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The Purpose of our Existence

Yarely
Posts: 329
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11/11/2011 8:15:50 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
I used to be an atheist but now I'm leaning more toward agnostic. There's this thing that Richard Dawkins said about how questioning the purpose of our existence was a silly question and that we are here simply "because". That's a pretty depressing thought. I mean we have contributed a lot to Earth. We have plenty of power, and I don't think that's being arrogant. We can both destroy and create. We have the power to bomb an entire city to ashes and create an entire civilization again from the ground up. I'm also getting into Romantic Literature, which is basically the complete opposite of what Dawkins believes. Romantic Literature, believes that God made us and that we special and our emotions are important. So I mean I don't know. Do you think we have a purpose?
"Anarchism stands for the liberation of the human mind from the dominion of religion and liberation of the human body from the coercion of property; liberation from the shackles and restraint of government. It stands for a social order based on the free grouping of individuals""
-Emma Goldman
TeenageApologist
Posts: 54
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11/11/2011 8:23:50 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 11/11/2011 8:15:50 PM, Yarely wrote:
I used to be an atheist but now I'm leaning more toward agnostic. There's this thing that Richard Dawkins said about how questioning the purpose of our existence was a silly question and that we are here simply "because". That's a pretty depressing thought. I mean we have contributed a lot to Earth. We have plenty of power, and I don't think that's being arrogant. We can both destroy and create. We have the power to bomb an entire city to ashes and create an entire civilization again from the ground up. I'm also getting into Romantic Literature, which is basically the complete opposite of what Dawkins believes. Romantic Literature, believes that God made us and that we special and our emotions are important. So I mean I don't know. Do you think we have a purpose?

Absolutely, as a Christian you can probably guess my beliefs. Richard Dawkins may be a great scientist, but he is no philosopher. I recommend the website www.gotquestions.org for any questions you may have about our existence. You can also keep up with my debate "Could God Exist" at http://www.debate.org... Good Luck in your quest for finding out our purpose.
drafterman
Posts: 18,870
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11/11/2011 8:29:26 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 11/11/2011 8:15:50 PM, Yarely wrote:
I used to be an atheist but now I'm leaning more toward agnostic. There's this thing that Richard Dawkins said about how questioning the purpose of our existence was a silly question and that we are here simply "because". That's a pretty depressing thought. I mean we have contributed a lot to Earth. We have plenty of power, and I don't think that's being arrogant. We can both destroy and create. We have the power to bomb an entire city to ashes and create an entire civilization again from the ground up. I'm also getting into Romantic Literature, which is basically the complete opposite of what Dawkins believes. Romantic Literature, believes that God made us and that we special and our emotions are important. So I mean I don't know. Do you think we have a purpose?

Yes. Our purpose is whatever we make it to be.

Also, atheism and agnosticism are not mutually exclusive terms. You can be one, the other, both, or neither.
Yarely
Posts: 329
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11/11/2011 8:29:38 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 11/11/2011 8:23:50 PM, TeenageApologist wrote:
At 11/11/2011 8:15:50 PM, Yarely wrote:
I used to be an atheist but now I'm leaning more toward agnostic. There's this thing that Richard Dawkins said about how questioning the purpose of our existence was a silly question and that we are here simply "because". That's a pretty depressing thought. I mean we have contributed a lot to Earth. We have plenty of power, and I don't think that's being arrogant. We can both destroy and create. We have the power to bomb an entire city to ashes and create an entire civilization again from the ground up. I'm also getting into Romantic Literature, which is basically the complete opposite of what Dawkins believes. Romantic Literature, believes that God made us and that we special and our emotions are important. So I mean I don't know. Do you think we have a purpose?

Absolutely, as a Christian you can probably guess my beliefs. Richard Dawkins may be a great scientist, but he is no philosopher. I recommend the website www.gotquestions.org for any questions you may have about our existence. You can also keep up with my debate "Could God Exist" at http://www.debate.org... Good Luck in your quest for finding out our purpose.

Thanks :D
"Anarchism stands for the liberation of the human mind from the dominion of religion and liberation of the human body from the coercion of property; liberation from the shackles and restraint of government. It stands for a social order based on the free grouping of individuals""
-Emma Goldman
Illegalcombatant
Posts: 4,008
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11/11/2011 8:31:00 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 11/11/2011 8:15:50 PM, Yarely wrote:
I used to be an atheist but now I'm leaning more toward agnostic. There's this thing that Richard Dawkins said about how questioning the purpose of our existence was a silly question and that we are here simply "because". That's a pretty depressing thought. I mean we have contributed a lot to Earth. We have plenty of power, and I don't think that's being arrogant. We can both destroy and create. We have the power to bomb an entire city to ashes and create an entire civilization again from the ground up. I'm also getting into Romantic Literature, which is basically the complete opposite of what Dawkins believes. Romantic Literature, believes that God made us and that we special and our emotions are important. So I mean I don't know. Do you think we have a purpose?

