayer before they were killed by a tsunami in 2004?

Do you have any examples of people who prayed and did not survive?
Gileandos
Posts: 2,394
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10/16/2011 9:26:34 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/16/2011 8:50:52 PM, Deathbeforedishonour wrote:
At 10/16/2011 7:09:35 PM, Gileandos wrote:
At 10/16/2011 2:12:49 PM, Wnope wrote:
Praying: Just in Case God's Plan Isn't Right

God cannot interfere in your life without you directly requesting it.

He will not violate your freewill.

If you pray for God to help you, He can then help you.

According to the Bible the ancient Isrealites were slaves in Egypt fot 700 years before god decided to do something about. It seems to me that even if god existed, he is a little too late. :P

It was less than 400 years but an unknown timeframe.
From my understanding of the Bible the suffering of the Jews was due to unbelief. When the nation was believing enough God led them out. They again failed and God killed them all off. If not for the intercession of Moses they would have all died very quickly.

You cannot pray to God on one hand while rejecting Him on the other.

A new believer can do such things as they are growing but once confronted with this fact, they must rest solely in God.

Same concept. If your wife is telling you she loves you but is sleeping with 10 other men. She asks for a vacation from her work so she can go out with her lovers but wants you to pay for it.

How accommodating should you be?
Cerebral_Narcissist
Posts: 10,806
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10/17/2011 2:38:47 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/16/2011 8:43:40 PM, seraine wrote:
At 10/16/2011 7:09:35 PM, Gileandos wrote:
At 10/16/2011 2:12:49 PM, Wnope wrote:
Praying: Just in Case God's Plan Isn't Right

God cannot interfere in your life without you directly requesting it.

He will not violate your freewill.

If you pray for God to help you, He can then help you.

If god is omnibenevolent and omnipotent, why did he deny so many peoples' prayer before they were killed by a tsunami in 2004?

a) Because their deaths ultimately served the greater good, should they have lived the world would contain greater suffering and less happiness.

b) God is not omnibenevolent, omnipotent and omniscient, perhaps one, perhaps two, but not all three.
I am voting for Innomen because of his intelligence, common sense, humility and the fact that Juggle appears to listen to him. Any other Presidential style would have a large sub-section of the site up in arms. If I was President I would destroy the site though elitism, others would let it run riot. Innomen represents a middle way that works, neither draconian nor anarchic and that is the only way things can work. Plus he does it all without ego trips.
000ike
Posts: 11,196
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10/17/2011 5:30:42 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/17/2011 2:38:47 AM, Cerebral_Narcissist wrote:
At 10/16/2011 8:43:40 PM, seraine wrote:
At 10/16/2011 7:09:35 PM, Gileandos wrote:
At 10/16/2011 2:12:49 PM, Wnope wrote:
Praying: Just in Case God's Plan Isn't Right

God cannot interfere in your life without you directly requesting it.

He will not violate your freewill.

If you pray for God to help you, He can then help you.

If god is omnibenevolent and omnipotent, why did he deny so many peoples' prayer before they were killed by a tsunami in 2004?

a) Because their deaths ultimately served the greater good, should they have lived the world would contain greater suffering and less happiness.

b) God is not omnibenevolent, omnipotent and omniscient, perhaps one, perhaps two, but not all three.

Guys, he got that example from me. Read my response to Gileandos's nonsense on the first page of this thread.
"A stupid despot may constrain his slaves with iron chains; but a true politician binds them even more strongly with the chain of their own ideas" - Michel Foucault
Gileandos
Posts: 2,394
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10/17/2011 10:02:59 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/16/2011 8:26:23 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 10/16/2011 7:09:35 PM, Gileandos wrote:
At 10/16/2011 2:12:49 PM, Wnope wrote:
Praying: Just in Case God's Plan Isn't Right

God cannot interfere in your life without you directly requesting it.

He will not violate your freewill.

If you pray for God to help you, He can then help you.

The Jews prayed and prayed before they were incinerated in ovens and massacred in the gas chambers. Many of the innocent people In WTC1 and 2 were praying for their lives before the steel gave way and the building collapsed into rubble, murdering them all. I wonder how many people prayed right before the 2004 tsunami in the Indian Ocean drowned them all.

