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I'm Leaving Atheism

Mr.Infidel
Posts: 300
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11/4/2011 5:21:00 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
That is right. I now accept the belief in G-d. Here are two interesting videos explaining how I came to believe G-d has to exist!

The first video is so powerful Antony Flew, a nitorious atheist, became a Theist!

The second is explaining the Theistic approach to the divine origin of the Torah.
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Cerebral_Narcissist
Posts: 10,806
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11/4/2011 5:24:07 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
Those videos are pretty long, but I'll watch them and impose... I mean... give my opinion.

Our of interest you never sought to find a counter-argument first? Conversion is to me a serious matter.
I am voting for Innomen because of his intelligence, common sense, humility and the fact that Juggle appears to listen to him. Any other Presidential style would have a large sub-section of the site up in arms. If I was President I would destroy the site though elitism, others would let it run riot. Innomen represents a middle way that works, neither draconian nor anarchic and that is the only way things can work. Plus he does it all without ego trips.
badger
Posts: 11,793
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11/4/2011 5:34:04 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 11/4/2011 5:24:07 PM, Cerebral_Narcissist wrote:
Those videos are pretty long, but I'll watch them and impose... I mean... give my opinion.

Our of interest you never sought to find a counter-argument first? Conversion is to me a serious matter.

awesome athiest. keep up the good work! i'mma go drink.
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JustCallMeTarzan
Posts: 1,922
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11/4/2011 5:37:19 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
The fine-tuning argument in a nutshell:

1) Here is a value for a property of the universe.
2) Here is an arbitrary range that value might possibly have.
3) But life cannot exist unless that value is within this much smaller range.

Therefore, because the life-giving range is so small compared to our arbitrary one, the universe is fine-tuned.

And therefore, because it is fine tuned, God must have done the tuning.
Cerebral_Narcissist
Posts: 10,806
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11/4/2011 5:46:27 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 11/4/2011 5:37:19 PM, JustCallMeTarzan wrote:
The fine-tuning argument in a nutshell:

1) Here is a value for a property of the universe.
2) Here is an arbitrary range that value might possibly have.
3) But life cannot exist unless that value is within this much smaller range.

Therefore, because the life-giving range is so small compared to our arbitrary one, the universe is fine-tuned.

And therefore, because it is fine tuned, God must have done the tuning.

We all know that the fine tuning argument is utter crap right?
I am voting for Innomen because of his intelligence, common sense, humility and the fact that Juggle appears to listen to him. Any other Presidential style would have a large sub-section of the site up in arms. If I was President I would destroy the site though elitism, others would let it run riot. Innomen represents a middle way that works, neither draconian nor anarchic and that is the only way things can work. Plus he does it all without ego trips.
PARADIGM_L0ST
Posts: 6,958
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11/4/2011 5:51:06 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 11/4/2011 5:46:27 PM, Cerebral_Narcissist wrote:
At 11/4/2011 5:37:19 PM, JustCallMeTarzan wrote:
The fine-tuning argument in a nutshell:

1) Here is a value for a property of the universe.
2) Here is an arbitrary range that value might possibly have.
3) But life cannot exist unless that value is within this much smaller range.

Therefore, because the life-giving range is so small compared to our arbitrary one, the universe is fine-tuned.

And therefore, because it is fine tuned, God must have done the tuning.

We all know that the fine tuning argument is utter crap right?:

Even supposing the validity of the ontological argument, it does not de facto prove, or even remotely insinuate, that "God" et al, is responsible. Secondly, what is God? Supposing a God of sorts exists, who claims the patent on it? What many theists so arrogantly assume is that, even supposing God exists, there is zero assurance that God would be anything like they think he's like... or she.... or it... It's all conjecture.
"Have you ever considered suicide? If not, please do." -- Mouthwash (to Inferno)
badger
Posts: 11,793
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11/4/2011 5:55:59 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 11/4/2011 5:37:19 PM, JustCallMeTarzan wrote:
The fine-tuning argument in a nutshell:

1) Here is a value for a property of the universe.
2) Here is an arbitrary range that value might possibly have.
3) But life cannot exist unless that value is within this much smaller range.

Therefore, because the life-giving range is so small compared to our arbitrary one, the universe is fine-tuned.

And therefore, because it is fine tuned, God must have done the tuning.

do you not think the fibonacci sequence is really really weird how it's plotted in whole numbers like that? i mean us conscious would be the only things in the whole universe to make use of whole numbers, or make distinctions between things with them, count things with them, whatever...and then they apparently define us in a lot of ways? like in what we find attractive and things? and then there's that the universe looks like a brain cell? lol, i'm probably talking sh1t... can attractiveness can be drawn plotted using nothing but whole numbers and 90 degree angles? every curve and everything we see, even? perfectly? and well, just what the fvck is it and why does it define us if you'd not mind explaining that to me? some result of gravity, our gravity? i'm thinking there's possibly a fairly good fine tuning argument there lol..
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CosmicAlfonzo
Posts: 5,955
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11/4/2011 5:56:12 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
OP has WLC in his avatar.