I remember this comment. My understanding is what Dawkins means by saying its a silly question is because there is no purpose of the universe then its silly to ask what the purpose is. Its like asking how tasty is the number 2 ? well the number 2 doesn't have a taste so its a silly question.

The other stuff you mentioned seems to be a non sequitur as far as purpose goes.
"Seems like another attempt to insert God into areas our knowledge has yet to penetrate. You figure God would be bigger than the gaps of our ignorance." Drafterman 19/5/12
Yarely
Posts: 329
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11/11/2011 8:34:36 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 11/11/2011 8:29:26 PM, drafterman wrote:
At 11/11/2011 8:15:50 PM, Yarely wrote:
I used to be an atheist but now I'm leaning more toward agnostic. There's this thing that Richard Dawkins said about how questioning the purpose of our existence was a silly question and that we are here simply "because". That's a pretty depressing thought. I mean we have contributed a lot to Earth. We have plenty of power, and I don't think that's being arrogant. We can both destroy and create. We have the power to bomb an entire city to ashes and create an entire civilization again from the ground up. I'm also getting into Romantic Literature, which is basically the complete opposite of what Dawkins believes. Romantic Literature, believes that God made us and that we special and our emotions are important. So I mean I don't know. Do you think we have a purpose?

Yes. Our purpose is whatever we make it to be.

Also, atheism and agnosticism are not mutually exclusive terms. You can be one, the other, both, or neither.

That's a much more satisfying answer than the Richard Dawkins one. He just says that we are lucky enough to even strain together a question but that the question of our existence is a "silly" one. I mean, it's perfectly human to find to need for significance in life. Because, what would then be the point of life other than breathing and maneuvering?
"Anarchism stands for the liberation of the human mind from the dominion of religion and liberation of the human body from the coercion of property; liberation from the shackles and restraint of government. It stands for a social order based on the free grouping of individuals""
-Emma Goldman
Yarely
Posts: 329
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11/11/2011 8:41:00 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 11/11/2011 8:31:00 PM, Illegalcombatant wrote:
At 11/11/2011 8:15:50 PM, Yarely wrote:
I used to be an atheist but now I'm leaning more toward agnostic. There's this thing that Richard Dawkins said about how questioning the purpose of our existence was a silly question and that we are here simply "because". That's a pretty depressing thought. I mean we have contributed a lot to Earth. We have plenty of power, and I don't think that's being arrogant. We can both destroy and create. We have the power to bomb an entire city to ashes and create an entire civilization again from the ground up. I'm also getting into Romantic Literature, which is basically the complete opposite of what Dawkins believes. Romantic Literature, believes that God made us and that we special and our emotions are important. So I mean I don't know. Do you think we have a purpose?

I remember this comment. My understanding is what Dawkins means by saying its a silly question is because there is no purpose of the universe then its silly to ask what the purpose is. Its like asking how tasty is the number 2 ? well the number 2 doesn't have a taste so its a silly question.

The other stuff you mentioned seems to be a non sequitur as far as purpose goes.

The other things I mentioned weren't irrelevant because what I was talking about was our significance. If we don't really have a purpose in life or there's no purpose in the universe that means that we are insignificant
And jeez no purpose of the universe? That's a very depressing thought
"Anarchism stands for the liberation of the human mind from the dominion of religion and liberation of the human body from the coercion of property; liberation from the shackles and restraint of government. It stands for a social order based on the free grouping of individuals""
-Emma Goldman
TeenageApologist
Posts: 54
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11/11/2011 8:50:07 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 11/11/2011 8:29:26 PM, drafterman wrote:
At 11/11/2011 8:15:50 PM, Yarely wrote:
I used to be an atheist but now I'm leaning more toward agnostic. There's this thing that Richard Dawkins said about how questioning the purpose of our existence was a silly question and that we are here simply "because". That's a pretty depressing thought. I mean we have contributed a lot to Earth. We have plenty of power, and I don't think that's being arrogant. We can both destroy and create. We have the power to bomb an entire city to ashes and create an entire civilization again from the ground up. I'm also getting into Romantic Literature, which is basically the complete opposite of what Dawkins believes. Romantic Literature, believes that God made us and that we special and our emotions are important. So I mean I don't know. Do you think we have a purpose?

Yes. Our purpose is whatever we make it to be.

Also, atheism and agnosticism are not mutually exclusive terms. You can be one, the other, both, or neither.