I'm not sure I even care to hear your fabricated explanation for these events, because I'm sure they'd either make me sick or angry. Just know that there is no such thing as a miracle. There cannot be a system where one individual prays to win the lottery, wins, and credits Christianity, while men and women are killed senselessly for no reason despite their pleads and prayers. Reality is not subject to influence by any force beyond this universe. Perhaps there is a heaven, perhaps, I would hope there is, but the notion that the lord can descend on Earth upon demand and steer the course of lives is heinously absurd and intellectually dishonest.

If you really want an answer I can offer one.
A genuine prayer to God with no rejection of God will receive an answer.

I can offer countless examples and testimonies of this.

The Jews are a special people. They claim to follow God but in turn do evil God does not step in to protect them.
Holiness is the greatest call of the Bible.

For Christians and Jews both, they must practice the commands of God to obtain deliverance from the hand of God.

Not my opinion but the explanation that God gives to the Jews in the Bible. Not only did Jerusalem fall but God promised the survivers would be killed by the enemies too.

NIV
Jerusalem's Fall Explained:
21 In the twelfth year of our exile, in the tenth month on the fifth day, a man who had escaped from Jerusalem came to me and said, "The city has fallen!" 22 Now the evening before the man arrived, the hand of the LORD was on me, and he opened my mouth before the man came to me in the morning. So my mouth was opened and I was no longer silent.
23 Then the word of the LORD came to me: 24 "Son of man, the people living in those ruins in the land of Israel are saying, ‘Abraham was only one man, yet he possessed the land. But we are many; surely the land has been given to us as our possession.' 25 Therefore say to them, ‘This is what the Sovereign LORD says: Since you eat meat with the blood still in it and look to your idols and shed blood, should you then possess the land? 26 You rely on your sword, you do detestable things, and each of you defiles his neighbor's wife. Should you then possess the land?'

27 "Say this to them: ‘This is what the Sovereign LORD says: As surely as I live, those who are left in the ruins will fall by the sword, those out in the country I will give to the wild animals to be devoured, and those in strongholds and caves will die of a plague. 28 I will make the land a desolate waste, and her proud strength will come to an end, and the mountains of Israel will become desolate so that no one will cross them. 29 Then they will know that I am the LORD, when I have made the land a desolate waste because of all the detestable things they have done.'

30 "As for you, son of man, your people are talking together about you by the walls and at the doors of the houses, saying to each other, ‘Come and hear the message that has come from the LORD.' 31 My people come to you, as they usually do, and sit before you to hear your words, but they do not put them into practice. Their mouths speak of love, but their hearts are greedy for unjust gain. 32 Indeed, to them you are nothing more than one who sings love songs with a beautiful voice and plays an instrument well, for they hear your words but do not put them into practice.

33 "When all this comes true—and it surely will—then they will know that a prophet has been among them."
gerrandesquire
Posts: 1,258
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10/17/2011 10:03:53 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/16/2011 9:26:34 PM, Gileandos wrote:
At 10/16/2011 8:50:52 PM, Deathbeforedishonour wrote:
At 10/16/2011 7:09:35 PM, Gileandos wrote:
At 10/16/2011 2:12:49 PM, Wnope wrote:
Praying: Just in Case God's Plan Isn't Right

God cannot interfere in your life without you directly requesting it.

He will not violate your freewill.

If you pray for God to help you, He can then help you.

According to the Bible the ancient Isrealites were slaves in Egypt fot 700 years before god decided to do something about. It seems to me that even if god existed, he is a little too late. :P

It was less than 400 years but an unknown timeframe.
From my understanding of the Bible the suffering of the Jews was due to unbelief. When the nation was believing enough God led them out. They again failed and God killed them all off. If not for the intercession of Moses they would have all died very quickly.

You cannot pray to God on one hand while rejecting Him on the other.

A new believer can do such things as they are growing but once confronted with this fact, they must rest solely in God.

Same concept. If your wife is telling you she loves you but is sleeping with 10 other men. She asks for a vacation from her work so she can go out with her lovers but wants you to pay for it.

How accommodating should you be?