'nuff said.

No, in all seriousness, good luck on your journey. Never stop learning.
Official "High Priest of Secular Affairs and Transient Distributor of Sonic Apple Seeds relating to the Reptilian Division of Paperwork Immoliation" of The FREEDO Bureaucracy, a DDO branch of the Erisian Front, a subdivision of the Discordian Back, a Limb of the Illuminatian Cosmic Utensil Corp
Mr.Infidel
Posts: 300
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11/4/2011 5:56:54 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 11/4/2011 5:56:12 PM, CosmicAlfonzo wrote:
OP has WLC in his avatar.

'nuff said.

No, in all seriousness, good luck on your journey. Never stop learning.

Same for everyone. No-one should stop learning!
Please donate to the following ENDANGERED SPECIES!
Preciousness of life.
Family structure.
Family values. 

Disarm a liberal. Vote for values.

Opinions of this signature are those of G-d's and any of His affiliates.
badger
Posts: 11,793
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11/4/2011 5:59:24 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 11/4/2011 5:55:59 PM, badger wrote:
At 11/4/2011 5:37:19 PM, JustCallMeTarzan wrote:
The fine-tuning argument in a nutshell:

1) Here is a value for a property of the universe.
2) Here is an arbitrary range that value might possibly have.
3) But life cannot exist unless that value is within this much smaller range.

Therefore, because the life-giving range is so small compared to our arbitrary one, the universe is fine-tuned.

And therefore, because it is fine tuned, God must have done the tuning.

do you not think the fibonacci sequence is really really weird how it's plotted in whole numbers like that? i mean us conscious would be the only things in the whole universe to make use of whole numbers, or make distinctions between things with them, count things with them, whatever...and then they apparently define us in a lot of ways? like in what we find attractive and things? and then there's that the universe looks like a brain cell? lol, i'm probably talking sh1t... can attractiveness can be drawn plotted using nothing but whole numbers and 90 degree angles? every curve and everything we see, even? perfectly? and well, just what the fvck is it and why does it define us if you'd not mind explaining that to me? some result of gravity, our gravity? i'm thinking there's possibly a fairly good fine tuning argument there lol..

leave out the second "can".

fix'd just to make sure you know i'm asking questions ;)
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Kinesis
Posts: 3,667
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11/4/2011 6:00:45 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
Same for everyone. No-one should stop learning!

Unless we contract severe irreversible mentally degenerative diseases, that is.
CosmicAlfonzo
Posts: 5,955
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11/4/2011 6:05:23 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 11/4/2011 6:02:21 PM, Ren wrote:
I think it's pretty clear from his use of the expression "G-d" that OP was being ironic.

He's a Jew.
Official "High Priest of Secular Affairs and Transient Distributor of Sonic Apple Seeds relating to the Reptilian Division of Paperwork Immoliation" of The FREEDO Bureaucracy, a DDO branch of the Erisian Front, a subdivision of the Discordian Back, a Limb of the Illuminatian Cosmic Utensil Corp
CosmicAlfonzo
Posts: 5,955
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11/4/2011 6:06:13 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
To clarify, it is common for the Jewish to spell it "G-d" rather than "God".

It is a sign of reverence or something.
Official "High Priest of Secular Affairs and Transient Distributor of Sonic Apple Seeds relating to the Reptilian Division of Paperwork Immoliation" of The FREEDO Bureaucracy, a DDO branch of the Erisian Front, a subdivision of the Discordian Back, a Limb of the Illuminatian Cosmic Utensil Corp
MyVoiceInYourHead
Posts: 260
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11/4/2011 6:06:32 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 11/4/2011 5:37:19 PM, JustCallMeTarzan wrote:
The fine-tuning argument in a nutshell:

1) Here is a value for a property of the universe.
2) Here is an arbitrary range that value might possibly have.
3) But life cannot exist unless that value is within this much smaller range.

Therefore, because the life-giving range is so small compared to our arbitrary one, the universe is fine-tuned.

And therefore, because it is fine tuned, God must have done the tuning.

God is a cosmic knob-twiddler. He must be to do all that fine tuning.

William Lane Craig and his ilk seem to mistake probability for inevitabilty after the event.

Yes we know life is unlikely. So what? Even if that proved a creator God, it still doesn't demonstrate that any of the religions are in the right ball park.

And it still leaves us with the staggering paradox that for a creator God to exist he must be at least as complex as the Universe is now in order to keep it running - you know, answering prayes and such like (must take some hefty bandwidth). So how did God's complexity originate?
badger
Posts: 11,793
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11/4/2011 6:07:21 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 11/4/2011 6:06:13 PM, CosmicAlfonzo wrote:
To clarify, it is common for the Jewish to spell it "G-d" rather than "God".