We can give ourselves a purpose, but that doesn't make it our intended purpose which I believe Yarely was curious about(although admittedly I am unsure). I suppose this is irrelevant to you, though. I agree with you that atheism and agnosticism are not mutually exclusive, nor are theism and agnosticism although I only hold to the former.
Yarely
Posts: 329
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11/11/2011 8:53:46 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 11/11/2011 8:50:07 PM, TeenageApologist wrote:
At 11/11/2011 8:29:26 PM, drafterman wrote:
At 11/11/2011 8:15:50 PM, Yarely wrote:
I used to be an atheist but now I'm leaning more toward agnostic. There's this thing that Richard Dawkins said about how questioning the purpose of our existence was a silly question and that we are here simply "because". That's a pretty depressing thought. I mean we have contributed a lot to Earth. We have plenty of power, and I don't think that's being arrogant. We can both destroy and create. We have the power to bomb an entire city to ashes and create an entire civilization again from the ground up. I'm also getting into Romantic Literature, which is basically the complete opposite of what Dawkins believes. Romantic Literature, believes that God made us and that we special and our emotions are important. So I mean I don't know. Do you think we have a purpose?

Yes. Our purpose is whatever we make it to be.

Also, atheism and agnosticism are not mutually exclusive terms. You can be one, the other, both, or neither.

We can give ourselves a purpose, but that doesn't make it our intended purpose which I believe Yarely was curious about(although admittedly I am unsure). I suppose this is irrelevant to you, though. I agree with you that atheism and agnosticism are not mutually exclusive, nor are theism and agnosticism although I only hold to the former.

Okay that makes sense
"Anarchism stands for the liberation of the human mind from the dominion of religion and liberation of the human body from the coercion of property; liberation from the shackles and restraint of government. It stands for a social order based on the free grouping of individuals""
-Emma Goldman
Illegalcombatant
Posts: 4,008
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11/11/2011 8:55:32 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 11/11/2011 8:41:00 PM, Yarely wrote:
At 11/11/2011 8:31:00 PM, Illegalcombatant wrote:
At 11/11/2011 8:15:50 PM, Yarely wrote:
I used to be an atheist but now I'm leaning more toward agnostic. There's this thing that Richard Dawkins said about how questioning the purpose of our existence was a silly question and that we are here simply "because". That's a pretty depressing thought. I mean we have contributed a lot to Earth. We have plenty of power, and I don't think that's being arrogant. We can both destroy and create. We have the power to bomb an entire city to ashes and create an entire civilization again from the ground up. I'm also getting into Romantic Literature, which is basically the complete opposite of what Dawkins believes. Romantic Literature, believes that God made us and that we special and our emotions are important. So I mean I don't know. Do you think we have a purpose?

I remember this comment. My understanding is what Dawkins means by saying its a silly question is because there is no purpose of the universe then its silly to ask what the purpose is. Its like asking how tasty is the number 2 ? well the number 2 doesn't have a taste so its a silly question.

The other stuff you mentioned seems to be a non sequitur as far as purpose goes.

The other things I mentioned weren't irrelevant because what I was talking about was our significance. If we don't really have a purpose in life or there's no purpose in the universe that means that we are insignificant
And jeez no purpose of the universe? That's a very depressing thought

It doesn't follow necessarily that no purpose = insignificant.

Whether it is depressing doesn't change whether its true or not, would you reject the claim that one day you will die cause you found this proposition depressing ? Of course not.
"Seems like another attempt to insert God into areas our knowledge has yet to penetrate. You figure God would be bigger than the gaps of our ignorance." Drafterman 19/5/12
GeoLaureate8
Posts: 12,252
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11/11/2011 9:00:33 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
"Life is like stepping onto a boat that is about to sail out to sea and sink."
-- Zen Proverb

"So long as people do not understand the true nature of the objective world, they fall into the dualistic view of things. They imagine the multiplicity of external objects to be real and become attached to them."
-- the Buddha [Lankavatara Sutra]

Just because you don't like the way things are, doesn't mean you believe whatever outrageous belief system satisfies you. If someone was devastated by the thought that unicorns don't exist, should they turn to a belief system that says unicorns do exist?

It is also important to note, if you don't accept reality and what is, then you completely miss out and don't realize how great actual reality already is.
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
Yarely
Posts: 329
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11/11/2011 9:05:43 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 11/11/2011 8:55:32 PM, Illegalcombatant wrote:
At 11/11/2011 8:41:00 PM, Yarely wrote:
At 11/11/2011 8:31:00 PM, Illegalcombatant wrote:
At 11/11/2011 8:15:50 PM, Yarely wrote:
I used to be an atheist but now I'm leaning more toward agnostic. There's this thing that Richard Dawkins said about how questioning the purpose of our existence was a silly question and that we are here simply "because". That's a pretty depressing thought. I mean we have contributed a lot to Earth. We have plenty of power, and I don't think that's being arrogant. We can both destroy and create. We have the power to bomb an entire city to ashes and create an entire civilization again from the ground up. I'm also getting into Romantic Literature, which is basically the complete opposite of what Dawkins believes. Romantic Literature, believes that God made us and that we special and our emotions are important. So I mean I don't know. Do you think we have a purpose?