1. A man's response to a situation would be different from gods to the same situation.

2.God killed the Jews off because they didn't believe in him, is this seriously what you are trying to say? And that if I dont believe in him, it is morally permissible for the benevolent Jesus to kill me too?
Gileandos
Posts: 2,394
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10/17/2011 10:21:37 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/17/2011 10:03:53 AM, gerrandesquire wrote:
At 10/16/2011 9:26:34 PM, Gileandos wrote:
At 10/16/2011 8:50:52 PM, Deathbeforedishonour wrote:
At 10/16/2011 7:09:35 PM, Gileandos wrote:
At 10/16/2011 2:12:49 PM, Wnope wrote:
Praying: Just in Case God's Plan Isn't Right

God cannot interfere in your life without you directly requesting it.

He will not violate your freewill.

If you pray for God to help you, He can then help you.

According to the Bible the ancient Isrealites were slaves in Egypt fot 700 years before god decided to do something about. It seems to me that even if god existed, he is a little too late. :P

It was less than 400 years but an unknown timeframe.
From my understanding of the Bible the suffering of the Jews was due to unbelief. When the nation was believing enough God led them out. They again failed and God killed them all off. If not for the intercession of Moses they would have all died very quickly.

You cannot pray to God on one hand while rejecting Him on the other.

A new believer can do such things as they are growing but once confronted with this fact, they must rest solely in God.

Same concept. If your wife is telling you she loves you but is sleeping with 10 other men. She asks for a vacation from her work so she can go out with her lovers but wants you to pay for it.

How accommodating should you be?

1. A man's response to a situation would be different from gods to the same situation.

2.God killed the Jews off because they didn't believe in him, is this seriously what you are trying to say? And that if I dont believe in him, it is morally permissible for the benevolent Jesus to kill me too?

Correct on both counts.
Jesus' second return will be one with a sword and violence to his enemies.

That is your personal definition of benevolent.

If my son became a murderer, you would no longer define me as benevolent if I agreed or even performed the execution?

Of course not. The benevolence of God has always been understood only to be towards a selective group. The good people. This includes Jesus below. Jesus even prophesied about the destruction of Jerusalem in Luke 19.

Here is Old Testament:
Zephaniah 1:14-15 (NIV) "The great day of the LORD is near-- near and coming quickly. Listen! The cry on the day of the LORD will be bitter, the shouting of the warrior there. 15 That day will be a day of wrath, a day of distress and anguish, a day of trouble and ruin, a day of darkness and gloom, a day of clouds and blackness,

Zephaniah 1:18 (NIV) Neither their silver nor their gold will be able to save them on the day of the Lord's wrath. In the fire of his jealousy the whole world will be consumed, for he will make a sudden end of all who live in the earth."

Here is New Testament:
Revelation 19:15-16 says, "Out of his mouth comes a sharp sword with which to strike down the nations. 'He will rule them with an iron scepter.' He treads the winepress of the fury of the wrath of God Almighty. On his robe and on his thigh he has this name written: KING OF KINGS AND LORD OF LORDS."

and Jesus specifically:
The Parable of the Ten Minas
11 While they were listening to this, he went on to tell them a parable, because he was near Jerusalem and the people thought that the kingdom of God was going to appear at once. 12 He said: "A man of noble birth went to a distant country to have himself appointed king and then to return. 13 So he called ten of his servants and gave them ten minas.[a] ‘Put this money to work,' he said, ‘until I come back.'
14 "But his subjects hated him and sent a delegation after him to say, ‘We don't want this man to be our king.'

15 "He was made king, however, and returned home. Then he sent for the servants to whom he had given the money, in order to find out what they had gained with it.

16 "The first one came and said, ‘Sir, your mina has earned ten more.'

17 "‘Well done, my good servant!' his master replied. ‘Because you have been trustworthy in a very small matter, take charge of ten cities.'

18 "The second came and said, ‘Sir, your mina has earned five more.'

19 "His master answered, ‘You take charge of five cities.'

20 "Then another servant came and said, ‘Sir, here is your mina; I have kept it laid away in a piece of cloth. 21 I was afraid of you, because you are a hard man. You take out what you did not put in and reap what you did not sow.'

22 "His master replied, ‘I will judge you by your own words, you wicked servant! You knew, did you, that I am a hard man, taking out what I did not put in, and reaping what I did not sow? 23 Why then didn't you put my money on deposit, so that when I came back, I could have collected it with interest?'

24 "Then he said to those standing by, ‘Take his mina away from him and give it to the one who has ten minas.'