It is a sign of reverence or something.

uninterestingly interesting.
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Cerebral_Narcissist
Posts: 10,806
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11/4/2011 6:08:14 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
The first video is annoying, he makes a few valid points, including ones I have been called a retard over... then he just sort of rambles on. At what point are we meant to think... woah.
I am voting for Innomen because of his intelligence, common sense, humility and the fact that Juggle appears to listen to him. Any other Presidential style would have a large sub-section of the site up in arms. If I was President I would destroy the site though elitism, others would let it run riot. Innomen represents a middle way that works, neither draconian nor anarchic and that is the only way things can work. Plus he does it all without ego trips.
Ren
Posts: 7,102
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11/4/2011 6:08:49 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 11/4/2011 6:05:23 PM, CosmicAlfonzo wrote:
At 11/4/2011 6:02:21 PM, Ren wrote:
I think it's pretty clear from his use of the expression "G-d" that OP was being ironic.

He's a Jew.

Oh.
MyVoiceInYourHead
Posts: 260
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11/4/2011 6:08:54 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 11/4/2011 5:21:00 PM, Mr.Infidel wrote:
That is right. I now accept the belief in G-d. Here are two interesting videos explaining how I came to believe G-d has to exist!




The first video is so powerful Antony Flew, a nitorious atheist, became a Theist!



The second is explaining the Theistic approach to the divine origin of the Torah.

What's with the "G-d" business. Why can't you say "God" like anyone else? Is it to make God sound more powerful & mysterious - he who cannot be named? Is God actually Lord Voldemort?
Mr.Infidel
Posts: 300
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11/4/2011 6:09:36 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 11/4/2011 6:06:13 PM, CosmicAlfonzo wrote:
To clarify, it is common for the Jewish to spell it "G-d" rather than "God".

It is a sign of reverence or something.

You are correct. It is a sign of reverence.
Please donate to the following ENDANGERED SPECIES!
Preciousness of life.
Family structure.
Family values. 

Disarm a liberal. Vote for values.

Opinions of this signature are those of G-d's and any of His affiliates.
badger
Posts: 11,793
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11/4/2011 6:10:16 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 11/4/2011 6:08:14 PM, Cerebral_Narcissist wrote:
The first video is annoying, he makes a few valid points, including ones I have been called a retard over... then he just sort of rambles on. At what point are we meant to think... woah.

spell 'em out will ya? let's make a proper athiests seriously considering god thread.
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Cerebral_Narcissist
Posts: 10,806
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11/4/2011 6:19:58 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 11/4/2011 6:10:16 PM, badger wrote:
At 11/4/2011 6:08:14 PM, Cerebral_Narcissist wrote:
The first video is annoying, he makes a few valid points, including ones I have been called a retard over... then he just sort of rambles on. At what point are we meant to think... woah.

spell 'em out will ya? let's make a proper athiests seriously considering god thread.

I haven't seen an argument yet.
I am voting for Innomen because of his intelligence, common sense, humility and the fact that Juggle appears to listen to him. Any other Presidential style would have a large sub-section of the site up in arms. If I was President I would destroy the site though elitism, others would let it run riot. Innomen represents a middle way that works, neither draconian nor anarchic and that is the only way things can work. Plus he does it all without ego trips.
badger
Posts: 11,793
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11/4/2011 6:26:42 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 11/4/2011 6:19:58 PM, Cerebral_Narcissist wrote:
At 11/4/2011 6:10:16 PM, badger wrote:
At 11/4/2011 6:08:14 PM, Cerebral_Narcissist wrote:
The first video is annoying, he makes a few valid points, including ones I have been called a retard over... then he just sort of rambles on. At what point are we meant to think... woah.

spell 'em out will ya? let's make a proper athiests seriously considering god thread.

I haven't seen an argument yet.

what were the valid points you were talking about? just points?
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Cerebral_Narcissist
Posts: 10,806
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11/4/2011 6:31:43 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 11/4/2011 6:26:42 PM, badger wrote:
At 11/4/2011 6:19:58 PM, Cerebral_Narcissist wrote:
At 11/4/2011 6:10:16 PM, badger wrote:
At 11/4/2011 6:08:14 PM, Cerebral_Narcissist wrote:
The first video is annoying, he makes a few valid points, including ones I have been called a retard over... then he just sort of rambles on. At what point are we meant to think... woah.

spell 'em out will ya? let's make a proper athiests seriously considering god thread.

I haven't seen an argument yet.

what were the valid points you were talking about? just points?

I dont know how it develops but the guy presents both atheism and theism and talks about the origin of the universe.
I am voting for Innomen because of his intelligence, common sense, humility and the fact that Juggle appears to listen to him. Any other Presidential style would have a large sub-section of the site up in arms. If I was President I would destroy the site though elitism, others would let it run riot. Innomen represents a middle way that works, neither draconian nor anarchic and that is the only way things can work. Plus he does it all without ego trips.