I remember this comment. My understanding is what Dawkins means by saying its a silly question is because there is no purpose of the universe then its silly to ask what the purpose is. Its like asking how tasty is the number 2 ? well the number 2 doesn't have a taste so its a silly question.

The other stuff you mentioned seems to be a non sequitur as far as purpose goes.

The other things I mentioned weren't irrelevant because what I was talking about was our significance. If we don't really have a purpose in life or there's no purpose in the universe that means that we are insignificant
And jeez no purpose of the universe? That's a very depressing thought

It doesn't follow necessarily that no purpose = insignificant.

Whether it is depressing doesn't change whether its true or not, would you reject the claim that one day you will die cause you found this proposition depressing ? Of course not.

I never rejected what you said. I'm still trying to find the answers. I just commented that it was a depressing thought. In no way was I ever completely dismissing what you said
"Anarchism stands for the liberation of the human mind from the dominion of religion and liberation of the human body from the coercion of property; liberation from the shackles and restraint of government. It stands for a social order based on the free grouping of individuals""
-Emma Goldman
Yarely
Posts: 329
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11/11/2011 9:07:22 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 11/11/2011 9:00:33 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
"Life is like stepping onto a boat that is about to sail out to sea and sink."
-- Zen Proverb


"So long as people do not understand the true nature of the objective world, they fall into the dualistic view of things. They imagine the multiplicity of external objects to be real and become attached to them."
-- the Buddha [Lankavatara Sutra]

Just because you don't like the way things are, doesn't mean you believe whatever outrageous belief system satisfies you. If someone was devastated by the thought that unicorns don't exist, should they turn to a belief system that says unicorns do exist?

It is also important to note, if you don't accept reality and what is, then you completely miss out and don't realize how great actual reality already is.

I am not deluding myself. All I did was comment that the thought was depressing. I never rejected the idea that the universe had no purpose
"Anarchism stands for the liberation of the human mind from the dominion of religion and liberation of the human body from the coercion of property; liberation from the shackles and restraint of government. It stands for a social order based on the free grouping of individuals""
-Emma Goldman
TeenageApologist
Posts: 54
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11/11/2011 9:15:10 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 11/11/2011 9:00:33 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
"Life is like stepping onto a boat that is about to sail out to sea and sink."
-- Zen Proverb


"So long as people do not understand the true nature of the objective world, they fall into the dualistic view of things. They imagine the multiplicity of external objects to be real and become attached to them."
-- the Buddha [Lankavatara Sutra]

Just because you don't like the way things are, doesn't mean you believe whatever outrageous belief system satisfies you. If someone was devastated by the thought that unicorns don't exist, should they turn to a belief system that says unicorns do exist?

It is also important to note, if you don't accept reality and what is, then you completely miss out and don't realize how great actual reality already is.

What outrageous belief system are you referring to? If you are referring to God, that is not outrageous. A unicorn is not a logically equal comparison to God. God has a book like the Bible which the logical arguments for God originate from, for the most part.Said logical arguments can be appied to a Unicorn, Flying Spaghetti Monster, or Russel's Teapot but they do not have the basis for the arguments God does.
Yarely
Posts: 329
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11/11/2011 9:23:32 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 11/11/2011 9:15:10 PM, TeenageApologist wrote:
At 11/11/2011 9:00:33 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
"Life is like stepping onto a boat that is about to sail out to sea and sink."
-- Zen Proverb


"So long as people do not understand the true nature of the objective world, they fall into the dualistic view of things. They imagine the multiplicity of external objects to be real and become attached to them."
-- the Buddha [Lankavatara Sutra]

Just because you don't like the way things are, doesn't mean you believe whatever outrageous belief system satisfies you. If someone was devastated by the thought that unicorns don't exist, should they turn to a belief system that says unicorns do exist?

It is also important to note, if you don't accept reality and what is, then you completely miss out and don't realize how great actual reality already is.

What outrageous belief system are you referring to? If you are referring to God, that is not outrageous. A unicorn is not a logically equal comparison to God. God has a book like the Bible which the logical arguments for God originate from, for the most part.Said logical arguments can be appied to a Unicorn, Flying Spaghetti Monster, or Russel's Teapot but they do not have the basis for the arguments God does.