25 "‘Sir,' they said, ‘he already has ten!'

26 "He replied, ‘I tell you that to everyone who has, more will be given, but as for the one who has nothing, even what they have will be taken away. 27 But those enemies of mine who did not want me to be king over them—bring them here and kill them in front of me.'"
Gileandos
Posts: 2,394
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10/17/2011 11:28:29 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
Sure here you go.

Correct on both counts.
Jesus' second return will be one with a sword and violence to his enemies.

That is your personal definition of benevolent.

If my son became a murderer, you would no longer define me as benevolent if I agreed or even performed the execution?

Of course not. The benevolence of God has always been understood only to be towards a selective group. The good people. This includes Jesus below. Jesus even prophesied about the destruction of Jerusalem in Luke 19.

Here is Old Testament:
Zephaniah 1:14-15 (NIV) "The great day of the LORD is near-- near and coming quickly. Listen! The cry on the day of the LORD will be bitter, the shouting of the warrior there. 15 That day will be a day of wrath, a day of distress and anguish, a day of trouble and ruin, a day of darkness and gloom, a day of clouds and blackness,

Zephaniah 1:18 (NIV) Neither their silver nor their gold will be able to save them on the day of the Lord's wrath. In the fire of his jealousy the whole world will be consumed, for he will make a sudden end of all who live in the earth."


Here is New Testament:
Revelation 19:15-16 says, "Out of his mouth comes a sharp sword with which to strike down the nations. 'He will rule them with an iron scepter.' He treads the winepress of the fury of the wrath of God Almighty. On his robe and on his thigh he has this name written: KING OF KINGS AND LORD OF LORDS."

and Jesus specifically:
The Parable of the Ten Minas
11 While they were listening to this, he went on to tell them a parable, because he was near Jerusalem and the people thought that the kingdom of God was going to appear at once. 12 He said: "A man of noble birth went to a distant country to have himself appointed king and then to return. 13 So he called ten of his servants and gave them ten minas.[a] ‘Put this money to work,' he said, ‘until I come back.'
14 "But his subjects hated him and sent a delegation after him to say, ‘We don't want this man to be our king.'

15 "He was made king, however, and returned home. Then he sent for the servants to whom he had given the money, in order to find out what they had gained with it.

16 "The first one came and said, ‘Sir, your mina has earned ten more.'

17 "‘Well done, my good servant!' his master replied. ‘Because you have been trustworthy in a very small matter, take charge of ten cities.'

18 "The second came and said, ‘Sir, your mina has earned five more.'

19 "His master answered, ‘You take charge of five cities.'

20 "Then another servant came and said, ‘Sir, here is your mina; I have kept it laid away in a piece of cloth. 21 I was afraid of you, because you are a hard man. You take out what you did not put in and reap what you did not sow.'

22 "His master replied, ‘I will judge you by your own words, you wicked servant! You knew, did you, that I am a hard man, taking out what I did not put in, and reaping what I did not sow? 23 Why then didn't you put my money on deposit, so that when I came back, I could have collected it with interest?'

24 "Then he said to those standing by, ‘Take his mina away from him and give it to the one who has ten minas.'

25 "‘Sir,' they said, ‘he already has ten!'

26 "He replied, ‘I tell you that to everyone who has, more will be given, but as for the one who has nothing, even what they have will be taken away. 27 But those enemies of mine who did not want me to be king over them—bring them here and kill them in front of me.'"
gerrandesquire
Posts: 1,258
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10/17/2011 12:22:01 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/17/2011 11:28:29 AM, Gileandos wrote:
Sure here you go.
Thanks.

Correct on both counts.
Jesus' second return will be one with a sword and violence to his enemies.

That is your personal definition of benevolent.

What is your definition of benevolence? Love those who love and believe in you and kill the rest?

If my son became a murderer, you would no longer define me as benevolent if I agreed or even performed the execution?

If you have two sons, one of whom performed the murder, and you killed both of them, then certainly you won't fit the definition of benevolent. Specifically if the second son begged you to save him.

Of course not. The benevolence of God has always been understood only to be towards a selective group. The good people. This includes Jesus below. Jesus even prophesied about the destruction of Jerusalem in Luke 19.