Exactly! I always thought that comparing God to a Flying Spaghetti Monster was a very weak argument
"Anarchism stands for the liberation of the human mind from the dominion of religion and liberation of the human body from the coercion of property; liberation from the shackles and restraint of government. It stands for a social order based on the free grouping of individuals""
-Emma Goldman
drafterman
Posts: 18,870
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11/11/2011 9:37:04 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 11/11/2011 8:50:07 PM, TeenageApologist wrote:
At 11/11/2011 8:29:26 PM, drafterman wrote:
At 11/11/2011 8:15:50 PM, Yarely wrote:
I used to be an atheist but now I'm leaning more toward agnostic. There's this thing that Richard Dawkins said about how questioning the purpose of our existence was a silly question and that we are here simply "because". That's a pretty depressing thought. I mean we have contributed a lot to Earth. We have plenty of power, and I don't think that's being arrogant. We can both destroy and create. We have the power to bomb an entire city to ashes and create an entire civilization again from the ground up. I'm also getting into Romantic Literature, which is basically the complete opposite of what Dawkins believes. Romantic Literature, believes that God made us and that we special and our emotions are important. So I mean I don't know. Do you think we have a purpose?

Yes. Our purpose is whatever we make it to be.

Also, atheism and agnosticism are not mutually exclusive terms. You can be one, the other, both, or neither.

We can give ourselves a purpose, but that doesn't make it our intended purpose which I believe Yarely was curious about(although admittedly I am unsure). I suppose this is irrelevant to you, though. I agree with you that atheism and agnosticism are not mutually exclusive, nor are theism and agnosticism although I only hold to the former.

You may be correct about "intended purpose." But unless God comes down and tells me, face-to-face, what that is, then I don't know what it is. So not knowing my intended purpose and not having an intended purpose are functionally the same.

So I'll reason out my own purpose and go from there, god be damned.
TeenageApologist
Posts: 54
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11/11/2011 9:46:33 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 11/11/2011 9:37:04 PM, drafterman wrote:
At 11/11/2011 8:50:07 PM, TeenageApologist wrote:
At 11/11/2011 8:29:26 PM, drafterman wrote:
At 11/11/2011 8:15:50 PM, Yarely wrote:
I used to be an atheist but now I'm leaning more toward agnostic. There's this thing that Richard Dawkins said about how questioning the purpose of our existence was a silly question and that we are here simply "because". That's a pretty depressing thought. I mean we have contributed a lot to Earth. We have plenty of power, and I don't think that's being arrogant. We can both destroy and create. We have the power to bomb an entire city to ashes and create an entire civilization again from the ground up. I'm also getting into Romantic Literature, which is basically the complete opposite of what Dawkins believes. Romantic Literature, believes that God made us and that we special and our emotions are important. So I mean I don't know. Do you think we have a purpose?

Yes. Our purpose is whatever we make it to be.

Also, atheism and agnosticism are not mutually exclusive terms. You can be one, the other, both, or neither.

We can give ourselves a purpose, but that doesn't make it our intended purpose which I believe Yarely was curious about(although admittedly I am unsure). I suppose this is irrelevant to you, though. I agree with you that atheism and agnosticism are not mutually exclusive, nor are theism and agnosticism although I only hold to the former.

You may be correct about "intended purpose." But unless God comes down and tells me, face-to-face, what that is, then I don't know what it is. So not knowing my intended purpose and not having an intended purpose are functionally the same.

So I'll reason out my own purpose and go from there, god be damned.

I agree with you on that second part. I can not give you absolute proof for God, which it seems is what would convince you, but absence of evidence is not evidence for absense, right? There is evidence, but not enough to underscore faith.
Gileandos
Posts: 2,394
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11/11/2011 9:59:45 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
@Yarley,
I was a heavy agnostic before becoming Christian.

To make a very long story short, I heard about the Angelic Conflict.
That God made the earth and the human race to resolve the Angelic Conflict.

I pursued the question relentlessly. Then I pursued God.

He revealed himself to me.

I began to realize that God was absolute Strength. He was the one object to absolutely rely on. Never would I be let down.

I assure you. Pursue his strength. Rest in Him.
Yarely
Posts: 329
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11/11/2011 10:01:57 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 11/11/2011 9:59:45 PM, Gileandos wrote:
@Yarley,
I was a heavy agnostic before becoming Christian.

To make a very long story short, I heard about the Angelic Conflict.
That God made the earth and the human race to resolve the Angelic Conflict.

I pursued the question relentlessly. Then I pursued God.

He revealed himself to me.

I began to realize that God was absolute Strength. He was the one object to absolutely rely on. Never would I be let down.

I assure you. Pursue his strength. Rest in Him.

Would you mind telling me what the Angelic Conflict is?
"Anarchism stands for the liberation of the human mind from the dominion of religion and liberation of the human body from the coercion of property; liberation from the shackles and restraint of government. It stands for a social order based on the free grouping of individuals""
-Emma Goldman
TeenageApologist
Posts: 54
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11/11/2011 10:02:29 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 11/11/2011 9:23:32 PM, Yarely wrote:
At 11/11/2011 9:15:10 PM, TeenageApologist wrote:
At 11/11/2011 9:00:33 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
"Life is like stepping onto a boat that is about to sail out to sea and sink."
-- Zen Proverb


"So long as people do not understand the true nature of the objective world, they fall into the dualistic view of things. They imagine the multiplicity of external objects to be real and become attached to them."
-- the Buddha [Lankavatara Sutra]

Just because you don't like the way things are, doesn't mean you believe whatever outrageous belief system satisfies you. If someone was devastated by the thought that unicorns don't exist, should they turn to a belief system that says unicorns do exist?

It is also important to note, if you don't accept reality and what is, then you completely miss out and don't realize how great actual reality already is.

What outrageous belief system are you referring to? If you are referring to God, that is not outrageous. A unicorn is not a logically equal comparison to God. God has a book like the Bible which the logical arguments for God originate from, for the most part.Said logical arguments can be appied to a Unicorn, Flying Spaghetti Monster, or Russel's Teapot but they do not have the basis for the arguments God does.

Exactly! I always thought that comparing God to a Flying Spaghetti Monster was a very weak argument

Yet, it is very commonplace.
TeenageApologist
Posts: 54
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11/11/2011 10:08:39 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 11/11/2011 9:59:45 PM, Gileandos wrote:
@Yarley,
I was a heavy agnostic before becoming Christian.

To make a very long story short, I heard about the Angelic Conflict.
That God made the earth and the human race to resolve the Angelic Conflict.

I pursued the question relentlessly. Then I pursued God.

He revealed himself to me.

I began to realize that God was absolute Strength. He was the one object to absolutely rely on. Never would I be let down.

I assure you. Pursue his strength. Rest in Him.

I enjoy your testimony, I was an atheist before being drawn into research and coming to the conclusion that Jesus is for real based on his resurrection. I opened my mind and heart and do not regret it in the least, I am happier than ever.
Yarely
Posts: 329
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11/11/2011 10:16:35 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 11/11/2011 10:08:39 PM, TeenageApologist wrote:
At 11/11/2011 9:59:45 PM, Gileandos wrote:
@Yarley,
I was a heavy agnostic before becoming Christian.

To make a very long story short, I heard about the Angelic Conflict.
That God made the earth and the human race to resolve the Angelic Conflict.

I pursued the question relentlessly. Then I pursued God.

He revealed himself to me.

I began to realize that God was absolute Strength. He was the one object to absolutely rely on. Never would I be let down.

I assure you. Pursue his strength. Rest in Him.

I enjoy your testimony, I was an atheist before being drawn into research and coming to the conclusion that Jesus is for real based on his resurrection. I opened my mind and heart and do not regret it in the least, I am happier than ever.

What exactly did you research?
"Anarchism stands for the liberation of the human mind from the dominion of religion and liberation of the human body from the coercion of property; liberation from the shackles and restraint of government. It stands for a social order based on the free grouping of individuals""
-Emma Goldman
CosmicAlfonzo
Posts: 5,955
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11/11/2011 10:23:27 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
Purpose is a human evaluation of things. It doesn't really have much to do with the way things are.

Things are the way they are because that is what the interaction of the laws of the universe led to. Purpose is a human invention. There is no such thing as "purpose". Things happen for a reason, yes, but this not the same thing as "purpose".
Official "High Priest of Secular Affairs and Transient Distributor of Sonic Apple Seeds relating to the Reptilian Division of Paperwork Immoliation" of The FREEDO Bureaucracy, a DDO branch of the Erisian Front, a subdivision of the Discordian Back, a Limb of the Illuminatian Cosmic Utensil Corp
TeenageApologist
Posts: 54
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11/11/2011 10:41:32 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 11/11/2011 10:16:35 PM, Yarely wrote:
At 11/11/2011 10:08:39 PM, TeenageApologist wrote:
At 11/11/2011 9:59:45 PM, Gileandos wrote:
@Yarley,
I was a heavy agnostic before becoming Christian.

To make a very long story short, I heard about the Angelic Conflict.
That God made the earth and the human race to resolve the Angelic Conflict.

I pursued the question relentlessly. Then I pursued God.

He revealed himself to me.

I began to realize that God was absolute Strength. He was the one object to absolutely rely on. Never would I be let down.

I assure you. Pursue his strength. Rest in Him.

I enjoy your testimony, I was an atheist before being drawn into research and coming to the conclusion that Jesus is for real based on his resurrection. I opened my mind and heart and do not regret it in the least, I am happier than ever.

What exactly did you research?

The plausibility of the Resurrection of Jesus Christ. Once I found it was not only plausible but the best explanation I was awe struck. I knew in my heart that God is what I needed and I was right.
CosmicAlfonzo
Posts: 5,955
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11/11/2011 10:52:17 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 11/11/2011 10:41:32 PM, TeenageApologist wrote:
At 11/11/2011 10:16:35 PM, Yarely wrote:
At 11/11/2011 10:08:39 PM, TeenageApologist wrote:
At 11/11/2011 9:59:45 PM, Gileandos wrote:
@Yarley,
I was a heavy agnostic before becoming Christian.