Here is Old Testament:
Zephaniah 1:14-15 (NIV) "The great day of the LORD is near-- near and coming quickly. Listen! The cry on the day of the LORD will be bitter, the shouting of the warrior there. 15 That day will be a day of wrath, a day of distress and anguish, a day of trouble and ruin, a day of darkness and gloom, a day of clouds and blackness,

Zephaniah 1:18 (NIV) Neither their silver nor their gold will be able to save them on the day of the Lord's wrath. In the fire of his jealousy the whole world will be consumed, for he will make a sudden end of all who live in the earth."


Here is New Testament:
Revelation 19:15-16 says, "Out of his mouth comes a sharp sword with which to strike down the nations. 'He will rule them with an iron scepter.' He treads the winepress of the fury of the wrath of God Almighty. On his robe and on his thigh he has this name written: KING OF KINGS AND LORD OF LORDS."

and Jesus specifically:
The Parable of the Ten Minas
11 While they were listening to this, he went on to tell them a parable, because he was near Jerusalem and the people thought that the kingdom of God was going to appear at once. 12 He said: "A man of noble birth went to a distant country to have himself appointed king and then to return. 13 So he called ten of his servants and gave them ten minas.[a] ‘Put this money to work,' he said, ‘until I come back.'
14 "But his subjects hated him and sent a delegation after him to say, ‘We don't want this man to be our king.'

15 "He was made king, however, and returned home. Then he sent for the servants to whom he had given the money, in order to find out what they had gained with it.

16 "The first one came and said, ‘Sir, your mina has earned ten more.'

17 "‘Well done, my good servant!' his master replied. ‘Because you have been trustworthy in a very small matter, take charge of ten cities.'

18 "The second came and said, ‘Sir, your mina has earned five more.'

19 "His master answered, ‘You take charge of five cities.'

20 "Then another servant came and said, ‘Sir, here is your mina; I have kept it laid away in a piece of cloth. 21 I was afraid of you, because you are a hard man. You take out what you did not put in and reap what you did not sow.'

22 "His master replied, ‘I will judge you by your own words, you wicked servant! You knew, did you, that I am a hard man, taking out what I did not put in, and reaping what I did not sow? 23 Why then didn't you put my money on deposit, so that when I came back, I could have collected it with interest?'

24 "Then he said to those standing by, ‘Take his mina away from him and give it to the one who has ten minas.'

25 "‘Sir,' they said, ‘he already has ten!'

26 "He replied, ‘I tell you that to everyone who has, more will be given, but as for the one who has nothing, even what they have will be taken away. 27 But those enemies of mine who did not want me to be king over them—bring them here and kill them in front of me.'"

I haven't really read the bible, but going just by what you posted, if it is literal, is really sad. Kill the people who dont support me being a king? That is not the definition of kind or benevolent. The person THought he was good, not enough evidence for him to kill others on disagreement.
innomen
Posts: 10,052
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10/17/2011 12:34:35 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/16/2011 2:21:25 PM, Cerebral_Narcissist wrote:
At 10/16/2011 1:57:43 PM, CosmicAlfonzo wrote:
Think about it though, it's totally true, eh?

Well no because God still appreciates that you took the time to call him up, even though you should probably be trying to avoid the disaster that motivated you to pray in the first place!

You make a better Christian than i do. Essentially i agree that any attempt at a conscious contact with God is good, even if the net result isn't what you want. A lot like calling your mother, it's a good thing to do, even though you don't really see the benefit.
CosmicAlfonzo
Posts: 5,955
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10/17/2011 1:07:01 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
Prayer in itself is a form of magic that has many psychological uses. It is a type of prayer that is primarily aimed at the self, unless you are praying over another person.

However, I still say that if you pray for someone to be cured of cancer, and they die of cancer... It could be said that you are using the lord's name in vain.
Official "High Priest of Secular Affairs and Transient Distributor of Sonic Apple Seeds relating to the Reptilian Division of Paperwork Immoliation" of The FREEDO Bureaucracy, a DDO branch of the Erisian Front, a subdivision of the Discordian Back, a Limb of the Illuminatian Cosmic Utensil Corp
Cerebral_Narcissist
Posts: 10,806
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10/17/2011 1:22:28 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/17/2011 12:34:35 PM, innomen wrote:
At 10/16/2011 2:21:25 PM, Cerebral_Narcissist wrote:
At 10/16/2011 1:57:43 PM, CosmicAlfonzo wrote:
Think about it though, it's totally true, eh?