To make a very long story short, I heard about the Angelic Conflict.
That God made the earth and the human race to resolve the Angelic Conflict.

I pursued the question relentlessly. Then I pursued God.

He revealed himself to me.

I began to realize that God was absolute Strength. He was the one object to absolutely rely on. Never would I be let down.

I assure you. Pursue his strength. Rest in Him.

I enjoy your testimony, I was an atheist before being drawn into research and coming to the conclusion that Jesus is for real based on his resurrection. I opened my mind and heart and do not regret it in the least, I am happier than ever.

What exactly did you research?

The plausibility of the Resurrection of Jesus Christ. Once I found it was not only plausible but the best explanation I was awe struck. I knew in my heart that God is what I needed and I was right.

I hate to break it to you, but there is nothing plausible about coming back to life after being dead for 3 days.

Hell, a miracle by definition is something that is implausible.
Official "High Priest of Secular Affairs and Transient Distributor of Sonic Apple Seeds relating to the Reptilian Division of Paperwork Immoliation" of The FREEDO Bureaucracy, a DDO branch of the Erisian Front, a subdivision of the Discordian Back, a Limb of the Illuminatian Cosmic Utensil Corp
TeenageApologist
Posts: 54
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11/11/2011 10:54:27 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 11/11/2011 10:23:27 PM, CosmicAlfonzo wrote:
Purpose is a human evaluation of things. It doesn't really have much to do with the way things are.

Things are the way they are because that is what the interaction of the laws of the universe led to. Purpose is a human invention. There is no such thing as "purpose". Things happen for a reason, yes, but this not the same thing as "purpose".

You say things happen for a reason. Purpose is something set up as an object or end to be obtained. Are those not synonymous? You say that purpose is a human invention then you say there is no such thing as purpose. I realize you are not being literal on that later part however. I see no evidence that purpose is a human invention, so I implore you to introduce to me the evidence.
TeenageApologist
Posts: 54
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11/11/2011 11:03:07 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 11/11/2011 10:52:17 PM, CosmicAlfonzo wrote:
At 11/11/2011 10:41:32 PM, TeenageApologist wrote:
At 11/11/2011 10:16:35 PM, Yarely wrote:
At 11/11/2011 10:08:39 PM, TeenageApologist wrote:
At 11/11/2011 9:59:45 PM, Gileandos wrote:
@Yarley,
I was a heavy agnostic before becoming Christian.

To make a very long story short, I heard about the Angelic Conflict.
That God made the earth and the human race to resolve the Angelic Conflict.

I pursued the question relentlessly. Then I pursued God.

He revealed himself to me.

I began to realize that God was absolute Strength. He was the one object to absolutely rely on. Never would I be let down.

I assure you. Pursue his strength. Rest in Him.

I enjoy your testimony, I was an atheist before being drawn into research and coming to the conclusion that Jesus is for real based on his resurrection. I opened my mind and heart and do not regret it in the least, I am happier than ever.

What exactly did you research?

The plausibility of the Resurrection of Jesus Christ. Once I found it was not only plausible but the best explanation I was awe struck. I knew in my heart that God is what I needed and I was right.

I hate to break it to you, but there is nothing plausible about coming back to life after being dead for 3 days.

Hell, a miracle by definition is something that is implausible.

Then why did so many people right after Jesus's lifetime die for something they would know to be a lie? How do you explain the empty tomb? Was he just badly hurt and was somehow healed enough to break free from his tight linens, get out of the tomb and be proclaimed the Messiah and worshipped. Did the Disciples die for something they knew was a lie by stealing the body(oh, and I'm sure the tomb wasn't guarded or anything). Was there a mass hallucination(which there is no evidence for).Also, my favorite, did Jesus survive the brutal crucifiction and was somehow healed enough to escape and live in captivity(he got by those guards pretty well for someone who got flogged if you ask me). Seriously, look at those and tell me which is the most plausible.
CosmicAlfonzo
Posts: 5,955
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11/11/2011 11:07:51 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 11/11/2011 11:03:07 PM, TeenageApologist wrote:
At 11/11/2011 10:52:17 PM, CosmicAlfonzo wrote:
At 11/11/2011 10:41:32 PM, TeenageApologist wrote:
At 11/11/2011 10:16:35 PM, Yarely wrote:
At 11/11/2011 10:08:39 PM, TeenageApologist wrote:
At 11/11/2011 9:59:45 PM, Gileandos wrote:
@Yarley,
I was a heavy agnostic before becoming Christian.