Well no because God still appreciates that you took the time to call him up, even though you should probably be trying to avoid the disaster that motivated you to pray in the first place!

You make a better Christian than i do.

How very dare you!

Essentially i agree that any attempt at a conscious contact with God is good, even if the net result isn't what you want. A lot like calling your mother, it's a good thing to do, even though you don't really see the benefit.

Haha, I like it.
I am voting for Innomen because of his intelligence, common sense, humility and the fact that Juggle appears to listen to him. Any other Presidential style would have a large sub-section of the site up in arms. If I was President I would destroy the site though elitism, others would let it run riot. Innomen represents a middle way that works, neither draconian nor anarchic and that is the only way things can work. Plus he does it all without ego trips.
brian_eggleston
Posts: 3,347
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10/17/2011 1:29:02 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/17/2011 10:02:59 AM, Gileandos wrote:
At 10/16/2011 8:26:23 PM, 000ike wrote:
At 10/16/2011 7:09:35 PM, Gileandos wrote:
At 10/16/2011 2:12:49 PM, Wnope wrote:
Praying: Just in Case God's Plan Isn't Right

God cannot interfere in your life without you directly requesting it.

He will not violate your freewill.

If you pray for God to help you, He can then help you.

The Jews prayed and prayed before they were incinerated in ovens and massacred in the gas chambers. Many of the innocent people In WTC1 and 2 were praying for their lives before the steel gave way and the building collapsed into rubble, murdering them all. I wonder how many people prayed right before the 2004 tsunami in the Indian Ocean drowned them all.

I'm not sure I even care to hear your fabricated explanation for these events, because I'm sure they'd either make me sick or angry. Just know that there is no such thing as a miracle. There cannot be a system where one individual prays to win the lottery, wins, and credits Christianity, while men and women are killed senselessly for no reason despite their pleads and prayers. Reality is not subject to influence by any force beyond this universe. Perhaps there is a heaven, perhaps, I would hope there is, but the notion that the lord can descend on Earth upon demand and steer the course of lives is heinously absurd and intellectually dishonest.

If you really want an answer I can offer one.
A genuine prayer to God with no rejection of God will receive an answer.

I can offer countless examples and testimonies of this.

The Jews are a special people. They claim to follow God but in turn do evil God does not step in to protect them.

Did you mean "God does not step in to prevent them"?
Visit the burglars' bulletin board: http://www.break-in-news.com...
DanT
Posts: 5,693
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10/17/2011 3:11:13 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/16/2011 8:04:56 AM, CosmicAlfonzo wrote:
Technically, every time you say a prayer in the name of your deity, and it goes unfulfilled, you have used the lord's name in vain.


Lesson learned....

Don't invoke your god to perform magic.

You need to understand Ancient Hebrew texts more clearly. You have it half right.

In ancient times, if one knew how he could control Angels in order to perform tasks. Since one could control angels, they could also control Demons, since Demons are fallen angels.

King Solomon build the Temple of Solomon using a ring that allowed him to control Demons.

Now back to the part about invoking God's name.

Eve was not Adam's 1st wife, Lilith was. Lilith and Adam got into a dispute because Adam wouldn't let her be on top, and God sided with Adam...
So the snake told Lilith that if she spoke God's name aloud she would gain the power of God.
Lilith yelled God's name aloud, often represented as YHWH, and than left the garden of Eden, where she mated with an Demon known as Samael. God sent 3 angels after Lilith, and their task was to kill 100 of Lilith's offspring each day until she agreed to come back to Adam.

When Lilith refused, God made Eve from Adam's rib, and Lilith swore to torment the children of Adam and Eve for all eternity. Invoking the names of the 3 angels who are to kill Lilith's children, would save Adam and Eve's children from Lilith's rath. The names are Senoy, Sansenoy, and Semangelof; and the invocation of their names is where the term lullaby comes from (lilith bye).

Lilith is considered to no longer be Human since she spoke God's name. She is considered a Quasi-Demon of the night.

The reason invoking God's name in vain is a sin, is because it's a very powerful invocation, that shouldn't be taken lightly, and can easily corrupt a person.