To make a very long story short, I heard about the Angelic Conflict.
That God made the earth and the human race to resolve the Angelic Conflict.

I pursued the question relentlessly. Then I pursued God.

He revealed himself to me.

I began to realize that God was absolute Strength. He was the one object to absolutely rely on. Never would I be let down.

I assure you. Pursue his strength. Rest in Him.

I enjoy your testimony, I was an atheist before being drawn into research and coming to the conclusion that Jesus is for real based on his resurrection. I opened my mind and heart and do not regret it in the least, I am happier than ever.

What exactly did you research?

The plausibility of the Resurrection of Jesus Christ. Once I found it was not only plausible but the best explanation I was awe struck. I knew in my heart that God is what I needed and I was right.

I hate to break it to you, but there is nothing plausible about coming back to life after being dead for 3 days.

Hell, a miracle by definition is something that is implausible.

Then why did so many people right after Jesus's lifetime die for something they would know to be a lie? How do you explain the empty tomb? Was he just badly hurt and was somehow healed enough to break free from his tight linens, get out of the tomb and be proclaimed the Messiah and worshipped. Did the Disciples die for something they knew was a lie by stealing the body(oh, and I'm sure the tomb wasn't guarded or anything). Was there a mass hallucination(which there is no evidence for).Also, my favorite, did Jesus survive the brutal crucifiction and was somehow healed enough to escape and live in captivity(he got by those guards pretty well for someone who got flogged if you ask me). Seriously, look at those and tell me which is the most plausible.

Read my debate against "Bible Defender" on the historicity of the resurrection of Jesus.

The resurrection does not meet the standards of historicity.
Official "High Priest of Secular Affairs and Transient Distributor of Sonic Apple Seeds relating to the Reptilian Division of Paperwork Immoliation" of The FREEDO Bureaucracy, a DDO branch of the Erisian Front, a subdivision of the Discordian Back, a Limb of the Illuminatian Cosmic Utensil Corp
Gileandos
Posts: 2,394
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11/11/2011 11:11:33 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 11/11/2011 10:01:57 PM, Yarely wrote:
At 11/11/2011 9:59:45 PM, Gileandos wrote:
@Yarley,
I was a heavy agnostic before becoming Christian.

To make a very long story short, I heard about the Angelic Conflict.
That God made the earth and the human race to resolve the Angelic Conflict.

I pursued the question relentlessly. Then I pursued God.

He revealed himself to me.

I began to realize that God was absolute Strength. He was the one object to absolutely rely on. Never would I be let down.

I assure you. Pursue his strength. Rest in Him.

Would you mind telling me what the Angelic Conflict is?

Sure,
It is the Judeo Christian explanation of the Fall of Satan in eternity past, the generation of the earth.

The earth and humans were made lesser than the Angels and given a limited knowledge about God and Angels to choose sides.

We are then given the status of co-heirs to the Throne of Jesus Christ when we commit our lives to Jesus.

http://www.gbible.org...

Here is a very good (albeit calvinistic) layout of the first portion. It is in 57 hours you can listen to at your leisure.

The book of Enoch and Jubilees gives more layout and insight after you study these.

When I first heard this I still did not know what to make of the whole Jesus thing. I was very programmed against the belief in Jesus.

I did not embrace Jesus fully until He came to me. When I met him, there was no doubt after that.

Let me know if you have any questions.
ApostateAbe
Posts: 236
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11/11/2011 11:13:28 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 11/11/2011 8:15:50 PM, Yarely wrote:
I used to be an atheist but now I'm leaning more toward agnostic. There's this thing that Richard Dawkins said about how questioning the purpose of our existence was a silly question and that we are here simply "because". That's a pretty depressing thought. I mean we have contributed a lot to Earth. We have plenty of power, and I don't think that's being arrogant. We can both destroy and create. We have the power to bomb an entire city to ashes and create an entire civilization again from the ground up. I'm also getting into Romantic Literature, which is basically the complete opposite of what Dawkins believes. Romantic Literature, believes that God made us and that we special and our emotions are important. So I mean I don't know. Do you think we have a purpose?

I believe that Richard Dawkins has said something to the effect that the evolutionary purpose of our lives is to maximize the number of our grandchildren so that our own genes can predominate. Richard Dawkins was the biologist responsible for promoting the idea that human beings are essentially vehicles for their genes. It is not so much an encouraging thought, and I think Dawkins' psychology is rare in human society. We tend to shape our beliefs about what we would like to be true alongside what seems to be probable. People like Dawkins shape their beliefs around what seems to be probable and nothing else. They don't idealize wishful thinking. On the contrary, they repudiate it. For them, what seems "depressing" has no effect on what they believe or don't believe. And they are happy with it. It isn't for everybody. It may not even be possible for most people. Very many people out there are much more wired to let their wishes strongly affect their beliefs concerning the objective reality.