A prayer is a request, invoking God's name is a demand.
"Chemical weapons are no different than any other types of weapons."~Lordknukle
Wnope
Posts: 6,924
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10/17/2011 3:20:00 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/16/2011 9:14:14 PM, Gileandos wrote:
At 10/16/2011 8:43:40 PM, seraine wrote:
At 10/16/2011 7:09:35 PM, Gileandos wrote:
At 10/16/2011 2:12:49 PM, Wnope wrote:
Praying: Just in Case God's Plan Isn't Right

God cannot interfere in your life without you directly requesting it.

He will not violate your freewill.

If you pray for God to help you, He can then help you.

If god is omnibenevolent and omnipotent, why did he deny so many peoples' prayer before they were killed by a tsunami in 2004?

Do you have any examples of people who prayed and did not survive?

You see no problem with asking this question?

I may as well ask how many people were hopping on one foot and did not survive.

THEY DIDN'T SURVIVE, WE DON'T KNOW.

However, I find it extremely hard to believe that with, conservatively estimated, 80% of a population being religious, a fair amount wouldn't think to ask God not to kill them.

You can't actually be claiming that everyone who prayed to survive the tsnumai survived, are you?

I can personally attest to knowing very religious people who did not come back from similar tragedies and I guarantee they were praying all the way down.
Gileandos
Posts: 2,394
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10/17/2011 3:29:01 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/17/2011 3:20:00 PM, Wnope wrote:
At 10/16/2011 9:14:14 PM, Gileandos wrote:
At 10/16/2011 8:43:40 PM, seraine wrote:
At 10/16/2011 7:09:35 PM, Gileandos wrote:
At 10/16/2011 2:12:49 PM, Wnope wrote:
Praying: Just in Case God's Plan Isn't Right

God cannot interfere in your life without you directly requesting it.

He will not violate your freewill.

If you pray for God to help you, He can then help you.

If god is omnibenevolent and omnipotent, why did he deny so many peoples' prayer before they were killed by a tsunami in 2004?

Do you have any examples of people who prayed and did not survive?

You see no problem with asking this question?

I may as well ask how many people were hopping on one foot and did not survive.

THEY DIDN'T SURVIVE, WE DON'T KNOW.

However, I find it extremely hard to believe that with, conservatively estimated, 80% of a population being religious, a fair amount wouldn't think to ask God not to kill them.

You can't actually be claiming that everyone who prayed to survive the tsnumai survived, are you?

I can personally attest to knowing very religious people who did not come back from similar tragedies and I guarantee they were praying all the way down.

We can do the numbers. Of people in the affected area what was the death percentage?
Of the survivors in the affected area how many claim to have prayed?
How many credit God for their survival?

What was the Christian percentages vs others?
Gileandos
Posts: 2,394
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10/17/2011 3:40:57 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 10/17/2011 12:22:01 PM, gerrandesquire wrote:
At 10/17/2011 11:28:29 AM, Gileandos wrote:
That is your personal definition of benevolent.

What is your definition of benevolence? Love those who love and believe in you and kill the rest?

I thought it was clear. Benevolence toward good people and repentent people. Actively bad people should be slaughtered outright.
If a person is abducting little girls in New York City and tieing them bads to be raped for the profit of the abductor then I have no expectation such evil would receive reward from God.
God's patience with evil people shows his benevolence towards all but I in no way expect reward.


If my son became a murderer, you would no longer define me as benevolent if I agreed or even performed the execution?

If you have two sons, one of whom performed the murder, and you killed both of them, then certainly you won't fit the definition of benevolent. Specifically if the second son begged you to save him.

I do not understand how this fits into the question. I do not know where you feel that God kills a second good son?
Execution of a murderer is a wholesome thing. It does not show a lack of benevolence. Justice against evil people shows he is benevolent towards the good people.


Of course not. The benevolence of God has always been understood only to be towards a selective group. The good people. This includes Jesus below.
.....

I haven't really read the bible, but going just by what you posted, if it is literal, is really sad. Kill the people who dont support me being a king? That is not the definition of kind or benevolent. The person THought he was good, not enough evidence for him to kill others on disagreement.

If you choose evil and you prefer your evil self to rule then you are denying God's selfless rule.
This is the point of Jesus' discussion (whether you agree God is a perfect ruler and better than you is irrelevant, it is what Christians and Jews believed about God)

God will punish evil people.